 Your mission has changed over time, and as I've seen you evolve in your journey. You started out in photography, and then you became a very successful businesswoman. And now your purpose has become creating more awareness around domestic violence. Why is that? I'm a survivor of domestic violence. I suffered abuse in an abusive marriage for three, almost four years. When I left my marriage, it was right around the time I started Verona. Verona reached all of this mass press. We were everywhere. We were at Fox News, CNN, Huffington Post, NPR. We had all of a sudden just this press comatose left and right. And so the spotlight was kind of on me and my partners. But behind the scenes, I had just left an abusive marriage. And so to the public eye, my life was like perfect, right? I had this brand that got into Macy's was making, you know, news everywhere, but I was like dying inside. So many women are suffering silently, and I was suffering silently included. And I was like, I have to speak out. Women's empowerment and encouraging women and supporting other women has always been a part of me. Now it's literally my life mission to create awareness, speak out against this injustice, and hopefully, hopefully encourage other women to know that they can leave and that they can survive and that there's life after abuse. So domestic violence is something that is universal, and it's been around for as long as we've been around as humans. And one of the things that I wanted to point out and you talk about this too as you create more awareness around this issue is that it transcends religion. It transcends gender even it transcends culture. It transcends those economic levels. It transcends so many different things. You are a Muslim woman and you also wear the scarf. And I know even with the Verona platform, you are a huge advocate of choice. Like for you, freedom means everything as someone who is not only wearing the scarf, but you have this bigger responsibility of creating this awareness and also saying that, you know what, this is not a Muslim problem. This is not an education problem. This is a universal problem. Can you talk a little bit about that? So that was one of the reasons that held me back from speaking out because I did not want to sit and reiterate a stereotype because I was a convert, started covering, I married a Muslim man, of course, and then fell into an abusive marriage. And unfortunately, there's a lot of negative stereotypes around Muslim men outside of the Muslim community. So it held me back from speaking out because I was like, I do not want to reiterate the stereotype. So I speak out against domestic violence and I meet so many women and yes, a lot of them are Muslim, but a lot of them are not Muslim too. I made very clear when I finally go public that one in three women in America have been victims or will be a victim of domestic violence. We only make up maybe two to three percent of the population in America. So this is clearly not a Muslim problem. Now, at the same time, I am very clear and I was okay getting backlash with this. I was okay with that because at the end of the day, if I'm speaking the truth, that's all that matters. The Muslim community does not handle abuse in the appropriate manner. So that was one thing that it's like, yes, it may not necessarily, stats show different. Some say it happens more, some say it happens on average the same. But regardless, what I felt and tapped them after victim after victim, a lot of times we've been told to stay patient and to read more on and a lot of the cultural barriers come into place. So I wanted to be clear that yes, this may not be, this is not a Muslim problem. This happens all over the world. But the way the Muslim community is handling it from my perspective and from every other woman I've spoken to, it is a problem on how it's handled. People have good intentions, they do. But there needs to be a lot more education on how to handle abuse. So people that were helping me and felt like they were doing the right thing by telling my ex-husband to read more Quran and that would help him, they didn't have an evil heart, but they weren't equipped on how to handle abuse. So some of it is awareness and some of it is educating our community on how to handle these issues when they're faced with these women that come to them that took every ounce of them to go and seek help because it takes so much courage to go and seek help when you get to that point. I don't want women to be turned away by saying it's going to be okay because it's not, they need to be removed from the situation. They should not be going back to an abuser. For you, how did you find that courage to say, you know what, enough is enough, I'm going to do something about it? What was that turning point for you? So my turning point was I went back to Dallas. I was actually in Houston for the ISMA Convention. And so I went, I was close to Dallas and I went back with my business partner. And that was the first time that I had been back to Dallas since I had escaped the abuse. And when I was there, all I could think about was memories of our abuse. And I went to the mall, the Frisco Mall in Dallas, and all I could think about was how he left me. I was pregnant, I believed, with my baby. And I had no cell phone and no way to go home. He left me there. We talk about abuse in the physical sense, but imagine just the trauma that abusers put victims through putting them down to leaving them stranded with a baby pregnant in no way to get home. These are the things that we don't talk about when we talk about domestic violence. So when I was there, I was literally triggered and everywhere I went. And that was my breaking point. I was like, I have to speak out, I have to speak out, I have to speak out. It almost became where I hit so low dealing with the abuse that I popped. And then I found my voice. And from there, I felt like I was never going to be silenced after that. He literally, he saw my post on Instagram and Facebook. And within seconds, he picks up the phone and calls me. And he of course demanded I take it down. But that was the first time I felt like I found strength. And I was like, no, I'm not taking it down. And I'm not going to be silenced anymore. As someone who's on the outside. I'm sure family members and friends or in this case, like even a co-founder, can that other person on the outside help someone who's going through this? So I would say not to judge them, to give them a little bit of tough love in the push when they need it, but also a lot of patience too. For a victim that's currently being abused, you literally want someone to pick you up and take you out of it. What no one recognizes is that every bit of strength and every bit of you has been sucked out of you. The life has been sucked out of you where it is difficult to get out of bed. And you want someone just to come and rescue you. But what I found and what every other survivor found is that no one's going to necessarily rescue you. You have to literally pick yourself up and say no more and go. And there's never necessarily a right time. We want there to be a right time where everything's set up perfectly. It's probably never going to be like that. It comes from both sides that there needs to be a lot of patience and support and community involvement and helping. But the victim also has to make that final decision and say, yes, I'm going to leave. For you being a single mom, what are some of the challenges that you have to face with this? And I know for a lot of women who have children, they stay because of the children. You know, at first it's the guilt. It's just this like, like, sick to your stomach type of a guilt. Like, did I break up a family? Did I break up a family? Would he have changed if I just stayed a little bit longer and got more help? If I just stayed six months more, no, no, no, with this help, he could change. But they don't change. They don't. And the guilt just stuck, you know, just at the core of me. And then I always, always remember, my God bless his heart. The brother and his wife who took me and the children in, he's the one that really was like getting the car and go. The day that I arrived to my friends and his wife house, I got in late and we slept, but I barely slept because of how much I had in my mind. And the next morning at the breakfast table, I was holding my five month old son and just dazing and, you know, staring off into space because I could barely comprehend what had happened. And I just, I spoke to myself, not even realize I said it out loud. And I go, I broke up a family. And then he, Arthur, who had taken me in, him and his wife, he's like, don't you dare say that you didn't break up a family. His fist broke up a family. So I will remember those words for the rest of my life because even as a victim of abuse, we're blaming ourselves for everything. Could I have been a better wife? Could I have done this differently? Could I have stayed longer and he would have changed. It's not your fault. Did nothing to cause them to behave this way. And then as you're out and as you heal, your brain starts to get rewired from how you should be thinking. And then you recognize that this isn't to the children, this is for the children to leave. And so I now handle out through so much struggle, financially, emotionally, but it's worth it because my kids and I have a peaceful home where there's laughter and kindness and there's no screaming and yelling and no violence. And this is the home that I want them to grow up in. And you're raising men. Absolutely. I talk to them and definitely don't talk to them about abuse because they're way too young. And even conversations like this, I do it when they're not around me. But I make sure that they know how to love and respect women. I literally have conversations with them now to even do things so much as open up doors every time they see a woman. But I also make sure that they understand how to, that it's okay for them to cry. It's okay for them to feel pain. It's okay for them to hurt because we need to start teaching boys how to handle their emotions. And it's okay to express their emotions. And in fact, you should encourage it because if we start teaching them at a young age that you need to, they need to learn how to express their emotions and it's okay that you are not any less of a man to show your pain, then we can start to break the cycle. That they know how to handle their emotions in a healthy way. You have so much going for you. You've got the successful business. You are recognized. You are all over in the media. And this piece wasn't in the forefront. And then you came out and you told your story. It almost seems to me that you've emerged as a completely different person now. Like you're not the same Lisa. Completely. This experience has changed you. And it will change you for the rest of your life. And this is something that for me and any other victim of abuse, you will live with this for the rest of your life. It's just a fact. You can heal from it, but you're going to be changed. However, through all of the trauma and speaking out, I'm actually stronger. It's almost like I had to hit rock bottom, like completely rock bottom to rebuild myself internally. Because looking back, I didn't have any self esteem or self worth before I went into the marriage. Had I loved myself, I would have understood my worth. And I went to rock bottom to rebuild myself to recognize what I deserve. You had to give advice to someone who's going through this. What would you tell them to do? I would say to recognize that healing is not overnight and that it is a roller coaster of emotions and everybody heals differently. And there is no timeline I'm healing. I think as a survivor, even now we try to always say we're healed, we're healed, but there probably will always be that sense of pain. I talk about it and I'm very strong in how when I'm talking about domestic violence, but I know that there's always this, it's like a slight bit of pain when you think about these memories, but understand that that's okay. It's okay to feel the pain and it's okay to hurt, but don't live in that space. Remember that you're out and there's life ahead of you and there's a beautiful life ahead of you and that's what I need to focus on. For me personally, what gives me comfort is that I recognize all the beautiful things in my life, that I survived this and that there's only good things to come now in my life and so that's what I tell myself every day. I think there's like a quote that says you don't have to see the whole staircase, just take the first step and that's actually, I was looking back, that's literally what happened. When I left, I did not know where I was going to live. I didn't know what my source of income was going to be. Verona just started, I was not making a dime from Verona. I didn't know where we were going, what we were going to do. I knew nothing. How am I going to take care of my kids? I put my faith in God and I left and I'm like, I have to leave and I will figure this out. I will figure this out. I definitely don't want to recommend victims where if they're trying to escape to not set up a plan, I want women to set up a plan but sometimes it's not always like that. Sometimes your life is on the line and you have to leave. I've talked to so many victims and survivors and so many want to have everything perfectly set up and it definitely does not work like that. You have to try to set up a plan as best as you can but then you have to take that leap of faith and go. These women have been silenced and have belonged that they have forgotten who they were but we're also, we're talking about women finding the courage to leave but I also think the other side of the flip side is we as a community do not do enough for victims of abuse. We need to be there for victims of abuse. We need to let them into our homes. We need to provide them services. We need to help with shelters and save space for women so they have a place to go. If you're able to take them in, take them in. These are the things that the community needs to do so then when they do find the courage to leave, we are coming together as a community and saying I'm here for you. That's the other side where yes, we're encouraging women to say you can be strong and you can do it but we have to be there for them. We are the sum of our experiences and for you, you've had multiple experiences. You're a mom, you are a business woman, you are on this mission now to raise your voice for domestic violence awareness. If you were to go back and talk to the young Lisa who is like just entering into her adult life, what would you tell that young Lisa? Honestly, I would tell myself I'm enough. I think I grew up like not having confidence and I think I'm almost getting teary-eyed. I think I would look at myself and be like, you don't need his attention. You don't need his love. You can love yourself and in some ways as ironic as it sounds, I'm thankful for the experiences that I hit rock bottom because of that. I know I love myself and who I am. So I would have started out is I would have recognized that like I am enough but thankfully I'm there. So that to me is all that matters. Even as parents and you know this now and this is why you're teaching your children, you're raising your boys to have that confidence and to treat others with kindness. Absolutely. Thankfully my mom was always very encouraging and so I'm instilling that in my boys too but it's something where I want them to have that confidence for themselves and love for themselves so then they can grow up and because really truly we focus on getting women out of abuse but we don't focus on how it starts and where it comes from. We never really focused on that and it really comes down to abusers come down because they're so broken inside. That's how we break the cycle. My boys are going to be raised to love themselves and have confidence in themselves because I always say hurt people hurt others. Right, right. So if they're whole inside and they feel good about themselves and they know they're loved and they have people that support them and love them, they're not going to have that pain inside to want to go and hurt other people. What brings you hope and optimism? When I get those calls that they're like I left, I did it. I feel like in some way it's just like it's like you know that feeling that they have it's like that moment of courage where it's like I finally did it, you know, I left. So that's what keeps me speaking out is that seeing other women's journey following it and knowing that they're going to rebuild their lives too. It's almost like being born again. When you leave? Well, one thing I want to always make clear is that when a woman leaves that actually is almost the hardest part then the real work begins because it's now having the courage to not go back. I actually when I got to Florida that was one time when I finally had the strength to not go back and I said I'm not going back unless you get help X, Y, and Z and I actually stayed married to him for a year while he got therapy but a lot of women go back just out of they miss them and it can change typically you know the cycle of abuse is they abuse you then they go to the super remorseful stage I'm so sorry please forgive me I'll change I'll never do it again I'll get help to the honeymoon stage giving you gifts, love, whatever it is you know affection then abuse again and that's how you get trapped into the cycle and the problem is is that every single time you go through the cycle of abuse like you get broken down a little bit more and so they have more and more strength and power over you so you think right because they're literally brainwashing you for however long you're with them and you get sucked into it they literally put prey on people that are compassionate because my ex-husband every single time we would go to a therapist he'd cry about how his after beating me he'd cry about how he was broken inside and how he was beaten as a child and so that weighs on your heart and then you're thinking I need to help him I need to be there for him I can't leave him so after you break through and leave the hardest part is actually making sure you don't go back then from in that journey you definitely there comes a point is I'm never going back and that's your breakthrough that's your new life it's not just a case of when you finally got in the car and left the breakthrough is after you've been gone you didn't go back and then you finally realize I'm never going back how do you want to be remembered I guess it's not so much about how I want to be remembered I mean it's just honestly hoping that what I'm doing is helping even if I'm forgotten no problem is what I'm doing helping after I spoke out I received hundreds of messages from other women hundreds and then I recognized that I was like I have to keep talking about it I have to keep speaking out so that's really why I keep doing what I'm doing just because of all the other women who need to understand that they can leave and there is life after abuse do you have a message a final message like a you know if there was like a billboard with Lisa's message what would that be it would be a book it would not be because I don't know what to there's so much to say the biggest thing that I want to convey is that your current situation doesn't have a future there is life after abuse in that you can find happiness and you can love yourself again thank you so much Lisa thank you