 All right. Hello everybody. If it's Wednesday, it's Warhammer and that must mean it's time for another episode of Warhammer Weekly Joining me as always my my best ally frankly, but sometimes a mercenary It's Tom. What's up, buddy? Hello friends. It's true. It's a momentous day for Tom. This is the last day of his hopefully of his primary initial work on On his dissertation, but he's taking a short break here. He's using it as his lunch break I have less than one half of one percent to right, right exactly like I have Approximately 600 words. There you go. But I care about you all so much do the show Before finishing by approximately one page left to type there you go Not too shabby at all and I'm hoping that's just wrap up and summary at the end so you know what you're gonna say Like it is. Yeah, I would I would think you're not cracking into new territory on the last page Like now let me introduce a completely new argument. That's how those works. That's how it is new material because it's like Research trajectories. Yeah. Yeah, I understand and so but regardless. Yes, it's basically done. Sure So tonight we're gonna talk about allies mercenaries unusual inclusions in armies Armies that can have other forces included in them and so on and so forth So but before that we have basically no news, so let's start there. Let's start with this Yes, but that's so not true Oh, I love how you updated our news and you and you missed the biggest news item of the week, but anyways We'll get to that. Sure a rubber engine hammer hammer time. It's Teclis's hammer Teclis doesn't have a hammer I'm sure like have you seen those bands? He has that's a good point. You've got me on that one Tom darn it I walked right into that as it has it's already been pointed out. It does look like a Twizzler the hammer looks like a Twizzler and so I Don't know it looks very elvish that looks like marble Right, what's around it because it has the Yeah, it has like the marble stone work on it, but it also has like the LV looking gem pattern, right? So I'm hoping this is just one of the previews for why not I don't I can't think of an elf unit I'm trying to think of like a high elf type unit in the past That wielded a hammer like a singular model or otherwise I'm trying to give any elf unit that had a hammer What was that terrain piece That was like the Forge of the gods What do you mean you talk about the phenomenal engine? No, an eighth edition So like do you remember there was a terrain piece that was like LV? I think That was some type of like anvil something. Nope You're probably imagining us. No, I don't know I legitimately don't remember anything because we have like the crafter We have like so we have the dwarven crafter god, but wasn't there like an elven smithy one? Yeah, there was the blind elven smith. Yeah He was he showed up in the end times and when he talked about how he was ample Amble ball bam right there. Okay. There you go the anvil of all But anyways that guy talked about how he was like he was a god or he was a hero in the previous cycle And he was like a god now and and he was telling like one of the elves I remember who he was having a conversation with it like when this is all done You'll do the same thing in the next cycle. Wow a lot of people remember that that's the anvil of all good Good on you. Well a plus work from our from our viewers here So here's the call. I think that it's some unit associated with a ball You're saying like as a remembrance thing because obviously he's dead He's dead, but it'll be like priests of all or something like that And it's like a smithy forging like elven craftsman because if you remember that with techless and the And they're like the the engines yeah The enlightenment engines like they were these like crafted masterpieces and I just wonder if like maybe It's not tied to that kind of stuff. Okay. All right. I Mean I'm reaching here, but from the lore what's already in the Lord. That's what I grab at. No, it's good call. It's interesting Yeah, I like that because yes, he did help with those before they were Penumbra legends or whatever right? He did help with those so that'd be cool. I dig that My second vote is dragon polo writers. Sure. Yes. That's been stated in the comments. Yeah, that's a good one I I like a sweet elvish hammer unit. Why not? That's just because they really need it given the emcee hammer jokes that it can just be hammer time all the way Like I hope this is just a sub theme throughout all of the elves. I really do Yeah, so My yeah, I mean my feeling is it's obviously like got to be somebody pretty strong because if you put marble on the end Of this like stone hammer that thing seems like it would be kind of heavy Right. Yeah, maybe so I could see it But who knows what it's made out of because you know stuff in the realms it could be Some magic II Magic super light stone from high who knows maybe their logic hammers carved from their like geometric things They just waxed like it's truly the logic hammer Like people are doing on the internet trying to hit people with logic hammers, but it's for real They just whack is more. I know. Yeah, exactly Realize the error of your ways wham. It's like the pennant stare from Ghost Rider, but in hammer form I am so down for that if that's what it is. Yeah They they have a change of alignment or suffer mortal wounds for their they're sinning Yeah, I like it Totally more damage most damage against chaos obviously clearly What else we got Yeah, comes out this weekend. Obviously we've seen plenty of previews about it man who reads book read book So that happened looks like we've got two sort of Pseudo full allegiance II things in there obviously a lot of focus on Bellicor in the main one where you can throw all the demons together under Bellicor And then I followed the news at all like sure You've been knee-deep in it. We're gonna review it in a couple weeks. We won't be doing wrath next week or the weekend Yeah, I don't it might be the week after I don't sure yet. Yeah, it might be the week after Yeah, um it won't be next week because I wanted there's like a lot of stuff in there I don't want to actually take time and look through some of that I'd like I'd like to actually comprehend the narrative too since that's gonna be a big part of this This is like a narrative book. It's not just Rules I understand that like even new battle tomes have a lot of narrative in them But they tend to be a fairly known quantity, right? Like this is the story of When when the seraphon book comes out, that's the most narratively narrative I'm interested in like when the slave startings book came out it had cool stuff I read it, but it wasn't like they were gonna suddenly take up a completely new slant on life, right? Like we get most of what you're on about here But this is obviously the point of this is a story driven thing So we're gonna I'll take time to absorb all that a lot of cool stuff What I was what I love about it. Honestly Tom from what I've seen so far is This is just my initial list of glance. So I reserve the right to take this back But at the moment reading over everything I actually thought it looked Just like some nice options. Nothing jumped out at me as like You know crazy bent or or broken or anything like that just like oh, that's cool option for that kind of thing A lot of stuff seems very tightly restricted and so would be more for people who like Who want to run or like a very specific army? That makes sense. Like I really love Puscoil blightlords Okay, cool. Well, here's the thing you can do if you're using a mainly Puscoil blightlord for us. So yeah, no, I agree with that From what I from like I did see some of the rules like I'm not all I like I Don't know it'll be interesting. I don't know who collects that all the even army Sure, like I don't even know how that works because I Could just imagine like having to buy up demons across the entire range. It would just be tough So it's a lot of demons I should note that like a lot of those places where it says The demon keywords though in the Legion of Chaos ascendant. It says them bolded. I Know so like you can't be on can be in there No, like I'm not saying demon bolded. Yes. A lot of those things like he'll benefit from that stuff Yes, like that there is there are several things where it says like chaos ascendant demon hero He would benefit from that. I mean like bloodletter will be bolded. So like blood crushers would benefit from it because they have the bloodletter keyword or you know, whatever Seeker chariots have the daemonette keyword that kind of thing. Yeah, so it doesn't just have to be like Tenors of the basic dude if that makes sense. Yeah, that's cool It's just about any any permutation of those troops Yeah Yeah I'm excited Sarah fun book out of stock which hopefully means the book is coming soon I mean realistically there was like no AOS content this week. No, so My guess would be probably in the next two weeks. We'll see the seraphon stuff start dropping Which are make sense. I mean probably accurate Um, and then we had the zinchen the KO book drop this or FAQ in a rotted drop this week Yes, you're right. I didn't put that in the news list. I remembered it and then just didn't type it out because I knew We'd talk about it Alright, so would you think that's okay? Sure. So let's talk about the FAQ I Let's talk about the KO FAQ first. Shall we is that a fair place to start? Yep The KO FAQ in my mind was fine There's probably still a question or two out there But it was fine like that like they're the one drop battalion thing is weird. Oh Oh Well, they already they've already said they're gonna address that separately that that that was just miss wording What you're referring to is the fact that it said in answering a question Sure, sir Okay, yeah, let's let's walk everybody through this shall we Tom a question came in that said if I When I'm deploying units Can I do like I used to do in KO and just have one drop be the boat and everybody in the boat? And the answer was no, that's not how it works anymore because that's not how garrisoning works, right? Right, right and so they said no you must put down the boat And then then you can put down as a separate drop somebody that's saying they garrison inside of it. Okay. Oh, cool Great, no problem So fair enough The problem with that is that then they accidentally broke the wording for battalions because battalions use the same language and say You can put them all down at once Right as one drop The really obvious answer here is that they clearly never meant for those two things to interact They don't mention the word battalion in the answer They weren't trying like this is one of those things that drives me up a wall and back down the other side How lawyery do we have to be I? Don't know I know I know because we all know the answer is yes, of course your battalion still all goes down as one thing We know that right because that's clearly not what the FAQ answer was meaning to talk about I would agree with you But a lot of people are arguing arguing vehemently that in fact KO don't one drop anymore You're saying even if they had a battalion where their whole army was in it as you can do with the iron guy command Like you could one drop if you don't drop into the boat is what they're saying And what that actually does is it does break their alpha because they have some abilities that let you move Like that let you like pregame move across the table and so that would that would stop you from like basically dropping the The warp fire vortex turn one I Understand that however No, that's not how they that's not just this isn't how rules get me Understand they were answering a question that was clearly about the old book They were indelicate in their wording and it has consequences if you want to play attorney as we all suddenly do Like three people in this community went to law school I think I know most of the of the content creators There are people who are attorneys and I think I know most of them then they're like and if they want to get on Their lawyer hats because they're all attorneys or solicitors or whatever it's called in your country fine Okay, but the rest of us all seem to want to play that way as soon as these things come out like But I do wish they'd be more delicate with their wording and think about that like because some of these answers felt a little flippant There was one in there that was in regard to the frigate thing that you pointed out Yeah, I know and it didn't answer it answer the question. I don't think they noticed it the the what so this rules interaction is in the It's the it's the what's the name of it? It's the battalion that has the frigate and Two times I iron sky battalion or iron sky Fleet not iron squad or iron sky I don't doesn't matter. It's the second battalion on the page. I will never run it Yes, it's the one that's two frigates and and two plus frigates and two plus units of arco one for every frigate and The the special ability in it is it says Arco can disembark after the frigate moves Right, and it just says moves Yeah, gotta get up gotta get up move and so the problem with that is because they didn't specify normal move Technically you could pile in and then pull the dudes out or you could charge and then pull the dudes out Like all of this would be perfectly valid because those are all you're a face accent sure all anything any time you moved You would technically trigger the ability to just pull them out, right? Yep, and that's how it is and then they answered the question with this sort of like Thing that copy page. No if it really modifies a rule any restrictions that apply to that rule still apply unless specifically noted otherwise and so The the can a unit of Arcana company from an iron sky attack squadron join or leave an Arcana frigate from the same battalion in a phase Other than my own movement phase no if an ability modifies this rule any restrictions that apply that rule still apply unless specifically noted otherwise Okay, there's a copy paste of the FAQ right above it. I understand that there's The the trick is is that they still answered the question, but they answered it wrongly like right They said no so fine enough. I'll accept your no But you there is no source rules to point at here, right, right? The source rules is your generic movement rule which you've designated that pylons charges All of that are moves, right? But again, okay, cool. You can't do that great. You can only do it in the movement phase Fine enough. So like that I accept their answer, but they they missed a trick there I believe well, no, what you can argue now is that that breaks anything that would trigger off of those other things because you can point to the KO ruling and say here's an instance where where Everything that is phase dependent normally has to remain phase dependent sure Because they have now set a precedent by saying so they've broken the rest of the game We just haven't found the implications of it Because because what it says because I mean what it says is that if something is faves dependent You can't do that thing out of phase ever, right? Unless it specifically states otherwise Unless it is specifically states otherwise And so what that means is that there are things in the game that will no longer work because of this ruling. Yeah Which is just Whatever my point is is like it doesn't matter that but the two things like there are a couple elements of the game that I'd want to see cleaned up eventually and one of them is that the movement nonsense because Everybody who immediately there's like seven people who immediately run to the fact that anytime they use the word move Flipently and forget to include the word normal everybody's like oh, I can trigger it 72 times in a turn now and it's like well Sure You know the best part of this thing they created yes The and the other thing is is that because they've used the language of normal move in some spaces It also really like so they didn't answer the question for example on the Zilfin move Which says that you can make a more normal move in your hero hero phase, right? Well the one So good the fly high rule is a No, instead of a normal move. Yeah, sure So like you can fly high in Zilfin in in the hero phase. Yeah. Yeah, sure All in all kale was good like it was nice It was good garrisoning is interesting now because all your troops are basically never in combat They can just they all get to act normally if they're in the boat Well, the really egregious thing that I don't think that they've thought about is that like what they've done with this FAQ Is it you can disembark still six inches out? So if like that unit of like hypothetical Brutes hits the side of your boat you can disembark behind them Okay, sure because you're not Because as long as you're outside of three inches You can actually jump that a unit on a disembark How would you get them set up within that thing? You're just saying like if somehow if they're in a very thin line where you know Yeah, holy within six outside of three right and so if if somebody hits the side of your boat You can actually jump them on your disembark if your ships rise. Sure, which is really funny and We'll have some really like ingenious uses uses for smart people. No, I agree like you're absolutely right Yes, so the situation you're describing is the boats here You know unit of the X models hits them here the boat here on the side You can then disembark the troops over the top of them Beyond within six outside the three inch line couldn't be a large unit But obviously like something could come out of there some thunders or something, right? You could fit probably some number of thunderers out there You could probably get ten models like off of an ironclad you could because it's six inches of the ironclad Yeah, and miles about there and then you get assuming the boat wasn't too screwed up You could still then fly high away and so the boat could leave and then the right unit It's just stuck there in combat with nobody anymore and and those shooters are not in combat nor have they counted as retreating So it's interesting like pow pow pow. Yeah might be interesting Yeah So, you know I Was really sad well Let me also say that like they didn't answer like a lot of a lot of KO questions were sent in like I was in the chat and I watched How like some of the documents that got submitted to them which were like 20 and 30 questions long sure And they did like they didn't address a number of things that they probably should have addressed for example vent plates Can we talk about vent plates? Yeah, I mean vent plates seemingly I Okay, sure go ahead Um, I mean as of right now there is no end duration to the vent plate item sure once it gets triggered You turn it on once on forever Which means that it's an item for the chemist you turn it on once per battle at the start of the enemy shooting phase You turn it on and for the rest of the game You subtract one to hit rolls for attacks that target the bear And it's not even like attacks in shooting even though it starts in the shooting phase Just forever Minus one to hit an attacker roll against the bear and any friendly unit holy within six That means that like if you have a unit in the boat with the hero all heroes in the boat are neg three to be hit now Yep, because they're in cover They're within exit number of inches for lookouts are in the vent plate to add one So like the boat is neg one to be hit ever all the units inside or neg two and heroes inside or neg three Hey go chemists that last forever in that last forever now sure cool. It's gonna. Yeah, it's neat Whatever stuff like that. It's just such a it's a miss, but I don't really care. It's fine Um, and then what the other thing I just didn't understand is like how did we not get? How did how were there no erotas there were zero erotas? Nailed it Done moved a printer. Um, I I I don't know and a Brent you'd asked about any replies on how little they clarified it's true It's missed fine. Just absolutely missed fine So that's KO but all in all fine They it answered most of the big stuff that I think will come up most of time All that should have been in a sidebar in the actual book said it originally still stand behind it terrible missed opportunity You can't introduce a bunch of complicated concepts like that and not sidebar them. Please don't ever do that again. Oh Yeah, oh, yeah, how about the shades fire pistols? Can we talk about that the fact that somehow the shades fire pistols Managed to stay excellent call by the way Alex Managed to stay the increased range. Oh, yeah, I because sure. Why not? They have the good ones That's cool that unit look stop trying to ruin one of the good underworld war bands. There's only like three of those Okay So it's like the bit either the first or second best underworld war band It's actually like one worth using in an army I can see that I think actually having quite a purpose Because it's one of the few like balloon boys that can actually garrison a boat the whole unit can like Zip up in the air and stuff like it's got all sorts of things that we can do. Well, it actually fit perfectly in Um a gun hauler. Yeah, and a gun hauler have five models Yeah, and like you have four models and your hero and so all five of them can actually go in The gun dollars, which I really like or you could like split them up put the four like dudes in there and then a different hero So you don't like keep that hero the chemist hero sure Good for chemists zeech As this isn't the point of the show tonight. I don't want to I don't want to tarry on this too long The zeech FAQ. I mean you missed it missed it by that much You can't see my hand, but it was not a tiny amount No, I mean it was good like everything in there was good. They got about 40% there That's my answer Zeech is still bent They probably pulled it back from late they probably pulled it back from like outright broken into just like very bent Here, let me say this. I think they can scale in six months. This can be fixed with points Sure sure that's probably true at this point. Yes, play Flamers go up to 160 The the take take the change host battalion itself and bump it up some amount You know like they can they can literally fix this with points. I think at this point Pink horse jumped to 260 or their maximum or maximum unit size is 10 Sure. Yeah, maximum unit size is 10 would go a long way Yeah, I mean like they can fix it on the GHB probably. No, that's fair. I don't know if they will Like again, I don't know if they will but if that still means that we have to deal for six months with this bullshit Yeah There is currently a big argument which there's currently a big argument which we're not gonna get into tonight Because I don't have an opinion on this around whether or not you can still destiny dice the one on the banner To respond more more pinks. Look There are people right now who I'm sure have a very strong opinion. I said we're not gonna get into it There are people who have a very strong opinion about it. I've seen perfectly valid arguments on both sides So the answer is you just need to clarify your FAQ. That's it. That's the and I I'm gonna say something real quick Sure, and it's my perspective. So for those that want to know my perspective. It's this When it says an unmodified role what that is looking for is is the number on the dice and So I am of the mindset that you can use destiny nice of one that is code for For what the dice face says not Um, because everywhere else that's you know, like that's what it that's what it amounts to Rather than saying that because of that weird corner like re-rolls happen before unmodified or something like that, right? Yeah, right like there are other things that trigger that way and that's like when it says an unmodified What they're looking for is the dice face number. They're not looking for like the actual result. I Look that seems perfectly convincing and then I've heard people on the other side are Does the wording that they use in the FAQ and you know what that seems pretty convincing too? And so you know what the answer is folks We can all sit here and spin our little wheels about it and you know what claim to truth any of us have a Freaking goose at words words is our claim to truth. Yeah, like there's the philosophical concept of a single Theory T being drawn from the same set of evidence E and one equally Leads you to T Okay, the most famous example of this being the conception of reality being either everything you see around you is real or everything You see around you as a matrix that kind of thing, right? and so Like in that way, you just can't argue your way out of it Somebody's got to come in from the outside and be like this is just the answer So they just need to update the FAQ Great, just do that and then we can all just not argue about this anymore and life will be fine wonderful happy Whatever, I mean at the end of the day like just kill 10 pink horrors. That's your job Sure sure like if you can kill 10, I know there's it's hard with all those penalties But if you kill 10, it's fine because then there's no make sure they don't write and there's no banner And just make sure they don't add more models or have more than 20, you know Oh Somebody said what should we to to do though? Whatever you want your god You don't need any permission to make a decision make a decision decide how you want to decide you read and use your best judgment And that's the answer there the only appeal beyond you is to our lord and savior That's it So if they can get permission from him to overrule you they can overrule you but other than that at your tournament You're where the buck stops. That's my answer So I agree with Vince completely Like toes rule the get to make a decision they can they could literally read something and go Nope doesn't work like that here and that's correct Right, because that's what we've that's the power. We've entrusted to us with now most don't do that There's sort of this social contract that to is when the rules are pretty clear Del yeah, yeah That they'll you know that they'll follow along with the rules is printed because we all agree to that social contract But in this kind of a case, it's whatever you think in your good faith judgment is the right answer. There you go easy peasy That's my that's my answer Yep, I Don't I'm like when I made a playing in a tournament and the TO says that's their ruling. I'm on board smile Thank them appreciate their time. They're working hard judgment. That's their judgment Here comes Marathi the judge is ready to rule. So, you know, there you go All right, cool. So yeah, I mean, I feel like it didn't go far enough, but at least they did some stuff I was like, I'm not I'm not knocking it They they tried to address stuff which is good and they did fix some of the more egregious stuff Like to their credit they took a very a very light touch to it And there they'll likely sit back and reevaluate, you know in six months Now the rest of us have to figure out a solution to deal with it in the next six months, but Yeah, yep. Okay Cool Yeah, so that was the FAQ good stuff All right next Any other news I think that's it right I don't everything cool. So Tom let's talk about some pick of the week, buddy What do we got? What do you want to share with everybody? I have nothing I have zero I have zero zero nothing. Yeah, cuz you've just been typing The only thing you've looked at is your your own laptop where you've been typing away Yeah, I've lit and literally written like 12,000 words in the last couple days So there's that. No, that's fair. Um, I I I I can I can empathize with that we all look forward to you getting back to your hobby desk Tom as I'm sure you do as well Oh my gosh And no problem Tristan happy to help My shout out is to our good friend the honest wargamer who posted up yesterday the can con 2020 army showcase So when I was down at can con and we were doing the field reporting one of the things we did was actually go around and look at all the armies like Rob was doing the camera work and I was just talking about every army as we were as we were looking at all the best army nominees so if you want to see close up some of the absolutely gorgeous Some of the absolutely gorgeous armies that were available at can con you can go look at them in the video And you can watch it with my voice or without frankly if you find me annoying you can mute it I'm not adding that much to the armies on display there I'm trying I'm trying my best just to fill the time and Point out all of the good things that I hope people notice about all the incredibly hard work and frankly beautiful work That everybody was doing there who is a best army nominee, but they're the ones on display there not me talking so I'll link it in the in the description below as it was a super great As it was a really really really super great selection of armies so cool stuff special shout out to To to Danny paints who Tom did you see his his display board? The the drum yeah, the oil drum the 44 gallon oil drum It had been hollowed out that he had to like learn metalworking to do Yeah, I think I'm at a point where I'm just gonna have to tap out like I love you all we've escalated now yes, like the the The battlefield has been escalated and I just I love you guys and I love painting stuff, but I don't love it that much Okay, that's just too much work right on Mike I convinced it goes back to like you're like okay So now what you need to do Tom is in order to paint this skin transition spend 12 more hours feathering nope, right? No, I don't care that much. I Get it. It was an amazing like truly amazing display board. It was coming from somebody that despises display boards I mean he had LED lighting he had dry ice smoke effects in there All of it it was a beautiful and it was like punkish and you had like the police Oh, it was so good Like it was so themed and so classy and like I just because when I saw it on the table initially I'm like what is up with that police one totally get it now Yeah, sure. Why yeah because it when when they're all on the board You see this beautiful narrative of like the police invading the hive and as you get down farther everything gets weirder. Yeah Yeah Yes, the Aussie Wargamer's is also awesome I don't know if you saw his in there Tom, but he had the big pirate ship with the mixed destruction like yeah again Just absolutely incredible work like you have to understand that pirate chest that was his display board He had like different little pull-out. I know I saw the other others Like treasure and models and things to discover like it was Bonkers good. It's so fantastic like I see that and I'm like mmm. I may paint up a new board For a depth gun this year, maybe I Mean, I already know I'm doing a new board, but it won't be your intel Summertime or something because my my my whirlwinds edge army whirlwinds edge. Yeah, and I already know how that's gonna be Yeah, it will not be a 44 gallon oil drum Oh, it could be with this army, but no, that'll be like a triptych Deep cut there actually my display board is just gonna be It's gonna be a it's gonna be a an automated reality thing like an AR You've got to like put your phone up and look and then it just it lays all the extra effects on there Like my board will be really awesome Would that be sure that'd be super cool your board looks relatively simple and then they're like I don't get it What's so special about this not be like oh put on this headset, please and then they see all these like Incredible weather effects and lightning and all this moving water stuff flying by yeah Yeah, yeah boats and the clouds in the background and stuff. Whoa. There you go All right, so time to time to get working. Yeah to do is I'm gonna do all that stuff And then as Chris the L said the low time low tan Shaq Deepkin I loved Vince your comment of like hey looking something useful for something. Yeah, or whatever. Yes, I that's uh, I Apologize I'm blanking on that gentleman's name, but he was awesome He and I talked a whole bunch his sharks were awesome because he had dumb like way sharks and yeah The actual things and then yes his his low tans dive bar was I mean that's It's genius and yes, it's probably unfortunately the best use for that For that right man. I just I really feel bad for low tan like Yep, that's all right justice for low tan also check it out video will be linked below Hobby time would you work it on Tom you've been paying some stuff? No, I Like how you left us in suspense there for a moment like like I thought for a moment Oh, maybe he did take a minute or two to paint something No, I Sold two sprues of three sequiturs on eBay nice. Good job, man Thanks Honestly, it was just all the extra sequiturs. I got when I ordered mice my six mortal realms magazines and So I had a bunch of extras like I had an additional like 18 sequiturs that I needed to do something with so they got sold That's sort of hobby For myself. Oh, I've been a busy little bee It's time. It was time to do the I wanted to do something big and So that meant it was time to work on my ironclad for Worldwinds Edge Now I could have Just gone out and bought a normal ironclad I could have waited until those wings are available on that adeptus Mechanicus thing, but I sat down Friday night after finishing up that demon and I thought nah and I got out all the bits and I put together my own ship and and so this is the ship and It's real big. I don't know if that's obvious And I can show the image if you need me to sure no, it's fine I brought it up on screen. It is hard to hold in the camera here. I'll pull it back toward me As a size comparison here. We'll do this. This is one of the new chaos nights That's one of the new chaos nights next to this thing so So this is my my ironclad that I made Just cobbled together out of lots of different bits and it's ready to come. It's not ready yet It's not done. It's still very much work in progress. I've got a lot of work left to do on this thing But yeah, and there you go It's big it's it's significantly large, but that's all right. It's gonna be it's gonna be super fun I am glad that you're gonna play KO even if there are no dwarves in sight That's right There's not a dwarf anywhere near this boat, but I did leave the tiny dwarven symbol on one of the missiles Oh, oh Scandal because I wanted to I wanted to see their their contribution I wanted to you know, I wanted to recognize that so and Heck no re-rolling ones Jack Because obviously I was gonna get an ironclad. This is only the first of two my friend And oh, we that's it. Thank you very much Wsoran we did get one other piece of news this relevant that I kind of forgot about but because it's not news news But it's relevant to my hobby which is we got the hammer-haul Harold that asked about the llama cat and That means the llama cat's actually coming soon finally Finally that llama cat's gonna be released the sphere ranks by the way is what I'm discussing right the mind-stealer sphere ranks This has got to be the one of the longer times between a book release and a model in that book being available It in ages sigma because certainly in the old days. This was common. It was October that I got announced, right? Yeah, that feels right and then the book came out in December and Still no llama cat and here it is we're getting to February I mean realistically, I'll probably have the llama cat like by the end of the month He's still two and a half weeks away most likely And Yes, I did greeble the heck out of this thing. Thank you somebody who's who's using the greebling word back to the ironclad So yeah, I'm excited about this thing a lot of work to do But God I love this big giant ridiculous boat a lot of a lot of plastic card and existing pieces and stuff like that So that's fun It was fun sitting around with a heat gun the first time I tried to make a hole And I was like trying to heat the plastic to bend it into shape and hold it And I got the heat gun too hot and too close and it just went like right and Crinkled up and once once plastic card is crinkled like that. You don't it's that's it. I was just like oh Get rid of that one Next try it again There you go Okay So yes, this thing is I'm excited so I'm hoping to have this thing done by the weekend which seems a reasonable goal. I Think I can finish it up this weekend. There's a lot of work to do still Too much frankly But anyway Tom let's talk about some mercenaries and allies and stuff buddy sure of Speaking of a giant ironclad which I'm not building for a KO force, right? Sure, it's interesting because I think we've seen a lot more not only it are the Armies of Aegis Sigma are more varied now than they were in old Warhammer days or stuff like that, right? Like cuz we're actually you might argue well. Yeah in early AOS, you know We had all these distinct little forces But the reality is most of them weren't actually armies, right the vast majority of stuff when we had those little dangler factions weren't Really playable. Yeah, like fire bellies man-eaters. These are not playable factions, right? So we're up over well over 20 actual, you know fully functional fleshed out book-supported armies now. Yeah Yep, and Now not only is that true, but more armies have Stuff that lets you pull Other things into them freely more interchange between the forces just natively not even as allies Then we have the ally system and we have mercenaries, right? So as I was reflecting on this it made me think about the fact that I we haven't really gone back for a while and looked at In this new world now that we're basically up to all the books because I assume seraphon will have some allies that look Pretty standard for most of the order stuff like they'll be able to ally with Stormcast or whatever Maybe that's it But I'm interested to return to the concept of these allies and the first place to do it is when you're not even allies Cities of Sigmar who can have one in four Stormcast and everything KO one and four in Tempest Eye Sylvaneth one and four in Living City, right or the new Kradron overlords who can have any Dewarden one and four in Barrack Thring Including the Hellcannon and every other thing that's insane that has the Dewarden keyword, right? So I wanted to spend a little bit of time on that and then move into considered allies yet I The answer seems to be no because it doesn't say they are I get why you're saying they might be but again another question They don't have the KO keyword. Yeah, I get it Yep, so let's talk about those things first cities first Okay in cities in general where they're not technically allies, right? So this is your Stormcast one and four or your Sylvaneth one and four in Living City or your Your KO one and four in Tempest Eye Who are your hot picks if you're looking at a city's army and you want to talk about integrating forces outside of the traditional cities of Sigmar book Who you picked so I really liked um The celestine prime in hammer prime time. He's back again. Do you want to explain why prime time is so good in hammer hole? Yeah, was it Alex that ran that or no that was not was it Jane? The the person who was playing at Cancun in round six on the top table had it. Yes, who ended up losing? Anyways, yeah, so he ran it and I thought it was a genius move so one of the problems that you have with With The celestine prime is that once he goes down He has this huge like bull's eye on his head and so oftentimes he'll get removed within like one You'll get one good round out of him, especially if he's going in like a really soft target And so there's always this tension of like how long do you hold him back first? How long do you drop him? He has the ability to do a really long charge. He changes dice and so In hammer hole what that allows you to do is to drop down like in turn two You don't even have to wait till turns three because what you can actually do is get your long charge in and then double pile in Because I will pile in happens at the end of the combat phase and so he can actually come out Down and do a lot of work really early in the game Which is just a really strong use for him because for me the cost of having him down on the tape Are of like keeping up or having him down is always too high especially because of how quickly he dies Yeah, no, I agree prime time's a big pick I will mention I'm making a prime time for my tempest I force as well because why not just for my city's force He's back there. He's also converted and ready to go But he's kind of hidden back on my my work in progress shelf back there No, the hammer hole ability to basically double pile in is really powerful The trick is you've got to be an enemy territory to do it Right, right and that's often a big limitation but obviously a dude who can just drop out of the heavens and Be in enemy territory because of what it says. Yeah on his war scroll Especially a guy who comes down and hits that hard I think he's a rock solid choice for sure and in hammer hole I think he's especially good although I would argue there are many cities forces that he can actually be a pretty potent drop-in Like where he can do good work hammer hole I think being the best Um, you know, obviously I mentioned the ironclad I think the ironclad in tempest I is a worthwhile pick, you know, probably your best pick is something like an Ironclad and some amount of thunderers or something like that to go in the boat or a frigate and some amount of thunderers to go In the boat like that seems like a really solid to pick again, not technically allies, but it's a lot of Good firepower that benefits heavily from the abilities that are there Yeah, I mean a good like depending on that like the scale of how many points you want to pay like a nice low-hanging fruit there would also be Six rigors. Yep. And a And a gun hauler. I would also say six rigors and the guy in the original suit because then you're You know like he's Like they're mobile six rigors But then you may as well go 12 minute rigor be like the advantage of the six rigors is that he could be dragged If you go up to 12 units in your army You could do an Gun hauler six rigors and the dirigible guy and by the way the drill to buy could be your general and make those That was my point. Yes, is that he if he comes in as your general then he actually will make the rigors He'll make the endring rigors battle line in your in your city's army Right and like you could do that, which is you could go like those three units and you can even do like three aether wings Like the dumb chase birds For a storm cast and that's only 150 points for three of those units. Sure You mix in a couple chariots and suddenly like you can still have some blocks of troops and a bunch of MSU So yeah, there's some you know, there's some neat ideas. I I think that I Don't think the real power of Dracoff's has been realized yet. Sure living cities super hot pick in living city I would argue a really good pick in Tempest I to Yeah, I would agree with that But like they spit hot lightning sure and then you get to then you get to move up, you know Like eight inches and have a three charge Absolutely, I would use them in a different way in Tempest I in Tempest They're just rock solid unbreakable in the first round and they have a speed with the bonus movement to just go alpha block a point Right. So in scenarios where you want to just alpha But you want to alpha bunker onto it onto a point they can do that really well Yep, or they can pin an enemy like all of those things. I agree with you. I agree with you. Yep No, that's good. I think that other Significant grabs in Tempest I I think the as he said the KO boats were a good grab I like the rigors like the combo the rigor and the in the end remaster The boats obviously benefit from the Lord Ordinator. Yep, sure. So that's a really good grab in There's so many buffs they can benefit from in there They can get the Lord Ordinator. They can get the hurricane They can get the plus one to wound aura from the general Hawkeye, right? Yeah, I mean you can have your boats on like twos and twos in Tempest I pretty easily same with all your Thunderers and everybody else frankly or not as we said close to that most of that. Well, so as we said during the book review There's more synergy in the two pages of Tempest I rules. There isn't the entire KO book for the ironclad. Yeah, yep Absolutely, I mean, it's just it is what it is So, yeah, I mean those are the things that that jump out to me Do you like a good? No, good. I I you know, I think that there may be some play with Like any unit that's gonna have a deep like a shooting it followed up by decent melee can be good in living cities because they can hit and then move forward And so The like the obviously the drakes were in temple are we've talked about that before that's a solid grab the Aquilores are 15 inch range. Is that right? Do I am I remembering that correctly the javelins? I Don't know so man. I Think I'll check here in just second my books look But I think that your aqua aquilores you could hit with with javelins and then sprint them like Jump them forward to engage the enemy And that could be a like that could be punchy because the not aquilore. I'm sorry The pallet horse and yet you have an 18 18 inch range on the javelin And so they couldn't like pop on the edge of the board hit with the javelins and then trigger the ability to pile in To move forward to move forward and then you can actually use the aquilores to pick them up off the table Put them back down and do the same thing somewhere else on the table there you go because because you can teleport from the aquilore and Then re and then reuse the ability like the next turn To close the distance yep after you've thrown your javelin So I think that there may be some gas with pallet horse as well What do you think about maybe the the two tree lord combo not not regular tree lords the two tree lord combo in Living city and what I specifically mean is one Tree lord agent who can summon a woods right so you actually can summon woods within the city's army within living city And then one spirit of Durthu so you can like summon the woods near where the Durthu wants to come in from the edge of The board and then he can he can pop in and he'll actually get his full bonus when he goes Yolo tree Right, and he himself does have a range attack that can trigger that same thing It seems like a lot of work for that extra d3 attacks or whatever it does But I don't know that setting up a big woods is necessarily a bad thing either like cities of Sigmar doesn't have terrain Those woods are true, but I like how what's the range on that ancient setup? I think it's like right on top of it like I don't So you're talking about his ability to set up a woods. Yeah So his you can set up one awakened Wildwood wholly within 18 inches of that model Yeah, I mean if like you could if you loaded to one side maybe What what phase is that in is that in the hero phase? Oh when does he have when does he have the ability to set this up? Yeah, once for battle in your hero in your hero phase not at the start of just in And they come in on the movement phase. That's too bad Yeah, you couldn't large on from the side and do it now you couldn't bring him on and then bring the tree in that's too bad Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, I Mean I'd be more interested if I could fit in a tree lord ancient a dirt through and a And a branch rathen Okay, and I could summon dryads as well And give these summoning you just need to go up to 12 units, which isn't impossible in a world of gyrocopters Yeah Also a good point like if you're ever if you've already got your battle line filled And yeah, all this other stuff and you need to like bloat the number of units in a city's army Gyrocopters are the way to just bloat units, right? Because they're useful like they're not a bad pick Right, they do good stuff and you just take gyros in one ease in one or something more not they're not doing anything They're not counting toward any anything other than number of units, right? Yeah, so So you can quite easily like just balloon your number way up because they're relatively cheap So yeah, there you go. I think that we can't leave this behind without mentioning Maybe one of the hottest picks from Stormcast across the board in almost any force the ally supreme The the ally of allies and we'll talk about him later because he has used a night of zero night of zeros Mr.. Azeros This guy does he ever actually work in Stormcast? I think he's just on loan to every other army in the game Yeah, he doesn't show up in Stormcast armies because he's in all the rest as an ally in other armies Yeah, it's true So obviously this guy could be really good in a lot of different forces He's a good segway to talk to move into just allies allies Because are we talking about the chaos stuff? Yeah. Yeah. Oh fair enough. That's fine. Well, let's circle back Okay, so fair enough, let's do barrack thing. Go ahead. Let's we'll come back to mr. Azeros. I I have to say I was pleasantly surprised when the fact dropped and I can still run my 75% Fireslayer K army sure Yep, like do you want to explain why that is? Yeah, so the way that the fireslayer K army works is a broccoli. That's what they want to call it is One in four units can be fireslayer units, right? And there's no restriction on allies. So you can also do one in four units that are allies. So one in every two units can be Not KO right and KO has a lot of 90-point units Namely like arcana company And so you can get like 200 wounds of dwarves on a four-plus save Between doing big blocks of 20 hearth guard or bulkites and a bunch of tenors of Arco and then you fill up all of your Ally slots with the heroes For like deep striking and the banner and stuff like that So you end up with it with a KO army that's because two and because a full half of it by count can be right 75% of your army is by points is Is Is fireslayers and you and like more than half of it by model count is fireslayers as well Not by unit count only have like yeah You only have like 50 arco on foot or 60 arco on foot and then a hero and then everything else is basically like Fireslayers big blocks of fireslayers and or fireslayer Like I might run it. I don't know I Against change hosts like I'm just gonna get locked into combat forever That's pretty dumb I Don't know about that. I think that army's pretty well rep ready to blow up a lot of change house stuff Alex you'd asked do they get to fight when they die as Tringy? No, because that ability and Tringy only works for Skyfarers and so what that means is that I think it's skyfarers. I think that's the right keyword Whatever it is. It's not the keyword that they get They actually don't get the right keyword to actually use that allegiance ability But because they're not allies technically I believe you can give them items Yeah, I mean as far as I know I don't there's no restriction about that. They can't be your general They can't be your general right and their units don't count as battle line Right, so they're like ha they're they're not allies. They're half allies Huff allies Huff allies. Yeah, so Yeah, they don't have the sky farer keyword So they don't get the Barak thing ability that other one that triggers off the back trial in but they could be given weapons And so there's some neat options with that Grudge hammer is not a terrible item. I love the idea of doing Like the compendium dwarf units can get pulled in with this And so my my favorite there obviously is Thorgrim Or what was Thorgrim like the power throne hero? That's like like a Anvils from earlier in the show. Yes, exactly There's like a neg to rend 3d image like for attacks or something like that like dudes packing heat That's the only move one inch No, no, no, that's the no so you're I'm thinking about the like what's now like the warden king on power throne Oh, no, I got it. Got it. Not evil guy. Not the end Right, like this is like at one point in time the throne had an anvil on it But not with not when they fixed it. And so that dude could like run around Yeah, like he's and he gets re-rolls on everything Like it's like it's like he's a good war scroll for like 220 or whatever he is So he's a nice like punchy melee hero So in he would fit well in this in this army and you can give him an item So you can also pull in the aforementioned hell cannon because it has the Duart and keyword so if you've been looking for a way to get chaos hell cannons into your KO force You can do that. I'm not gonna lie. I consider doing two of them. Sure. I actually own health guys. I Owned two of them painted. It was like what would this look like if I had two hell cannons in a KO army Sure. Why not? Why not? Yeah, I mean, it's it like I don't I think that there's a probably a more balanced version of what I had joked around about With the fire slayer mix, I think there's a balanced version of that that's probably actually probably pretty punchy The the grudges you are gonna get the re-roll ones so like all of those hearth guard berserkers get the re-roll ones Yeah, like natively that to hit which is not gonna be bad and then the extra like double hits on sixes They'll also get if you triggered it on that unit And so I don't know I like I think that there might be some interesting stuff there is what I would say Yeah, because you can also do spell on the bottle You could do spell on the bottle bridge So then you could like You could bridge like iron drakes across if you wanted to or fire slayers or I don't know. There's some really neat neat combinations I don't know that I'm gonna play it, but I will say that often you only need to get bridge off once in the game For some for some attack plans. So the fact that you can definitely get bridge off once, you know Right now and they think they truly cannot say no to it. So yeah, there's some neat there's some neat stuff Yep, and yes, King bread the crew has the Dwarden keyword, but it doesn't matter because that means the war scroll has the Dwarden keyword so Anyway, so let's transition now and talk about some proper allies So and the best transition for that is the night is heroes good in any of those cities armies almost any of them Good all over the place the night is heroes obviously being a standout because he has this little magical lantern that has a Big range and just gives you real ones to hit in both melee and shooting absolutely fantastic ability The fact that he just broadcasts this massive aura when you target units in the range of his lantern. He himself has a Good fly move. He's on a three up save He can be a good little unit corner pinner as well where he can you know get on the corner of a an only mildly offensive unit And actually hold them for a while And he's like a three-up base, right? Yeah, he's three up base and he's a hundred points. Yeah Yeah, this dude is the MVP of allies This is the allies this is he is the ally of allies and the ally awards He would take it every year year over year. This guy gets the ally award So I think of things like him in a KO force many KO armies that I built have this dude in there There's a lot of bait because almost any order army basically can ally and stormcast He ends up being really really Powerful in a lot of these these Is this buff isn't keyword specific and he's extra punchy against chaos Yeah, and there's like seemingly a lot of chaos in the meta, right a near endless supply of chaos Yes, he yes, we should mention that he also has a color Multitudinous hordes of chaos, maybe and probably more here in a little while because some people will be using the Wrath of the ever-chosen stuff. So if chaos is stock is on the rise the night as Eros just gets better and better and better Every time. Yeah, he's a great ally We should talk about an ally that we mentioned in passing in discussing our can con coverage for For fire slayers And that is the gun haulers Yeah, you're gonna spoil my my my secret trick your secret trick you didn't think of it the guy at can con thought of it You're not getting credit for this one buddy so Yeah, so gun haulers are an excellent Ally because they're cheap And they can jump around the table so they can provide threat on objectives Yep, so most notably two of them are 300 points So 150 each with a with they have a little bit of shooting but critically the Disengage and fly high and all of that nonsense is on their worst role So they bring that with them. So the reality is this ship can just teleport itself every turn You know nine inches away from any enemy meaning that if you're If you're If if your opponent ever Ever leaves an objective unguarded for a second walks away from it You own that objective instantly if they the reason I like to gun haulers is because if they try to hold it with just one hero How many times have you seen an opponent hold a back-of-line objective with just one hero? right Yeah So often you'll be able to drop in shoot that hero and claim it depending on where they are vis-a-vis the objective itself right Yeah, I mean I would say that like I Think that there's probably some play by throwing in because of the price points that like Rigor like if you can't do two haulers Then like one hauler and a full gun unit of Rigors or full gun unit of wardens will put out similar damage Preferably Rigors because they can still shoot on the other end of that with their shortest guns They would put out similar damage as a second hauler But you're gonna be your 50 points cheaper your more bodies But you're more susceptible to having the hauler removed sure So yeah, I don't know or you could do one hauler and in six rigors That's another variable combo sure because then you've got something that's that's got a real offensive punch As well the rigors could have the the drill One of them could have the drill thing or whatever Charge for us want to charge. Yeah, that way when they come back down, they're charging on an eight, right? Yep. Yep. Yeah, I mean there's a lot of there are a lot of neat combos with With KO as allies It makes me sad honestly that That there aren't there's an immersionary company yet Sure, the KO mercenary company just feels like the thing that should exist because they are quite literally the mercenaries of the mortal realms. Yeah Then they're a mercenary. They and fire slurs. Yes Yeah, so like when that suddenly becomes like Open season for mercenaries Like assuming that they ever get one or that mercenaries even continue because they could evaporate in the next GHB Is there like they're in the narrative section of the GHB? And so mercenaries may not actually survive this next update who knows could be Yeah, it'll be interesting just addressing a comment Chiz it said doesn't it have to be teleported behind a train piece I don't know what that means, but no all the boats just have a rule called fly high where every round they can just Pick up and sit down anywhere as long as they're you know, like some of them have You know certain not being wounded or something But to a certain amount, but they all just pick up and set down any every round every time nine inches away from an enemy That's just a thing all the ships can do they just leave and land and it's so Unbelievably powerful you don't think about how powerful it is until you play against it and the KO player is repositioning their entire army every round Which that's what's happening if you don't pin them down They're just picking up their entire army and landing it somewhere else every single round because the ships go up You know people get in the ships or never got out The ships go up the balloon boys go with them and suddenly the entire army has moved anywhere on the board like they have Almost army-wide teleport every round for every for everybody in their army Yep so And the fact that they can now dump their people and then the boats can leave and the people then don't count as retreating Gives it even more versatility Yep Because the boat could just bug out and let and drop behind the troops Just literally pick up and drop where you behind like dump the troops pop up land back down And then have the troops is now a chaff screen to it And they all unload because the boat still shoot a normal move for almost any of those boats is gonna be greater than like You don't need to teleport because like you could just do It's a 12 inch move. Yeah, yeah You know once per game and go to 18. Yeah They I mean KO definitely have a very strong mobility game. Absolutely So I think that it's ironic to me partially That almost everything I want to do with KO is his allies and not as the actual KO force, but oh, yeah Yeah, but at the same time, maybe that's somewhat appropriate. It's there's some kind of thematic for simulitude in the world to that That they that they end up in that way Sure. I mean, why not right? Any other fire slayers type allies you like besides what we've mentioned so far you've built a lot of fire slayers lists I have like allies for fire slayers or fire slayers as allies Yeah, sure. Let's go both directions and and let's bring the mercs in at this point as well Because I know you've played around with some interesting mercenaries and fire slayers I have I have So I think that So the things that jump out to me Fire slayers if you are an ally or a merc because remember fire slayers can be mercs themselves You could grab to like a 20 pack of volkites and a rune smiter who can deep strike those 20 bulkites and So now you have a nice little power pair that you can put anywhere on the board That are 40 wounds on a four up save in melee. That's pretty good. Yeah, sure Yeah, it's a nice again. It's a nice little power pair that can get the job done I as far as power pairs go What else do I like? I Yeah, I mean there are some other stuff But I mean I think the Volkite one is like right at the point sweet spot is what I was where it's not an over investment Right, right. Yeah, when you look across order Are there any other allies that you that you really value? Can I talk about one that I think is pretty solid? Sure in order like let's just broaden this out We'll go by grand alliance because that's probably the easiest way to talk about it because in most cases You can reach across like that, right? So that's probably fine um All right, so let's I'm just I want to bring them up real quick for me here Boom, boom, boom, boom. Oh my gosh, they're gonna be really hard to find here. Aren't they? One moment while I while I bring them up So I want to talk about there aren't not a ton of forces can ally with the daughters of cane right Yeah, but there are some who can And if you have the daughters of cane as an ally then I want to talk about your canary Right as an ally Canary heart renders and or lifetakers whatever you prefer. I'd obviously probably prefer the heart renders in most cases, but you know Lifetakers can get there By the way, Tom, you know that there was only one dock list at can con came 16th. Okay, which was Dane and You know, he was running a tenor of Lifetakers and he was juicing them to three damage and doing the thing that you yeah, I'm doing And he caught a lot of people out because who's ever seen lifetakers or knows He was he started telling me about it because I wrote down to can con with him and he mentioned Yeah, I've got these lifetakers and they can I can buff them and they can they can do a lot of damage I was like, yeah, they do three damage apiece. I know because Tom was trying to Trying to build a 20 or and the 20 or just doesn't work. It's too many on the phone. I'll base They're just too big but the tenor work. Anyways, canary heart renders Canary heart renders are absolutely wonderful because they are 90 points for five of them and most importantly on their profile They have the instead of setting this unit up on the battlefield You can place it to one side and side and say it's circling high above in any of your movement phases It can descend into battle set up The unit anywhere on the battlefield that is more than nine inch for many models that is their move for that movement phase So again, if you have Daughters as an ally, it's so potent because unlike most current armies that have this stuff that can wear on the scroll It says you can go into reserve They don't have the turn four or five exception Right, right, right. You can keep up literally until turn five. Yeah, exactly Five models. They have a melee potential. They can obviously float after they shoot, right? So they have a lot of ability to just body block people off of a point Even if somebody's like standing in the center of a point They have one or two models standing the center of point Yeah, you have a four up chance if they have one or two models You have a four up chance of literally just floating within range of the objectives, right? And just body blocking them off of it and taking yeah, yep Absolutely, so heart renders to me and or lifetakers. I like that for the heart render version, but again as you wish I Think they're just a really really solid pick that often gets overlooked Because they are such a powerful objective stealer. I don't think that there's enough Armies that have them as allies. Sure. It's not That's their real challenge there That's the real challenge. Sure. I mean, that's fair It is not the most common ally I think the other order ally we should talk about it just came up in the comments But yes, I was gonna I wanted to close out order on him. So we'll just we'll just move to him now Do we want to talk about go Trek? Nope. You don't want to talk about go Trek. Why not? No? Pass You're saying you'd never take him. No What about say in Sam Morgan's? Grand Alliance order all the big scary things He had a Lord sell us it on Star Drake Marathi go Trek It was just like it was Grand Alliance order all the big scary things And I don't remember what his battle line was but it was just three units of whatever and just those three big monsters You want to talk about ruling all of the Objective all of the will the hero based mission objectives, you know like places of arcane power is in there And he just had that one on hard lock Just all three of them walk forward and she's like what what come get it You're not getting these like these are mine now. I own all three of these Good luck. Yeah, no It's just not like I Know Okay, I Disagree, I think go Trek absolutely has use especially in armies now. I'll be interested to see What he looks like in something like seraphon a post book Like I what if I'm gonna pay that many points, but then I want like a mall crush for like I'm I mean He certainly hits harder than a mall crush like he hits he hits really hard His speed is obviously the issue, but who cares He's just a little like slowly moving missile That's just going out there So there you go. Yeah Yeah Yeah All right fair enough I There's a lot of things we could talk about Chris somebody else mentioned tree revs tree revs Another thing like heart renders super useful because they can reposition every round if you have Sylvaneth or like in Living City Very potent choice. I totally agree tree revs are a plus any small points investment You can make like that that just can auto win you the game by stealing objectives is super powerful Yep, so there you go All right, so that's order let's talk about chaos Because I think that chaos is interesting because you Because armies don't often work Exactly logically in chaos Totally not. So here's what I mean by that Let's just get this on the table first if I'm playing slaves to darkness and I bring in and I'm generally slaneshi aligned But like so I may I'll mark all my dudes slanesh, but I'm slaves to darkness allegiance And I bring in a keeper of secrets as an ally All right bring in a keeper of secrets. That's an ally Even though it's all it's all slanesh mark force. My allegiance is slaves to darkness However, if I take the exact same force assuming it's you know legal and Change the allegiance scratch that out and change the allegiance to slanesh. I have zero allies right Because all that the the only rule for the god armies is be have that keyword Right right be slanesh's ancient urgal or corn much broader. Yes. Yeah, whereas for slaves to darkness It's not enough to have the keyword. You have to have you have to beat slaves to darkness That's the that's the keyword. That's the allegiance. You're you're you're gonna let go you're gonna go on there So Sometimes allies don't work both ways is my point, but can we talk about? Maybe one of our best allies and he's in an underworld war band and That's a good old our good buddy Grashrack Grashrack the underworld's war band beast man Your internet is like freaking out right now by the way, but I'll just keep talking until you come back into into Clear frame or whatever That's all right, don't worry about it. You'll catch up in a second. I'm sure Uh Grashrack is absolutely wonderful Because we're talking about a wizard who shows up with some extra dudes. He's a hundred and forty points a lot of people Can ally in beasts within chaos He doesn't have any of the god keywords that would keep him out of the out of the party and He has a spell that just does basically d3 mortal wounds and makes it so anybody who attacks that unit is plus one to hit Do you like plus one to hit? I like plus one to hit. Who doesn't like plus one to hit? It's an amazing ally like this dude if you can fit beasts Grashrack at a hundred and forty giving you another caster a little bit of dumb chaff that you can throw in the way in the Ungor and everything that comes with him and a dude That's just a gun a marker light ammo gun that shoots around you're fine now By the way your internet caught back up is just absolutely wonderful. I Love me some Grashrack I Think he's the other one that's vying for first place in best underworld warband inclusion Sure, I know I'd agree with that Who else you like in chaos allies? Going any direction There's a there's a lot of sort of or or or by the way, but we'll have to talk about mercenaries here at some point Yeah, since we're in chaos should we talk about the marauder mercenaries? I mean I mean, it's not usually you would use them in chaos, but I guess you could no I was gonna check and see So for Skaven they the only thing they can ally with is Nurgle if they have a clan pestilence General or whatever it is. Yeah Nah No, I mean like I kind of like like you almost never have to do allies Let me say it this way in chaos unless you're playing straight slaves They're the ones you often end up with allies, right and straight slaves have to have allies But almost no one else does Because you can bring most people into your stuff All the all the God marked armies are big tent parties Right. They are and so like I was gonna say well, you know, I kind of like you know I used to like monks in and What's his face I'm Glotkin, but now like you don't even need to do that Because like they're both like yeah, I don't know No, not really not nothing really spectacular for that I mean for for marauders marauders make really nice mercenaries. Sure Like marauders make better mercenaries and they do allies Okay Because they get a pregame move Right, right. Yeah when they're taken as mercenaries So you got to eat a command point, but they give you a bunch of bodies and a pregame move And literally all you have to take is the marauders Yeah, that's the only required part of the mercenaries the command point basically for a pregame d6 move sure Now, obviously, I don't know how often you do this in chaos unless you were what you're you're right I mean even in chaos because it's same amount of points So what you're effectively doing is just paying a command point for a pregame move That's imagine that first turn you have to spend your command point to pregame move them, right, but like You could still bring them in as mercenaries and then buff them with all of your abilities Like you could bring them into more as mercenaries into slaves of darkness Yeah keyword-wise they still completely work right because they still have all the necessary keywords to trigger off Right buffs and the spells and the things like that. Yeah. Yeah, you can just perpetually trade basically your first command point For a d6 move even in slaves Sure. No, that's fair Do we want to talk about Bellicor showing up in all these battles because he is one that that never gets god marked, right? So he's actually a potentially strong ally. I Bellicor is so potent Right Yeah, I'm a big fan of Bellicor. He's a double caster. So, you know, he Doesn't like cost-wise. He's pretty reasonable I mean cost-wise he's 240 points That's not bad Yeah for a for an ethereal fast mobile double caster who can once a game Potentially for a round who also screws with like the turn priority basically because of his incentive just Shut off their their most powerful unit Yeah Yeah, that's true. I think he's like the Is he the hottest choice right now as an ally? In chaos in chaos. Yes, in chaos. Yeah, I'm chaos. Yeah, I would say so Because he's universally useful for what he does, right? He has he doesn't have much synergy with anybody Who cares? He doesn't need much synergy with anybody He's a solo practitioner who just shows up and can earn his points if you can shut off their most potent unit So that for one to two turns They just sit there on their hands and do nothing that will often just win you the game on its own Yeah, I mean so the other one that I would add that I'm actually kind of a fan of now I like I wasn't before but I'm I've warmed to them. Okay As an ally or to him Thus them as an ally. Sure is the gaunt summoner. Okay Because of his ability to replacement value with his pinks, yeah, yeah, and those pinks are now 50 models Sure, 50 wounds mean. Yeah, yeah, like 50 wounds because of how the splitting works now You actually use them. You can always use them. Yep And so I think it becomes a really interesting option Like he's a lot more valuable like before I was really not hot on him But now that you're splitting works 100% Where you you're getting functionally like a 50 wound unit plus him for that cost You know, he he's earning is a value more than he was. Yeah, I mean he's 260 points, right? 240 if you do one foot. Oh, okay. There you go. So That's a lot of wounds Double master for 240 points. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, he has a it is a horde killer spell So you can throw up on top like a horde damage or spell not a killer anymore But you know, he's does the 5 plus you throw him up on a bail when you know It has the full like an additional six inches range Yeah I guess technically you're getting a triple cast of sorts out of him because the little pig show up and can cast a spell Only their own spell but only their own spell, but that's yeah Yeah, I just I really like a lot of what's going on there is what I would say That's like I like I I would probably still take velikor like every time like in that matchup I would just take velikor. Yeah, um but But I I don't think that he's actually terrible All right is what I would say so speaking of pregame moves. Do we want to talk about the untamed beasts? Sure So obviously the untamed beasts don't have a lot of synergy and this is the challenge with them against the mercenaries But to me they're like they're they're marauder mercenary light because they also have a pregame six-inch move Right. They're cheaper Right because you know with the mercenaries you're stuck doing them in 20 Right, you have to take at least 20 of them right and That's 150 points With the untamed beasts You can get 10 of them or nine of them sorry because they come in nines For 70 points and they all do get to still do the six-inch pregame well to be clear They're actually like a lot better than marauders for that pregame move because those marauders are a d6 not six. Yep. Yep So the untamed beasts are actually, you know, they can move across the table The problem is they don't have any of the like offensive capability or synergy that you can still do with the marauder mercenaries because What you generally want for pregame moves what you want for pregame move is zoning Of course, I'm just saying like the marauder mercenaries are are effectively doing double work here, right? Sure because on one hand They're they have this pregame move to go out and zone But then they can still actually do work in the game because as mentioned they can benefit from all this energy And they're a very scary unit right now. Yeah, the untamed beasts are literally just pregame move chaff They're there to die. They will not do anything else ever ever. They're just they are just Hey, they can still run in charge Sure. Okay. Sure. Sure. I mean, but yes, they're they're basically just dudes waiting to die But that being said, I think they they have potential They can run and charge so they can do 18 inches in the first turn Okay Why I Don't know. I mean, I don't know what they're gonna do with that 18 right like what happens when they get there. I Mean They they have a they have a javelin that they can throw they can't throw and shoot or they can't run and shoot never mind Okay, just kidding. Yeah, just kidding. They're terrible dude. Don't don't try All right, let's talk about our homeboy here. Who's who's showing up and Who's hopefully showing up in a week or two the mind stealers for ranks Okay Is this guy a worthwhile ally pick? 10 wounds 10 inch move 100 points right 100 points even Not taking up any kind of slot basically, right? It's not a behemoth not a leader Or anything like that. He's just a kitty cat that walks around and makes everybody in a range around him fight last Often not everybody makes a unit one unit within 12 inches if you win the dice game, which you're very likely to do fight last He's hero phase ASL So unless they have an ASF that they can activate later in the turn to break out of the the prison you put them in You can ASL unit and then pile on I'm just saying Cat llama He's got some he's got some potential traction. He's cheap Almost everybody has slaves to darkness as allies. So, you know, so what force are you putting him in? What force are we putting him in like where do we need this guy? Is that your question? So zinge? No, no I was gonna say I was gonna say like the pie that always strikes last for like Zangor Um The beast of chaos that's my answer Okay, I can see that with best of words. Yeah with best of words like beasts have a lot of often units They often want to multi-charge things which is often hard for them because nothing in beasts can take a punch, right? That's their problem. They have no and yep. Yeah and this guy can go up and float around and Tag a unit and then you can bring in all your your dudes who zip up and charge the thing and you can multi-charge the heck out Of a unit, I mean, that's why everybody's been talking about why the big bull, right? They want the big bull to happen because the big bull makes them fight last. That's why they have that spell Right, and you can get one of these guys for the cost of that spell But he can do it much more reliably than you casting the spell and then wielding it into and it piling into them and He can't be turned on you Yeah, I mean the reality is I think that beast is the right pick is then you can also like you could do three of him Sure sure Four would be pushing it because you have to have 16 units, but you could do three of him an MSU the rest of your army and there might be something there. Mm-hmm. That's what I'll say. Okay, I Don't I don't hate it. All right kitty cat has some interesting play But in beast, you know, I think about beasts because they have slaves to darkness as their they're basically their ally. Yeah And they are sort of lacking in an anvil and I became very sad that the chaos sorcerer Lord the guy on foot sure is a hundred and ten points Mm-hmm. Like that ten points is the killer Because if it wasn't for that stupid ten points, you could do Good 15 cast warriors in the sword Lord and he would make them like that'd be a great pick or something like that No, at the same time you could just do 20 cast warriors You could because they'll just re-roll saves on their own. They're a good and right. Yeah, right Like they don't need the re-roll will save But I agree. It's sad that like it's just that little extra ten points. Yeah, yeah Yeah, 20 cast warriors 15 or 20 cast wears I think is an interesting pickup because obviously once they go for 10 they automatically re-roll saves There they have a five up against mortal wounds built into the war scroll They're actually a quite decent anvil, which is something that beasts generally lack Wait, if you're just looking for you know, that's 30 or 40 wounds on a very difficult to shift Body, right? Yeah. Yeah, so I just liked the idea of having the sword Lord in there with them, too The nights just don't understand it way. It's a shame I wanted the nights to work because that more fits with the speed of it Yeah the nights as a mobile anvil like need the Guy to help them and five isn't enough and ten is too many and blah blah blah blah. Yeah, there you go Okay, any other any other chaos Any other chaos Allies that we want to want to call out here. Okay. No Destruction let's talk Destro There's not like destruction and death have a lot less in the allies department We'll get to death in a moment who just I don't I have very little there. Okay But destruction has some interesting play Obviously when you look at something like iron jaws or something like that You Oh Bartek just pointed out that you have to watch out for your cashwares in the in the herdstone range I mean everybody complains because the herdstone expands so slowly I don't know. It's necessarily a problem like you're you're using them as as an advanced anvil and Yes, you're just gonna offset them from there They're hopefully dead sometime around turn three But by then they've served their purpose because you're just really shoving them down the jaws of the enemy Right and the herdstone expands so slowly you really shouldn't sure maybe by turn four they're in there But if they're still alive Let me let me say something real quick. It just dawned on me Another possibility I think is sale is actually a really good ally Okay In chaos because he has the teleport spell natively on his scroll Sure, and so you can bring a teleport into like into zinch But he only teleports slaves darkness Which also be You're saying it's a good way to carry the sort of mask of darkness teleport style spell into the god-marked armies Yep. Yep. Yeah, you could you could carry like you could carry The teleport in for like chaos nights Into nerple sure or the teleport like of like corn units Into into corn so it was just it was a thought that like he actually brings a very useful ability that you couldn't get at any Other way. Yeah, and I mean we didn't really put a pin on it But obviously if you're making a slave to darkness itself allegiance army Bringing in the synergistic god-marked stuff is as allies is obviously you're playing there Like the bloods a crater and the blood stoker and yada yada yada like that's not we'd already talked about that back on the slave Show that that's pretty obvious Yep. Okay destruction Yeah, I mean you're so in iron jaws forces or something like that some of this very command point thirsty the thirsty boys Bring in your fungoid cave shamans. That's an that's an old but a goodie right people love that But but there's not that many allies in destruction that I find really appealing It's funny because chaos and order have this like really rich Um like deep deep well of sort of allies that I I generally want to play with whereas A lot of the destruction stuff really often relies on its allegiance abilities To get like the full value out of the scrolls not always but often And so there's just not as much I want to Be bringing into other forces the fungoid is a standout admittedly Fungoid I like the ability to drag in the fungoid with the skittle cauldron. Oh, yeah, sure with your yeah. Yep. Yep Because I want to explain this Yeah, so the endless spell for a gloom spite is like a cauldron Yep, and when you cast it it gives you full access to the glooms fight lower So it'll it lets you like access the glooms fight lower outside of allegiance um, and so you could like use either scar snick or Um, like a normal like shaman Uh, and then you could also like normally if you just did like a shaman You could actually bring in like a large block of like goblins or whatever. Sure Um, or you could bring in the trogoth hag and then she can actually bring the uh, the cauldron in But I mean, I think the the the key with the cauldron is is just having like that full list of spells Yeah, the fact that it brings any entire spell list for you, which is there's like a teleport in there There's like a really nice d6 nuke, you know, there's a couple other. Yeah, exactly. There's an asl So, uh, I think that um Yeah, I I'm a fan of that. Let me say that Okay, cool. I dig that um the You know if you mentioned the trogoth hag Yep I don't love her as an ally. I mean like she's a cool model And is fine. I'm not saying she's not good. I just honestly and it's probably the destruction type lists that I play You know, there might be different lists where she's better in But certainly in like the iron jaws forces that I'm building is like that. She would do nothing but weaken the list Because she's so expensive now. I like to see different takes on the forces where Where she's a hot pick. So I'm not going to say that's impossible. I'm just saying my the way that I tend to build it She doesn't work for me Yeah, I think that the arachnorok is probably a better caster um because uh I like more of what the arachnorok is doing Um as a caster that could bring in the cauldron Um, that's really punchy with mortal wounds. It's not as tanky as she is but I don't know That's where I'm at. Sure like for the points. I think I would take the arachnorok first Fair enough, uh Anything else grabbing your attention out of there? No, I mean not really Fair enough All right, uh, let's see So Let's talk about death, man death um Oh, so somebody asks how do we feel about rippa's snarl fangs? um I feel uninspired by them The same as I feel about most of the underworlds war vans. I think they're how do I feel about the models? I think they're awesome looking models as A pick I mean, I don't know. I'll let me let me bring them up again here. Let's all look at rippas together. Shall we let's let's send somebody Ask in the comments. Let's take a look at rippas That'll be fun. All right, so rippas. Oops Rippa snarl fangs Okay So they are 80 points for the three dudes Obviously, they're unique because a duh duh, right? They have a bunch of attacks that don't do much of anything Nope. No, no attacks to do anything, right? Uh, they add one to hit rolls for attacks made by this unit snarl fang Jaws that target a unit with one or more wounds allocated to it And they're eligible to fight in the combat phase if they're within six inches and can move an extra three inches when they pile in Okay I mean Oh Excuse me. I'm so sorry everybody. I mean my issue there is like I love a good six inch pile in But Who cares like I don't know what they do when they get there That's the problem. I mean, they're very fast because there are Okay, so hold on the snarl play the snarl fang jaws. You'll have three units that have that attack Right and all of them are on threes and threes two damage Yeah, okay Um And target with one or more wound and so you're on twos and threes against multi wound models No, if they've got a wound allocated to them Oh Like let let's let's say that that's not going to be the modal outcome, right? But like sure sometimes you'll get that Yes, you get six of those those jaw attacks that have no rend right uh Which doesn't do much damage like they're kind of okay against weak enemy chaff. Sure Yeah, I mean let let me just say this but for 80 points. They're not terrible I don't know that I would use them in a As allies. Let me be clear about that. I don't know what I'm going to add them to as a unit But in a gloom spite army, which they have the gloom spite gets keywords. Sure Is it just the speed Like the fact that they can without a charge hit something 18 inches away guaranteed 24 Oh sure. Yeah. Yeah, sorry 24. Yes. Thank you. I wasn't yeah on their other six Yeah, the fact that they can trap that they can hit something 24 inches away without a charge Like that's valuable. Don't get me wrong. I like things that can pile away from six inches So maybe all right. I you know what you're kind of selling me as I'm thinking about them because I'm thinking about Hellstriders and my slinnish army They hit like wet noodles, but I run seeker cavalcade all the time Just to let them pile in from six inches because Uh at 80 points, you know, like I use the seekers anyway, they're 100 points I just run them around the side and I use them to like pile in and tag a corner of something Because it's so reliable All right. I take it back. All right. You know what? Who originally suggested these guys? Uh germ all right germ you sold me germ At 80 points rippus snarl fangs. I've come around on them Uh, there you go I'm I'm with it. Yeah I dig it No, I agree with that. Okay. You turn me around on rippus Uh, they're they're a good I would you I would use them exactly like I used my my health writers in slinnish And I could see that in something I could actually see that having some value in a couple different destruction army And they're like a utility piece right and destruction doesn't have very many good utility pieces like that. Sure They're like pigs. They're like they're like pigs. Yeah. Yeah, I mean Sure, like I just say I built a lot of iron jaws armies where I have like 80 points left or that kind of that amount And nothing to do with right because all their units are just you know, expensive sure so So, okay. All right. All right I'm with that Jermy brought me around. You've you've made me discover a new ally. I like it. I like it Okay, uh, cool. So let's talk death and then we'll close this out. Um Um, I mean, I actually don't want to talk to that All right At all I want to talk mercenaries. Oh talk mercenaries then Because I think because death is best when thought through the mercenary lens Because the best mercenaries in the game are actually a death mercenary unit Uh, yeah, what which death mercenary unit the abhorrent arch regent? Yeah, okay. Good. Yeah, we're on the same page then. Um Uh, well because you could also get uh necromancers Sure, I mean, why don't you walk through the permutations because to me I agree with you Because of the nature of how death is built right now, right with legions being so huge and all inclusive and like legion of grief that even reaching across and having a bunch of night hot in it and You know just the nature of these armies means that like often you don't really need to worry about allies and death. I'm not saying it's sort of Never a thing but just death has much less call to use allies because They almost exclusive like it's already part of their army because death is such a hegemonic force Right. Yeah, they're already reaching deep into the bench. Like most of the time allies aren't really a thing There's not a lot of allies that are doing a lot in death Right. And a lot of stuff that's in death is so so so Allegiance dependent That to actually reach into allies is truly detrimental, right? Um, but Death has some of the most interesting mercenary. Apparently death is sending out mercenaries Shai is just uh, they're those mercenaries are ready to go. They're shipping out of shai ish And uh fighting in armies all across the moral realm. So walk us to tom. I'm not gonna lie Of the mercenaries I would use I think all of the death mercenaries. Yeah, sure indifferent lists Let me look, but i'm pretty sure. Yep Yep Yep, okay, so take us through them because I agree. I think I think you're right Um, so the least useful of the death mercenaries is the vampires The blood next one. Yeah, the blood knight's one. Um, the Reason why it's useful is that you can fit a vampire lord in there Um, and that lets you in legion of grief pull a vampire into the army Right is right now in legion of grief You can't have vampires and so you could do that Pull the vampire and the vampire has a really wonderful Command ability usable in the hero phase that adds plus one to attack plus one attacks to a unit Um, and so it's really useful for things like banshees or hex rates or things like that And so you can get all the toys of legion of grief including like the neg one to hit Um, or and i'm sorry neg one like save spell like the armor cracker spell and also have the the the attack buffer through the um the vampire Company, yeah, it should be noted that the the vampire lord good old vampire lord on foot That's all we're talking about bringing him in through the murk. Well, no, I mean, he's on vampire nightmare steve But still he has the same abilities fair enough. I'm the the picture is just the guy on foot. Yes Yeah, you can you can arm him with wings or he can walk around or he can be a guy on a horse Yada yada. This has to be on a horse Uh, not for the plus it's in the bursary. He has to be on a horse. That's funny I didn't I didn't remember that at any rate That scroll his plus one attack command ability is just a death unit Right, right, right? So he's a good like using this as mercs is an interesting way to actually suck in a plus one attack Dude in places where they might not otherwise be like you could bring him in into like um ocr bone reapers And get plus one attacks to a unit and the way that they're command like point things work Like you spend them on command abilities. So he would suddenly use the relentless discipline points Is that true? It is true Are you a hundred percent sure about that? I am okay um, uh Like correct me if i'm wrong But if you're not a hundred percent sure that is what i'm hearing Well, i'm like 99 still use their command point. Wouldn't you sit like they don't have command points But you cannot spend them that's part of the ocr rule You can no longer spend command points period I I would need to go look at that to understand exactly how that would work. I mean doesn't matter. Yeah, because right now This is it's an interesting case because obviously uh, uh, obr normally has no allies, right? That's one of the interesting things about them. They're a they're a hegemonic singular force within death. They just allies are done, right? uh so I'm I'm looking over the rules right now so here's I Relentless discipline points are used in the same manner as command points We can only use for command abilities if you're on a war scroll that has the ocr bone reaper's keyword There you go. So no, you would just not be able to use his command ability in there Oh Yep, okay, but it was something was clarified in the faq. I remember that allowed for some degree of synergy there I'm sure people in the comments are screaming at us right now about that. Yes. I'm sure there you go So, yeah, he just doesn't do anything in obr. It's a shame But there's other places where you can pull him in and get that. Yes As you mentioned into your legion of grief or whatever Uh, yeah, you could use them for our legion of grief for sure. Um Uh to do that. Yeah Yeah Yeah, just got to buy the extra command point. So you're balancing out that cost and obviously you can there's other Things you could do there Yep, play the sad trombone Well, uh What else Oh, it's the other way maybe that i'm thinking about is it that Yes, if if you take ocr bone reaper's units into grand line's death The ocr bone reapers can use command points to like normal command points for their command abilities like shield That it went the other way. Sorry. I apologize. Nope Okay, cool No, I like that. So let's talk about the other mercs. Yes, I agree fanplour is fun, but he's he's whatever whatever Yeah, he's limited. Um, that's the least. Um, the sons of the lich master mercenaries gift you a necromancer um And so you can actually pull the necromancer into night haunt this way Um, and that's valuable and you don't have to buy zombies or anything else like that Right, you can just do the necromancer And you can and by the way, you could pull in the corpse card as well with the plus one to cast for death units If you if you really wanted to as well and the advantage of that necromancer is that he can give your death units double pylon Your your your night haunt death units double pylon So Yeah, I think it's solid right on but then the the winner winner chicken dinner Shall we yeah, I mean the thing that actually matters is Is uh, is the tenebrous court the flesh eaters because you can add an arch region um at 260 I think is what they're at now. Is that right? I don't remember his point goes off the top of my head, but okay. Um, I'll look it up But yeah, I think it's 260, uh, and what's what's his advantage Is that like he is my catch all go to mercenary Well, I mean this guy shows up all the time in your stuff because he is a straight powerhouse. Yes. He is 240 seven wounds right Four up save heals a flat three wounds every round Yeah, so you have to focus him down Uh brings his own summon ability with him Yep on his scroll Yep, right And so he can summon Like automatically just on his scroll it takes command point obviously because you're not going to have a throne round But he can just show up in any army And summon a courtier or a unit of three knights or unit up to 20 serfs meaning like 20 ghouls or you know, whatever that's not That's all trans you summon 20 ghouls. Yes in a horde and off objective. That's what you do. Yep I mean like that's Like if you're going to bring him make sure you bring 20 dudes to come take an objective He's that's what's gonna happen here. Not to mention this dude's also a double caster Yep, all right, and he brings in one of my favorite endless spells. Yes, he does Talk about the endless Um, so it's cadaverous barricade And units that start near it Are have are half move So it's a wall That also halves move for nearby units Um, and so this becomes really potent when combined with other walls When you go for the wall build for those who remember the magic the gathering time period back in the 90s Where you'd have like the wall builds the blue white wall decks Uh, this is this is just doing that again because you can have you know, your palisade and you know, blah blah blah blah And you can bring it see the key here is that you can fit him A knight in cantor Yep And then however many endless spells do you want? Uh But you fit the two of them into like a fire slayer build So that you get you see you get the magmic wall Yes And then like the palisade and the cadaverous wall Yep And then you drop a comet behind the walls Sure So you put like three walls up like this basically where people can't get out of them Like you can do all the wall Yep, you can do like all the walls first turn Is all you have enough casters for that and then and that wall by the way is a 24 inch setup So it's like it has some range on it. Um, he's also uh, and so you could do that. That's a nice fun combo Uh, this is also by the way one of my my favorite Like it was one of the lists that I came up with with the kao look really early on That gary both loved and hated which was basically like it was the equivalent of like the The 40k soup list. Yeah, sure Because it was the like the boat like the kao boat alpha build That had a a vortex and a bottle sure Okay, so you could drop a chaos endless spell like the vortex for that like the half move Yes, the warp lightning vortex from the no run that the other no run no charge No fly whatever that thing and then that does damage all around it and then you could bring in the arch region Who could then wall? Who could then wall for half move and then you could bring in a Night in cantor and drop a comet sure sure because Because why not why not And just hope that they have enough uh dispels or or or what not to to deal with all that dumb stuff It's a very funny build against armies that doesn't fly. It's absolutely crippling, right? Right like and and a majority of your points are in units that can teleport and shoot Sure So they're just gonna like whatever whatever survives that initial onslaught They're gonna pick off It's all that damage just gonna trigger in the movement phase and the hero in movement phase Um, and then they'll have free reign those kao will have free reign to shoot whatever they want Yeah, and we should point out like nog and knocker had said that's an expensive build for a gimmick and knight haunt would laugh at that I mean keep mind if you're actually using the warp lightning vortex all the all the knight haunt lose their ability to fly Right, so they'll get stuck there in the wall too because the vortex does just legitimately shut off fly for everybody in that triangle Yeah, but I mean knight knight haunt aren't going to be scary in that matchup Like I hate to say that but you can pick off all of their heroes because their heroes are all like four wound models It's not that weak for god's sakes. There's more wounds than that. They're not goblins, but come on be fair tonight Knight haunts dreadplayed hero, which is normally the general for the teleporting is four winds There's plenty of non four wound heroes in knight haunt for goodness There are also multiple four wound knight haunt heroes in knight in knight haunt fair It's not the one there are there are two or three that are four wound Because the the banshee's four wound the cairn wraith is four wound Who else like like they truly have terrible heroes knight haunt does and all of their six upsades are dependent upon their their heroes sure Uh, I will say that if you build if you've heard any version of this like Wall and drop whether it's the vortex or the comet or both because there's a couple of them you've played around with that are um Agreed just that are that are egregious and yes That's noggin makes out a good point that like these heroes could start off the board Because remember knight haunt could just you know be not on the board um Half of knight haunt could be not on the board, right? Yeah, sure, but you could be there. He there could be No, it's half. It's half. It's just like storm cast. They have the same allegiance ability. Um The at any rate this army needs to be called the telltale heart Okay Because you're putting them behind a wall and then putting the pulsing thing Behind the wall that's just there you wall them in and then if you put the pulsing Thing behind them. So this is absolutely the telltale heart build Yeah, clearly, right Uh Yep, so there you go um I mean to be fair knock knocker tom does play knight haunt. So I mean he he knows him. I understand I certainly don't think tom would fall for his own trick Like no, I what what i'm saying knock knocker is that like you can teleport those ko wherever you want on the board every turn And they can reach out 18 to 30 inches from that point that they teleport to with their guns Sure So the point is that like I don't care where you hide him They can literally if you teleport away they can teleport and chase you every turn But at any rate, this isn't a knight haunt thon I I you've taken knight haunt tournaments and and I know that you also know the power of them. They're they're perfectly Perfectly viable. Yeah, yeah Yeah They are a wonderful army and I would be taking them to acon probably if if uh If change host wasn't a thing but change host is definitely a thing um, and so Nope That's also a good name john shaves between a falling rock and a hard place Yeah Yeah, I mean, I don't know we'll see. Um Yeah, we'll see right on Uh, cool. Uh, yeah, so I mean but that that arch region is such a hot murk pick Yeah, he's like high mobility. He's high mobility. He's self healing Uh, he's eight wounds right or seven seven wounds, but he heals every a turn self healing like a ridiculous amount of self healing Like he has summoning. He is a double caster um Like I just there's nothing about him. I don't like yeah, sure absolutely um He is he is to me I think he's actually like the hot mercenary pick period because he can go in any grand alliance Right, we're talking about him through the lens of death But honestly he can go in almost he can go in so many different armies and be useful I love him in fire slayers so much I actually have a conversion and I've built all 20 of my converted ghouls Like like that's like that's a real thing Of running the arch region in fire slayers and into my k.o. Dwarf army um, because I mean it's like it's a He brings a lot of utility that a lot of other armies don't have Sure. Yeah. No, it's good. There you go. All right. Cool. Well fun stuff I think we we broke back into this. This has been a good to good to revisit I thought this would be a cool time now that we're sort of On the edge of all the books being out and so all these you know The ally lists were often messy when order looked like nonsense before the city's a sigmar book, right? Cleaned everything up and it just sort of occurred to me in the last month that there really is a whole new world here of allies and interesting builds and hot picks especially because some of these armies are putting a lot of the power of the thing On to the scroll Right, right and the more that's sitting on the scroll Uh, the more interesting it becomes as an ally choice as pointed out with things like the gaunt summoner with bellicor with uh With the Arch region that we just talked about like a lot of they they're just People when they show up and do a lot of work and can refund their own points in a big way Become really interesting allies to me or mercenaries as they were So yeah, right on cool. Anything else we want to say tom before we call it No, I mean, I think that like we've just scratched the surface like there are lots of combos that are like really powerful Is what I would say and so um, I would encourage you all to to to explore the options Yeah, I agree and plus it's just a really good chance It is my favorite thing about my city's army Is being able to include all this crazy stuff That's what also got me thinking about it because it's just so fun to do these conversions to make like my city's version Of the iron clad right to do Your as you mentioned like to do your fireslayers version of the arch region, right? Like it's just a cool hobby and modeling opportunity to make the the force more your own Than just being limited by what's in your book So, yeah So right on uh, okay, cool. Well, very good everybody that brings us to the end We'll be back next week if you're watching this and you liked it hit that little like button down there That helps other people find the show. I'm going to actively say that now at the end of the show So thank you a lot of people do hit it. You're awesome if you're hitting it Thank you all for sticking with us awesome week discussing allies If there's anything we didn't mention that you think is a hot pick for ally If you're like They how could they have missed this you have offended me sir to the depth of my soul by not including this ally Drop it down in the comments. We'd love to hear it. So give it a like sub if you haven't already But we'll be back because as always We'll see you next wednesday Bye. Bye