 Give me a second. Oh, yeah, I have to yeah caffeine caffeine so bad It's a terrible habit it really is because the podcast is delayed because of this habit. Well just a couple minutes though We're okay. My Uber driver was in my driveway, and I was like waiting for her to come to drop off the energy drinks and was like 933 I'm like hurry We red bulls How was your week? It was good. Yeah Nothing really happened What is the life of a mr. Sandwich? Oh, man Lots of work at home. We're working on getting our apparel out if you've seen any of that that's coming soon So but there's still just lots of steps to complete Getting that together. You've had quite the adventure getting the equipment if I recall. Oh my goodness Yeah, so we bought a printer and then returned it and then bought another printer and then return now So yeah, it's been a bit of a hassle, but we're getting there couldn't be me My week is literally the same as always work Wonderland work Wonderland work Wonderland Survey markings splash works survey markings wild beast survey markings Survey markings, I'm excited about the wild beast ones and Frontier Canada survey. It's the survey the whole park's being surveyed Well, they need to build a map doesn't Man, okay, where do we even start? I mean, I guess since we didn't do we weren't here last week. We can talk about tundra Oh, yes, anything else happened last week that we missed on giving news on Just to like start it off Anybody else says anything in the chat, maybe but off the top of my head. I don't think there's anything in particular I think there's like big stuff, but that's okay, but let's talk about tundra twister I'll let you go first. Okay. I mean, I think I was So I said on the podcast before it opened that I was pretty sure that it was gonna be like a very variable ride like more so than Shockwave so like you would get some really good rides and then there's some not so good rides I think that's held up. Unfortunately more even more than I thought it would maybe I know you've said you've you've gotten a lot of Kind of boring rides on it. Yeah, okay, so I'll explain my thought process. I posted my review I got to partake in a film shoot. So we wrote it 13 times straight, right? And that was the best day I've ever wrote it. Okay, and that was what two weeks ago now. Yeah So two weeks ago and it was because the gondolas weren't full like it was like Spaced out they were having trouble keeping people on the ride because it was flipping a lot and people were getting sick And there was even people throwing up into the garbage bins at the exit platform Like we were coming in upside like it was great And then it started to go downhill ever since that day and then now it's just it doesn't do very much Do very much at all that that first day we got two different cycles There was a slow slower cycle that they started it on and then it seemed like they were running it faster after a few I don't know why that decision was made but we all noticed right away and felt like we were getting better rides on it after that and then I Don't think I've seen it run that cycle since no So and I think that's a big part of it Just it goes so slow that the gondolas have time to kind of settle out flat as it rotates Right. Yes throwing them out towards the outside. I've noticed that whatever they did with weight Or how heavy the gondola they just can't they like if they're going to go flat It's so heavy that it like gets out of its flat. They don't quite make it Yeah, whatever they did with that counterweight when it was getting stuck upside down so much. It does seem like they're not Rotating as easily as they were when we're watching it during testing. Yeah If you're coming in sideways over the top, that's how you know, you're gonna flip Yeah, like if you're going up sideways like this Then you're gonna flip if you're going up like this, you're not gonna Just gonna go flat. Yeah like a big Ferris wheel Yeah, it I still like it. It's not ranked as high as I thought it would be I would rank the cycles that we got that were the fast cycles like right like below shockwave for me personally But the way it runs typically I would I would put it below cyclone as well. It's just it's just a little too slow Come on. Yeah, I Don't even know how they can fix it like can they up the speed of this thing So that I mean they can because like I said, I'm sure there is that one cycle where they were running it faster Yeah, I think it just comes down to a combination of maintenance and how much they think the average guest can handle it That's true Like because the on the film shoot day of so many people are throwing up right like even in our group Craig I got knocked out then Tyler got knocked out and then like even enthusiastically knocked out And that's the thing is these are people who ride rides a lot So I feel like they might have slowed it down because they thought well if this thing's flipping like crazy Like the average guest isn't gonna be able to handle it No, and it would like it would do this thing too at the end on Film day like where it would get up to the top when it's coming back home You know how it still doesn't now but it come but we were getting stuck outside down on film day on that final rotation Every time for like a good 20 seconds. That's interesting, which was super uncomfortable And it's scary, it's scary and it does It does go down a lot. I've seen how many times we see it running empty cycles today I mean every other time I looked at it. I feel like it was up there empty. Yeah, but it is a new ride That's true. It is a new ride. That's true I saw Braden's comment. I was like This brings me to a really important question because we were just talking about it before the stream started So when we talk about 2024, we're talking most likely a flat ride or dark ride But then that brings you to every other year. How many more flat rides can Wonderland really build? Oh, man I mean It depends on how close they consider certain rides to other rides. I guess like Is the screaming swing different enough from Cyclone for them to make one? I think it is I know a lot of enthusiasts think it is but Does Wonderland? Because if you go like if you have said this before but if you go online and you look at kind of what People from other who have other parks as their home parks are saying like what flat rides they'd like to see come to their park Or what their top five are? We already have them all other than like a screaming swing. We have we have them all it's true So then they're gonna have to start building things that are either like not right for the park or not Not even right for us the scale of park like you start to get into almost like the fair rides of like Which I as much as I love fair rides They just don't have the capacity for park like Wonderland. They also just don't fit in they don't they don't feel right I mean, well, you could put it next to time warp and fit right But like you heard from TPM vids the park said that they're in a transition phase now to become a theme park so so they're definitely obviously looking for bigger things like You know tundra, but then that's that's another question is so this is the first one that they built of tundra So there could be flat ride designs that we don't even know about that the park Oh, maybe maybe, you know, Sam Perle will show the park a design and say hey What do you think of this and they'll build something nobody's ever seen they do a frontier Canada themed air races they do yes Back in the frontier days and their airplanes don't they have a flat ride in storage? um They have Characters from the care. Yeah The only flat ride they had in storage is now at another park the Great Well of China. Yes that one I have heard they have alpine. No, what do you call that? Oh, Baron's Curve Baron's Curve But I don't know that any it's small enough to keep somewhere truth behind that But I don't think Wonderland has any interest in building that again either. I doubt it It's too small these days. Anyway, yeah, it looks like a scream and swing is what enthusiast one I mean, it's so Wonderland's like what do y'all want as a flat ride? I Hear it a lot. I people say it all the time. I would love to see one I mean Wonderland likes building the biggest and tallest and fastest. Yes all the screaming swing It's true. We could they're great rides. That's what I've heard. I want to go on one Oh, the photos are starting already Jake you're at Wonderland You're literally at Wonderland It looks so cute. I don't understand how I'm single Okay, so Tundra twister, I wouldn't consider it a flop though like truthfully I wouldn't consider flop I think it's really beautiful This part's not going to make sense as to why I like it as a ride because they could have done this with any attraction But I like the storyline that Tundra's Incorporated right and I like the sign. Yeah, this it does have a good sign. Yeah, the theme mean everything is good I think if you compare The line that it's been getting to like the line of typical flat rides I think it's doing about as well as like it like Shockwave and cyclone typically will have like half full lines and so did Tundra So I know it is a new ride, but the fast lane line was spilling out When we went to ride Tundra, which is yet today and it was a full line today It was a big line and flat fast lane Ryan line was spilling out Yeah, like I wouldn't call it a flop and to be honest having maybe not the most aggressive Flat ride is probably okay for a park like Wonderland and that's that's you know, I think I've said that before as well that like I think As much as I and I'm sure a lot of other people would like it if they turn them up a little bit You know, there are plenty of guests who like a bit more of a mild ride with some nice views And it still gets close to you con striker and you've got that interaction there and and you can see Honestly when we're in splash works today coming out and seeing it coming up above the change It looks it looks really good. It's good like it's good, but It's not as much fun as we hope Can you imagine if it was the animation being on it and having those crazy cycles and that's not even a step close to what the Animation showed. Yeah, we we would I wouldn't be able to handle more. No go on. No now. I'm like Because I remember watching the animation thinking they can't run it that fast. No Remember that first animation too It would rip itself out of the ground. Yeah, okay, how many people in here right now? Home park is carolins or cares about what carolins is gonna get because I have some theories About carolins is next coaster and I feel like a lot of you guys aren't gonna like it. Oh, no I think it'll be a good addition. It's gonna be a great addition. Just like ours is a good addition um Waiting for the the uh, what is it? Okay. Well, let's talk about it This is the best ride in the park. Yeah, what is it? Snoopy's Racing Railway, of course. Yeah, the most well-themed ride with on-board audio and Whole storyline they'll improve it ever so slightly for carolins that little tunnel with the kaboom will be fogged up Oh, yeah, they'll put fog machines in there So this is what I okay, so I don't have carolins sources. I have like wonderland sources I have access to great information about wonderland, but I have heard that This is a ride that's going to be cloned. So with the location of land that carolins is kind of Pre-starting construction on right now. It's kind of really close to the kids area Yeah, I mean it would make sense and I think I mean, it's a good ride anyone who's had a chance to get on it I mean, it's you know, it's not thrilling, but it's it's good Smooth it seems, you know, like I know kids like it from the kids of people that we know who we've talked to they will enjoy it So I'm just looking at the floor and the animation though and that Slightly oh really, I don't know But I think it's great so I'll explain why so here's my theories on carolins carolins attendance is kind of doing this right now Right a lot of the American parks are yeah Carolins is in a really weird area where you kind of have to have a car or you're transiting a really good distance to get to the park So the average person that has a car especially in the United States I'm gonna assume. I don't know this is families and Carolins doesn't have the best Family lineup. It's not it's nowhere close to Canada's Wonderlands family lineup Wonderland is the most successful park in the chain like in terms of seasonal and compact attendance in a short period of time Right, so I would if I was seer fair and I was sitting at the board of directors having a meeting. How can we? Turn our American parks into what Canada's Wonderland is because I'm sure that conversation happens Yeah, like how can we they want to see the success that Wonderland is having at their own parks I think that that's impossible to not look at how many families do go to Wonderland Yeah, and those meal plans that those families load on to six season passes and the drink And they buy they buy merch they buy shirts and and everything Yeah, so I think it's it's no brainer, especially with the trademarks They filed for parts of the ride and all that right that this is gonna be a clone attraction It has its own soundtrack. They paid voice actors right and they could put the whole Snoopy's characters and everything same the same ride right as it is So that would make sense because you can reuse a lot of the the work that you didn't design. Yeah, this one exactly So I I think it's inevitable that carolins will probably be the next park to see this coaster pop up in in 2024 maybe or 2025 whatever their coaster year is. Yeah Yeah, I mean because it didn't take them that long once they got really going on it to get it done No, and we fell behind for something. I can't remember what I think just weather I think they had we had some warm weather and then it got super cold again And I think it was wetter was a lot of it. I know there's been supply chain stuff too both with oh, yeah Snoopy's and with tundra. They had trouble getting parts lumber especially Oh My god, we're going to jump right into it. Oh, are we okay? That's a good one Wild beast. I hope it's a big one Did he something big but okay, so I have updated Map of footings, you know, I'm not gonna show you guys yet. I'll show it in a video It's based off of the footings that are marked currently, right? Obviously not it done. It's still being surveyed I think it's inevitable that it's a gravity group renovation similar to grizzly. Yeah It's not RMC. No as much as everyone wants RMC. I just don't see it I don't think that's gonna happen. No and this for what you've talked about for what they're serving for I don't think there's enough going on for it to be like a full-blown if This is RMC though. This is our 2025 coaster I don't know how I feel about that Because this would be about the time that you and you know you'd start getting ready the ride will announce It's closing for good. How long does it take RMC to do a conversion? Well, actually because is that something that they could do more they would start in fall and it would open next year Yeah, they're pretty quick. Yeah, because you don't have to do the site work all the footings and everything are there so But I just RMC is not what you guys want like it's not you got I think everyone looks at an RMC and they're like Oh, it's so cool. It's so fascinating. It's it's great It does I I think if we got an RMC you guys would really regret it because it would be down like half the season Yeah, I mean it from everything I've heard about how much carpentry work has to be done on steel vengeance like on a regular basis and like Someone posted a photo of mindblower. Yeah with the the structure just like coming apart. Yeah, and it's like I don't know I see a lot of Not great work From RMC, and I'm not gonna try to you know be too mean to an entire company, but like yeah It just seems like they're not the most reliable well thought out attractions unfortunately like the Great track profiling, but unfortunately our roller coaster is more than that. Yeah Now Let's talk in favor of RMC for a second. So the go-karts today. Did you see them? Just the red flags. Oh Okay, okay, so the go-karts have had these little red flags in them in it a few of them Yeah, they've had them for over a year now But as of today, there's about double the red flags the red flags don't mean Anything really it could be for even if they're digging near the go-karts They would still need to mark an electrical line right for where things are and that's all those flags are doing It's marking an electrical line. Yeah You can see them. It leads right up to the traffic lights on the go-karts, but Let's say that is a sign that you know, they're gonna dig up the go-karts if They were gonna extend it over there That's definitely a much bigger project. That's a that's a pretty healthy sized RMC It's about the same size as arngwazi. Yeah in terms of plot of land. Yeah, I don't see them getting rid of those go-karts No, they make the money everybody hates them. But yeah, they make a lot of money They make way more money than the other two up-charge attractions just because they can seat so many more people Yeah, so the flags could also mean they're just gonna be digging near Wow Beast Yeah, and it's a close or they may even upgrade the go-karts You know what I mean? Everyone wants them to go but I see them going the other direction. Can we get electrically? So I'm not being gassed. That would be nice. I would love that. I would love that Do the go-kart track get electric go-karts? No more gasoline. Everyone wants RMC. Am I the only enthusiast that like is okay with like not going RMC? I want GCI. I want a GCI so bad. We're gonna talk about GCI in a second because there's there's Isn't a route Wonderland could be taking with splash ricks that would inevitably lead to a GCI Yeah, but we'll talk about that when we get the splash ricks. Okay, I Think the fan so right now the fan curve is marked up and the base of the drop Like literally the pullout of the drop is marked up on Wild Bees. Yeah If you look at what they did to Grizzly they changed the drop every profile the drop. Yeah They made it steeper so you would need to survey those specific areas. Yeah Did they do anything with the turnaround after the drop on Grizzly? No. Oh, that's the worst part. I know What name suits the new water ride coming next year. Oh Someone got that survey Great bear what I think it's gonna be that one. Yeah, okay Well, that's like it's weird that they're gonna like literally just transition the water park into frontier Canada as well I think it's gonna be a mixture I think it's gonna be like frontier Canada slash like grand Bend cottage country. Yeah country type thing But they would have to fully overhaul everything all the signs of that. Maybe they will but it would be a complete 100% you saw it all the signs are all marked up and all that too. That's true They do have survey mark everywhere in splash works, which is crazy I mean, they probably were just that could be for multi years. Yeah, and then we we know one of them Yeah, which fell through but Anyways Would you guys be excited for a Wild Beast reto like even and okay So this brings up an important topic of discussion. Someone asked me this at Wonderland today Would this be considered a new credit or a new I know the answer is I don't think it's a new credit But would the guests think that this is a new coaster. So then we got a new coaster in 2023 2024 we're gonna get a new coaster most likely which we'll talk about further and then 2025 we're getting a big coaster, right a big coaster I think if all they're really doing is reprofiling the drop and then maybe a little bit of work on the fan curve I don't think guests would consider it a new ride. Yeah, especially since it's not the full ride Which I learned today, too. I did not know that the grizzly retract was not a hundred percent of the ride Yeah, if they were if they were reprofiling the whole thing or the majority of it, then I would say Yeah, right, but if all they're doing is changing the drop I mean, I don't think that's enough and I feel like if enthusiasts don't think it's enough and guests definitely Won't think it's enough that's true and Ryan brings a really good point because the park said this to Craig and I That the reason they would not do an RMC conversion And they would do a ground-up RMC is because the average guests would not view that as a new ride See, I've said that yeah enthusiasts love RMC because we know what it is And we know the potential of what they do in terms of the ride experience it can provide But the average guests doesn't that those three letters don't mean anything to them They I mean, I'm not this isn't to be insulting to anybody Everybody but most people they go to the theme park. They're just there to have fun They're there for one time in a while or whatever. Yeah, they don't know the even the names of the rides They're getting on half the time. No, so they're not gonna know who built them Which I was shocked about with tundra twister because did you notice that every guest knows tundra twisters name really? So obviously marketing did something right in talking about the ride They must have because or is it tick-tock is it could be all Syria's mine other Wonderland creators on tick-tock and guests posting tick-tock animations with the correct name Yeah, is that helping alleviate those problems because everyone knew tundra twister probably Holy shit, I feel like we're going through these so quick. I'm seeing like the important ones coming up Well, this is one of them. Okay, so For those of you who have been on patreon, which you should sub to not to self-promote You know that I've been teasing a waterslide coming to Canada's Wonderland I've been teasing it for I think like two weeks now when I whenever we did the last podcast I started teasing it right away, right? So Wonderland may have self-leaked their own waterslides. Yeah, so there was a survey that went out asking people Hey, what what do you think a good name for the new waterslide would be? Yeah, they literally said if This new waterslide, what would you name it and they give you three options if we were gonna get a waterslide? But I know that there is splash works is a 2024 edition that I can confirm It's it would have to be like the only the only thing that would delay it If it weren't gonna happen anymore would be a wild beast Renault Yeah, but but they wouldn't be planning for a slide this far out. It doesn't take that much. No to get it done No, but If you watched we've walked through splash works a lot and as we just talked about there's survey markings Everywhere and even some of the buildings if you looked at the pavement have almost like drawn out Extensions to the buildings. Yeah change rooms on the wave pool side. Yeah Well, and it makes me wonder if we're gonna see more of The pizza pizza they added those wings on the other side basically with the timber kits and that's where you get your drinks Yeah, check out. So maybe they're trying to add more stuff like that those kind of wood structures And we are so overdue for a water park expansion. Yeah, and We've talked about this quite a bit. Well, we'll talk about that in a second But do you guys want to see what the new slide is? I'm asking us if I know the answer if I don't know the answer Do you guys want to see the new slide, I don't know I don't see anything in chat. I don't think they want to see it Oh, yeah, I don't think here. Let's move on Let's talk about 2024. Yeah. Yeah They don't want to see that That Okay, so I see some no, thank you Alright, let's skip over to World Expo. That's what that's everyone's favorite is World Expo Swings of the century. All right Here we go. I don't know if this is sound or not. I Hope I edited out the sound. I guess we'll see It looks like Great Wolf Lodge Well, they may I don't know if they have a slide like this But yeah, it very well might look like other slides It does something that exists in other yeah marks already. This is white water. So unfortunately Canada Well, I I personally don't like white water sign up. We looked at it right before this podcast Like pro sides definitely has the better product. It's true But Wonderland has a lot of reasons why they might make one decision or another that is true So that is true white water from what I understand is able to produce a product much quicker Yeah, and cheaper. Yeah, that's always gonna be a big factor the white water versions. So are ugly. Yes I agree. I agree like look at this. It's so generic Now I do from what I understand Wonderland is transitioning their water park into a Canadian theme So I do suspect that you know We might see some theming to this because I noticed that Wonderland even Paid a pretty penny for theming on their pump house that they're rebuilding. I noticed that which is weird So that says a lot about the direction Wonderland's heading Yeah, I would expect that we're gonna see more I mean that's what they keep saying is that the kind of the level of what they did for Snoopy's in tundra It's gonna be what we'll see everywhere else Yeah, I mean that's definitely not to spend too much time back on tundra But that was one thing that I noticed was there's a lot more theming that you would normally get for a flat Right and a storyline. Yeah, like it's it's themed up to the level of like you con striker Whereas every other flat ride is basically just other like they're just there for the line There's no theme at all. Maybe this sign I guess counts as even new con striker has a pretty sloppy storyline compared to in terms of storyline Yeah, yeah, I Didn't notice something though that that's not a pool at the bottom of this waterside that looks like a pool Runway, okay, like it looks a little deeper than like a runway, but it's not I don't know enough about waterslides to really say What that might be because I know you were saying proslides does the the runouts with the drains But we're not supposed to talk about the proslides came up before. Oh, yeah, no, no avoid the runoff time. Okay. Yeah No, that's just a pool. That's just a pool. It's a shallow pool. Yeah, that's just a pool It's the break cry Yeah, literally Okay, so that's your that's one of your potential 2024 waterslides I can tell you that Wonderland is looking to add waterslide or waterslides now you would ask What could possibly be in the works? So We'll talk a little bit. I'm gonna tell you that the area highlighted in orange Was either an important area for a new waterslide that may be changed Or it's still in the works, right? But we obviously can tell right now that that new waterslide wouldn't fit here. No, it's big raft one. No The area circled in yellow it would fit comfortably. Yeah So that's a potential area The area highlighted in red does have small land clearing that has been going on for years to come But it looks like they've been more so using it for dumping soil. Yeah Um But that is a potential expansion area It's also a really important area because if Wonderland were to ever see her fair Wherever to want to money grab Wonderland Which we know that they're gonna need to with the direction that their American parks are heading Yeah, that they're gonna want to build a separate entrance with a separate parking lot eventually But that entails expanding the water park, which as you can see They don't really have a ton of room. No So the area highlighted in brown Like carowinds is the only option for Wonderland and Cedar Fair to expand their water park But I'm not saying this is happening. So, okay, let me make something clear This is not in the rumor mill at all. Yeah, this is literally pure speculation. This has not been rung up on my phone This isn't the podcast where I should check my snapchat. This isn't like last week where I'm like, oh That blueprint Water slides, yes Okay That's one of the reasons why I've always said that I think Wild beast is the better candidate for some kind of conversion work regardless of who does it Yeah, because I know mind buster has the nostalgia factor, but it's right in the way of the water park Yeah Yeah Now I will say the opposing argument to them wanting to expand the water park is that they don't make money off of Wonderland's current status of a water park Which would lead to the red area and that's true, but I mean they're building new stuff for it So they're obviously they make enough that they consider it being worth investing in do they or do they Have plans to make money off of it well That could be too, but I mean they put in the cliff diving I don't remember what came in splash works before that, but I mean I feel like they've been steadily Yeah adding things to it. I think there's also the potential factor for Splashworks may bring some people to the park who then go out and spend the remainder of the day in the dry park at The end yeah if there was no splash works. They might not come at all that is a good point So those people may then go spend money in the dry park after they're done But I do know that one who has confirmed to me that they don't make money off their water park And that's that makes sense. Yeah, there's I mean there's no merch in there really to buy no merch the food I bet you everyone's got the meal plans for the food and there's not a lot of like There's not a lot of no game Games the game when they reference that they said the games the fast lane now if they were to build a water park Like the other parks do you can sell water park fast lane? Yeah, that's something that I could see yeah something else that I Rolled around. I don't know if this is a direction that they would go We've talked in the past about them potentially being able to charge a separate fee for splash works So that's something else I wonder is like how much could you charge for you know like a splash works wristband where when you go in Park, you know to be able to get a splash works You have to pay an extra 10 bucks or something the reason I want to entice your separate entrance because I have discussed it before But I noticed that the gate to get into splash works is marked up. Yeah, if you remember Yeah, it's got a survey marking on it. So that could just be for a Canadian re-theme of one. It could yeah But if I was Cedar Fair again, like I said earlier sitting at a board of directors table And we're looking at a park we can is one in line that's selling an estimated at 1.3 million season passes You're looking at their water park going. Hmm. We could literally Add an additional like one fourth of a revenue. Yeah There's there's a lot of space to work with there if they really wanted to do something with it So you need a parking lot though. So that red would have to be a parking lot. Yeah And then you could literally build your gate right over here next to the pizza pizza and the black hole area With a little bridge that goes over their service road and then yeah You would have the but mine buster would have to go and then even you would even have to potentially say goodbye Who like a little bit of whitewater Canyon like in my opinion if you were gonna charge extra I feel like that's tough to do whitewater Canyon isn't easy to modify No, it's not but you can build over it. You can build a station I don't know. That's a tricky one. I can't I Don't see them going full out, but the markings are suggesting they do have some serious plans I think they're I think they want to find out what their options are Yeah, they're probably serving a whole lot and having it all, you know done in CAD software and then Saying no to some things. Yeah, they'll they'll then they'll be able to shop it out and say hey Show us what you can build in this space and they'll make some decisions about what they want to buy Yeah, sorry, I see my patreon seeming being like leave my buster We're gonna have differing opinions if they are in mind okay, but like let's talk about my buster for a second cuz y'all be Defending her she is horrible this year. It's bad. It's bad We have a friend in our friend group where it's his favorite ride at the park I mean like I'll genuinely I'll feel bad if they take it away from him But at the same time like I won't personally It's his number one of the park though, but he says this is the worst year for it and that he has a hard time You know riding her well if a superfan even has a hard time riding imagine how hard it is to everyone else So Mine buster is a really interesting topic of discussion because it could segue into 2025 I find mine buster almost to be one of those factors that would determine what our 2025 coaster is depending on What does or doesn't happen? Yeah with mine buster? So obviously at the end of this season I would say around August we're gonna hear I'm gonna predict we're gonna hear a ride removal and that's been yeah one If not at least one. Yeah, cuz we know almost for certain at this point It's gotta be so time warp time Warbs go more but when is the question? Yeah, cuz right now. She's just being surveyed But they're surveying her entire bottle land if they're if they're I mean cuz you were talking about like the drive tires and stuff They're kind of letting them go a little long. Yeah, you see them. I think they're like ripping apart Yeah, I think if they're doing stuff like that. They're probably like She's gonna go soon. So let's just get the most out of it that we can't not buy new parts for a ride We're gonna get rid of like yeah, I hope It's really exciting because things are things are happening And if you talk to anyone higher up at Wonderland and if you even just pay attention to grace and some of her interviews There's like a little there's like almost a sparkle for me like she graced at an interview with TPM videos And I found it so telling yeah, like did you watch it? You have to watch it and I'm gonna send you the club after because I'm obsessed She literally the guy asks TPM video TPM vids he makes the best vids about Wonderland like period He asked her about Frontier Canada and she goes You know, we have we have things in the works for Frontier Canada. We're not done and then literally smirks. Yeah, like the most obvious like To like directed at every enthusiast like smirk and I think that was so telling I Mean I still think we're we're on track for that Development along the the back path like yes Dawson City probably yeah, and then you have whitewater and action theater That needs to be turned into something and then I Mean the 2025 coaster could go anywhere, but I think the smirk Was gonna be in Frontier Canada the 20 I think that was her being like you just wait and see yeah I think it look to me. This is this is a stretch by the way This is me trying to be a psychologist right now, or what are the people that analyze people's likes? yeah She looked like she was dropping the biggest like you guys have no idea and you know that one of my good sources Tipped me off about December and how this was big. That's true. So so Yeah, I mean, I would think there's probably one more big thing coming to Frontier Canada and That's gotta be a coaster Yeah, I mean what if it is RMC my most area. I don't think so It could be I don't I don't see it a ground-up RMC over whitewater Canyon would be insane And they didn't say in the past that if they're gonna get an RMC It would be ground up which seemed telling because if you knew that already that means you've had the conversation Yeah, and RMC and Frontier Canada would work so well. I mean look at steel vengeance in their frontier area Yeah, exactly so The only thing I have the only reason I'm like first Wait, they can't build it back there because you know the height restrictions By the way, how how high can they go that close to the highway? Do you know I don't know if I want to tell my audience that it's very telling fair enough just for in predicting the coaster Yeah Yeah, they wouldn't be building a really cool RMC if it's back there So I will say that part of the park has a serious height restriction. Yeah They could build a launch coaster though some kind of a yes, well the thing with the launch coaster is there's a specific If I could just okay, I'll I won't say heights, but take white Action theaters very front of the building. Okay, and draw that line across the entire park, right? There's a height restriction from there to the highway. Okay of about Like but that's yeah loads of room then on this side of the building for the high elements, right? There is but that would be really restrictive that would be like you're like, okay RMC build this but like you have like But yeah, there is some height restrictions and then they go inward like it doesn't go just like no height restrictions Right, it's like higher and yeah, okay And it's all and it makes sense because you don't want the cell phones to potentially end up on that explains Bechemist element being so angled and almost inverted at that spot because that must have been like part of the design Yeah, the hammerhead if not because that is past the element But I also think it's actually below the height requirement there I'll draw the number we can dig Jasmine I don't think they are gonna dig 100 feet down so that they can have Yeah, okay That's not very tall no, but I mean it's Is that tall enough to do like a a load of the ground launch coaster? Like how how well how tall is the tallest part of care velocity coaster fits into that does it it does well Then that's more than enough. Yeah for something like that If you could see let me erase that that's like permanently But yeah, you wouldn't want an RMC at the height restrictions back there, I don't think I don't think so I think I mean unless they're gonna do you know like a launched arms it because you need to lift hill, right? So how are you gonna even get away with it? Because I think they would need to lift taller than that for whatever I don't I don't See them building a lift hill base coasters shorter than that in adult park like You have the world expo area to build whatever height you want right Or a slim thiver sliver for a launch coaster in world expo For your top hat and then it can go do it's like velocity coaster load of the ground elements Right, you can make that work back there. You're not going to waste the plot of land on something tall That can't do much outside of a sliver of land Like a B&M. Yeah, like you I if you guys remember I predicted a wing coaster back there ages ago And then I got tipped off about the height restrictions We then found the city permit that lays out the restrictions specifically, right? Patreons actually have access to it So I put the actual height restrictions on patreon. I think like two months ago But you're gonna you're not gonna want that you like your 400 foot RMC 300 foot RMC 200 foot RMC is not going to fit Back you know the whitewater can it can fit but height restriction wise. It's too messy I don't think they'd be able to make something work And an RMC is not gonna stay low to the ground. No, that's the other thing So it'd be too complicated to work whereas a launch coaster can do it's one insane top hat And then work its way through the highway area load of the ground that would make white water a much more interesting ride too Right a birding over which coaster like flying over the troughs and everything Yeah, and then they and then they got to do the white water refresh and like redo all the yeah um So 2025 is going to be interesting because the park is already visually Dropping like small little like Watch out. Yeah, that's how I'm taking it. Yeah So I'm excited and I think 2024 will be super telling If you see them starting in december so I broke the news already about december construction to my audience. Do you remember if I did? Okay Well construction on our 2025 coaster is supposed to start in december So that is also really telling in its size because uconn striker was the only other coaster to start that early And that was simply because of an infrastructure Part of the project the tunnel. Yeah So And I mean it could make sense If they were going in that back area It's getting not only the tree removal, but like if you're trying to get Uh coaster footings and everything in between white water can you're going to do that without destroying the existing ride, right? Whereas You know if you just have an empty plot of land it doesn't take as long as driving and rmc's don't take very long to build guys Even steel vengeance It was not starting in december though. Like I always word things like And we're talking conversions though because yeah long did zadra take right, but that was ground up That's true But if we're talking a conversion because again, they've done all the site work. They've got all the footings there So that's like half the project almost and everyone thinks surf coaster So if coaster did not take very long to build that seaworld did it I mean jasmine jasmine I feel like how long something like that might take to build would just depend on how big it is and where they're putting it, right? Yeah, so you you have to really think about this. They're gonna start digging ground in december for a 2025 coaster Leviathan didn't even start that early guys Leviathan started April 2024 so how i'm gonna talk about this so it makes sense to you guys is picture whatever coaster i'm talking about Is opening in 2025 And now i'm going to give you timelines for it to open in 2025. So leviathan would have started construction april 2024 Maybe march march april they had their fence up and they didn't even start like right they just put up their little like We're preparing for your future enjoyment with their little hard hat construction workers Then uh behemoth behemoth started really early But that was only because they poured footings inside um All the lake back lots down coaster Before and this is the funniest thing the park kept teasing the enthusiast community after being like we had footings for behemoth done like two years before the ride even Um open and that I think was just because it was inside a ride that needed to be open, right? um But yeah, I think like you when you look at you know uconn striker it started construction same time uh, I think Around Correct me if i'm wrong. I actually I think it started earlier. It would have started construction april 2023 But that was because of the tunnel. Yeah, and you look at the uh engineering side of that it went through Vortex, yep Under water underground and came up and then nothing else about the ride was started Well, I think um If it's starting that early they must it could also be like because Supply chain issues have been ongoing now and because things keep getting delayed. They may also push construction start dates back or ahead I guess To try to avoid some of that. I mean just tundra was how late lazy bear was how late. Yeah um But then it as you know And not to like sound cocky here, but the good source I have saying that this is big. Yeah Like big like bigger than and that it's going to take that much time. Yeah, I almost said something I shouldn't have said um But just and they they would have known the size of other projects, right? So I'm I don't know but like is velosa coaster considered a big project like what's big to someone I mean again, I think when it comes to something like this because we know that The site work the footings that kind of thing are are such a big portion of the cost and the time that it takes to get done Yeah, half that question is where are you going to build it? Yeah, if you want to build it in the parking lot, maybe velosa coaster is easy Do you know what I mean? But if you're trying to weave it into another ride and over a lake and across the path in the park now It's now it's harder, right? Yeah I really hope it's velocity coaster. I hope so too I hope so too walking around that park doing the same three b&m's over and over again is getting so old on me I am not enjoying my visit this year No, no, like I'm so bored walking from and now that tundra isn't doing it for me I was talking to you on the car right here. Yeah, the tundra would be a little bit more exciting Oh, man. I like I'm really hoping for a dark ride in action theater, which you know what? Let's go to that. Okay. So 2024 Yeah It's gotta be action theater, right? They've got to be How long is it gonna sit there? I am so done talking about action theater. I'm so mad That is perfectly good building Nothing in it We'll know haunt this year will be so telling It will be so like how are you gonna like unless they can build a dark ride starting after haunt to can they I think they could Because it's all like like I mean I keep saying site work But they don't have any site where the whole building is already done They literally just have to ship the stuff in and construct it inside like now again I don't know how much the inside of the building would have to be modified. So that could be a big job But I would assume I can imagine the foundation and the general structure are the biggest part So assuming the foundation can handle the weight of whatever they want to put in there I would think that it could go pretty quickly and Weather wouldn't hurt them That's true because it could be February and and a blizzard But the guys inside the the building don't want a true job They're they're doing construction inside today, right? So that's true And they didn't start construction on tundra twister until pretty late either in the winter So if you're thinking about they're essentially building a flat ride, right? But if you're smaller one, yeah, like indoors, they don't have to worry about weather and they don't have to pour a foundation. So But I like I have been predicting Action theater since 2019 just keep predicting it and eventually you'll be right right eventually That is what people are. That is what people are accusing me of but I literally had the groundwork laid out for me over the next five years at ucon media day I remember it And I was told action theater was going to be developed into a dark ride sooner than later It was in the way it was worded It was going to be like 2020 2021 if covid hadn't happened right right then covid happened And then the toronto cn towers like yeah, we're going to build like a soaring over canada so we know that I in my Honest opinion like I can't wait till they do something So wonderland can sit me down and be like yeah, you were right because they do that sometimes right Like ucon was supposed to be built in 2016 like they've confirmed that right So I I just want someone at wonderland to be able to tell me Or is this happening? It was delayed because soaring over canada and we had to go to the drawing board and figure something That's a different thing to put in there because I am going crazy getting this wrong every year It doesn't make sense that it's been sitting there empty year after year And it because it feels like to me like this would be the easiest cheapest Like a attraction right to do the buildings already there They've already got a queue outside that they could just kind of rework You know the the foundation's already laid. They probably have electrical. They might have to upgrade it, but I hope you would think that it would be the most sort of drag and drop like planet coaster Like addition to the park that they could have and they still haven't done anything The winterfest exactly and that's the other thing right they would give them another winterfest ride And we know they're desperate for winterfest attraction because tundra twister is able to run during winterfest whether they're going to do it or not Yeah, we don't know But they bought a ride that can run in winter. That's what the park has said Why like to me like winterfest and we were specifically told that winterfest was becoming a Not a flop, but it was declining in attendance because guests thought the rides would be open For winterfest and they're not the way that guests thought so people stopped showing up the last season that just happened versus Right 2019. Yeah So you think they would be like oh the basement of the mountain Action theater like these indoor areas that can pose There's this yeah I mean that's what I would be looking at if I was them because it's kind of serves a dual purpose like being able to add on to How much people are willing to go to and spend at winterfest is is A unique boost that you're not going to get necessarily get from the flat rides. Yeah The gold past sales rely heavily on winterfest And haunt obviously more so haunt But I would say winterfest and especially with cedar fair eyeing the prestige pass I don't know how they're going to make that work at wonderland to be honest because we don't have shaded areas that they can turn into We have to build some The wonderland building shaded areas hey if they can make you pay an extra 200 bucks your season's past maybe that'll No, no, I have beef for a second. I I'm taking over the microphone for a second I know someone from wonderland is in here right now What is with all y'all and not giving us areas to sit? They don't want us to sit No, because I think it is no, I have beef tundra twister. No, listen here Tundra twisters animation had rocks even and we were upset over the rocks. Okay And then the wrong one doesn't even have the rocks We aren't allowed to sit anywhere. We're forced to walk around like the dinosaurs in Fantasia if any of you have watched fantasia and the dinosaurs are dying off in the desert on their way to walk find water At the end of the world that is us at wonderland. Oh god Where you can get shade in like two places you can go to the kids area behind pizza pizza There's big umbrellas there and then there's one spot in splash works like next to the drink station And you got to kick the old lady with the crane and the cane over to get to it It's a fight like everyone's like fighting for it They used to have umbrellas by like roadside chicken and and everything up there They took all the more so now there's no shade. They don't have table umbrellas anymore. They got rid of them all That's what I'm saying. They don't want us to sit. They're like we want them to bake So they're constantly they'll have a restaurant. This is my other big. Are you still in here wonderland? Hello, okay I'm sorry. I'm ranting. I don't hate y'all, but I'm gonna pretend like I hate y'all for a second Just we have beef for the next five minutes You have a restaurant that serves like 200 people an hour and anyone that works in retail knows and restaurants knows How much that is okay? They'll have two seats for guests to sit at outside this restaurant That's serving 200 people an hour and they'll have two seats with And they're like Where even has seating like in it in the restaurants like okay lazy bear and then they close out the seat They close it. Yeah, you can't go downstairs most days. Oh my god. There's off limits And they closed the outside patio in the back. That's closed. There's a sneaky way to get there, but Like they had beef with seating like I swear There's like some guy that sits in head office at wonderland at cedar fair Cedar fair is like, you know, we can give you all this seating and they're like no no You can sit next to like the pizza pizza on international street the greek place. Oh, yeah some chairs there Yeah, and the geese come up and attack you. I love them and eat whole a whole slice of pizza Steal your food the geese Yeah They have no fear at this park if you're from if you're from america and you come to kansas Oh, and just know our geese are different. They will come right up to you. They don't care They're docile here now. They're like pets like I could take some of these home You could we saw someone pick up a goose once. Uh-huh. Yeah, we could it took it I believe we fought those people Almost Oh, but yeah, no seating no shade no shade. Um, the drink plans are you buy a $35 drink plan to get cups of water Yeah, there's not enough drink stands at least now they have them mostly open But there's a few times earlier in the season where there'd be like two drink stands open the whole park Because the one by you comes close because they're still building tundra. Yeah It's got drink stands have gotten better in my opinion. They're better now They have they have actually this is the best year for drink stands because the one by swings is always open It would be nice if they could get something going by leviathan It's kind of like they're working on it. It's kind of like a soda desert over there leviathan's area is so confused Like, okay, I'll explain it for you guys. We just learned about it today So there's a new painted building a winterfest building that they put in the leviathan area That was supposed to be the fast lane building, but then they changed their mind So now they're like tearing apart the fast lane building that was Moving it to speed city's little ticket booth, which I don't understand at all And now they're going to turn the fast lane booth that worked so well into a place that they sell cotton candy Snacks and leviathan t-shirts. Yeah Well, they took out all the the merch from the photo Ages ago though. Yeah, but that's what I'm saying like they used to have it in there and now they're going to put it in the other building Freestyle machine next to leesbury watch. Yeah, the screen's a little broken there. Yeah That's I feel like that's been broken since pretty much to install that that happened like right away Yes, action jacks is right Action theater is not empty. It houses a really important haunted house for haunt like one of their best ones Oh, yeah, but I mean and and he mentioned storage, but like in store store store things wherever Yeah, there are only christmas trees stored in there and then it is raccoon infested as well from what I've heard Like horribly well You take care of that. That's a that's a solvable problem Oh, no, we've seen how they handle the raccoons that leviathan Oh You can't see that I forgot about that a little bit You've seen that more than once But they have been building storage. Um, I'm more curious about where these haunted houses are going I know they said there's going to be how many this year not I have not seen construction starting anywhere. How are you going to build? Are they going to be like the haunted houses we saw at the basement of that pandemonium? Well, they'd be like, um that maze at la ronde with With the thousand liter totes in the pool Like, um, and I'm not insulting the haunt team because they're actually like spirit manner is insane Like when they're handed like what they like I can tell it's what they're handed. Of course, of course It's like it's like if you give an actor a bad script, they could be a great actor, but it's still not going to be a good Not the container maze They'll just stack up shipping containers. Okay, so, um, I have so daniel bell said something daniel be really careful posting stuff If you work at wonderland, especially with your full name Um, if I could get a mod to just delete that comment just for his protection I just said Well, you can say that they're whole um Yeah, we're or yeah, um, I did hear so I heard last year if you remember we talked about this last year I had heard from someone in entertainment that um This would be the last season for spirit manner and corn stalkers Which aligns with the 2024 2025 editions We have seen no signs of spirit manner coming down yet And corn stalkers is sitting in there, you know rotten away I mean Would we see Signs of spirit manner coming down though Because they could just do that in like wouldn't that just happen inside could be down in the facade Outside. Yeah. Um, it's facade the right word. I always use it. I'm like, is it That's the right way to say it. I think I think that's how you would call it because it's like a fake No one's called me out here yet. Yeah, I think that's right facade you that's the costume Yeah, they could easily find prop and costume storage elsewhere though Yeah, but they've got they've got like when you see those the shots from brennan's drone And they've got like shipping containers everywhere. Like I'm sure those are awful Oh, yeah, and they're working on building proper storage, but I mean that's something that they can always like Oh if we need some storage, okay get get five more ccans and we'll put them over here and you know what I'm really excited about though And I just thought about it right now my eyes just lit up Even for winterfest guys wonderlands had to buy decorations from like a third party vendor for howling haunt and winterfest What did they just install it their park and were the only park in the chain to have it The printer the three mass of industrial 3d that means they can literally build their own like that would be pretty interesting Yeah, and they have a apparently a really talented word wood carving team now too They hired wood carvers. I think they've had for a while because the sign department has almost done really good woodwork But I learned I thought that they had 3d printed those big characters on snoopy's racing railway Um, but no, I learned that actually the wood carving team made those from hand. Oh, wow. Yeah, those are wood That's awesome. Like that's insane. Those are pretty big too. Like that's awesome. Yeah, I'd love to see more of that So a wonderland has the potential to build whatever they want and so much easier and better with that 3d printer even like decoration wise Yeah, I mean, I think if they can put that to use for haunt and winterfest, we could see some interesting new things. Yeah I'll three I don't think I don't think your 3d printer would be big enough for Jasmine are okay. No, I'm gonna throw shade for a second Actually, I don't know if I should throw this shade. It's about the wood team that works on the wooden coast well They're great, but but an rmc would have metal rails So they wouldn't have to really be involved in the Trackwork and they actually could be told to just let the rides rot right now That's the other thing is you always have to remember that Uh Just because you see a certain level of work being done by people who work for a company doesn't necessarily mean that That's like the best. Yeah, those people can do. You don't know how much time they were given What material what they were asked to do like No, I have I have more beef. I have ran you guys are triggering me. Oh my god This should be a new segment where the patreon's trying to trigger me because r dot dot dot just triggered me Bring back the uh front gate great gate graveyard What the hell did wonderland do? So the costumes at the front gate are some of the coolest and it's supposed to be the gates to hell Right, there's like no decoration. There's no decorations The whole like front entrance area has like it's got the the big skeleton guys in the Which is cool. But like other than that, do you remember when they made the decision to make it really pretty the year before and it was like It was like pumpkins and wagons and everything. Yeah, and then the haunt would start and it's like Um, no, they need they need some some big like fake stone pointy archways or Gates I want like fire like people dying like a big arch with glowing eyes and smoke and stuff I there is no room for decorations. I get that but you have areas you could put decorations that would work You could I mean they would have to be off to the on the edges Yeah, but you could make it work But I I yeah you you couldn't just put them out You know out and about like they had you hire some of your best talent for these areas and you give them nothing to work With yeah, like and then you wonder why like people are harassed by that Like like you need a scenery every other area has it and then the front gate's like We're gonna put some of our coolest costumes and actors there But you don't have a scene to work with yeah Like that the clowns have a cool scene everywhere has a cool scene, but the front gate area pretty much. Yeah I think there's room. I think there's room around the edges. Yeah 100% I guess farmstead is a little limited like they have nice they have the scenery that works with it But it's very like farmstead's confused between a haunted house and it scares them Exactly because it's like you kind of go through in this line, but You can't hang out in the area. Yeah, that's I think you know what I'm really excited about for haunt Dark ride because it's coming from knots and knots is no the maze. Yeah So if we're getting shipped all their stuff, you know, it's gonna be good because that's like knots They're just below universal studios when it comes to that one it is everything. Yeah It's a really ugly story wide out of my opinion like it's stupid, but It's just a so the whole thing is supposed to be like There's a killer in the dark ride, but they made the killer a clown. Oh Because we already have carnival. Yeah, so that makes me think that the um bumper cars are going to be closed this year And instead of carnival the haunted house which was discontinued two years ago three years ago They're going to do dark ride But I like or it's gonna be in this half of the mountain because there is this side of the mountain underneath thunder I hope that's what they do. I want to I gotta get on the bumper cars this year Yeah, I have a rivalry with the clown in there Coming for you skyliss Um, but I'm excited for haunt because they made a lot of promises that seem really cool and yeah I'm always excited for haunt All right. Do you guys want to see a leak for the 2025 coaster? If you do say yes No, no, I don't see anyone. There's poor communication going on here Okay, here you are I won't know anything until december No, unfortunately. Yeah, so we gotta wait. I won't know any inside information Like serious inside information until december. I just know it's big. That's literally all I know That's good. It's big as good big good coasters All right, let's talk about world expo I don't even know what to think about world expo at this point. I feel like it's pretty far off It is pretty far off my american engineering friend was basically like when you have so much land being surveyed And you know that it's for coaster Which we know that if they're going to do world expo, there's going to be a coaster You're thinking three to five years out minimum. That would make sense So basically how it was worded to me is let's say I was assuming this was for 2025 which I started to get a little confused which I was super honest about in the podcast You know, I was like, what's going on? I'm confused But essentially a 2025 coaster is done planning like it's been designed Like whatever company build it it's done. They're already they're starting to like get parts ready Um wonderlands hiring the construction teams Everything which I already know That they would do because of ucon um I remember that um And what was I going with this? Oh, um, so essentially for a 2025 coaster you wouldn't be surveying. That's done Yeah, which is makes sense because two years ago all the survey markings were in front of canada That's true on the buildings. They surrounded white white water canyon. Yeah, they literally did so now that I know I just thought about this I can't believe I didn't make a video on this now that I know what those distance markings are that they represent a barrier right It literally enclosed it went down the splash path. Yep, and then it went down towards action theater It literally is surrounded white water Yeah, um, so now that I know that's what that means and then the acts the x's with orange paint on the ground Are points of interest right? It all makes sense that yeah, like in my opinion the 2025 coaster is a no-brainer going in front of canada That makes sense that makes sense now it could be wrong and it could be like a white water canyon refurbishment That's why they enclosed that area. You know what I mean, but I don't know that they would need to do any major surveying for that I feel like a white water canyon not for theming if it was just theming if they were going to really change it But then at that point it would basically be a new riot, right? So yeah I'm trying to see if um, okay. Good. Um, so it's essentially world expo is like three to five years out minimum If you're building a flat ride in in world expo, you could survey the year before so tundra twister Right survey markings popped up in 2022. That's true for 2023. Yeah, so there are things That could happen pretty quickly then which makes also sense that the water slide the water park survey markings are for 2024 Yeah Whitewater canyon refurb is a big deal Yes, if you're thinking about like an actual refurbishment and we're hearing rumblings that Carowins is thinking about refurbishing theirs. Yeah, and they've been held off on theirs. So yeah, so just to clear up like When I say refurbishing it wouldn't be a big deal. I'm thinking like going in and like timber wolf Yeah, like doing doing more theming getting maybe Rockscapes to come in the people who did the cliffs for the cliff diving and getting them to come in and like build up the sides And make it look like you're actually in a canyon and change up the rapids a little bit Versus actually changing the ride itself and you know putting something new or different there or really changing the experience in a big way Yeah So World expo The the end of time warp it literally like and potentially fight deck now and yeah, maybe so Like I thought about this. I put a lot of thought into this I think it's pretty obvious that the park is I think it would be really dumb if the park didn't play on the cultures That are coming to wonderland. Yeah, I think that makes sense Like I would love to see again like a middle eastern or How do I word it better? I like Like a like a middle eastern area Like a japanese and like chinese area like an asian area um even maybe like a Jewish area I hope i'm saying the right words. I'm not saying anything offensive right now I think we're trying to be inclusive. Yes, and so I think we're good I think that wonderland should play on the cultures that Surround the park and go to the park and that would be perfect for Like even a greek area would make sense because there's a lot of greek like People that live around the park it'd be really cool. I think so and the food wise it'd be great. Definitely A lot of opportunities for food In a world expo type place. I'd love to see them do more with food that Is actually like fun and interesting. I find that a lot of the food at the park is sort of like Like it's it's like fuel, you know, I mean it's like you're going to the gas station because you have to Very rarely do I find myself thinking like oh, I want to go get that thing because it's it's good. Yeah, you know what I mean like I really want them to bring back the old japanese restaurant That's like my biggest like if they do if they even just did that i'd be like You're done world expo is back great. You can keep flight deck. Yeah, just want that japanese restaurant back I still want the big red light deck Yes, rocky place they um, but So what could they do? Ride wise They do anything in there. There's so much space, especially if they get rid of both of those two. Yeah, I mean I think we'll see Something of a spectacle though I think what you're talking about with height restrictions kind of makes sense why they would want to put a launch coaster at the back And then something tall. Yeah at the front I just pictured something in my head the points of interest around time warp and flight deck Time warp is the station for a wing coaster It could be and did you notice that the points of interest go on a diagonal from time warp towards front gate on a diagonal path through flight deck And then so you're thinking it would have an interaction with front gate. Yeah Stop at that It could be I mean, I know I'm sure they're very happy with how uh gatekeeper looks Obviously so at the end of the day if I get my launch coaster and then they want to build a wing coaster You know two three years later go for it as long as I have my I'll be very happy if we get something similar to Velocir coaster. Yeah, very very happy. It's gonna end up. I'll be happy with this too. It's gonna end up being mock Mock would still be good. I don't I don't have a problem with mock if it's like copperhead I might be a little upset fair enough, but if it's like an extreme spinner Then I'll be equally happy to a Velocir coaster clone. I think Not clone. Sorry. Velocir coaster I I think though that if the park went to mock and was like we want Velocir coaster Can you do that? I don't see any reason why mock would say no. No, no, definitely not If it'd be really pricey because I think mocks more expensive than interplay. Yeah I think so I think it's worth it because they just don't want to work with intimate I don't know But if intimate's working on top for the dragster and this project is as big as it's going to be Maybe cedar fair is trusting enough to be like, hey, you know our canadian park could benefit from something Not as big as top flow dragster, right? That could be yeah, because if I mean if they're back to working with intimate again, they might be just thinking well We're here. Anyway Let's let's grab a couple roller coasters. You know our park over at wonderland. Yeah Well, they got a lot of family coasters. Uh, can you build them something that'll make them throw up? Yeah, yeah, we do need that on that note though If people can't even handle tundra twister without throwing up And did you see wild beast's station today? You did you go on it? No There were three vomit spills in wild beast's station at different areas not cleaned up either Who is vomiting from wild beast? It was in the loading platform too. I don't think it was from wild beast You don't need to drink more water throughout the day like it's hot out there, you know drink Yeah, that's what it is Everybody's out there getting dehydrated Can you imagine them riding like a velocity coaster at our park though or even an extreme spinner? No, like it would be like they would have to build like a vomit station. Oh, yeah Well, that's I mean, that's what we were saying about tundra was like if they had the cycle going that fast They'd need extra garbage cans just for that But I think all in all You know, we have world expo we have 2024 We have our new slide. We have our splash works expansion. We have Oh the light just What was that? My this is hawn. Did you all see that in the mirror or in the picture frame? Did anyone see that in the picture frame? Please tell me someone saw in the picture frame what just happened Someone someone please tell me that we are crazy. We're closer to tycoon guests. Thanks extreme spinner is too intense. Yeah They might It's a gust the whole light there. Oh you guys can't see my mouse in the picture frame right here It's just rotated. Yeah That's pretty weird. Um, so Oh, we're not gonna It's very promising. I think it looks good. I think we have a lot to be excited about It'd be nice if tundra was a little better But I still think I still think the guests are gonna like it I still think it's it's in the right place for guests to enjoy it. Yeah I mean, every if you know, I'm not even gonna let y'all get away Y'all wanted a ferris wheel at wonderland and you got your god damn way. You got your god damn way. I can't take my camera on this Y'all asked for a ferris wheel a little too hard Oh, man wonderlands, like how do we disguise a ferris wheel into a flat ride? The most complicated looking ferris wheel The scariest you get your views of Yukon, you know frontier canada. It's all there. It's a sassy ferris wheel I guess we could start the question period. What time is it? Yeah, it's almost 11. So yeah Question period everyone Ask your questions and we'll quickly wrap up because mrs. Sandwich is waiting for mr. Sandwich I don't think she's waiting. Is she I don't she she she's on her way, maybe Yeah, I don't see anything yet. So let's see questions Delayed how much Nike tech at the park. I didn't too much I miss stream. Can you do a quick recap? Well front gate potentially an upgrade to in 2025. I don't I think that's a little early I think if they're especially if they're planning on that whatever coaster they build in world expo having Anything to do with front gate. I think we might have to wait until what do you think 27 even 28? 2027 is supposed to be like 2027. Yeah, I think that the park's under a rapid expansion So typically you wouldn't see this many coasters back to back to back to back But the park is in like a desperate a lot of rides are expiring like they're reaching the end of their service life That's true And then 1.3 million season passes. You guys can't like you you can't ignore that number Is dragon fire in the long-term plans for canada's wonderland? It can't really be in the long-term plans Yeah, I mean I I would expect almost the opposite. I would think that They would do medfare last if they're Working on kind of adding and upgrading the theming at the park because medfare I would say is probably the most themed That there is at this point like it's not a great theme. Yeah, but it's there So I would almost expect that they might be looking at like okay when we go to re-theme it then we'll do something with dragon fire, but I can't imagine that they're sitting here thinking like Yes, this aero looper is going to be with us until the end of time So how do you theme go-karts to medfare like you get little wagons? Oh my gosh. I mean you don't You just don't just ignore you just pretend you get those little rideable characters that you see people at the mall on You just get a bunch of those and like everyone's riding little horses or CAD like oh my gosh I don't think you could do it. I think they just have to pretend and just like Um, is marine land just dead in the water? Um I can tell you that hershand explored buying marine land last year and They're open to conversations still, but I don't think that's ever gonna happen I think the contract that the owner and this is all speculation I think the contract the owner has is too restrictive From what I've heard a lot of people have wanted to buy marine land But essentially to give you a little context speculative late. Is that the right word? Take this with a grain of salt. This is just speculation. Don't see me marine land. Um The owner has made it so you can't change any existing buildings on site You have to keep the animals Um and all the rides and names of the rides and theme of the park has to stay the same You can't touch or move anything I mean that nobody's gonna Nobody's gonna touch that you have no freedom. Yeah, even just keeping you having to keep the animals nobody's gonna touch it Yeah, so I think that the owner is a horrible person The woman I used to like have a little bit of like oh, she wants to do good But if you are trying to sell a park so desperately And you're not finding buyers and you're so attached to your horrible image That you're unwilling to allow people to change things And you clearly aren't selling the park then you're done. You're not a business woman. You suck I think at this point it's just going to be a matter of um When at some point a financial institution comes in and says, okay, you haven't been paying your other bills So this is ours now and they forced them to sell it back Yeah, because I just if they're trying to put those kinds of restrictions on it like Even just having the legacy of the animals there is bad enough to keep a lot of operators away. I think yeah, like if you think about What we're talking about is a huge plot of land right next to Niagara Falls that is zoned to be a theme park And nobody wants it They do well, but they aren't nobody's buying it, right? So it's like there's obviously something Really wrong that is keeping people from you know, because in theory it should be a prime location It's already a tourist destination, right? You don't have to rely on the park to bring people to the location because they're already there because it's Niagara Falls Yeah, it's right on the border so you can attract Americans easily It's already zoned to be a theme park So you don't have to worry about dealing with planners and zoning and everything like and you could build totals Even it's such like a profitable model for anyone more room than you actually need but it's the contract The contract her stupid little contract. Yeah, nobody's gonna sign it. So I hope she goes bankrupt Okay, she's shooting that she's shooting that park in the foot right now It has potential to be great and it has potential to literally make wonderland even try harder than they are now Exactly. Yeah having some competition that close would definitely change things for wonderland Like if a good operator came in and bought that park and started putting in good rides. Yeah Oh, that's a what do we think of the cable bar transit system that has been keyword proposed As an option I think it's a joke I think it's a joke gadget bond and I'm not gonna get too much Not just bikes on here, but it's not gonna happen. Get over it. How do you operate that in like extreme weather? Like when you can typically run buses in extreme weather, you don't yeah The answer and any question that you have about that cable car like well, how does it do this or how do you do that? The answer is it doesn't and you don't and falling ice on the cars on the road. But like yeah, like don't right That's the answer, right? It's not gonna happen Extend the subway. That's a little costly for the reason the reason they want to like who proposed that was that wonderland like at the Meeting be like, hey, we would like better. Can we have a can we have a subway? So they're like, okay Well, we can't exactly afford a subway So You can have a cable car Honestly that cable car thing strikes me is just something where it's some investment Firm looking for money and I like hey look at this cable car thing we could build We just need a few million dollars to investigate it and then they'll be like, oh no, it won't work. Yeah Sorry, but like a monorail would be smarter But I think the monorail the thing with the monorails and wouldn't be able to keep on demand Whereas the cable car has had a little bit of a better shot at keeping up with demand because they're constant Yeah, I I don't know. I think a lot of those things are Because the reason they're proposing this is actual substitution to transit is my understanding Which makes no sense. Yeah, just so monorail wouldn't be able to keep up with that man. We already know how to make transit So They don't need like we don't need new new technology to make good transit What is with canada being so against subways? Like like every other major city does subway so well and then toronto and canada's like We'll give you one new line Whereas like every other city's like 20 lines going out of like one area I don't know. I think it's I think it's partly money Well, apparently we're sitting on 22 billion excess funds in ontario Come on Oh, they wanted transit that is seasonal Why would they specifically want transit that can't be run? Like I like I get that you would say well because we only need it in this summer Then it doesn't matter if it can run in the winter, but I don't get why you would specifically install something that can't work Do you know what I mean like what? But I I just don't see it as Something that's going to happen in general to me whenever I see anything like that is is literally just somebody's trying to get investment money Yeah, action to access cable cars are used in other cities as transit, but they do it due to elevation barriers Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah cable cars are used like there are even places where they have like It's like a train car that climbs up the side of a mountain on this big like Track and there's a gear and a cog and those work in some places because they have to go up the side of a mountain But there's you know, you have to like you do these things because of the restrictions and limitations where you're working with Whereas like they don't have that here. So I don't think that's gonna happen personally Right five years later when risk gets huge and they're like, yeah, or or any other reason I mean if you wanted to expand that like how do you build more onto a cable car system? Like I said, you don't You know like Build a bus lane like everywhere else is building bus lanes. It's all done young street and the highway seven they work really well Yes, building them ruins traffic for like five to ten years Um, they are about to extend the road though. I can see signs on wonderland side. There's like orange paint all the way down They're marking up all that thing. They're about to extend that road The wonderland drive. Yeah, no the uh Jane or oh the one out the one out in front. Yeah Do you think they're coming in on the hill that one they are? Yeah, it looks like it I wonder if wonderland had to give that up to the city if they did then there's definitely something benefiting wonderland in the end I would think so. Yeah, like a hotel contract that they were having so much trouble getting the first time around Um I don't see any other question question anyone else with the question Kimberly I've heard that suggestion multiple times that would be brilliant For uh marine land and Niagara to have a good outdoor water park Yeah, it would be there's a thing is there's tons of great stuff you could do at marine land the question is Who's who's gonna do it? Yeah, because the current owners aren't gonna do anything with it And if they have these crazy restrictions on you know, the sale of the park Nobody else is gonna want to put their hands on that Um, but yeah Okay, yeah, everyone hit that like button rude how free entertainment My day my day was good started with fishing ships at splash works. What's the likes ban of a b&m? Oh, it's about 20 to 30 years from what I understand. I think it's more about cycles Because uh look at the hook It lasted 20 years said but it ran but that's what i'm saying right the last 20 years But they ran year-round so I bet if you could figure out how many trains they sent that would give you a good estimate Because it's all about like I would imagine if the be it like when a b&m sits there in our park for Oh four months that has an effect on it, but it's not going to wear it out as much as running heavy trains on it all the time, right? The new owner the current owner of marine land does plan on making investments There's a reason she's selling the land around the park But also keeping the ownership of the land like leasing it back Also, it was the what is the lifespan of the bat the bat? I mean they seem to be wanting to keep that so they really want to keep it I keep seeing things happen to it and thinking myself. This is it one more thing But it must not cost that much The other thing is it's so small I think it's clickbaity too Yeah, people people complain about the capacity of it but like It's so it's the thing you have to remember with capacity when we're talking about rides is the footprint as well, right? Like leviathan has huge capacity But how many flat rides could you put in the space leviathan takes up and would have what would their capacity? Yeah so Capacity isn't the only thing to think about but it's definitely yeah And the park did confirm that capacity isn't always on their mind, right? And so that's the thing is like I I'd like to see them Do something different where the bat is because it's kind of an old tired ride But from their perspective like if it doesn't cost that much to maintain um You know it's doing its job. It's low throughput, but it's also very small so Exactly one one has a lot more land to work with them people give it credit Again, whitewater canyon is a massive lot of land And then world expos like an entire theme park for some so But yeah I think that's it Yeah, I think so no more questions. Yeah, I'm so can you see how red my eyes are guys? My allergies are terrible and I'm tired. I know when I work early in the morning We should probably wrap up then We'll see everybody next week same time. Yeah, I'm already So it might be Friday next week. Yeah, we might do it Friday night Um because I would like to enjoy the full day at Wonderland on Saturday because I work in the morning and then Um Friday night Friday. I'm filming something really cool with the company I'll tell you guys later In Niagara Falls not Greenland. Don't worry Um, so yeah That'll be exciting And I think that's it. All right. See everybody next week. Have a good one guys. Bye