 It's time for the Lawn Jean Chronoscope, a television journal of the important issues of the hour, brought to you every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, a presentation of the Lawn Jean Wittner Watch Company, maker of Lawn Jean, the world's most honored watch, and Wittner, distinguished companion to the world-honored Lawn Jean. Good evening. This is Frank Knight. May I introduce our co-editors for this edition of the Lawn Jean Chronoscope. Mr. William Bradford Huey, editor of the American Mercury, and Mr. Cecil Kahn's noted author and foreign correspondent. Our distinguished guest for this evening is the Honorable John F. Flauberg, Assistant Secretary of the Navy for Air. The opinions expressed are necessarily those of the speakers. Mr. Flauberg, it of course is a pleasure to have you with us tonight to discuss some of the problems of the United States Navy. Now, sir, I'm sure that our viewers are interested in some aspects of the naval war in Korea. Now, it's true that we have been fighting a naval war for more than two years, isn't it? Well, it's much more of a naval campaign than most people realize, Mr. Huey. The Navy has a substantial force in the Far East, approximately 150 combat ships, and as you probably know, the Navy and Marine Corps run about a third of the combat sorties that are running the Far East. About 99 and two-thirds percent of the logistic support that crosses the Pacific is transported by the... Now, those 150 combat ships, approximately how many men are involved in the Korean War and Navy personnel? Oh, I couldn't give you that, even in round numbers, sir. Now, has the Korean War been expensive for the Navy in men and material? Well, it's been pretty expensive in material. You know, we've fired... I think it's almost as much ammunition as it was fired in World War II. I do know that the carrier-based planes have expended more ammunition than in World War II. It hasn't been as expensive in lives for the Navy itself, although we've lost a substantial number of aviators. The Marine Corps had over 2,800 killed in the Far East. You've lost a considerable amount of equipment, I assume, airplanes. Yes, there's been a rather heavy attrition on airplanes. The anti-aircraft is pretty good in Korea. And of course, your losses, enemy losses, are principally from anti-aircraft fire. As far as airplanes are concerned, yes, sir. Most of your missions are low-level missions that the Navy flies in the Navy and Marine Corps. For the greater part, the Navy's Navy and Marine Corps air effort has been in close air support and in the interdiction mission. Most of that is conducted at low level, which is the most hazardous level, as far as aircraft fire is concerned. Yes, it seems to me that that's one of the branches of our effort that doesn't get much publicity, isn't it, that low-level flying that's done by both the Navy and the Air Force. That's right. And both the Navy and the Air Force, by far, the great proportion of missions is conducted at a relatively low level. And that's where the great proportion of losses takes place, too. Mr. Fulberg, shifting for a moment from the air, has the Navy run into any submarine warfare in Korea? No, sir. There have been various kinds of stories, but nothing... The North Koreans don't have any submarines, as far as we know. No, sir. There have been no casualties in the Navy from any surface or submarine craft. There have been casualties from shore bombardment, that is, from shore batteries shooting back at the ships. And there have been a fair number of casualties from mines, too. We've lost about four or five mine sweepers over there. But moving on from the war in Korea, of course, the Navy's principal effort at the moment, I suppose, is planning for what may be a large war, isn't it? Well, we're finally concerned with any potential difficulties. You're concerned strategically with a possible war against Russia, I assume. Well, we're concerned with anything that might come up. Well, what is the primary mission of the Navy at the moment? Well, the Navy's big job, of course, not just at the moment, but forever is control of the seas. That's our big mission. How important is that to the control of the seas is your naval air power, Mr.... Well, that is the key to control of it. The same is control of the seas is key to the national security, the national economy, the national industry, the national standard of living. And the naval air power is the key to that control of the sea, because whoever controls the air above it is going to control the air below it. Is it fair for our people who are trying to understand the evolution of the Navy? The Navy is now principally an air force, isn't it? A seaborn, a waterborne air force? No, I wouldn't call it a waterborne air force. What I would say is that the airplane is the most significant single weapon today in the Navy. It is a means to an end. It's one of the weapons the Navy has, the most powerful, effective, long-range weapon, but it's just a weapon like the other weapons. Well, this great area of water on the Earth's surface, your way for maintaining control of that is principally through your aerial weapon, isn't it? That's right. The aircraft carrier is the principal fighting ship of the Navy, isn't it? It is the major ship today in the Navy. And all else goes to support that either directly or indirectly. So you're essentially operating waterborne airfields and ships that go along to protect your airfield. Not just airfields, air bases, because they're complete with shops, fuel supplies, ammunition storage, repair facilities, technical experts to handle all kinds of particular problems that come up. That is the whole nature of naval air power. For any place on the 70% of the Earth's surface that's covered by water, and to expand on that a little further, historically, ever since the earliest days, control of the sea has depended on mounting the weapon of the day on a ship. That was true of the ramming prowl, that was true of the sword and the musket and the smoothboard cannon and the naval rifle and the propeller of an airplane and the jet airplane today and whatever comes tomorrow. What would be the principal threat that any prospective enemy poses, would you say, the submarine? Yes, the submarine is the major threat today because there's no readily apparent major surface force going against it. It could be a raid against us. Well, don't you think, well, since you have, or isn't it true that you have long-range airplanes in the Navy, do you have long-range airplanes? Yes, we do. We have the truck in a turd, as you know, still holds the world's long-distance record of over 11,000 miles. That's right, I'd forgotten about that. Well, now why couldn't the Navy then concentrate with the long-range planes and knock out submarines instead of going after them all together with aircraft carriers? Or is that your idea? No, it isn't at all our idea. We're going to fight submarines in four different places. One place and the worst place is to fight them in the screens of your own convoy. That's the ideal situation for the submarine because there the fighter of the submarine has a problem of location and classification as a submarine and identification to make sure it's an enemy submarine and then a complicated fire control problem on a maneuvering target that's working in his own element. And the next place to fight him is in the open seas between his bases and our supply lanes of commerce. That's a bad place too because it's a needle in the haystack proposition, but it's better than the first. The next place that's good to fight him is in his training areas. There he's relatively amateur compared to you and you might have him at a tactical disadvantage. Finally, the final place to fight him is at his own base alongside the dock where he's either being repaired or resupplied or something of that sort. There you don't have any problem of location or classification or identification and your fire control problem is reduced to a bomb control problem, but you run into a different problem in the latter two places. There you run into defenses by high performance fighter aircraft. Make 15 is a pretty good industry. Are you ready for that? Well that's exactly what you'll run up against and in order to attack him in those two latter places, which are really the two better places, you have to have equally high performance aircraft to get in there and fight him. And long range aircraft aren't high performance, they sacrifice. They're long range. Well, they're relatively unmaneuverable, relatively indefensible. Once you gain on the bananas, you always lose on the peanuts and that's what you do when you try to get performance into aircraft. And Russia is really loaded, isn't she? With submarines, she has a very formidable array of submarines. Well, you can pretty largely spin the wheel and take your number, but we know that she has at least five times as many as the Germans had to start to last for her. Well, just to word on this, Mr. Flo Berg, our viewers know that these weapons cost an awful lot of money today. Now, in round figures, what's the United States Navy costing the American taxpayers now? Well, all military preparations cost money. The Navy's budget this year is a little over $12 billion. And what proportion of the total defense outlay is that? That is just about a quarter, roughly. Just about one-fourth of it. Now, what is the Navy? Our audience, of course, is concerned with a, is familiar with a long argument over the propriety of these vast floating airfields. Is there any serious opposition to that strategy of the Navy of creating more and more of these vast floating airfields? Not that I know of, seriously. There is some amateur opposition, but no serious that I know. I see. And you are committed now to building more and more of those floating air bases. Well, we're committed to control the sea, and you have to have that or else abandon control of the 70% of the Earth's surface that's covered by water and live in the 2% that we occupy in the United States of America. What about the argument that you hear over and over again that one lucky hit and poof, there goes millions and millions and millions of dollars on these aircraft carriers? Well, that's never been true that there's been one lucky hit. But you're in the atomic age now? Yeah, that's right. We like that. That makes the aircraft carrier that much more powerful. That makes it that much more versatile. And your sting is 400 to 1. Maybe if you carry 400 planes, you've got 400 chances to carry the attack. Is that the idea? I don't know if I would reduce it arithmetically quite that way. But the point is that the carrier is an offensive weapon. And atomic weapons are offensive too. And the offensive punch of these ships has just increased astronomically by virtue of the introduction of atomic weapons. You think you're ahead of the Russians in that possibility? Well, remember, we have a 30-year history of successful operation of aircraft carriers. And we have a national history of victory at sea. But if we can carry A-bombs in these small planes off the decks of aircraft carriers, can't they? They don't have any aircraft carriers. Well now, sir, thank heavens. As a final question, our Navy is maintained today in a state of readiness, even for war on the worldwide scale, isn't it? Within the limitations of our overall size, we are well ready to perform our missions. Yes, sir. I'm sure that our audience is very much appreciated. These forthright statements from you, Mr. Phil Burden. Thank you for being with us. Thank you. The editorial board for this edition of the Laun Jean Chronoscope was Mr. William Bradford Huey and Mr. Cecil Carnes. Our distinguished guest was the Honorable John F. Floberg, Assistant Secretary of the Navy for Air. You know, one of the virtues of our free enterprise system is the benefit to the public from goods of better quality and lower prices, which spring from free and open competition. And certainly the stimulus of competition has resulted in making Laun Jean watches ever finer and finer. And it was in free and open competition that Laun Jean watches themselves won 10 World's Fair Grand Prizes, 28 gold medals, and highest honors for accuracy from the great government observatories. And so Laun Jean became, in fact, the world's most honored watch. For their superior qualities of excellence, elegance, greater accuracy, and longer life, Laun Jean watches have become the first choice of the discriminating men and women of every country of the free world. So if you wish to buy a very fine watch, either for yourself or as a gift, look for the true quality in the watch you buy, and your choice will be Laun Jean, the world's most honored watch, premiere product of the Laun Jean Wittner Watch Company. Since 1866, maker of watches of the highest character. We invite you to join us every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday evening at this same time for the Laun Jean Chronoscope, the television journal of the important issues of the hour, broadcast on behalf of Laun Jean, the world's most honored watch, and Wittner distinguished companion to the world-honored Laun Jean. 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