 Good morning. Welcome to House Human Services Committee. This is Thursday, January 27th. The first part of our committee meeting today will be a discussion and reflection on Prop 5, Declaration of Rights, the Right to Personal Reproductive Liberty, and at the end of our discussion, I will be entertaining a motion for action. Okay. Last night, we had a public hearing where there were 70 people signed up, I believe, and I can be corrected by Julie if I am wrong, but I believe that while 70 people signed up, 60 people actually ended up testifying because 10 people, and it was evenly split in terms of positions on the amendment, 10 people did not show up. I was glad to see that one person who was not there in their order of which they had signed up actually came in with the end and so we're able to participate. We heard from that and we also were presented with two petitions from Vermonters for good government and Vermonters for common good, and those petitions are right here. All of these petitions are directed, both sets of petitions are directed at requesting us not to support passage of Prop 5. The first one from Vermonters for common good is a petition to my legislators to not put late term abortion in our Constitution. I'm going to, Carl, I see your hand and I will get to you in a second. Thank you. I'm going to perhaps put legislative counsel on the spot, but my understanding is that there is a federal law that prohibits late term abortion and that positions will infect. There is not a medical, that is not a medically correct term, and that there is a actual federal law that prohibits late term abortions. Yes, I believe so and I can get you that information and send it to an email at all to the committee. Okay, but that is my statement accurate. Yes. Okay, thank you. You know, I'm sorry, this is a discussion in committee and I realize and folks who are listening, we happen to have someone in the committee room who just asked to speak. This is not a time we have finished taking testimony. The committee that we have finished taking testimony and I will ask the legislative, I will ask the Sergeant at Arms to remove the person in the room if they do not keep quiet. Carl. Thank you, Madam Speaker. I was just going to say I thought it was a very respectful hearing last night. Unfortunately, we were not able to bring the parties together in the name of our creator and simultaneously satisfying women's issues before us. But I thought it was well run and basically respectful of each other. Obviously, I'm not happy with the ultimate outcome. Not that we decided yet, but I just have a feeling. Anyway, that's an upset at this point until we get to the vote. Thank you. Thank you, Representative Rosenquist. And I want to say personally, it means a lot to me to hear you say that the hearing was run respectfully. And I meant it when I said at the end of the hearing that I really was thankful and impressed with not just the committee, but everyone who was in the well of the house as well as who testified in terms of the thoughtfulness and the respect for the clarity of their different opinions. But the way that they presented them. So thank you. OK. And so we have a lot of those. And I want to say these positions. And so folks, I want to encourage you to look at them. They are directed to individuals of us. These were I think people could click on appears that people could click online and then send them in for some of these. And this. The second one is the second petition, which is in the larger box down here is to the committee in general from Vermonters for good government and who are opposed to Prop Proposal five. And they one are concerned about. That there that there is a rough to get prop five article twenty two through the legislative process. I want to remind people and folks who are listening that this is the this has been a four year process. It started in two thousand and nineteen when there was it went through the Senate and then the House and there was a public hearing in the House. In two thousand nineteen. It then was was passed by the Senate. In a new biennium and we got this committee got proposition five assigned to us in April of two thousand and twenty. We did not take it up then. We have taken it up now. We had two weeks of testimony and a public hearing. So this is a four year process. And again, as I said, at the end of the hearing. What we are doing is putting this on the ballot. And for whatever your position is, this is what is what is important is that you state your is not in a petition and you know, but rather on the on the ballot and vote yes or no on November on Election Day or when you get. And in fact, I believe that ballots are going to be male. I believe that number are. Oh, thank you. Now, you will be everybody you will not even have to go to the polls and you can, in fact, it will be mailed out to you probably sometime in October. Forty five days before. Forty five days before Election Day. So you will be able to vote by mail in terms of number eight. It won't arrive to you. Forty five days before Election Day. But and the petition goes on to express. That Vermont voters were attacked for trying to speak out about this bad proposal. I'm not aware of that. They certainly were not in the well of the house that we heard last night. And the these are they are alarmed. So the article twenty two would enshrine late term abortion. Anything goes abortion in the Constitution. You just sort of cover that in terms of late term abortion is well, not illegal, not a medical term is a term that is used, is used in federal law and it is not allowed. Remove conscience rights from doctors and nurses who do not wish to perform abortions or sterilizations. I think while there are differences of opinion on how that goes, we have gotten some very clear testimony, written testimony that one, there is a part of federal law that folks have to and please, anyone else add to my my memory and my recollection as to what we are doing. There's a con there's it's protected. One's one's conscience rights, whether they are for, whether they relate to performing an abortion, whether they relate to performing blood transfusions or other medical procedures that are contrary to one's religious views. Those conscience rights are, in fact, protected. And at the same time, medical medical institutions have to balance in an emergency the health and safety of a individual. And there's also a whole ethical process that at later that the medical that all of the providers in Vermont do require taxpayer funding of radical policies, regardless of what elected officials or voters desire. This may refer to I'm not quite sure what this refers to. But Vermont has since, I believe, the time of Governor Madeleine Cunin supported low income for Monters who are on Medicaid. They use we use state funds for those instances where they need an abortion. Or for that matter, when people need any kind of reproductive health care decisions and it will prevent future generations from weighing in on these important issues through the democratic process. I want to clarify that, in fact, this is as in other constitutional amendments. There is a process by which people can go to court and challenge it. And as we learn, I imagine that this, you know, people may challenge people challenge constitutional issues. And that this is part of the this is part of the democratic process. Amending the Constitution in Vermont is a is a live living document. The last time we amended the Constitution was I think was when we allowed 18 year olds to vote in the primary, if they 17 year olds to vote in the primary, if they were going to be 18 by November, we have and there are two actually proposals to amend the Constitution that voters will be. And that is actually part of the democratic process. And if it's built into our state constitution, that it can be amended. But. Vermont is for good government. Those so we have lots of lots of petitions in terms of that. I don't know if anyone I will be. Representative McFawn will is not able to be here right this moment. He will be coming as on as soon as he can. And as is our practice in this committee, if we take an action, we will leave the vote open till the end of the day so that that individual can vote. I'm does anyone Carl has made a comment around the hearing. Is anyone want to reflect on what we heard at the hearing or what we've heard in the last two weeks. I'm happy to do that, Madam Chair. I just wanted to let the committee know that last night I went home and I thought a lot about what I wanted to say today and I didn't want to just speak off the cuff. I wanted to really write it down. So I'm, I'm going to read what I wrote last night before I went to sleep. And I just, this is something that I've been thinking about throughout the summer. And then when we all came together and heard testimony here in this room, and then the test went last night. So, of course, Sorry about that. Okay. So I don't know about you all but last week when I learned that it was a 49th anniversary of row versus way. And that the year before that was the Vermont's where Vermont's courts made a decision to throw out an anti abortion law. I was kind of surprised I knew it was about that, but for half a century, individuals in this country have had reproductive liberty. My whole reproductive life. I have had the freedom to decide in the privacy of my home, my family and my healthcare providers, whether to use contraception or not, whether to have a child or not. But now it dawn on me that I had taken it all for granted. Now, all of that could be taken away with support for row eroding in the US Supreme Court and growing concerns about diminishing federal protections. It is absolutely possible that our federal government to allow states to change this and put state legislators in charge of making reproductive decisions for the people of Vermont. It actually scares me to think that my daughter and my three sons might not have. Sorry. The same rights that I grew up with that we would actually go backwards. Last night when I heard that governor Ronald Reagan in 1967, a Republican governor signed a law to guarantee legal safe abortions in California because entire floors at some hospitals were taken up with women who were critically ill after trying to end their pregnancies at home. I remember why this change to Vermont's Constitution is so incredibly important to me. I want these decisions to remain between individuals and their healthcare providers, not in state houses. I am 100% supportive of amending Vermont's Constitution. This amendment protects everyone's right to reproductive freedom as we all heard. The right to use or not use temporary or permanent birth control, the right to use or not use or perform sterilization and the right to carry a pregnancy to term or not. Most importantly for me is that this allows all reproductive decision making to remain between the individual and their physician or other healthcare provider. My husband, my daughter, and my niece went into the field of medicine to take care of their patients in the best way they know how. They were trained and educated to help their patients to understand and learn about the pros and cons of every decision they make with regard to their physical health and their mental well-being. Why should their reproductive health needs be treated any differently? The right to this privacy is paramount. And finally, in my mind and my heart, I believe it is imperative that we allow Vermont voters to have the last word. Every voter should have the opportunity to make this decision for themselves, their family, their community, and their state. If we truly trust our fellow Vermont, how can we not bring this important decision to them? So I vote yes. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you. I was very eloquent. I regret that I didn't have time to write something. But this morning, as I was driving in, I really reflected about the testimony that we heard last night. I'm new to this body and I was honored to have that experience last night. That was very respectful and maybe really proud to serve in Vermont. I was also really moved to hear from so many brave women that shared their personal stories and really touching stories that brought tears to my eyes. And I was trying to describe some of the stories to my daughter and thinking about, you know, she is growing up in a life in a world where she can take it for granted. You know, at her age, it doesn't resonate, but I hope that it will, you know, with time, have some impact on her. I also found it really reaffirming to hear from religious and medical leaders last night in my support of the of proc five, the declaration of rights, the right to personal reproductive liberty. To support this proposition. I was really honored to hear from so many people that came out last night, and I'm really proud to live in a state and serve in a state that prioritizes an individual's right to personal reproductive liberty. And I will make that a pass. Thank you. Thank you representative. Does anyone else want to say anything. Thank you. One is, as a person who thinks that abortion should be legal, but safe and rare. I think that this does go too far. It is not prescriptive of the state's compelling interest as the trimesters go along. I think Reagan isn't quite accurate. He did do that, but he quickly regretted that it was part of a deal that he didn't expect it to pass just sort of the records clear on that. He didn't expect it to pass and he quickly regretted doing so. And he was a champion against abortion for most of his life. And that I think that for me, whether I agree with this proposition or not, and I definitely don't agree with the emotional side of, you know, insisting that we're going to go back to the 50s, which is just not going to happen. I certainly don't support Texas's law, which I think is a little bit on the extreme side. We have a very different situation of Vermont where we just did age 57. So, these, these protections are already in place. But my vote on this prop that today is not going to be whether or not I think it's good or bad. I will be voting on whether or not I think the people who are not deserve the right to vote on it or not. And they do. So, I just want to make it say anything before I call for it. Thank you. I also had very difficult time writing remarks this morning. I have been in support of prop five I have spoken out in support of prop five and in recognizing that so often we talk about this we talk about it as a women's issue and it very much is very much women's issue. But the the amendment itself is so much more expansive than a women's issue or just focusing on abortion and I think of my own identities in the way that they show up in the access to the care that I'm able to receive here in the state of Vermont. And I wanted to know that we would in trying this in our Constitution means that not only would that be like saving care for myself, but I think of the trans youth in our state, I think of other trans people who needs this care. And although so many of us consider abortion and contraception and pregnancy to be in a women's issue. So I want to expand that to include, of course, lesbian and bisexual women and transgender men, non binary people, gender non conforming people it is inclusive of our full community and it is needed because across identities people can get pregnant. And I can use contraception, and I can have abortions and carry pregnancies and parent and we should all be able to engage in those decisions and consultation of course with our medical community but it is a difficult and personal decision. So I'm proud to vote yes on this proposition today. And I think this is one of, you know, I'm a new member to this body but I think this is one of the most important votes that I will be taking at my time here. There'll be more opportunities, I would entertain a motion. So I'm going to move for us to vote on the composition. Oh, in favor, in favor, okay there is a motion on the table to support passage, looking forward prop five. Is there a second. A second. Okay, and there's a second by representative from said. Make the motion and the second there is another opportunity and the structure for comments. Carl or anyone else want to make any comment before the clerk calls the roll representative rose inquest. I just like to say it is with a heavy and sad heart that I approach this vote. We were unable to bring bring the creators law and the law of reproductive freedom together in a common place and unfortunately, like so many good laws in our country. There's some of some of God and some of man in those laws so and we were unable to do that and I feel very sad and to start and I will be voting. No, I'm sure. Thank you representative rose inquest. If there's no other discussion, the court shall commence to call the roll representative would. Yes. Representative small. Yes. Representative rose inquest. No representative garfun. Yes, representative Whitman. Yes. Representative pile. Yes representative Greg war. Yes. Representative noise. Yes. Representative promise that yes representative pume. Did you. I didn't call representative McFawn, because, okay, we will hold it up. Okay, represent you. Yes. And as I spoke before. Yep. Yes. I will vote until the representative upon avail. The tentative vote is nine in favor. And one opposed, and we will close the vote when representative McFawn is back from his appointment. Thank you committee. We will now take a break. And this will end the first half of the morning session of the Vermont House Human Services Committee when we come back, we will be coming back 1015 and we will be hearing about COVID updates as it relates to childcare and three settings. Thank you.