 Welcome to the documentation office hours. It is the 11th of January, 2021. So here's what we've got topics I had put on. I would love to review with the three of us doing a combined review and adding additional content to this blog post draft. That Oleg and Oleg and Markey Jackson have been assembling its due Wednesday to the continuous delivery foundation and they would love to have our feedback on it so edit live during the meeting is my proposal. We'll have some fun with it then Jenkins in Google summer of code was a topic security release upcoming was a topic. There's wiki plan and we should probably move this one earlier just to be sure if there are no issues pull request progress. Any other topic she'd like to add Vlad. No, I guess that's that's fine. Okay. All right. And I think the most maybe what we do here is let's put this one down a few, just to get through a couple of sort of trivial news things and then I hope we can, if you don't mind we'll spend the bulk of the meeting talking about this one and I generating ideas back and forth of topics that we can include in it. So, great. Okay, so, so we've got in terms of pull request progress. The scaling Jenkins on Kubernetes pull request still needs additional work because I haven't worked on it over the holidays, and there are I need to work with Kristen whetstone to have her guide me how to use the some specific things that I couldn't figure out how to make them work with this with this what's described here. So, whoops, to review continue review work with Kristen to identify his mistakes. Then Vlad as far as I can tell all of your pull requests have been merged. That's that's really quite positive. Excellent. Thank you. No, none open and 35 that have been merged from you. Thank you. Thank you. And may ask, well, just raise one one issue. I, one of the pull request, all of them are very simple but just to be more kind of consistent, I opened an issue. And in the pull request, I mentioned fix this issue hoping that the issue will be closed it was not closed automatically. It was closed the issue manually. So, from the top of your head, maybe you remember in git, do we need to say fix issue or fixed, or if you don't remember I can probably find this out by Google. That's a really good question because Tim Jacome had said, if you reference it with the that text you use fix for some number. It would it should do it automatically. Do you happen to remember which which issue it was and we could take a look at it. This is in Jenkins.io, I guess, and if you can look at closed PRs closed. So, what we get what I've got here is closed issues and I think it's this top one Docker page reference to Docker enterprise. Maybe that the one. Don't call right now. Is there. Yeah. This. Oh, this issue is closed by. Yeah, so if we look at 4059 it was this one. And you, you said fix, fix issue number 4058. Well, maybe I didn't wait long enough because what happened when the pull request was closed, the issue was still open. And I went inside GitHub and menu closed issue. Maybe there is some delay. I'm not sure. But yeah, this is minor thing and Well, so there is this over on the right hand side here. This thing that says linked pull requests. And, and if you click that. Now I don't think it will let me link it now because it's already it's already merged. But that you might try that the next time you open an issue see if, if linking the pull request would help help the automation. Very good. I'm not sure that I able to do this editing problem not allowed to but yeah in case if there will be some things I will communicate somehow. Well, as and if, if you can't do the added as a link to pull request, then that says that the people who have merged permission should probably see this comment that you gave. And go ahead and go do the linking because it it makes sense to me that 4058 should be linked here. Because that that lets Docker then automatically close the pull request. Yeah, thanks. Okay, so that covers all the next next item was Jonathan's pull requests, and we did in the last within the last 12 days or so three days ago we merged this one. And so the JMeter, there is a page now that describes JMeter we still have three yet to do, but nine of his pull requests have been merged. So nice, nice step forward and what that JMeter page migration I did quite a number of changes to it to get it to the point where I thought it was ready to publish. So I think we're in good shape. Very good. Oh, whoops, why did I stop sharing. Sorry, that wasn't intentional. Let's try that again. Okay, good. I have a small comment. And the question also, JMeter is performance testing kind of tool open source which had been for 100 years, but there is also blaze meter, which is not open source but the product. So my understanding as the rule of thumb we should reference only open source projects in this integration and how to not just any any products right. I'm not meeting this question because blaze meter is kind from from the same category, but does better reporting. Right, right. Well, and that's, that's actually a really good question. So I think blaze meter actually be maybe mentioned on Jenkins that I'll let's see just so it's listed as a plug in, and there was a blog post, and we, we, we certainly welcome a blog post. So this is a blaze meter based blog post and and no issue there and we've as an example of other things that we've done with proprietary solutions we've certainly got the tutorials on how to install with IBM cloud and your email on Google cloud, and we've got one pending now on AWS cloud so I, or here this lab view app lab view is definitely not an open source solution so we're, we're open to do do any of them I like. I rather like that we've got a that that we make the distinction you described that we prefer open source when it's available. Thanks for clarifying. Yeah, I just didn't look so far away like 2017. Yeah, it's my fault. Right. See, so what were the examples there was. Oh, that's right it was the name of the product there it's lab view. And a blog posts on blaze meter others on. Let's say I think we have one or more pages on Visual Studio, but a good examples of that kind of thing. All right, so then the reminder reminder was Google summer of code is coming. And, and we would love to have more suggestions for project ideas. Now Google summer of code is all about code. So it's less about documentation other than to encourage them to document what they're working on, but absolutely would love to have more. We had a blog post from Cara de la Marc, inviting a calling for additional mentors and then next topic was security release so this come this next week we will have the Jenkins 2.263.2 and Jenkins 2.275 and it'll be a security release. It was announced was announced last week that it'll be a security release and the change log has been submitted for the LTS and final revision of that change log and of the weekly will be available Wednesday when it ships. Any questions there. Cool. So now I would propose we switch to the most valuable part which is a group editing exercise. Oops, why did it do that. That's strange. There we go. Okay, so this is the. Now we could do this together, we could do each of us at our own keyboards, whatever you'd whatever you'd prefer. To edit this blog post. I would say individually, but whatever whatever you prefer. Yeah, so here I'm going to I'm going to paste the URL to it. And this way you and I both can start looking at it and and talk as we go because for me the powerful thing here is are there are there things we missed are there things that we should be considering. Oh, that should be in there. When I went through it earlier today for instance it mentioned the roadmap briefly, but did not have a paragraph about the roadmap and so I added a paragraph about the roadmap. And for instance documentation cleanup and plug in and plug in documentation migration. We could we could maybe make a graph or something like that for visual interest. See what we've got for documentation cleanup. Nothing in the body for documentation cleanup but I think I could grab some data on that that might make the post interesting. And there is like a then there is statistics page, and I noticed it was in our jitter discussions, I guess, team or somebody else provided you very interesting graphs on statistics. I guess it was. Was it in Jenkins dogs or maybe some other, but it was quite interesting statistics, or maybe it was an email exchange I forgot where, but I saw quite interesting. How many heats and so on. Oh that and that was the that's the Google Analytics page that's the Google Analytics data for the last month. Right. Yeah. Right. And I just just idea. You want to put it inside of expand with like interesting statistics. See what now what that may that's a that's a good question it may be worth looking at. We have documentation. Statistics that I collect every month into the doc sig meeting notes, and I've got those and we've got graphs of those that we might consider now see well yeah okay so we've had. We could easily count the number of documentation pull requests that have been merged over the year, because I've got the data. I have to do the summing. See if and let's let me see if I can get it from. There is also this Jenkins dot dev stats dot CD dot foundation site. Here I'll put a link to it. Metrics site were Jenkins repositories. And this is a metric site that's maintained by the Linux foundation. Now, how do we find all of the interesting dashboards on it. Okay, so what if we said, there we go documentation committers in repository groups. So repository groups. Interesting documentation committers in repository groups, listing companies and developers. If we show quarters. Hey, let me show you this one. This is kind of a cool graph. Okay, sharing my screen now. So what this graph says is the yellow line seems to be companies. And the, I know is it which one is which okay is that one. Okay, so the green line is companies contributing and committing and the company's access is on the left so beginning back in 2018 we had 80 distinct companies that their metrics said we're contributing. If we go all the way back to 2020 January we had 92 companies contributing documentation. We've dropped off a little bit until, and I don't know why we're seeing that. Oh, this is that one that number is because it's for this month, it hasn't come in the data isn't available for January right where we're only 11 days in so I'm not worried about that one. But, oh, and this is like, let's do months. There we go. Okay that's better that was a quarterly graph if we do a monthly graph and instead of last three years let's do last 12 months last one year. Okay. Now last one year is not good enough right we want. Okay, so here if we look at it. Now we've got data for December, which says 98 documentation committers. And that matches with this axis on the right and 36 companies contributing which matches over here. Do you know how we count companies are those. They're making them. They're using a best guess if I remember correctly based on the email address of the of the person let's see if we can figure that out is this dashboard shows companies. I use in the business email address but in case right. Oh, and here's the here's the way they determine company affiliation from this file. And it's, I'm sure a very large blob. So we could look there and Sam test it and see. Hey, is it. It's a 60 megabyte JSON file that's a big, that's a big data file. So we could we could consider mentioning something like this in the blog post saying hey, we're, we're delighted that over the course of the year we've consistently had over 30 companies. Okay that one dropped to 29. And I have to say something like we averaged over 30 companies every quarter that we're contributing 30 different companies every quarter contributing to documentation and documentation committers 8996. Oh, I need to look further back. How about here. Yeah, these are the low points right so 31 committed companies and 110 committers. 31 out of 9634. Is it possible to look like annually, or by, by year for the last five years for instance just to figure out the trend. Is it the same or is it going. Good question it only gives me quarters but I certainly can broaden the range to. I mean we could go with a custom range or we could just say the last five years. Here we go. The last five years. So it's nice to end. So we're doing upward, please. That, and that really is okay. Now, it's a little bit worrisome here that the number of companies committing to documentation number has actually dropped. The, the aggregate of number of committers we, we hit 237 in the first quarter. No, in the at the end of 2019 and 191. No 238 in the month in the quarter ending, September 30. And we have several sites for recommendation we have besides Jenkins.io we have plugins site and we used to have a big key I'm not sure how it counts this graph. So this one doesn't count the wiki, but but and this one may not based on their description because they say anyone anything changing MD files. So, for instance, Jenkins.io does not use MD files we use that a doc files. And so this thing may actually be under stating the amount of documentation, but it's looking across all repositories so it's looking at plugin repositories and Jenkins core and Jenkins infrastructure so it's looking much more broadly than and even so we're still getting increasing contributions by number of people and well we haven't we haven't collapsed too badly in number of companies 77 from our high of 86. So the only drop was July of last year, which was, you know, I know in California it was a little weather, right. July was July was sort of a mess wasn't it. So dumb question what exactly constitutes a commit is like I'm thinking. This pushes a PR and I review it and I make a suggestion in there. When you accept that suggestion that shows up as your commit not mine right. Correct. Okay, so there could be participation. That's not right right this, this is not this is not describing participation right this isn't not describing reviewers it's only describing committers. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But even even that for me is is commendable because it says a from from 2016 to now across so across the space of five years. We have almost doubled haven't we so we were at 15 no not quite so we're we're a good 30 or 40% higher in terms of number of documentation. We did double very close to double the number of committers from our start in early 2016 is the data here to this high point in end of September. But how much has usage of Jenkins increased in that time. That's a very good question that the plug in site can help us with. Let's use the let's we're going to use one approximation of Jenkins usage. How many users have installed the get plug in. So, over the last 12 months usage is largely flat it's to 15 to 260,000 up from 250,000 so about 10,000 user 10,000 installation increase in 12 months. So only 10,000 so 10,000 out of 250,000 that's what 125th so that's about a 4% increase in Jenkins server count, but we've got an almost 100% increase in documentation can committers. Okay. And I wonder in case is possible to compare with commitments to the code base. So documentation versus code base base that are much more. That's that's actually a really good question and I think we should be able to answer the question but I don't know the answer. Let's duplicate that tab and go find out okay so let's see what else there is so your question was about companies contributing in repository groups, or. Well let's try that one. So this one is, and let's go to quarterly and over the last five years. If I read this correctly companies contributing okay number of users number of individual contributors so we are 1600 here up now to our peak 2000. So, 2082 there 90 so roughly 2000. If we take the average across all three of those quarters. So we're up by what is that 400 over 2000 is 20%. But only up 20%. So again, documentation contributions across five years is dramatically better even then code contributions. So, that's a great success. Now there could be all sorts of errors hiding in that data but for me it's that's that's quite comforting to think that okay maybe maybe the documentation contributions really are increasing and that's great. See so was there another dashboard we wanted to take a look at for instance developer, I don't know what developer activity counts would mean that doesn't help me. This, this tells me, who are top contributors notice Oleg, Jesse, Daniel, who the Hoffner, Tim Jacob, these are people I know. That's good. You are number seven. There. Yeah, that's, that's a weird one because well that that is odd. Huh. So, why is it odd. Because I'm not sure that I'm actually doing that many commits to the code. Maybe this is, yeah, maybe this is looking at docs. This is all yes it's also including docs. So that's that's understandable then. Yep. Okay, got it. The difference of this graph versus what we have on GitHub. GitHub is only on specific rapper for instance on Jenkins.io. You can take a look at different commitments from different people. I think you and Oleg are on the top. I think I think even there I thought that there was a way to do insights, but is it isn't there some way to do insights, even from here. Okay, we've got the concept of projects. It may need someone with admin permission to see the insights for like aggregated Jenkins, the entire organization. And what is the entire. So this is, this is the entire organization if I look at my organization. I think I may be able to see some. Just a minute. No, no, I don't have it either. Oh yeah, so here we go. It's this kind of data that I suspect may only be available to a to an administrator. This is like it can be viewed by anybody. Oh, oh, interesting. Okay, so then I don't know how to how to determine repository level. Oh, oh, I can insights. So if you go to, for instance, Jenkins info Jenkins IO. Oops, not jank dash info Jenkins.io this one. Okay. And go to insights. I guess now we can look at this is the one I've been capturing. And If you go a little bit lower. Yeah, probably different, different types of five for requests by five people 11 issues and eight unresolved conversations. And you should click on every person. All different statistics on specific person and talk to the person. All right, so if we click here, let's click on Vlad. Yeah, see that just takes me there. Oh, but okay now I don't know how you did that how did you put the stats there. Oh, I guess you can go to read me file. It's that's markup in your read me file I see. Yeah. And it is the repository of which is responsible for this constant content is. It is the same name as the name of the author of this so this will be so. That's an elegant technique. I'm going to have to, I'm going to have to look at your technique just to see what you did. So you inserted. GitHub read me stats. Oh, that's that's very, very interesting. I grabbed it from market. Guys, that's all yes the most sincere form of flattery ever. That's very good. Huh, nice. Okay, I like that. All right, so Meg, just to take us back to where we were. Vlad and I, our goal here was to do edits to this document. And the document is where. No, not that one. Vlad, what did I do with it? I've lost the document shame on me. That's definitely not it. I have it on my computer. Maybe this one's it. Here we go. No. Oh, that's that's really frighteningly embarrassing because it's right here in this one 2020. Oh, there it is. I see it. It's already on my. Here it is. This one. What I wanted to do was this is a proposed end of your summary blog post that Markey Jackson started and that Oleg Nanash of and I have been adding comments to and text, etc. The key highlights and the thought that Vlad and I had was the three of us could independently during this meeting spend time in this document and make our own proposals to it so that we could help. Excellent. So here is the URL to it and I'll put that into the meeting notes are into the chat. Let's open it on your computer and take a look at it. Your comments will just go in as comments. Okay. And one of the things that helps with the blog post is images like this nice happy new year. And I suspect we ought to do pictures into the Jenkins user interface thing I think that's a good one to embed a picture and I'm going to go find a plugin manager. Because I know we did a blog post on that. Where when was that glad that was that when you and I did. Oh, can you, can you repeat the question. Oh, it was on the changes to the to the plugin manager. If you don't remember that's okay that probably means I can take a look and search for this. Just, I'm sure that we owe a way to say user. Maybe. I thought for sure that maybe it was somebody else wrote the blog. I remember a video because that would that came out at the same time as the tiles on the manage Jenkins page I think those two together and I remember there was a video. And that's that's actually a good one. That was that's not even mentioned here. So new typography and layouts we ought to insert. I just captured that. I just know that Jenkins blog again manager. Here we go. No, no, that's not it. Hmm. Okay, I am going to find this thing by looking backwards in time just a minute. Okay, that reminds me that there is the Windows installer upgrades. There's a blog post that we should probably link. Because down here later, I mentioned Windows installer. Yeah, I'm trying to find this for the manager somehow are closed. There's all that work you guys have done on the plugins. And there's also the beginning of the cleaning up the terminology. Right. Oh, and, and, Meg, if you could look through, I think terminology is mentioned there. Yeah, there it is. It's mentioned there, but it would be really good to suggest a hyperlink to it. Because I've lost track. And we're waiting the last I heard we were still waiting from get our GitHub to decide what they were going to do about master right. Oh, they've made a decision. It's now called mean, it is called mean okay. No, because at one point it was going to be choose something other than master and I was trying to figure out how we're going to write for that so. Right. Yes, that needs a link definitely. So we're just above events. Let's see we have links for terminology updates over here we have that. But they're only mentioning master I don't see anything about whitelist blacklist. And we don't have anything about the documentation. Yeah, so look for for that one look for a blog post from Alex Earl from slide slide or mix. I believe he's the one no slide. Alex, the here link is to a blog by Alex Earl called Jenkins terminology change. Oh right and that was done to that was done to the CDF site, not to Jenkins that I owe the first here. Yeah, exactly. Here is Markey Jackson's piece about on Jenkins terminology updates. And that one I think so that this one then is no wrong one. The terminology updates. Yes. And I give it I lost track of where we I know with the doc some of it you said you were happy with the dots being ahead I know we've got some implemented but not. I don't think we're done right. So yeah there's lots to do on your case of the first link is to the CDF blog post, and the second is to the one from Markey Jackson. Yeah, yeah. Okay. So moving forward, I have a, I mean you guys and Jonathan are the greatest ones, but we've had a lot of talk about making ways to get more people, especially underrepresented groups feeling comfortable and stuff. And it seems like documentation is a good place. Why don't we have more people showing up at this meeting I mean do we need to have some time make a big deal and announce a special session that's just for people who've never contributed before to come in, you know, or, you know, something like that to to drum up some interest I, I think there's a lot of people out there who would like to contribute who are a little bit scared. If they just hear it's regular office hours are probably a little bit scared about going in and looking like an idiot. Not realizing how kind and gentle everybody would be and that they would be welcome but you know, do we do we need to do something to drum up some more interest or Yeah, that would certainly be great some way of, of promoting and encouraging people to join. Yeah. We have outreach group. We do efforts. That's correct. Yeah. Yeah, so we've got, we've gotten in the Gitter channel we've got the outreach and advocacy sig here that's encouraging us. Maybe expanding channels besides Twitter. Well, and interestingly enough, I think LinkedIn is a good as a good suggestion there because we've we've recently surpassed the number of Twitter surprises subscribers with a number of LinkedIn subscribers. We have more LinkedIn subscribers where we can do full size posts we can embed pictures we can do all sorts of things. Then we do Twitter followers, and we have a good number of Twitter followers already. So LinkedIn is is an even more interesting thing than I thought. So LinkedIn, LinkedIn, the LinkedIn readers are probably more likely to follow an invitation. Hey, come join our documentation. Actually, maybe that's what we do. Here's this here's here. Let's just do it. Invitation to, let's see Docs sig suggests. Docs office hours suggests that we should post a submittal post a LinkedIn invitation to join the office hours for coaching and encouragement to help document Jenkins. And now here's a proposed so I'll prep a Google doc with some ideas, we can discuss that okay. Yeah, if there and I'd like is, I think it would be great I mean, to me, contributing to the doc is a little I mean not I mean, it's not a Vlad level contributions are going to, but somebody who just wants to get started, you know, to go in and fix code and then you've got to test it and you've got to deal with a test environment it all gets complicated. If you want to go in and clarify a sentence in the documentation it's much straighter for more straightforward. And we had a lot of stuff at DevOps world about, you know, diversity and underrepresented groups and making them feel welcome and it really annoyed me that it was more a thing of these things these bad things have been known to happen and we feel your pain, rather than say you know, here's some plays that you can get in and get started and you will be safe and maybe Alyssa could help you know just, you know, and we don't want to be stupid and sound like we're being tokenism or something but maybe we can particularly target. They must have mailing lists that came out of who tended or watch those videos. Those videos are up for viewing now actually that would be a place where we could put a link and say, you know if you're looking for place to get started this event is happening and such and such a day click here. Oh, good idea. So, would we also consider adding links to office hours in in the comments. Oh in the descriptions of our you to one or more of our YouTube videos. Maybe it's already that we could, we could take your idea there. And let's not just say this we get to do it, we will also add links to office hours of YouTube videos. It just seems to me there's a lot of work that is sort of simple work that people could get started with you know and it's like I mean I know for me. I know how to write but the you know getting comfortable with the project and then once I was that I could say you know gee I could do a better job right describing this subject and what's here. Mm hmm, right, but. Okay, here I want to grab that where was it. I have that graph that graph was just too cool not to have a picture of it. Okay, so this is docs contributors. And I'm going to change the date range so that we get through that 930 date range to see that was 2021 2020 dash 10 dash 01 apply the time range. There we go now does that show you a picture okay I'm in it I'm cheating the data a little bit. It's a window that I'm using okay so now if we do this take a picture, and we edit the picture, and we crop the picture, then we'll need to give them a key because they won't be able to. Oh you don't think that they'll oh they can't hover developers right so so now you're going to really strain me okay so it is that. Committers is the yellow yellow line companies. Is the green line and committers goes from, we said it was 100 and this is why we can hover over it now. Committers at that point 118 to 238 18 in 2016 to 38 in 2020. Almost exactly double. Yeah, that's that's very close to double right so no need to be ashamed of that number. How do I change the size of this. Come on. There we go. Okay. companies companies and committers. We don't you're, you got to remember the axis on the left is companies the axis on the right is committed so it's a it's a two axis graph. Okay, oh dear okay I'm in over my head. Yeah sorry Jewish history sorry. Oh, I'm the wrong person to talk about medieval Jewish history that's great okay 57 companies to 77. Okay. So that one's not as good 57. Not as not as much of an increase but is still an increase. Okay, 57 in 2016. 27 in 2020. But that's good it means we have I mean, we're not. We're probably not escalating the number of companies involved in Jenkins but the companies that are involved it would say they are having their people do more work on it. Yeah, I think that's. I mean we don't, we don't need another 200 companies targeting Jenkins for their business. Right. We're not using it they might be contributing but realistically. Well, we would we would certainly I would love to have more contributors but in this case I think it's a good story to tell. Look, the documentation contributions are stronger than the documentation contributor account is actually stronger than the code contributor because if we look at the code contributor account we had that earlier right contributing companies contributing in repository groups this one shows if we if we do quarters and last five years. We see relatively flat. In terms of number of contributors to code. 2000. So we are not we're increasing still right so it's from 1600 1600 on five years ago to 2000 so it's about 20% increase, but it's not the 2x the 100% increase that we see in documentation contributors. But it's still a lot more people. Yeah, right, right, we only have 200 here instead of one instead of 2000 so it's a full order of magnitude less documentation contributors than code. But still I mean maybe an indication to the people are figuring out that okay we've got this cool code now we need to tell people what we know about how to use that it shouldn't all be unstable. Right. Exactly. Yeah, now where did my post go that I was working on get her. Too many windows, not enough time. Here we go. This. Okay. So, now I can actually upload the picture. And I think I can just drag the picture right in here and upload it. Very nice. Okay, so. Fair enough. I don't know if in the number of individual well in the number of contributors individual contributors who are not working for any company accounted by included. That I do not know I don't know. Certainly the data behind this is, is only as good, or the graph is only as good as the actual data behind it and they give us a link to their table so we could we could go read it to see if it's, if it's an error. And probably they would even accept. I'll bet you they would even accept pull requests. Let's see if they do. They would probably accept a pull request, correcting their data. If someone wants to go through and update their 60 megabyte JSON file with more accurate company information. Do they have a read me that describes what they're how they're doing it. They don't bad, naughty naughty. Well, this this dev stats project is amazing what they've done they have been so responsive to us. Anytime we have a question or a hey you can do this. These, these two people have been just great. Huh. But I don't see anything specifically about. There's a presentation. I wonder if the presentation tells what they're doing. Yeah. They're using it looks like they're using the off on a software. Yes, yes, definitely. Absolutely they are using Grafana, for sure. Yeah, so there is a, there's a whole presentation describing it. All right, well so forgive the forgive the side trips there I think. We've, we've at least started the edits encouraged both of you to continue editing on that blog post. Your, your suggestions are worth considering and Oleg will take another look at it tomorrow. Okay, did we get a mention because I don't know what to say about it because I don't completely because I'm not doing any work I'm just floating here. What exactly has been the work on the plugin documentation. I haven't done a lot of it. Right and I don't know what the sentence is to say what we do what we've done there. Yeah, so let, let's put, let's see if we got here we go. Plug in doc so there's an entry here on plugin documentation migration. And I can provide some text for that to describe how the progress we've made and it's, it's actually quite astonishing how well we've done so if we look at the documentation here and we look at the, here's a good one. This one is shows from the GitHub projects view. This is an incomplete view but still interesting. We have had had 126 projects that have tracked themselves as releasing their documentation. Now from GitHub and 59 have merged and are waiting for a plugin release with 35 in progress now that that ratio is is very attractive it's great to have 126 there's an even better piece of data, which is this. Let's see if I can find the wiki exporter. And this one takes a while to load because what it's doing is it will compute based on the plugin site, which how many of the plugins have made the transition to the to online documentation in their own repository instead of relying on the Jenkins wiki. And last I checked it was almost 600 of the roughly 1800 plugins. Here we go. So 595 have made the transition. Wow. And oh and this is this is actually very encouraging there used to be one in the top five that hadn't yet. So that's good. And 61 have pull requests pending. Ready to go as soon as someone merges the pull request and we've still got 1000 plugins now, you can imagine, many of those plugins haven't been released in many years, probably will never make the transition, right exactly. And if you look at the just visual effect if we look at the how this feels in terms of color you see the blue is PR but not yet released. And we're still. We haven't hit an empty row there's our first empty row. What number is that row. I don't know that I can see a number but I can tell you how many installations of that plug in there are that plug in has only 20,000 installations which is 10x less than the top plugins the top plugins have 250,000 installations. What I was thinking is if we had the number of that row, and minus one that we could say, all of all, you know, 300, whatever, of the most used plugins, have you or have an open PR to do. I like, I like that idea what you're saying one, one nice metric would be. Take some representative subset by installs like the top, top 50% of plugins or something or the top 30% of plugins right because 30% yeah we went down to the very bottom I bet we're going to have row after row after row that are all white great. Exactly, of course as as plugins are less and less used, they're less and less likely to be touched to update their documentation. And people are less and less apt to care. Right. In other words, that number on the top doesn't look very good 595 out of 1789 or whatever. That doesn't look like great progress. But if I can say, for the 500 most frequently used plugins. Right, right. 98% are done or something like that that's a much more impressive number. Well, and that's a good, let me see if there's a way to export is there a way to export a page to Excel. Let me see if I can export this because I think you've got a good idea there Meg that we should, we should put something in that in that blog post about how this, how this process has done so well at addressing the the most frequently used plugins. And that's, that's really cool. And then we decide whether we, you know, we cut it off and say so 100% of the 350 most used ones are in this state. Or we go down a few more so that we can say 90% of the 500 most used or something like that then. I like that live at Liars configure. Yeah, that sounds really good. So now how would I turn this into just cut it based maybe control C. Yeah, copy and then open up Excel and hope for the best. I've never in my life opened Excel and hope for the best. Really. Meg that's just shocked. I hate, I hate Excel. It's like all you who enter here. It's like quoting, quoting, quoting from Dante. That's very good. Excellent choice. Let's face it Dante is all you really need to know to understand the world. All right. Okay, so I am I I'll take I've got the data and the data here looks like it's usable. So, no reason. What number we get to when we start seeing whites. Okay, just a minute. Oh, I'm sorry. Okay, so now well and let's get. I'm going to do one more trick here to make the, the size of the. Come on, come on there only like Excel isn't a man is an amazing trick for me. I'm easily impressed. So the problem now is it's it's going off to talk to the Jenkins server about things that shouldn't. So I'm stuck now and that's that's, I didn't need it to do HTTP things but I can go find that separately. Let's just do this. Now I have to jump all the way to the bottom and then start here. Now, so I'm just going to have to take the whole page. So let's start a new Excel. It's really stuck. Okay, but I'll, I'll work on it separately because I think that's a good story to tell and I think that's a worthwhile story to say, Hey, here's here's the progress we've made. And, and isn't that amazing help us make more progress. I have a dumb plugins question. You see I'm here just to ask some questions. I think that that steps that reference page that you said is auto generated which by the way I think I saw the feet PR go through to fix it. So it's. But that lists all the plugins that can add steps to your pipeline and those for me, all of those steps are saying you can click from there and you get some documentation about the steps themselves. Is that documentation a is it auto generated out of code and be is it considered part of the plugin documentation or is it different type of what category of documentation is that is a pipeline. Okay, so it's definitely not plugin documentation because for instance if we look let's let's pick one let's pick. Let's pick the get plugins one that I know. Okay, so here we go. Here's the get plugin so I found this and I click that. So this documentation is extracted from the plugin source code and placed into this web page for for use. So did that answer your question. Yes it did yeah so it's, but it is it's in Jenkins IO so it is considered documentation but it's generated out of code that's in the software right it's extracted directly so here's another example get the get bisect plugin. It's extracted from and you see it's relatively minimal right there's not an awful lot of content here, the author of that particular plugin hasn't, hasn't taken the steps to document all the details like the get plugin has. That's a good one though okay so let's just say in terms of project management. Let me show up that because so it's not a straight doc review but that this there's some information there that could be that needs more documentation. Well so it really doesn't somebody would have to somebody would have to submit a bug report to the get bisect plugin for instance to say hey your documentation is missing this and and those kind of bug reports do appear. I don't, I have no idea what get bisect step does right and it could be a topic sentence for starters, you know, an example would be juicy but right and and and that plugin is is relatively low low volume. The second one is high volume and tries to have topic sentences etc, even so it's still. It's, it's certainly not as as effective as it could or should be. Right. If we took, let's see what's a different one. Check out. See if we can find the checkout SCM page. There we go. This one. We need to have to wait. Oh, that was faster than I expected so this is the checkout SCM step, which has, which has, if you look here, like 30 or 40 implementations of the step. Right. And one of those is used by 250,000 users 250,000 installations this thing. But the way this page is assembled. This page is assembled by asking each of these individual plugins to give their information, and then it's packaged into this monster page. Okay. And so all these, all the, all the phrases here are actually coming from the get plugin source code. But the experience for the user here is, is not nearly as good as nice as we'd like because how do you know you need to look at get SCM. You know, that's that's already complicated. Right. That's yeah that it's like there's a level of knowledge here that's only for the initiated. Right, way beyond initiated right you have to know. Oh, well I need get SCM okay I might have looked for the word get but if I looked for the word get how many times does it occur here. Only three that's not that bad. Okay. So they might get lucky there, but, but really, this page is an indicator that there's a lot to be done there. Right. But well there's a place for a guide to that goes through. We started a little bit in our training materials I don't know if that's the right place but it was the one we had open but you know, there's some cool things you can do with the get plugin. And to just references and say you know if you want to know every bloody thing this thing does that they're all listed there but these are the common ones. Right and maybe we need a layer like that I don't know. I just the more I do this stuff I have a feeling that this software has so many really powerful things in it that nobody is using because nobody can figure out how to use. And that's you you've just made it you've just made a brilliant a brilliant argument in favor of documentation good choice. Yeah. All right, I apologize. I have run beyond my time. I need to call an end. Well I came 15 minutes late so I can stand 15 minutes old and the hell with the rest. Love, simply lovely make simply lovely. Okay, let me this was wonderful. I missed you guys. Yeah, happy. Happy Goyesh a new year. Okay, so I am going to actually try one more time this time I'm going to try paste special text. Hey, hey it worked much better. Okay, so that was dramatically better because now it won't attempt to resolve hyperlinks. Okay, clicky. And now. Okay, there we go. So, so we're looking for the non okay we don't have numbers anymore so we're looking for a nano PR I see so okay it's done PR means there's an open PR that does it. Right. Exactly. Maybe just blank for one that isn't there so. I don't know let's find out to do do okay. So there we are. So if. Yeah, so now it's now it's time to do some some data crunching to see, because there's deprecated here, which we can, we can ignore we will not document deprecated plugins right to do. And so this could give some hint of what fraction has been done as we go through to the top, you know, if we said what if we said the top 300 plugin. Yeah. So this this needs some Excel slicing and dicing and Excel is really good at that kind of slicing and dicing so. So this may be a fun project for me just to see a documentation migration project process. Yeah, progress. It will be a nice number for the blog to whichever way you choose to slice it. Right. You might even give them multiple numbers you know this percentage of non deprecated ones are done but you know, but it's this percentage of the top 500 or whatever. If you want my help mark to work with this Excel, like with me now. Oh, I would love your help flat I am not a really strong Excel user are you comfortable with Excel. I can really well I can. Yeah, can work on this. I'm going to save this and I'll send it to you, and you are you are welcome to, to anything you can do to help I will be deeply grateful for it. And we don't need to use Google Excel right Google spread. I'm using I'm intentionally using Excel on my desktop on my Windows computer. Yeah, because I, in this case, there are things that Excel locally can do that. I don't quite know how to do them with with Google Doc with Google Sheets. But I'll send you a copy of this that way you've got it and you could try some some different different slicing and dicing. But do we have like special place just couple minutes where we can put this Excel as add on file or we are keeping it separately from our good. Good suggestion. Well, so we we could put it but it's just an extract of the existing data. So, so my, and my hunch is that if we were going to do this very frequently, we would want to go grab the original data source for these things because I think the data source is is already available as probably a JSON file. It's just, I'm not expecting we'll do this analysis over and over again I was just thinking, let's do it once. Yeah. So I will send this to you by email Vlad and thanks very much both of you. Thank you. Thank you. All right. See you next week. Same time. Bye.