 All right, here's something that can help you out when it comes to your health. When you're introduced to novel foods, foods that humans haven't eaten for like thousands of years, foods that basically have come into the horizon in a new time or modern times. When you're looking at those foods, remember this, guilty until proven innocent. I know the opposite is how we talk about our justice system, but when it comes to new foods, assume they're bad until they're proven, absolutely proven that they're fine, that they're okay. Doing this will probably save you a lot when it comes to your health. So remember the term guilty until proven innocent. Got this one from Max. I didn't think, uh, did he actually say it like that? He did. Yeah, Max Levier taught me this. Okay, so I love it. I don't, was that when we were in London, he said that to you? I don't remember. He did and I wrote it down and I put his name under it because you guys tease me and said that I take quotes and don't, I mean I actually don't remember that, nor did I have any idea where you were going with that whatsoever. But I do like that, um, I do like that philosophy. Like I think that is when, at least in regards to nutrition, I think that we're so quick to jump on the newest, uh, you know, supplement. We're always so quick to jump on to a bar because it meets the macros, um, versus going like, you know, ideally, and you've heard me talk about this on the show many times. Like that's my thought process. I even talk about shakes and protein bars this way, that, that's not considered a perfect day for me. Even if I hit my macros that I would be following, uh, if, if it was done with shakes and bars, it's not a perfect day. A perfect day for me is could I hit my macros and could I do it through whole foods? And then how many of those days can I string together? To me, that was always the goal when I was competing was like trying to string as many of those whole food days of hitting macros. That doesn't mean I beat myself up because I had to have a protein shake or a bar. It's just that I, I realized and recognized that eating a whole natural foods is always going to be superior, uh, for overall health, not necessarily for body composition and losing weight on the scale, but overall health, we're just not going to be able to beat whole, I know it's not, it's not as popular because, you know, artificial sugars in our space are like sort of, uh, highly contestable. Yeah. And you know, there's people that are, are very much trying to, um, sway their, their clients more in that direction because it's lower calorie and, but it's not innocuous. And so there's, this is one of those newer kind of segments of like sweeteners and like brand new things that they introduce into the market. We don't know the long term effects of, uh, some of these chemicals. Yeah. Well, it's also, uh, food doesn't just affect our physiological selves. It also affects us mentally. I mean, like, like you used artificial sweeteners, right? No calories. Okay. So you take it, okay. So it's nothing. It just goes through the body, but if it was nothing, you wouldn't use it. Why do you use it? It gives you the perception of sweetness can perceiving the sweetness, alter your behaviors. Of course it does. Otherwise you wouldn't seek it out. And what are those potential effects? Long term on your behaviors or eating habits and so on. So this conversation with max happened because we were talking about, uh, seed oils. There's a big debate on seed oils, right? And they're like, Oh, the data shows it's fine. Other people like, well, they're not good because in order to consume seed oils and the quantities that we do, uh, we have to process the hell out of them. It's like modern industrial technologies are able or what allow us to eat, you know, lots of, you know, rapeseed oil or canola oil or whatever, right? Um, that whole process probably not good. But then again, you have the people on the side are saying, well, the data so far isn't showing that it's bad. And max said, look, here's a deal. There are better oils that are already out there. We know olive oil. We've been eating it for thousands of years, requires almost no processing. You squeeze in olive, there's the oil and the data is very clear on the health benefits of all of us was like, why choose this thing over here that humans have not really been eating in large quantities for more than let's say 60 years or so over something that we know for sure is a good thing. And then he said, I like to use the term guilty until proven innocent. When a new food or new process emerges, then it's probably better. Now, this doesn't mean you're gonna be 100%. But it's probably better to assume it's not good until it's unequivocally, right? Completely unequivocally proven to be totally okay. Now, the reason for this is that we co evolved with our food. So all the food that we've eaten for thousands and thousands of years, right? So like animal proteins and plants and grains that don't require tons of processing, right? We've eaten those for thousands of years and our bodies over those thousands and thousands of years have evolved with these foods. So we know they're okay. All novel foods like a pop tart. Yeah, pop tart is made with other ingredients and all that stuff. But pop tarts have been around for how long 100 years maybe or 50 years. Probably safe to assume it's not going to be great for you. This is true for all foods that haven't existed for a long time. It's better to assume that they're guilty until proven innocent and that'll lead you more often than not. I'm not saying it's perfect. But more often than not, that's going to lead you in the right direction. And I like that he said that I think that makes a lot of sense because do we have hard data that shows that seed oils are super bad for you? No, there's some data that might suggest it and other data that suggests it might be okay. But there's nothing unequivocally, there's nothing like total unequivocally, like we've been having these for 200 years, we got all this data, you know, over generations, it looks like it's totally safe. We're not there yet. So let's just assume it's probably worse for us than like olive oil. At least keep an air of caution. Right? Like at least like sparingly with some of these more modern foods that came out and lean more heavily upon the whole foods where we know like over centuries, people have done well. I think you could have you can also have like a moderate attitude about this too, right? It's like it's so it reminds me of politics so much, right? You either have to be way left or way right. It's like no, I'm somewhere in the center in this like, I absolutely I'm drinking something right now that has you know, artificial sweeteners inside of it. So you can you can and if someone asked me, Hey, is that a health drink? I would say no, it's not. I'm aware of that. Right. I think I feel like that's the hardest part about communicating about the seed oils or any of these foods that are highly processed is that listen, I feel like I can communicate that it's I know it's not ideal for my body at the same time too. I'm not demonizing and saying like I would never touch something like that and I think that's I think that's the way I prioritize the right stuff. Right. That's the idea. Exactly. I think that's how I prefer to communicate is like listen again, 100% day looks like a day where I don't have to use any real processed foods. It's all whole natural foods and I've been able to hit my macros. Now, does that happen every single day? No, it doesn't happen every single day. But I also I'm not fooling myself into thinking that when I have all these processed foods and artificial sweeteners and things in my diet that I consider that completely feeding my body ideally like there's still a better version. And then and I feel like that's how we talk about fitness all time. It's like I'm always striving to be a better version of myself every single day. I'm not also going to beat myself up every time that doesn't happen to be a perfect day. I think you could be somewhere in the middle of this conversation and you don't have to be this, you know, dogmatic person who's just like demonizes vegetables and all you eat is carnivore or you don't have to be this. I'll never touch any of that hippie or you have to be this person who justifies it and then they consume nonstop all day along all these artificial sweeteners. It's like, I don't know. I'm somewhere in the middle of this. Yeah. No, I like what you're saying. I mean, look, here's like heavily processed foods is a good example. Heavily processed foods contain preservatives. They contain food, you know, things that color that change the color of them. So like artificial colors, they have sweeteners that maybe we didn't consume thousands of years ago or even hundreds of years ago. So they have all these things within them and we can debate whether or not they're good or bad and there's data that shows it probably okay. Data that might suggest it might not be okay. Some of its animal data. Can we trust that? Let's forget that for a second. Here's what we know for sure. Heavily processed foods for sure are processed to be hyper palatable for sure. They're designed to be so irresistible to your body's senses that they will, for a fact, cause you to overeat. We know this for a fact. We know that it's to the tune of about 600 calories a day. You'll consume more when all things are equal. If you're consuming heavily processed foods versus whole natural foods. Okay. So why is that important? We evolved with certain experiences with our foods and flavors. When we hijacked that, our primitive bodies don't know what to do. So all of our, our, you know, checks and balances like satiety, right, palate fatigue like palate fatigue is when you eat the same food for too long, you start to get sick of it. Like, you know, you eat like just a plain potato after a while. Like, I don't want to eat anymore. That's one checks and balances. Satiety is another checks and balances, right? You eat and then you're satisfied. Oh, I don't really want to eat much more. Okay. There's feeling of fullness. That's a checks and, that's a check and balance. Well, those are gone. Those are hijacked when you eat foods that are designed to go around those things. So you eat a bag of laced potato chips. You'll eat way more potatoes than if you just ate plain potatoes. Even though the calories are higher in fact with the, with the bag of chips because of the oil that they add. You'll eat way more, you'll eat four to five potatoes worth if you really push yourself. But I'd love to see somebody do, you know, four or five plain potatoes. So that alone, so I don't, you don't need to debate with me or we don't need to go down, like you said, the extreme path of every single ingredient. Maybe this data shows it. Here's an animal study. And what about this, that and the other? It's like, these foods are so addicting, they're designed to be addicting that you will overeat. And we know overeating is not good for you. So why are we even debating pretty much anything else? That's, that's like California is protecting us from red dice. So that's, that's the start. Today's program giveaway is maps and a Bollock advanced. If you want to win that program, you got to do this. Leave a comment below this video in the first 24 hours that we drop it. Subscribe to this channel and turn on notifications. If you win, we'll let you know in the comments section. We're also running a sale this month. Maps resistance, our beginner strength training program is half off. And then maps prime pro, this is for correctional exercise purposes. That's also 50% off. If you're interested in either one, just click on the link at the top of the description below. All right, here comes the show. That's broken clock sometimes, right? What's that term? Broken clock? What happened? What do they do? They're banning certain dies because of their effects on. Yeah, California is tackling the big issues. Yeah, I think because they affect some kids certain certain ways or whatever. Red die does that. Yeah, you brought that out. You brought that up my kid is affected by a red die. Oh, you know that specifically. Yes, dude. Really? Yes. If I give him like red, like gummy bears. Yeah. I just noticed it starts acting crazy. What? Yeah, dude. You are fucking high, bro. No, I'm not. There is no way you give your son a red gummy bear and you can tell all of a sudden he acts different. I can tell when he has anything with red die. So we avoid it. So, you know, we get Tylenol, we get it die free. Really? Because a lot of there's a lot. See, I've heard this a lot. Look up at look up red die and hyperactivity, Andrew, and you'll see. No, I know it's got negative. You've talked about it before, but why would it? Why would I be making it up about my kid? You really think you could tell a difference from him having that? Oh my God, really? Can you tell the difference when you give a kid sugar? Yes. Okay. That I definitely can tell. So I can tell the difference between sugar because he's had the other gummy bears and then we add the red ones in. It's in a whole another gear. What's the difference between the red die gummy bears and the other one that are sugar ones? What do you mean one of them is not sugar? Oh, I'm just saying, so, you know, sugar makes kids, well, it makes kids act a particular way, but red die number 40 has been connected to increased hyperactivity or ADHD. What is that most prevalent in? What is it? What do we see that in the most? Red, red processed foods. So if it's if it's it's a colored red. Yeah, it fits like our scale. So like red vines? Yes. Most like I would imagine fruit punch or anything else. Most common sources of red die 40 cereal, chips, sports drinks, baked goods, candy, soda, like Gatorade and all that. Oh, cereal too, huh? Yeah. Yeah. Hmm. Yeah. So if you're in chips. Yeah. That's a weird one for red died. Doritos. Oh, or like, uh, or fire Cheetos probably. Oh, God. Is fire Cheetos got it? All those. That's like the most popular chip in the world, isn't it? I remember to like look whenever I eat them, I'll take a look to see the ingredients and it's almost every time. Yeah. Why is your kid react to red die too? Not that I paid close enough attention to, but I'm just talking about like I'll just eat it really. You know I was crazy as hell. Sometime. You know, you know what happened? You know what happened? We gave him a paint. But I think it was Tylenol. And I was like, oh, he doesn't react well to Tylenol because he doesn't make him, he can't sleep. So I thought maybe it was the acetaminophen. Yeah. Then I had another acetaminophen that was dye free. So it was just like white colored. And he slept totally fine. That's when I started paying attention. Then every once in a while we'll get, um, like gummy bears or something like that. Mainly because dad likes gummy bears. You guys know this? Yeah. And I noticed it. And so I pointed out to Jessica. So we started paying attention. Sure enough. So whenever we do something like that, we take out the red, the red candies. So is that one of the, is that one of the dyes that they're pulling or they're I believe so? Yeah. Red dye number 40. And then there's another one. So it's going to be like red gummy bears on the black market real soon? I'm stocking them all up right now. Actually, red tamales. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No. Red dye number 40 is banned in Europe. Maybe look that up. Yeah. I don't know if red dye 40 is being banned, but I saw here starting in 2027, California, Gavin Newsom, signed a bill that prohibits red dye three, potassium bromate, a vegetable oil, and another thing, um, going into law. And it's already illegal. Those ingredients are already legal in the European Union and some other parts of the world. So Newsom does care about us. Yeah, that should, should help our crime and homeless problem. I want to know which lobby like what's, what's the angle here? Yeah. Because he's stocking them up because some of the black market is right at all. He's been saying. He hasn't where red dye is buried of all our problems. He just made the red gummy bear. Yeah. He cornered the red gummy bear market. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, have you ever seen that, by the way, have you ever seen those? You surprised me. Have you ever seen those memes of like Fruit Loops in America versus Fruit Loops in Europe or what have you never seen that? No. Oh, Andrew, look that up. They'll show the ingredients of like a popular cereal or something. Oh yeah, I've seen this. Versus one in Europe. Okay, let's talk about this. They use like beet, they use like beet juice to color it. We use like 15 chemicals. I swear that's like a cross because when we went out there just recently, like I felt like there was a lot more foods I could eat that I didn't have an immediate reaction to in terms of like. Everybody says that. Yeah. It was weird. It was strange. Even the drinks like, I'm sure there's a lot more added chemicals preserved is what not here in the state. Something. So, oh, do you have a picture of the ingredients? Oh, that's just like, they look different too. There's like ones that'll show the actual ingredients and you'll see. There you go. Look at the list of ingredients for the U.S. version versus the German version. Wow. Look at that. Can you, can you read the Yes, less than half. Bro, there's like seven ingredients in the in the German version. What the hell? Yeah, there's like at least three or four times more in the U.S. Yeah, dude. And then we had all kinds. Okay, no, no. Inundated chemicals. Yeah, but okay. Hold on. A big portion of that though is the fortified vitamins. Why is that not in the German version? And why is it like, look at the We made laws. A third of that list is five vitamins. Read the first seven ingredients. The second half is all the E vitamins. Hold on, let's copy. Let's read the, let's read the ingredients. By the way, when you're reading an ingredients level, the label, the it's in order. Yeah. So if you want to know what it predominantly is, by the time you get past five, like everything else is like pixie dusting. So what's different? So there's hydrogenated the flour oil. The corn flour, yellow corn flour is top on the American one. Yeah, on the American one, but not the German one. Yeah. And I think that I know that there's colorings and stuff like that. So why not the fortified vitamins in the German one? That's interesting. There was a law a long time ago in the U.S. where all wheat or corn ingredients had to be fortified with We made it a law. Yeah. Because there was like deficiency of the vitamin in mineral deficiencies. Like iodine, I think was added to salt for the flour oil for a while ago because people were iodine deficient. Yeah, maybe Andrew can go down the rabbit hole and dig a little bit and figure that out. That's really interesting. Yeah, because that's a little bit misleading because literally Yeah, that's a good call. That bottom half is like all vitamins. It's on that list. So it does look way more dramatic than what it what it really is. I mean, it still is a big deal. There's way more in the U.S. But it looks crazy when you look at it from like a meme or whatever. I know, right? It's not that crazy. Yeah, but what you said, Justin, is a lot of people have said that when they go overseas, they'll eat things and they don't You guys know said at all? No, I did too. I was I mean, I ate off the diet all. I mean, two weeks now of not following any of my shit. And I actually did not feel that bad at all. That is not what I would expect. Max said that they don't use glyphosates to desiccate their wheat over there. So here we blast wheat with with glyphosate to make it like to dry it. Dry and strengthen it. No. So does it get moldy or something? I guess. And I think in Europe, it's illegal. So we're not consuming like glyphosate residues over there like we are over here. Yeah. For sure. A lot of the carbohydrates and and wheats and things like that. Yeah. It's like way different. Actually, how I want to ask you is how nice was it to sleep in your in your normal bed? It was like heaven. I sleep like shit when you're gone like I do. Oh, yeah. Yeah. No, this whole I mean, of all the trips I've ever been on, this was the worst collective sleep that I've ever had. I mean, Doug and I pulled our aura ring stuff up to compare. And the first five days that we were traveling, one, the plane ride over, I didn't sleep at all, which you needed to sleep because we were we were flying. Oh, you looked like it. I know. Every day it was rough. At a full 24 hour day where I didn't sleep. And then the next four days, the most sleep I got was four and a half hours. I was just. Wow. Yeah, I was bad, dude. Last night was so, you know what's funny though? So I forgot that I had turned off the bed system. You didn't sleep? Yeah. And I didn't I didn't realize it because Katrina asked me to turn off before I was because it gets too cold for her. And so I shut it down. And I obviously didn't think about it. And I like fell asleep early and was sleeping hard. I woke up briefly, but it was because my bed heated up. And I'm not used to it having the control system. So got back up, turned it on real quick and got it recalibrated and then went back to bed. And then I just slept. Oh, slept through the whole night, man. That thing is such a. I mean, you don't you don't realize it until you don't have it for a little bit. And then you come back to that, like what a treat that is to have that control temperature, at least for me, like that's a big deal because I will. I don't care how cold it is out and out out of the sheets. My body heats up so much that all all heat up the sheets big time. Yeah. Yeah. Coming home was so nice. Obviously sleeping in your own bed is nice. But just to see the kids and my wife and just it was a long time. I don't like going being gone that long. I think the longest stretch in a long time. Yeah. Yeah. I was talking to Courtney about that. Have you guys ever? That's what it was. That was the record for both Katrina. That's the longest I've ever been away from my little ones. For sure. I've never been away from Katrina that long. I've never been away from Max that long. Yeah. Yeah. I think just same actually. Yeah. That was a long time, man. It was it's rough. It's funny because men don't talk about the slot. And I know why because I think it makes you sound or maybe you feel like you're you're not supposed to talk about this. But after like day two, like two, three days, you know, it's like, oh, we're out. We're doing this thing. It's really cool. After day two or three, I start to get really homesick. And then by the end of the trip, I was really missed, especially like I would get on FaceTime and see my kids and they would get excited to see me. And then I talked to Jessica and then hang up and it's like, oh, it's terrible. It's almost worse to do that. It's almost worse to communicate. It's like kind of like because you could just disconnect. Yeah. I mean, and honestly, like, I can only imagine if this trip was amazing, right? Like London was absolutely amazing. Oh, so great. City blew me away. Like I did not expect to love the city as much as I love the city, running into people every single day and night and getting the chance to spend time with fans of the show and ARC was just incredible. And then to go to Olympia and do that. Like just an incredible full day, every single day nonstop. Yet it still was. So I can only imagine if it was a trip where it wasn't like that. Like if we were just like, it was all leisure and you're kind of chill. Like that would have like drove crazy. It was so nice to see Trina. She came to get you at the airport. She runs across, just jumps in his arms like a little girl. It was so nice to see that. Yeah. I was like, oh, I can't wait to see mine. Yeah. Yeah. That was that was really, really, really nice to see her. And then Max wanted me to wake him up. So when I got you, yeah, yeah. So I woke him up. And oh, so I came when I came home, the kids were sleeping. But I told Jessica specifically, she's like, I know you're tired. I'll feed the baby. I said, no, no, I want to feed her because I love that. Right. So I came home. We, you know, we, Jessica and I hung out a little bit, went to bed. Then the baby woke up to get fed. So I picked her up. And at first she was kind of like, because it wasn't mom, because mom had been doing it. Mm hmm. And then she reached up because it's dark. She touched my beard and instantly just relaxed on my arms because she realized it was me. And I was like, oh, it's the best feeling ever, man, to do that. So nice. So nice. But arc was incredible. Oh yeah. Yeah. Super inspiring. Yeah. The Alliance for Responsible Citizens Tree. It's an event that was hosted by Jordan Peterson. You can watch it on YouTube now. You can watch all the talks on YouTube. I don't think I've been surrounded by that many like brilliant. So impressive. Yeah. Everybody there was like insanely impressive and successful in their own industry or whatever. You know, that was the most interesting part. It was like artists, like it was like diplomats. It was like entrepreneurs, like intellects. There's just like a whole religious leaders swath of interesting people. We were the only fitness people there. Yeah. I was so humbling because when we were there, I thought, I wonder if we're going to see other health and fitness people. Nobody. Mm hmm. In fact, people would ask us what we did. We'd tell them and they were kind of like confused. We stuck out a little bit. What are you guys doing here? It was such an honor to be even chosen to be there. I mean, technically you could count Max. Max was there and he's in the house space. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I guess so. Between Max and us. But I guess I didn't realize what an honor it was to be even invited, right? One, I wasn't sure what it was going to look like. Two, I didn't know that it was literally hand-picked 1,500 people from all over the world. Now, 1,500 sounds like a lot, but when you think about all over the world, to be one of those 1,500 people that was selected to come to this private event and have that opportunity, I thought was just, that was really incredible. Basically, the gist of it, and we're going to talk with Jordan Peterson, so I'd love to talk more in depth with them, but the idea is to really change the narrative because the popular narrative that's out there is this really negative. Oh, yeah. Everything doom and gloom. Dooming gloom. Humans are a cancer. And they're like, no, the story needs to be positive. Humans innovate. We work together. There are common values that have led us to accomplishing some incredible things. And we got to make sure that we worship the common good and not all these earthly things. And it was really just exceptional conversations and talks from people all over. It was really cool. I mean, many times I caught myself getting choked up listening to some of those talks. Yeah, and it's interesting because it's walking the fine line of bringing in religious leaders to help inspire a bit of politicians, which was also a bit of a line that they're crossing, but the entire energy there was just to create this positive outlook and to really figure out how to create that abundance for everybody. Well, that was the part that I enjoyed was that, I mean, you had different religions. You had different politicians, but the common theme of the entire event was to change the narrative. We have a choice. We can make a better future for ourselves. And instead of complaining or choosing the victim route or making humans look like they're this parasite on the world, like what can we do as leaders in the space? And so I just, I really enjoyed it. I absolutely got emotional several times. I mean, the speakers were just... You guys have a favorite talk? Oh man, that's a tough one. Konstantin was probably one of my favorites. True, he's fire. For me, it was Jonathan Pageout. Oh, Pageout. I actually showed my dad that and he loved it. Oh, you can watch that on YouTube. It's up there now, but he's talking about like how simultaneously in all of recorded human history, we have more stuff than ever, and yet we're as unhappy as ever. And it was really incredible talk. Yeah, Pageout, Konstantin, I think we're two of my favorites, too. I really, and it's not up on the YouTube channel, is the British teacher. Oh, the headmistress? Yes. What was her name? I mean, maybe Andrew, if I remember, I think she was seriously saying you could look up Google, the strictest teacher in the world. Strictest teacher. And I think that her, I think her name comes up, or for sure you could probably do it in Europe or whatever, and put that in and see if her name comes up. She was incredible. Catherine, there you go. Her ball scene. Is that what it was? She was amazing. By the way, doesn't she look like what you would think a headmistress would look like? Yeah, almost like, yeah, out of Harry Potter, at like Academy or something. Can any of you try and Google and see if that was true, if you Googled the strictest teacher in the world or what that, if it popped up? Yeah, no, I think she does. Yeah, pop up in that search. Oh, yeah? Oh, wow. Yeah, see, that's great. She was awesome. Now, favorite, I got to say, though, my favorite, it was, ARC was incredible, huge honor, really humbling. But my favorite, favorite, favorite thing about London, the city was amazing. People are great there, by the way. I love English hospitality, humor. I feel very at home there. But I got to say, my favorite was, every night we got to hang out and dine with and just generally just essentially hang out with a listener of the show. And this was just on accident. Somebody would stop us. We were already on our way to get food or whatever. We'd invite them. And every single night we had somebody come with us. And we just started out as kind of a random occurrence, right? We're at the pub and then, you know, we get met by somebody outside that's like, oh, hey, you know, I love your show. And then we go have a drink. Yeah, come hang out with us. And we're hanging out with them all night. Just chat. Yeah, I would say that was probably one of my favorite things too. Just because it happened so organically too, it wasn't like we set out to go do that or made this deal that, hey, if we run into people, we're going to take over this. So it was just, we were doing our own thing and traveling around. And it seemed that every single, it was every single day, every single day. And it was interesting because it was always like, right before we were about to go get dinner or right before we're going to go head to a pub and go have drinks and we would randomly meet somebody and end up talking to them on the street and say, hey, we're going to go to a pub right now and get some drinks or hey, we're going to go with dinner. You want to come with us? And they'd all like, are you serious? And then we ended up taking them all night long and they just hang out with us. So fun. I love, I absolutely loved it. Great hearing all the stories too, man. Everybody that we met were just really, really interesting. I do got to say along those lines, you mentioned pub. I always learned this lesson when I travel. Foods that you eat, let's say outside of the country of origin, you'll have a perception of those foods and you'll think, oh, this is what fish and chips taste like, for example. It's not that big of a deal, whatever. It is way better when you eat it in London. Way better. I had fish and chips over there. I'm like, this is amazing. Yeah. Versus like, you know, fish and chips have had here, and that's so good. That's sort of their staple. Yeah. Yeah. All right. My, the couple we met where the young lady, I can't remember her name. I think it was Tony. I'm going to pull it up. I have her before and after because that was a crazy story where she, let me see. Yeah, Tony and Christian. She went from a very unhealthy place to a very healthy place. Yeah, right. She showed us before and after. Or right when the pandemic hit, she was chronically under eating. She was over training. Doing cardio like crazy. And then she looked like it. Like if you could just imagine a young lady who was under eating and over training, just, you know, she was this kind of frail little body that obviously didn't look like she lifted weights, looked like she just ran and starved her body. And then to see what she did in a year's time, it actually didn't look believable. I mean, except for that we had the pictures and saw her in person. And so her transformation was just incredible and unreal to see. Yeah. Such a cool story. And she's just like, yeah, I was one of those people that just abused cardio and just under eight. And I guess her boyfriend was the one that was like, you got to lift, you got to eat. And you know, got her to kind of forced her to listen to us and then it made an impact. And it was crazy. So the third time or I've been to the UK, but like two out of three times, like some incident happens at home. I didn't know about it. So my family was trying to kind of keep it from me so I didn't stress out or worry or anything. Oh, shit, what happened? Yeah. So like first time, like my mother-in-law that was watching my kids broke her leg and I kind of explained that story last time. So this time, like my dad was moving his hot rod and turns out that like he installed and he had some neighbors trying to help him kind of move the car across the street. And I guess he had one foot inside the car and trying to steer and basically missed like the pedal. I don't know, he was trying to tell me like all the details of how this happened because I'm like, what, how did you not tell me? Basically got run over by his own car on his legs. And he's already had like two knee surgeries and so he's just recovered from that. And then like I have pictures and everything of his legs but like he, thank God, nothing broke. You know, on his legs didn't break, but like he has these crazy bruises and the compression. Wait, the car ran over and it didn't break his legs? Literally like he fell down and then the car ran over his legs. And they didn't break? He's six, seven and he's like, he was trying to jump out of the way and you know, his legs were still there. Nothing broke? Nothing broke. Holy cow. Just boom, boom. And then like actually the car itself kind of went into like a leaf pile and stopped itself and nothing happened. And but I was like, dad, what? You're not going to tell me to go to the hospital and everything. And so anyways, it's just like, oh man, I hate that. Like I'll go leave on some like long trip and then like, you know, two out of three times, something crazy happens. That's going to cause you to be all weird every time you leave. It's going to be super paranoid next time we go anywhere, dude. Hey, can I talk to John? John can't come to the phone when I was busy. Wait a minute, what's going on with John? Did that happen at the beginning of the trip or towards the middle? It was like in the middle and so yeah. That's crazy to break his legs though. I know, it is. It doesn't make any sense. I mean, he's got some strong ass bones. I mean, for reals. He does, yeah. He's a big boy. You just see his calves. You think I got calves, dude? Oh, is that where you got your calves from? Oh my God. Not from all your calf races. That because you walk on your toes? No, no. I don't wear my high heels that much. You bounce around all the time. Yeah. And then we went to the Olympia on the way back, which was really cool. We met a lot of fans there and we worked the transcend booth, which was really cool. How funny was it though? We went to Michael Hearn's booth. That was hilarious. Well, that was the first time that Justin and I had the pleasure of like meeting him in person since. Great guy. Since you. Him and Mona. Yeah, he seems like a super cool guy. Yeah. And I know you spoke highly of him off air talking about your experience with going to their home and hanging out with his wife and him and just said that we would absolutely love them. And so I totally got that impression when we ran into him. And I mean, you could tell that he's actually a fan of the show, right? You could tell by the way he reacted when he saw Justin and I. Well, he's working a booth with a competitor. So we were representing transcend. You guys all had t-shirts to say transcend. He's working a different booth. Oh, man, you could tell. I don't know if that was his COO or who that was, but you could tell he was pissed. Yeah. So he jumps over basically, he's a lion waiting for him. He stops everything to come say hi to us, jumps over and takes pictures with us. And you guys are wearing like transcend shirts. And that's the competitor. And so whoever that guy was was so mad. Oh, he tried to tell him no. And you could tell he tried to tell no, no, no, no. He was barking at Mike. And Mike just kind of blew him off and then still hopped over and over. But you could tell he was not happy about that whatsoever. I mean, I would have covered the shirt up just for just out of respect if I would have picked up on it faster. Yeah, I didn't even know that was going on. The thing he was mad about, yeah. They donned on me afterwards. It's like, I didn't realize. I'm like, why was that dude mean-mongering? And why was he so adamant about Mike not taking pictures? They're biggest competitors. Yeah, and then I realized, like, oh, shit, Justin and I, we have all the transcend on. He was at his medical booth. And I'm like, oh, God, that's hilarious. I love transcend. They literally are like signing every name in that whole segment of fitness. Everybody was at that booth, man. Everybody you could think of. What was crazy is when you go to one of these conventions, you're going to see the most extreme bodies you've ever seen in your life. Okay, that's just obviously. I saw some, like the extreme male bodies are always, like, shocking and impressive. But I saw some women that I, like, it doesn't even, I don't understand. Yeah, it didn't compute. It was like, whoa. If you're not part of the space, you never go to this convention, just picture this, okay? Imagine me with an additional 20 pounds of muscle and way more shredded. There were women like that walking around. Literally, they're walking around and they got traps. Yeah. And you're just like, now I know people are like, oh, that's all steroid. Yes, steroids play a role, but that's also crazy genetics because I could take all the steroids in the world. I wouldn't look like those girls. Yeah. It was, it's crazy to see some of these, the development of some of these people. Insane. It's been like, it's been close to nine years, I think, since I'd been hanging around Olympia or anything like that. And I was really impressed with just the, what a spectacle it's become. I mean, when I was in the circuit, it wasn't, I mean, it was mainstream and it was getting popular and the conventions were still kind of a big deal, but man, the amount of money that's behind these things now of everything from the booths that were set up to the amount of famous people that were in and out of there to the stage and the lighting and the sound system. I saw Shaquille O'Neal was watching him. I was so mad. Yeah, I didn't know he was there. Yeah, no, no, no. Yeah, yeah, no. There was a bunch of famous people that were in and out of there. You know what was weird was that Chris Bumstead got less money than the winner of the physique Olympia. Chris Bumstead has the most popular one. He's got the biggest social media poll, I think, of all of them. That's interesting. I don't understand that. Yeah, I'm not sure how they justify that. I don't know if that's based off of entries, right? So maybe there is a lot more people that enter to, you know, men's physique. Has physique been around longer than classic? Yes. Maybe that's why. Because slowly over time, it's built up. Yeah, well, I mean, but why though? Why does that matter? Or is it because, like I said, the entries are like why it would be how long? Because if Bumstead is far more famous than, you know, say like Ryan Terry, who won men's physique, like why are they getting paid? What I would assume is that it has more to do with like entries. So I would think that based off of that, like you would get, you know, and I know that Olympia. Yeah, but the open has the biggest paycheck. There's got to be less entries for the open. Yeah. Well, I think the whole show is built around them, right? I mean, that's how this whole thing started was, you know, like it used to be just them, right? I don't know if there even had all the other categories. It didn't exist. Yeah, it didn't even exist. It was just Olympia. I think that they're probably always going to get the biggest piece of the pie since they're the origin. But I think the popularity behind men's physique and bikini must drive more entries, which then drives more revenue. Maybe I don't know. It's weird to me that, you know, like Chris Bump said, I mean, it was $50,000 was the... First place. Yeah, first place. Like Tuvers is like July bill for food. Yeah, I think. And then I think men's physique was like 90, I think for their first place. I wasn't, I don't remember what bikini was. I don't think we sat through that or not. But I mean, fascinating though to see the growth of it. And also really fascinating to me to see, like people floating around, like you were saying, like Shaq that are like ultra famous, but then to see these lines for basically, like just famous influencers. Oh yeah. Just around. Just to take a pic, you know, for the grand. Yeah, it's because when I was coming in, like so nine years ago was the last time, but I was, before that, I was even going to some shows. So let's say 12, 13 years ago, you would show up to one of these things. And Ronnie Coleman or Jay Cutler. Yeah, the basically winners of competitions. Yeah, yeah. So if you were like, you know, Mr. Olympia, Jay Cutler, Ronnie Coleman type of guy, the place would just be, that's where the lines would be at. And that's all the lines would be at. And then you'd have all these like supplement booths that people would stop by to grab some samples and stuff. And obviously somebody hacked into this or figured this out because now every supplement company or every booth has at least two or three, you know, influencers that are attached to it and that draw all the traffic and attention. And these kids line up and wait to talk to or to take, just take a picture. Most of them don't even want to talk to them. Most of them, it's just like busting through to take a picture with some of these influencers. And I thought, man, that's so wild. I mean, there was a point where Ronnie Coleman was, you know, in his wheelchair right next to us. And I felt like nobody was even paying attention to him. Like nobody was even talking to him or anything. But then, oh God, like if an influencer come walk him by that has. It's interesting. Yeah, people screaming, going crazy and taking pictures is like, God, that's so, so weird to have been there before and then to come around afterwards and kind of see the difference. It's interesting. Yeah, it's super interesting. And the reason why Chris Bumstad, even though he's the champion of his category, he's so popular, it's his social media. He's got a huge social media presence. He's also, you know, obviously he talks really well and he's on lots of podcasts. It's his mustachos, to be honest. He's got, I will say this. I mean, he's got one of my favorite physiques. I think his physique is sick. I think classics, that's where bodybuilding should be. You know, that whole category, just enough muscle to where they look like crazy amazing, but the open, it just gets too much. Well, I mean, the truth is though, people want to see the crazy, right? Like people, there's more people that will aspire to look like Chris Bumstad, but everybody still wants to see the freaks. Everybody wants to see what is the craziest extreme, yeah, that we can push the human body. And so when you see a real pro bodybuilder in front of you, like on top level one, it's weird. It's just the muscle and the development of the shape is just, it is so mutant. Shoulders are like this wide. It's so wild. It's so crazy to see. Yeah, and you know, it's to your point too about like, everybody thinks it's just drugs. It's like, there's such a massive genetic role that plays. Like, remember when people used to ask me like, why I stopped or why wouldn't I keep going and doing it? I'm like, I was not made for this. Like genetically, I am not made to be a bodybuilder. Like I've built a good physique and I could use all the drugs in the world, but the people that win that stay at the top of this, they've got both working for them. They've got all the drugs and they got all the discipline and they've got the genetics to be able to be the superstars. Like they are genetic freaks on top of doing all the other stuff. In fact, I would make the case that some of these guys that are the most famous for their physiques, the amount of drugs is way less than a lot of people think they are. Oh yeah. It's just, it's not taking them a lot of drugs. I mean, we've talked about this before, like, you know, the Ronnie Coleman's, the Flex-Wheeler's. The Ronnie Coleman's top 10 Olympia natural. Yeah. These guys were already winning Olympia shows before they even introduced the drugs. Yes. The drugs took them to a crazy level. But I mean, even our friend, Aria, Aria was competing on the Olympia stage natural, you know, and then he took testosterone afterwards. And so, yes, it took his physique to another level. But I mean, you have to have the genetics and the discipline and the hard work first, like before, even before that stuff. Something else I learned on this trip. I had no idea that you were a photographer, Adam. It was so funny. I am not a photographer. Brandon, listen. Justin and I were so, we were like, what's going on? We would be walking through London and then Adam would grab, and his iPhone, it's not like you have a camera, you use your iPhone, and you were like climbing up on things, standing at angles, seeing squatting down, laying down to get the right angle, and just potential portraits. Spending like hours, like you just like, Justin, I eventually left, we walked off because you were just taking pictures of things from different angles. I'm like, what is he, what's happening? Well, first of all, he's taking it in. First of all, when we first were planning this trip, we almost didn't do London. Like we were going to drop in for ARC and then bounce out of London and go over to Italy or some other places that we talked to all of us going, and really that was because I think at that time, Justin and Doug were the only ones that have been over there really, and they were like, ah, it wasn't, it wasn't one of my favorite cities, I'd rather go somewhere new or different. And so I had a very low expectation for what the city was going to be like, and I left London saying that was, that's my favorite city I've ever been to. Now I'm not the most world traveler, but I've been to beautiful places all over the United States. I've been to Paris. You're like a big fan of architecture. I did not know that. So, and that's the part that I think that London doesn't get enough love for is that it would have, because I also, somebody made a point about Rome and Paris. I'm like, listen, Rome and Paris, I'm not saying that they're not, that the target architecture there has even more history and is even more beautiful. But what I love about London is it has both. It has the history, and then it has like new modern. And so the blend of that is just unique. I mean, contrast. Yeah, the contrast is, there was a one night, Doug and I stayed out late to go sightseeing more, and we took the Uber boat, which is really cool to have this Uber boat that travels all the way down the river. That's the only way we're going to travel next time we're back. Oh, totally. That's the move to go faster. Oh, it's super fast and it's cool. And you go under, I don't know, I'd say 10 bridges maybe, Doug or so, roughly 10 bridges. And so you'll go under once, you go under like the Tower Bridge, which has probably got the most history right in London, as far as how old it is and how beautiful it is and the lighting is amazing. And you'll go like two more bridges down, and then all of a sudden you'll see this super modern, and looks like it was built in the last 20 years or less, and it's all lit up and designed differently. I mean, so you'll see that. Like just think that's, I mean, I've never experienced a city like that. And then everything at night was lit up, just epic. It was just, everything was a postcard. So yeah, it was definitely. It was just funny watching you just run like with your phone. Well, and the audience doesn't know this. I've talked to Doug off air a bunch of times about wanting to get into it. Obviously, Doug is the photographer of all of us. And I've always been fascinated. I don't know if I've ever told you guys this or not, but the very, one of the first, like not first business, but one of the first businesses I ever started was a photography business when I was 19-ish, 20-ish. Wait, wait, wait, wait, what? Yeah, so I started. You started a photography? With my two best friends called Callie Myrna Photography. And the idea of it back then was to have a business ride off to do all the cool shit that we did. So I was into off-roading stuff with my ATV. We were into snowboarding, wakeboarding. And so the idea and concept was let's start this photography business and it'll be able to ride off all of our toys and ride off all of our trips where we do these toys. And so it started that way. Now, I never really took it far enough to get really good with the camera. My best friend did. It ended up being a pretty, he's not like famous, but he's had his photos in some places and has shot a lot of landscape photography that I have hung up in my house that you guys have probably seen don't even know it. That's from him. And he kept going. He kept the business going. It became his and he did really well. He ended up taking wedding photos. So I've always had like a thing for it and liked it. I just never have taken the time to discipline myself because those cameras aren't easy to work. Like they're like, they take a lot of... They're also expensive. The lenses are super expensive. Yeah. And you got to really understand like lighting and speed and all that stuff like that. Like to be able to get like the perfect picture. And so I have an appreciation for it. And I've always wanted to get into it. You were so into it. I did not expect that. No more than Doug. I felt like Doug was just into it. Well, I expect Doug to get into it. I don't expect you to disappear and to get into it. Doug would just run off. Yeah. Yeah, I love it. Actually Adam I think has a real talent for composition. So I think he'd do well once he gets a good camera. But I have to apologize to London because the last time I was there I was with somebody that we were having a rough time. And so I think maybe that tainted my view of London. So when I reported back to you guys out of London, I don't really care about London. I've changed my mind. I really like it. Yeah, I feel like you and I mean we had such a, you know, we had a blast. Speaking of photos and Doug, you know, what was really cool and interesting to experience was. So I didn't know that there's a lot of strict rules around tripods and these these expensive lenses. When you're photographing, you know, some of this stuff. Well, buildings in particular. Right. And and Doug got some security guy came over and said, hey, you can't be using your tripod or fire like that. And so Doug put the tripod away and then we're like, literally like five minutes or 10 minutes later, we're walking further down the pier and Doug's taking this beautiful, you know, modern looking building that's right on the other side of all the other old stuff. He's like taking cool photos and the guy, the same guy come over to him and bust his balls again about it, about taking photos in there. And it's it's because you have these high power lenses. You know, I'm keeping Tom's. Right. And so but the thing that I thought was so cool was the way the guy checked us. So polite. Yeah, he was so friendly and polite. And I thought, man, in a thousand American car. In America. I'm going to get your ass. First of all, he would have been addicted to Doug the first time. Yeah. But definitely if he was checking him a second time for the same thing, basically that guy would have been a complete asshole. Three in the car. And this guy like took the time to explain the reason why and was like, you know, super. He was apologetic about telling us, you know, the rules and that he had to put it away. And I just thought, man, the the culture over here is is such a it's now here's the deal. So I so I did a post about how the friendly the people were there. And it was funny because people from England from other parts of England are like, what? Look terrible. The people are assholes over there, whatever. Right. I'm like, they were so nice. I'm like, oh, the context must be different for them because we're used to here, Silicon Valley, where everyone is an asshole. Yeah. And nobody gives it. Ignore you. Everybody ignores you. And then I thought, oh, it's true because when I went to Arkansas, when I've been to Tennessee, people are super friendly. So it's really just here, dude. We're right here. Everybody's just Silicon Valley. Yeah, it's rough. Yeah. They're just assholes. Well, it's hard to when, when we're, you know, basically born and raised in this, you pluck us out of here and you put us in. You notice the differences. Yeah. I mean, I even catch myself. Right. Because it's everything so fast paced in the Bay Area and heaven forbid, somebody walking in front of you stops to look at something like, you fucking want to lose your shit. Yeah. And so I actually felt that in me a few times of like my, my natural reaction. I'm like, oh, shit, like I can't, I can't act like that. Like nobody's that everybody's like so. They're all patient. Yeah, they're all patient. Like you, it's not, it's not weird at all to be walking in a crowd under the subway area. And then like a group of four people just, oh, stop and talk to somebody or just stop to look at something right in front of you. And you got to kind of wait or go around them. Like that happens all day long and nobody really is, you know, get upset about a work. God, that happens in the States. I've never been to New York City, but I heard New York City people are rude. That's what I heard. I heard they're really. It's like a badge, you know, it's like, yeah, there's a lot of name calling and yeah, but it's like a term of endearment. Maybe. In their eyes, right. Like, ah, fuck you, fuck you. And it's like, hello. It's like a thing. Yeah. Just ask them. Well, I know in New York they like, and I guess Paris was like this too. They like use the horn as like a courtesy. So like to get someone like, here if someone in California lays on the horn, it's like, it's like you give them the finger. It's like, fuck you. We're in places like in Paris and I think you New York is like this too. It's like more of a courtesy. People are always honking their horn. It's more to let you know like, hey, I'm right by you. I gotta tell you guys, we're speaking of cars. I gotta tell you something to happen this morning. So funny. So I got back the day after was we did it early. It's his birthday. It's really fun. Like we had this great day plan and the main gift we got him was this car that he could drive. Now this car is pretty red. Like it's got a key that you could turn. I can control it with a controller just in case he's going to go. Wow, modern power wheel. Yeah. Yeah. So awesome. So anyway, all he wants to do is that, right? So this morning, Jessica and I are working out really early. He wakes up. She brings him in because he wants to watch me work out. But then he sees car. Can I drive my car? Oh crap. Okay. I'll let you drive your car. That's fine. So we take him and he goes out into the backyard. We have this huge backyard and Jessica has the controller but she's also holding the baby because then Dahlia woke up and whatever. So I'm working out. All of a sudden, you guys remember the commercial for Kool-Aid? Remember what Kool-Aid did? Oh yeah. He just breaks through the wall. All of a sudden I'm working out and my son drives his car through the garage door. So there's a side door. Okay. There's a side door. And I just see his car and he's like frozen. Like holy shit. I didn't mean to. I didn't mean to. But he literally just breaks through. Oh my God. And then he's like, he starts crying. He got scared he'd get hurt, right? Yeah. He starts crying or whatever. So I tried to flip it. So I'm like, your car's strong. Look it. Not a single scratch. He's like, oh my car's stuck. My back fire. I hope he doesn't make a short break. He's smashing the door. But it was like, I'm working out literally randomly. All of a sudden I just see him drive through the door. Yeah. I wanted you to catch a video reaction. We all wanted to see the reaction when he saw it. You saw the video. You shared a video of him driving it. But we all wanted to see the. I think I have it. I think I'll send it to you. Yeah, yeah. That's it. Did you do that? I mean, did you set it up? Like, how did you, how did you present it to him? You kept talking about. I said, we have something in the garage for you. And you know, I think you, I think my car had a son so that you could play with or something like that because he loves my car. Yeah. So he went out there and he was just, he was so pumped. He was so pumped. You know what he wanted for his birthday? If you ask him, what do you want for your birthday? White cake. I don't know why he wanted a white cake. So we got a white cake. I love white cake. And he was excited. Why don't, why don't why it's my favorite? When he, when he came, uh, when he walked out of his room, we had balloons up and he's a huge fan of cars, right? The, the animated film cars. So Jessica had a bunch of cars balloon and she was playing the theme, all the theme songs from cars. Yeah. This kid, man, he comes out and he's like, oh, oh my gosh, it's, it's lightning McQueen. He goes, and the music matches the balloons. He said that. I'm like this kid, man. That's funny. You just reminded me, so Katrina was telling me last night that she had a conversation with Max while, while we were gone. My birthday is coming up, right? So she was talking to Max. Hey, do you want to, let's get daddy something for his birthday. What do you want to get? I want to get him a watch. Katrina goes, how does he know? I mean, he knows he's been playing with my watches since the beginning. So obviously he knows I like them, right? So she's like, oh, pick a different gift. I mean, can't afford one of daddy's watches. And he was like super adamant. No, no, no, I want to give him a watch. She should let him pick whatever watch or he could wear it when you go home. Of course, of course. But I thought I thought it was hilarious that she was like, she tried to like change the subject to something else. And he was like super adamant about I want to get daddy a watch. I want to get daddy a watch. So she's like, no, we're not getting daddy a watch. Oh, that's so great. We'll get daddy something else. All right. So we're going to, we're supposed to mention Organifi. And I tell you what, we basically announced their new Shilajit product, right? Yeah. I really like it. Yeah. Tons of messages. Oh, okay. You are getting something. Yes. So for people, no, a lot of people I've never heard of Shilajit, which is interesting because it is one of the most studied aromatic compounds there is. Probably, I would say it's up there with Ashwagandha. Okay. And it's got, it's not just that they've used it for thousands of years and it was used as an aphrodisiac. It was used to improve libido, vitality, health, reduce inflammation. It also has lots and lots of studies showing that it actually works. The reason why I was excited about Organifi is they got a really good form of Shilajit in their gummies or whatever. And then they made the gummies taste good. Shilajit doesn't taste good. Yeah. I was going to say, I don't know how they figured that out. Yeah. They have a fantastical way of doing that. And it's a full serving of Shilajit in that. Mushroom herb, what exactly? It is literally black tar substance that seeps through. From like a tree? No. Seeps through mountainsides. Okay. What it is is literally ancient forests that have been decomposed and broken down for thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands of years. I mean, wouldn't you say it's comparable to top soil? It's just in like tar form, right? It's so condensed. I mean, I don't know. There's a lot of compounds in... Because that's all like... So do you know the history of like what it was used before? Broken down. Obviously, we got a hold of it and decided to try it for everything. Like what was the common use of it? Libido, vitality, health. It's like an all-encompassing, adaptogenic compound. So for health. So it's up there. Like I said, it's up there with Ashwagandha. But it's so we know one of the compounds, fulvic acid is in there. There's lots of health benefits to fulvic acid. But there's a little bit of mystery as to why this actually raises testosterone in men with low testosterone. Why it's been shown to improve cognitive function. I mean, again, all backed by actual data. And who is the first to like stick their finger in there and be like... There's always that guy, right? Yeah. There's always that guy. I'm so curious about that stuff all the time. Like and then obviously back then... They must have been hungry as hell. Well, it's starving. Just think though, the thing that I think is always interesting about like Eastern medicine and herbs and things like this is that we didn't have the technology, we didn't have the ability to study it the way we do now and like to prove the science behind it. So obviously, one, somebody or some peoples did it and did it enough to like recognize like, oh, I'm feeling this stuff from it to pass it on for so long. Like it obviously... I think some of it was accident. Like the first people to eat psilocybin mushrooms were probably like starving. Like these might be poison, but we're starving, eat them and they're like, I see God. So that's like one example. Then the other one is they witnessed animals. So horny goatweed, okay, this is a plant that definitely boosts libido. They say it raises testosterone, probably not, but it does raise libido. They saw goats eating it and they were fucking each other like crazy and that's where they... Correct. That's really how it went down. Correct. Really? That's the story. The story is they saw goats eating it, then the goats would get all like into it and they'd... That's funny. What's the sound? So then I wonder, I wonder then if that's true about this? Like you saw like deer licking the tar and then all of a sudden they started humping each other and you're like, yeah, I should try that. I don't know. But there was definitely... My wife's turned me down three nights in a row. Let's see if I could put it in her food tonight. See how that goes. She got kicked out of the cave, just starving. Ugh, fuck. She says I don't put out enough. Oh, that's interesting. I'm so hungry. I'll eat anything. I'll eat something. Strong as it used to be. Yeah, but Doug, what are the benefits there say? Because there's a lot of studies that support its use. It's pretty wild. Yeah, so it's a blackish brown resin that contains over 40 minerals and substances, most notably fulvic acid. It's been used in Ayurvedic medicine. Treats conditions such as iron deficiency anemia. And it also has evidence that suggests it's also an antioxidant and has anti-inflammatory properties. Okay, so one of the main ingredients is fulvic acid. That's in it. Okay, so that's like... That's the... Remember that other water company before Pathwater we were talking to? Yeah, I can't remember. Blackwater, right? Is it blackwater? That's their main thing is the fulvic acid and all the benefits that come from that. Yes, but there's more. Because the studies that support chelégie are better than the studies that support fulvic acid, although fulvic acid has benefits. Well, I'm assuming that's because it has fulvic acid and other things. Correct. Right, so it's got all the benefits that fulvic acid has in addition to all the other compounds. Yes, look at this. May it generally... Generally, we're mineral deficient. You know, the population is very mineral. Yeah, and so that's the thing. There's compounds that we don't even know that are in there that we haven't isolated yet. So I can't tell you exactly what it is. We just know that we've... People have been consuming it for thousands of years. It's been used for those purposes for thousands of years and we do have data to support it. Look at that. Even may improve exercise performance and recovery. There was a study that showed that tied it to improve strength from strength training. So it's... I'm going to say this right now. Interesting. It is the next big supplement. Now, here's what the supplement industry does. They're going to over blow the shit out of it. There's going to be different variations of it and all kinds of weird stuff. Look, no supplement is going to change your life unless, of course, you fill a nutrient deficiency, which is something you need. But Shilijit is up there. Like I said, it's one of the supplements that is a non-nutrient deficiency filling that I would say has got some value. But we're going to see it start to blow up. More people are talking about it. Is it an adaptogen? So would it go in the category? I would put it there. So you'd put it in... And would you take it independently of Ashwagandha or could you take it together? You can take them together. Okay. So that would be interesting to do. Yeah, you can take them together. But although I don't know if you necessarily want to, it might be an interesting alternating stack, where you do one for a while and then do the other one for a while. Did you kind of compare the feeling? The thing about some of these compounds is I noticed great benefits in the first three months. And then it seems like I don't necessarily get anything. So I'll go off. But we'll see. I have never taken Shilijit for longer than a couple months. So now that we have it with our organization. We're coming close to a month or, well, I guess we did have a two-week break because you didn't take it with you. Yeah. So, but we were starting to take it consistently. I mean, I haven't put my finger on it yet. What exactly what it is that I like about it because I just feel good from it. And I think that's why I think it, I asked about it being like Ashwagandha. Has that Ashwagandha kind of good feeling? Yes, yes, yes. It's a stress, it's a adaptogen. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I get the similar feeling when I take the green juice from Organifi. It has that same kind of effect to me where it's like, it's not like a caffeine energy feel. It's not like it just improves my overall kind of mood. It feels like that. Nothing that it's so strong you feel it like jittery or anything weird like that. It just feels good. Do you guys see, there's been a few of these crazy-ass sports I've brought up on the show a few times. Like, you know, when you've seen some guys in an inside a telephone booth, like fighting or like, like levels where people kind of almost chase each other and then they fight and there's groups of people that fight each other. Anyways, like lots of crazy ideas. And usually it's in Russia where a lot of these sports are happening. Well, there was a new one that I was like dying laughing because it was just like, wow, this is so brutal and hilarious that somebody thought of it. There was like, basically there was like four bars. So it created this like square. And so each guy had to hang from bar. Oh yeah, you shoved me there. And then this contraption lifts up the bar. So they're all hanging from the bar. And now what they try to do is basically knock each person off. Kick each other off. And so they're kicking, they're punching each other, like as they're hanging to be like the last one standing on the bar. And it's so brutal and hilarious. It's actually hilarious. Yeah. And it's like, I just want to know who comes up with these things. What would the strategy be? I feel like the strategy is grab them with your legs and rub them down. Or you could like, yeah, grab, pull, like use your body weight. Yeah. But then you're pulling yourself down. I almost feel like putting your feet over their shoulders, resting your body weight on them. So they have to carry your body weight with that. Kick their grip, you know. Oh, they're blasting each other. They showed me the video. It was hilarious. Oh, my God. Oh, so funny. They didn't they do that? And remember that show that you watched? The 100 Strike 101? Didn't they do something like that? That one, they just hung. They just hung. They couldn't hit each other. They couldn't hit each other? No. I couldn't remember what they did. I never finished out that show. Yeah, I love it. I'll keep my eye out. More brutal sports. I think for shout-out today, we should actually send some love to the Tony, right? That's her name? Yeah. I think we should show the before and afters of what she did. I think that. We have her Instagram page, so we'll see. Yeah, yeah. So I'll have it. And did you send the photos to the YouTube team? I will now. Yeah, send the photos to the YouTube team that way that people watching could see this transformation. I just think it's like such a testament to. Super inspiring. Yeah, I mean the increasing calories and strength training and what a dramatic of a difference that you can do even in a year's time with proper nutrition and feeding the body and strength training, right? Joy Mode is a product designed to improve blood flow. Okay, so you'll get better pumps in the gym, but you'll also get better pumps in the bedroom. No joke, this stuff is backed by clinical data to improve the quality of your sex life. Check them out. Go to usejoymode.com forward slash mind pump. And on that link, use the code mind pump and you'll get 20% off your first order. All right, back to the show. Our first caller is Nick from Utah. Nick, what's happening? What, uh, how can we help you? Hey, guys. How you doing? How's it going? Good, good, good. Feels awesome to be on your podcast. I've listened to you guys so much over the last year. It feels like I'm talking to a bunch of old friends. So I appreciate all the content, everything you guys do. Yeah, thank you. Awesome. What you got for us? All right, so I've been lifting for about a year now. Found your podcast about a year ago. Made some really good progress overall. I ran through Anabolic. Well, let's see. I ran through Anabolic over the summertime. I saw my list really go up across the board. I got my deadlift up to about 315 or so, started at 225. And really my overarching question is, is it realistic to get my deadlift from where it's at now to 400 pounds by this time next year? So a full 12 months from now? Yeah. And you've been training consistently, strength training for a year? About, yeah. And now within that period of time, MAPS Anabolic was the only MAPS programming you followed. Before that, what did you do? So I was doing your typical push, pull legs, five days a week training before I started MAPS Anabolic. And I saw some significant gains through that progress, but really introduced deadlifting to my lifts with Anabolic. And by the way, I've kind of started Anabolic recently again, and I'm in phase three my second time through. Cool. And it says here you're 165 pounds? Yeah, about, I put on maybe a little bit more since then. I've been kind of slowly bulking since then, so like 170 ish right around there. That's good weight you're moving. Yeah, so this is a tough question to answer because there's a lot of factors that play into someone's strength. But I'll say generally for a man, your age, consistent training, you've only been working out for a year, which means you still have a lot that you can progress to, right? If you said this is 10 years, it'd be a lot more difficult. There's still potential there. And if you do really good training, good programming, good diet, most guys will be able to deadlift, can get to about a two and a half time body weight deadlift. I would say good 70% to 80% of men will be able to get that. Another 10% or so will be able to get to the three times body weight. You weigh 165, let's say you got up to 175, 400 pounds is within range for 12 months. You've got to follow really good programming though. To go from 315 to 400, it gets actually more specific. Mass power lifts. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, mass power lifts is the direction. Yeah, after you finish maps on a ball, like you do mass power lift, I wouldn't be surprised if you got up to like 375 at the end of it with it. Yeah, and that'll only leave you 25 pounds away from your... I mean, there's a lot of potential here because there's technique in there too that you can really master and improve, not just as we're progressively overloading, like you want to really be able to get a fluent with that. And so the more practice, the better. That's why power lift is going to be great. I mean, when I was chasing you, Sal, I started at about 185, 200 pounds is all I was deadlifting. So I mean, and I just watched that over, especially with a movement like a deadlift or a squat because there's so much technique involved. So not only is there a potential of building muscle and getting stronger, but then also just the CNS adaptation of your form and technique. So there's lots of factors that could do this. And you've only been deadlifting for... So you've been working out for a year, but you've only really been deadlifting for like four months. Yeah, yeah, about that. Oh, yeah. And you're at 315. Yeah, you should be able to get to 400. I think you will. So long as there's no big hurdles in the way or anything like that, I think that's totally... Run mass power lift. Yeah, follow mass power lift. That'll do it for you. Yeah, I mean, overall, I'd love to see all of my lifts go up. So I've kind of set the goal 400 for my deadlift. I'd love to get over 300 pounds on my squat and get my bench to 225. And really my squat, I'm in phase three of anabolic right now. I'm actually doing 225 for the endurance phase of it. So that's been getting better. So that's... I think I'm there. I think I'm getting there, but really been focused on technique overall. If you're at 225 for like 15, 20 reps, you're probably already there. You're already there. And I bet if you were to do a... When was the last time you actually did a single or a double try to do really low reps? Not since the strength phase of anabolic. You're probably already there. If your deadlift gets up to 400, it's definitely reasonable to have your squat be within 100 pounds of that, for sure. Oh yeah. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. So no, good job. I realize it's just normal. Just eat surplus protein. Yeah. Target's all there. Yeah. Get good sleep and all that stuff. What I'd like to do, Nicholas, is we'll send you mass power lift. I would like for you to get back on at the end of power lift too. Yeah, I would love to. I want to hear about what you noticed and what you're shrinking to. Yeah, going into that. Let's do that. Oh, I love that. I love that. Maybe the last like three weeks, like before it's over, email in so we can make sure we have time to get you in. It'd be nice to get you like right when you're timing the end of it. Or maybe Doug, you can make a note for us to schedule them out that far. Okay. All right. Sounds good. That's awesome. Hey, well thanks, guys. I really appreciate that. I appreciate the advice and really like overall, like you've gotten all of your contents fire, like all the guests you bring on, everything's just great. I didn't even have my wife running through anabolic as well. She's loving it. She went from doing classes to now focusing solely on strength. Awesome. Like we're loving everything you guys are producing. So thank you. Oh, yeah. That's great. Thank you, Nick. Great news, Nick. Yep. Thanks, guys. All right. Take it easy. Yeah, the whole strength, you know, standards. Like a two-time body weight deadlift is within the reach of most healthy men. Two and a half starts to get harder three times. Now you're getting to like, you know, more of an elite kind of level. Super strong. Squat, one and a half time body weight. Most men will be able to get there. Two-time body weight. Now you're getting really strong. And then bench, you know, one and a half time body weight. Those are like the standards that are good things to chase that if you're healthy, fit, you train a long time, consistently, good technique, you'll get pretty close. Anything beyond that, now you're starting to get to like the, you know, you're getting that elite level of strength. The real key for the listener to understand, because I think it would be very unrealistic for most people that have been lifting for, you know, five plus years. It's because he's only really been consistently lifting for the last year. We know there's a lot more. Yeah, there's a lot of potential in him still gaining a lot more. Unless he'd been lifting for five years terribly or like circuit training. Yeah, right, right. Or he never deadlifted, right? Let's say, and then now he's deadlifting or something like that. Then you can see those types of gains. I mean, that's what happened to me. Like I had been lifting for 15 years at that point in my career, but I had never consistently deadlifted. Yeah, so there was just tons of potential. Yeah, there's tons of potential there. Our next caller is Rachel from Maryland. Hi, Rachel. How can we help you? Hi guys. Thank you so much for having me on. I just, like everybody else, want to thank you for everything that you contribute, the pearls that you provide. I actually work in the healthcare industry. So it's definitely very enlightening to hear the conversations that you guys bring up and the discussions that you challenge with things. So thank you for everything you do. Awesome. Thank you. Great. So my question is primarily surrounding having a busy lifestyle. And if I'm not getting enough movement in my day to day, is it appropriate to add a little bit of cardio to help counter that? Or is that going to negate the work that I'm doing towards muscle building and muscle maintenance? So I don't necessarily get an adequate number of steps in per day. I have a fairly sedentary job. I work as a nurse practitioner. So I'm in a clinic setting. I stand a lot, but I'm not really walking a whole lot between room to room. I'm 30 years old, five foot eight, about 153 pounds. I don't track my body fat percent. But really just feeling a little bit troubled where at the end of the day, I only get about five to 6,000 steps. And I would really like to hit that 10 to 12,000 step goal to help lean out a little bit, but don't want to sacrifice my strength by overdoing cardio to fit in at the end of the day, just getting that extra movement, say to get a mile run in versus walking a mile just from time constraint standpoint. So I wanted to hear your advice and what you guys think. Do you track calories at all? A little bit. I had done some calorie tracking probably four or five years ago. I don't pay too much attention to it now. I try to pay a little attention to how much protein I'm getting. If anything I track, that's kind of where I look at. And I probably get about 120 to 130 grams per day. Oh, good. You're not going to get leaner from doing more cardio. We now have lots of data to show that, but it's healthy. It would be healthy for you to get some more steps, but I wouldn't necessarily schedule cardio to do that unless that's the only way you could do it. So what I would do, and it's not as hard as you think, right? So you're getting 6,000 steps now, just by doing your job. Just after breakfast, lunch, and dinner, just try to walk for 15 minutes, 10, 15 minutes. That alone will probably get you close to 8,000 or 10,000 steps. Or go for a walk right before bed. Yeah, it's just for health. It really is for health. Now, the fact that you're standing is a lot better than sitting. The data on being sedentary, they really show the negative effects come from sitting more than anything else. Like even if you're active, if you sit a lot all day, it's very detrimental. Yeah, believe it or not, 6,000 to 7,000 steps is above the average. Yeah. But if you're lifting 4 days a week, you're strong. You put your numbers up there. 235 squat, deadlift 245 bench, 140. That's a big bench press. It's incredible. Your body weight and height is good. You look lean and healthy. The only reason why I would add steps would be because you feel like you need to move more and it's just good for you. But don't do cardio for fat loss. It doesn't work for fat loss. For endurance, for stamina, it's great. Activity by itself is just healthy so long as it's appropriate. In your case, I would just say just try to walk a little more throughout the day. And that alone would be perfectly fine. I mean, ideally, if I have a client that wants to lean out a little bit, what I'd want you to do for the week or two is just to give me a track so I have an idea where our calories are at. Or a generic thing, if I had an idea, I would say something like, oh, well, just cut that serving in half or skip this one meal and you're going to lean out just fine. But I don't want to say that not knowing where your calories are. Because I wouldn't say that to somebody who, let's say, is at only eating 1,500 calories a day. If you're only eating 1,500 calories a day, I'd say, oh, let's reverse diet. Let's get you up to a healthier, more thriving metabolism. And then I would cut you back down. But if you're in a good place, say you're eating 2,500 calories a day or more. I would just say, oh, let's just drop 2,300 calories off the diet and do what you're doing and then occasionally add some walks in at the end of the day if you had what you would consider a really low or sedentary day and you're going to lean out nicely. But I'd want to know where your base is first because I wouldn't want to advise you to cut calories if I thought you were already in a pretty low place. So if you're under 2,000, I don't like the idea of cutting calories to lean out right now. I'd rather reverse diet you, keep building muscle, keep getting strong like you're doing, then cut back down after I've got you up to, say, 2,500, 2,700 calories. But if you're above 2,300, 2,400 calories already, you could easily just cut out 300 calories and or add a little bit of walking every single night. So you're getting over 2,000 steps and you see a nice lean out from that. Okay, yeah, that makes sense. And then as far as I've done a couple of your guys' programs, I've done strong, I've done aesthetic, maps hit. And then I was looking at potentially doing something like symmetry, but particularly when I did maps hit, like is that the program with the neat days on the weekends? Yeah, yeah, I like symmetry for you. I like symmetry. Especially because it's especially, well, I don't know. Okay, so obviously nurse practitioner is a wide range of things that you might do, but if you're having to move patience and support patients, symmetry is really going to be good at preventing. I mean, the injury rate with nurses is through the roof. Yeah, back, yeah. Yeah, so I like symmetry, especially because you've already followed strong and I don't like hit for you. I mean, hits good if you want like really build stamina in a short period of time. But for what you're doing, I think strong was great. Anabolic would be good. Symmetry is good though, I think would be perfect. Yeah, I like symmetry or performance. I think there's going to be some benefit to some mobility or multi-planar movements. I think that's the way to go from where you're at right now. Okay, awesome. Yeah, yeah, I liked hit best. Like I was saying, the neat days were a little bit harder for me to fit something in without feeling like I wanted to do a full workout. And thankfully, I'm not really moving patients. They're lifting any equipment. I'm in an outpatient clinic setting, but still there is like some of that, you know, depending on what we're doing, leaning over and some of the body mechanics can be a little bit hard. But thank you. I appreciate that. That's great. We'll send you a map symmetry, okay? Yeah. Oh, thank you. Thanks. You got it. All right, Rachel. Thanks for calling in. Yeah. Thank you so much. Have a great day. No problem. Well, it's good that the message is getting out because she's asking about cardio and talking about sacrificing muscle and strength. I don't want people to be afraid of cardio. It's just don't do it for fat loss. That's it. It's just not good for fat loss. But for stamina... Use it for what it's best at. Yeah. For stamina and endurance, nothing's better than cardio. You want to build endurance, go do cardio. If you want to improve your health and you're not active, moving is good for you. And that's most moving is cardio-type activity if you're just trying to be active. But when it comes to fat loss, strength, train, strength, train, and then diet, of course. Yeah, technically diet's first outside. Yeah, diet's first. And that's why, to me, the real first thing here is to get an idea where we're at. So long as she's in a good healthy... Yeah, I'm glad you said that, right? Because if she was already in so low calories... Yeah, right. So I wouldn't want to take her from under 2,000 calories and then cut her down to, say, 1,500 or something just to lean out a couple of percent, even though that would potentially work. But now I've got her down to... She's in a bad place then. Yeah, she's in a place which can only eat 1,500 calories. Like, that sucks because you can't go on vacation. You can't have a little bit of flex. And you're also getting only 1,500 calories with the nutrients. That's right. That's right. So if... But if she's in the mid-2000s already, oh, sure. We'll just cut 3,400 calories out of the diet every day. And you're going to lean out nicely. So to me, that's the most important thing is to see where she's at calorie-wise, based off of her size, movement, all of that. And then decide whether we cut or we reverse diet. Our next caller is Bethany from Tennessee. Bethany, what's happening? How can we help you? Hi, I'm so excited to be here. I can't believe I can see y'all. So I have been listening since about April or May of last year. And I have just enjoyed all of the episodes I've listened to. I started at the very beginning and skipped around a little bit just to find different topics that I was wanting to listen to. But you guys are awesome in all the information that you're providing. So I'll dive into my question for you guys, for a time's sake. So my question, will implementing a new stimulus help with fat loss or to visually see the fat loss? You need to eat at a calorie deficit, no matter what, like no matter the circumstance. A little bit of background. I have been lifting weights consistently since January 2022. And then started following maps and a Bollock in August of 2022. Since following maps and listening to the podcast, I have eaten that maintenance or a slight surplus in order to gain strength and then to allow my metabolism to adapt towards muscle growth. And then for over a year, I have maintained my weight while increasing strength. So never a decrease in weight. I've always wanted to be strong. And I never found anything on how to either train until I found you guys. I guess I wasn't looking in the proper places over the years. And I have heard you're stronger than you look so many times throughout the years. And I want to look as strong as I am and then continuously getting stronger. I enjoy how much food I am currently eating along with the quality. And I say that I don't, I'm not tracking, but I had started after I submitted the question. Because I figured you all would need the information. But I don't think I can track at a calorie deficit without hitting mental blocks and then leading into inconsistencies and then downspiraling since I've done that every time I track in a deficit throughout the years. Is it possible to introduce a new stimulus, say map strong or maps in a Bollock and remain at my current calorie intake, which is 2,300 currently? Or do I really need to eat at like 18 to 1,900 calories to further see the fat loss? I want to experience a body composition that you guys talk about while lifting heavy and eating well. I'm a believer of lifting weights. I absolutely love it. And then walking for cardio. So I'll do anything that you guys advise me to do. I'm here for all of it. So I am 5'4, maintaining at 162 to 165. There's some fluctuations. And my number one goal is strength and then to lean out enough to be able to see the muscle gains. Okay. I got good news for you. Can you scroll up for me, please, where she had her strength gains? The strength gains that you had, I'm going to go over them here. So your squat went from 20-pound dumbbells for stopping at 90-degree angle to 105 pounds for four sets of four, and you went deeper. Wow. Your deadlift went from a 25-pound bar on a Smith machine to 125 pounds for four sets of four reps. Over how long of a period of time did this happen? A year, right? Yes, a year. And then actually Monday I hit 135 on my squat for two reps. Okay. So that was my goal. So I got two plates up there. I got really good news for you. I got really good news for you, Beth, because you went like the strength gains and the fact that your body weight stayed the same. Or even went down eventually. You went down a little bit actually in body weight. You got leaner and built muscle. Yeah. That's what happened. Okay. Okay. So you're really right on track. You're 100% on track. Now, the cardio that you're doing, it's set up there. You're doing about 45 minutes, five days a week. Is that just walking? Yes, strictly walking. Oh, you're killing it. Yeah, you really are. You're doing really good. I wouldn't go on a cut because you're still, you're getting leaner. You are. Right now. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, to get that, that much of a strength gain. The name broke. Don't fix it. That's a huge strength gain over the course of a year for your body weight to go down. Because you went from 170 down about on the scale, about eight to five to eight pounds on the scale. Yeah, 170 was the highest increase that I saw. Yeah. I would guess that you gained five or more pounds of muscle and lost probably seven, eight pounds of body fat. Yeah. So on the scale, it's going to show up like a few pounds. You know, do your clothes fit differently? Are people commenting that you look like you lost a bunch of weight? Because sometimes that'll happen. Someone will come to you and be like, you look like you lost a bunch of weight or you'll notice in your pants feeling a little different. Waste typically smaller, maybe tighter in the glutes. Are you noticing any of those things? Yes and no. With the pants, I try to focus on, like if it's feeling tighter in glutes or even like your quads and hamstrings. But it's mostly my, like the core. So back and then stomach where I see like, I could like quote unquote trouble areas. If I didn't have that, I probably wouldn't have any issues with how I looked because I can see some, you know, muscle definition in my legs and my arms. It's just not showing up. I guess where I want it to be and we can't, you know, we can't spot. You just got to stay on track. You're moving in the right direction, Bethany. Yeah, you really are. We could, okay, so. I mean, you could do a cut. Yeah, this is how I would do your cut right here is I wouldn't do much of a cut actually. In fact, I would be kind of hanging around the calories where you're at, where I think you're around to maintenance to a slight surplus because we're gaining muscle. Three weeks out of the month, then one week I would put you in a deficit. So one week we would cut calories, say four or 500 calories or just, you know, a meal, get a meal out of there. And that's it. And then go right back to the calorie surplus slash maintenance and just keep rotating through that. Because I think you're already doing a pretty good job of leaning out. You just don't realize it because the scale is hovering around the, you're in what we call the Goldilocks zone. It's actually like the sweetest spot to be at where you're just, you're getting a little stronger. You're building muscle. You're also losing body fat. And it's just a process. It just takes, it's, it takes a long time to build a pound or two muscle. It takes a while to burn a pound or two of body fat. And you've got a nice even exchange happening right now. And so you're not seeing big swings on the scale, but all the, all the indicators are all positive for us. If I'm seeing, and you just said you hit another PR on the squat just like yesterday. I mean, that's great. So it's like, and if that, so that would be another thing too. Like let's say we, we, we talk in a month or two and your, your progress is stalling. You haven't got any stronger this and the scales. Then maybe we decided to reverse diet or maybe decided to cut because you're not continuing to see performance gains and getting stronger. And you're also not feeling like you're leaning out. Then maybe you just hit another PR. But yeah, you just said, I mean, you're getting stronger. So I mean, we're, we're building muscle. You're doing, you're doing good. How tall are you? How tall are you? I try to tell myself just to trust this process, but when you're in it and you're not seeing what you think you should see, it's very difficult. So that's a good reminder. That's, that's the biggest challenge for everybody. Okay. It's like, I'm not seeing what I think I should. That's always a question. How tall are you, Beth? I'm five four. Five. Listen, I, I, one of the most fit, lean, female trainers I ever had was about 157 pounds at your height. Almost your body weight, but she was shredded. So there's so much potential for muscle. That in fact, body weight, I wouldn't even weigh. I mean, you can weigh yourself, but I don't think you should. I think you should just stay on track, maybe throw a cut, a little cut here and there. Like Adam said, but you're, you're already moving in the right direction is what I'm saying. Beth, I see that you have quite a few of our programs already. Let's put you in the forum. Are you on Facebook? Can I get you in there? Yeah, I'm on Facebook and I don't have the form yet. So that would be fantastic. Yeah, I would love to put you in the forum and then just keep us updated. Just, you know, check in with us at least once or twice every other month or whatever and just keep us posted on, on your numbers and how things are going. And then we could give you a little adjustments along. I really think, and then just the encouragement of stay the course. Cause I think you're doing great. And I think you'll hear that. You're killing it. And you just need to hear that. Yeah. There's quite a few people in the community that are in a very similar place. So I think it's a great place to kind of hang out and, you know, spitball ideas or things that you want to do. Like you're going to get great feedback there. Awesome. And then so with the three weeks of maintaining, should I ever try to slowly increase my calories or just hold off on doing that until I see a plateau? Well, right now, I think wait to plateau. But what's happening now is where your calories are at now is you're in an interesting space because you're leaning out while building. So I don't even think you're in that big of a surplus. I think you're in maybe a tiny surplus. So you could bump your calories. You might slow the fat loss down, but you'll speed up the muscle game. So that's up to you. But if you do want to see yourself get a little lean a little faster, then I think the three weeks on one week, you know, cut is a good way to start. Really what it looks like when somebody is doing what's happening with you, where you're kind of hovering around these calories in what we can't see into, because we're not peering into minute by minute, day by day is some days, you're actually in a little bit of a surplus, say 100 or 200 other days, you're in a deficit to 200 or 300. And it's like, it's just, which is a beautiful place. It's like you're feeding the body the way you should feed it. That's body composition change. Yeah. And it's changing. And it's doing it naturally without you having to have like, you know, scheduled three, you know, so many days in a deficit, so many days of surplus, you're hovering right around where your body needs. It naturally has higher calorie burn days and lower calorie burn days. And so you're leaning out on those lower ones and you're building a little bit of muscle on those higher ones. And so that's a beautiful place to be. And I wouldn't mess with too much of that right now, at least not until I start to see progress being stalled. And so get in the community, get in the forum, keep us posted on how you're going. And if you start to get discouraged or you hit a plateau, then we'll start to manipulate and some change in things. Okay. Sounds good. Thank you guys so much. All right, Beth. This has been awesome. Thank you so much. All right. All right. What a good place to be in. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, today I feel like we got a lot of people getting all the champions that are doing it, which is, I mean, that's, I mean, if you're, look, here's the deal for people watching, if you see big strength gains and your body weight is staying the same, that's a huge, huge, that's a very, very clear sign that you're very likely, okay, very likely to be building muscle and losing body fat. You don't go from a 20 pound deadlift to a 135 pound or whatever she went up to without gaining some muscle. And if her body weight is even lower than it was when she started or the same, well, okay. Well, why didn't her weight go up? Well, it's because she lost body fat. You know, this is also why I do like to, you know, for me, not for the client, but for me to have like photos of when we started this process and then like, you know, also that way I could show, I'd put them side by side and like, look at this. I know you feel the same. Yeah. I know you feel like you haven't seen a lot of change, but look at, and then I can literally point out like, look at the context. Yeah. Look at your waist here. Look at the muscle definition that's coming out here. And like, you're changing your body. And trust me, it just, because you see yourself every day and it's incremental and it's a very slow process and the scales not swinging like crazy, if you get numbers like this where you're, you're increasing your strength this much consistently and scales kind of hover around, you get, you're in the goalie lock zone. You're in a sweet spot. Our next caller is John from Canada. John, what's up, man? How can we help you? Hey guys, how's it going? Good, good. What's up, man? Man, I'm really excited to be on your guys' show. This is crazy. Been listening to you guys for like over two years and I saw every episode, I'm just learning something new, whether it be through life, fatherhood or just fitness and health, obviously. So thank you. Thanks, man. Hey, what you got first, John? All right. So my question comes in two parts. So one relating to fitness and one relating to nutrition. So first thing, how can I progressively overload or track improvements on fitness metrics other than the weight on the bar? So I know putting weight on the bar, it's, to me, it's objective, whereas other metrics like tracking your mobility or balance, to me, it seems a little bit subjective. And number two, I've never really tracked my macros consistently and I kind of just eyeball what I eat, making sure I have a balance of protein, carbs, fruits, veggies and all that. However, I feel pretty good. So is this a case where if it ain't don't, sorry, is this a case where if it ain't broke, don't fix it? Or is there value in me tracking calories or macros? Sorry, just a background. I'm 24 years old, been working out for over six years, but it's only been the past two years where I've been dialed in and consistent. For the first part about progressively overloading, well, there's a lot of different ways to do this. You mentioned a few in your question, balance, stamina, mobility, control, tempo. And then one that's objective and easy is total volume, which is weight times reps, time sets. And that's your total volume. And you can slowly over time increase your total volume of your workouts. At some point though, you can't progressively overload, right? If you've been doing this for 10 years, there's only so much volume that you can go up. There's only so much weight you can add to the bar. And yet you can still make improvements. And one of the best ways to do that is to introduce exercises that you're not good at, to learn new movements, challenge stability, or just challenge different athletic pursuits that you haven't trained before. But those are the best ones, right? I like range of motion and control and stability. And I like total volume a lot. Weight on the bar is great. Total volume though tells you a lot more because you could do a high rep exercise with less weight and actually do more volume. Oftentimes you do do more volume than if you were doing heavy weight with low reps. And total volume speaks more to recovery and adaptation than just total weight. As far as macros is concerned, there's a ton of value in tracking your macros, really just learning what you're doing and where you're at. And then if you want to progress in any direction, you'll have an idea of what levers to pull. So that's the value. I think most people would gain a lot of value from tracking, at least for a certain period of time, just to kind of learn and bring clarity to what they're doing. I mean, eyeballing is always off. Now that doesn't mean, it means you're still paying attention, you're aware, so you're a lot better off than the average person. But nobody guesses right. I don't guess right. Adam doesn't guess right. You know, and Adam tracked for years. So tracking is illuminating oftentimes. You'll look at it and be like, wow, I thought I was eating more protein than that, or wow, that's how many calories I'm eating. I thought it was over here. And then you have a better idea. And then if you ever want to pull a lever, you know where to go. John, what programs of ours have you ran? So I recently ran anabolic two months ago, and now I'm on symmetry phase two. Okay. So a great way to overload and pay attention to fitness metrics is to run through a series of our programs that are very unique, like so anabolic, symmetry, performance, aesthetic, like that's a good, like it's a good mix up right there. And that really covers a lot of your basis as far as like overall fitness. And as you come back around through those, you know, you're looking at improvement. You're looking, when you're in anabolic, you're looking at improvement on your squat and deadlift, how much stronger you got when you get through performance, you're paying attention to how good you can do some of those challenging exercises that are unique, the mobility, the depth of your squat, like can you perform the lunge matrix really well? Like you're looking at stuff that when you get to aesthetic, you're focusing on shaping and sculpting the physique. Do you, did you gain an inch on your biceps? Does your shoulders look better than they did the last time around? So those are like really basic easy metrics too to just to pay attention to watch as you go through the program. And the program's laid out for you, so you don't have to like overthink this process. You just go through it. You stay on top of your sleep and diet nutrition and you try to improve every time you go through the programming. As far as the nutrition goes, I'm with Sal. You're somebody who's doing well, and like you said, if it ain't broke, why fix it? Well, yeah, you don't necessarily need to change a bunch, but I would every once in a while, and I still do this, where I'm like, you know what, I'm gonna track this week and just see what I'm doing. And every time I do that, I recognize a few things. Oh wow, I didn't realize I wasn't getting that much fiber. I need to, and then the next, and then I can not track, but then I'll just make sure I add foods that are high in fiber because I tend to miss that, or oh wow, I thought I was getting more protein than I was. I was actually under eating protein. I'm gonna bump or add a protein shake in there every day. So I think checking in every once in a while to see what you're currently doing and pay attention to some of your habits that you may be doing that may be like, you may be missing the mark on a couple of things. And then you go back and you just start to add those things in the diet, and then you don't have to track, don't pay attention for a while, and then recheck back in and see if every time you check back in, you're doing a better job of really, without tracking, being able to target the things that your body needs. Yeah, I'm a big proponent for reassessing. So not just in the beginning, we kind of point people towards our map's prime compass tests, just to see kind of where we're at in terms of our range of motion, our stability, our joint function. And so to be able to come back like two, three months and like kind of periodically throughout the year to kind of see where you're at in terms of the changes, or even if you've been lifting heavy and getting stronger, how is that affecting your mobility and your overall functionality with that? So that's one to always kind of throw in there to reassess and look at. I think that the Turkish get up is a very valuable exercise for assessing a lot of what a lot of people don't realize in terms of control and in terms of strength and being able to move in a very detailed way. And to be able to do that while holding weight and while anti-rotational components there that you're trying to control your body at a pretty high level. So I would use that one as another measure for being able to see your progression just with your overall body's performance. I think that's a good one to kind of look into as well. Yeah, it's definitely an exercise I've never done before. So it'd be really cool to incorporate that for sure. Yeah, good deal. But I like the program you're following now. I think symmetry is great. Yeah, you're on the right track. Yeah, I'm loving it so far. It's completely novel to me and the fact that there's isometrics and unilateral stuff in there, it's been really helpful. It'll be interesting to see at the end when you get to get to when you do the bilateral stuff just what kind of strength things you got. And especially for your age, the questions you're asking and for your age, and you've only been really doing this consistently for two years, you have a lot of progress ahead of you for sure. There's maturity there, yeah. Yeah, for sure. I mean, your peak is going to be in terms of strength and performance. You got like another 10 years. You're doing good, man. Yeah, I appreciate that. You got it, man. Keep it up, John. Thanks for calling in. Thank you. Have a good day, you guys. You too, brother. Just a bunch of good news questions today. Yeah, yeah. Jerry made sure of that. Yeah, the whole progressive overload, I love that message. It's true, but then it can get a little sketchy because it's not linear. You just keep progressing. You just keep adding things. I only really cared about this when I got into competitive mode. The rest of my lifting career, I just, and teach there, I know there's somebody out there. It was also incremental, Adam. I mean, you got to explain that. Like you got to a pro level, but it wasn't like you looked at your volume, you're like, oh, cool, I'm going to go up 30%. It was very incremental. Well, you know what I saw the most value, and if you've listened for a long time, you might have heard me say this. It's been a long time since I've mentioned this. The most value that I had in tracking volume was actually not the, oh, every week, I'm going to increase more volume, more volume, was actually just to not go backwards. Yes. So because what I learned over tracking that diligently for that long of a period of time was we have these natural peaks and valleys. Oh, you have a good week of rest, and you did all the right things, and you just feel good, and so you push that extra set or that extra way. And then the next week, not so good. And then you would go, and so we- Without tracking. You went with that. And so what I noticed is like, man, when I looked at the over a month or two months of tracking, I actually wasn't really progressively overloading at all. I had these peaks and valleys, and so, and in my head, I'm remembering, oh, but yeah, but I was lifting more weight that day, and I did more reps this day, but then I also had the week where I went the other direction. And so when I was competing, my real goal wasn't like to always just keep adding more volume. It was just like, just like this week, even if I had like a rough week, I'm like, just make sure I get to at least that volume. And then when I have a good week, I'm going to make sure I push the volume up a little bit. And so it was really, really small amount, but it was really to help me from not letting those weeks where I go backwards. And again, that was only important because I needed every time I got on stage to show, I needed to show that I've improved my physique. And so there I'm like on a timeline. If it was just real life, like I deal with now. Just listen to your body. Yeah, just listen to my body. And I'm going to have times when I'm progressing well and other times when I'm regressing a little bit and other times where I'm just kind of maintaining and I'm always trying to adjust things in the day to make better sleep and better this and better that. But I'm not a fan of really getting hung up on a lot of these metrics unless you are in some sort of a competition where we've got to be done. But even then, like if you looked at it over the course of a year, it's incremental. Yeah. It's not these massive jumps in progression. Yeah. Look, if you love the show, head over to mindpumpfree.com and check out all of our free fitness guides. Also, come find us on Instagram. Justin is at Mind Pump. Justin, I'm at Mind Pump to Stefano. And Adam is at Mind Pump, Adam.