 Well, good morning everybody, and sorry for the delay in getting started this morning. Dynastalyn, and welcome to the US Institute of Peace for our continuing series, Changing Ethiopia. You can also follow the discussion online with that hashtag. My name is Ali Virgy, and I'm a senior advisor to the Africa program here at the Institute. We've had a few small changes this morning, for which I apologize. Unfortunately, as a victim of the strong winds across the Atlantic, our two speakers coming in from Ethiopia are not yet here. They're at Dulles and they're on their way, but we're going to start the conversation with the speakers that we do have and integrate them when they arrive. A few words of introduction about the Institute before we turn to today's panel for the benefit of those of you who haven't been here before, as well as our audience online. The US Institute of Peace is a national, nonpartisan, independent institute founded by the US Congress in 1984, and dedicated to the proposition that a world without violent conflict is possible, practical, and essential for US and global security. Today, we're delighted to host a discussion about one of those countries pivotal to global security, particularly in the Horn of Africa, Ethiopia, to discuss in particular the philosophy and the ideas that have emerged from Ethiopia's still relatively new prime minister, Dr. Abiy Ahmed, this most recent recipient of the Nobel Peace Prize. This is the name of this philosophy, but what is Medema? What does it mean? What does it not mean as well, perhaps? What are its principles? And what are their implications both for Ethiopia and beyond? Is it a new idea? Is it a path to sustained reform or merely a catchy slogan? To discuss some of these questions as well as the broader bilateral relationship between US and Ethiopia, I'm joined today by a couple of eminent panelists, and I'll introduce who we do have at the moment and come back to our later guests when they arrive. Etana Dinka, our discussant today to offer some critical reflections, is visiting assistant professor of African history and Mellon Postdoctoral Fellow at Oberlin College in Ohio. He is the author of Society, Revolution and Military Intervention in Ethiopian Politics, Experiences Among the Maka Oromo of Wallaga from 1974 to 1991, and his research interests include the political history of Ethiopia and the Horn of Africa. We also have as our DC representative here, Ethiopia's ambassador to the United States who will make some opening remarks and then we'll kick off the conversation, who has been ambassador now just for nine months, he was telling me. Previously he served as director general of the Ethiopian Investment Commission, head of the Addis Abba Investment Agency, and as Prime Minister Abi Ahmed's first chief of staff from April to December 2018. So please join me in welcoming our panelists and ambassador, some opening remarks from you. Thank you. Good morning. I'm checking if there are people in the room. Good morning. Thank you. Excellencies, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen, good morning. I'm very honored to be here with you this morning among this August assembly. Before I start my remarks, I would like to express my sincere appreciation to the US Peace and Institute for organizing this timely event to discuss Mademar, the new philosophy interest by Ethiopian Prime Minister and Nobel Peace laureate Dr. Abi Ahmed. Thank you very much. As most of you know, immediately after taking office in April 2018, Prime Minister Abi initiated unprecedented political and economic reform measures that have completely changed Ethiopia's political landscape and put our country on a new trajectory of social and economic transformation. His achievements have been duly recognized not only at home but also internationally with the honor of receiving the 2019 Nobel Peace Prize. Some of the major reforms undertaken in the past few months include the following. Immediately after taking office, the new administration lifted the country's terror of emergency and released thousands of political prisoners. The terrorist designation of exiled opposition political groups was removed and they were invited to return home to participate in the political process. Media censorship was discontinued and several repressive laws have been revised to build a more transparent, accountable and democratic governance. Ethiopia now has a gender-balanced cabinet, a female president, and Supreme Court Chief Justice, among other high-level appointments, significantly increasing the influence of women in the country's political and public life. The Prime Minister took the courageous initiative to resolve the border conflict with Eritrea, ending the 20-year no war, no peace stalemate between the two countries. Furthermore, his effective mediation of conflict between Eritrea and Djibouti, between Kenya and Somalia as well as in Sudan, South Sudan and beyond led a new hope of stabilizing and integrating the Horn of Africa and the continent at large. In the economic front, the government has introduced a series of reforms to open up and transform the economy from state-driven development towards greater participation of the private sector. Accordingly, the government has initiated an ambitious homegrown economic reform program with the aim of ensuring rapid economic growth, generating employment opportunities, especially for the youth and women, and creating an inclusive pathway to prosperity for all. A national ease of doing business initiative is being implemented with the aim of improving the business climate, eliminating the opportunity to create a tap and creating a predictable and transparent regulatory framework. A new investment proclamation is recently approved by the parliament to modernize the investment regulatory framework and encourage private sector participation and foreign investment in several sectors of the economy. Ladies and gentlemen, getting back to the main theme of today's forum, understanding Mademois, the organizers point out whether this new political philosophy can remake Ethiopia and they framed three important questions for discussion. One, what are the key principles of Mademois and how can they be applied, both domestically and abroad? Two, how does Mademois link with existing Ethiopian political and social structure? And three, is Mademois a path to sustained reform or merely a political slogan? As this question will be addressed by the distinguished panel of experts, including senior advisors from the office of the Prime Minister. I will not dwell on the details here. However, I will try to highlight some of the core aspects of Mademois to provide a general framework for our discussion. In explaining the philosophy of Mademois during his Nobel Peace Prize acceptance speech, Prime Minister Abi has noted that Mademois' homegrown idea that is reflected in our political, social and economic life is signifies synergy, convergence and teamwork for a common destiny. The Prime Minister envisioned Mademois as a social compact for Ethiopians to build a just democratic and human society by pulling together our resources for our collective survival and prosperity. He said, I'd score Mademois a covenant of peace that seeks unity in our common humanity. It pursues peace by practicing the value of love, forgiveness and reconciliation. Beyond the broader Ethiopia's Mademois inspired foreign policy pursues peace through bilateral and multilateral cooperation in good neighbourhoodness. The inclusiveness of Mademois ensures no one is left behind and we strive to live with our neighbours in peace and harmony. To further elaborate the concept, I would like to share with you some insightful reviews by a prominent scholar here in the U.S., Professor Al-Mariam, who has written extensively on Mademois over the past months. In his recent Mademois book review, Professor Al-Mariam wrote, in the dynamic process of cooperation and competition, Mademois represents a synergetic process of coming together of individuals, groups, leaders and institutions to work more energetically and effectively for the common good in the public interest. The synergy using a physics metaphor would be like fusion in which nuclear combined to release vast amount of energy. When individuals, groups, institutions etc., etc., are coming together in Mademois form, they release a vast amount of social, political and economic synergy. This Mademois as a synergy collaboration for the task of nation building and collaborative progress aims to harness the aspiration of individuals and unleash their energies for the collective good. Thus, from the above brief review, we can understand that Mademois is not just a political philosophy or a mere political slogan, it's rather a grand vision that encompasses the political, cultural, economic and social fabrics of the society. Although we still have a long way to go, the achievements gained and suffered by the political and economic reform undertaken within the short period of time are both exceptional and are commendable by any standard. We understand that these deep-rooted reform measures take time and require patience. We also recognize that the journey will not be smooth and there will be bumps in the road that will challenge us to derail the reforms. As we have already started the preparations to hold the general election in a few months, the challenge ahead of us could be even more daunting. However, the Ethiopian government is fully committed to stay the course and ensure that the upcoming election is free, fair and transparent. Let me conclude by emphasizing that in order to ensure that the reform measures are sustained, they require the participation of all stakeholders, political parties, civil society organizations, and the public at large, each and every one of us. I'm confident that all of us make positive contributions towards the peace-building and democratization process in the spirit of Medemar. The political and economic reforms will create new opportunities for Ethiopian people to build a democratic, peaceful and prosperous society. Thank you very much. Thank you, Ambassador, for your remarks and thank you for joining us today. Maybe we can start where you left off just to begin the conversation and come back to Medemar in a moment, but you talked about reforms. And for those of us who've been watching Ethiopia since Prime Minister Abi came into power and witnessing the changes, observing the many accomplishments that have occurred in a fairly short period of time, one question that I have for you is to hear a little bit more about what reforms do you feel are most important now. When we talk about reforms and you talked about political reforms and economic reforms, we could also mention security reforms. The danger is that it's the seemingly endless list and I think it would be useful and interesting for us to try and understand more about what the priorities are. If we talk about now, early 2020, you mentioned the elections are upcoming later this year. What are the reforms that are both necessary now in 2020? Achievable now? Realistic now? What are the priorities for the government when we talk about reform? What does this mean practically speaking? Thank you. The whole concept of reform is why the reform was needed. Before Prime Minister Abi came to power, as most of you remember, there were a large number of youth needing reform, pushing for change. That built up over a long period of years. Basically, if you see what happened before Prime Minister Abi came to power, there were, in terms of economic progress, there were fast growth, mainly fueled by public investment, investment in infrastructure, and mainly by state-owned enterprises. Banks were not providing any resources or enough resources for the private sector, and the private sector, in every sector, were not able to compete easily with government or state-owned enterprises. So, because of that, there were feelings of non-inclusive approach for economic, as well as when you come to the political process, the parliament that is still working at the moment is 100% controlled by the governing party, which has created a sense of alienation or people want to be inclusive. So, the whole reform is both political, economic, has been the need for inclusiveness. Sure, but what are the priorities? Because when you mention the parliament, yes, you're right. As you say, 100% held by the governing party, that isn't going to change tomorrow. That may change with elections whenever those are held. But one of the priorities that the government can do now, you can't change the composition of the parliament, right? It's going to remain more or less unchanged. So, when you talk about economic reforms, for example, what are the things that the government can do in the near term? Okay, as I explained earlier on my opening remark, I'll come to the political, the economic part, but in the political part to allow citizens to participate directly or through whom they are represented by opposition parties or to express their views, to allow freedom of speech and also freedom of expression, which is already on the constitution but was not practiced. So, there were also laws that prevented practically the expression that was enshrined in the constitution. So, removing, changing and enacting new ones has been a priority and that has been already done and will continue to be. So, that's part of the democratization process, political process. So, if I can ask you on this, then what, because as you said, it has been done, I mean, opposition parties are now able to function, there is greater freedom of expression, media and so on. So, what remains to be done? What still can be done now? So, that is just opening up. One of the problems, as I said, was lack of inclusiveness. And the political parties that descend are at different views. Some of them were labeled as terrorists, exiled or imprisoned. Some of them left for life or death sentence. All were given amnesty. All were given another chance to not only be free but also participate in a political process in that they are now participating. So, that part has been already done. And with the remaining periods, there are things that will be done in consultation with the participants in the political process. In the economic sphere, the main or the core for the reform has been homegrown economic reform program, which is basically reviews what went wrong and found out that public has crowded in and private sector was not supported. So, the theme is just to encourage private sector participation. By way of first one is not maybe the main one, but privatization, partial privatization is part of it. But the challenge is not only few public ownership, but also there are challenges in the macro arrangement where you have huge foreign currency shortages, the exchange rate control or the foreign currency policy, the trade policy, all that has to be reviewed in pursuit of supporting the private sector and accelerating the growth. To do that, we needed to look into the areas that need change, one of which is to improve the ease of doing business. The business climate was not as supportive as it should be. We have two regimes, one is supporting the FDI, which relatively was friendly, but still when it comes to access to land, power or contract enforcement or related to ease of doing things, tax collection and liquidation. There were so many challenges in it. So, the reform includes easing all those parameters. Import-to-export policy, accessing foreign currency for inputs as well as for other purposes to run the business has been a challenge. So, reducing the import-to-export time as well as cost so that companies operating BIT, FDI or locals be more competitive in a global sphere. That was also another area that has been touched on. Also, accessing to WTO has also been considered. After eight years as part of this reform, the first meeting has been commenced two weeks ago. You see, when it comes to public investment that was designated as public investment now are open to PPP for the first time. We have at the moment more than nine billion US dollars worth public private participation projects already identified and available for participation, road projects, power projects and also other areas. When it comes to public privatization, sugar industries are ready for full privatization. And ETO Telecom, which is biggest in terms of mobile subscription in Africa, even bigger than big operators. But when it comes to internet and digital services, one of the poorest is also open for partial privatization in order to create efficiency and competition and will be implemented through transparent process. We are not here to transfer the asset to a private sector and create private monopoly. Here we are trying to bring more efficiency through new technology and expanding the service in areas that are highly needed, which is access to internet. When the use gets connected to the internet, they will be liberated to connect to the rest of the world and companies who want to do outsourcing businesses and other related to IT sectors will be highly encouraged to do that business as well. So this will open up for not only in Telecom, but also power is also ready for partial privatization and PPP is also available. All arrangements are also there. Railways for the first time logistic sector has been opened, has been liberalized for private sector and also is ready for privatization. Thank you. Ambassador, maybe we can come back to some of the many details you raised in a moment, particularly this idea of a homegrown reform plan, because I think a lot of us would recognize when you talk about privatization and more investment and so on that this isn't necessarily a unique approach. It's certainly something that's happened in a lot of countries, but I want to bring Etana Dinka into the conversation first for a moment to ask you the question about reform. From the vantage point of 2020, February, what reforms are necessary in Ethiopia? You've heard what the ambassador has to say in terms of both political reforms and economic reforms. What is your opinion on what Ethiopia needs in terms of reforms at the present time? Thank you for the opportunity. Now, since every political group, every civic organization, and in fact the entire country, agreed that Ethiopia gotten to reform, we are now in the second year. Like the ambassador enumerated earlier, peace was made with Eritrea, prisoners were released, exiled political parties went home. So all of this happened since April 2018 and no one will be bent to challenge that because it's a positive move toward this democratization process. But after 2018, as soon as the new prime minister, Abiy Ahmed, came to power, Ethiopia is not doing well and the main agenda is not about reform. The main agenda of Abiy's government is to lay a ground, build a foundation upon which Abiy will stay on power for long. So what reforms are needed then? If you don't think reforms are occurring, what are the reforms that are needed? The reforms needed for me are many in terms of politics, economy, and even within the society itself, including the issues of media. But the first step Ethiopia needs to do to get into a real reform, there is one priority. Unless that priority is filled, Ethiopia cannot get into a real reform because there is a major obstacle on the way of the reform. That is the prime minister, Abiy himself. So what is that one thing that needs to happen? The removal of Abiy Ahmed from office. I'm not sure I see that as a reform exactly, but I want to press you a bit more on what is the reform that is needed. If Ethiopia is not experiencing enough reform in your view, what reforms are needed? Thank you very much. So once we talk about this issue, if we agree that Abiy is a problem, not part of a solution because since he came to office and the name of democratization and the name of reform, lots of damages have been done to the country's institutions, including the defense forces and every institution that the country has. So the reform we need is to open a space equally for the opposition and for the governing party right now. So opposition has a freedom to work to some extent, which we cannot deny, in major urban centers. In rural Ethiopia today, hundreds of opposition supporters are getting into being taken into prison. Citizens are slain, killed in broad daylight in the western province of the country. As I am talking right now, citizens are being dragged out of home, being killed, three provinces in the western part of the country are cut off from internet, from telephone. The country's national army are dragging news from home, killing farmers on their own farms in the southern part of the country, in Guji province. Citizens are taking them to prison for no reason. Totally, the political space has not been opened the way it has been promised. There is no equal opportunity given to the opposition and to the governing political party. In fact, the governing political party is hijacking every government institution, every government structure to promote its own ideal, which is a return into imperial Ethiopia in disguise. Ambassador, let's come back to you. There are some fairly serious things that were said there. But what I want to, serious things that were said, if we can please allow the discussion to occur. I want to ask you, Ambassador, in terms of the political space that exists, I think you yourself accepted in your opening remarks that there are still things to be done, and that's why I asked you what you saw as the priorities now. In terms of the political space, let's begin with political parties. Is the situation one which can be improved? How can this happen in the time that remains before elections? We know that there isn't a lot of time if the calendar announced by the National Electoral Board of Ethiopia basically holds. We'll have elections in August of this year. It's just a few months away. What can be done to increase the political space, or what are the plans of the government to increase the political space for opposition parties, for other parties, particularly during an election campaign? Thank you so much. Just to reflect a few issues on what Etana... Well, maybe we'll come to those in a moment, but if you could address my question, that would be great. So what things to be done? On the political space in particular. If I understood your question correctly. I mean, the government has been doing all its best to ensure there is peace and stability in the country. But given the previous government security apparatus, the way human rights has been abused and changing that with a new set of attitude and equipping that definitely will take time. So if we see, I mean, if we see the principles I just mentioned earlier, if we see the history of Ethiopia in the past 40 or more years, there were mistrust and there were also ideas that were brought from either East socialist attitude and principles and from West just taking it as it is without adapting. This is the first time that we are now having a homegrown and also what I can say is just what's exactly assessing the Ethiopian situation on the ground. So what we were lacking is if we have to accuse each other, nobody can be clean. That's why it starts with forgiveness. As something, you know, it looks like some religious kind of metaphor, but if we have to count, there are so many issues. Everyone has committed. We cannot escape from that, but we have to start afresh. So what Prime Minister Abi is saying is that let's start afresh, no pointing fingers. We can, you know, one can blame the other with tangible issues. So forgiveness will take us forward. Let's cooperate from now on. That's the best I mean. So with that, if we work with that spirit, if the future is in our hand, we cannot control the past. So let's work on where we are now so that we write our own history. There are histories that are still controlling us. For example, there are identity politics, ethnic politics, religious politics. So people have to come with ideas which can convince people. What are the policies that we are bringing to people? What are we going to do to change the lives of the people? Let's discuss on ideals, not on identity. So when we do that, I think the real debate comes into picture. When you talk about forgiveness, you're touching specifically on the philosophy of Medema. So let's perhaps go there in a moment. But I do want to ask you to respond to what Atana referenced in terms of the fact that there have been clashes. This is not something that is secret. There have been clashes in parts of Ethiopia in recent times over the last couple of years. What, in your view, can the government do about it? What do you say to the accusation that the army or state forces have been participating or complicit in some of the violations that have occurred? What is the government's response to that? First of all, before this thing happened, before the change happened, it's important to see how it happened. So the former Prime Minister, Hailamara, has resigned mainly because of the pressure, the mounting pressure, and also the pressure coming from the party. So there were internal fight, external fight. And I think we have to appreciate the step he has taken in Africa. He resigned himself despite the pressure. I mean, there were pressures. He understood that, you know, where that is going to lead. But he chose to resign. So there were two kinds of, two sets of thoughts as to how to continue. The first one was, despite the challenges in the previous electoral process, there was a law. There were views from political parties, opposition parties, some of whom were armed and, you know, they think, they thought they can influence. And they were asking for a transitional government. So that was one of the options. I'm not saying that wasn't possible. The other course was to complete the term that was given by the constitution to the previous Prime Minister and then prepare for elections. So after a thorough debate, I think this course has been taken. So there are people, opposition political parties that still believe the first course of action should have been taken. And still they believe now we need to have that. So they see themselves fit into this process and want a new transitional government and reforming starting from the constitution. But we believe that that would bring mounting tasks which we cannot easily handle for a population of 110 million, where there are ethnic as well as the religious conflict is, you know, you can feel it everywhere. So this is a kind of, you know, a political consultation that has led us to where we are now. Okay, thank you for that. But I don't think that entirely responds to the question of what has happened since Prime Minister Abhi has come into office in terms of some of the violence that has occurred in the country, some of the displacement that has occurred in the country. Ethiopia has now a very high number of internally displaced persons as a result of some of these subnational conflicts. What do you say to the allegation that the government has or the government forces or the army have participated, maybe not in all cases, but in some cases to either participate in these violations or otherwise not prevent them from occurring? I mean, what is the government's response to that in terms of what's happening now and last year and not necessarily when Haile Marum was Prime Minister? I understand. So what happened is a continuation of what was prepared before I mean the new Prime Minister came to power. But now when different parties joined for a peaceful political process, all of them were not denouncing violence. Some of them continued with their way of looking forward to power. Some of them who were in neighboring countries armed when invited, there was a condition to denounce violence and also be unarmed. They did that when they joined, but partly what you see in parts of the country is as a result of not honoring this coven they just took before they decided to join. But I don't want to take this blame to all, but also there were also security reform that I mean dysfunctioned some of the security that were accused because of human, I mean because of, I was going to say abuses, they were in the security room, they were important, but were not aligned to the new change. So they were very important for securing the previous arrangement, but were not helpful for the new one. Taking changes has taken some time. That was also another thing that needed adjustment. So what you hear from people is two views. At one hand, you hear there are conflicts in these parts, government is putting heavy hand. In the other hand, government is not doing enough to secure peace and stability in the country. So government has been trying with the new philosophy for its teaching, then enforcing the rule of law. So in the process it's unfortunate there are, yes, loss of life and also so many damages. I think the opposition party, all politicians in the country have a role to call for peace and for peaceful process. So I just want to be clear so that for the benefit of the audience and also for anybody that will be watching this later, you are saying that you hold at least some opposition groups somewhat responsible for some of the things that have occurred without going into every individual issue and area because Ethiopia is a very large and diverse country, but as the representative of your government you're also saying that the government accepts some responsibility for some of the violations that have occurred. Is that accurate? Is that a fair summary? So as you can see we are in making of inclusiveness. So government is trying now not to blame one party over the other and make it a clear line like that, but definitely they know it themselves, those who are destabilizing and time has been given for them to come back to their mind and choose a better inclusive way of working together. In the meantime those who are in direct contact with the violation of human rights or the perpetrators are brought to justice. Again you may feel from media and many people also would agree that the way such responsible individuals groups has been identified and the process has been taken, the justice process is not properly communicated and people feel that this government is not protecting the people enough and they compare this with the previous government which has relatively stronger communication and also maybe it's not inability but as a way of encouraging inclusiveness, as a way of giving chance for individuals who are not part of this, that's the whole thing. Otherwise I think government is trying its best with a reformed security system, with a reformed police force and justice reform to ensure peace and stability. So just to be clear again you are saying that you do accept to some extent, not necessarily that we need to debate to what extent, but to some extent there is also a responsibility for the government to perform better, to address some of its weaknesses, some of the violations that its forces may have occurred, is that right? I'm glad that we're clear on that. Great, well just on that moment as I was about to move on to Medema, we have our two other guests who will be joining us in a moment and while they just get ready let me just ask you one more question before we turn to them. It's coming back to the economy. You mentioned and we've heard this phrase and the Prime Minister has also used this phrase homegrown reform, homegrown economic reform plan. What exactly about this plan is homegrown? What is the uniquely Ethiopian element of this? Because I heard you talk about increased investments. I heard you talk about privatization and giving more room for the private sector. I mean these are all things that economists all over the world encourage or discourage depending on their own views. I don't hear that as a uniquely Ethiopian thing to do. So what are the elements of this plan that are homegrown? The fact it makes it homegrown is that it starts from what's exactly happened in the country. So given Ethiopia is an agrarian country, wants to pursue industrialization and has opportunities in the tourism mining sector, we want to use our opportunity by bringing more investment and enabling. So what it makes it homegrown is it identifies the growth challenges, we call it growth diagnostics, has been done. So we are not bringing new ideas from somewhere and trying to, in the past there were attempts to just copy from, we hear it sometimes from South Korea, Developmental States approach, or from other countries. So this time what we have done is what are the challenges in the country? Then reviewing all those challenges, the growth was double digit for nearly two decades before the change, but that growth was fueled mainly because of public investment. So that is not sustainable. And it took too much borrowing from overseas. So we need to base on our resources to sustainable development, which is unleashing the opportunities and also support the private sector. So what it sounds like to me is that you are describing a plan that is tailored to Ethiopia's circumstances, because certainly Ethiopia is not the only country in the world that has a primarily agrarian or agricultural economy. It is certainly not the only country that wants to diversify and industrialize. What I am hearing you say is that the plan, whatever the economic plan is, needs to be tailored to the particular circumstances and realities of Ethiopia, but in terms of the responses, whether it is privatization of, you mentioned the industries, you mentioned the opening, whether it is transport or telecoms or what have you, that it sounds to me like the solutions to that are amongst the ones that we might recognize in other countries, but that they may not have been pursued in Ethiopia before. Is that fair? Just to give you one simple answer maybe for that. If you remember the structural adjustment programs that were taken in the 80s and after that, mainly in Africa and after the Cold War in the Eastern Bloc. Most of them were driven by IMF and World Bank. If you do this, we will give you this. But what happened in Ethiopia is just this is our plan. Anyone multilateral or bilateral could you support us? So totally different from what has been achieved. So in the case of structural adjustment, after they failed, blamed the financial institutions. Here now we are saying it's our plan and we know how to do it. So just review what we have planned and also if you believe in it, join us. We are now on the way to prosperity. Thank you Ambassador for holding the fort in the absence of your colleagues. Perhaps we can ask your two colleagues to join us on stage and I'll briefly introduce them. So please come up if you can. Well thank you, welcome. I know that traffic is still what it is. Dallas is not that close, but thank you for making the journey. The long, long journey from Addis. We've been talking in your absence a little bit about the Ambassador's experience. Of course you know very well that he was also working in the Prime Minister's office for some time and we were just talking a little bit about his own views and some of what he said in his speech. Perhaps we can turn now more to Medimer as the philosophy which we try to stay away from a little bit, although the Ambassador said and we've just been talking about forgiveness and forgiveness is obviously one of these key concepts in Medimer. So let me just say a few words of introduction and then put questions to you immediately. Lencio Barti is the Senior Political Diplomacy and Foreign Policy Advisor in the office of Prime Minister Abi. Prior to returning to Ethiopia to rejoin, or to join the Abi administration, Mr. Barti taught Human and Political Geography at Gustavus Adolphus College in Minnesota. So welcome back to the U.S. And we also have sitting to your left, Mamo Moreto who is Senior Advisor on Policy Reforms and Chief Trade Negotiator in the office of the Prime Minister. And you lead the Policy and Performance Team as well in the office of the Prime Minister. So thank you gentlemen again for coming and for making it here. Lencio Barti, if I can turn to you, we've heard... Sorry for interruption, Virgil, because Ambassador was talking for most of the time, I have just one point to throw before we get into the main discussion of the Medimer. Can I come back to you in just a moment? Can I just put a question to our... Just to be fair to the audience. Don't worry, we'll get there. So Mr. Barti, if I could come to you and just ask you, what does Medimer mean for you? What you may have not heard is the Ambassador summarized and gave some of the excerpts of the speech that the Prime Minister gave in Oslo when he received the Nobel Prize. But can you explain to us when we hear this word, Medimer, and people say Synergy, what does that really mean? Like, practically speaking, Synergy is one of those words that people like to throw around. It's one of those buzz words that, you know, we can find it in a lot of places in this town, for example. What does it really mean? What does it practically mean? Can you help us try and understand that? And then we'll start from there and then we'll come back to respond to some of the other issues that have been raised. Thank you. Sorry for being late. I'm asking to explain the idea behind Medimer. As you all know, every society, every state has a unique history and a unique trajectory. In Ethiopian case or in African case, in post-colonial Africa, different form of state building, different form of organizing a society has been tried by large, there's some success, but when you look at the continent by large still, we're struggling with the idea of stateness. We are struggling with the idea of how to hold a society together. In case of Ethiopia for many, many years, a project that was aimed at creating a national political polarity has been tried for many years under different governance during the monarchy, during the Marxist regime, under Marx-Leninist different form of ideology has been tried. Since 1991, the federal arrangement has been tried. All of them, we cannot say they are a failure, but they are some successes, but they still remain inadequate. Ethiopia being one of the oldest nations in Africa, still from time to time, it faces a challenge of stateness. It faces challenges of fragmentation. So the prime minister trying to find a way. How can we organize Ethiopian society? How can we organize our political economy? How can we create a national unity? Out of this, he came up with the idea of madammer. Madammer means it's an idea of national mobilization, where we put all our efforts together, instead of dichromatizing things or instead of just putting things into the extreme, trying to find a common middle ground around which we all organize ourselves and build a multinational federal state. This requires mobilizing and bringing together all ethnic groups, all religious sects, at the same time in the arena of economy also, it requires creating partnership between private and public also and also mobilize the entire Ethiopian population. So madammer means it's a synergy. It is a system that looks things from holistic point of view. Usually things has been defined in dichotomous way, either in the left or in the right or with me or against me, all those kinds of stuff. This ideology, this thinking, trying to strike a balance between competition and also cooperation. How can we synthesize? How can we synchronize our social relations and how we can also organize our economy in creating partnership between private and public in the past? A lot of investment has been made in public sphere, but the private investment has been somehow suppressed. This time we are trying to diminish the role of the state eventually, but still the state still intervenes when it's necessary, but we are trying to invite in the private investors and foreign investors in order to put the Ethiopian economy in the right track. As you were away, we actually did talk quite a lot about the economy, so let me press you more on the first part. This idea of synergy, I still don't hear an answer to my question. What does it mean, practically speaking, when we talk about a synergistic approach? I mean, the way the Prime Minister put it in his speech in Oslo was madammer signifies synergy, convergence, and teamwork for a common destiny. Those are nice words, but I'm still not clear on what exactly they mean practically speaking. Well, madammer has three pillars. One, it's an effort to create a national unity, and second, it's an effort to make sure citizens of Ethiopia become free and enjoy freedom, and third, combine all this, we pursue the path for prosperity. In order to do that, we need to come together. We need to come together, put our efforts together, and work for common goal. Our diversity is a blessing, and we have a multinational federation, a multinational federation state. It is not a system or a process of creating one monolithic national identity. It's a way of bringing everything together and create a symbiosis relationship, a relationship that is mutual. But mutual between who exactly? Because when you talk about mutuality of agreements... There are different agencies here. Society is an agency, religion is an agency, the private sector is an agency, the state is an agency. All these things need to be organized and articulated properly in order to bring a desired goal. So the synergy is organizing, coordinating all of this in a synchronized way, so that we can achieve our destiny of prosperity. And who makes those decisions about articulating it? When you talk about national unity, for example, you can say on this stage that we have Ethiopians, we can all identify as nationals of that country, but what does national unity practically mean? What does it mean? Does it mean changing or reinforcing certain symbols? Does it mean changing the nature of the state's political structure? What does this really mean? We talk about national unity as if it's an obvious thing, but I don't think it's so obvious. What does it really mean? National unity means a lot of things. It's an issue of geography, it's an issue of sovereignty, and the issues are also citizens' pride. So when we say national unity in any state, in nation state building project, these are some of the things that you pursue. Some can be arranged, can be managed through governance, through bureaucracy, some need to also have a national aspiration where people identify themselves with the geography, with the national anthem, with the history, and also common destiny. As I said, this problem of issue of Mademmer in the first place came about because we have a problem. We have a fragmented society. So the prime minister thinks this is a means to fix this fragmentation. If you see our federation, for example, it's a step in the right direction. But this federation is not converging. It's not a process of creating a national common political polity. Rather what we see is a divergent federation in which in most cases people really don't share an aspiration of one another even under one geographic system. So it is a necessary intervention to fix some of the system that is broken. So when you talk about the federal structure, does convergence mean abandoning that, moving away from it? So this is why I'm trying to understand practically speaking that yes, Ethiopia is a federation. You just said that's a step in the right direction, but that there isn't convergence. So help us try to understand practically speaking when we talk about Ethiopia as a federal country. What does convergence mean in that particular dimension? Does it mean changing somehow, tweaking somehow? I mean, what does it mean? No, federation is, as I said, the step in the right direction. It came about because it was aimed to answer some of pre-1991 tensions, but that federation was mismanaged. It was more of a facade. It was centrally managed. So regions were not free to run their own bureaucracy, to run their own governance. So as such, it has created a lot of conflicts. It has created a lot of tension. That's actually eliminated into mass protest and opposition, and eventually the system has to change. So when we say this federation needs to converge, as an Ethiopian society, as a people under one state, we have our differences. We also have things that we have in common. We need to emphasize on what we have in common, rather than emphasizing what we have separately. So how do you propose to do that if you're also pursuing more federalism? You're saying that effectively the problem was it was too centralized or it wasn't genuine. So that means or implies that there should be more federalism, there should be more decentralization or more autonomy for the regions or however you wish to characterize it. So if there's more autonomy or more separation or decentralization, then how do you come up with this fact that people all identify more together? Surely the opposite would happen, or potentially the opposite could happen. First of all, federation, that is not democratic, end up in catastrophe. We have seen that in Eastern Europe. Ethiopian federation lacks democracy. So it is necessary to interject a democratic system of governance into Ethiopian federation. And at the same time allow people to exercise their language and culture and also use their resources. At the same time also unite as a national political society. Etana, let me come to you. You're a historian of Ethiopia. You've heard this argument just being advanced that yes, Ethiopia is a federalism, is a federal structure, we need more federalism. What is your response to that? And if I could ask you to respond specifically to this issue is Ethiopia, does Ethiopia need more federalism? And if so, what does that mean? Does that permit convergence? Thank you very much for that question because the Ambassador was talking about this and very honestly to that point I am very grateful to Ambassador first to have said that identity politics is not necessary for Ethiopia when the country's constitution, the existing constitution is about multinational federalism. So when we listened to Lange Obati which unfortunately just arrived, the points are very much different. I think Ambassador first was very, very honest in saying that the prime minister and his government is against identity politics. It is not necessary. He said when he explained he said people must come with ideas which means ideas which are different from mobilization as apart from identity politics. Unfortunately, Lange Obati is insisting that Ethiopia will pursue and maintain multinational federalism. Having said this, Ethiopia adopted multinational federalism to come out of a serious problem. It's a matter of existing or disintegrating. By 1991 when it was adopted it was not a matter of joke or it was not even a matter of creating comfort or any luxury. It was a matter of keeping the country together because Ethiopia has a history of nationalist struggle, civil war, conflicts, famine, poverty, all of those things and that came out of the road that Ethiopia traveled in history. Imperial Ethiopia, the principles of Imperial Ethiopia did not accept identities of people, cultural identity, religious identity, all sorts of diversity we have in Ethiopia, Imperial Ethiopia rejected us and that laid into the birth of liberation struggles. Liberation struggle, struggle, and struggle in Oromia, Gambela, including Eritrea. Eritrea is the product of that policy. Just on this question of Lange Obati saying we need more federalism, do you agree with that? Of course, Ethiopia needs more of not just federalism, multi-national federalism. The prime minister and his assistants usually want to skip this kind of question. They say federalism They are not courageous enough to call about multinational federalism. What the country needs to exist and survive this problem is to maintain and promote existing multinational federalism. What it requires to survive as a country, as a state, is more federalism, not less. All right. Let me come back to you, Lencho Bhatti and you, Mama Meretu. When we talk about Medema, and you've described also the problems that Ethiopia has had, there's some shared historical analysis there, I think. And you're basically describing Medema as a response to that, right? You're saying it's a way to respond to these things. We've heard the sort of rhetoric of Medema in terms of coming together and adding together and so on. But I'm still struggling to understand what does it practically mean as a solution? Because I've heard the diagnosis, the diagnosis that Ethiopia is in trouble, that Ethiopia faces many challenges. What is the solution here? I mean, when you talk about Medema as a philosophy or as a platform or as a policy to advance addressing some of these problems, what does it entail on the political front? One of the questions I put to the ambassador a bit earlier is with elections upcoming this year, what practically can the philosophy do or lead to? What reforms can be further affected to improve that environment? Where there is this idea of coming together, but also we know elections are competitive and divisive. That's the nature of elections if you have people with different points of view. So how does Medema really address the political space in a practical sense? Thank you. I know Ambassador Fitzsum will not dismiss identity politics. I know for sure. I know him when he was talking about stuff. Ethiopia is a diverse nation since its inception. So we have more than 80 ethnic groups. Some of us have multiple identities. We speak different languages. Because we speak the language of our neighbors, the kids we want to school with. So identity is there. But the issue is identity as a cultural practice, identity as a social practice, and identity as a political instrument to mobilize. There is a lot of debate around that. Probably what the ambassador is trying to say. As far as the federalism is concerned, the prime minister is a federalist. He believed in federal multi-national federation. He actually struggled within the system against a facade, artificial form of federalism where one single ethnic group mastermind even select presidents for other regional states. So accusing him or his administration for being anti-federalism, this is not true. It's very, very, very far from the truth. Because we know the record. We know the struggle within the APRDF. We also know his daily livings. He's a centrist. He has to, Ethiopian need a leader like him because there are different aspirations. There are two extremes. And the Ethiopian community is highly politicized. There is a lot of cynicism. So therefore, for him in order to maintain the unity of this country and also move it forward, he has to maintain a balance where he can bring everybody on the right direction and move the country forward. Federalism is a constitutional issue. Nobody is going to temper with that. And anybody who really knows the reality in Ethiopia is not going to really play around with that. So federation is going to stay the prosperity party. One of, it is key identity, is maintaining multinational federation and how it's going to be practical. Mademur believes in inclusive politics. Let me tell you, over the last 27 years, most of the politicians were in jail or either in exile. The journalists were in prison and the political space was controlled with narrow political oligarchy. Mademur, the prime minister, released all political prisoners from prison. Freed journalists, reform, civil society proclamation, at the same time also allowed all oppositions, armed and then armed, to come to the country. He liberalized the entire political space. So right now, the political space is liberalized. That is actually the first stage of reform. Many countries either fail or succeed based on how this opportunity is managed. And the way we see it now, it needs to be handled with proper care. The opposition needs to implement very civil politics. We need to accommodate each other. We need to speak to each other in a very civil way because we have common destiny, we have common country. There are all challenges. Like any other third-worlder countries, these are challenges. So in the past, the state was the mother of all the problem. Now I can see the way we are doing our politics is becoming, I'm not blaming the society, but it is becoming a problem. So how to really fix this and move the country forward is what Mademur is trying to... But what is that? Because that's still what I'm trying to understand. And we talk about the second phase, the second phase of that, yeah, the second phase of that reform, and maybe Mama wants to come in on this to respond as well, please feel free. But yes, we know people have been released. We know that the opposition parties are working. I'm still trying to understand, and I think the audience would like to also understand, when we talk about the second phase of reform, when we talk about practically preparing for a more inclusive politics, as you put it, what does that actually mean? I mean, inclusive politics is one of those phrases that also sounds nice, but in practice, what does it mean? Beyond the bearability of parties to function. Mademur is actually much richer than inclusive politics. This is what has been prescribed from someone else in the past. Mademur is homegrown idea. We have our differences. We can maintain our differences, but we have common needs. As human beings, we have common needs because we have to meet our daily needs. As citizens of a country, we need to maintain our national unity. As a people, we need to get out of this poverty and move forward and achieve prosperity. These are the three things. We have been talking about poverty for many, many years. When we talk about something again, again, again, it become your friend. That's why we are trying to avoid the word poverty now. Now, that's why we adopted the word prosperity. We're dreaming big. Mama, you wanted to come in. Maybe you can try and respond to this question of, okay, it's more than inclusive politics. We understand that. It's a broader idea. You don't want to talk about poverty, fair enough. Although we all know that Ethiopia's poverty has declined over the last, in conjunction with economic growth, but there's still a problem of poverty in the country, definitely. So what is Mademur in a practical sense? When we talk about coming together, when we talk about opposition parties functioning, is Mademur more than a slogan for the prosperity party? Well, definitely it's more than a slogan. I think you keep asking what Mademur is again and again. But I think you can look at it in three ways, in my view. I think the first is the literal definition of the word itself, Mademur. It means coming together, working for the same purpose, for shared purpose, working in sync. That's the literal definition of Mademur. But I think it goes beyond this literal definition of the word. I think the first thing is Mademur can be seen as a set of ideas that guides the reform process in Ethiopia right now. So if you look at, for example, the book that was authored by the prime minister, there is a general discussion of what Mademur is, and then it offers a set of ideas when it comes to the economy, when it comes to the direction of the politics, when it comes to Ethiopia's foreign relations. So it has a set of ideas, really good ideas, of how to guide, how to shape the reform process that's currently happening. So one way of looking at it is, it's a set of really good ideas that transform the country towards prosperity. So that's one element of it. The second element of Mademur is you can see it as a framework, as a way of looking at things, as a lens through which you examine things. So essentially what Mademur says is, it's a call to the nation to extract it, this habit of, this dangerous habit of throwing the past and starting with a clean slate all the time. So that needs to be stopped. What Mademur says is, instead of starting afresh every time, you build on the successes and the gains of the past, number one. Number two, you identify mistakes of the past and try to correct them. And number three, try to be observant, try to really examine the current reality and identify the problems that come up with a solution that responds to our current reality. So it's a framework of looking at things as well. So viewed through this lens, you can actually say what would be the policy of the government comes to the economy? What's the policy of the government when it comes to the foreign relations? Looking at it as a framework of thinking. But ultimately the goal of Mademur is to achieve shared prosperity for the Ethiopian people. Ultimately the goal of Mademur is to leave a legacy of hope for the next generation. So we look at the past, instead of throwing it away, we see lessons that we can take from that, correct past mistakes and build a bright future for the next generation. Ultimately that's what Mademur is all about. Thanks very much, that's helpful. Maybe we can move on a little bit from this to talk a bit more about foreign policy. You've just mentioned that time is running. The African Union Summit just happened in Addis last week. When you walked around Addis, you could see the billboard saying, Mademur for a prosperous Africa. This is emblazoned on the African Union Summit billboards. What does Mademur mean? When you say it's a framework for understanding action, what does it mean when we talk about foreign policy and let's perhaps start with the region? So we're all very much aware of the achievements that have occurred. So let's not dwell on what's been done, but let's try and understand what does it mean practically speaking? So as we know right now, Ethiopia is engaged in these sensitive talks about the Nile with Egypt, with Sudan. Without going into the details of that, obviously it's sensitive and still a negotiation that's ongoing. But can you explain to us, for example, how Mademur, when we talk about cooperation or coming together, how would that play out in this very practical and very real case where it matters, right? The outcome matters to all the countries involved. It particularly matters to Ethiopia. So what does it mean when we talk about Mademur in a regional foreign policy context? And maybe we can start with the water issues and then perhaps we can broaden out a little bit. I think at first of all, I mean, when it comes to the negation regarding God, this is, as you said, a very sensitive issue and I would avoid making any comment on that particular topic. I mean, I'm not asking you to go into details. I'm just saying in terms of the approach when we talk about it, right? I mean, the principle, if we look at the Prime Minister's speech is cooperation, friendship, right? And that presumably goes for the neighboring countries as well, including ones which may not have the same interests as Ethiopia. So I'm just trying to understand what it means practically speaking as a point of policy. So I think, absolutely. So if you look at the Mademur conception, you can actually make a really strong connection about Ethiopia's foreign policy priority when it comes to Africa. Because Mademur essentially focuses on our shared humanity. It focuses on our shared objectives. So it doesn't really wish away our differences. It actually cherishes our differences. So when it comes to African continent, for example, Ethiopia wants to play a purposeful role, an active role, to actually bring together all African nations. A very good example of this is the role that Ethiopia played in finalizing and negotiating the African continental free trade agreement. This is a clear example of past work legacy that we inherited from our forefathers and creating an integrated Africa would create the basis for a prosperous Africa. And Ethiopia plays a very active and a very purposeful role in that regard. The African, for example, the African continental free trade agreement becomes a reality when Ethiopia right fights the agreement. Without Ethiopia, the agreement will never come to existence. It's come into existence because of what Ethiopia did. Ethiopia brought close to 100 million people to this single African market. So this is sort of a natural extension of our domestic policy. We support, we promote coming together domestically. And a natural mirror image of that would be to support further integration effort in the African continent as well. So does that mean, I'll give you in a moment, but I just want to ask this question and response to that. Does this mean that effectively it's a sort of pan-Africanist idea? I mean, where we've seen in the past, whether it was Krami and Krumah or even Haile Selassie, articulating this sort of pan-Africanist vision, is that a fair way of characterizing it? Maybe, Lencho, you want to respond to that? To just add a little bit on what Mammo said, how Mademois applies in our foreign policy activities. For example, we promote regional economic integration in the Horn. The reason is Ethiopia is a heart of the Horn of Africa. And also, Ethiopia shares borders. At the same time, we also share communities. There are almost in Ethiopia, or almost in Kenya. There are Tigrians, Tigray, there are Tigris in Eritrea. There are farce in Ethiopia, farce in Djibouti and also in Eritrea. We have Somalis in Kenya, in Ethiopia, in Somalia, Somaliland, in Djibouti. It's the same with Anuak, the same with Nuweir. So therefore, we share geography, we also share cultural groups. So therefore, we can say our faith is interlinked. So Mademois is interlicking things. Instead of, we don't believe in particularizing things. We are trying to create a synergy for everything. We believe it will work because human beings, as Mammo said, have similar interests. Nation also can have similar interests. I don't know any nation who really wants to condemn itself to underdevelopment. Everybody wants to move forward. So in this, we can pull our efforts together. We can also use our natural endowments and work for the betterment of the whole region. For Ethiopia also, it's a larger economy. It's 100, 100, 10, 108 million people. It's landlocked. It is a primary economy, agricultural economy. We need ports. All these countries around us have ports. So therefore, even for our own interest, for our economic interest, we give priority to our neighbors. We don't have any enemies. We don't start from labeling somebody or some nation as an enemy. We start everybody as our neighbor. Then we move forward. So what you've described, in some sense, is basic political interests, that Ethiopia needs access to ports, Ethiopia needs to have good relations where it has shared ethnic groups and so on. Two questions. One is, isn't that always what the interests have been? I mean, the ports may change. And that may still change. But where is the key difference in that? But if I can just add a second question to that and coming back to this idea of beyond the border regions, obviously, you're right. There are these areas where, through history, colonialism, the way that land was allocated, you have groups split between several different countries. But beyond that, in terms of when it's emblazoned on the African Union, banner as Medema for a prosperous Africa, what does that mean if you are, say, Nigeria? What does that mean if you are a Zambia, from the perspective of Medema and this sort of idea that it's beyond boundaries? I mean, what should those countries understand? And by extension, countries further afield as well. Yeah. One important concept in this Medema is it's not a zero sum game. It believes in symmetry, means balancing. It believes in competition. As a same time, it's also believed in cooperation. So this is how our foreign policy is going to be guided. We do not pursue a foreign interest. It is not because it is our right. It is because we need it. For example, the Nile. I mean, most of, I mean, the majority of the rivers comes from Ethiopia. We are not raising an issue of rights. We are raising the issue of needs. We only use what we need. It is not about we use what is ours. We don't pursue that kind of. We just use what we need because we need it. And when we do that, we also make sure others do not get hurt or others' livelihood is not affected. What about where needs or interests conflict? I mean, Ethiopia has its needs. Other countries define their needs as well. While this is all the international relations politics, we want to pursue a different one. And we believe it will work. As you are right, it's a pan-African sense. And we are humans of this globe. And our lives shouldn't always be fueled by trot-cutting competition. OK. What about for the other countries on the continent? Like I said, if you're thinking about this from a further perspective, you mentioned, Mama mentioned the continental free trade agreement. So that's obviously a tangible expression of that that incorporates or hopes to incorporate almost every country on the continent. If you are not an immediate neighbor of Ethiopia, what does the new foreign policy mean for you? What if you are, as I said, Nigeria or Zambia or the Central African Republic, or you name it? I mean, what is the expectation? Is there a general orientation that we can see coming out of this that other countries should expect or should know? Whoever wants to respond to that. I think, you know, Mademar, you know, essentially, as I said, if you look at Mademar's foreign policy priority in the African continent, we want to promote integration. We want to create a bigger market within the African continent. When that happens, it will benefit not just Ethiopia, but the rest of Africa, whether it is Nigeria or South Africa or Guinea, whichever country that you mentioned, will benefit from that. It's just simple economics. When you create a bigger market, you will be able to attract investment because investors will come and invest not just in one particular country, but in all countries, knowing that, they can freely trade across the African continent. And this would be an important contribution for shared prosperity, not just in Ethiopia, but also in Nigeria. So what we really want to do is the Prime Minister often talks about markets that are open to trade and mines that are open to ideas. That's a common phrase that he often repeats in his speech. You know, his idea is for an Ethiopia living in this Congo and working in Lagos, for example. That kind of closer integration would benefit everyone. Yeah, sure, please, Ambassador. Just to add a little bit on this, what it is is we are saying it's better together. It's better our way than my way or your way. So it's not just a simple concept when you see our politicians or many people in the country, even the intellectuals. You find a kind of orthodox or conservative kind of my way, kind of attitude. Staying for the last 10 months, nine months here in the US, I've learned you compromise a lot. I think this is a wonderful wisdom to go forward. We hardly do that. So Mademois is bringing this kind of infusion, this kind of bringing a way to work together. So what you see, what we are trying to achieve in the Nile negotiation is also what can we achieve together because it's better together again. And when you bring this into the African continent, intercontinental free trade agreement is one of them, but that's not all. We have what we call 2063 AU African Union agenda, which has many issues to bring Africa together to create common market, to create common African, to unite Africa. So I think the African Union team and what is coming out as Mademois has more of one and same in many ways. It aligns easily to the African agenda as well. I think we have done so much in the past saying this is my way and that's how I should be pursuing. But politicians, opposition or government, other institutions all have to come to listen to others and see how much they can compromise for the betterment of the nation, for the betterment of the country. So what you're describing is not only, of course, an international precept, it's my way, your way. You're also describing it in a domestic context. But listening is one thing. We can all listen or you can invite people to listen and exchange views and dialogue and that's something that is obviously very important. But that doesn't necessarily mean that there is a compromise that results in it. I mean even on this panel there are different points of view. How is it more than just about dialogue or just about hearing the other people? How is it possible, particularly for those that aren't in power don't have the benefit of being in office. It's always easier for those that do have the power and do have the stronger position to say there should be compromise. It's much more difficult when you are in a weaker position to be an economist in that way. So what does it really imply at a practical level for your average Ethiopian? I mean, if we're talking about somebody today, forgetting about the high politics and whatever else is going on amongst the political parties, if you are an average Ethiopian citizen living in Ethiopia, what does this mean for you? So, you know, just referring to the Medimer book, unfortunately the English version is not yet until next month will be coming out. So just referring to that, Medimer is about clearing the past through forgiveness and coming into a new term and then to know one another, to work together and the past 40 years or so, politicians were divided and accusing each other and they have never been met in person. What about the ordinary person? I mean, not politicians. I'm talking about the ordinary people as well because the politicians, you know, they are the one, the coin ideas that divide or unite people. So those who are receptive of these ideas have never met because they believe they are in a different world and I've been, I said, in the US meeting more than 20,000 diaspora in 22 cities in just nine months and in many of the meetings I met people coming to the meeting for the first time together. They met as this community or that community or the other community, not the Ethiopian community together. So whenever some ideas were raised, the other was saying, I didn't know that you think this way. So we have never met, introduced each other, worked together. So I think that's a process that we should be encouraging people to know each other, what they are thinking, what they believe and also help them to know each other and compromise to come to center because ultimately we have to build what we call our nation. Okay, yeah. Mamawalancho, do you want to add to this? I want to put the same question to you and I also want to put it to you in a moment, Etana, as well. This idea for the individual, again, you know, the political thing, the diaspora is perhaps not the majority of the people we're talking about here. The 100 million Ethiopians are mostly in Ethiopia. So what is the individual consequence of the individual implication when the Prime Minister makes these rhetorical flourishes to come together and to, you know, promote this idea of oneness? What does it mean for your average person? Thank you, actually. It's beyond rhetoric or pledge. It's happening actually in actual practicality. I have never seen in my life that the Ethiopian Grand Palace, ever open to its citizens with this magnitude and openness. This is the palace in Addis you're talking about? Right now, yes. There is a lot of dialogue going on between him and the opposition, opposition leaders, and among the opposition itself, he also formed the Border Commission, he formed Peace Reconciliation Commission. There is also an Oromo and Amara elites forum going on because there is two states exhibit tension. So the actual dialogue is happening. How are we going to use it is what is a test. So the opening is there. We are going into election. We want to make sure, you know, everybody get a fair level playing field and let the Ethiopian people decide whom they want as their leaders. So there is massive commitment from the Prime Minister and his administration in terms of making this election free and fair and democratic and credible also. That's very important because the credibility of state and state-society relation depends on the outcome of that election. That's where, if we succeed, with liberalization we are struggling because the field is open and the way the politics is being played, sometimes, you know, we have, you know, 70% of the Ethiopian population are used. So there is challenge, but the commitment is there. So if we manage to have a free and fair elections with credible result, then we can see a positive identification of people with a state. Then we can say we can achieve, we really transform the Ethiopian states. So two things. One, we want to transform the state. At the same time, we also want to bring democracy to the country. There is two challenges. So this election is not just a normal election. It's actually a referendum whether to live together or not. So it's a very complicated situation and the prime minister is quite aware of this. He's working very hard. He's dialoguing with all the oppositions. For example, you know, the election board is chaired by a woman who is a victim of torture, who was also a very famous political figure at one time. 50% of the cabinets are women, so the commitment is there. So it also requires, as Mamu said, how we the Ethiopian people play this chance in order to move our country and transit into democratic governance. Maybe we'll just turn to Etana just in the interest of time. I just want to ask you to respond to this idea of what does it mean for an individual. You've heard the aspirations, some of the aspirations that remain, some of the things that have been done, but if we're talking about an individual citizen, what do you hear, what's your reaction to what you've heard here? Just briefly, please. I think you'll be fair on me as well. For Lange opening the Grand Palace for visit for ordinary citizens or urban dwellers is a fall. But I haven't reflected on Madame herself because what is going on in the country tells much a lot than the rhetoric of the prime minister and his allies about Madame. Madame is not something that is yet to be put in practice. It is already practiced since April 2018 when the prime minister came to office. What Madame meant, we have seen through his choices. We have seen it through his decisions. We have seen through his rhetorics. We have seen it through a number of political decisions that have happened in Ethiopia. So if you give me just two minutes, I want to reflect on that and come to what it means for an individual or ordinary citizens in Ethiopia. Let's come to the individual right away just because we're running out of time. I want to hear this idea. I haven't reflected on Madame herself. I haven't said anything about Madame. One, in the first place, the claim that Madame is a philosophy is baseless. It is not a philosophy. Madame is not a philosophy. The book itself, the book itself, the prime minister's book which has just been published did not call Madame a philosophy. I think my colleague, I mean the ambassador and other workers of the prime minister have got a chance to see at least four words of the book. It says this is an idea. It is not a philosophy. That's a minor point. It's a minor point but we have to take it into account. What is the impact for an individual? I want to get to the heart of the matter. You can critique the concept but you've heard one articulation for what it could be for Ethiopian citizens. I want to know if you see that vision, if you agree with that, or if you see it a different way. Do you see life changing as a person as a result of this idea? Madame is an old rhetoric. It's just a return of the outworn and exhausted word unity that have been used for long. It's not a new thing. We have in Ethiopia today, we have in Ethiopia today a prime minister who just saw the referendum that had happened in a particular place in the south at Isidama and failed to recognize that the people have decided to have a separate statehood. Unfortunately, Lane Osaid, he is a federalist. If the prime minister is a federalist, what is his problem with Isidama? Why we have got 69 people killed in less than a week if the prime minister is a federalist? If the prime minister is a federalist, what is a problem with reorganizing the southern nations and nationalities into separate states? So the point is, the prime minister is in a process of dissolving Ethiopia's multinational federalism. That is what is unfolding in Ethiopia. One basic question, why has Ethiopia experienced all of this violence since the prime minister came to power? A type of violence that Ethiopia has never seen in recent decades. Why have we got people evicted in hundreds of thousands after the prime minister came to office? A prime minister who is a peace laureate, a prime minister who is praised to be democratic, a prime minister who is praised to be including woman into his cabinet, but why Ethiopia hasn't got a peace when we are saying the prime minister is an amount of peace? The answer to the question is what the prime minister is doing to stay in power? A prime minister manipulating security structure, intelligence structure, administrative structure, dissolving the old systems that kept the country together, that kept people safe in order to expand cracks, in order to create problems, expand conflict and declare a state of emergency state on power. The southern nations and nationalities are under state of emergency right now. The western provinces of Ethiopia are under state of emergency. The parliament knows nothing about this thing. For ordinary citizens, Mademois is a hell. I'll give you the chance to respond to some of that in a moment because I think it's important that they respond. I'll give you a chance in a moment but I do want to allow while we still have a few minutes left we have time I think only for one question from this side I'm sorry people but that's how it is so let's just have a question please ask a question please be concise and please tell us who you are so one gentleman here please or lady there's a microphone just behind you there thank you I'll give you the chance to respond to these comments in your response there but I want to hear one question from here please thank you for being here I'm glad that you have focused on Mademois itself in reality for the citizens of Ethiopia right now who are moving from conflict crisis to crisis to crisis since Abiy is coming what we are sensing is a hijacked chain do you have a question sir yeah yeah yeah last question how is Mademois in any way related to the millions of who have gone out and put their life in danger to bring about change because of land grab that is taking away their private property their private property personal property is taken away you serve it by government for the enrichment of the elite and that has never stopped it in fact has been expanded okay thank you and we'll take one question here if there is the gentleman just here my question is why the government is relating those people who committed this atrocity to the people of Ethiopia I know Mademois is a principle of bringing people together but if we see really literally a very few people are creating the community to create this kind of atrocity everywhere why the government is relating these people to these things I think that solution can be resolved with a few people coming inside and fixing this problem those are the people that are causing all these problems in every part of Ethiopia 95% of the Ethiopian population is peaceful when they live together and been living together for a thousand years that's not a problem of all the bad thing the history and everything that's the philosophy of Mademois bringing these people together so we can find a solution instead of staying on the blame game and continue fighting again so why the government is letting these people do whatever they want and get out of without any problem thank you a few issues that have been raised we have this idea of the question that has been raised in relation to land issues and some of the grievances perhaps of the Oromo community why the government is not doing more but I also would like you to respond in general if you could as a summary remark to the critique that you've heard that Mademois isn't delivering isn't actually making things worse for some people how you respond to that we'll start with Lencho and then we'll come to Marmo thereafter alright first of all in 18-19 months in office what the prime minister have done is something that takes minimum 10 years to do the speed, the commitment and the change also we know Ethiopia was hell under previous administration for 27 years there are a lot of people still unaccounted including my brother my brother spent 10 years under the Dirk he was released few months again he was detained by TPLF his whereabouts is still not known my mom died every time somebody knocked the door my mom said open the door maybe he's my son she died with that pain this is not only a single story it's a multiple story we know where some of these questions from which corner it comes from this prime minister tried to be inclusive he believed in forgiveness there are some who are really suffering from self-imposed isolation okay the opportunity is there to participate the opportunity is there to play the role but if really they want to do what they have been doing for the last 27 years Ethiopian people say no so therefore this prime minister he freed the country yes, Ethiopian people freed itself but he's a leader who can really move this country forward so therefore I hear from my brother that atrocities continue human rights I spend more than half of my life struggling for change I know all this and I'm not going to put myself in a situation where with things are not promising I see things on the ground I returned to Ethiopia after 31 years in exile I was a fighter too for that matter so therefore there is a change on the ground so recycling this old rhetoric from distance is not going to solve Ethiopia's problem thanks if I can ask you to try and respond to some of these critiques that have been offered I understand that we want to articulate or you want to articulate a positive vision but I think it's important if you can try and engage with some of the critiques that have been offered why is the government not doing more for example is one important question I think because I don't have a few minutes but let me just quickly say I think this comment this voodoo analysis that Mademoiselle is just laughable if you want to see the record of the prime minister all you have to do is just read the news this is the prime minister who has achieved significant reform in a very limited period of time and the international committee has recognized it the Nobel committee has recognized it for me it's just mind blowing that people how far they can go to twist things for a political purpose I think that's not right and that doesn't help productive and purposeful discourse but let me just say two things I think the first thing is yes we acknowledge that we need to do better and more when it comes to maintaining law and order on that point we absolutely agree and I'm sure soon enough we will see some positive development in terms of the government taking additional concrete steps to maintain law and order in Ethiopia but as a point as a final point on my part because this session is about Mademoiselle let me just say this Mademoiselle focuses on our common humanity it focuses on our shared culture and history that's what Mademoiselle is all about is the Ethiopians in all of us but at the same time it respects and cherishes our diversity it doesn't ignore our diversity but at the same time it recognizes our common humanity and shared objectives but ultimately the path of Mademoiselle the framework of Mademoiselle and Mademoiselle as a political vision and conception will take this country to the inevitable destiny of prosperity and let me just say this when we think about prosperity in Ethiopia we have a sort of wider perspective on prosperity, it's not just about economy growth it's also about respecting the fundamental rights of the individual that's where the individual comes in it's also about respecting the freedom and liberty of the individual it's also about fostering equality so prosperity in the context of Mademoiselle should be understood broadly but just economy grows but respect for equality and respect for political liberty at the same time Thank you very much and on that note we will have to leave it there I'm sorry we didn't have more time alas Ethiopian Airlines flight times are not beyond not in our control but please join me in thanking our panelists Thank you