 It's September the 2nd, it's Wednesday, it's 11 o'clock, that can mean only one thing, it's Trump week. I'm Tim Apachele, your host, and with us this week is Stephanie Dalton, Jay Fidel, and Winston Welch. Welcome everybody. Thank you, Tim. Well, you know the title of the show is Wisconsin's Governor to Trump, Don't Come Here. You know if you really think about it, Donald Trump, since the RNC has taken a page right out of Richard Nixon's playbook, I'm the law and order president. I mean it's almost page for page word for word. You know that he's, he's the defender of suburbia. He's the defender of Housewives in suburbia. And if the Democratic Party specifically Joe Biden that is permissive of anarchist thugs and agitators. And Donald Trump did a fairly successful job on Friday night when he had the last night of the RNC. And a lot of people were concerned that Joe Biden, you know, has to respond to it. But the bottom line is, Richard Nixon back in the day was quite successful 1968 to paint the Johnson administration as permissive because we had writing in the streets we had college campuses, you know rocks being thrown and it was a horrible time for America and the difference was that it's true that President Johnson was responsible for a lot of the violence that was taking place. This time around, Donald Trump is using the same tactic but he's the president of the United States. And I find that glaringly odd that he's pulling that page out of Nixon's playbook but it's his administration that's causing this problem, particularly being non attentive to some of the racial tensions and difficulties and not paying attention to some of the abuses in the police department. And all the things that are sparking this, this unrest and Donald Trump is mute to that, but he he's the defender of suburbia and certainly against rioting and looting and all the things that the boogeyman is coming to get you for it down the road here. So, Jay, to you. What do you think about Donald Trump strategy of painting Joe Biden as permissive and the radical socialist that's going to allow suburbia to go to hell in a handbasket, yet it's under his administration that is causing this reminds me of one of my early cases in the practice of law. And the other guy made a really flimsy ridiculous argument, and the judge said, you know, that's a ridiculous argument. And then the lawyer said, yeah, but that's all I got. Well, you know, I think that's the answer that everyone in America should hear. I think that's the perfect answer. The story of yours is exactly what America needs to hear because that's all he has. Well, you know, you talked about it last time but he has no platform. It's what he had for breakfast how many hamburgers, and you know he just makes it up every day every hour. And this is, you know, the thrill of the moment. And so, I think if you look carefully I don't know if Fox News looks carefully I don't think they do. But if you look carefully, we see that he's fomenting the violence. It's not only that it's happening. He's making it happen. That makes it worse. Not only is he a sitting president who could stop it, but he's a sitting president who foments it, let the dog whistles, and all these encouragement so you know the people who do it or wouldn't do it. I mean it's outrageous Tim, and I just can't understand why anybody would support him and yet they do. And after almost four years now I'm convinced that Donald Trump, you know, puts on his bunny slippers and, you know, puts a hamburger aside on the side table and sits in this chair and watches Fox, and takes direction from Tucker Carlson and Hannity and the like. And one of the things if you notice on Fox News is that Tucker Carlson was propping up the 17 year old shooter with his AR-15, Kyle Rittenhouse. So Donald Trump didn't prop him up but he certainly didn't condemn him. And I find that really unsettling that he refused to condemn him. And not only did Donald Trump refuse to do it but his chief of staff on the news on Sunday did the same thing. He refused to actually condemn this individual that came across state lines and brought in his AR-15 right on the open streets, walked right past policemen and killed two people and wounded one. And did Donald Trump have any words against him? Not one. Did Donald Trump have any words against the Patriot prayer group that came, you know, riding in on their posse down the streets and shooting protesters with paintballs and spraying them with paint? No, Donald Trump didn't condemn them. He said, well, you know, paint is a defensive tactic. They're not bullets. Are you kidding me? I mean Donald Trump said, go ahead, agitate, go ahead, shoot the crowd up with paintballs. That makes us look stronger and better. I can't believe this president, well I can believe it, but this president has, you're right Jay, has taken the tactic that I want to promote the violence so I could be the savior to stop the violence. And tell that to all the suburban housewives in America that I and only I can fix this. And that's what he does. That's what he's trying to do. Well, it's tragic. Tragic Tim that a guy without a platform only shiny objects, only this really bizarre thing about pasting every problem on his and his adversary's opponent, and in creating problems and then pasting him on his opponent. He stands a fair chance at winning. Michael Moore, you know, predicted a few days ago. I mean a lot of people think Michael Moore is over the side himself. Michael Moore predicted a few days ago that Trump was going to win. Now I'm not saying because he said that it really means a lot, but it's a it's a seductive possibility that he will win. He will monkey up the post office. He will suppress voters. He will confuse housewives all over suburban America and other things we don't know about yet. He's looking for opportunities, and maybe he'll win. And that's when I put my application in for permanent residents in Tasmania. Okay, Stephanie. Not listening to the Michael Moore interview, but feeling fairly dejected fairly depressed. After Donald Trump, I thought did a fairly effective job of trying to paint Joe Biden as a permissive Democrat that you know is representative of the thugs and the anarchists and the radical socialists. And I was going, Where's Joe Biden? Where's Joe Biden and all this? Well, on Monday Joe Biden came out. And, and I think for 20 minutes, did an outstanding job of trying to refute that which Donald Trump is trying to paint him in the corner in. And just was wanting to hear your thoughts about how well you thought Joe Biden did on Monday in that 20 minute speech. Well, I think it's such an important point that you make. I think he did come out, and I like the way he expressed himself. It wasn't shouting screaming and rebutting it was this is what it is. And he did it again today or at least or maybe the tape I saw was old. And I think that he's making the point that now is being echoed through all the progressive networks that, by the way, all this is going on under Donald Trump's administration that Biden hasn't been an officer eight, eight, five, six years, five years, four years. And what is what is this is another one of those fantasy disaster fantasies that he is playing with his race and they for some how they somehow take that on even though it's, it's not real what's happening now is Trump's not Biden's, although, and I understand that one thing driving this because I've talked to people heard them real on about the people AOC, and I mentioned that she's our representative. What is it. Oh yeah but she's really dangerous and now we have this crazy California person. So I, I do think you're, you were right on to call him out he responded to it you pick that up. I think we saw it it was adequate as far as I was concerned, the echoing of it through the capillary system of the networks is really important. And I got to tell you Joe Biden did what I thought he did very naturally. And the quote of the day for that 20 minutes speech was, you know me. Do I look like a radical socialist and soft and have a soft spot for writers. That's what needed to happen he needed to take Donald Trump on almost word for word to refute the lies that Donald Trump is trying to paint him as and I think that that 20 minutes was gave me a lot of hope again because I was getting very concerned and to the network to Tim because they're also saying we know him from all of these years in office not to mention his vice presidency. So we know a lot about him and it's ludicrous that he could be painted in that manner. Hey Winston did you have a particular moment of Joe Biden moment on Monday that you thought was a fairly effective way to refute Donald Trump. It's because it says top intelligence officials will not brief the house anymore and I thought oh that's quite interesting isn't it on activities where we know that Russians and other state agents will be involved in manipulating or trying to manipulate the election and so CNN feed just kicked up and reminded me of that. You know, the thing about Joe Biden is that, you know, he's not exactly he's is he a radical socialist. No, he likes buying fine neckties and suits and eating in great restaurants. The man is not a radical socialist what he is not. Really is Donald Trump. That is his biggest selling point right now to the American people but there was another great article in. I thought recently that was that came out in a box which was can anything change Americans minds about Donald Trump it came out on the second which was this today. It seems like a long time ago and the scheme of things because so much happens. I don't think that I don't know maybe just more chaos and anarchy. Will that will that just strengthen both sides and have people retreat or will those soccer moms indeed say you know what it is time for just a normal nice guy. I don't care if he wants health care for everybody or not maybe Joe Biden strategy needs to be that everybody who lives in a server and zip code gets a white embossed Bible with a gun. I don't know to calm whatever fears that that Donald Trump is able to play on. He has that solid 42% that was mentioned in that article about it was great article by the way. The difference is shrinking. You expect that right after a convention and a convention public and national convention was only a few days ago. You expect that but you know I like to add something to this whole thing about how well Biden did fact is that here in Trump week. On a number of occasions we said, where is he Trump is hitting him left and right, you know and he's not hitting back. Why is he not hitting back. Well I think you could you could argue that he's not hitting back because it's this thing about go low and go high and you know we'll let Trump fall in his own sword and all that. I'm not sure that works in today's America. I think and I like to ask you guys how you feel about this I think every time Trump attacks Biden, or lies, either way, maybe the same thing that Biden should respond. It's not going to cost him anything because the press will come around and hear his respectful response. You know, ladies and gentlemen, I'd like you to know that Donald Trump has lied about the following things today. I just want to set the record straight every day. And I think that's perfect point and that's what I said last week is you never leave a room when someone is lobby to lie against you and there's people in that room that may make accepted as gospel truth. And maybe that's my way of thinking and I've always thought that way but people say well, you know Tim you really shouldn't lower yourself down to their level. I'm not sure why addressing their slanderous, you know, libelous lies. And I said no, because you don't know you never know what someone's going to accept as the truth versus a lie. True. And Donald, I mean excuse me and Joe Biden I think did an effective job on Monday. In fact, this particular point I want to bring out is, he said, I want to safe America, safe from COVID, safe from crime, and looking safe from from a for a vaccine. And he said I want to save, save, save from bad cops. Let me be crystal clear. I want us to be safe for four more years of Donald Trump. So, I think, I think you're right Jay is that for not maybe every lie that Donald Trump tells because we know he has over 20,000 of them, but certainly the ones that are going to land a blow on on Joe Biden's ability to garnish votes. And he doesn't have to lie to do this. He doesn't even have to raise his voice. All these got to be is that you know a fair minded commentator saying, I just want to be sure you understand that he lied. And that's my I don't know if it's every day every couple days maybe, but it shouldn't be once every two weeks. There isn't enough time. Now as the point with MSNBC where immediately after Donald Trump is done with the podium, they bring on their fact checker immediately. And it's, I call him a kid he looks like he looks like about 22 year old kid, but the kid looks like he's haggard he's worn down he, you know, he's, he looks defevilled because he can't keep up with Donald Trump's lies. Well, can I just mention that you may have seen it but actually Joe Biden suggested and said it would be wonderful to have that running commentary across the bottom of the screen. When they both speak or when he speaks or if they happen to do the debate which I hope maybe they don't do and take Nancy Pelosi's advice. A running line across the bottom that that reads out the fact checking as it is happening as the speech is happening right well let's let's go. The commentators then discussed that as something that's been studied and the conclusion was that actually nobody pays any attention to that. Okay, or not much with the finding was that they there wasn't much attention paid to it. So I think that what it does is highlight this dilemma. It doesn't matter if he lies. Okay, well it does. It doesn't matter. Yes, it matters in the big picture but for the people that are going to put him back in. That doesn't matter and that's okay but you know we're we're Joe Biden and the Democratic Party are fighting for the hearts and souls of about 11% of the voting population. We know the Democrats who are in their silos they're in their silos we know the you know the Trump, the Trump begins that the 42 to 44% they're in their silos, we're fighting for the hearts and souls of about less than 910%. And that's the target audience that everyone has to you know is vying for. So Winston let me ask you this, do you think it's a good idea that Joe Biden has suggested that he would debate Donald Trump only if there is a fact checker on site. You know it won't matter because anyone tuning in it, we're already in our silos you're right it's that 11% that we're looking for so what it is is people need to look back and that that question that they always ask every four years. Are you and your family and our nation better off than you were four years ago I mean that's just like the simple basic one. And people might say well COVID aside of COVID hadn't come in and the Chinese virus and the Democrats and Obama and you know God and everybody else who caused this. Yeah we'd be having a roaring economy and you know, black unemployment so lowest it's been in a while and blah blah blah that will be a message that's out there, however, if you just take a look at the nightly news the country is in in such turmoil. It's stoked by the President who's going to who is specifically asked not to come to cities because he's so inflammatory. The economy is not healthy it's it's it's collapsing around us and so many important Donald Trump's world that the Dow the Nasdaq and the S&P is the economy. Donald Trump and it's better than ever in fact it's it's reached even the late February 2020 highs. Well if you and if you have that $100 million house in LA while you've got 20,000 homeless people surrounding you on the streets and that's the kind of America you want to live in. That's the kind of America you want to live in but for the rest of us we can look around and we can say you know what actually things aren't better. I don't want to talk to my friends and my neighbors anymore because I'm feeling disconnected from them in reality we probably still share a huge majority of our values but one person and an and an ideology, and I just wonder when Donald Trump is gone, although Trumpism will last beyond him. I wonder if when he finally goes if people will wake up and then say, you know what I was, I liked him. I didn't really like his message. Because what is the message just chaos and dissension and violence that's not a message that is resonating with with most Americans but he has somehow captured their hearts and minds and so if he is hopefully, you know, God willing, you know what I did. And it's, it's very clear to America that that has happened. We need to capture the hearts and minds back of Americans. We need to hand out an olive branch every each and every one of us because I recall the 2000 election between Al Gore and George Bush Jr. And there was some really hard feelings for at least 12 months after that election it really. In fact, for some it never was that was never healed that election and I think this is going to be far worse, no matter who wins. There are going to be some really polarization of Americans and I think no matter who wins one side to the other needs to hold out on olive branch and say you know, ultimately we're Americans. There's a lot of people say that Tim but you know it's hard to get everybody to do that. Everybody's in a silo I want to go back to the question you posed and that is whether it's a good idea for Biden to actually engage in a debate. And I keep thinking of how Trump got behind Hillary Clinton. Do you remember that in the Clinton Trump debates. He got behind her. He stalked her on stage. He stalked her on stage. And that was obviously a dirty move. Okay, and there will be much dirtier moves like that beyond that. The other thing the idea about having a running title of, you know, is he telling the truth, having the fact checkers. A lot of these lies are more complicated than he's telling the truth he's not telling the truth. He's mischaracterizing. You know, I mean, you go to court you find certain lawyers do that all the time. And judges get fooled by it. And so I mean the public will be fooled. The fact checker won't be able to move fast enough. Won't be able to. Well, you know what, maybe Joe Biden says, I don't buy it. Donald Trump, I don't buy it. And let's let the facts checkers come out tomorrow and prove you to be lying as I think you are right now. Yeah, but I want to go back to the whether he should have this debate at all. Okay, and my answer is no he shouldn't. He can make it much better impression if he, if he does what he did on Monday, and he can talk to us fireside chat, he can connect with us, can ask us to understand him as a human being. He can comment on the crazy things that Trump says, why does he have to engage with the guy. Well, let me let me ask you this. Let me let me ask you this, Jason, how does don't how does Joe Biden respond to the ultimate criticism that's going to occur saying, see, Joe Biden isn't up to it mentally. He can't take on Donald Trump because he's feeble. And he knows that if he's not on a script that he will fall apart if there is a, you know, a live debate in front of all of Americans. Joe Biden is going to be lobbied against Joe Biden and I will guarantee you it will land some blows and we'll take away votes. However, can I just say he's proven himself so many times. One at a time go ahead, Jay, then I'll get to you Stephanie. I Joe Biden have a lot of experience in in dealing with pathological people. And I don't want to deal with him. You can just listen to me you can listen to him, you can get the flavor of who we are. I don't want to have the dirty tricks. I don't want to have to engage with him and listen to his ad hominem attacks. That's what he does. That's what he's going to do. Why should you listen to that. That's not the way you should select the president. Let me tell you my platform. And incidentally he doesn't have a platform. I mean, you know, there's so many things if you do now I agree that some people may love to see a good fight. But on the other hand, it's a lot of people would respond to that I would personally respond to that. I don't want to see them, you know, get bloody on the stage doesn't mean anything to me. That's not the way you select the president. And Trump is going to do that. Okay, thank you, Jay. Stephanie go ahead. Thanks. Sorry for overlapping. I actually didn't hear Jay anyway. You know, he has, Biden has taken on many of these challenges and the most maybe the most recent of this of this ilk is the is Sarah Palin. I mean, he has no problem. This is an educated man. He is perfectly capable and that that issue is not the important one for me. I'd like to submit that. I respect Nancy Pelosi who has come up with just the best ways of handling this man, which is not invite him to use the House of Representatives for his state of the Union speech. Okay, that got his attention. Okay, and now she's suggesting Joe Biden does not need to. It's not in the Constitution. This is another norm. So this is one that Joe Biden can break. And I, I understand your, your well established concern, Tim, but I think it's much less of a concern compared to the advantage that Joe Biden would have by taking control of this and getting his message out more, you know, more vociferously than he is for the points that he needs to make and the platform that he needs to share. So I'm, I'm thinking here's a question to you when's the last time a president was elected without a debate. Well, we're talking Lincoln Douglas, okay, so maybe before that, but I don't know the history before that you need that we need the historian on. Winston, Winston, you're going to be our historian when's the last time a president was elected without a debate between the two candidates. Well, I mean, these debates are happening whether we want to or not so that's There you go. Okay, there's the answer right there. And you know, we got I, Chris Wallace is not. He's a reasonable person. He's willing to call Donald Trump out, and he will for Joe Biden to and ask him hard and fair questions. You know, they were determined. He's from Fox News. So the Fox News people feel they'll have someone in their corner. The other three I thought were also I don't know about the one fellow Steve. I can't remember his last name, but in any event, hopefully they will moderate this well but you remember back when Reagan what it must I don't know if it was against Carter but when he said, There you go again, something like that. That's what Joe Biden needs to do when when Donald Trump is having a tantrum is he just can look at it like, can you see here folks to compare and contrast which would you rather have in the White House and who is going to respond to your needs who's not taking away your guns who's going to let you go to church, just wear a mask, socially space whatever, but the country's going to go back to normal, or do you want for more worse, much, much worse years of chaos and destruction to the point where I think that would this is all that that that he has to do. They are both senior citizens they're both have, you know, I mean, if if if Biden wants to say something so why did you deny your strokes when that wasn't an issue before or I mean he he shouldn't go to that level he was not into the question. I get you. I want to go back to Donald Trump's the focus of the show is Donald Trump's attempt to, you know, fan the flames of violence and pin it on Joe Biden. Did you happen to watch Laurel Ingram interview Donald Trump, particularly about the part where you know Joe Biden is being advised by, quote unquote, people in the dark shadows, almost a q non q non conspiracy kind of air to it and and to Laura Ingram's credit I mean she kind of said what can you what do you mean dark shadows. I mean he he made all sorts of crazy references on that interview. And that was one of them and the other one which I thought was rather shocking was comparing the policemen that shocked Jake, Jacob Blake, in the back seven times, comparing that to someone who's having a bad day on the golf field on the golf course, and choking at a three foot putt putt. And, you know, again, the things that Donald Trump says is so obtuse to the situation of which he's commenting upon. I'm just wondering again for the 42 to 44%. I'm sure they're just thinking that's great thing for him to say but I got to ask you know I wish I could get a 11% in a room and a focus group and say, How does that strike you how does that impact. I mean, we're thinking about voting for Donald Trump and doesn't make a difference that he says he's outlandish crazy things. Don't forget his thing about the airplane, full of people in dark suits who look like yes they're flying in Antifa in black shirts and pants, and they're flying them in on airlines, which he got again from guess where Fox News. There's some weird Facebook posts or somebody, you know, it's just crazy, but when somebody says, Well, you know, it's about the, well, I can't tell, but you know, then that invites people's own minds to put in whatever theory they want to put in there rather than just a simple fact. You know, the more interviews he does like that, the more we see the more it exposes. I think the better it is for him to have even a box of interviews, they are revealing what's there and what's not there. Yeah, well as usual, we're running out of time this is 28 minutes just isn't enough time to handle the topic of Donald Trump. Winston your prediction for the week to come. Oh, it's just like, you know, Captain Kirk sitting down and saying disaster report and then just holding on as what happened. All right, we'll look for Captain Kirk in his big swivel chair. Jay Fidel, please your your prediction for the week to come. Oh, there'll be there'll be a tax on Biden for sure. But there'll also be very bizarre things that he does with government. There are things he has no authority to do we saw that this week, and everybody says, Oh, my God, he can't do that and yet he doesn't. And the more he does that the more he distracts us from the fact that we have COVID and a failing economy. All right, thank you, Jay. Stephanie, your last thoughts. I just wanted to share my side of it that there's no waking up. Okay, so hopefully of the 11%. There are those that are open minded and and looking to logic and values and our norms as Americans. But there's for those who are empowered by this administration. They are not going to wake up it's just like when you're divorced and you're looking at you know this other person they're not going to wake up after the divorce or whatever they're there in their place. I don't know if someone writes a check. They're not waking up as far as the convictions and the and the values that you know you're you're wanting to to bestow for everybody have access to it. And that's one place where I'm trying to organize myself prepare myself to deal with my fellow Americans, who are of this ill, and who are empowered right now, and please might be empowered again, and please hopefully not but you know we're all in this boat. Okay, it's Stephanie. Thank you. We're we've run out of time and I wish to say thank you Stephanie. Thank you Jay. Thank you Winston for coming on Trump week. I'll see you next week. I'm Tim Apachella, the host. See us next week 11 o'clock Wednesday Trump week aloha.