 We we have we have a three-pack today. It's it's it's half of our six pack, but that's all right We will more than make up for it next week next week is our special tears of the kingdom spoiler cast We've already got seven on that show Add three more make it a clean 10. It's gonna be a lot of fun, but tonight you've got Mr.. Andress restart. How's it going, buddy? I'm glad I didn't meet my mic. I'm good Yeah, as well next to him mr. Eric more hell and I am the host as always Mr. Nintendo Prime. All right So we have a lot we can get into what we'll start it like we always start What have we been playing lately? This should be pretty quick Eric. What have you been playing lately? I brought my switch again. Yeah, he played a switch. I hear right still tears of kingdom Yes, my second dungeon now. Hey, which one? Which one? It was definitely goofy to try it the carts the mine carts. Well, you didn't cheese it What I'll just do a whole bunch of uh, there's multiple ways to cheese it You go down to the lava with a hydrant and then you can just stack shit No, no, you can just kind of build a path to go underneath and then you can just ascend up in You can do that you could also do what a lot of people did they built a hover bike Yeah, and then they just literally just cheated the whole thing Or you could just do the way I did which is try to do with the legit way And then somehow end up climbing a lot like like I did in the rest of the while because you know I forget there's new mechanics. Yeah, right and uh, yeah about that. Yeah. No, so I've been playing that I'm doing the the depths. I just got the oh god Which we'll call it Careful now Yeah, you ought to build you got all built. Okay. Congratulations. There you go. Dude. That's a The sick feature. Yeah. Yeah, not even because like it saves vehicles like that's cool But because you can save items with it You can do a lot with it Have you fuse something you can save it you could save it Yeah, and then if it's like an item from the world use ultra hand just for the yeah Yeah, yeah, and if it's an item from the world like say a giant metal plank or something that isn't normal When you auto build it'll just appear So you can have something anywhere it's it's pretty Let's say it's very it's a very interesting system to me. No, it's intended. Yeah, it's just a very easy to abuse That's why you're seeing people build calculators and other crazy things right now. I don't need that's insane Yeah, I know it's insane That's where I met nice nice well, I'm glad you got that so you got you got a few dungeons to go So yeah, good luck sir. Good luck sir on the rest of your journey. I You know, I'm not gonna say much because next week's a spoiler cast So like and he hasn't beat it like conveniently Eric's not here next week. Oh look Eric's not gonna be around family So the spoiler cast after time for the game Yeah, so kind of otherwise the spoiler cast might have been this week But honestly the way guests have been dropping out from every podcast the last month It's probably good that it had two weeks to plan the spoilers We actually have some guests already planned out in August so you know what hopefully they don't drop out some bro I'm talking to you Talking to you buddy. You drop out on August 2nd. You know, I'm looking at the camera and see your finger pointing at me Whoa Anyways So I'm just what are you been playing lately? um Man, I know what I will be playing this week. I'm hurry. So I've been playing a combination of the Pikmin 4 demo I finished that Sunday night. I've been playing Pikmin 2 and Every once in a while jump into the kingdom, but I haven't played a lot the last week or two. I Anticipate I'll probably go back once I finish Pikmin 4 But beyond that I've actually been playing a decent amount of switch sports Just because for father's day I got my dad switch sports because used to play we golf all the time and Whenever I'm at his house, which has been a lot lately because there's been family So I've been visiting we've been playing a lot of switch sports mostly golf and I used to hate it not hate hates a strong word, but like, you know back back back during the the wee days, which is kind of like my high school Beginning like it happened between my high school to college years that that transition They would play we golf all the time and I was like, but there's so many other games. There's there's Smash Brothers There's there's Mario Kart. There's there's Zelda like this Donkey Kong like come on Let's play something else and they're like not we golf and like I can't stand this but now in my more mature Wiser form I have a greater sense of appreciation and just slightly more patience So I've been able to perform a little bit better at a switch sports golf. So yeah, it's fun Well, you know when you give up trying to give them to change their mind that'll happen sometimes Yeah, awesome. I can't I just accepted that I'm the hardcore gamer Hardcore gamer So on my end I played a smidge of tears to the kingdom after I beat it Technically I beat it after the the podcast last week so that you could argue I beat tears of the kingdom this week this last week So that's pretty exciting Got the true ending and all that Cool. Yeah guys. I don't really consider that a spoiler. It's kind of like a breath of the wild There's multiple endings putting on what you've completed in the game That being said I've also played a little bit more of Final Fantasy 16 Because I wanted to see if my initial impressions after a few hours still held up and yes my initial impressions held up I still don't like it. So There is that I did dabble a smidge into the Pikmin 4 demo just a smidge See this is basically yesterday and I'm like did the games out like tomorrow night I'm also just wait at this point. I'm away to this long with the Pikmin demo. Why not? Why not just wait? So yeah, and it was kind of cool because I I heard something on my social and look and I said Oh, it just gave me the final little update because it updated Pikmin 4 updated to 1.0.1 So it just updated Pikmin 4 for me because it's already pre-installed So That's what I will be playing at some point tomorrow night it through the weekend I may I might even be done with the game after the weekend. We'll see we'll see how that goes But here's the biggest Pikmin game yet Yeah, they said well They said what there's more to do or more to collect or something than all the other prior Pikmin games combined whoo That's awesome by the way, which that means that this game should be pretty hefty pretty big pretty large compared to other your product it's not a From what I've seen you're not you're probably it's not like a Legend of Zelda 100 plus hour campaign kind of big. Mm-hmm. I heard the campaign like but there's You know between the main campaign apparently there's a lot of really good post-game content. That's significant That's really cool. And then you have the Dandori stuff Like you can you have a lot to enjoy with this base base game. So Yeah, yeah, so like I'm really excited for this one plus I saw that there's a Zelda Easter egg So that always Anytime there's a Zelda Easter egg and it's a music related. It really makes me smile So that's that's that's a fun one for those who haven't seen it. Don't know about it It's cool play Pikmin 4 me happy We do have a pick before topic today. By the way finally we're talking some Pikmin Because there's actually been some news and some stuff happening around the series and Miyamoto Saying some stuff about it as well because they did do it as the developer Segment on it. So we'll talk about that a bit later what I want to do right now quick is something I've been forgetting to do but No more we'll remember now every month We got to thank some of our patrons who directly support the podcast If you would like to be shouted out and one one podcast per month All you have to do is go to our patreon at patreon.com slash nintendo prime and become a $5 enough member The patrons who are supporting our show this month We have a nixia at $20 we have kylan grant at five Chris Palmer at five Zenith at 10 James fazl at five two at 20 and Joe prosco as a $10 So thank you guys so much for directly supporting the show because that's pretty much for all $5 and up ones are about They're about the podcast the money from it goes towards podcast related equipment and stuff. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you alright And I guess we just hop right into our first topic because this wasn't gonna be the first topic like this wasn't supposed to be a topic at all today why Jeff grub The topics literally called the Jeff grub rumor train First off we haven't had like some nice juicy Jeff grub Nintendo related rumors in a while Because he backed off After the man had to cut his hair and Nintendo trolled him and dropped Metro Prime remaster two months later He kind of backed off and said hey, I need to do better He was saying this long before he cut his hair About double sourcing and all that and he's been the source on a bunch of rumors For other consoles that have turned out to be true over the last year, but he's backed off on Nintendo Until yesterday. I don't know what came over him They have a producer on their show now that apparently stops him from doing this but the producer wasn't in So they got like 12 minutes into the show and he's like dude I do that you guys want something crazy you want to make some headlines drops a bomb pretty early Do you want to make some headlines? Let's make some headlines. The so-and-so is not here to stop me this time acting as if maybe the producer's been preventing him from saying anything but Probably instructed him to do so because because of what happened before yeah It's not just Metro Prime remaster, which you can argue technically was right on it clearly was delayed But the the Wind Waker and Twilight Princess one that's been the Yeah Yeah, and he even in talking this time says by the way I'm not saying it's at you because like his his buddy Mike or whatever brought up Brought up the Wind Waker and he's like don't you know no Jeff doesn't want to even go there He doesn't want to even revisit those rumors Um That being said we got a bunch of stuff. Let's start with the first thing that that that he mentioned And well, it's we're kind of go with the first thing and then the very last part that he brought up because they're kind of related Bratching at the mic. I see this cat here Yeah, this is what happens when it's just me on you're gonna just see me getting extra weird So we're gonna start with the first thing he said that he's like very sure of and it's very specific and He thinks he knows when it's gonna happen, but he's not really positive Metro Prime to remake. I think he used the word remake. I probably master, but I believe he said remastered anyways it's coming soon and He says he thinks it's gonna happen at the September director at least that sounds right to him He also later said a September director is gonna happen Although, you know that shouldn't really be news because I do one every September, but he's already heard that there's gonna be one in September like well Yeah, of course And you know, he thinks that he thinks this is what he thinks it'll be around the time of the Nintendo Thing that are doing the Nintendo live 2023 which that part's a little interesting because that's literally the first through the fourth Like it doesn't get any earlier in the month and that's a Friday Saturday Sunday Monday So clearly the directs not happening then so they would have to be the following like Wednesday or Thursday, so I Whatever I have no idea But that's what he said. So let's start there Metroid Prime to remake because yes, he talks out that we'll get to that What are we thinking? Yeah, remastered Whatever I mean so In terms of the the Metroid stuff first, right? And I think I saw your bullets like he said relatively soonish, which is a very relative term Yeah, but I Think something to be careful about not that I disagree not saying I disagree But it's just this is just kind of like the road we've gone down before Where you hear something and then you know about something else and then you connect the dots Like as as theorists speculators people who talk about the news like that's you know, you do if you're gonna engage in discussion You're gonna make connections like that's that's part of the conversation, right? But when you are One who reports the news or the one who's a source on stuff when you Start connecting dots and thus are saying more than what you heard It can start to get messy so what I'm getting at here is He heard that Metroid Prime to remastered is Happening relatively soonish in his words, right? and He's heard there's going to be a September in town direct which shouldn't come as any shock, right? I think there's only one time we didn't have a general internal direct and we still had like two directs in that month anyway If it didn't it was 2020 and even then we they had the Mario event and everything so I Partner direct that had multiple other stuff like so representing stuff every September Yeah, exact September's always gonna have a slew of Nintendo announcements like we agree on that it hasn't since they've started It's always been that way at least starting to switch era, but the point. I'm simply making is that I just want to get it's a healthy distinction to make is that We are making that leap That because we're hearing Metroid Prime to remastered is coming soon It's going to be in the Nintendo direct. He made that leap. He's made right No, he did say he doesn't know that it'll be there He just says it sounds right because right well Metroid Prime one what happened. It was shadow dropped in February So if it's going to be coming relatively soonish, which to him sounds like this year, then Why don't shadow drop this one doing that next direct? I mean, I think we all think it's it that Nintendo doesn't have an August or September published title Yeah, I mean a shadow drop could work right Yeah, so do a September direct in the second week of the month and announce the physical version to come out like right at the end of September so they technically have a September release, right both physical and digital and There's only one month of the skipping, which is August, which isn't really that out of the ordinary So like I can I can see that I think that's that's probably what's going to happen Like I Before the rumor I thought there's a good chance of this happening, but now I feel more confident on it I think what might be more interesting to us is kind of talk about how He's not say he's from what he's hearing it sounds like it's just going to be primed to remastered Yeah, and not two and three. Yeah, nothing about three nothing about four come in just this which I Have a theory I Don't know. I'm not by the way. I'm not relating this to the next generation system. Although it probably is but I get this feeling that if This is what they're doing and there's nothing to support it yet because by the way Metro Prime 2 Hasn't even been announced let alone shadow dropper coming up. So right now. It's just Jeff grub There's been other people saying that they will happen eventually, but nobody was really saying it was happening soon For sure until Jeff grubs like hey, this is what I've heard and he seems pretty confident But he also noted later that hey just like Metro Prime one things could change like it can be soon at the moment Then they decide a month or nine. You know what, right? I'm gonna move things around and we'll shift this to a different time But so this is not locked in he's not like 100. It's not locked in happening this year But he's pretty comp like what he's heard is very solid for this year What what's interesting to me is if they do that September drop. I'm kind of thinking oh Well, then they're dropping three in February and giving us four next holiday. Well, you could argue you could argue that They skip the summer direct. So maybe they're gonna skip it's gonna be every other direct So we don't get prime three until the summer direct in 2024 possible and then we don't see prime four until So the early director 2025. I don't think that's what's happening. I not at all but I think it's definitely coming sooner than that, but you know Yeah, who knows right? We don't know we don't know and I also Don't think the jury's out on three not happening. So like I still think you know A lot of people wanted them bundled together because if it wasn't getting like the full ground-up visual right overhaul like one got It's more like an HD in which again, we don't really know Then oh, why not package these two together because it's not as much work put into them But then again, maybe it hasn't we just don't know like we just don't know like yeah, we haven't seen it We're an unknown terror for all we know it does look better than the prime one remaster. They dropped earlier the show We don't we don't know What's interesting though is it from what he's saying and You know, I think he probably doesn't know for a fact either. He's probably based probably hasn't seen it Right exactly. So he doesn't know for a fact but from what he's heard the sense, right? So it's kind of like I'm interpreting his words and his when he's interpreting someone else's words So like that is like classic rumor, right? But a telephone but exactly but the sense that I got from what he was saying is that This is going to be more than just an upscale Yeah, but more than not more than just an upscale but also less than what prime remastered was and that's So there's a window there. I don't know what that window like I don't know what that means exactly Because prime two also looks better than prime one Yeah, that's a thing like maybe it's less work because they needed less work to make it at that same level Yeah, I mean, maybe it's maybe it's upscaled to 1080p. They But maybe they implement like a new lighting engine And just better textures without like models And maybe that's maybe it's like one of those really good They did it with prime one and then when they just sort of like brought in the code of prime two and just sort of slapped it in there Maybe it just worked. So it was less work Maybe I don't know that's a good point Like if the engine's already a stat like been modernized to the point where they can make it look and run like that then Yeah, maybe they just don't need as much time to do. Yeah, but there's also multiplayer Yeah, what will they add? That's gonna be really interesting actually Dude I'm going a little nuts here online multiplayer. It's gotta be online. I'm going well But the thing if we go up the precedent sent by the prime one remastered They didn't actually add any new any well, I mean they added art There was art and like bonus collect less stuff, but like in terms of like like game. There was no new gameplay content To add online It's I guess it's not They could do something with that They can do a lot with that. I just don't know they're gonna do a lot I think if there is online, it's literally just gonna be the same game, but you just be able to okay All right, I'm gonna go on This is me going full full hype mode for Well, I mean, I think there's some there's some logic behind my thought here, but if they bring back prime 2 Right, and I think we all agree. It's that's definitely happening just a matter of one and there's a good chance it is this September that if with the multiplayer if it's just cut then Any any fascination or idea about prime 4 having it you can just forget about it They literally took it out of prime 2 forget about it if it's bait if it's brought in but it's just local then Still forget about it. I don't think prime 4 is not multiplayer, but it's possible Right, but if they add online and enhance or change it in any way Then they're total then I then I think they are going to give prime 4 more multiplayer focus Because I think if they're gonna if they're gonna go to prime 2 and make any sort of dramatic changes I think that shows a bit of a like it kind of shows what direction they want to take the Metroid series in Not to say that I think that Metroid should be a multiplayer-centric franchise not at all I think it's a it's if you if you look at Metroid as a multiplayer franchise You don't understand what it is, but it doesn't mean it can't have a multiplayer component, right? It just kind of depends on if they can manage the resources to do both well So if prime 2 remastered it comes in with online multiplayer or just an enhanced multiplayer some some sort of Something in that territory Then I do think that means that they're going to somehow fit in multiplayer into prime 4, but I'm not expecting that But I'm keeping my eyes peeled Mmm. Yeah, I mean we'll see what happens that I'm really excited about because this was the one that he had like An exact thing. Hey, it's Metroid Prime 2. It's a remaster. Like we're Soonish, okay, bring it up and he did he did say remaster. So yeah, so it's gonna be it's gonna be quite interesting to Just to see what happens and after we got the Metroid Prime one and he was right about it all last year He just was wrong and exactly when it was gonna drop. He was off by like 45 days But that's I mean look his source on that was legit probably the same source So we'll see what happens the pricing is what's going to be interesting to me because base if again If we we're interpreting his wording, right, but my interpretation I think you agree with you guys agree with me that Well, he is suggesting that primary mastered is going to be an improvement. It's gonna be a visual improvement That's more than just an upscale It's somewhere between just prime 2 upscaled to primary mastered right somewhere in between So it's gonna look better But if it's just only a little bit better does that warrant the same price? Unless they do add some sort of multiplayer component, maybe they look at the multiplayer component as adding value So maybe that's kind of how they sort of justify it. And maybe it's also $40. What do you think? Yeah, I mean, I'm thinking $40 probably but You know, the big thing is if it is $40 I do feel like they need to at least have it be close to visually on par with the last one that they dropped Not have it look like oh, this is prime one in here's prime two and it looks worse. I'm like, I Just kind of feel like they gotta implement the physical based lighting, which is what yeah, that's the big thing Go real. That's the big thing or like it gives it that depth. Yeah That yeah, that exactly that would be if they could just plug and play that because it The you know, I'm sure they had to they had to redesign a lot to get that to work. So I don't know I'm not I know I'm not game developers. I have no idea so Okay, cool So that that was kind of the first part of his rumor and then you're not done. What do you got what do you got? What do you got? I know you can't let Metroid go well the thing is I mean it's big. Yeah, dude It's big man. I think I think part of it is that Where I mean, I think we all agree that that these primary masters are a build of the prime four So the question then becomes if we're only getting prime two in September, which Based off what Jeff Gribb is saying that's going to be the case Do we see prime four or does this mean prime four is further out? I? Think we will not see prime four Until a direct next year Okay, where they do another shadow drop of prime three I think they don't want to show four before they get the full three out or at least have three announced Maybe maybe you're right But I guess what's interesting about this is and I haven't heard anything from what they're trying I just feel like they're building like We got one at one in February if we get to like they're building they're building up for I mean It's kind of like how they built up the Pikmin for that Pikmin 3d luck Pikmin bloom I mean people wanted to are announced after the fact but yeah, absolutely, but they still had you know stuff So the timing may be different But I guess what's interesting and I don't know if Nate the hate is like changed his opinion on this but I know Like pre-direct his belief was that prime four is supposed to come up by the end of the fiscal year So if prime four is not shown showing off during the September Nintendo indirect That essentially means it's not coming out by the end of the fiscal year He's a prime for I don't see a scenario where they show it off in a February direct for it to come out in March It's not that kind of game. So Who's right? You know well first off Jeff Grub didn't say prime for wouldn't be in the direct No, right. You didn't really talk about anything that would be there. He like he just kind of said I know under like basically he said this Like don't run headlines direct in September. He was basically just saying this isn't really newsworthy right now There will be a direct in September, which I know guys at some point in August I will run a headline about a direct happening in September I know I'm going to do it because people click on it and watch it. It is what it is I'm gonna wait to do it until I've got more to Use this news even if you expect any more to put with it. I want any more than just this I need like Something some other hints from Jeff or Nate or something on some other games that might be in here and then I'll be like, okay So yes, that might be the headline, but we're gonna talk about what's gonna be in it Or potentially in it rumor-wise. So we'll see in the bottom line. There'll be more rubors in August Anyways about stuff coming so I get just to get a clear answer So you I don't know if you've heard anything but like so I guess Nate the hate things prime force coming up by the end of the Fiscal year, right? He's a credible he said her. Yeah, right and the but Jeff Krabasan said no, but prime to Coming down this September direct depending on how you interpret that Maybe without three right like it would be weird Like what I don't think prime force coming up in the fiscal year. I think Nate was wrong Maybe Which it won't be the first time Nate Nate the hate is a very credible insider But he's been wrong on releases before so just kind of sit there. Everyone's wrong at one point or another. Yeah. Yeah, so Oh man, um Can I move on now? You got more you want to say there's a rabbit hole, but I'll save it for later Okay So we do have more to go along with this because This next part was one that it it sounded like he was always gonna maybe bring up this Metroid thing because like he seems pretty solid on it but the next thing was something that He even will on his show for a moment was like, I don't know if I should really say this Okay, one of those that like I and I think it's some trepidation because of the wind waker in Twilight Princess HD it's totally because it's like it's Zelda and last time he did something Zelda Really bit him in the ass because he didn't have double sourcing on it And he you know, he didn't do what he usually does because the one source he had he was just that confident in but this time around If we're to believe what Jeff Rudd said in the past that he wouldn't bring up stuff without double sources Then he should technically have double sources on this but the problem is That what he said is very very very open to a lot of possibilities And it's because he doesn't know he literally was just conveying and his own words. He said this is exactly what I was told So do what you want with it basically he did say I don't know what it means And I'm gonna say this but if you guys spin it out of out of context and things like that That's on you not on me. Yeah, like this is what I'm hearing. I cannot be in a confirm it He just said exactly what he was told blow it up, but but he but the funny thing is immediately after they started blowing it up so like what We gotta get to what he said. I think it's really unfair that they should be able to talk like they're people, you know Yeah, like what what was what he said was essentially and again paraphrasing a bit Something Zelda is happening later this year that is not related to tears of the kingdom he doesn't know what it is and They speculated on possible games and then that's when Mike reality brought up the whole wind waker thing He didn't want to go down that rabbit hole maker after last year but He doesn't know what it is. There's not a guarantee it could be a game We've seen people, you know, I use game in my headline But obviously when you get the full context it might not be a game It could be a spin-off. It could be a remaster. It could be a new Zelda game for all We know what Gresel is making for movie announcement could be a movie announcement, right? You know, and at first the trading card game. I said, oh for a moment I'm like, oh, it could be this all the Lego, but then I realized as all the Lego that leaked Had one of the things you could build was the Deku tree from Breath of the Wild Which is also in tears of the kingdom So then if it really has nothing to do with tears of the kingdom Then it really couldn't be that Lego set so that it could be a different Lego set By the way, it has nothing to do with it. That's possible that hasn't leaked but Because we know the Lego sets happening at some point. It's probably next year But who knows it could be that they want to give us a tease of what's coming after Donkey Kong at the At the whole theme park and then Zelda's gonna be next and maybe they want to tease Hey, while we're working on DK's Zelda's next on the roadmap. Yeah, there could be a lot of things that it could be That's the thing. It's so vague and he told to make sure he has no idea What it is But we're gonna get some and and he said if it in either it's a game He's not promising the game will come out this year But it could be an out he his own word is that if it's a game it could be announced this year Let me ask you a question This is this is a full overhype mode. Yeah, well full full We're even get overhyped right after everyone is like, oh don't run with it Also, we're running with it right now Oh, I mean full overhype mode like I'm not a kid. I mean full overhype mode, but there's some Very little it's very little but but there's a little vestige of logic very little but What if there is no tears of the kingdom DLC? I Literally said that after I beat the game. I was gonna bring it up next week But I don't think there's gonna be DLC. Well, I I might just we'll talk about that next week We're pushing it okay, that's next week. Yeah, but I Will concede that it's up in the air. We don't know right? Yeah So what it's so what if they do go in this direction of those tears of the kingdom DLC What then it does open the door for something more significant of Zelda to come out Next year and to be announced in a September direct and this is where the overhype comes in I'm not talking about I'm not talking about a twilight princess when wicker HD or I know it's too obvious Yeah, I'm not talking about that. I'm not even talking about what would be a very exciting Top-down say that I say top-down for you Zelda game like that would be amazing. I'm not even saying that I'm saying in The spirit of hyping up the new hardware Have something to showcase that hardware Ocarina of time remake For the new hardware exclusive Overhype the one that requires that they announce the new hardware first. Yeah, it does it does but I will say if you I They could show it without having like the switch logo in front Obviously, we don't know until next year, but could be you know it also like I Through this idea out for my video like I didn't I didn't mention to remake it in that video because I think it would come out a few years from now if it were to happen, but What if we get a tech demo? What if they do announce a new hardware this year and they showcase an awesome Zelda tech demo as they tend to do? Yeah, that is one possibility We didn't bring up that it could just be something like a tech demo that's never really gonna come out But it's just hey, we want to show what this thing can do like they did with Wii U Yeah, although I feel like modern Nintendo if they show something for the system It's cuz it's actually gonna happen. Yeah, I mean they didn't they didn't do that with switch Well, no, did they have a demo there weren't there wasn't a switch tech demo I don't think there was a switch. It was the tea. It was there was a switch Announcement trailer where there were several games that people said were fake And I was like no you're an idiot and they were wrong and all those games in the trailer like the Mario Or the Skyrim, yeah Skyrim, that's not real like the NBA 2k Skyrim's on everything. Okay, man That was people being like Nintendo doesn't get third party. I'm like yeah for the record. I know when I don't think anyone's an idiot per se It's just kind of like I just draw strongly disagreed with that You know when the actual brands are not only being shown with the logos. I mean come on Yeah Yeah, like this isn't EA unprecedented partnership, but no games are actually announced This was like they showed actual games that exist. So anyways, yeah But point is there wasn't that actually a tech demo. No, there wasn't and maybe they're done with that Maybe they're not gonna do tech demos anymore. I mean, what do you think about? We Think about how many games they just sit on they don't have to have tech demos. They can just show games But I do think they like to have And again, we're in a one-generation sample with switch But some sort of showcase their party game Some sort of game that you want to expect Nintendo to have Starfield but now they can I won't be star that would that would be cool I think it's gonna end up being Star Wars outlaws actually from Ubisoft, but okay They always like to have like one big Ubisoft thing early on in this Nintendo systems life cycle so Also the studio that what that made the Mario plus rabbits and has only worked on switch over the last seven years Just got added to the outlaws Development team. So there's some hints potentially that a team that's literally only been working with Nintendo for seven years Might have been added because they're gonna be important or they might have been added because they were pissed off. Oh, yeah I mean, there's the whole Yeah, yeah, that's what it is. They're not gonna make it anymore But the point is it is a team that has a ton of experience with Nintendo's hardware It's their most experience Nintendo hardware team There's that and there's also a mention on their website that where it has It's all it's coming to PlayStation 5 Xbox series PC and more and nobody knows what the more is yet Because there are two third-party games. I haven't played that I've been wanting to pull They're not my safe third-party being not Nintendo. I haven't played resting for remake yet. I haven't played Elden Ring yet I really want those games to come to switch to They're really popular games. They are the kind of games that would sell well the fact that we got Was that one or two of the Dark Souls games makes me feel like yeah Dark Souls remastered I feel like we can get Elden Ring on the next hardware. It's totally multi-plat. There's no exclusivity contracts and play Like I I feel like that would be a and actually Every single resident evil game, but resident for remake is on switch to some capacity most of them are cloud so it's Kind of like okay, but you know I the point is that Capcom does want resident evil on switch So if res it switch to can run resume for remake I think that's a it's there's a good chance. They will want to get both those There's obviously different studios right from software Capcom, but if they were I think both would be interested in Maybe and at least entertaining the idea of getting those over Obviously, I'm bringing those up because I'm biased for them, but they're also really big games. They're really big games I think would be in the conversation so Yeah, those would be hype. Yeah, so again, like I think there'll be some sort of sugar Maybe Elden Ring is a showcase it beats me But there'll be some sort of showcase game when they were real it the thing is I don't know if it's been revealed this year, but it getting to your point like in our creative time remake It would be pretty hype for some people Um I mean look it's an it's an it's an old-timer, right? It's an old-time classic This is where like I just don't I don't know I don't think that's what it's gonna be obviously and I don't feel you realistically think this was gonna be It's more of like a hey, let's get crazy. That's overhyped crazy. It's overhyped crazy. Yeah Look, I I don't know what this Zelda thing is gonna be there. There's so many possibilities I mean the movie is one that many people like feel like is this big obvious thing and I want to remind people that there is a writer strike going on at the moment There's also an actor strike and that includes All those big name actors. They can't do voice acting roles either So I'm kind of like I don't know that we're gonna hear anything for a while about a movie It's gonna be a bit Now they could already have a script done That's possible And I don't know how any of this affects animators and all that because they're not part of those those unions But they could still announce the intent to make the movie because it was it was alive before they show anything on the movie For mario like they announced. Hey, we're making a mario movie Well, in a year from now, we'll announce the actors and then another year from now will give you a trailer, right? Yeah, but now that but now they don't control the timing of when people are available to actually make the movie It's kind of what I'm saying like yeah, they don't they don't have so maybe they want to handle like control And I just feel like they don't have control right now. Sure. No, no, I think that's that's reasonable That's my only reason guys by the way that I doubt on a Zelda movies Just it's more so the writer strike and also I do think they want want big name actors for it as well and I just don't think This just isn't the right time to announce especially It's a little tone-deaf to what's going on to suddenly announce a new movie Right can't even market it with anyone. It's just Probably further out. But you know, you never know, right? We don't know how lined up things may or may not have been right. So I think it's worth Throwing out. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not yeah. I'm not saying it's not worth considering I just think I mean the writers aren't even going on like two three months I just don't see a way that unless it somehow ends before then That they will announce it Might end before then we don't know Hollywood can only be shut down for so long before People just care about not making any money. Let's know if I think there's a lot of options, right? You have the movie you have Um You have a remake you have twilight princess one waker hd You have a top down zelda. Like those are all options Yep of those what what's the most likely? rezzo A rezzo zelda, right? That's what feels the most likely to me because they they They haven't done anything or released anything or haven't released much since links awakening back in 2019 So they've been a few years I doubt it still they will they remade octree time 3d. They remade They made majority Well, yeah, that was for 3ds. This would be for a switch too. So more there would be more power there Um, there you go. They they did twilight prince. They also be the biggest project rezzels. No, no, twilight. I'm sorry. That's wrong That's wrong twilight princess with tantalus. Yeah, yeah What are they? Oh, they did links. Well, they didn't links awaken. Well, the point is is is it when you look at rezzo's history of development They've had their hands in a lot of zeal the stuff for quite some time and yet we haven't had anything from them now in quite some time So it kind of makes sense that if there's something zeal it could be something they worked on and this is where my last hope comes in That they're making a top-down original zeal the game Has made one they have made one It wasn't well received But I don't know that it was their fault because it was still directed by someone at nintendo That's where they made triforce heroes that was entirely made by grezzo Under the under direction of a director from the zeal the team And so it might not even been their idea that it'd be a multiplayer zeal, but that's what they did and You can argue sense then by the way. I like triforce heroes. I understand you want to get sales That's probably not the way to go They did do links awakening was very well received sold just as well as the original Maybe it's time they let grezzo make an original Zelda game you want traditional zelda grezzo understands traditional zelda I'm just saying I know Hey, you listen to edgy on numo. We ain't going backwards. Well, maybe you're not but grezzo. Maybe I don't know We'll see Actually happen by the way, I think chances are it's another remake of something if if if they announce a grezzo game, but It's fun to dream like you're dreaming of oh hype. Hey, I'm like dude. Give me new zelda. Don't give me old again I'm also not the biggest acronym of time fans. So that plays a little bit of I'm also talking about a big big big big boy remake, right? I know you're talking about a big boy remake. I'm talking about a visual showcase to show off the power of the hardware, right? But I I think you are warming up You're warming up to the idea of a top town zelda getting announced like I'm just trying to think about like what's the most I just think it's more like going to be a remaster What are they remastering though or cool seasons or cool of ages? Those are coming out on anso like they're they're not even out yet Like why would it links awakenings on anso too? What's your point? Yeah, but the timing of it the timing of what why would you put out the Because putting them on anso isn't going to make them any more money Do you under but And these aren't coming out now. They wouldn't be coming out now. They'll be like sometime next year Just saying They could do the minish cap. They could do a link up look the past you take your pick a top town zelda they could do it like between worlds Every 3ds games over You tell them one stuff one that It's not that I don't think that they can't have something on anso and then eventually remake it I just think that the timing of it It's too close for it to really be like I just don't think they would do that I also don't think nso games have ever determined what they're releasing They just have a completely different team that ports that stuff over it is curious that mario rpg is not on anso But they're they're doing the remake now Sure, but they've also never re-released mario rpg Even on prior virtual consoles. There's something I don't know if it's a licensing thing I don't know there's something going on with that. Um, and maybe Maybe it's a music thing. Maybe there's some music licensing that they don't know It's hard to know because like why haven't we ever gotten mother 3? Is it licensing? Is it this? Is it the themes? I don't know because they re-released it in japan As much as I would love to see oracle of ages and seasons. Um getting a get remakes I just don't think they're gonna announce those like when we already we currently have like Minish cap I could maybe see because that's been available for a little bit already Like that that's kind of my perspective on it I could do I mean, I don't want them to but they could do zelda 2 Yo, actually That would be really cool. I don't want them to because they're gonna ruin what makes it great to me But it's okay. Let me throw another dumb idea at you Sure, what if they were to reimagine zelda 2 as a souls like game. All right. I'm I'm done They outsource zelda 2 to be made by from software that would be actually really Oh That would be they're not gonna you're not gonna let from why not i'm the tender outsources things Um, you know, okay, so this would be put it like kind of like spin-off territory From software just we'll just make our own game and make more money. No, no We don't want to share money. You don't want to share money with you that But You go from a 30 cut to an 80 cut goes to nintendo like they're not gonna be cool with that They might be a hundred percent cut and they're just paid upfront Like I don't think they're gonna be cool with that They just dropped elden ring and it's sold incredible for them the best selling game from them ever They're they're too big of a studio. Yeah, they're a little too big. I think they're too big to be well And you can say well, what about margith? Let's grab some cats a spin-off Well, we'll be stopped as a billion studios Well, that's what zelda 2 would be a spin-off But like a reimagining of that, you know, but tell the two is not a spin-off game No, this would be a like it would this wouldn't be the normal series Oh, so are you saying it's gonna be like final fantasy 7 remake style? Yeah, like it would be I'm thinking it's a remake, but then it's actually not a remake No It would just be like a separate thing this wouldn't be it's not it's not being made by the mainline zelda team It would be a different style of gameplay like Yeah, that obviously this is just a random idea, right? But I know Well, that's why I mentioned final fantasy 7 remake because it doesn't actually replace final fantasy 7 Well, right It's literally like it's that's that's what I mean. It wouldn't be replacing mainline zelda. It would just be like a really cool side project Whatever you want to call that. I mean sure. Yeah, that's not gonna happen No, I agree. It's not gonna happen. It's just yeah over. I'm just gonna work on whatever elden ring 2 or whatever Yeah, yeah, no, you're right. You're right, but I mean the potential It's like what dreamed what developer besides nintendo Would you like to touch zeal everyone's gonna say from software? Yeah um I got one kind of in a similar vein They reimagine the original zelda in the breath of the wild engine It's kind of yeah, that would be cool. It'd be smaller, but that's okay. It can be smaller I also make it a $40 game. I'd be all in on a top town zelda that uses that prototype Engine that they had that they used to experiment for breath of the wild Oh, yeah The 8-bit engine they went with Just to test ideas Whatever I mentioned spin-off. What if we just get a zelda spin-off? There are mario spin-offs left and right given how big zelda has become We should be getting spin-offs for zelda. Remember links crossbow training. We do get spin-offs We don't get enough cadence of high rule We can get Sure calamity some argues a spin-off It is trying to it's it's it's It may nine it technically might be cannons Well, then it wouldn't really but then again the tingle games are also canon, but they're spin-offs. So like sure Yeah spin-offs can still be canon it basically but you've listed off several spin-offs like why what if that's like We're talking about all these things that don't seem to really make sense because it feels too soon after cheers the kingdom Maybe what makes the most sense is a spin-off Yeah, we've had several already on switch. Why can't we get another one? And and what's crazy is like we have no idea what that could be. I'm a warriors, too Not that What Do you know they want to make another one because age of calamity is the best-selling warriors game in history? That's too It's too Okay, that's 2019 to say it's been long enough. I will tell you this I'm talking about in relation to tears is the kingdom timing. That's where I feel like it's weird Not but this is how real warriors to not this isn't an age of calamity style spin-off because remember it's not related to tears of the kingdom Oh, okay. Okay. Well, all right. That's why I said a high real warriors to not And that's why and in that case I do disagree. I don't think that's happening I think if they're gonna do another like warriors game It would be Based off Zelda would be to kind of follow up the cheers the kingdom story But I do think there's a lot more they can do with the characters, especially in the past Um and if there's any war This is how it could not be related to tears of the kingdom What if it is an age of calamity sequel game? But it just continues the new timeline it created that isn't even part of Breath of the Loud tears of the kingdom It just continues that timeline Where the champions are alive I see That that I just realized how the game actually ends Can lend itself to actually having another game and have it not be tears of the kingdom related because It that the champions are alive. That didn't happen. So I also can see myself not buying that What if well, what yeah, because I was gonna say what if they're bringing tears of kingdom elements, but then that's I Well, okay, maybe we're being too tight with that tears of the kingdom related Maybe tears of the kingdom related just means tears of the kingdom DLC, right like not that but he didn't specify. He said I told you exactly what I heard Right. Well point is that's the thing. We don't know what the person who said what they meant Yeah, there's there's room for interpretation because the person probably knows they just don't want him the nose They don't want to get out. I'm gonna tell you what I think it is I think it's either a top-down Zelda, which I feel like it might be too soon to announce that Or a zelda spinoff And I got one for a zelda spinoff You could do a mario party-esque, but zelda related and have like your Bomb chew bowling your zelda crossbow training for like your mini games and stuff like that I mean I you know, I I keep going with this whole thing What what is one original thing like oh, oh, oh, I got a dungeon maker and links awakening to add to that in We get a full dungeon maker zelda makers. I'm sorry. Listen. I got I figured out what it is. Yeah, you ready? Okay, oh boy. All right, so this is me shouting myself out So tomorrow there will be a video coming out That is my predictions for the final eight tracks in mario kart 8 deluxe's booster course pass If you don't see where i'm going here, i'm gonna tell you one of my predictions is a tears of the kingdom related But not tears of the kingdom itself track So that would be zelda and not tears of the kingdom mario wonder related That's my guess For what for one of the tracks one of the tracks Yep, there's gonna be a The data mine suggests maybe three new ones, but that's kind of weird because yeah the data mine hasn't been 100% But it's pretty close. I've been kind of hopeful for like a like a mario odyssey related Yeah I'm just saying though I do think maybe they could slide in one more zelda track and if it's but based off tears of the kingdom So because maybe that could be the it would be zelda content, but not actually four tears of the kingdom So maybe that's what it could be Yeah, yeah, um and and just just thought about that obviously uh geronal Ainsworth earlier with the ten dollar super chat We'll say they hope it's twilight princess, which I totally get a lot of people want to see twilight princess and windmaker like those are When you think of obvious those are the obvious easy Probably already done somewhere just sitting on it waiting. Yeah, obviously they could do that Twin packs come out in the same year as tears of the kingdom though I don't think it really matters because I don't think the audience is the same And I think scabber sort of gene links are making me and all that's approved and you might go Huh, huh, huh, huh, huh, really? Uh, yeah, because the audience I bought breast of one tears of kingdom didn't buy twilight princess back in the day Well, you know, I'll give you this. I think nintendo can put those out at any point and sell like a quick five million Yeah So I think it's almost like the ceiling That's fine. I don't I don't know what the ceiling is But it's definitely it's definitely lower than tears of the kingdom. I'll give you that um But uh 10 million three days. I don't know. I don't know. Um, but I do it does kind of feel like hey Like I could see nintendo just like kind of they're kind of keeping it They're like just kind of thinking about their financials and like oh We need to hit this, um Forecast So let's let's let's push these out That'll that I'll sell five more million in software before the end of the of the quarter So I could see them pushing that And again, maybe I don't know the fiscal year And I'll just bring up jeff grubb's own words. I know this was just part of his speculation It could just be an announcement. It doesn't necessarily need to be this year Yeah, so it could just be if there's not going to be tears of the kingdom dlc Let's hype you for something else because everyone's expecting while everyone's disappointed last right, don't you fine You know what let's stop disappointing you there won't be tears of the kingdom dlc But we have a new Zelda thing that is coming next year and let's just tease that So that that that could be how they get people to stop freaking out about tears of the kingdom dlc But who knows again that also is on the little presumption. There isn't any and even though we'll have that discussion next week I still obviously see ways that there can be dlc, but Well, we'll we'll get into that next week One thing that did come up to taker 610 mentioned Um, which I thought was interesting. What's the last thing grezzo put up because we talked a lot about grezzo Meetopia. So meetopia is the last thing that they have had released But they're working on jet dragon for ios and macOS Hasn't come out yet. So it's just a mobile game. So yeah, they're last like bigger games where basically links awakening in 2019 and meetopia in 2021 so Chances are they're working on something So and and you and you kind of look at their past right like they did Um, we know about acumen time 3d. Uh, they also People forget about this they did the dsi wear version of the four sword anniversary edition Uh, they've also done major's mass 3d Then they did try four serials and then they didn't like awakening. So like it's they've had years Well, they've had multiple games come out in the same year. Yes, and they haven't had anything I mean they meetopia in 2021 and then they got that that that uh mobile game, right? So they've been A little quiet actually in comparison to prior years Uh, but main point is because I remember when the dragon thing came to light. Um, just sorry to No, you're good. You're good. I just remember a lot of people were saying, oh, I guess me Grezzo's not making anything the jet dragon thing really doesn't That's not their whole team. It doesn't de-confirm anything. Just like 2015 legend of legacy I don't even know what that is major's mass 3d and legend of the triforce heroes all in the same year from Grezzo 2017 the alliance alive and ever oasis That's the same year 2018 the lead he's mentioned 2019 links awakening remake like back. That's that's too back to back crazy things Um, two years later meetopia like they yeah, if this is just a mobile game like there's no way That's the only thing they're working on that they could totally have something ready for next year Yep, I mean it can be ready this year who the heck knows so like it's just one of those things They're they're they're doing something. They do have I think they have like two teams I believe last I actually looked at them. I haven't done room a bit Um, but I last I checked they had two two separate development teams So they're they're they're working on something chances are based on their history It's probably something with nintendo and when they do nintendo It's been mostly zelda with a little mix of a couple other things like meetopia and like street pass garden Uh stuff like that, but it's been mostly zelda that they worked on So they've had a team there that's done a ton of zelda basically and then so the question is And and I doubt I doubt links awakening lost the money I think they were probably maybe they hoped it would sell more or less We don't know nintendo never acted disappointed with the sales But it's all about the same as the original release. We're back on game boy cool Maybe they have them working on something else We'll see like if it's not this year. We'll probably see next year. I don't know This has been rumored for a long time my back when we were talking 35th anniversary stuff If you remember there were talks about grezzo and like are they doing oracle games? Are they doing this? Are they doing that because it's like It makes sense that they would be doing something And here we still are and we still don't really know what they're doing. So I don't think they were I mean, I don't know what they're what they were hoping to sell But I feel like six million the links will make any quick any remake is pretty good I understand that the initial one sold well too, but I don't know what they would have been expecting for for a top-down remake like that six plus millions are really strong number so I I feel like they would not be disappointed with that. But yeah, I don't think they're disappointed and it's top down It's talking about the same appeal. I mean they they were to announce a non remake top-down zelda. It could sell above six million so That's really good A non remake top-down zelda. I hope Yeah, I knew it's a new top-down zelda. Well, I don't know if a new top-down zelda would I'm going to be honest because links awakening was new to most of the people that bought it That's why they just called it links awakening because it's been so long since links awakening came out If it was a new top-down zelda, it would be bigger Um, they could have a more a hype marketing cycle. I think I mean imagine if they marketed Pretty hype marketing cycle for links awakening You could argue it was better than tears of the kingdom's marketing cycle. It's just people are more excited for Tuesday. I'm sure Tell me this If they marketed a new top-down zelda That was looks beautiful. You know, it's clearly got the budget for what it what it would that style of game would be Um, they marketed it similar to the way nintendo marketed metroid dread Sure, do you not think it would sell six plus million? Like assume like assume this top-down zelda uses like kind of like those breaths of the wild 2d zelda prototype mechanics that they had right and they play it's obviously it has like that 3d engine that's links awakening I would say that it's sealing is what links awakening sold And i'm saying that because I don't think it appeals at all to people who play breath of the wild And tears of the kingdom it's only appealing to old school zelda fans And we already know that's like four or five six million people I think um breath of the wild inches the kingdom have opened up More people to give zelda other zelda games to try so how how'd skyward sword hd do for you? Did okay Did not sell very well Like i'm just being honest like for a 3d zelda game It didn't sell well the first time around didn't do really anybody second time I also think that skyward sword hd was not after they had a high value It was not a high value proposition. I think they were really um Trying to like there was a lot of that game got a lot of flak 60 dollar game for what was essentially an upscale at 60 frames per second No, I want to be clear because I see this being talked about in the chat Uh, this doesn't mean that it wouldn't be worth releasing guys We're not saying that like oh if it's with the ceiling six million, they're not going to release Yeah, the budgets are different. These are different right different stratosphere They wouldn't be expecting tears of the kingdom I just as a person who's been covering zelda all this time It's never mattered how much a system has sold traditional zelda has a cap on ohai itself If it didn't we want to need a breath of the wild and tears of the kingdom So when we're talking about a traditional top-down zelda game and the top-downs have always sold worse There's a cap Close to four million it's at 3.91. Yeah, that's good But obviously it's not You know, that's that's a little disappointing. I Scourge sword is also the worst selling 3ds all the game of all time I I I guess what I'm trying to argue is I think they may have sold poorly for different reasons Um, or maybe not maybe maybe it's all tied in I I feel I mean, I think we agree scoured sword came out too late on the week Oh, yeah came out too late and then the I don't think I want to save we Those taking me doomed those two things ruin the sales right like coming out way too late motion controls I even know they were good. They were devised our sword needed to be like a 2009 game Yeah, something like that. I would have probably did a lot better totally. Um But then in the case of scoured sword hd. They do have traditional controls in there Sure So I don't think people I think a lot in fact I remember a conversation being that a lot of people who were turned off by the motion controls We're willing to give it a try now because of that. So that should then it didn't really happen Well, I mean I played with traditional controls and I enjoy a lot more I think most people played it with traditional controls, but like when we're talking tradition, they're still not traditional It doesn't control like here's the kingdom. I'm not traditional Zelda controls. Yeah It's an alteration of yeah, yeah non motion control non motion controls But like the thing is and I've played it that way too. Yeah It's a little clunky compared to just playing a normal game that's built for a controller Just a little bit clunky a little bit Too much moving that that right stick when people are used to just using that for the camera I really enjoy the game. I thought I love skyward sword It's like in my I think it's in my top eight Zelda games of all time. I have to double I have to go redo my list You'll hold an entire steam the knock real time you monster. Oh, yeah I mean, that's okay. I think it's fair to have to if I think I think It's got three dungeons I like better than the ones that are coming of time and I've got the best story in zelda. So I don't know we're And I love the motion controls the motion controls are actually a plus for me Also skyward sword hat was a somewhat challenging Zelda game. Yes, and I like challenge. Yeah skyward sword hiring really did did a lot of things that I think were great for the series Because win maker and twilight princess while we do kind of seem to hold those in higher esteem now Sword felt like a game built for me by the way I don't know people like you love I'm like for what I want dude You go to the overworld once you get below the clouds It's literally like a dungeon from beginning to end like you love dungeon crawlers, baby. That's that's all this game is It's a not a dungeon crawler. Yeah the whole game's a dungeon like for you guys complaining about dungeons In breath of the wild and tears of the kingdom go play skyward sword. It's literally just one long dungeon You know, it would be crazy You know, it would be crazy if maybe like after breath of the wild they thought Huh, maybe we should have more of a dungeon focus in tears of the kingdom And then skyward sword came out and performed as it did and they're like, oh, I guess People don't dungeons aren't really what cell games. Okay. Got it. Yeah But you know, but the reason why I think skyward sword didn't sell as well Um has nothing to do with the dungeons. I think it has to do Um, well the motion control thing and to your point like even it's it's argue It's more clunky than a normal control setup. I give you that Yeah, it's fine for me, but I understand where you're coming from. I mean the whole camera thing I like having the camera, but the fact it is weird Um, but I think when you come off trying to reach a new audience of a breath of the wild and they have full camera Control or something like nope now it's sort of control It's it's weird. It's weird. I'll give you that but I think the other problem is that It wasn't a high value proposition Uh, I think they tried to sell out the name of zelda alone and that hurt it because it was just an upscale It was one of those games that just by upscaling it looks really good because skyward sword has a very ageless art style but They didn't enhance it visually that much the 60 frames are great, but that was you know Something that not most people tend to care for Um, like when I say most I mean like not the core game where I'm talking about like hey That's like two zelda games ever at 60 fps look out. I know I'm excited world in skyward sword I love that they added 60 frames per second for me that was big But I think I think it's one of those things it doesn't really It doesn't really help the sales that much as my point is my main point And so they see this game that's basically just a wee game With some minor enhancements that didn't have a lot that require a large budget for selling for a full 60 dollars There was a lot of conversation and negativity around that and I think that probably hurt sales I don't know by how much but I think it definitely hurts. See I look at it as a majority of sales I've nothing to do with what people say online I've always felt that way about it Yeah, like skyward sword was guess what skyward sword sold like shit I we meaning most people wonder we don't even know about this game back then It didn't even exist in their mind like it was I I think there's two things that the about about this game one Obviously the controls are just wonky no matter which way you play compared to traditional games and people aren't going to buy it because of that Uh, I also and this this feels weird to say but when you're watching the trailers And let's say your first Zelda game ever was Breath of the Wild and then they say oh Oh, there's a new there's a new like 3d Zelda game or whatever coming out. Let me watch this trailer and then you watch the link run that running animation Ain't good compared to Breath of the Wild. It just ain't good And so now you're looking at animations that look old The game feels dated before you even touch it and I just don't think it appeals Um, I don't think skyward sword. I mean, obviously I had a hard time appealing back in the day The biggest argument was always release timing release timing release timing. Okay. Well, you're in the heart of the switch You just came off the most popular Zelda ever links awakening did pretty well later in 2019 or earlier in 2019 So if links awakening could do pretty decent See what tears of the kingdom did I just think there's just not an appealing game from like do you just look at it and you go pass And I think that's the way a lot of people felt back on we and I think it's a lot of people feel that just like The general consumer the one that's gonna buy Breath of the Wild tears of kingdom after they see a trailer When they watch a trailer of that they go That doesn't look great I But literally I I thought about the song because like I love the game. I love the game But also you even just looking at the animations everything just looks dated. It doesn't look like a modern game Yeah, I'll also say that The boss fights not saying they weren't either weren't good boss fights, but I guess like I guess what's Breath of the Wild tears of the kingdom are a spectacle like that's gonna appeal to a large audience right skyward sword It doesn't have a lot of spectacle if that makes any sense, you know um Like the imprisoned while it is a giant boss fight It's also whack Like it's it's really wacky like it's got giant toes and you you pluck the toes like you don't pluck them You know what I mean like I'll say But you don't you wouldn't you wouldn't define the imprisoned boss fights that happened repeatedly in skyward sword as an epic boss battle, you know And then like there's ten talus which On paper sounds really cool, but when you see it, you're like that's just funny. It's straight out of monsters ink So and then I'm not gonna spoil the final boss fight for skyward sword That is one of the most epic boss fights in self-history, right? So there are there are some epic boss fights, but yeah The weird thing about this game is it's also one of those games where the mini bosses almost felt a bit more epic at times Especially because there's like a whole sword fighting mechanic the sword fighting mechanic I mean the gear heme fights were all pretty cool, but they could have featured that a bit more um And then and then obviously you have things like Gosh, you know the the pirate ship and like that that the mini boss fight. There's Just the pirate ship dungeon was let me even ten talus is great. It's just I wish it looked like a monster from monsters ink But I wish the design was different Um, I mean you're not wrong. Yeah, um We're we're kind of like we're really speaking ill of skyward sword. We're not I love skyward sword I'm just speaking to why why it just didn't we're talking about why other people didn't probably didn't like Skyward sword that much like not like that's why it's like I know people that bought Breath of the Wild in Tears of the kingdom that That's told when I asked them why they did by skyward sword age She's like, oh, I watched the trailer on it. It didn't look very good. I'm like Why it didn't look very good. I don't know I watched the trailer and I go, this is awesome But then I'm like I gotta remember They aren't zelda fans They are fans of Breath of the Wild in Tears of the Kingdom which by the way that does make you a zelda fan You're just a modern zelda fan that didn't grow up with the classic games And if you didn't grow up with the classic games You might look back at those and say they don't look very good Like you're like you talk about oh ocarina of time. Yeah, okay They can make the visuals whatever but they still might watch the trailer and go huh Nope And why I don't know I think I think that is a full visual Reimagining and redoing. I think that's obviously a very different thing obviously, but I'm like, you know, if they just HD You know ocarina of time 3d. They'll look like no that looks like garbage Right. I think that I think that I think it would need more work Yeah, that's why I say like final fantasy 7 remake that's still yeah, that might reach that might reach but In my ideal world I would want them to make Ocarina and I can't ocarina time remake more like a little bit of a reimagining Like maybe add a little bit more exploration factor to kind of appeal more to that breath of the wild Tears of the kingdom audience. Sure because I think that would probably increase sales Uh, significantly So, um, I do think though that if they were to like straight up remake ocarina time like visually like Like a primary mastered level of remake. Sure, right? Like I think it would do better than skyward sword probably I don't know by the way I by the way of all of all the 3d's all the games to bring over and port Skyward store was the worst selling 3ds all the game before And I think if you port all the 3ds all the games, it would be the worst selling of the ported 3ds all the games So it is one of those things that I don't think and I just don't think skyward stores that appealing But I also think others all the games like oh if they brought twilight princess Over and let's say they put some real work into it for the next generation system And it's in 4k and they actually make some texture changes and do some cool things Could it hit 10 million if that next system is also just as popular switch? Yeah, I think it could get a little bit of a 2 million boost from what it did back on we But I don't think that that's like groundbreaking You know, you're just kind of Hey, here's an old school style game that was appealing Why was it appealing what made it more appealing than anything else for some people it's just the art art direction that it went in Um, you know, I know that was a huge twilight. Twilight princess had spectacle. Oh, yeah It's practical. I would eat a very epic adventure. It's hard an epic adventure And it also went in an art direction. That's very appealing Like win waker is not a very appealing art style in comparison for the general populace guys general populace The non zelda aficionados Are more interested and think something that looks like dark souls and something that looks like Someone maker then you might go put breath away. I know again That was a new we have a new generation of zelda fans that started with switch and that's awesome, by the way I'm thrilled because I love the new styles of the games I'm good with this in the future But in terms of bringing the old ones back, you know, what ones could sell best what one could do this one Who really knows and we don't know what this zelda thing is going to be anyway, so I mean, I would say that the art style of breath a while is not that much Different than the skyward swords, right? It's almost like breath was art styles Almost like a fusion of skyward sword and twilight princess. Yeah. Yeah. It's like it's a happy medium. Yeah Eric, why didn't you buy skyward sword hg? I did. Oh, did you did you play it? No? Oh, there you go. I bought it. Well, hey, hey, you gave him money Yeah, so you're part of that almost warm milk, but why didn't you play it? Because that you beat breath of the wild. Yeah So so why wouldn't you want to play you're like an example of a more general consumer a new age Even though you have experienced the old zelda fans it might be because he's an adult and just didn't have time Yeah, that's mostly but you're still playing tears in the kingdom So I want to hear when you want to play you want to play You beat sparks. I hope they even 100 sparks. I hope yes Okay, so again, why why didn't you feel that drive us that I wanted to play more? Okay, so I well, I know I do Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. I I mean, I've seen it played So I've seen them all played Obviously in my play dabbled here and there way back in the day with the I think even that game Probably I mean at your house. We've played dull pretty much. I know so it's yeah, it's I don't know I I wanted it to do well But I don't know I just haven't had had the I had every attention to playing it Haven't had the motivation just haven't had the motivation and I've had other things that I wanted to play more since then so what why So what about like Say like sparks of hope or tears of the kingdom or the other games you wanted to play Appealed to you that skyward sort of did because you bought it with an intent But then it's not like you didn't play games. You just didn't really feel like playing in that game But there's got to be something so I'm sort of like you're more you're like I'm a hardcore zelda fan So I'm like, yeah, of course I played it. Yeah, I didn't beat it, but I also I don't usually read games I've already beaten a bunch before right I don't know I Died I honestly don't know I haven't played it So I guess I don't really know if it's the gameplay or anything like that Like I said, I've seen it played and I know I mean, here's the kingdom. You're gonna play that. Yeah I don't know I'm not gonna answer Well, I mean, I think I think it doesn't necessarily have to be an indictment on the game I think sometimes people just don't get around to games For whatever reason it could it might not be the games fault at all So Well, I mean you're you're you're correct in that. So like there's games I've bought that I have that I haven't touched or barely touched Um, but why well, it's because other games appeal to me more Well, then why do those games appeal to me more? I just I I don't always have an answer But I could say I've spent more time with Breath of the Wild tears of the kingdom and links awakening Let's just go with links awakening another Why did I play that one more than skyward sword hd? Well, because a new art style. Yeah new art style was really the big the that and the dungeon maker I probably felt more it probably felt more new to you than skyward sword. No, I didn't feel new Nothing about the just the base game felt new to me Even like kind of just moves and controls in the same way It was the dungeon maker was one of my big driving factors was like this is actually new content And skyward sort of didn't have new content Is that maybe maybe that's why they want to argue that dungeon maker was the different was a 2 million difference Um A 2.2 million difference could be round up could be Could be just sell the fans that always wanted one. They did advertise it. It was a selling point of the game They it was a remaster that had new content with the x button other in is I just press x for doubt Why do you don't think dungeon maker's appealing? No, I just don't think that's that that's a 2.2 million difference I don't think that's that's why that's I don't think that's that's a sole reason why links awakening remakes sold 50% more Than skyward sort I think it's a little mid Isn't what's a little bit i'm using i'm using all the memes. Um, you think the dungeon maker's mid I just don't Yeah, but you can think it's mid, but it copy i'm saying I don't I don't think that the dungeon maker Is why everyone want a why why? Two extra couple million want it. Yeah, I think it's a nice little piece Right and when I when I say mid, I just mean it's fine like I played it a little bit. It's fine You can you can mess around with that But I I think most people just want to play through the world and enjoy the adventure Um, do we have statistics on that? No, we don't we don't This is just going to be an opinion-based thing and we're not going to really get an answer out of Yeah on this again. Nintendo is the only one with the data. Yeah, so They may not even have the day I don't know how much they monitor like what parts of a game we play we play Well, they they have you can argue they have the data for every person who backs up to the cloud They have your save data they can literally but are they going to be able to like piece through that and like Considering they created it. Yes. I'm assuming they could if they want I'm not saying they do by the way I'm gonna say and they could If they want it and then people go invasion of privacy, dude, you put something on their cloud. What did you expect? Anyways, I do think that It being remade Visually, I think that adds a lot I think the extra dungeon maker con like those things together, right? Like I think that It links awakening remake Not as many people were complaining about the price tag as were as those were for skyward sword New concept will do that I'm uh, I know it's a visual overhaul. Yeah, but there was a My whole thing is there was a confidence with links awakening. That's why it doesn't have hd after it doesn't have remaster after it It's just this is links awakening For those of you that have played before we have new content dungeon maker They were just very confident with the game skyward. So the here's skyward sword hd They literally put hd into have a good day Is there anything new oh 60 fps Okay, it's 1080p different control styles. Yeah, we updated the control. Okay. What about content? No, no new content Or is an amiibo allows you to Shoot upwards That's enough war upwards. Yeah. Yeah, it's an ability to warp anywhere upwards. Yeah Yeah, makes the game a little easier. Yeah, it just it does make it easier, but it's not new content. It's not content It's just a breaking the game basically Which is fine. It's a more convenient way to break the game So you can get back and resupply because you always have to go to the same place to do that Um anyways, we can get to the merits of links. By the way, yeah I do think links awakening is a better game than skyward sword So like there's that as well, but that's also getting into someone who's played all the games and Get into personal opinions Blah blah blah Maybe more replayable I don't even care. Well, you know me. I don't count replayability as a factor. I Well, I didn't know that. Oh, I guess I don't Understand that replayability is not a factor But I have not taken though to consider That when you are thinking about the quality of the game You don't factor in how much time you're going to play it for or how many times you may go back to it Because I don't go back to it You might dabble, but you don't like yeah, I'll dabble if it's for a video Otherwise, I just don't go back to it like Breath of the Wild. Why did I ever replay it after I did almost everything? um Just for video purposes I get I get that If there wasn't for if there wasn't videos that would go back to Breath of the Wild for I would go back to it less often But I still personally would have gone I've gone back to I've tried replaying for the game multiple times And it's just fun playing it through the world Like whenever I have gone back be it for footage or for whatever reason I buy myself playing for longer than I should because it's just like a fun playground to explore and enjoy um The same can't be said for a lot of games period Yeah, so I I think I think that should be considered I think I think um the Breath of the Wild experience is actually pretty replayable And it was for me What was interesting is that when I decided to do the master mode run um leading up to tears of the kingdom And so I played through the game and I was made a concert effort to play from beginning to end That was really cool Like I got to re-experience the game from beginning to end again. And it was fun. Um, it was very replayable It was I I think that that that experience to me Kind of cemented Breath of the Wild is my favorite game of all time. Um Now tears of the kingdom is like it's kind of a weird It's a whole other conversation to kind of muddies the waters a little bit Because tears of the kingdom almost feels like just more Breath of the Wild but um I I I think I think replayability totally matters like sure think about how much you may play Mario Kart Smash Brothers For example, the more you want to play those games I don't think I think that And again, it's your opinion. It's your opinion. This is my opinion. Like, yeah, like your opinion is wrong I know that replayability matters a lot for you like you talk about how we talk We used to joke how many times you're beating Metroid Prime remaster when it came out Replayability I know is a huge factor for a lot of you guys out there I feel weird. I'm one of the only people that that that I shouldn't say the only people I know they've had people in the maybe in this very chat Agree with me that like you just don't really replay games. So replayability doesn't really matter Yeah, no, I understand that if that's something not something you do it just not as valuable well because I it's not even something I really do I like Skyward Sword hg came out. Yeah, I dabbled in it for like an hour to mess with the new controls and that was it At least awakening I dabbled for for a bit longer than that because there was new content that didn't exist in prior game with the dungeon maker When it came out of a Metroid primary master Because he could beat that I did beat I did beat Metroid primary master. You didn't think you would No, here's the thing. I did I did it just because I told you I would no I did it because I told you I would That was it. That was the only reason so you're committed for me Yeah, I like I couldn't say that I was gonna do something then just not do it So I'm like I'll do it if it wasn't because of me I would have now I if it wasn't because of you I might not even bought the game Just to be honest I want to save the money. I am an influencer. I have influenced you influence me to buy the game Yes, right. They've made at least 40 dollars because of me I mean, I'm just being honest It is not because like of much like am I gonna pick up Metroid Prime 2 if that one comes up I don't know. I don't really have any desire to replay the game at all Well, I'll just restart at some point in the podcast Get me to commit and make the purchase of some probably he'll probably talk me into it I have not beaten Metroid Prime 2 Well, see that's the motivation for you then though. Yeah, what happens is that it's kind of hard It is hard It is hard. I've only beat it once I've got I got I've gone to the near the end a couple times, but what always throws me off are the You have to get like these keys. Yep, and they're they're kind of hard to find. Yeah Yeah, I think I think I'm prime one. I only got through because it tells you where they are I walked through. I didn't walk through that section. So I don't do walkthroughs often, but I did walk through that section I'll probably prime to this time. It's just because I only again I only play through the game once and I knew if I didn't beat it then I was never going to beat it So I mean, yeah, I just get the water screw it. I'm this close. Let's just go Um, well, I didn't realize it was this close until I looked at the water and then I was like, oh, I have this close Well, then yeah, we're gonna finish this off Um, but by the way I don't hold against anyone who uses watt throughs. I want to be clear Some some people look down on people who use watt throughs Dude play the games you want you know, I don't look down on others that walkthroughs need to exist for a reason I use someone else you you want it you need to walk through use a lot through if it Doesn't lessen the gameplay experience for you and it just actually makes you progress more and makes you happier Go for it. It's a lot better than getting super frustrated And quitting and never coming back the only person I look down on for using walkthroughs as myself Yeah, yeah personal judgments fine. Yeah personal judgments fine Um, but yeah, no for me that with the replaying game thing. It's always just been one of those um One of those things that a huge driving force and I don't talk about it a lot with my with me playing games Is Not knowing what's coming next whether it's story or gameplay not knowing what's coming next and The thing is once I know I don't have that desire to really play anymore um, and that's The the fun part right now with tears of the kingdom is one of the big driving forces remove the story So I kept putting the story. I'll keep on the story. I've now got to do this review thing this weekend So I'm like, okay, cool. So I beat the story Oh my my drive to play tears of the kingdom has gone down a bit since I know how it ends but The thing it's still making me play Is that there are things I was doing along the way to the end Other side quests and other story things that I didn't experience that I'm like no no no no I still need to go back in because there's still things I haven't done There's like things to discover but now great This is an open world game and there's a lot more to do in it. So it's not the main quest is not the only thing Uh, so it's a bit different than some other games where it's kind of like the point is to get to the end And there isn't a whole lot necessarily outside of that Uh, but for me I probably only see myself maybe dropping another Maybe 10 hours in tears of the kingdom before I probably just put it on the shelf and don't and don't touch it again outside of like Some random stream when someone's like you should play tears of the kingdom. I'm like, okay, cool. All right. Let's build a bear Let's build a bear Like and that's the thing like you might go but tears of the kingdom is really unlimited thing You can do all these imaginative things with the building and I'm here to tell you right now I don't have an imagination anymore I thought I did And I thought I was so proud of the weird contraptions I built in tears And then you looked on twitter then I looked on twitter right and I realized I I'm not an engineer I am not I don't have imagined the Maybe when I was younger I would have came up with these ideas now I don't and you're like well, don't you want to don't you want to try and I'm like look I watched a tutorial on how to build this really complicated thing And after I realized that I was following this tutorial and running around in the game for 90 minutes And I still only had about a third of the materials I needed to pull it off I realized I ain't got the patience To make these really cool mega contraptions Either so I'm just going to leave that to the people that want to do that It's not entertaining to me to waste my time just to build something that really Don't really need It's just cool. It doesn't There's other ways to do do what that thing does like when you build some of these mega mechs It's like yeah, that's cool. But like I could also just Do a billion other ways to do accomplish what I'm doing Yeah, but that's just me. I've always been I've known for a long time You're someone that really values replay value a lot because you've talked about games that you replay And if you'll notice A lot of times when we go like yeah on this podcast really what have you been playing lately? Very rarely am I mentioning something that hasn't come out recently Because that's that's what I that's what I play. So yeah for me Um I mean there's a lot of games that I'll only play once there's a lot of movies I'll only watch once there's a lot of shows only watch once right books indictment if you don't rewatch Not necessarily. Um, but I also think that if it's something um I think if it's something that For me personally when I just be thinking about it every game Uh that I would put in my or even anime right like I'm a big I'm I admitted to anime. I meant to video games I meant to movies too. Um I would say that my my favorite video games my favorite anime my favorite movies I have played or watched more than once Um, it's fair and and for me, you know, maybe you don't want to do it back to back, right? Maybe wait a few years right, but it's It's fun to go back. Um, I prefer reliving those experiences More than engaging in a new experience that I think will add less if that makes any sense No, that makes a lot of sense. I mean, I mean, this is it's well documented that going back and watching movies You will discover more the second time. I think the same applies for all forms of media. You will discover more There is more to everything right? There's always Another layer that we can dig on anything. I mean if you're a zelophearest You can keep peeling those layers forever if you want to Right like it's kind of so Yeah, I mean me thinking about like the Metroid games. Um, by the way, um, I think it was king frost was making a joke No, I think I was thinking about the only Metroid game that I think I have not beaten Is Metroid Prime 2 echoes I've been every other Metroid game at least once. Yep. Metroid one while I've beaten It's actually I didn't I've only I've dabbled the Metroid 2 like the Game Boy version But if you count Samur's Returns, which is a remake of it, then I've beaten that I just realized I technically never beat the final boss in Metroid Dread What is hard with me? What's wrong? I know I fought it, but I didn't beat it I beat Dread 3 times. I clicked in my head and now it's like, okay. I'll go beat it But that's not replaying because I haven't beat him yet. You're right. Oh, that makes sense. Yeah, but so Before Pikmin 4 comes up gold tomorrow beat that boss Dread's like designed to be replayed because they they literally programmed in sequence breaking There it has a you know, there's a completion rating is also a time Rating right then when you beat that if there's multiple difficulties to unlock So I've been it multiple times and then there's the boss rush So I've done all that like Metroid Metroid me thinking about Metroid Dread That's definitely I just want one of my favorite switch games for sure. Um, Yeah Anyway point is I've been every Metroid game at least once except for Prime 2 I've tried beating it multiple times over the years But I always get stuck right at the end and then life comes around that I have to focus on something else But yeah, and big thing for me Zelda What I realized like you were talking about movies and like shows. I'm like, oh, I've rewatched some movies and shows. Sure Yeah, uh, so why won't I have a game? I think it will have this time commitment Yeah There's so many new things coming that I want to play all the time That when I go back. Oh, man go back and play our community of time. Oh, yeah, we beat it in 12 hours Yeah, but not the way I played that's going to be at least like 20 30 hours for me to beat our community time again Or I could just rewatch dumb and dumber for two hours Well to your point remember a few months ago when I was playing the wind waker in twilight princess Yeah, I replayed through those and I beat them both. No, I could have been playing elves in ring Yeah I would have more desire to play something like elden ring which I haven't beaten then Then those you want to you want to know what's the real kicker? You could say oh, well at least you saved money by not buying elden ring by playing games you already had I had lost access to twilight princess hd. So I bought it on my wee wee shop Before they took it down. That's awesome. I took it down. Yeah, because I had It actually sucks. It's not awesome years ago. Yeah, but at least I have it to some capacity Yeah, the physical copies are ridiculous. Yeah, I regret selling that so many years ago But when you're gone, I mean it look when we you barely sold it's like dude Anything any physical and we use going to be insanely expensive someday. Yeah And so prices are only going to go up All right, um, hold on. I got one more thing. Yeah, it just if if the new Zelda thing is Like, um, I know you mentioned an add-on to like universal If they don't have some sort of reference to Gearsland, they they missed an opportunity I mean, I mean if they don't call it Gearsland or something along the lines of that they they missed an opportunity Well, that would be cool if they at least have a ride Right and maybe the Gearsland. Yeah. Yeah, maybe like exactly that would be cool Called the pompadour express somewhere in there. They have to have a reference to Gearsland Oh, they probably won't one of the least VR a loft wing ride Oh, that'd be awesome It's something Nintendo would totally do. Yeah. I mean, this is a Mario Kart ride a VR ride That's nice. Yeah, so we're getting to our last topic here Pikmin 4 I mean guys it comes out basically tomorrow night But technically Friday Especially for physical copies midnight nonwards Um, it it has a meta critic store because all the reviews have come in There'll be more reviews coming down the line, but it has an 88 Which is right in line with pretty much all the Pikmin games You know Pikmin one and Pikmin two Those both scored like 89 and 90. So it's like right there with those Pikmin 3 actually scored a little bit lower And I think it was like 86 on its original debut, but still Right and right within that range, you know Pikmin Guess what? Um, you have the same review score as Final Fantasy 16. So You can celebrate that Also, by the way, this is a little bit. It's only tangentially related Nintendo better be up for publisher of the year they have Assuming mario wonder delivers again that that that's kind of the last one they have coming out That's like a brand new game in October release so it can be up for some sort of game of the year nomination Yeah, like if that one scores a 90 plus and they also have This this the throw in there You can argue the fire emblem game You can argue, uh, obviously cheers to the kingdom. Uh, if you want a big oh, oh remasters. Oh, by the way Yeah, one of our remasters is the highest second highest rated game of the whole year so far Uh, it's a good argument that they could be a publisher of the year, but we'll see they don't always really Usually win publisher of the year, but this is a year that feels like 2017 where they They might have a shot at it. Yeah, but I also have seen Where nintendo gets a shaft because of uh, just an anti-nintendo bias And this is a year that tears is going to probably going to win game of the year We'll see we don't know for sure because starfield's really that one Um, that could that could potentially get up there because yeah, but some Bethesda games have gotten up there before Yeah, I mean I I think starfield looks pretty cool So the but again verdicts still out. We'll find we'll find out pretty soon We'll find out pretty soon how that game is going to be Yeah, what would be funny if mario bros wonder takes it? I sincerely hope that uh, Bethesda and microsoft are giving reviewers like a couple months It feels like they're gonna need that if you I wish I didn't have a life And I didn't have a life expectancy So I could just like I wish I could go back to like the ages of 18 to 20 When I pretty much just played video games did nothing to worry about like if you had just no kids No, look, I'm just chilling at my parent. They're not yelling at me to get my life together I'm just you don't have to feel bad about spending 12 hours a day playing starfield I don't feel bad that oh, I cut back my hours at work intentionally to play more video games billion Yeah, what I will not win the power ball here in 10 minutes I would have to work anyways, we did buy some power balls Um, all right, so getting getting more back into the pigment four stuff Uh, the game has leaked for starters. Um, no real surprise every switch game leaks this one Took until about monday night to leak Uh, which was unlike, you know, tears of the kingdom before that that that one leaked the week before the right right until the weekend so that was pretty insane, but yeah, we we got this uh this leaked pretty easy to avoid the leaks because well The did pick me games then not to sell a lot of copies It's kind of like when Kirby in the forgotten land leaked. We didn't really you could freely go on youtube and twitter and not worry about seeing a damn thing Same thing here. How many people even knew it leaked besides seeing the headline. Oh the game leaked I haven't seen anything anywhere. I haven't had to put filters up I have not seen anything spoiled from this game that wasn't from a review or a preview outlet And that's i'm choosing to consume that so like that's why I know about like the zelda easter egg Is because I chose to consume that and I'll let them review the game the only time leaks have really mattered Was for tears the story The story it's a big I guess yeah, but I guess what my point is that like I haven't seen this that that is a big point Like a story really matters that that matters a lot for zelda for a lot of people I guess i'm just thinking like in terms of my own personal experience like in terms of my scrolling through feeds and stuff the only time spoilers have ever Actually impacted me was the tears of the kingdom one and it's just because I make so much content on it Gonna have to really careful, but also I saw tons of stuff On my youtube feed about I was spoiled on a live. I was all over that tears of the kingdom reddit I was making all those videos and you know what somehow I didn't get spoiled on the end And that's all I really cared about so it is interesting how that worked out Yeah, like there was there that there in hindsight There was a couple screenshots that I saw that what but I didn't know because I didn't have the context So Worked out. Oh, man. But speaking of sales Shigeru Miyamoto had something to say about this He did a developer interview for those who don't know. Yeah, Shigeru Miyamoto actually worked on Pikmin 4 Might be potentially the last video game he works on we don't know He doesn't he doesn't directly work on video games anymore But he did Pikmin 4 Which is awesome by the way glad to see the mice drove back at work now He talked about What they are doing with Pikmin 4 to hopefully see it boost in sales because he's personally been pretty disappointed with how the series is sold And he thinks they figured out why it doesn't sell Apparently it's too hard So that's the general summary. Let's get into his exact words. So here's what he said when talking about What what's prevented Pikmin from selling and what they're doing with Pikmin 4 to hopefully get it to sell better There have been three games in the series until now from Pikmin to Pikmin 3 and personally I've always wondered Why haven't they exploded more in sales even though they're so much fun to play Why do people think they're so difficult? I get that people find it more difficult when death is a factor But I think the franchise strength lies in its relationship with mortality If something is irreversible You need to figure out a way to prevent undesired things from happening To try to prevent Pikmin from dying. You need to practice Dandori to me That's what makes this game unique. I think people find Pikmin difficult for two reasons the controls and the depth of the gameplay I spent a long time mulling Over how we could convey these points as interesting rather than difficult. We were talking about how We want as many people as possible to play Pikmin 4. So yes, their goal with Pikmin 4 is to Be the best selling Pikmin of all time and actually reach a new audience But if it's not Pikmin like enough, we won't meet the expectations of those who've enjoyed the series until now The first game provided a deeper challenge while the second game was broader in terms of content And we went back to something closer to the first one in Pikmin 3 But after thinking about it, I realized that we could do both We could retain the depth of the gameplay that makes Pikmin so interesting While providing the functional support to address the challenges around controls I do wonder if that has something to do with some of the dog mechanics, but um Because that for those that haven't played all the Pikmin games. What's wrong with you. They're awesome but uh The doggo For some people and I see this from some Pikmin veterans The doggo in Pikmin 4 just playing the demo for some people makes the game feel a bit cheap Because it takes some certain aspects like swimming across the water And making them not really a risk anymore but but We haven't played enough for the game to really know and Miyamoto is saying that the depth is there So the question is I guess for Miyamoto. Why the hell doesn't Pikmin sell well? As we're on like literally close to the eve of the game coming out like Why why doesn't Pikmin sell they've gotten other weird wonky games to sell Why can't they get this one? Well, like what is it about this particularly? Like here's the problem Like I I don't even When people ask me what's the name of flaw in a Pikmin game. I can't even think of one and the I can't think of a flaw Well, then why won't it sell? I don't know Maybe because it the only thing I could think of is like the story isn't really that deep I don't like a story I just think it's the style of game that in the how it appeals to the audience and I look at Pikmin 4 And Pikmin 4 has retained A lot of what Pikmin is while also making it a little bit more Appealing to a larger audience because like the the camera change Thinked it makes it feel more like a third person action adventure game That's a big one when you account that when you account for the dog It does streamline the experience so I guess you could say easier But it makes it more fun to explore Right the camera, um, you can see more of the environment. You can see more of the world It you see your eyes are looking for more for seeing more things And when you account for the dog and just the they've streamlined the gameplay, right? Like there's more you can do a lot more things. It's more more fluid So it's just a more It's a less stressful because they did to get rid of the like the the limit in terms of days or food resources So it's become less stressful. It's become more dynamic and fluid and it's just become more of an adventure game Um, it still has the Pikmin gameplay, right? You're still Doing the dandor you're you're managing your resources sending Pikmin different directions To get different treasures or things by the end of the day Like there is still that management part But it's within the context of this like kind of whimsical magical world that and it's an adventure that looks beautiful So that I think that's bringing in a lot more people I hope Yeah, I hope like I'm more I will be frank I I think I feel more inclined to play Pikmin from beginning to end than I did prior Pikmin games I think there I think that there's something about this. It makes it feel that's good. It's exciting. It's good. I mean I look the changes you've made or that you've mentioned they made to the gameplay I do think that will make it more appealing My thing is But will they get them to the door to have the appeal like what can they I I don't know how they get people through the door It looks good I mean, it's probably why they did the demo like they're probably want want people to really try it out True. Yeah, the demo the demo actually might have helped a lot I mean and it's not like they haven't been marketing like it's weird guys because like you'll know i'm a news channel I basically haven't talked about Pikmin and there's been trailers. There's been news Haven't really talked about any of it and it's weird because I'm actually I already bought the game I'm going to play it like I mean I I'm Pretty confident Pikmin's not gonna that I'm gonna beat this game Big of a deal of zelda, right? So like well, it's all right, but it's not about the big deal like I've seen Very few but I have seen like three other content creators actually make like cover the Pikmin news As it happens and they're getting views so I'm like Cool. So there isn't interest. There just isn't a lot of people Covering it and by the way, I've already said this before I was covering things. We might sell some copies, but like You know general general appeal like when people see the commercials and they see them pop up in their videos when they're watching They're on tiktoks and stuff and they see the ads What makes it appeal because it the thing is I look at this from the outside looking in as someone who doesn't you know Who tries to examine things from an outside perspective and I go You can look at Pikmin and maybe think it's a kid's game I can Kids games don't you know, yeah, but but you be like oh, so does mario. I'm like Mario's a lot bigger franchise people know Know what mario is Yeah, it's a lot bigger ip that's been around long if you don't know what Pikmin is Like if you don't pay attention to news or gaming or if you don't have friends We've played it we talked about it with I can't I like if I were to just kind of think of my Myself and I just look at it without knowing what it is. I'd be like, okay, but looks And there's nothing about that that makes me want to play that like it doesn't look unappealing. It's just You know like Oh, well, I played wonderful 101. I'm like, okay So it's a kiddie version of wonderful 101 got it, but but it's not but like Just watching the trailer for it. It's like but I would think about it. I would need to yeah It is interesting. I am now trying to think about from the perspective of someone who doesn't know anything about Yeah, yeah There's no experience with it and then you see an ad you own a switch You see a commercial and you're like I mean would that appeal like it what what about like And the thing is I don't know what they could show that would make it appeal I mean maybe a boss fight, but then it's actually a very unique game. Yeah, I think that's another um A sort of element to consider here. It's not like you show that to someone who doesn't know what the series is They're not going to understand what they're really looking at You know like you you can't be like a shooter. Oh, it's an adventure game. The tomb was unique But you could understand it you can see what's happening in some tune you get it You see what's happening in arms even you get it you're fighting In defense of well, I don't know if it's in defense, but it's Like the opposite just to play a contrarian as I typically do with splatoon I think a lot of people can see that and not realize just how crazy it is And because I remember when I first saw with splatoon I didn't I I was like, okay, this was making a weird thing. This is not a big deal Like that was my first thought but then when I saw it the second time I was like, wait, hold on a second You can shoot ink on the walls Climb up the wall and hide in it and then jump out. Oh my god. That is a crazy mechanic You know like once I realized how actual unique and crazy mechanics were physical tune. That's when I got hyped But also that's like people would notice that for a face value Yeah, but as as unique as splatoon is also it's still a shooter people get shooters At least know that yeah, you're you're shooting things and competing. Yeah, you're shooting things. You're competing. You're trying to win Yeah, um, like yeah, that's that that excited me too about the original splatoon back in the day But I was like But I get why like people get the people sort of get the concept easier because there's other shooter games Even it's not like this. This is unique. It doesn't matter. They understand the value of a competitive experience There's I can't think of too many games That are anything like pigment Just pick been appropriately convey that you are an ant sized character in a giant world I think it It does but I think there's ways they could they could do something that would make it more apparent I I think I think incorporating the house environments make makes that house environments help I also I also think one thing they could have done because I I kept thinking like When when we saw like the trail for plucky squire What was awesome? I was storybook and then you popped out and you're in the real world And you're this tiny character in the real world and it just looks so exciting because It just it'll look exciting and I think what made that look exciting But then when you see a pickman trailer it doesn't I don't know that that you watch A pickman trailer and really understand what the point of the game is Oh, you're in a spaceship and they got lost in the plant. You need to go save Okay, and what are these weird things? Why are we so tiny? like it would be cool if I always I always thought like a way that they could have advertised this game and they would have to put the Some of this in the game I would have been like They show this mysterious ship they instead of giving us a background. So oh you're saving below You crack you crash land your ship You know you'll walk out all these plants look kind of big you're pulling some stuff and then it cuts to when you go into the house And in the house one they actually not just have house supplies around They have some humanoid characters in there interacting with some of those things giving perspective To what the hell is going on and they don't bear it too Yeah, like I think something like that would have been like a plucky squire movie of like realization why they're like wait a second What is happening? I don't know if that would help itself. I don't know it's just I don't know how the pickman is such a very unique game like when I think of pickman one through three I can't think of any other game. I've ever played. That's like it I can think of very specific things that I can find in other games But the collective of what makes pickman what it is. It is basically a unique experience in the world of gaming And and how do you convey a unique experience to general consumers who have never experienced it I don't I don't know. I mean getting it in their hands with the demo is good But this almost feels like the game that could have used like a nintendo live 2023 You know could have used a demo tour And I know that I think they are adding it to like a summer demo tour But like I don't even think like that. I mean like every best buy should just have a kiosk with pickman three on it or pickman four demo on it or something like Because like the only way to really do it is just to put it in people's hands And I don't you know, I how do you get people to choose to do that? I don't know So it's I think you were onto something though people understand shooters people understand platformers people understand You know the your major genres and stuff like that. This is this game I haven't played any of them, but it it's it's such a as you guys have said it's such a unique experience that Just from the from the trailers itself all it looks like is I take these little Dudes and just chuck them at things and that's it and that that's the game You know, that's that's what I get out of it when I watch the trailers Okay What do you do? I mean and you're not going to pay more attention to it earns your you're exactly right like so That's that's the tough part You know one thing they could also do they could go completely All in on word nintendo and our other ip's appeal Let's cross over those ip's hardcore into this game So like we have a zelda item right, but imagine there was a zelda world A zelda level a mario level That could now start to get mario and zelda fans and people who don't pay attention to pick them start to pay attention to it And then you're just selling more copies because you're selling it to your audiences of your other games That would have been another way to maybe it would be interesting to explore like a like a mushroom kingdom level or like A high rule field I think that would have appealed That would have got that would have at least made headlines on mario website The minish being Like a factor in a pikman level kids. Oh, yeah That but that's what i'm saying like I as a zelda fan i'm like, oh baby, but I also love pikman So i'm like might be a good dlc idea But that's that that's sort of my thing is i'm like if you can't get it to appeal on the merits of what it is Because it's so hard to convey it then maybe you just convey it by Incorporating your major ip's into it in a way That gets them to try it. I don't know. I mean it's cross promotion, right? Yeah, that's what it is. Yeah, uh, yeah Something about and then you do like a little you do like a little pikman update and in like tears of the kingdom And you start to have some of the corax reference them and then they start pulling out like a little pikman plushie And you're like what the hell I I guess my perspective is There's something about what you said. It's not that I disagree But I don't like it Like I feel like it's a pikman fan. I don't I would I think those those kind of things would be cool, but it's just to appeal If they did it from the beginning you might feel different Well, yeah If they wanted to try to she wanted it now it'd be Well for first off, right the the pikman it would it wouldn't It's the depending on how they do it I'm not saying it couldn't be done in a way that would would not make possible since the pikman world, but it just kind of Yeah, one it it would just feel like I can't imagine it making sense Yeah, but it's also But if it sells copies Right, but so but my other perspective on it is I feel like they shouldn't have to do that. I feel like they should be able to sell their games on the merit of their own games for perspective Sony comes up with new ip's all not maybe not all the time but with some fair degree of frequency And they're able to hype it up to their audience and get people invested in buying it, you know, like they can do that Can you give examples? Well, I mean horizons still relatively new right and what's easy to understand game action adventure popular open world Sure You're just hitting on all the things people already know and understand Little big plan like it's easy to explain You can watch that trailer and understand this is an action adventure game Sure. Well, I mean they may pick one form more of an inaction adventure game But do you understand that from a trailer? I think we'll see what this feels I by the way, I want the end to sell well, but I'm just kind of like Oh, just because they put the camera over the shoulder. Does it really explain anything? Like oh, it's sometimes over but other times it's not and the trailer looks wonky and you're pulling these things as erics And you're just chucking things and Like I I think that Pikmin is just really hard to convey like Sony does launch new IPs and does do new things that work But they work in existing genres that are easy to understand and also their games are all Significant story like heavy story. So they get you invested in a story This game Pikmin's never really been Story, so you're not going to get an investment from a story perspective Is it your investments totally gameplay? Which is what nintendo does best and by the way the gameplay in the Pikmin games is fantastic But getting people to try the gameplay I just I I don't know of an easy way to sell Pikmin Like if they may put me on the marketing team and said hey, how can you sell Pikmin to a new audience? I'm like Grassroots campaign go out and handle free copies People play it if it's free make it free to play I don't know what else to tell you Free to play Pikmin I think Pikmin 4 is going to be the best selling Pikmin game to date And I Hope so hope it all sells three deluxe three deluxe is the best selling at the moment question is A half million is that because it's the best game or is it 2.23? Is it because it's gonna be the best game or is it because of the switch effect? I mean well Pikmin 3 deluxe sold 2.23 on switch. So I mean if Pikmin 4 beats it that is Going beyond switch effect. That is just being a good game. Um I I just there's something about it to me that I think Pikmin 4 is gonna do but I mean it just feels magical It feels like I look at Pikmin 4. There's something about it that I think Just looks amazing. I think a part of it is the graphics They went with unreal The the way the way always have our depth Pikmin's always had some really nice. Oh, yeah That's anyone who plays all of Nintendo's IP, you know that yeah, the Pikmin are simple the character is simple but the world The world is very detailed and all of the games and I think you touched a little bit on too some of the Some of the monsters that you fight do look a little kid-ish It and things like that. So I can see where some adults might go As you said before it it looks like it could be a kid's game. So it's you know kind of I could see that too, you know It's I guess a commercial I think has a hard time conveying what's fun I'll tell you most commercials that exist are terrible But like you watch it you watch the trailer for super mario world and like wonder super mario wonder It just looks fun But then they'll do like this people also On Pikmin in a Uh In a thing and I think if you don't have experience and don't know what Pikmin is I don't know that people watch those two minute segments and are directing go that looks fun They're also a slower-paced game, right? It's hard to show to showcase the gameplay loop of Pikmin as opposed to 2d mario Yeah, I mean very true. Yeah, it is Like it's hard to showcase it compared to most of what Nintendo has offered Yeah I mean, I'll even argue Like you look at metroid, right? And I feel like metroid deserves better sales Um, I think it's what you know, it's one of the highest highest reviewed um franchises in history, right? Like but it doesn't sell like that. Um, it's comparable to Pikmin actually it they're they're comparable So You know, I wonder like with with metroid like yeah, you look at it Oh, that's a pretty looking game, but it looks kind of scary. Um that you shoot stuff great But metroid is not a shooter Like it's it has shooting components, right? Like that's how you attack things And that's how you impart into interact with the world, but it's it's an It's an adventure game. It's kind of like zelda where you're moving around solving puzzles. Yeah So but that that's harder to convey Um, you know in a quick trailer that's a I mean, obviously definitely possible I think, you know, people do understand that to an extent, but It's it's it's different and maybe the other thing it's not even so much Maybe part of it is just kind of like making it clear to people what these games are But another part of it may just be While that may be a really cool concept that may be very well executed for what it is It's just a concept that people just don't care about as much Some of the best movies of all time are not some of the best most viewed movies of all time, right it So what I like in this uh, this is where my parent comes out How do you know you don't like it if you haven't tried it? I mean, yeah, the key thing is getting the attempt to try Like like like if You know, you could have a we've seen this with many many game franchises over the years not just from nintendo other companies Where they'll release a game and it sells incredible But the user reception is Garbage and so then like the sequel sells you know worse and worse You'll see this even with movies sometimes a lot of hype going into a movie It's really really well then the next one isn't as good because guess what? People who watch the first one maybe weren't that impressed They went based on hype and now You know, it might be kind of like a youtube video You ever sometimes put out a youtube video and you do everything you can to make it work and it just doesn't That's every day It just doesn't I'm trying to get back to those 50 60 k's l the view days It just doesn't work and there'll also be times where you do something and it does do incredibly well and then it just stops No parent reason the algorithm just like oh, that's it. We're gonna stop sharing this out The why it got it got a lot of views that are short on time the analytics. I'll show that people loved it Why did it stop? Yeah I think it's just kind of my video last night My video last night on those elder rumors and all that stuff we talked about in this podcast It has a 27 click-through rate It is the highest click-through rate on a video this year for me. Wow And yet 12,000 views It doesn't make any sense that makes no sound like It's legitimately youtube's just not sharing my video like that's That's the only explanation It's got it's got five plus minutes of you of watch time which is way higher than my normal videos It's got 27 7 click-through rate when they do show it to an audience It makes no sense to me like I know this is a youtube thing, but I'm just like this makes I am confused But then maybe that relates to game like the player satisfaction of a metroid when you play it is very high When people play metroid, they tend to really really enjoy it But then you want to play it though getting people to play it And now you know in the case of youtube Some of that's out of my hands like why isn't youtube sharing the video? I don't know There's only so much I can do youtube's got to share it Right It's not like we're like we're not even like complaining to the people who work at youtube. There is an algorithm. Yeah. Yeah, it's all automated Yeah, like they they try it. I'm just not in favor with the algorithm at the moment And that's cool. There's a myriad of variables. Um, what I was ultimately alluding to is sometimes just luck I don't want to chop it down to like just that right, um, I mean, I think you can you can bring luck you can You can facilitate your luck, right? You know the more you try right the more you get word out there This is ugly Sorry in my head. I just said oh this will make pickman popular You make it free to play you advertise it you keep it at the top of the charts And then how do you make money on it? You sell pickman types and I just sat there and said this is so evil Why am I going down this evil ea rock? You might as well just call me andrew wilson bobby cots I could just kick me off of youtube. I gotta I just came up with the most evil idea for you Wow, look at that. Um, I got another idea. Um, what if they had like a commercial or maybe not even a commercial like just like A real life event Where they had someone dressed up in an olamar like suit like, you know It wore the helmet with a little thing and they have a whole bunch of like pickman dolls that have the pickman like Ford cartridge right like the case and just chucking them Like actual like in real life pickman and there's chucking him at people That would be hilarious and it's just kind of let's just showcasing. Hey, this is what you do You know that that the the thing is about that see that's what they that's what they needed to do They needed to figure out a way to make a viral marketing campaign that makes other people start doing it Oh, okay. Here's an idea. So imagine like that that could have really got saved like a like a fourth wall breaking Kind of like the grimace shake how the grimace shake blew up and people kept buying all those damn meals Just for the shake. Oh, you can only get the shake if you buy the meal for this one week only and it became this massive like Meme all over the internet like if they could have found a way to do that with All right, I got I got I got I got a commercial idea for you for pickman. You ready? All right, hear me out. Hear me out okay, so You're this young kid Right, like young kid. I mean, you're like, you know, maybe 18 19, right? Like you're it's your first job young adult You're a young adult you working in this store, right this electronics store Boss doesn't like you, right? But you It's you you're they you're working in the back of the store Right the warehouse and you get it in the beginning of the day and the boss is there. He's like, hey Pikmin 4 is laught is launching Soon so it's not it's not a store. It's a warehouse, right sends things out. Uh, we need to get shipments out By tonight or you're fired Leaves so the day starts Just like in a real life Pikmin game and your job Is to is to Dan Dory, right? You got to plan out What you're sending so there's conveyor belts There's there's cargo freight and you're just you're chucking You're chucking Pikmin cartridges in different locations to get everything to where they need to go In time by nighttime So you can get out before the big bad bullbord Manager comes to fire you and everything gets shipped out. So it has a successful launch So it's a fourth wall breaking moment where they're like, hey buy Pikmin 4 We're getting it out in time But also the commercial the skit is the Pikmin gameplay that hectic energy to try and get everything done before nighttime, but also You know the the fear of what nighttime provides And then also the the management the dandori gameplay style of throwing things in different directions Heck, I mean if they want to get extra they could actually you've got to be throwing Pikmin And they can be helping you to get the Pikmin cartridges You are literally throwing Pikmin so they can move around the the cartridges to the right locations I like it. Yeah. Yeah. It's a good Nintendo You could have done this I'm still gonna go out to tick tock rock. We need the Pikmin challenge. Yep Just they should have done something completely stupid That makes people want to do the Pikmin challenge. It's like the the game throw throw burrito But uh, you do Pikmin instead and you just chuck them at each other Yeah, I mean all they would have to do for like a Pikmin channel Like I I'm by the way, I'm not good at coming up with ideas for challenges as you see at prime gaming fest But but all they would have had to do is hire like somewhat some Someone who's just really big on tick tock to do the Pikmin challenge and they just come up with some stupid I don't know if it's like I already Pikmin you can fit it in your mouth. I I don't know I don't know what it would be. It was some stupid challenge And then it would have just taken off People would just take out you just create a viral marketing family now What's trending on on tick tock? There's 18.3 million people talking about Pikmin challenge. What the fuck is Pikmin, right? So like I don't know I can't I This is why I'm not one of those people. I'm not an idea person for challenges. I can't do it I'm I barely come up with ideas for videos. Okay, so and I do news Look I'm a news channel. All I gotta do is go to like nintendolife.com There's a news article. There we go. That's my video And I still can't even do that so um But no, I I have no idea what they could do. I I really love your commercial though. That's a that's a sick commercial I mean, I'd sell me if I saw that would tell me that would be a fun skit Like it would be cool to make that Once by the time I had ideas to do like little short films on the channel Um, but I don't have the resources or times really do that now Um, imagine if you imagine if you can condense this idea down to a short It's possible a one-minute short. I think yeah, it could go crazy especially I mean, it's too late now, but if you were working on it for a few months and kind of got it out right around launch Oh, man, that would have been It's it's too late because it can't pull this off and pick been five Pick been five. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I I do hope for the sake of this game that it does become the best selling Um, I hope it hits three million plus sales. I I would like to see a dude closer like forgotten land numbers but, um, that's five mil plus. I don't know if he can do that, but Look, Miyamoto has been wanting this thing to be a bigger success than it is I could say the quality is there the reviews back up that the quality is there Um, people who play it love it. So we just we just get people to play like the only reason Yulia my fiance and she had never heard of Pikmin until I bought Pikmin three deluxe and she saw me playing it And after sitting in the living room while I played it for like three hours She's like, can you give me the controller? This looks like a lot of fun But it took three hours for her to like get it And I understand why because it's so it's a slower pace game Like you're not you don't always get it right away and I and and now she loves it She I don't even know if I'm going to get the play Pikmin four because she'll probably take my switch and play Because I only have a digital copy Or she'll make me go buy her a physical one because she she was really looking forward to Pikmin four and it's like damn I'm like The appeal of the games there if you just play the damn thing um But man, uh, thank you. Uh takers extent. Uh, I had a little super chatty popped off here I'm I kind of actually like that switch to markup Do we want to end talking about that? Yeah Yeah, should we I mean it's fake But I mean that that's not that's not really Well, I mean, there's some other stuff. I got the Microsoft expects switch you guys the earliest 20 24 leave the combo leave the combo andres uh, yeah, um I guess that you could argue it's a slow switch to news week, but I mean Sort of not really depends on what you consider news if you count this tomorrow tomorrow And they five five hours ago. He did put up a new jiff He now shows it docking Shit, of course, it's bullshit. It's it's very well crafted bullshit and I appreciate right here's the thing We have mockups to switch to and we have other people who have done this in the past They just didn't pretend it was real this guy keeps pretending. It's real when we all know it's not It he's just it's clever But why are you pretending it's real? I that's the part I don't get yeah And you know what as a you know, we're creators, right? Um, so I I personally think that You shouldn't really like Dog on other creators, right? Yeah Yeah So it's kind of like when you're an athlete, right? Like you ever see athletes talk trash about other athletes if they do It's kind of like oh, you shouldn't have done that, right? Um, usually because of some personal beef, right, but it's not a good idea No, he doesn't go well. It's entertaining. It's entertaining. Yeah, but it's not entertaining for the people involved I'm sure it's not good for for people's careers is what I know Basically, I'm saying I think it's unethical Right, not saying you should go to jail for anything. I'm just saying Yeah, you can trash talk all you want I mean, I love the trash talk, but it depends The trash talk in the spirit of competition is fine Like when Michael Jordan's yelling at people on the court, you can't guard me. That's just entertainment Yeah, well like when if you go out and public and start to say he's a piece of shit Fuck him. Fuck his kids. Like, okay. Yeah, that's too far. What are you doing? Well, like for example, let's say you and I are gonna make a video and it's like on the same topic And I'll be like I'm gonna get more views when you watch, right? Like that's different I'm gonna have ever Dude, we've talked a lot. Have I ever done that or like I'm gonna get more views than you look at No, but the thing is you're bigger than me, right? So you in general you know, but that's why okay There was that one doggie comic video is like, I don't think I told you it's like, oh, I'm gonna get more views Watch they do. I'm not I don't even remember only one time Only one time. There's also a difference in, you know, a friendly friendly competition friendly competition There are times I'll glance at the views in your video and go, oh man his video today out did mine Um Well, how big are You want to swap channels quick? I mean like I I think competition is good But also like when it comes to youtube stuff like it's kind of like a fine line because you also don't want to You want to be attractive you want to be I guess click baiting in the sense Yeah, you want you want obviously you want to get views But you also don't want to go so far that you're lying Right or misleading right so that there's there's a fine line so you can get a little tricky um, but What were you talking about the the fake mock-up fake mock-up so anyways that That tangent aside I only brought it up because I don't want to Speak ill of the work of this creation because there was clearly creative That went into not just a photoshop. Yeah. No, he's got actual moving You know 3d renders that he's done But this is this is a fantastic job And I can understand trying to pose it as a leak From the framework of they want their work to be appreciated But also it's totally misleading. It is not at all true Yeah, see what got me wasn't that like if you just put it up and didn't say anything I'm cool with that Whatever we all know it's fake and you're not claiming it's not that it's real My problem is when you go to some of the replies You know and Some of the replies are like Yeah, oh you want information on the new joy cons. This is what the new joy con information is. This is this i'm like You're acting like you know things you don't like you couldn't just leave it at the mock-up and just Keep releasing new types of the mock-up let people get high let people think about it and just leave it alone right if you don't say anything at least I mean you could I guess you could thrive off the ambiguity of Non-response. Yeah. Yeah. Were you not you never really said like I liken it to The uh, do you remember the the leaked nx back in the day that was 3d printed When that got out, you know and was posted online You know with the joysticks and the little of the screen and everything People ran wild with it and the person who posted it never claimed it was real That never came out of their mouth They just let the internet go crazy with it and then after a while, you know It was like a few days and they're just like guys come on here here It is let me show it again And then he showed the whole process how it was 3d printed and everything which was very clever Got him lots of attention and like that's what this person wanted was just to get a lot of attention for some clever ideas Cool I'm cool with it, but you can't just maybe tomorrow Let the internet run wild with it tomorrow. Maybe there's like hey, so it's fake. This is how I did it Right, except the difference is we know this is fake There's no Like you remember the yeah, at least that was based on a patent Love the 3d model one. Yeah. Yeah, and then the the rayman leak Um, like that people were like, oh, we're not sure if this is real or not, right? Like there was some doubt um, so those make sense like but this If you know what you're talking about, you know that this is fake And the problem is not everyone knows what they're talking about. Some people don't analyze things as as deeply They just like see oh, it looks cool. Okay, great. Maybe it's real Like I think that's what that's why it's things like this gain traction because not everyone kind of like assesses it I don't a really deep critical level, you know um And so I wanted to preface By saying I think as a creator, right? Like I think what they did is impressive, but it's by no means at all Thank god, there's no there's no there's not even a snowball telling chance that I think this is real So so for those who don't know I've seen a few people the chat like what are you talking about? There's this guy on twitter that put up share the imagery um Yeah, I could whether or not I I don't have it locally Oh, and I don't have my keyboard. Well, I mean it's your podcast. I just I mean you can share it I think you don't have the ability to share. I I don't have my keyboard in front of y'all So don't have a public bad. Yeah Yeah, I could be if I I'm sure I could find it in like a second, right? Yeah, it's it's it's at I think I quote I quote tweeted. Oh someone was this is Cheeto gaming This is I think I had more a problem with this what cheeto gaming did. Oh cheeto gaming pissed me off Yeah, and I I don't know Because because I've seen him I've seen he's got a decent amount of followers And he's been quoted by people before and he's put up leaks and stuff before and I'm like, dude Cheeto gaming basically acted like it was real and that that And he didn't source and he's hiding he's hiding by saying hey, I said it was a rumor The problem is this is not a rumor It's not a rumor He's conflating information. Maybe I could just do a straight up screen share here. Let me pull it up over here And I I don't want like it's one of those things where I don't want to There's just things that were done that I I don't agree with Um, let me see if the screen share will work And Present I don't know what I said guys about a snowball in hell and chances, but you know what I meant A snowball's chance in hell. What is it? It's small Although unless you believe Dante's inferno where it gets cold I'm talking about the fiery a snowball's chance in the volcano. How about that? An active one Okay, so I think Yeah, I think we're we're good. I don't know if I have oh, man The hype is real. Okay. I I can't see it. What I can see it. Yeah Um, anyways, okay. Yeah, it's it's live. Okay. All right So this is the the account that it all originated from and if we go down it kind of started with this Okay, he's a new account that joined in july and he did this. Okay. He put up these mock-ups There's obvious things with some of the mock-ups that are a little weird Some of the capitalization on legend of zealotiers the kingdom is not how nintendo did it a zeno blade of mark The zeno blade one is is a big one as well. So there's a platoon three is backwards actually to yeah Yeah, so there's obvious There's obvious things about them that are uh, we clearly fan made So I'm going to point out how the background behind some rpg here is um from actually like mario 64 or something But I think my mario galaxy or the mario galaxy. Yeah, I think it's like that The point is there's a billion red flags. Okay Tons of them that that it's fake But it is neat and it is a concept that we haven't seen anyone come up before And him just posting this into an hashtag nintendo switch I don't like the leaked part, but whatever cool. I'm this isn't a big deal I literally already used this image mock-up in one of my Thumbnails recently because I just wanted a new switch Mock-up because we've been used like the same ones for a while. You know, it's interesting. I I I almost never Use any like Fan made mock-ups one because I try to use just like official stuff and sure sure around But also I just that's just something I but it's hard. It's hard to make switch to thumbnails without using a mock-up Yeah, yeah, yeah And then he posted this joy con 2 I find this image more impressive than the first and this is It this looks official. I think I don't know what language it is. I think it's italian someone told me, but I'm not 100% sure Can I read it bad? Nope. It's not spanish. Yeah, so It's it's interesting. Uh, it looks like exactly like a document This looks like an official thing and it's very well done Maybe it's not because maybe the text is a bunch of bullshit, but I can't read it And that's kind of maybe part of the point is that unless you are this native language. You can't read it either Uh, okay, cool. You just essentially tell me sometimes we'll shoot in town. I'm cool with this. It's whatever The guy the guy's having some fun doesn't bother me. Okay. We haven't even gotten to the really impressive stuff yet Then he did this Okay, this was this was his 3d render mock-up of the of the new UI. Was it made in blender? Yeah, maybe I don't know what he made it in Um, and there's red flags in this as well The biggest one that people point is super mario wonder instead of super mario bros wonder Uh, but Like so far, I'm cool with this like kind of would never make a ui look like this. No, they don't and it's it's it's a Nice ui. It's slick. It's it's fine. Also probably uses too much ram Probably but the point is it's neat and I'm not even mad at this guy This is just cool. We've seen mock-ups before. That's good. This is neat Then he does this thing tomorrow What does that mean? puts an image from the launch trailer Of switch Like the reveal trailer. Maybe he has his own version I actually would I actually want to see it because I think it's made some cool stuff And then he does that did this one showing it going in a dock Going down a war pipe pop it out of the war pipe and boom. It's on your tv That that's so fake And then you see that some details on the game pop up on the screen So potentially in this situation the reason the dock is this way is you might be able to get extra information Or certain things on that screen while you're playing sort of like it's a side tablet And you know what a lot of people do have tablets on the side while they're doing things So okay, it's just a concept and you know what if this is all this was I'm kind of cool with what he did It's fine to me If the problem is like when he goes to some of the replies his his his twitter handles at nintendo's bs Which is I mean, if you don't know what that acronym is for it's for bullshit And if you don't know what that figure of speech means it means probably not true Yeah, like it It's just I don't like any of this Like it's not an adaptive dimension of the new joy con or the same like literally acting like this is a Official thing it I just But for the most part, I'm not really mad at that person. Okay to be clear I'm not really mad at them And I I'm for the most part fine With how things turned out But the problem was switch force put it in a video yesterday But he Was straight up that it was fake the whole time He just wanted to talk about it because it's really neat looking and it's one of the most in-depth mock-ups we've seen in a long time. It's a very well done mock-up Yeah, we we haven't had concept since the switch pro days We haven't really gotten any more really neat mock-ups until this one. So it's it's cool. It's neat And so it's fine and he clearly didn't have much else to make a video on at the time So he chose to do that's fine. That didn't bother me. But then cheeto gaming and like four other people Started acting like this is a real thing Some of them being content creators with a bit of a following We're hiding behind the guys. It's just a rumor And that really set a lot of people off that got people like You know, so rgt spawn wave all these other kind of people want who the hell believes it's clearly fake blah blah blah blah blah Like this isn't It's isn't the zelda OLED edition leak that was very very difficult to really prove if it was fake or not. It turned out it was 100 real And that's why it was so hard to prove that it was fake. There were arguments for it to be fake I'm just made a whole video Doing some close examinations on things that just feel off Then maybe didn't matter. It was real. It was real the whole time Cool back and forth on that one. I first thought it was real then I thought it was fake Yeah, but that's the thing like even when you point out your nitpicking At things that aren't really definitive and could just be maybe because of the quality of the photo taken right Like it pre-production version. Yeah pre-production. So like and it turned out it was 100 legit So it's kind of like but this from the very beginning Gave obvious signs that it was fake from the very beginning the very beginning the first off is this all it's all portrayed as Promotional material. So as if it's final. Yeah, um, and there's nothing about this that makes any sense Because first off we're not showcasing any switch to games Right like that as you point out that here's the kingdom. Um font is like that Like system launching this year clearly with the game shown Right. So here's a here's something that maybe some people make make confused some people On youtube titles a lot of us may capitalize every single letter That's just kind of something that is done but that is not How it typically is portrayed like if we're writing that out like in a description or a website or a blog or a twitter post Like we're gonna say legend, you know the legend of zelda and the the the ofs and those are going to be lowercase Unless it's the first one because you know the beginning of a sentence um or title But like that's that's weird. That's not something that nintendo would do for that No, they don't because I'm looking at it right now and it's the normal case of the first word And then legend lowercase of the key words have to have the Yeah, yep And then the all the images have we have weird little backgrounds But then just like you consider like functionally what this is like, I think it's a cool concept I think there's some interesting ideas there like the idea that the joy cons can maybe have a glove So they could have maybe better grips. That's great But also to have the system where there's one oval one oval and then the system's an oval I don't that that almost feels like they're making this hit something less sleek It's almost sure. Yeah. Yeah So that is unrealistic the ui thing how much ram that would take to do Unrealistic, I don't know. I mean if it's apple that made the ui I would believe it took very little because they just make smooth ui's on I mean, there's nothing But this isn't you know, it's probably some android or something Those phones cost close to a thousand dollars, right? So it's very different I mean, it depends because now they're hitting those different price points Because the lowering the price of all the older phones that are pretty much just as good You can go get them for like 500 or something I think it's the lowest price when I saw on their website Which is still really high for a game system that doesn't have a controller or a bigger screen No, no, I understand your point, but yeah, also there's insane margins on those phones So they don't have to be that expensive the margins on the game system usually aren't that great. Oh, yeah I'm not seeing the margins on switch aren't good. I have no idea what the margins are on switch I'm just they're obviously good. They make money They could they could they could sell a lot more systems. They were they were to do a price drop They have well no, no anyways, they haven't because they shouldn't But the market I mean guys, it's a clearly fake market My problem was people that tried to pretend it might be real for the sake of just getting views And and look I'm a content creator So I get part of the game In you got nothing to talk about so let's make Let's just talk about this and make a really enticing title that makes this sound real Um, and look there were some content creators that did that I'm not gonna call anyone specifically out, but there were some content creators that did that even though in the video It specifically said oh, it's obviously fake But the title and thumbnail made it feel like it was real I'm not going to say I've never done anything like that because that would be very hypocritical of me In my six years of doing youtube videos I can say that I've definitely done stuff like that, especially when I was a really dinky creator with less than 20,000 subscribers Um But what I will say is after being a creator for six years I've slowly realized that there are certain lines you just shouldn't cross And I do think even though clickbait is a thing and you're trying to get views If the clickbait is pretending something is something that you factually know it isn't That to me is a problem As an example my title on my video yesterday That I posted late last night total clickbait rumor new new zelda game Um, you know announced later this year or whatever Hey, we don't even know that it's a zelda game, but I also don't know that it's not a game This is different than me being like rumor Potent, you know rumor Here's the first look at switch two But you know it's not Like you just 100 like beyond any doubt it is fake And like that's where That's what really kind of got me today. I mean there may be some people There may be some people who don't know it's fake Um, right because not everyone analyzes thinks the same level we do apparently have to analyze it So it's so obvious. He's got so many examples I mean, I understand. I'll say this There are people out there who think it's real if you're a kid If you're a teenager making youtube videos, I'll give you all the excuses in the world You have no experience. You don't know what you're doing. It looks legit to you. Cool My problem is some of the people doing this are like well known Ben at this a while they're not that stupid and they're saying in the videos it's fake And that pisses me off because they know it's fake. So they're just Making a title to get clicks on something they know isn't real It's fine if you want to say hey this the everyone's talking about this this latest mock-up of switch two That might get people going. Why are people talking about it? That's fine But I don't know man And and the thing is I tip a critical for me to say things because I used to do it. I just Man, I don't know And that's I think what pissed me off is just people pretending that it's real just just to give views More so than the person who actually made it. I'm not really that mad at that person. He's just Having fun. I assume He's got talent The the youtube videos, I'm not even sure I have a problem with that. I mean, I I wouldn't do that But if you make clear as long as if you like you make clear what the truth is like You know, I can maybe let it slide, right? But when there's people who Are kind of like intentional gaming was bad That that that one again. I don't I don't like attacking you won't even be like it's fake. It's a rumor I'm like, no, but if he believes it if he believes that that's okay, but I also think that that is Incorrect By the way, I don't really know who cheeto gaming is besides this random person that keeps popping up on youtube or on twitter So no, uh, no no real shade to him. I have no idea Um, he he says on his thing that he's a former realist content creator. He's actually quite big He's pretty big What's his I he's got over a hundred k on on uh Yeah, his youtube channel small But his twitter is huge what did he used to be part of something that was big I don't know he must have been former realist content creator So he's a former he was associated. He had to be associated with someone that used to be big Maybe the chat knows if you guys ever heard of under this cheeto gaming guy for another set Because he's he's got a really big following for someone. Why do you follow him? I don't know That's what I'm saying What is going on? Who is this guy? Hey, by the way, um, so his tweet it just says rumor and the title switch to may have leaked but take it with a grain of salt Announced it might be this year with a q1 2024 release. So the second line I have no problem with there is a rumor that it announced it might be this year with a q1 2024 release That is a legitimate rumor, but the first line that switch to may have leaked What has leaked? Nothing, but he posted the images of the nintendox guy the the the 100% fake Yeah Stuff and I don't think it's sort of either. It's kind of it's a very confusing message Um, so those who do not and the know Might think that this imagery is a leak that he's saying that has not happened. There has not been a leak Now, you know, sometimes you can call some there are people who call things leaks when it's still a rumor. Um, you know So this that's kind of like a gray area, but there hasn't been any rumored leak there's just I don't know. Do you would you call the the legal stuff that's come out of microsoft and the fctc court case a leak? Because that's kind of the most I would call it. It's just affirmation It's it's information that They know they knew was going to get out. Maybe they didn't want to get out, but it is out, right? It's not an example It's potentially the name of the system is in the documents. It's also redacted. So it doesn't really matter But I was watching your video on that I was like, man, I wish we could just I know I was like, why couldn't this be the sharpie one? Remember when there was a document earlier the case that was sharpied I'm like, oh, why couldn't this be sharp? I even printed the thing off and tried to photocopy it just to make sure I would I the detective work. I wish we could just they actually worked it out I wish we could like do that kind of stuff to find the answer. I would love to find the answer Like it's like there's clear information that the public isn't supposed to know about the next system In those documents and it's just staring at us. Here's Steve singer saying things about the system We are not allowed to see and it's just like but it's right there. It's literally like I see It's Okay. All right. All right. It's gone to let it go It's gone to let it go I guess So if you want to reference that fine and say, hey Yeah all you look For I will say this I get this on my switch to video sometimes Yeah, you know what it's like you make a switch to video you're gonna piss some people off because people just don't want to even see Whenever I make a switch to video anger and that's it. I I would say I'm still Almost always positive in terms of subscribers whenever I make a switch to video But I also lose more subscribers Than any other video. Yeah, like I see people unsubscribing for this absolutely Like there are people that see that and they're like, oh screw on dress. He's an asshole. Yeah, it's funny because You get the unsubscribed you get the negative comment and my favorite one is when people tell me Nintendo isn't working on anything switch to isn't real and I'm like look it might not be called switch to but here's Here's one evidence. Nintendo in 2021 literally mentioning the next generation system in a financial briefing That's one evidence. Here's another one from another meeting where they say they are working on new hardware Oh, and by the way, here's a bunch of legal documents We're literally it's referenced like a dozen times and it the name of the system's even in the damp I made it If the thing exists, we just don't know when it's coming out I made a switch to video two weeks ago, right and I tried to frame the article of video I think the video was like why people are going crazy about switch to rumors Like I wasn't even so I was trying I try to make the title clear. I was like, hey I'm talking about what other people think I'm not even saying what I think I'm not even saying what's happening I'm saying what other people think like it was trying to try to explain why there's the craziness, right? I think it was relatively well received and I think I had like seven different articles sourced And then there were comments saying there's this is this is fake. There's no news But there were several articles some of which were from a legal case Yeah, like what what does not cat? Well, like at what point is it not news? Like I don't I don't understand Like, you know people have opinions, man Yeah, I think I noticed on Kim one of my videos recently that I did That went over this stuff Um Actually, yeah, I gained like I gained like 50 subscribers off It actually was it was one of my most subscribed videos in a bit And it also dealt with with some of this stuff And I think the difference was that I didn't frame the video necessarily around switch to even though it was clearly about it And then in the video while I the switch to came up On screen this was dealing with the legal documents on screen. I was showing The actual evidence The way like I don't know if you see my videos recently that kind of the new way I do it Where I'm down in the corner and I'm just hey, I'm not just talking here. You go like you claim I started doing that for the Jeff grub Yeah, I started doing that because uh people kept saying that like, you know, if you just throw a screenshot, Bob It's not good enough. I'm like fine Well, you photoshop a screenshot fine. I can photoshop a screenshot. You're right fine You know what? I like the way this other guy's doing some content. He does it sort of like this I'm gonna do it like this because you know what? I don't want to hear that. I don't have sources anymore people always say you You're sourcing. I link it in every video, but you know what here you go I hit a button you saw it firsthand Information's not from me. You can mock up. Here you go. You can mock up. You can fake tweets You can fake this but I'm showing you it in real time. It existed You can still do you can you can still You can photoshop and put it behind you with a green screen effect. But yeah, yeah Yes, but but it's much more believable when they're like, oh He's that hit look there's an actual url in there and then he he clearly hits f11 And it goes full screen and he's scrolling down and it is a document Look all of it can be faked, of course, but it just looks much more believable And then obviously I do have an old link down in the description So then if you really don't believe me even though you saw it you could actually go verify all the sources yourself but Yeah, since I started doing that I've started getting a bit less dislikes and a bit a bit less People running away from my videos and unsubscribing. Do you think I've actually used this green screen for more than just hiding wall on a mess behind me There is this is a real image. Look at my hands waving around it. Look what it says. I'm trying to find my I'm touching the image I'm touching it says Microsoft employees expecting to know No, you see my finger 2024 therefore The the competition is gearing up for Nintendo's new system, which means If the competition is preparing it's because they think there's a realistic possibility it could happen Meaning that there are trained professionals who think it could happen. Therefore the conversation is at least worth having Dev kits Dev kits Do not Interesting until we have a even if we have a photo of a dev kit People are so me like well, it's that could be fake and it's true. It could be it could be that people are There's some amazing things that people can fake Yeah, amazing things Yeah, but I mean and I don't know like But I but I do like it now that people are kind of coming around and be like, okay Yeah, the thing exists, but can we get some real news? I'm like, no That's that's up to Nintendo just to be clear There is no real news until Nintendo says something So like Yeah, the news are that it exists the news is there's plans for the news is yeah There's some third parties that are thinking about bringing games to it cool, but What you want something more you want to know what it looks like Yeah, you're not going to know that till Nintendo shows us Unless it somehow does leak like this all the old that which Senses all the old that leak happened You can't rule out that there can't possibly be a manufacturing leak It is yeah theoretically possible because we just had it happen you imagine getting that four months early There's a man who literally came out like at like like the day before New Year's or New Year's or something Like like that was like December 31st. I think we got it And so and that didn't come out until what April And it wasn't announced until like two weeks before right so like We didn't know was real for like three more than three straight months or something Um, which is crazy Yeah, yeah, so can you imagine getting a switch to leaked? Three months ahead of time You know what you know what makes me think I think I think we're gonna know about switch to like I'll know this once we're within about six months of release. They will announce it I will not fall for another beat him up video claiming he has it Early like he did with his although that I will never fall for a video like that again Well, I don't know he he went back if you watched that whole video. He like says oh, I faked it. Oh, no, I didn't oh wait Yes, I did oh wait. No, I didn't he he explained later in the live stream that it was it was entirely faked He never he never had it early And he went through all the details and all the money he spent to actually make this thing come together I thought it was really really it was a very clever idea It blew that's one of his biggest videos in the last year So like it was clearly a really brilliant idea and I don't think it hurt his channel Plus you put the way he's a is it fake is it not fair? like um But I will never fall for that again if he's like, oh, I got the switch too early like literally the day it was announced I mean No, you don't look You'd here's the thing you had an initial video and then later on he had to The reason that um, it was seen as believable also the fact that his initial video didn't really explain that it was fake um was that He was one of the people like me that got the switch OLED early We actually got our hands on it about a week to two weeks before it actually came out so It it it became this believable thing that hey if some content creators got their hands on the switch OLED early Why couldn't the content creator get their hands on this early never mind that when we got our hands on the switch OLED early It was already announced for months I'm not like just announced But then oh but it leaks so maybe you got a I have a friend at a Chinese factory and Blah blah blah and I'm just like sure there's a long convoluted way where he spent millions of dollars to get access to this thing Early, you're correct. I And for a bit. I'm like maybe he did he's just got that kind of money He bought out a game stop like you know what maybe he's just got that kind of money. He's rolling it. It's cool Maybe I'm rolling in it. I don't know. I haven't checked my powerball numbers but I'm sure you will yes right now. She probably texted me. I don't even know where my phone is um But yeah, I don't know guys it That they're just I like talking about the next system because it's so obvious that it's probably coming next year at some point and it isn't that far away it within the next year and a half it's going to be in our hands and We are in Another transition period and this is the first time I've been in a transition period as a youtuber So this is like a really cool time for me I made some videos back on the Wii U days and stuff like that But like I wasn't really taking YouTube seriously until switch came out And this is the first I've never been through a console transition. I don't know what this is like I I'm a tech enthusiast. I'm always excited for what's next I don't know what this is going to be like because this transition is going to be nothing like the week There's something on the Wii U because look the Wii U didn't even exist When you transition I mean just be honest I mean you think about it think about all the popular Nintendo channels today Kind of happened to the switch and so this is It's going to be crazy, man I don't know what this is going to be like, but I'm I'm excited for the ride and You know, you have some content creators that are completely dedicated to just they want to be number one on switch two for everything Maybe that maybe it's a good bet if it's called switch two. It's a very good bet um, but I mean Give example a guy that I've been watching forever a guy. I've been watching him on youtube for like a decade obi one plays I remember him He's still going man He's still doing like a stream every day something's going on with switch two every day with that guy every day There's something switch two and you watch it. He's still exactly the same as he was back then nothing much has really changed And that's fine But it just hyping up. I I just don't know how there's that much to talk about I Look, I'm someone that makes quite a number of switch two videos I I really do like just in general. I know that I do like looking at my most recent content. It's like one two three uh four Five of like my last 15 videos are switch two videos. So it's like one out of every three or so And I don't even know how and honestly if it wasn't for the ftc case Most of those videos wouldn't have even existed Notice I haven't made a video on this mock-up. That's why a lot of the people watch you're like, what what what mock-up? What are you talking exactly? I haven't talked about it because I don't think it's worth talking about I just use I just use parts of it in my thumbnails sometimes and even then You know, you can even look back five days ago. Remember everyone thought this was real Five days ago on my channel nintendo switch two news gets interesting and what what image did I put in there? It's literally the box art mock-up Right, but the thing like you use random mock-ups forever. Yeah. Yeah, like two days before that like or sorry 10 days ago I use the old the old switch pro mock-up with the purple joy cons and like the little dock that fits multiple cartridges in Well, yeah, I use mock-ups all the time. So people didn't think anything of it Because I didn't think anything of it to be honest. I was like, whatever. Here's a new mock-up man We have a new mock-up in forever. Cool. I'll just use this but yeah, it's I don't know man I want them to announce it this year so bad Just so we have tangible things talk about I for those that want tangible yet. We all want it We just don't control when we get it I'll do something that we haven't touched on what watch the guy watch this guy be real And nintendo does announce it tomorrow And we're we're like talking shit this whole time Then all of a sudden nintendo actually drops a reveal trailer and we're like, what the fuck And it looks nothing like look it looks nothing like that of course because it's clearly fake But he was doing it as a troll as someone who actually knew they were about to reveal it That would be I don't I have no problem, but that would be insane. I have no problem with being wrong Um I sometimes I like being wrong. I like being wrong, too Sometimes I'm being skeptical even though it's something I want You know would be nice to be real like I think a lot of people were skeptical I think we created a lot of the skepticism around that zelda olad was when people saw those uh images They're like that's ugly. We don't want it to be real That's a lot of comments like that And um, sorry guys It's very much real. It's very much real. This is this is a real thing here Yeah, I'm sorry Um You know something else we haven't talked about what's that? I don't know how much longer we can touch on it. What is it? I think you may just yeah stream about it, but um the pokemon legends rumor Oh, sure. Yeah. Yeah, I guess I guess it was kind of circulating a week before did you talk about it last and and uh, I I didn't talk about it because I don't Am I knowledgeable enough to really sure sift through this stuff? So, you know what you why don't you? I'm actually glad you're here. You you give a nice breakdown of it because I still I tried talking about it yesterday And I'm still kind of like I I don't know. It's a rumor. I'm not gonna act like I understand every single little detail Um, I haven't done enough research. I understand every angle to this but basically So There is this leaker and They are a leaker. Uh, they go by the riddler And they go by the riddler or riddler coup. Yeah. Um, it's because uh, they but when they leak things they don't leak things They're like, hey, here's the image. It's leak. They they like to put little riddles and little hints and puzzles for us to kind of speculate Over and they're they constantly do this for pokemon and they've been hinting Um content and details about the pokemon games for now the last few years Consistently so basically whenever the riddler says something without a shadow of a doubt is real The only thing is because it's in riddle form. We're not never been wrong He's never been wrong But also we're not because it's a riddle. Is there sometimes conveniently No matter which way you take it. It's right If you pay attention to everything it's very clear He knows what he's talking about and what and once the information is is made clear like oh So that's what he was referring to. Yeah, like like He does that. Um, but it's very clever because it's a way that you can't ever say he's technically leaking because you can't Can shut down because she's not Telling you exactly what it is and it makes it more fun because it's kind of like every time he has something new to say It's a game. It's a speculate. We can it's a puzzle. It's it's it's it's like you're playing detective Yeah, so it's really fun actually And lately the riddler has been talking about the the scarlet and violet dlc But also hinting at what's to come afterwards And he's talked about how there will be a character that may hint at some story stuff that could Kind of translate over to the next pokemon game next year. He put out a a poll asking what kind of Generation five game would we like to see and there are four different options If I remember correctly one of them was um, like a let's go style another was like, um I'm not remembering everything correctly. Uh, like a black a black and white three So like pokemon generation five had black and white and then they made sequels black and white two So a third version, um, like a you know a trilogy, right? So that let's go style um legends or Or paradox, which is just kind of like a a neat, you know Maybe like the opposite of legends like instead of the past it's the future But point is he's hinting at something generation five is coming. Um But when you think about it, uh, and then There's there's other things that make sense because there's a lack of generation five pokemon of the pokedex And typically that does kind of It could be a clue that maybe they're going to have a game that will introduce more generation Five pokemon to kind of fill in the gap kind of like what legends are arceus did So there's been some clues. Um, the riddler's hinting at something generation five Related coming out next year. Uh, so I believe it because of his consistency now the question is what and Legends has been thrown out. He's acknowledged that the poll picked legends, right? He's like, huh? The legend seems to be quite, yeah, I'm looking at it right now. It's quite popular with the community right now Yeah, right. Yeah, so and what's interesting about this is that A legend's game makes a lot of sense for a few different reasons one and next year will not be Or it's it's it's still too early for a new generation. So it's going to be a current generation game But it can't it's not going to be, you know, they this is the dlc So there's definitely going to be a game a game coming out next year for sure They're not going to skip a year. They don't do that if they skip a year to get this dlc So for sure, we're getting a pokemon game next year, but it's not going to be next generation So then what's left maybe a remake of some kind But the thing is about remakes, especially when we talk about generation five We got generation four remakes Not that long ago holiday 2021 And before that it was seven years With generation three remakes in 2014 and before that it's been five year increments So to then expect a three year interval between remakes I'm skeptical of that but to play devil's advocate if they did three years They would be averaging the the remake gaps to five, but it just seems unlikely So then you consider okay. Well, maybe they do a let's go style Which is kind of like a remake by a different direction, right? So let me do like let's go jodo or something instead except let's go jodo wouldn't be generation five, right? So maybe they could do like let's go Something you know of something like they could do that But if you look at the sales of um pokemon let's go compared to pokemon legends I think you can make a really good strong case that pokemon legends is a is a better idea So sales wise pokemon. Let's go Pikachu and Eevee Total out to about 15.1 million if we round to the nearest tenth right of a million But um legends arceus is at 14.8 Pokemon let's go came out holiday 2018 Pokemon arceus came out In the beginning of 2022 It was just one game. It was not given a a a dedicated holiday season It was cut off immediately in terms of attention because of um pokemon scarlet and violet And yet despite all that and it having less time it's right under it And people love it people love it. It's actually the highest rated pokemon mainline pokemon game on switch And if you also fact during that let's go was actually the first hd pokemon games And it was based on kanto Those things probably bolstered sales a lot to 15 million if they were doing another let's go game With it not being kanto and it not and it not having the advantage of being the first hd pokemon game It'll probably perform less But but a legends game if it's given a year of marketing Right if it's given a holiday season if it's treated like the big game release Yeah, it doesn't have btsp right before it and scramble right after exactly So it would have a huge chance to probably exceed 15 million. Well, I know let's go game most likely will be under 15 million So what makes more sense a legends game or a let's go game? We know how business-oriented pokemon company is So you could argue that let's go game would be less a resource intensive Which might make up for the fact that it won't sell as much But a legitimate case can be made that a pokemon legends game based off You know a generation five Is coming out next year I mean you look at the sales you also look at obviously all the hints and the rumors here You glance at things like you know critical reception It's what the highest reviewed and the highest user score Like it is literally Like everyone said oh, yeah the visuals aren't the greatest but everything else is They nailed it. They nailed it. They nailed it. They nailed it. They love it Legends is Right now like the while it's not selling scarlet and violet type stuff a new gen it is One of the most highly respected I think of all the pokemon games that have come out During the switch era. It just makes a lot of sense to to come right back Drop another one with another popular You know game tied to it somehow. I don't know if they're going back to the past I don't know the world in the future that's for them to worry about what they're doing with it But you tie it to you know what's being hinted at you know black and white you know But all the stuff I I think that it could end up I mean you give it a full cycle you get a full like nine months full year whatever whenever they decide to announce it Uh to advertise that you push it as a big holiday game I mean Also switch just coming out next year and it'll be on both probably it'll probably be on both Yeah, I mean it could be combined Combined between both systems if there's a separate specific version for the next one It's not just the same cartridge for both, but we don't know but if there is a separate version It would probably just be like oh, it's higher resolution or higher frame rate or something um I mean you could be talking about a 20 million seller I think I think it's got as long as they're bringing it on both Which clearly what the pokemon company doesn't like abandoning I I mean, I have a I think it would probably do better than let that mean like I don't think it I don't know think it'll top whatever scottland violet ends up at but I think probably not that but if as an in between Generation and a single game release pop it off at 20 and if it hits the critical reception again Everyone loves it again. I'm like So another interesting there's another interesting detail. Um, I'm trying to remember his name. I think it's is it ingo There is a A yunova black and white character that's in legends arceus He's like the only other character that was like warped from another world for another time into the game besides yourself and If you look at the the the history of pokemon games, they always have some sort of subtle detail That's alluding to whatever's next. Yeah So that might be it. I might be misremembering his name But it's the guy who was the captain or the uh, the train conductor for the battle subway in gen in gen five so It's weird that he's there So and there's a huge part of me that just wants this to be real because let's just be honest I'm so very scared. I'm very scared that legends is a one-off and it better not be But it it's it's said to not be though. It's set up not to be it's just they could have just called it pokemon arceus But they didn't they call them pokemon legends Legends arceus setting it up to be a series of pokemon games. Yeah, but granted legends sound school So it's a very cool name too. I like the name. It's very Yeah, I I really hope that this is real obviously there's Several hints. We'll we'll have to wait and see obviously as we get closer to reveal You know, there'll be four more hints dropped, but The and so there's something else about this that some people may be like Well, if they do this they also have to give us a remake I don't think they do I think, you know, there's there's there's a kind of a scenario where It's not going to be called pokemon legends. You know, right? That's gonna it would be called pokemon legends q-rim Yeah, it would be based off like the the ancient dragon Actually, I was speaking to some people in the comments for my video on this That the idea was thrown out that maybe they could go back to medieval era That would be a sweet era gen five has a lot though their legendaries are all dragons That would be that would be sick. See that's that might make it my favorite pokemon game of all time and pass the era they go with It would be super cool I'd be all in on that That would be sick. Yeah Now the flip side is it may be because like the scott and via has I never get excited for pokemon But I was stoked for our season and it paid off Yeah the interesting thing about um That this like another consideration is that um scholar and violet has this motif of like past and future And legends came out right before and that's obviously past The the idea the reason why paradox you know that has been thrown out these paradoxes are first like the paradox pokemon that are from different times It's because Like maybe maybe they instead of going to the past to go into the future And what's interesting about that? Um is that well one they would be kind of completing them like the motif of past and future But also you know va is based off from not mistaken Like it's based off the united states, but specifically new york hence why they have the the buildings and the bridges Can you imagine like if they were to kind of go more in that direction where it's like a very futuristic world that you explore That'll be a totally different direction Um I i'm gonna say that's not what's happening because Then you don't call it legends probably doesn't fit with the legends right like either maybe you call it Legends feels like it's something from a long time ago right pokemon prophecy might be like a nice Contrast to that That's a nice name. Sorry. That's just a really nice thing. Yeah I don't I'm not even like this big big pokemon guy although. I've been more into it recently Mostly thanks to rcs and I you know I I had my moments of enjoying scarlet and violet I think scarlet invites a good game. It just has a lot of performance problems Yeah, and I used I used to I don't care. I don't care and then I don't know man The more and more I played of it the more and more I started running into the problem It does feel incomplete though because you can't go inside any of the houses in the town Yeah, yeah, there's games. Yeah, like if you That's the thing about scarlet and violet um is The the setting aside all the bugs. Yes, they deserve to be trashed for all all that crap. Absolutely Sucks should not have released in that state and certainly by now should have had a patch to fix some of it and it hasn't But I will say that setting all that aside There are just some things about it that sort of still felt like it was incomplete And that's the one thing that you can't go inside all the houses or Even most of them to be honest you can't go inside anything that's not like not a shop basically Um and it's it's kind of it's weird It's weird because you could do that in prior games and I could do it in arceus. I know it was only one Town basically, but there were a couple hidden villages to have a tent Um, it's not a significant, but no, right? But like even still I can walk into your tent like I remember going like And I get it arceus is a smaller scale technically uh, but It's still a massive scale compared to some pokemon games. I just I don't I I think to me it's like the contrast of arceus pretty much not buggy Yeah, people didn't think the visuals were that impressive then people loved gameplay Felt like pokemon yet something new and fresh Gameplay Look, look it wouldn't I I still like I mean, this is a really opposite letter gameplay is also really good. Yeah, there are different types of gameplay I still prefer legends But I will say for the way the mainline games have been I enjoy the scarlet and violet gameplay more than I had prior pokemon games um, I still I mean catching pokemon to me is still my favorite thing that like arceus just has that hands down to me compared to scarlet and violet But it is better in scarlet and violet to me than it has been in the past In some instances when it's not glitching it's a little I don't want to get it Some of the things that we've all edited don't need to be the dead horse. We all know the things that Happen in that game sometimes. Yeah um, but yeah, it's I don't know. Uh, just something something about that game felt like It to me the big contrast was scarlet and violet is pretty good If you get past the glitches and you ignore some of the things that feel a little bit incomplete But the problem is we just got that game off of arceus that felt like nothing was incomplete And it didn't have any of these bugs And you go from that to that it was just like a big contrast In polish, I guess maybe that's the way to put it polish and attention to detail maybe I I do wish I mean And I know So it's like really hard to come every time we talk about pokemon this comes up, right? Like I think I think they should have four year gaps between generations. Um, you know, I don't want to Make games. Yeah, I mean we agree. We we agree. I just don't want to beat a dead horse because I feel like it's not Any pokemon fan disagree. I think they all would like to see fully polished fleshed out games every time Yeah, I will but I will say this still about legends game because I know as we talk about this legends game Some some have the sentiment that we listen. We don't want them to rush out another game, but they're going to Oh, it's gonna happen. Oh, it's gonna happen because everybody keeps buying them the only way look Look the only thing I think I could think of if it wasn't legends and again The the the rumors are really hinting towards that anyways What have been if they rushed out another btsp situation and I with that other if it's another team working on it Yeah, it would be that same team because it's sold well enough Three year gap for another. Yeah, that actually would be like they could do that Uh, I kind of hope they don't I really don't like I I but I could see why they might justify it because it probably was a very small investment for them for a Pretty big return. Yes, then business wise it makes sense. I just I don't well legends I mean, who knows may here's the thing They already made legends. So if they're just using the same engines and the same graphics anyways Theories shouldn't have any of the bugs also by making dlc this year That's not as much of a development load as a whole game And also they're pushing out the dlc a bit. I don't know if you guys have noticed It's more spaced out The sword and shields dlc was a wave one was summer wave two was holiday Now wave one is holiday and wave two sometime early next year So they've given themselves more time with this dlc And a legend's game which might be made by the second team, you know, we'll likely have had And by time it would come out if it comes up say holiday, right kind of spacing it a little bit after the dlc Like that would be three years since arceus and it's not like arceus is like a huge game Yeah Not quite it would be it would be three. It'll be two years and three quarters. But it's close Yeah, or two actually probably we don't know how you took to make the first one. Sure It'll probably two years and 10 months which rounds up to near three. Um, I I think consider I I don't think that's I my point is is that There's reason to think that let that a legends curem Would probably be about as good if not a little bit better and more polished and let than legends arceus. Absolutely. So All right, probably won't be perfect though. Yeah I I I predict there will still be issues. There will still be complaints, but I think it'll be a little bit It won't be as bad I'll say this I I'm gonna give a massive benefit of the doubt at the next one is a legends game They know it's just because the last one gave me faith and maybe that's my problem Just because they got faith for me. I shouldn't give them faith because they'll use and abuse it but They made a good game super stoked my biggest thing now with like oh ones whenever they do the next generation game or whatever The next game in the scarlet and violent engine. I'm gonna sit there and I'm just gonna sit back and go I'm gonna wait and see I'm not buying it day one. That's the last my day one sales Even though I I I enjoy scarlet might they lost my day one sale the next game in that engine until they proved to me They I'm not excited for the dlc like I saw a dlc. It looks good, but the way I I don't even know how to buy it Right now We'll see I'm gonna wait till it comes out. I obviously I keep waiting for a performance patch And I know it wasn't I'm a bigger pokemon fan than you and I'm still not sure I'll probably buy it, but it depends on timing. Yeah. Yeah. There's something else comes out too I don't want to play instead. Yeah like metro prime for um If we're talking about wave 2 if they come out like for for march. Yeah, probably but even like I'm already going I'm like, well, you know mario wonder and mario rpg all the yields from time for me So like that'll give me through the holidays. Those are higher up on mine. Yeah, those will give me through the holidays easy So, yeah, I'm gonna skip detective Pikachu and warrior wear probably, but I am not the mart I'm gonna wait. I'm gonna wait for reviews. I'm detective Pikachu to see because I really like the first one Yeah, I'm gonna see what reviews say of it. I will say I do like the idea of a detective game That does sound fun. But visually it just I mean, look anything that hasn't been like new pokemon snap visually hasn't been great Pokin tournament's pretty sick. Okay. Yeah, we're talking about games that are made by third party companies that care Yeah, like know how to make good-looking games basically Gamefreak still like I don't even I I'm not even convinced that that scarlet violent engine isn't another modification of the 3ds engine at this point I'm just not I don't know Um, I again, I don't know Maybe the details are out there what engine it is now, but I want to see a pokemon stadium game Like some I would love that so much Or at least just the mini games. Give me the yeah, that's what I'm saying Like you can have the stadium and have the big thing where you become the champion Also the mini games the mini games are so great They're so great pokemon party. I'll do it. I'll buy it Oh Why they need why hasn't that been a thing yet? Come on. You try it amiibo festival. You can give us a pokemon party game like the mario party series. Come on Oh, man, dude. I just want I just want an updated version of ekans ring toss With all my online friends that works, you know pokemon stadium one and two remake actually would be crazy good Yeah, even just remake it Yeah, because like when we were doing it during prime gaming fast students, we noticed that like, okay The controls are a little finicky touchy with today's controllers Now, maybe it's better if we would have actually had the n64 ones that we made So maybe that would have fixed it, but just using the pro they were really touchy compared to what the controls used to be Like you you barely pull the right stick back to lawn check-ins and that that he just Just sucks it all the way across the map. I'm like, am I only moved the stick like I can't even tell I moved it Yeah, but you know, that's the way sometimes it goes when you're emulating and bringing in all games sometimes It doesn't really work perfect. It is what it is switch. Why no, it's the best system of all time what Excluding the switch. Why no, it's the best system of all time The switch excluding the switch excluding the switch. Do you want to know what's the best system of all time? I know what the best system of all time is excluding switch, but you tell me what's your Yeah, this is obviously opinion. So no, it's not it's not it's not it's fact We're not talking about the sales. We're talking about Okay, all right, we got to say at the same time We're gonna be disagree so ready One one two three go on go. Okay one two three go nintendo super nintendo You're you're wrong No, I mean, that's pretty good choice. It's pretty good choice. I would say it's hard to knock super nintendo It's pretty very hard to knock super nintendo. That's a very good era of gaming I just thought of it because I was just thinking about how like we were talking about the pokemon stadium games And I was like, um, man, I remember like single player pokemon games outside Like legend is really good, but then I was thinking you know, I was thinking about oh, well, there was pokemon Colosseum and pokemon uh Gala darkness Like those are really good pokemon games on the game He was like, well, so if you had two really good single player pokemon games Absolutely, but then also to pick them one and two And metro frame one and two and moomaker and twilight and resident evil four the original and resident evil zero and louis just mentioned And eternal darkness and mario sunshine Gamecube is one of those. It doesn't have a very big library. The problem is every games of anger There's it doesn't have a big library, but they're all good So many games so many games odama bet and kaitos one two Two before I don't disagree game A lot of a lot of good a lot of games that were on dream cast that were brought over to switch I almost wanted to troll them and go comment or 64 I just like 64 the neo geo. I I only I wouldn't I wouldn't even Know what I know. I should have one for the game. I should have one with game boy color and I said Try me you want to try me with games game boy color. You want try me right now game boy color Would have because I can go all the way back to the og game boy. Game boy color would have been an effective troll because You would have enough material to make an argument But I would still strongly disagree super nintendo It kind of just comes down to what your preference is because super nintendo Is like the opinion epitome of 2d gaming hangers. Yeah, I mean it is the epitome of 2d gaming Hangers man like every third part is all the third party games You like fighting games. It's got all of them. You like rpgs. It has all of them. Oh, yeah, I mean from rpg like It means got chrono trigger, right? Like we're just all the final fantasies So think of it like this the big three the big three, right? Um, it's got super mario world It's got linked to the past. It's got super metroid And all three of those games are like the greatest games of all time for for large audiences. Yeah, that's crazy Super nintendo is with my favorite system until switch Gamecube is First 3d. I've always loved gamecube on nintendo with star fox. I've always loved gamecube I don't know that I could have reported ahead of the n64 But it's there There's an argument to be had the gamecube better I Can listen on an argument. I mean, I also I think gamecube is better Like that's why that's obviously obviously I enjoy games on n64 a bit more than the ones on gamecube Sure, but we're not arguing. It's we're we're arguing gamecube versus super nintendo. Yeah, I know, right? Yeah, that's why I was here's here's one thing you can concede to me that super nintendo That's a pretty legit than one to say I can understand the argument I mean you got earthbound like there's if you just think about like the rpgs If you're an rpg fan, you can just get lost For years on super nintendo, right? but like I think like gamecube like let's think of it like this if we had the entire library Of super nintendo and all the peripherals needed and the entire library of gamecube all the peripherals needed And there is a apocalypse where you had to be locked in a underground facility for a few years with a few people You have all the food and stuff you need but you can only pick one for entertainment one entertainment system, right? I would pick gamecube why Well, there's a lot of reasons why because I think the library is better personally But I am biased right because but I was born in the early 90s. I didn't really play that much super nintendo, right? Because I was a baby um but Gamecube that was when I was growing up like for realsies, but also it has four player games, right? Like it's it's a bet. It's a way better party system Sure, but I mean I'm locked in a basement in a cellar. I don't really have three friends with me If if you're by yourself, I guess I can see where you you can make the argument for super nintendo But if you have at least a few people also if I have four people I'll just take it on 64 No, but Eric look we should have involved Eric in the conversation because I know he's gonna go in 64 And uh, he can give a very strong argument that's right. He'll just start rattling off the games It's just just like you different game. You'd be like, oh, that's a nice list on gamecube. You got here now Let me just show you the superior list and 64 if you can get to like 30 game You can give it like 60 We could do this He's just like we have conkers you're you're out. You're out. We have multiplayer Oh, yeah, well Andrew Kazooie and banjo 2e Okay, star fox adventure mario 64 octane of time star fox assault star fox 64 donkey kong jungle beat dunk kong konga Donkey kong konga too. Yeah, right? Kirby's air ride Kirby's air ride was sweet. Pickman's one and two. Sure Sure We did just establish nobody plays them But we don't also establish they're good games 89 and 90. Yeah. First of all, first of all, it's not like n64 got a lot of sales either No, no, for sure. No, I better than gamecube better than gamecube. Yes, better than gamecube. Yes I mean, you gotta remember like you're rallying off games. I mean, you look you want to go genre for genre I might not always be able to be done get diddy kong racing. Yep So a second a second mark our double dash at zero gx Mario Kart 64 and diddy kong racing. What are we? What are we? At zero x by the way, we have enough zero game. Yeah, but as your jax is better rock squadron Star Wars. Oh, yeah, Star Wars work squadron. That's right wave race to wave race 64 Gamecube have ropes wave race 64 with the og paper mario back in the day, of course a thousand year door Thousand year door. I get it. I get it. By the way, by the way I'll give it an odd by the way If you you can bring up octree time and draw his mask But there is this such a thing as the the special collectors Version on gamecube. Yeah, but not everyone can get that It was very limited if we're talking about the hypotheticals where we have the libraries by the way by them individually By the way, I had it. I had two had it so people had it right it would exist it That's fine. It's still better. So it's still better with the n64 controller. So i'm good I know you had the master mode the master that was pretty cool. I mean gold gold nine perfect dark golden eye Perfect dark. You had the good mario mario golf. We also had pokemon snap the og great pokemon puzzle league was really great Yeah Can't forget those stadium good games Yes stadium we did a stadium I know coliseum so a stadium like Can't deny stadiums. It's got a good mario tennis and golf. What the actual good mario tennis and golf for sure Yeah, yeah, we have the good. We have some good sports games Oh, tony hawk pro skater two we had that too time splitter Time splitter is good time splitter is good There were tony hawk games on gamecube as well See i'm gonna say super smash rolls but that's because I like it more than melee and I know that's sacrilege to many I mean I like break the target baby break the target wasn't in melee I love break the target for one of my favorite modes in smash But I know doom 64 Animal crossing and this animal this animal crossing had classic Nintendo games built in Okay Star Wars episode one racer That was a pod racer was the awesome. What are you talking about on my switch and I think that's on switch You got to play back in the day. We have better games today. Come on Mario strikers. That's a good one Yeah, my strikers 1080 snowboarding I mean you don't even get me starting on snowboard kids. Isn't that also on gamecube I have no idea what it was started. It was on n64 first. I don't care if it was on gamecube Yeah, conquer the bad fur days also on xbox. What's your point? We had the better online. No, it's not the better multiplayer No, the single player is fine blocking that out of my mind. No, no the single player is fine. No, you're right Yeah, it's gorgeous. It's just a multiplayer. They've fucking it Oh, by the way, we actually had good wrestling games back then like wwf no mercy By the way, you brought up rogue squadron just just for the record like game you had rogue squadron 2 Campbell southern ones better What what like oh by the way, did I forget to mention perfect dark? I'm just we can keep going. We can keep going. It doesn't end. We're at the You brought up Kirby. I totally forgot about Kirby 64 in the crystal shard. I'm just saying great game. It's a great game it is It is like we can just keep going. You're like 30 games. I'm already like 50 games deep over here I can just keep going. We have to actually you know what we have to do We have to do a stream where we just list off the games And like like like a like a google doc so people can see we just kind of like Point for point I think that would be a that's like that's a good stream idea Like it could it could just literally be like gamecube versus m64 and just We talk about each game Yeah, there's so I'm literally just go we had to send in punishment It said the punishment was great Was it yes Can't forget we still had Mortal Kombat back then Full trilogy by the way, there were fighting games on gamecube But also legends so caliber two is the best fighting game. So don't go dude. So It was awesome. So park back. That game was that game was sick Yeah, more wrestling games. Wcw vs. w o revenge. Yeah wrestling games on gamecube two Okay, but I'll see you listen. I'm so it's clearly not part of your argument of enjoyment Well, I mean there is I'm I'm telling you games. I actually played and enjoyed Okay, well, I'm literally skipping games. I didn't play That that I'm seeing on this like there's like like this aiding chronic. I don't know MBA street volume three with the mario characters Yeah What are you not in your head for It wasn't a good game. Yeah You're bringing up nonsense. You say that's not a good game spy hunter. I enjoyed that. I'm bringing up not I'm bringing up games. I do even enjoy those games that you're listening right now I had them in my gamecube and I enjoyed them. Yes. Okay, at least you can okay shadowgate 64 I don't know what that is. Oh Oh my It's one of the greatest Okay, I'm leaving alone. It's a top 10 rpg all time. I'm just Holy shit. I don't get 64. Yeah, I don't know what this is trial the four tower I've never I guess Uh, I didn't really play killer instincts. Oh my god, bro killer instinct though. That's a good one I'm not that big in the fighting games But I actually did play mortal combat and like primal rage and stuff back then no offense, but shadowgate 64 looks dull as hell A lot of it's before games just don't have not aged well Dude game all gamecube games look like shit. Yeah, you're talking about right that that Is Yeah, I expect n64 to look like shit. I think gamecube. I'm like, oh man. It's almost a wee But it's just not Was there another curry game on game ogre battle 64 Raymond too the great escape that was great. That was a good one Blast corpse Hell yeah tank action, baby. Oh we had harvest moon 64. I forgot about harvest moon Some both I don't know it has 64 in the name It's a man 64 automatically better if it has to number 64 in the title We have a bunch of mario party games. I know so the gamecube mario party is always a bunch of party games and everything So that's all personal preference. I wish we didn't like more. We had the last excitement with seven 64 mario baseball Hmm The mario sports titles are Well done. Oh, do we make a man 64? I forgot about that Yeah, there's something pretty good Pilot win 64 by the way It's a good one. Yeah, we had resident evil two by the way. I know you had four Two's pretty good. Yeah, but we got resident evil four and zero We also have castlevania legacy of darkness by the way Just one of one of the best castlevanians of all time that I bring up the Metal gear remakes Not that. No, you didn't this is the first time There you go. That's a big deal. That's a big deal I never played p.m. Yeah, I actually like that get mission impossible expect the impossible It's a ridiculous name, but it actually is a pretty good game Oh, we had duke duke 64. I forgot about that duke duke duke I think I think uh, we should probably Dude, I can keep going all night at this baby. This is nothing you're looking at a list I'm just saying stuff off the top of my head I'm looking at a list because we just established before I played through games one. Alicia gank you ddr mario I played through games once, you know, so like I don't replay so they don't always stick I gotta be remind to be like, oh, what was that game? You can eric and I do this all the time. What was that game never just sitting here? What the hell is it? What is it? What is it? Oh wave race bluestorm Yeah, 64 is better Look at him. He's like It's really better if it has the number 64 That's what it felt like back then any game that had 64 in it quest 64 and I was standing Oh elusive man with beautiful joe. There's beautiful joe one and two. Oh killer seven Yeah, killer seven's good Yeah, I mean Look, we have conkers after that and you got no rare games So you mean that's not true with star fox adventures. That's it though And it's not as good as it's not as good as star fox 64 Or it's also star fox assault, which is tremendously underrated. Yeah, really good multiplayer game. I will say it is underrated. That's for sure Yeah The holy magic sentry. Oh, that was a good game. That was a really good rpg That was a really good rpg bomber man 64 So we're going to rock back to rock was actually good super monkey ball one and two So jet force gem and I Yeah, that's that's a that's a stinger. Yeah, I knew that was going to be a stinger. I'm like gem Yeah, that's that's a real if you guys haven't played jet force gem and I you guys got to find a way to play. That's awesome It's really good Well, I mean you mentioned let's just talk about the big hitters here for a moment When waker in twilight princess I believe you Like more than offering a time in major's mask No, major's mask is literally like my number three game of all time So major's mask makes up for the fact. Well, first off Occurring a time in major's mask are also on gamecube right So sure, but you don't like the control options for those. No, I prefer it in 60 level and let me ask you a question Be honest with me Occurring you get our current time major is mask on in 64 or you get Occurring a time a major is mask the gamecube versions of those and when waker in twilight princess What are you honestly picking? There's no way come on. There's no way you prefer the n64 version major is mask so much That you would not pick the gamecube zelda offerings. Also. We got four swords Um on on the game four swords adventures. Yeah, I know. I'm aware. I played it beat it back in the day when I was good That's another little thing cables had eric over and all the people saying that that's that's how I remember having a birthday party But if you were playing uh We got five zelda game playing gamecube. They're pretty damn good I do have to give look if we're gonna start as you're gonna start being like that I could just talk about how like We hit we have We we have an accessory That allows me to play games from a completely different generation And I can start talking about all the zelda games I have then Oh, you're not aware of some of the accessories available Shall we start listing the accessories that make other games playable from prior nintendo lab worms? That does assist the 64 disk drive allow That or you're talking about something else? You're not talking about the the gameboy transfer pack. Are you? No, not that Uh, what are you talking about? I'm gonna leave it alone. I'm gonna leave it at that But to answer your question you you got the fives all the games. It's hard to deny the the the gamecube um I the gamecube might also have like a really like Rare um peripheral attachment that also allows it to play other games But there's also actually there is a game boy advanced player. There's a game boy advanced player I believe so go for it that that gives you a lot of the super nintendo games. I know but I I love majority of the game We should this has to be its own podcast. We got it. We got it. I honestly like More than win waker and twilight princess with the gutted versions It's not that bad I mean, I do like the master mode. Um, the master edition of ocarina time, but also like okay Like the only reason it was interesting is because of the original game Don't they also run a little bit better on the gamecube, too? Like aren't they a little? I I that I have no recollection of like I think I think the rule the only point of context here Is you just don't like the controller? Oh, I love the n64 what was made for the n64 controller, so sure, but I mean you You get over that pretty quick for the sake of being stubborn I'm sticking with major's mask And oh, wait, wait, I guess I'll have another reason this this is where nostalgia comes in You guys know I rank ocarina time outside of my top 10 Zelda games by the way rumble However, if it wasn't for ocarina of time, I wouldn't be a youtuber It is what led me on the path to content creation on the internet Yeah, literally. I made a zelda fansite that led to all of this because of ocarina of time You could have become an ocarina time buying on gamecube though Nope I would have I would have been older and I was a four sport athlete and I was too busy I want to even thought about making websites or doing any of that stuff Literally once if it was the right time in my life I was I was 12. I wasn't busy all the time I don't understand this argument So doggie said asked me if you're going to discard ocarina time of doors mask on n64 Then we'll make her in 12 prints is also have to be discarded on gamecube. No, they don't We're not discarding anything. Oh, I think I think he's I think he's saying because those games are available on other platforms This is probably what he's pointing out. We're comparing n64 versus gamecube Yeah, and he's probably thinking that you shouldn't count n64 games ported over I think is what he's trying to say Yeah Well, I mean like like literally if we only have one system That I know I know that's the thing when it comes to the value of the system Yeah, like it like so the games are there Glover I mean The thing is that your system has But I forgot about shadows of the empire Oh, man, that game was great. Let's just put it this way. You're not going to go wrong either way Well, let me put it this way Anybody that picks a system To take with them Into the depths of hell to just play forever You're going to pick whatever system is your favorite. If I'm honest, it'd be the switch anyways It wouldn't be any of it But we're excluding the switch in the conversation problem is the switch ends the conversation The switch I mean the switch has You say this You gotta remember the caveat of the switch do we have internet we don't have internet then we don't have nso Yeah, there's them Well, the thing is the effect more games you can play too because some like it's platoon really matter if you don't have internet Thing internet's changed a lot a lot of games like Suddenly a lot of values lost without internet Yeah, that is a fantastic point I do believe that you can play the nso games without online. You just have to have the initial connection Yeah, but if you have no internet, there is no connection. Well, I mean assuming you If my switch right now if it's not connected internet, I could play every single game that's loaded onto there Yeah, because you've had a connection But eventually it's going to ask you to reconnect and if you don't have internet you lose access When does it ask that? It's like once a month Because I want to confirm you're still subscribed. I think there's no way I'll be I can go into airplane mode for more than a month To find out how long I mean you could but like if I would you know like just to prove me wrong But it does check. I know that it has a check. Yeah, that is tough Yeah, well the beautiful thing is I don't play nso games enough to know every time I do it's always checking to make sure This is a hypothetical situation that's never going to happen because all right Like if you're are going to create yourself a bunker for a hypo for an apocalyptic scenario And you do want to think about entertainment if you have the resources to set this up The you probably can get more probably all the systems Yeah, right every system and every well, maybe not every game But all the system but you can you can set yourself up so you can have pretty much everything Yeah, yeah, yeah Yeah, you you I mean that's the thing in in the situation. It's not realistic anyways because you could just get everything It's it's more of like one of those gun pointed the head Which system would you choose? And there is only one right answer But the problem is you don't know what the right answer is because you're thinking your opinions But you're trying to think what's that person's opinions like I knew when you said, you know, let's say systems I'm like, oh, we're gonna say the same system I'm like you're gonna say game cube and I'm not gonna say game I knew you were gonna say game cube before we like just knowing the kind of games you enjoy I'm like, he's gonna say game cube. Yeah, and I'm gonna say part of it And I thought I thought when I said snes my age Like I also thought when I said snes you might go I can actually respect that because snes has I do I do it's it's it's the last time nintendo had full third party support All the games from third parties back then seemed to just be great Yeah, I had a lot of great games super metro Yeah, by the way, I love n64 right that was Yeah, yeah, yeah, you weren't dissing n64. Yeah, right That's probably one of your first systems you probably got into that that I mean technically the first game I remember it's a super nintendo game. Sure the first system. I actually played games on consistent It was probably n64. It was n64. That was my my first personal system. Yeah. Yeah I just think there are more games on game cube That you enjoy that that have aged better That's the other thing like going back to n64 some games are kind of depressing to play That makes any sense You know like Not all of them, but a lot of them. Well, I have a lot of nostalgia for almost every game back then So like it just feels good. Yeah, it just feels right. I was really happy about the the That time crisis Dinosaur hunter to rock Torok the remaster they put on switch. That's actually a really good remaster. Yeah, it's a really good remaster I'm glad they didn't mess that up. I I'd be to rock used to be really good Awesome back in the day The series went to crap and I'm really glad I was so scared they're gonna mess up the remaster It's a nice little visual upgrade. Yeah, it's something like super crazy. It still looks like it. It looks it's nice Um, just there's a lot of people um In the chat correction nintendo had all the japanese third party support they uh on snes They had a lot of western third party support too back on snes It just so happened that a lot of games were made in japan He actually looked at um the market back then, you know, gotta remember What was snes's number one competitor the genesis? Where do these companies come from japan? Like back then a majority of video games were actually being made from japan So like when you talk about correction had all japanese, there wasn't that many western developers back then There really wasn't because you're like, oh ea. Yeah, it had all the ea games Like It had the western there just wasn't as many being made back then um, but that really changed I want to say Probably during the n64 gamecube ps2 Kind of in that range. We started getting a lot more western studios popping up I just looked up the The the highest rated gamecube games This is a really nice list some games that didn't bring up There's a few quite a few sports games on here um The sports games back in the day were legit quarterback club 98. I should have brought that one up All the core all yeah, but quarterback club 98 specifically brett farbrunch a little run to the right Something that didn't bring up that is a really key game. I would say prince of persia It's a good nice That's a good game The original resident evil is also remade and bring it up only brought up zero and four There's actually a few really highly rated tony hawk games on gamecube tony hawks pro skater four and three No, there's several football games that apparently are like extremely high rated which mba2k I'm surprised. There's golf games tony hawks underground There's a lot of highly rated sports games. It's kind of blowing my mind. Oh burnout Yeah, because the sports games used to be legit back in bro. You got tom klancy splinter skill burnout two I didn't I only brought up mba volume a street volume three, which is a rated 88. I'm metacritic by the way You were throwing some flak at that. That's pretty high Um, do I know it's higher than volume three mba street volume two Right above it I brought up time splitters but time splitters too is that this is specific when I meant I mean time I mean you want to talk about high rated. I mean, we have, you know, ocarina of time in the 99 Perfect dark of the 97. Isn't ocarita about a 98 99 i'm metacritic What? It's the highest rated game of all time. I'm right. Yeah, I thought it was a 98. No, it's 99 I'm the only 99 in metacritic history For I for my I don't know why I don't know if this like revisionist history or my my brain's like because I always thought it was A 98 98 already almost one o'clock for you too Yeah, that'll do it I'm I'm just curious now. I'm bringing up the gamecube list as well Because I want to I want to see them side by side just review wise um Smaller sympathizer reviews back in the n64. Well, yeah, small sympathizing gamecube compared to today too Right, but yeah, like like the top one's what metroid prime We have ocarita time two points higher perfect dark. This is number two and 97 Resident Evil 4 and 96 what list are you looking at? I'm looking at the uh I'm on metacritic. Yeah, I'm on metacritic Perfect. Oh, the perfect dark is the game game. I was I was thinking of eternal darkness. I was like, yeah, perfect dark 97 By the way I didn't bring up beyond 64 I mean, do we do you even want to bring up the the mario game on gamecube? Do you even try to compare mario sunshine is try to compare mario 64 is great Yeah, yeah, everyone knows that Uh paper mario 93. Oh tales of symphonia Is paper mario is oh What's thousand-year door rated? Oh man, there's I'm going through this list. I'm just other games. Wow thousand-year door Where is that to see star online fire emblem path of radiance ekeruga? Oh, come on Yeah, by the way, there's there's more than one prince of persia game on switch skies of arcadia There's more than one banjo kazooie game by the way on the 64. Yeah, it's called both of them There's there's there's more there's just we just try not to acknowledge the other one hit man another prince of persia There is a harvest moon. Oh custom robo Yeah By the way, um lord the ring the lord of the rings nfl blitz 2000. Oh, yeah. Oh, that was that was the bomb That was the bomb Yeah, forgot about that one. Oh the neruda clash of ninja games. Those were good. It's a good fighting games Oh, but there is a good there's also more to combat deadly alliance. That was a good moral combat game I will say to your point final thanks probably large today's sports games number 37 on the uh game on the game cube This is a 80 overall and number 37 on uh, sorry 37 on n64 is 80 Overall and 37 on game cube is 88 So just pointing out you have more higher rated games I'm already on 143 and we're still at the 78s on game Yeah, you're 143. Let me go down 143 is luigi's mansion. Yeah. No, it it drops down. I'm on n64 right around 50 51 oh harry potter the chamber secrets There's a lot of um There's like how many how many reviews are you even on? Yeah, like like a Sunshines Mario 64 Oh Beach spikers virtual beach volleyball Here we go. Here we go I will I got a warrior wear warrior wear was warrior wear was on game cube. All right Sunshine is better than n64 change your mind Uh, I'm not going to try to change your mind because look there I I liken the mario 64 to sunshine comparison to the Zelda one to zelda two comparison They are so completely different in so many ways That if you really love sunshine, there's no way to convince you that mario 64 is better Because it's just the things it does doesn't happen in 64 Now is it widely is 64 widely considered the better game? Yeah, and just like for zelda zelda one is widely considered better than zelda two But like me, I'm like the black sheet. I love zelda two It's my second favorite zelda game or now third favorite zelda game of all time Actually, I got to move it down against majority mass like this is for now. I forgot that cheers to the kingdom Is now on the list. So cheers to the kingdom breath of the wild zelda two then majority mask Feels weird feels weird like zelda two that much that's interesting. I love zelda two But that's the thing I won't be able to change your mind but not to 712 because you Obviously if you love sunshine like there's there's people that swear by sunshine. You'll never win an argument with them Well, what I mean, I love sunshine. I love sunshine, but uh, mario 64 has more levels Sure But it's basically if you love if you love the mechanics in in sunshine, I mean it's I look the water actually like sunshine. I just yeah, I like mario 64 better but Sunshine what what makes sunshine so good is is how different it is and for some people that different That's just a weird different for them. So you know how like I think behind it I think it'd be a great if you know island just isn't enough You know that they don't like a lot of people don't like the way that the spray Mechanics work. It's just people don't like the blue coins. You have the blue coins but If you do like that stuff, then it's like, oh well Just like some people don't like the rpg elements and zelda two They don't like how difficult the enemies are they don't like the magic They don't like a well, I love all those things. Well, I don't like the size. I love it It's just I just want to point out that while it may be the case that we've run extra long because I was a fool for bringing up game cuban 64 Yeah It's it's what it's been we've been on for four hours and yeah over a hundred people watching. Yeah, it's crazy. That is Thank you to everybody Yeah, thanks for being here guys Be sure that you guys do come next week too because next week is the biggest podcast I've ever put together Just with the sheer number of people and everything I got to manage Because it's rare that we have to talk about a zelda game Post zelda game like it. We just don't get zelda game releases that often anymore Uh breath of the wild back when we did we did a podcast reaction to that that was just me and eric back in those days So I've never actually Done a spoiler cast with a huge bunch of people. So I'm really I'm kind of excited for and I'm also kind of nervous But it's going to be a lot of fun It's going to be a lot of fun as I'm pulling every favor. I can't I don't have to pull it her I just say hey spoiler cast. I'm like, I'm there What wait, when is it? The last thing when it is later Uh, but yeah, I hope you guys come in for that one if Obviously only if you're okay with other things means well, there's going to be so much talked about on that show Um, you know dlc potential Uh things like um timeline implications And so much more like I don't even I can't even tell you where the conversation is going to go because I'm just going to give myself like a Set of little guidelines to get it going and I just have a feeling just like tonight It's just going to kind of go Because everyone's got so many thoughts. It's just going to go I don't want to be here. So But thank you guys so much for being here uh staying this late. Thank you so much for this It's also like the most amount of super chat revenue. We've ever had on a podcast before so Uh, thank you so much for that as well the 2998 and uh one new member we got tonight. Thank you guys for that You can catch our podcast ever podcast I heard otherwise go subscribe to andress restart man Go subscribe to the man. He's he's he's that close to getting up to 30k. So let's Let's do it. Thank you. Yeah, it might happen soon Yeah, might have been very I'm glad to see you still growing while I'm shrinking As I said losing subs is my game Someday you'll go up and I'll and I'll I'll I'll meet you on the way now. Yeah, I'll meet you at 80k That would be so bad if I drop I lost it There's no way I don't even think that's like possible I Look, I can slowly bleed subs for a while at my current rate It would take about two years, but I'll be up back under 100k in two years It's not gonna happen, but if it just keeps up in two years, I will be under I'll be under 100k Yeah, looking at the the list of um, we'll we'll bounce work as I'm not worried about it Yeah, we're in a lull once mario gets going. We'll be I'll find I think we're a new channel. We're sick. I think a healthy um, wow, I mean Just looking at the list like maybe you could count if you look at the top 60 games and then 64 versus top 60 games Man, yo, I'm trying to wrap it up. You know, I can't let this go I need to show you how much better my top 60 is than your top. Oh, I was just gonna say But but also I I when I when I said like I would take n64 over Gamecube it wasn't because gamecube doesn't have more quality games. Of course it does yet There's more than 30 quality games and n64 that really wasn't the point. It was that I've Someone who doesn't replay games. I find n64 games infinitely more replayable And so my top 30 games on that platform. I could just play those forever Where is gex Gex 64 Yeah, I don't know where that is on the list. I enjoyed that game. I don't know if it reviewed well though I didn't care about review. I didn't care about reviews back in those days Yeah, I'm seeing some games that are reviewed poorly on the 64. I'm like, nah, that's no game But that's like we didn't and the thing is they it was reviewed back when there was like four people Reviewing so like yeah, like Yoshi story. People don't like the game and you're just like a game Yeah, and you look and you think of that in context of today like back then When they used the whole review scale like a game being a 65 was technically actually better than average But that's changed today like a 65 today, you'd be like, oh that game is dog. Shit. And I'm like, you know It was still a quality game You were dog shit when you were in like the 40s Also for instance before because there's most people were reviewing a lot of games are not not even on this list I think that includes gex It's possible. Yeah, that's true There's probably a bunch of games and get it think of the reviews because it was really up to magazines Basically, they had to have enough magazines choose to review it So, yeah, all right guys. Well, that's gonna do it for the podcast that you guys sort of tuning in Uh, you guys are awesome and we'll see you next week for our episode 30 of season two Happens to be a spoiler cast. It's gonna be a lot of fun. You'll see eric in a couple of weeks It'll be back with some bro nation that week and andris and who the hell knows who else because i'm still building up the roster Maybe a sombrero Maybe a sombrero And definitely with me having a massive margarita on the stream next week Oh, I like the theme sombreros and margo and tacos And tacos I'm just moderating so I can just suck it back and just chug down and eat and be like Where's a good point? Joycey jay, what if she's saying something? I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna. Joycey jay has a margarita recipe. She really wants us to try Okay, I think I think this is the date We're gonna have margaritas on the show by the way We're gonna have margaritas and tacos and I'm just gonna listen I'm gonna we're trying to spread it around and get everyone to get into having some margaritas at least You want to throw tacos in the mix? Cool I'll I'll do tacos. I'll make tacos margaritas and tacos Talking about what's up on zelda. How does it get better? How does it get better margaritas and tacos with deep zelda discussion? I'm in this There you go, Joycey. That's that's at least two people that'll get me in. I know you'll be in Joycey. So that's three Here we go, dude. I'm gonna get I'm gonna I'm gonna call cap urges and tomorrow and be like you're you're The margarita ready It's happening. I know he'll drink. I'm all worried. He'll he'll he'll he'll roll one up Is it has a lineup in is a lineup h and k will too h and k will definitely do a margarita Is the lineup public yet? I've I've mentioned on live stream. We have f a f v l a m and nick barrett on nick barrett. I'll do it I literally just tell him and he'll do it I don't know why he he just likes him. He likes to participate cat berguson Andres restart joy cj h m k and myself that's the list at the moment With some other people still talking to me behind the scenes to see if they can make it So big smells like brainy bunch. We'll work out the details over the next few days, dude Yeah, I need to know because I gotta go pick I gotta go pick up because her margarita Has more It's not just tequila. So um this outro has been two hours long. I know the record. That's fine for sure All right guys have a good day. Peace out. Good night guys