 Welcome back to the breakfast. Our first major conversation this morning is on the third wave of COVID-19. In the last few days, we've reported the closing of unilag school hostels and of course, the governor of Lagos State also making statements with regards to what needs to be done to ensure that Lagos residents are protected from a third wave of the COVID-19 virus. We are speaking this morning with Dr. Thuyi, who is joining us to share his thoughts on this. Good morning, Dr. Mabawandu. Good morning, Dr. Thuyi. Thanks for joining us. All right, so in the last, you know, couple of, let's say months, we've seen figures from COVID-19 drop to as low as, you know, 20, you know, positive cases a day. And this is coming from, you know, in the same country where we used to have more than 2,000 a day. It almost seemed like something to celebrate that we were, you know, over this. What do you think may have changed as the figures are starting to rise and there seems to be a little bit of panic now in the air? Is it with our, you know, the protocols that we dropped or was this just expected? The people, the information management was also not so much. We left the information management to those people who were called the audience of conspiracy theories and who is the firm. That's happened. I said, probably the critical discussion of public space about COVID-19, we see that we are not talking about COVID-19 again. Everybody felt that, well, it's over. It's not existing. Let's talk about the banditry, which is also important anyway, that it could be, you know, where the information management of the public space, it was the case of the other thing. And the incident commanders of the COVID-19, which used to be some group of the presidents, they called PTF, the other tax force, and people in the state governor were not speaking about COVID-19 again. So when this seems to happen, what do you expect? People would drop their guards and then became careless. People would fly to the country, testing was not being done. Effectively, I learned the good, the determinants, their cause problem in India, their cause problem in South Africa, and Thailand to our country. Okay. During the last COVID-19 vaccination updates, the head of the National Primary Health Care Development Agency, you know, went on to answer questions, you know, that journalists asked regarding a third wave of COVID-19 in Nigeria. And he didn't seem to speak with much certainty regarding if we are already experiencing a third wave. So if, you know, there's not certainty regarding, you know, the third wave of the virus in Nigeria, what do you think Nigerians must do to prevent that? Well, you know, the scenario you narrated is a pointer to the fact that concrete information, proper discussion, we are upset with the public space onto this third wave came up. And even the vaccine that we're supposed to use to drive the numbers down, or do you put, prevent severe illnesses, and adjust available in sufficient quantity. Okay. Now, now we're not having a vaccine, because in public health, if you want to fight a pandemic, you have to look for a vaccine, very essential. That's the fastest way to fight a pandemic to come in here. We are not going to have vaccines. Here's what he said, about a hundred percent of Nigeria's are in the past, they've been so far. And secondly, we don't have the next system that we're resonating off to do, which I'm upset at the number of patients that may have to return to the institution. First, we're dealing with a lot of other factors, economic contractions, and we're dealing with things that are actually worsening the public trust environment. So we do to them, return the visitor commandant back, to keep talking about this. And let me also emphasize this, visitor commandant in this case should not just be the government of Palestine. A local government chairman should be involved in discussing, in passing the right to permission to the population, very essential. Also, if the media must start to step up, they literally can do to protect themselves. But honestly, there's no, there's nobody, when we don't know where the vaccine is coming, we don't know how soon the vaccine is there, I mean, deployed, and then there's no, let's not have space and have space in there to attend to you. All right. He just said it there, protect yourself. Let's move, let's also talk about the Delta variants now. There is fears about how much worse this particular variant is. Looking at how we managed the first two waves, and of course, the fact that we don't seem to have improved it a lot with regards to our healthcare and preparations. We don't seem to have improved our testing. We haven't gotten a lot of people vaccinated. Public information about COVID-19 still doesn't seem to have done so well. How do you think we would cope with a Delta variant that seems to be more powerful than the very first? Dr. Mabon, can you hear us? All right. I think we're going to have to try and reconnect with him. Something that I feel like I should also mention as we go on, and I think this is also a challenge with public information and the attitude that Nigeria as a country and Nigerians have with regards to COVID-19. You walk into a public place at the door. They force you to put on a mask, no mask, no entry. But immediately you get in. You see dozens of people with their mask on their neck. Or totally off on the table. And it makes absolutely no sense. A lot of times I get so irritated, but we're Nigeria. So this really, and I understand how a lot of people don't get to react to things if it doesn't affect them directly, but it's really still a failure on the level of public information that has to do with COVID-19. Nigerians always like to be forced to do the right things all the time. We as people need to do better. The level of sanitizing has gone down to below even what it was in the first month of the COVID-19 pandemic. And these are some of the things that must be fixed. If we're starting to talk about a Delta variant that seems to be even more powerful or causing more deaths than the very first two waves of COVID-19, then I don't think this is a time where Nigerians should wave this off and say this is white man's virus and it doesn't really concern us. See how the sun is hot here in Nigeria is going to burn off all the rest of the virus. We as people need to do better. And I think that when you talked about Nigeria sitting to be forced, if this third wave of the COVID-19 comes as we've seen in other parts of the country, in other parts of the world, Nigerians would not need to be forced to do what they need to do because we all know what we need to do. Ever since the outbreak of the COVID-19 pandemic, and how we saw our first case in February, we've been having sensitization. Nigerians know what to do, to stay indoors, to wash their hands, maintain hand hygiene, social distancing. We know what to do, but we keep talking about, oh, we need to survive. We need our daily bread and all of that. But you would admit that most of the world has adjusted. Most people still work remotely even now that, you know, it seems that economies are opening up. So many other businesses are going to be working remotely and people are going to be telecommuting for a while for a long time. For some companies, they don't see themselves coming back to fiscal office spaces. So I feel that once this virus gets to the peak, Nigerians would comply. And this is really scary because during some of those meetings recently, just yesterday, he mentioned that this Delta variant is 60 times more transmissible than the Alpha variant of the COVID-19 virus. And what this means is that it's going to be a very bad time in our nation's health and that we must do what we need to do, which is take the necessary health precautions. And I need to also ask Dr. Mabawando once we get back, you know, on the line, you know, when we hear the World Health Organization giving the briefing regarding the COVID-19, it seems almost scary because you hear the WHO making statements like the worst is yet to come for Africa regarding the COVID-19 virus. So it just seems like we've been in a period where we've been having it easy and that when this third wave hits, already the Delta virus is in Lagos, we know that people in the Unilag have been infected, hostiles had to be shot for the safety of others. When this gets to a point that is unbearable or the breaking point, Nigerians would do what they need to do. And another story I saw in the papers this morning is a statement, and this is by the Lagos State Government, the NEC National Economic Council. I was speaking on Thursday saying that there is no indication of an imminent lockdown, but we know that these are statements that will just be said to make sure that Nigerians, you know, don't get so tense and worked up. But the theme remains what Dr. Mabawando said, Nigerians have to protect themselves. Absolutely. Welcome back, Dr. Mabawando. Dr. Tui, can you hear us? Well, if you can hear us, can you unmute your mic please? All right. Dr. Mabawando, can you hear us now? Yes, we can. Yes, we can hear you. Please go ahead. All right. If you can hear us. Like I said, we are now at the point where individuals need to take action, no doubt, no doubt. We are at the point where we have to decree what we have. What do we have? Information, talking, explaining. And I want the team to be actually, you know, step down to the level of new government chairman, working in their local community, and sharing protection. In fact, it's a situation where to distribute masks in critical places like markets, and then also meet with the tribe and the religious leader for them to embrace this protocol. And it is time, even for the new governments to look at the kind of permits it's going to give, for those who have to do celebration, those who have to do party. These are critical issues that we need to follow. Right at this, it is essential that government should, as a matter of urgency, find a way to get vaccines. Because the truth is that, without vaccines, you can't fight this coronavirus in any certain way. Sufficiently, we've seen that we've done just about one percent of the vaccination, even though the vaccines are not available or used, and the government is calling again. And then, the vaccine assistance that we are so worried about is not as simple to be happening as we think in Nigeria. So, while we are looking for vaccines, it's important that in the government, the government especially, do more to the locality to limit the spread of the coronavirus. Is it too early to figure out how successful the vaccine is with fighting the virus? Like you said, we've gotten barely one percent of Nigerians vaccinated. Would it be too early to use those figures to show that, if you get vaccinated, you will be able to survive the COVID-19 infection? Well, it's not too early. It's not too early. Because what we're preventing is one, severe infection of COVID, secondly, the infection. Those are the cases where we're doing a severe disease, we're doing one hospitalization. Of course, so many diseases affect us that we're not aware of because they're not bringing the desired severe form of those infections. Now, what we need to do, because we are trying to push for herd immunity, herd immunity means that we want to see as much as 60 percent of the population getting vaccinated. That's herd immunity, that's herd immunity. But even at that, the figure we are taking, we are taking, we are not sure if we're going to track them pass on time, to do a check on them, and explain or show whether we're listening to these, whether it's a variant of COVID. We're not tracking them sufficiently because unfortunately we have somebody to contain it. But if we look at data from other countries, what we have seen is that those countries that were vaccinated are now opening up their spaces. We saw this Sunday, in the year 2020, when there's a 60,000 people in the stadium, they're not wearing face masks. We called the ambassador. We saw that even if they're trying to open up the puncture, they don't give a better, even putting the burden of the vaccination or you, that you demand, it's a number, it's not a demand, it's something that's only left in the queue and they are put in prison because they are not wearing face masks, whereas it is a manner of policy that you should do it. So that should be taken on how to find the virus to another level, to a very limited, very similar, because that's not the first official day. And if we look at U.S., those states that are not abusive access are the ones having the upsurge of the disease. Usually somebody is hoping that because we have vaccines, U.S. is saying that because that's not the the plan. These are sufficient evidence to show that vaccine works. And the better we get that so, the better for us. Okay. Doctor, the first wave of Nigeria's vaccination plan is complete. And, you know, Dr. Faizal Shraibu, head of the National Primary Healthcare Development Agency, mentioned just last week that Nigeria is expecting more, you know, vaccine doses from, you know, all the different companies that are producing them, you know, 3 million here, 4 million there. So we know that in the first vaccination phase, there was lots of, you know, vaccine hesitancy. People didn't really want to take it because of all the conspiracy theories and what they felt, you know, and, you know, what they saw in social media about the vaccine. But do you think that this third wave now, and this Delta variant might, you know, stare Nigerians in the direction of being open to what's receiving the vaccine in Nigeria's second vaccination campaign? So, I mean, I tell you, the constitution has actually reduced to extra, you know what I'm people say that in Europe, you know, they're not going to love football. You see that in Europe, 60,000 people are not in the stadium. They don't know what Max is saying. All these visual visions of you are not there. And this is a scoffing fact that they vaccinated. So, I mean, Nigeria likes to travel and engage themselves as they send the vaccine as a solution to get that result. And thirdly, nobody wants to get so sick. We want to engage in our work. We want to do our best. And vaccine says to be only one of the things. If you don't think that could be, then vaccine is the second thing that can help you escape the disease. So, what we need to do now in our own estimates is that government needs to actually deepen communications. They need to counter negative relations in public space. They need to engage people. They need to meet with the community leaders. They need to engage the market to meet the church leaders. And actually further show evidence that these vaccines are working. Now, we saw a lot of fake videos showing that we take the vaccines. We're not alive to vote. We're going to be magnetic. No. The government is actually demonstrating those sports that are taking the vaccine. For instance, the government or the government chamber that are taking the vaccines. They're coming up on television and are putting this progress and nothing like that. It's not true. Okay. Some of the situations and those conditions that make people think that the vaccine is in danger can be dispelled with such public action. So, we need to engage the public. And for me, I also feel that we need to incentivize the vaccine to take the way that we are going to take those vaccines them up. And now, the key issue is this. There's economic depression. The food price is directly, money is scarce. What the intervention is going to do in this regard to help people face the challenge of vaccination. We had the challenge of COVID. So, if you combine this, now, from a physical intervention, it's only studies. It's only economic support or cash transfer or whatever. I'm sure not who we want to take the vaccine. If you don't do this, economic contracts will face down conditions which regards to health of the people. All right. Let's also talk about what we may have learned from 2020 and in what ways do you think that our health care investments may have changed? Do you think that we maybe have started to invest better in health care now, you know, or is Nigeria still where it was in 2018, if possible? Yeah, it's a tough question. If you tell me that the fact that they have include the oxygen of the factory for manufacturing of oxidants on part of Nigeria, yes, what can I do with you? But, you see, the health system basically follow about three platforms. One, the input in terms of infrastructure, okay, you know, that we could be building, equipments, the oxygen and the input in terms of human resources, okay? You could agree with me that we've seen a reduced number of doctors, you know, and the increased number of doctors in the country and desperately moving away because of bad working conditions. And the third thing is that where is the money? For you to run on the stage, you have to have a few of money. And then, you know, because human resources and money would drive the process, the health process, that we say desire. Apart from the fact that some donors choose to build one of the hospitals here and there, all these other components are not saying, you know, because if politicians build hospitals to get money, that where the human resources, if I come to your studio now and I put the equipment there, and I put the money, it's a system. If you come to an hospital, I'll put the money there, but it's not that beautiful building. No. It's the core things happening in the place. Where are the human people working there? Are we looking at hospital to fight our high mortality and diseases that is delegating us? These are core issues. But if you look at that, I can tell you that we have not messed up at all because we're not even producing medical drugs. The strike in the university is limiting those drugs. We're not training our nurses because of those factors of love that. We're not even applying those drugs that I said, we're not giving them some studies, research worker. So I've seen to see what we have learned from all this. So it's basically, you know, almost going to be a similar situation with what we dealt with last year. That's what it seems like. If you remember, the whole country was struggling with isolation centers and, you know, sometimes even referring people back home because their isolation centers were filled up. And so if we're talking about a third wave now, in what ways have we made better preparations for the possibility of a third wave to accommodate more people who may need to be isolated to provide better health facilities for these people? It doesn't seem like anything changed. Without trying to be the best, you will know that nothing has changed. Yes, we have more information about the COVID right away. And because from those factors I'm not sure, the public is tired. We are fatigued. The COVID has went down and put down the morale of the people. It has created a lot of stress, instability. The public is fatigued. When you're doing the fatigued public, you don't dare wake up and start summarizing. What else can you do that can make those people embrace you, believe in you, and run with you? Now, it has come to the level of individuals to stand up and say, listen, I don't want to be COVID. If it is not essential, don't go there, because there's no other system that's going to respond to an Indian kind of scenario. There's no other system that will do that. So in government, you just need to step up this campaign, the talk, take it to the local government, take it to the councilors at the work, and then help. Even if it means giving face masks, giving sanitizer, and monitoring markets, ensure that people face masks, whatever they are, traffic businesses. And then we have to keep doing those things. Because let's face it, we have just tested 2 million people. That's a number too small. If you don't test, how do you know what to do? So we don't have the capacity to test, capacity to test is challenged. The vaccine distribution is challenged. And then the only thing we now have is to act at the information level. We should be able to do quality information to change behavior. If you act at the information level, act at the real level, act at the community level, and see how to do this. Okay. Doctor, when the WHO makes statements like the worst is yet to come for Africa, what do you think they mean? It's simply this. One, the data variance is supposed to pass 60 times 200 times faster than the conventional alpha and beta variance of the virus. Secondly, the data variance affects younger population. We know Africa has demographics mainly about 80% younger population. So this data variance affects younger population. The data variance coincides, you know, more senior for more units, you know. So unlike these ones, because they're okay, maybe part of the larger world, you know, actually manifest. When it comes to data variance, you see more senior for the future. So in Africa, which is the demographic we see, a lot of younger population, know that system, the system is compromised sufficiently, and then they're having economic contractions. So obviously, you don't need the system to know that if you combine all these things and put a pandemic in that kind of environment, the worst is yet to come. So for us to find the worst, what we need to do is to look at ourselves, measure our capacity and figure out what else can we do to ensure that the worst does not benefit us in this part of the world. Is it also critical? Last year, there were a lot of questions as to why Africa, Nigeria, you know, didn't suffer or didn't, you know, get hit, you know, with a big blow by COVID-19. Do you think we've been able to figure out exactly why? And will that help us with getting into a third wave to understand what, you know, was the reason we or the continent was able to not have as many casualties as projected? Would that be an important information to have if we're expecting, you know, a third wave? You know, from the side that they don't manifest senior forms of disease, yes, it can be carriers. And that's why in the other part of the world, we are simply thinking about access to people in the 20s, 20 years and not taking the taxes in another country. But for us, you know, in most of our population, you know, quite a few number, 18, 90 percent of them are actually of younger age, okay, less than 40 years old. So now that's actually a very kind of shift for us, why the virus are terminated and they will not see much of it. The other aspect we're talking about is that is the requires, I mean, endemicity of COVID-19, not a virus like COVID-19 as in Africa. The question was that, is this conferring some sort of immunity on us? You know, and the 13 is that, well, you know that in the traditional alpha and beta variants, actually, as much as 90 percent or 95 percent of people that have tested it actually will not show the symptoms, they just get to it. So I bet that could have been a factor that we are not actually testing enough. We didn't opt to know we're not testing enough. So we may not see the true picture of those people that have contracted the virus and will not manifest senior form of the illness. If you don't see that, that will be an alerted. But here now the data variants is up in Nigeria, 23 countries in Africa, 98 countries all over the world. And then crossing that series of people, Uganda, South Africa, Rwanda, Kenya, Botswana, all these countries are having unique challenges with this attenuation. So now the data variants affect younger generation. It's spread easily, I mean, and then in addition, it gives to more senior form of disease. So for us, the message we should have learned that now, the younger generation that returns our own direct representation against the virus is being affected. We are seeing more spread. So we should be able to take charge of the situation by deploying information and looking back at it. Okay. And with all the negative economic figures we're getting out of Nigeria, do you think the country can survive a possible third lockdown in the country? Now, there will be first and second waves, okay? And I didn't compare them as much, and 4.9 percent. Up to 2 percent of what we contracted, the girls, the nurses, we go to Nigeria. 2 percent. We'll be first and second wave. We go as much as 2 million in Nigeria, okay? So now the business is just yet to open up sufficiently, okay? And if you look at the provinces of our economy, even the government, they're limited those who are coming to work. They are paying half-salary, quarter-salaries. Food production is not going up because of boundary tree and all those kidnapped that is going on in the country. We see the food as a skyrocketing. Salary is not increasing. Money is not there. Inflation is double-digit, and employment is double-digit. So if you put all of these things together and then you now add a third wave of community, obviously, you are heading for a very bad economic situation, which is going to respond to the health system or the health system of Nigeria. Now, lockdown will be an additional burden. You have to figure out how to deal with this third wave, with that lockdown. We can try to push for what I would call a smart lockdown. You look at an environment and find out that you're having such a large number of these virus in this area will knock that area down and figure out how to deploy more pharmaceutical intervention to that area as it were. So maybe you can probably think of this to decide if it's not going down. If you remember the country as it is now, it's going to be horrendous. We're still dealing with the after-effect of the first lockdown. You know, the after-effect of what? About a lot of the security. It ended with answers. And after the answers, we are saying that even the security at the state of Nigeria is busy as we compromise. Are we ready to deal with all these after-effects of lockdown? Are we ready to deal with increased armed robbery? Are we ready to deal with increased security? Are we ready? So if we are ready to do that, then we can knock down. If we are not ready, we have to figure out how to navigate this third wave, with that kind of turnaround of that. All right. Let's move away from the health angle. Now, just quickly before we go, trying to remind us that still we haven't heard any stories of anyone being prosecuted for misappropriation of food items and the likes that were meant to be shared across the Nigerians during the first lockdown. If you remember during the Ansar's protest, after the Ansar's protest, there was a looting of some of all these items in different warehouses across the country. But we still haven't seen anyone being made to answer those questions. And now we're talking about the possibility of a third wave and maybe another lockdown. Is this something that maybe you think would come up again if we get into a lockdown? We shouldn't. I just think that we don't get to knock down honestly. And let's face it, who are the people holding the food? The gatekeepers, the people that have the maids, that have the connections, because I don't know if I can get a warehouse, have access to the food store, keep it, you know, are used for whatever, whether politically means or their own party. Now those who will not be prosecuted, let's face it, those who will not be prosecuted. We will see that my own expectation is that governments should now be strategically trying to store food and distribute this or some criteria. And if you are not feeling secure to co-op with their challenges or people more than 40 million people with malnutrition, you know, 40 million people today with malnutrition, that will worsen our future. Then, you know, if we cannot assure food security, then what are we going to, how are we going to deal with the challenges that have come from that? So, if you are waiting to be prosecuted, I doubt whether we will see anybody that will be prosecuted. We should just look beyond that. Governments should strategically, based on local government, look at the intervention that they can do for individuals. Guys, take this ticket or whatever, come and buy a bag of rice for it, at a reduced price. Come and buy this at a reduced price. And if you do this, this will further advance confidence and trust to efficient between the government and the people. We don't need to actively move forward to solve this problem. We don't need to exist for people. We cannot claim they still know they don't want other people to die. We should be able to honestly look at this. Yes, we desire infrastructure. Are we going to push a new government structure so that we can survive first? I mean, again, if you believe infrastructure, infrastructure is meant to help people, not die to people. So, now, our attention should be on those figures, food security. How are we assured? Two, on the planet, how are we using it? Three, inflation. How is it coming down? I am not an economist, but you see, health is so connected with economy and general even of people. So, if we're not dealing with this dimension of the COVID pandemic, then we're missing a lot. So, now, it's time for them to enhance and be trust between them and the government, and these are few ways they can build those trusts. All right, Dr. Tui, Mabawandu, public health expert. Thank you so much for your time this morning. Like you said, we hope that there is no third lockdown or rather we hope that there is no new lockdown forced across the country, but at the same time, it's a reminder to Nigerians to remain safe and continue to live with the protocols for preventing COVID-19 spread. Good morning once again. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Okay, so we're quickly going to talk about the stories that we saw on the newspapers this morning. Just to quickly remind you of what the stories are, it says Senate's dumps proposal on e-transmission of results, and the proposal is that the Commission, INEC, may transmit results electronically where practicable. Now, this is the nation here, given this breakdown, say, the amendment is that INEC may transmit results provided that the network has been adjoined, secured by the NCC and approved by the National Assembly. Now, how they voted on this? 52 people voted no. They're voting against the electronic transmission of results for 2023. 28 people voted yes to that proposal. 28 were absent at that seating. I would touch through this during off the press with our guest, Mr. J.D. Johnson, the chief lecturer at the Nigerian Institute of Journalism. He mentioned that those 28 lawmakers who were absent at this very crucial vote to determine Nigeria's future regarding the 2023 elections should be recalled because they're not doing what they should be. That's according to Mr. J.D. Johnson. But we know that they have basically postponed the sit-in, postponed further debate on this till 10 a.m. today. So, basically in a few hours, we'll find out what the decision, the outcome, would be regarding the electronic transmission of results. All right. So, first, I don't expect anyone to be recalled. That's, you know, wishful thinking, of course, in Nigeria, and it hasn't, you know, ever worked. And then second, you know, I think that the major things that Nigerians should talk about with regards, this is, first of all, you know, why is anybody voting no? You know, in any part of the country, I heard a particular senator talking about, you know, poor network in this area and all of that. You know, but I'm sure they still do bank transactions in those areas successfully. So, what is he talking about? There is that. Why on earth is anyone voting no? I'm trying to understand and I think Nigerians should ask these questions. Actually, you're representing your senators, you know, National Assembly. Why are you voting no? You know, if you're in Lagos, why are you voting no? What's, what is that bad network in Lagos? If you're in Abuja, if you're in Abelkota, if you're in Benin, Potarkot, wherever you are, and you're a senator representing those areas, why are you voting no, sir, or ma? What exactly is the challenge that makes you vote no? So, the people in your, you know, in your constituency, the people that you represent in Lagos state, because we are here, Lagos Central, you think that the people in Lagos Central don't have good network to send a voting result? Make it make sense to me in any way. And that's why Jeter Johnson said a lot of these people who seem or who claim to be getting into the National Assembly aren't there to represent anybody, but themselves. It's definitely nothing about the network. Now, I'm trying to figure it out. So, why voting no? Definitely nothing about that. And he also mentioned the disagreements, you know, in ideas between the governors and their senators. So, 17,000, you know, governors have, you know, said that they want, you know, it to be a part of the bill. The senators completely disagree, you know, or have, you know, spoken against it, and includes the same thing with the Petroleum Industry Bill, 3 percent, 5 percent, 30 percent, all of that drama. It tells that governors and people, they are members of the National Assembly, all the people from the National Assembly don't seem to be, you know, having the same ideas. And it makes you ask questions. Do they really speak in for their people? Are they really representing the people that they're meant to be representing, you know, when they sit in those seats? You know, questions that we need to ask. I spoke to politicians, you know, in the old Progressives Congress and in the Opposition People's Democratic Party a few weeks ago, asking them important questions about the 2023 and the Electoral Transmission of Vote. And I asked, what is the opposition? Why? What is there to fear about, you know, these? And you find political parties pointing fingers, you know, at each other, saying, no, it's the APC who doesn't want this, the APC saying, no, it's the PDP who doesn't want this. And really, where exactly are we going? Are we going to have electronic transmission results or not? Are we committed to a free and fair electoral process in 2023 or not? I think these answers need to become obvious to Nigerians because the time is running fast. I'm really just trying to wrap my head around the reason. There has to be a reason why anybody is voting no. I mean, they said that on the nation, they said that this will only depend on if the NCC determines that it's a secure way to vote. What else could be more secure than electronic transmission anyways? AINEC has already been given the power to make that decision, has nothing to do with voting the National Assembly or the NCC. It has, you know, it is fully AINEC's responsibility to make that decision. I'm speaking about the senators themselves. So your problem now or the reason you are voting no is because you feel like NCC might feel like there's no network in these areas. We need to ask those lawmakers and that's why the constituents need to begin to ask questions. I want to quickly share, I want to quickly share something that I saw. It says, before AINEC can transmit electronically, NCC must adjudge national coverage, coverage is adequate and secure and National Assembly must approve. It also goes on to say that they are broke. Proposal of section 52, subsection 3 of the Electoral Act Amendment Bill is in conflict of section 78 of the Constitution of the NCC 1999. The section 78 of the NCC provides the registration of voters on conduct of elections shall be the subject of direction and supervision of AINEC. And so it's a lot. It really just means that this will eventually get to court. Exactly. That's what Mr. Dede Johnson said. He said AINEC should be taking this matter to court because it's an independent or it should be an independent electoral body. So they need to be also fighting for their independence. But we'll see what this leads in the next few weeks and especially by 10 a.m. today to see what they decide to the house. Let's take a break here to join Wale Scots for sports.