 Hello, hello, how's everybody doing? How is everybody doing? We are here for classic cast our very first classic cast of the classic wow beta We are very very excited to be here. We have been rookie here with us stay safe TV tips out baby, of course So yeah, welcome guys a lot of you guys know who then rookie is then rookie is a very high-end arena player Caster as well then rookie do you want to tell us a little bit about yourself for those of us who? Might not be following the retail wow scene Yeah, sure. So I've been playing the game since vanilla Really long time I started getting into the competitive scene when arena came out Was heavily into duels and 3v3's and basically all aspects of wow mythic rating everything and Yeah, after years and years of competing. I think I competed from 2007 to 2015 I decided to get into show casting so I've been streaming for the last six years as well as doing Show casting for the AWC 3v3 tournament and yeah, just been a part of the walk community for a really long time ended up winning blizzcon in 2012 and Yeah, that's basically it I guess there you go Yeah, so like we know like a lot of people have already seen your video if you guys haven't seen it yet You should go to vendor with his YouTube channel and check out his video about Why he's so excited for classic and you you originally like you weren't like a big classic guy Like you were just kind of like whatever like it's not my thing. I want to play arena and do all that right? Yeah, so when Noss Nostalgia, I don't know how to exactly say but when that server got shut down a lot of people were complaining and I Totally I got it. I was like man people put a lot of time a lot of effort into playing on that server So, you know that getting shut down it sucks, but for me. I wasn't that interested I played vanilla. I felt like I had really experienced the game And I wasn't that excited to go back because as someone who's dedicated, you know 10 plus years and to the arena scene the thought of going back to a version of the game where that just didn't exist Wasn't that appealing to me? So while I was sympathetic to all the people that wanted a big classic for myself I guess selfishly I just would have rather than make the current game as good as possible, but Yeah, kind of going back now and playing classic it it feels like That dream of them kind of bringing back all the things that I loved about wow way back in the day a little bit more Far off than just playing classic. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. And I know like yeah, yes Yes, if you want to go ahead Well, I was gonna ask like just coming back and playing for the first time in a really long time vanilla Wow, what are the like biggest couple differences or biggest things, you notice like wow, this is totally different So I was actually I was chatting with one of my friends Yesterday and it really felt like there's too many things the name is like every five like if I'm having a conversation about it I can just consistently name off things over and over but I think the things that have stood out to me the most is actually feeling like You there's a community like it's a community game That's the best thing like having a guild having friends to play with needing to group up with people Actually needing to play with other players in the game Not only does it better yourself, but it also feels good to help people out You know, it's like a mutually beneficial relationship to all these different people that you're meeting The immersion in the zones the satisfaction and getting a level because it is more difficult I mean, I think we can all agree if you guys played I don't even know if you guys play battle for azeroth, but Battle for azeroth leveling was probably the least fun Experience ever it just as you leveled in battle for azeroth your character got weaker Added hidden scaling so even though you're higher level than someone your character was just worse than them And it just wasn't that fun whereas this once you get past level 10 every single little talent point you put in is actually impactful and meaningful and Playing it is a lot different than thinking about it in the past because the past I was like Well, you know, I really did like those talent trees, but maybe they weren't the most impactful decisions But that's wrong like you really feel it when you put a point and improve blizzard And it completely changes your rotation and your ability to now aoe grind Yeah, like so I think even though it's just like a talent point here a talent point there Like the amount you can customize your character. It just feels super good Yeah, that's totally true retail while leveling is also feel the comparative vanilla wow or classic wow Retail while leveling feels very linear right you sort of have to go on this Set path. You don't have many options or ways you can level differently in vanilla wow classic wow You really have like it's an adventure like there's no There's nothing telling you where to go. You just have to figure it out That's one of the things I love as well opening up a quest log You know having to read the quest like adventure around on the map I feel like so I played a couple this is gonna sound silly, but I played um a couple of mobile games on my stream rpg mobile games and And a lot of those mobile games they have basically like an autopilot mode where you just like put it on autopilot And your character will just run around to play the game for you and I think bfa leveling is as close to autopilot mode as you could get without actually having it on Because like you said you pick up a quest it tells you exactly where to go everything is super shiny easy to pick up where as in A classic wow you get a quest It actually feels like a quest you have to read where you have to go the mobs that you're fighting are actually dangerous And can kill you accidentally pull two monsters all of a sudden you need a pot You need to use everything if you didn't have full hp or full mana. It's a nightmare And it just feels a lot more rewarding to complete things Absolutely, dude I mean with with retail while leveling like it it's so trivial If you're a new player to wow you've never played bfa you've never played wow before you buy you go to the store You buy bfa They give you a free 110 like that's how trivial the 1 to 110 experiences. Yeah, it doesn't even matter for your game And like 20 years ago if you put quest markers on a map in a game Or they told you exactly where to go from point a to point b Or exactly which chest in the water temple to loot to get the key to open up the next door Oh, man, that that would be considered like a cheat for something like that or like, you know what I mean like It wouldn't yeah, it'd be boring. It's like you'd go to cheat planet com specifically to get some kind of code To to fricking put in on your n64 controller. So you get stuff like that nowadays It's like streamlined into every single game and it definitely it definitely hurts. Yeah, definitely hurts the experience Yeah, I think one of the things that and you hit on this is it's what I like always talk about this is how classic wow Uh, you just have this constant feeling of progression. It's like a series of small wins Right. So like you're saying like you level and your decisions matter and and it matters like where you put your talent points and stuff Like I think it's really cool that uh, you as somebody who like, you know, we weren't really looking forward to this and you weren't even thinking about it Um, like you recognize that like immediately and I think that goes to show like for a lot of people Who maybe are like more retail players and like, okay, like what's this classic thing all about? Let's check this out Like do you do you think like that, uh, I mean you were obviously more in the high end arena scene Do you think that your other guys who are like more high end arena players are kind of noticing the same thing Do you think the average player is going to notice the same thing? What do you think? Oh, absolutely I mean, I've had a lot of the people, you know, there's a lot of streamers that are my friends Like it's not sony digital, uh, cd, you know a very high end arena players blizzcon champions You know, they have been basically playing classic non-stop since they got the beta They haven't really touched live that much and I think Like we were talking before the show started and one of the things I said I was most excited about is for everyone to like be able to log on and experience What I'm experiencing right now because these last like five or six days I think five days have been like the most fun. I've had streaming in years like every single day I'm excited to log on and play the game and I know like the tasks that I want to do If I want to level if I want to farm like a very specific piece of gear Like I just I can get that done and I'm really excited about it. Um as Far as I don't know if that actually answered your question. No, no, no, I think so. Yeah Yeah, I mean yeah, you do totally like I mean, I think that Uh, I think that these guys I think it's important because if you look at a lot of the big streams in the wild section Not all of them, but but a lot of them are uh, are like big arena streams Right, that's what people want to watch that people want to watch like competitive gameplay and stuff like that Um, and I think that you have these guys who they're playing a game with you know, there's no rating system Right, there's no rate. Well, at least there's a ranking system eventually with the honor system But everybody knows it's not that great, but it doesn't matter like it now It's a lot more like you can't necessarily point at the scoreboard and say well Yeah, look at my rating right like check my rating But I think in not being able to do that actually opens the the door and opens the discussion a lot more for like Okay, who's who's the best at this who's the best at that and it makes them more exciting I think in terms of you know, people like China like oh like, you know, venruvki's my favorite or ziko's my favorite or whoever, right? Um, I just think stuff like that is cool. Um For us like I know for me, I kind of stopped playing after burning crusade Stay save you stopped playing or you you you picked up You played all the way through wrath. Didn't you stay safe? I really stopped at the start of season nine So the start of cataclysm, but I always came back and tried the beginning and the end of each expansion And it never really like I stopped like really playing at the start of cataclysm That's right changed Tips when did you when you stopped because you played through You played their mom right? I played through yeah, so I I like I played every single expansion for at least like some section of it But like stay safe the beginning of cataclysm after those first two months There was a big dungeon nerf that happened to all the heroic dungeons And it was like kind of a big deal at the time and like it like turned a lot of heads and stuff There when that blue post came out I quit the second day like right after that so Yeah, it was basically like the start of cataclysm They had recognized some of their mistakes in wrath when they had made the game a little bit too easy So they decided to you know tune up the content for heroics and stuff like that But then apparently like a lot of people quit or a lot of people weren't happy with that And so they completely buckled and they went back to how they were before and then that's when I was like this game is no longer for me Yeah, I think uh I think it's I just think it's really interesting whenever you have like you have this game that uh I mean it's it's like 15 years old and now all of us right we we all we all played the game differently Right, I I did a lot of arenas like I did 5v5 a megalole. I get 5v5 not super balanced whatever But I like favorite by the way, I do I loved burning crusade 5v5 5v5 was badass. Yeah, it was so good, but uh I uh, I was I like to do 5v5 three threes were good, too I just didn't have like a consistent team and uh, like that's that's kind of like what I mostly like to do Is arena back then but then uh kind of coming back and seeing like so many people from from different like eras of wow Playing classic like on this beta has been so unbelievably fun. And it's just exciting to see because it's almost like Watching these beta streams is almost like this crazy crossover episode And I think that's why everybody's viewership is so high because it's like oh look like You know s-fan cd or s-fan adventurer Like I mean just even like us running outside scarlet monastery a little while ago and like just getting like little skirmishes like People like we're just pog champ like it's so funny like people are going nuts like it's it's just stupid like little level 30 pvp, but um But yeah, I think that's probably one of the things that's been best for like the viewing experience and I think it's helped the Wow section a lot like as a whole um Just kind of bringing everybody together and especially for a lot of the viewers who Maybe have been out of the wow scene, right? They haven't really been watching wow or whatever But then they get to come back and they get to watch like a bunch of people come back I think that's been really cool What are your impressions of the beta so far in terms of like how you remember things as somebody who's consistently played through Like is there is there a lot you remembered from vanilla like as far as like mechanical stuff Or is it just like you kind of forgotten a lot of things So I'm starting to remember like I today I started getting a little bit more into like duels And then yesterday I was getting a little bit more comfortable On my role as a mage like running into a raid and I could I was like, oh, wow I actually can just know everybody and they can't do anything about it That's great, you know, so I'm slowly like coming back into my element Obviously, it's a completely different game than live, you know I have fireball frostbolt and arcane missiles all on my bar where I was on live, you know Depending on the spec you only get those abilities. So I'm like having to rethink my key binds like what did I do in vanilla? What were my strategies? So it's been a little bit of a learning process But it's kind of cool to see that I'm remembering stuff from so far So long ago and like my own gameplay and my own strategies and stuff Oh, go ahead. Do you do you like that more sort of playing the class instead of a specific spec how it is in retail? I like it. I mean, I like it a lot more. I think that's one of the things I mean, okay, so when you know, you're running around on a mage in a dungeon You're pressing frostbolt most of the time, right? Like people will be like, man, this rotation is so boring But I'm like, it's actually not boring. I don't know. I thought that as well I was like just pressing frostbolt. People don't remember Vanilla rating like that's not fun But then when you do it and in addition to pressing frostbolt You have to worry about like weaving in your mana gem and look you you can decur Like you're the only person in your group that can decurse in this dungeon If you don't decurse you're completely screwed. So you have to weave in decurses and then Okay, I do have mana. Let's dump that mana do like really heavy aoe like I'm gonna know everything and cona cold I might have said insane burst damage. Oh my mana is low. I guess I gotta want a little bit to recover Okay, I guess this is a good time to evo or should I save my evil for the next pull? It's like there's a lot of different things to consider You know stuff like buffs and decursing and mana management like those things I guess turned out to be fun because I've been enjoying it quite a bit Yeah, I think there's more I think one thing I'm starting to realize well I'm not starting to realize because I've realized over the years is there's more To playing wow as a damage dealer than just doing damage You know, I think people got way too hung up on that and it's actually one of the reasons why I haven't been using damage meters on my stream at all a lot of people ask for them, but I feel like People being so damage meter obsessed like oh my class has to do the most damage or it's a work less I think actually ruin the game really. Okay. Yeah. I think that's interesting. Yeah, it's funny how Uh, it's funny how like just putting yourself in that situation We'll like remind you of a lot of these little things like, you know Whether you're running around in the canals in storm wind like stay safe is doing right now As we can see on his reflection in the background But no, it's funny like it's cool that you can see you can see all that stuff No, I look I was I did allcraft this week literally me and asmagold were running around grinding mobs while we were on allcraft So yeah, like it's it. I think like it's kind of the point where like it's volumes man The game is so fun. You just don't want to stop. I'm addicted to this game. It's so good. It's it's unreal, man It's unreal and it's like I I'm like I said this earlier like I haven't left my house It's a bit of a game out like I've been holed up. Yeah, I haven't left my house. It's it's actually pretty bad So, uh, yeah, I gotta I gotta get on that. Maybe uh, we'll take the night off, but um But uh, yeah, no, I think um Something else that you were talking about it's like the the uh the rotation It seems so simple right and I think one of you play vanilla wow you have to learn how to be creative There's like a lot of creative freedom that you have in playing your class that a lot of people don't consider And it's like using stuff outside of the scope of your class outside of your spellbook even right with different items or Things that they might not seem like they're part of your rotation But like you said like your manager and stuff like that and making sure you're like you're doing stuff at the Right pace popping the consumable at the right time Another thing is like optimal time for you to pop like a like your your trinket Or if you're arcane like arcane power like when you use it do you use it the right time in a boss fight Or like whenever you have another prop go up use your arcane power and all this stuff um I think that's one of the big things about vanilla that people don't understand is like it's not uh Like dps rotations and stuff like that aren't always like about a perfect rotation. It has to do with timing and There's a lot of other factors too. Like you said that damage meters can kind of take away from I think damage meters are like the hype thing and and it's it's fun to watch But yeah, it's not all about damage It's it's has more to do with like being able to provide to your rate and being able to get the job done Right, it's not always about your own numbers Yeah, absolutely like a perfect example this or warlock simulacore, you know warlock dps simulacore is really really really bad But you want three or four of them because they have banishes for the trash They have uh soul stones and hell stones and summons and they have the curses to debuff You know curse of rec curse of elements curse of you know all the stuff So they have a ton of value even though, you know, just if if their only merit was their dps You wouldn't want to bring them at all. Yeah, but but they provide so much else that justifies, you know having three or four of them in the rate Okay, yeah Yeah, uh, sorry. Is it okay because I got kind of distracted the end there There there is uh, we got some breaking news Uh, I just want to touch on this real quick. Um Oh, we can go and go into it actually so a lot of you guys know that there is going to be a stress test We were talking about this before Uh before we went live and we were like, yeah, we haven't said anything about the stress test. So, um It looks like there is a blue post out on the stress test Let me go ahead and make sure that I can get this up for you guys So you guys can see it up on the screen and we can go ahead and read it off together. I've not read it yet myself Um, let's see. Let me just give me one second here Okay. Yeah, this is good. Okay Uh transition. Okay. Nice. So, uh, this is wow classic stress test one This is from borneck community manager We'll be performing our first stress test for wow classic on wednesday May 22nd from 4 to 6 p.m. PDT Uh during this time the closed beta test realm will be unavailable Those who are currently in the beta test will only be able to log into the stress test realm During this time and beta testers can participate Using their existing installation will also be adding a significant number of players to the stress test from the pool of people Who have already opted in for the beta, but have not yet been selected So, yeah, make sure you guys do that if you haven't done that yet Uh, since the same client is used for both our stress test users and our normal beta users The name in the battle on an app has changed to beta and stress test while classic If you've been selected to participate in the stress test You'll see this option appear in the region slash account drop down menu So you can download and install the wow classic client in advance But you'll only be able to see the stress test realm when it becomes available for the stress test All races and classics will be available for creation, but the maximum level will be set to five Hey, that's good 25 minute speed runs here we go The test will also take place on a pvp realm But since the starting areas are sanctuary You don't really need to worry about attacks from the other factions if you just want to level up to five We expect to put lots of people in the starting zones though And we're looking forward to seeing what you all do as we test the servers under crowded conditions We'll be actively monitoring the server sending server messages ETC during the four to six p.m. PDT period and it's important to have as many people as possible log in during this window So hey, make sure you guys get ready for that The stress test realm itself will be available until thursday may 23rd becoming unavailable around six p.m. PDT If you encounter any issues during the test you can submit them to the bug reporting tool in game If there are any aspects you'd like to discuss feel free to post in the classic forums Performing tests like these are very important contributing to smooth launch on august 27th, and we appreciate your support. So yeah Big news we so yeah, do you want to go in? This is kind of like you brought this up beforehand So if you want to talk about it, this is exactly what they have to do I think they should do one to five and also I think they should do one to ten The one to five and one to ten, you know the first ten levels. It's going to be a hell hole on launch day Probably the first couple launch days. So it was It was bad enough. Yeah already, but it's going to be really cool to see you because they're not doing dynamic response to see Like how comfortable is it in these zones with all the so this is going to be a lot of fun I encourage all you guys to try to log in or update if you haven't absolutely like Like for those that that didn't participate in the first day of the beta Like leveling was bad enough with 10 people in in the starting zone Like literally every single mob was dead in the valley of trials for a good couple of minutes before I respond I can only imagine with 800 a thousand people in valley of trials. No dynamic spawns Leveling that first day of classic launch is going to be absolutely insane So crazy Yeah, it's it's going to be it's going to be really wild guys And then we could even see that a little bit like there wasn't that many people logging in But there's certainly like different choke points, right? Starting in like the human starting zone. For example, it's like Tags are key right getting the tags because one big difference between classic wow And retail wow is that there's not shared tags on mobs. So Going in and like you pick up the cobalt vermin quest everybody is doing that quest The first quest that you can get the first quests that you can get everybody is doing them So if people are out tagging you and getting those quests done faster, you have to go figure something else out You have to go like grind on something or whatever to get through it Otherwise, you're just sending around like freaking just you know, thumb in your nuts or whatever until until vermin spawn and you don't want to do that But yeah, there's there's several things that have happened throughout this beta like people have found Bugs or things that they think is bugs or think our bugs excuse me Because they've been playing on private servers or because they don't remember properly like I know they're like I personally have been there I think pretty much anybody has been there who who's been playing on private servers like oh, I think this is a bug Oh wait, it's not Or you know just get confused on something right like let's be let's be real And I think that's been really really interesting to see I like that a lot just kind of to get to go through and there is a list of things that Kyvax the community manager has actually talked about that's On a not a bug list things that people have been reporting as bugs over and over again, but they're like no, that's how it was in vanilla. So We'll look at that in a second They've talked they brought this up a lot. They're 1.12 reference client. So they have a They have a Version of the game though the 1.12 the original retail vanilla version of the game that they can load up and it can work It's not Distributable one of the first blue post it might have been the first like dev water cooler that there was for classic wow or for wild classic Mentioned how they wanted to go through the development and that was the first thing they tried is they wanted to redistribute this They figured out okay, they couldn't and then that's why we have the game the way they have it now Where it's the current game stripped down to try and make it as classic as possible. So um So, yeah, that's kind of the goal with what they're trying to do um Is there anything that you guys want to talk about some things that you guys have found as bugs or what are some things that you Guys were surprised by that you thought were bugs and then Turned out to not be bugs or whatever I mean I I can start if you want one of the main things for me was I originally because I've been loving the image. It's the class I play mostly and um, I was doing a we grinding with blizzard And one thing I noticed immediately that I thought was a bug But it turns out is not a bug is when you use blizzard I forget how often it ticks but it ticks every like a few seconds or seconds I can have something like that But if you start channeling a new blizzard the tick won't reset So it actually continues from where it was So like if you use blizzard and then use a second blizzard you have to actually time your Your second blizzard for when your first blizzard hits Otherwise it appears that the second blizzard isn't doing damage for like one or two seconds And I was like wow this is a big bug and that's something that's completely different on live because it does take out instantly But that's just like an example of something that seems like a little buggy But now that I've played with it and I know that it actually feels really good because I can sort of manipulate the ability And like do it a little bit better than other people. Yeah, for sure I would say the big one is the hitboxes. That's like, uh the like the hitbox is Not not just torrent like generally speaking. I tweeted this the other day They hitboxes are so much larger to the point where a rogue can no longer dead zone a warrior It's like typically the way rogues do warriors on privates that resist they'll put your crippling poison They'll go into the dead zone about seven yards away. So you can't charge or intercept When you get out of combat, but at the same time, they're you know close or they're far enough So you can't hit them In classic wow, you will always be able to hit a rogue in the dead zone. It's actually insane um And it really changes the meta on top of that hunters Can be dead zoned very very easily because if you're within like eight to ten yards of them They won't be able to shoot you which is actually a big big nerfed hunters too So the hitboxes seem Really really big supposedly not a bug But if you want to see a really cool clip about it I think perplexity has a really sick clip where both him and tribe rolled hunters or both him and tribe rolled torrent And they're attacking each other from like 15 yards away Which is really really cool. Plus there's something something to do with this boss and willing caverns I can't remember the full story, but uh, you know something about him doing a lot of damage and uh, yeah, it turns out It's not a bug actually, but yeah All right, all right Yeah For me one thing that I've been dealing with I've been playing with an imp for my warlock and I actually don't know If this is a bug or if this is just the way um If I command my imp to start casting firebolt at some other monster If my imp isn't in within alo isn't in los Of that like he's not already in cast line of that. He won't cast so I have to position myself and move my imp directly So the imp was in is in cast line So my imp will not move himself to go cast. I have to move him. So that's really that's been sort of clunky I don't know if that's how it's supposed to be or not. I'm not sure Really? It feels like a bug. Yeah, that's interesting. I wonder I wonder how the because I didn't I didn't like play warlock So I don't know that's really interesting Yeah, I think like, you know, speaking of that clip tips that you brought up with the the torrens um, so one thing that's interesting and uh, I don't know if I could explain this without being able to like draw and paint or whatever but So if you have two torren right if you have two torren and they have like a seven-yard Let's say a seven-yard hitbox versus like a five-yard hitbox Or five-yard range or whatever whatever the number is right or The verbiage, excuse me the proper verbiage But you know for the sake of understanding, let's say hitbox range, whatever If they have two more yards, if you have a torren versus a torren, they're both going to have two more yards So really what ends up happening is you're adding four yards distance between the two So whenever you have two people rolling torrens, that's why it looks so ridiculous in that clip and a lot of people are like Like well, what the crap like there's no way that's right But uh, it's it's kind of deceptive right because you're generally not going to see two torrens fighting against each other Unless they're in a duel against each other because there's no like arena where horde fight against horde It's all bg's and it's all against the faction so or if against the opposite faction So that clip does look a little bit worse than than what it actually is and I kind of think that's uh It's something interesting that I haven't seen too many people really bring up So yeah Clip where if somebody has the clip if you guys wouldn't mind posting it chat so people understand so Yeah, yeah Another thing I've noticed is uh the batch windows and I don't I this is one that I I really don't know Uh So damage is batched a bunch of stuff is batch right they added spell batching into the game and we talked about this on classic cast Uh, whenever they they after that after they had added spell batching, excuse me um And and one of the points that I brought up was you know, I was kind of worried are they going to do spell batching Properly and you know, do we even understand spell batching properly is like the average player or whatever? um To me it seems like the batching windows are really really big and there's certain things that just feel delayed like, uh I know I was talking to monkey news and he said that Uh, he said that like payo was was stunning his Charge for one and I noticed that like whenever I judge people there's a really big delay before the actual damage hits And whenever I hit my button and there's like I'm supposed to be like a minor delay, right? But it seems really really big um That was one thing I noticed I know I hammer of justice a stun or a charge Uh, which is you know, I stunned a charge as well whenever I was dueling a warrior and I was like really really surprised by that so I don't know like um Batching is definitely in the game But I don't know this is something that I like I genuinely think I could be wrong about maybe I'm just Misremembering I think I would have realized or I think would have remembered if the delay was that big I think another another kind of thought that I have is The delay was that big back in the day But everybody's internet is so much better now that the delay feels incredibly long Because You're like playing like on 30 ping instead of like 200 or 300 ping That that's what I think might even be the thing because They uh, like whenever we got a chance to talk to them in Irvine. They said yeah, they're supposed to be delay there It's supposed to be batched. So I think whenever you add those things together Uh, it ends up really changing it a lot and I think for that reason like I don't know Maybe that's something that they've really got to account for because it just feels it feels really Like I don't know it feels it feels weird sometimes on certain abilities So How do you guys feel? Did you guys notice anything like that? The biggest thing that I noticed was the looting and it's the most annoying thing when you loot something or go to loot something It takes you like three not three seconds But like it takes there's a significant delay whenever you loot a mob like uh, how many times It happened where you go to loot something and you think you looted it But she didn't loot it and then you got to go back and loot it again It looks like what they did was they they just added They literally it feels like they just literally added a point three second delay on to everything in the game We'll check it out if you're looting something I don't know if you guys have felt this or if you guys in the chat have watched a stream or do this Sometimes the loot window will be like you won't even see it and then other times It will sort of linger there and that's That's if you're looting at the end or the start of the batch window that like that's what results in how long the Loot windows there. So you're absolutely right. It affects looting. Um, but yeah, I've I've had um I've feared other warlocks fears like I felt that so It's I don't know if it's longer. Like it was so long ago. I I can't you know over 15 years I can't tell one one fucking tenth of a second or whatever, right? It's really hard to determine, but uh It it feels a little bit longer than private servers. That's for sure I think yeah, I think that's I think you bring up an interesting point about internet and I think that's something that we definitely have to consider because there's a lot of things that are different about the You know the way our capabilities applying the game back then and how it is now Like before we started the show, we were talking about dungeons for instance and Then maybe they feel a little bit easier now, but I I kind of feel like that's just because people are so much better at the game. Um So like I was using the example on wailing caverns like when as soon as we pull extra mobs instantly she Know for the extra guy everybody's crowd controlling everything and I feel like a lot of the lessons we learned from over the years like made that feel um You know a little bit easier than maybe it felt back in the day, but maybe it is pretty similar In terms of like the spell batching it was actually kind of cool So I was actually doing payo as well and he ended up gouging my blink And I haven't experienced something like that in a really long time So man you can make those little outplays, but I haven't noticed it I've been doing a lot of like a we grinding and looting a lot of mobs I haven't even noticed really the delay on the loot, but it's interesting. You guys bring that up Yeah, I think uh, I think some of that stuff where people can like take advantage of batching and and Play it up to their advantage. I think it might end up being much easier than uh Then it was back in vinyl because that I don't know a bunch of people said they had like seven ping in 2004 Like I don't know what the crap kind of internet you guys had I had like Like I had I had two to 300 ping on dsl So that's that's what I because I know because I specifically remember If I was sub 200 ping it was green. No, no Yeah, if I was sub 200 ping it was green if I was over 200 ping it was yellow And then in one patch they like ninja changed it to being over 300 ping makes it yellow So everybody thought that their internet or like they thought the game was less laggy Even though that's not what happened at all They were just like just kind of deceptively changed it on them, but just by changing the colors So, uh, yeah, uh, so that's just kind of how I feel But uh, I sorry, this is kind of I guess it's kind of on topic But I feel like there used to be an add-on I used back in the day that would show me my leg on my cast bar And I can't cancel cast early What I don't remember what it's called. Yeah, I don't remember what it was called. Stay safe I won't have that though. I know what you're talking about. Um, I didn't use it though And I don't remember the quartz. It was quartz. It was quartz. Yeah, I remember that It was quartz. Yeah Wonder if something like that will work again I remember that because what I remember doing is like I that's whenever I got to the point where like I would like spam heels and I would stop spamming heels and I would just like wait until I got to the bar I would just So I and like it was like, yeah, it was good. That's really good Yeah, quartz is good. So yeah, I think I think it'll be really interesting to see how it plays out So because I've noticed like certain things were maybe just because the batch window maybe like I said, maybe it's not bigger And I said it's it's very very possible that like I'm I personally am misremembering or maybe it's the combination of Maybe the batch window is the same and people's internets are better and all that so So yeah, I think I think that's gonna be really interesting to see um I think that uh, I kind of want to go over this the rest of this uh Not a bug list. So I'm gonna I'm gonna go ahead and pull this up for us two guys This is another blue post and this was updated 20 minutes ago as well. So Again, this will be something that's very interesting. Uh, let me load this up three two one Pretty break sweet. Okay, uh This is from kivax. Um As we've discussed before the nature of wild classics sometimes invokes different memories for different players And this leads to certain misconceptions for some about what is or isn't working as intended The following is a list of commonly reported gameplay in wild classic That's not actually a bug it is working as we expect it to Torn's hitboxes and their melee reach is slightly harder larger than other races This is what you know, this thing we just talked about being critically struck while using slash sit to sit Does not cause abilities like enraged blood craze and reckoning to activate Uh, this is this is something that we can have like a fun little discussion on this I posted a video on my youtube channel about this where I was testing some stuff If you guys want to go check that out, um Using the automatic quest tracking option does not auto track newly accepted quests It instead will start to track an existing quest once progress towards an objective is started Warrior health regen on the beta is working at the expected wraith Hmm. That's good. Mm-hmm Quest objectives and the points of interest are not tracked on the minimap or map Uh, completed quests are marked on the minimap with a dot not a question mark Feared players and npcs run fast Standing on top of other players while phasing away allows spells allows spells and attacks to be used I didn't really quite understand the context of this one when I read through this uh earlier So maybe we can talk about this if you guys understand it better than I do Um Creature respawn rates are much slower than in battle for azeroth. This was a good one. Yeah That's kind of how it goes in classic npcs which offer multiple quests may inconsistently display them as a dot or quite or an explanation point on the available Quests they were inconsistent in 1.12 and we've reproduced the exact inconsistency that they had back then Wow Yeah Quests that are too low level for you do not show up as an explanation point in the game world Available quests do not display an explanation point on a minimap Uh, this is an interesting one. I I didn't remember this on level up the message your skill and protection increased to 15 Was added in 1.12.1 and we're intended to keep that basically it says your spec your skill in whatever your three specs are increased to whatever um You were unable to polymorph enemy targets that are tapped by players with whom you are not grouped This is something else. I didn't remember. Uh, I guess if you had already tapped the target Then you couldn't polymorph them anymore. Uh by the end of classic. I did not remember that So so you so you can't grieve somebody by polymorph, right? So you can't you can't grieve them by polymorphing their mobs Uh at all levels of player characters and enemies aggro radius is set to the intended distance I know this has been a big topic of discussion. Yeah, I thought it was waste Smaller. I thought it was too small. But uh, that's it is what it is. Yeah So that's that's very interesting. So uh, they do have like a working 1.12 client with everything So how they're treating this beta is uh, I I know like look, I've done a lot of testing on stream And I think we all have and we've been reporting bugs either on or off stream Um, we're like, you know, just talking about it on stream reporting bugs all this stuff Um I think that's the big thing whenever they get their bug reports They get a report and like whether or not it's a bug or not they go through and they say, okay Like this is interesting. Let's double check this. Okay. This is right or oh, you know what? Something is messed up here. We really need to figure out how to port this properly Um So this list is is I think really good that they're kind of uh, they're being kind of candid with okay We've checked these things out. We're getting a lot of reports of these things chill out guys This is okay. This is working as intended. Don't don't worry about reporting this anymore. We appreciate your guys effort, right? Um, I think I I think that's incredible like how how How active they've been with the community and just like the the transparency, right trying to make sure that like, okay We're getting people involved. They're they're slowly putting out more and more ways more and more people getting into the beta And and using people's feedback, uh to try and I guess just double check everything, right? Yeah, yeah, I don't know if you guys agree. Maybe people in chat won't agree with this I actually think they've done a pretty good job of picking people not no. I'm not saying the four of us I'm not saying that but they've done a pretty good job They have done a good job picking people that actually know a lot about vanilla. Wow Like I actually think that they have there's a lot of very knowledgeable players that are playing an action report Yeah feels good to get selected So this is this is something we should talk about like I know like I asked the guild Uh the guild that we're in you know make azeroth great again, of course, uh our guild on on the beta servers but uh I asked the guild. I was like, hey, what year did you guys start playing? Wow? And uh, everybody said 2004 now I I would venture to believe them at least this morning They said that like we asked last night and there were some people who said like 2005 and stuff I I would venture to guess that they're telling the truth seeing as how it's not twitch chat and uh automatically saying like Oh me me so I think they were probably being honest when they said they started playing in in 2004 2005 in the last couple of days So it's cool to see that they're trying to get people with uh Early uh who who started playing the game have older accounts like a little bit more priority Which is uh, which is something that They did say that we're going to try and do is try and give some some players who have older accounts priority Um But something else let's talk about there's just something that I think like some people are like Uh, I've seen it come up a little bit. It's like, oh like, you know, they're saying like, you know These big streamers have the beta or whatever like, you know take asmongold or Uh soda poppin or tim or any of these guys like oh these guys get the beta shroud Uh and then other players don't get it and I think one of the bigger reasons is uh to to mitigate a loss of hype And uh, I think that people will need to uh, I think people need to understand like how How big of an impact having streams that are like that big like you have guys like like soda asman tim Shroud all these guys are pulling 20k plus views streaming the classic beta. So with one person streaming it They can get Literally tens of thousands of eyes On the product and you see people I had somebody message me the other day and says, hey, I've I've reported 800 I've counted like 800 bugs In in the classic beta just from watching people streams. Like I really wish I had the beta I was like, dude, you are the perfect You're you're the perfect person for this right because this is exactly their goal is they want people who are excited And it's unfortunate, right because in my opinion, I wish they would have put out more people in the beta I really do wish they would have put more people out in the beta And they're going to continue to do that. So we'll see where it goes, but That way it's like they retain the hype for their product But at the same time they're getting good testing in because everybody's when something is bugged out everybody sees it so There's good and bad to this right there's good and bad to this because sometimes there's something That's just like a minor bug and then like Everybody acts like the sky is falling Or there's something that like hey like this is something that's actually legitimate And then you see people posting on the forums and giving feedback and We've seen this over the course of the last year or so or maybe even a little bit less than a year They've been pretty They've been pretty responsive and it's been really cool to see how closely they've been working with the community Yeah, absolutely. It seems like with giving out beta keys or beta access They're sort of giving it to two demographics, right? There's the streamer, contigrate or demographic and that makes sense It's for advertisement for hype like as fun said and then there's and you know This is what I tried to sort of mention a moment ago There are a lot of like really turbo vanilla nerd Private server players and you can omega a little private server But these are guys a lot of these players have spent a decade digging through Databases and old comments and things like that and a lot of those like really big vanilla nerd guys They've actually gotten in they've gotten in and it's those guys that I was talking about that are You're watching their clips of the one the the attack range clip the tips mentioned stuff like that They're getting these people and these guys are really getting in deep and uh, so That's what I was trying to say I think the biggest thing with that is like whether or not like you remember something from private server or not It's it's right or wrong, right? That's not the point. The point isn't whether like, oh, this is a bug The point is is like, hey, let's double check this and then they report it to blizzard and blizzard can check like Okay, like let's say we copy and pasted this stuff over and then they look over and like oh look We didn't you know, we screwed this up here. We screwed this up there So it at least gives them like kind of an alert to go and check on the stuff and be like nobody you're wrong Or like, hey, you know what? This is actually something worth looking at so I think it'll be I think it'll be really interesting to see how this goes and as as more and more people get involved in the Uh more and more people get involved in the beta. So Yeah I'm curious. I'm curious what they're gonna do after the stress test Are they gonna let everybody that does the stress test get into the beta? Or are they gonna like bring people in and then say, okay, that's it You know gates are closed. Goodbye. See you next week. Like how's that gonna work? I hope they let everybody in just just kind of seemed like the way they worded it is they're gonna Like not everyone's getting it like this is this they try to like it felt like they're being very specific that this is a stress Test and it's not the full beta Yeah, I uh For me, I kind of I kind of my impression of it was that we're gonna get in Uh, really? Yeah, because it's like uh, let's see Those who are currently in the beta test will only be able to log into the stress test So and beta testers can participate using this will also be adding They said will also be adding a significant number of players to the stress test From the pool of people who have already opted in for the beta but have not yet been selected So I guess it could go either way right because they're saying they're they're saying adding a significant players to the stress test From the pool of people already opted in so maybe it's like the the way that they're phrasing it It could be okay. We're just adding them to the to the stress test or We're gonna give them the full beta after the stress test. That's what I would hope for It kind of depends on how many I hope everyone gets it I I hope that they add they add everybody to the stress test and then open up like a fresh server that people can roll on And and and they can they can do another fresh Fresh okay, they could do another fresh test for um For for the new people coming in and everybody else if people want to roll again and and basically check check it out On a fresh with like instead of having like a few people in the beta test at first Now you have let's say a few thousand people in the beta test at first and seeing how that goes after the stress test That's what I would hope they do and I think that would be cool Yeah So how do you guys feel about that? Yeah, I agree. That's a real good idea. I've been getting questions in my chat Like are they going to you know, let you continue your beta character progress on full release? Like absolutely not That'd be crazy. That'd be super super unfair right for the people that got in but I actually didn't score a mystery with that Oh, really? That's probably why I just got word they don't want everyone to start at the same time So they're gonna let us keep our characters, you know, it's a little bit of an advantage but not that big of a deal It's actually crazy how many games do that nowadays Like there's actually games that do that where they let you keep beta progress Just because they don't want everybody leveling the same zones at the same time Well, and it's like the concept of like early access, right? And that's the difference between this and like your typical early access thing that you'll have and that's that's not What this is this isn't like an early access. Wow classic. It's a genuine beta test. It's not It's not just a hype marketing thing even though like that seems to be like that's what it's turning out into I think for a lot of people whether it's the the people watching streams whether it's the people waiting to play the game or Watching youtube videos or whatever or even streamers like they sold you on it for example And i'm sure they sold a lot of other guys too, venerate Yeah, I think a lot. Well, I just wanted to kind of add on what you said About like it being fresh eyes like I got the beta, but like I'm I don't remember a lot like I played vanilla a while but I don't remember a lot and It's been really helpful to have people who are really hardcore into classic wow in there like telling me that's a bug Like I should report this like pay attention to that and then people being like no, that's not a bug Like that's exactly how it was and people have like conversations and I feel like I get a lot more information that I can sort of pass on From that and I do think it is cool like a lot of a lot of my friends that don't play They still have a wow sub. I don't play wow anymore. That used to play vanilla with me got into the beta Which I think is really really cool too. Yeah Yeah, speaking of bugs real quick trial. I'll just link this in the chat. I had not seen this yet So apparently they did address the elite damage values. Oh, yeah, I was gonna bring that up next actually Yeah, so I got uh, well they addressed it or the the issue It looks like they addressed it. Yeah Will you link the will you link it in discord? Yeah, yeah, sure This seems specific to horde side, but I'll link right there. Yeah, I think the discord so I can pull this up Um, yeah, but did blizzard address this or is this just the post on the forum? Yeah. Oh, there's cave backs respond. Okay. Yeah Um, okay, so this is what we're gonna bring up, but this is from the classic wow sub reddit. Um Let's see this is from the classic wow sub reddit, so let's bring this up here Um So one thing that people have been noticed let's preface this actually let's preface this One thing that people have been noticing is that it seems like mobs are not doing enough damage Uh more specifically elites and in my experience. I don't know how you guys feel about this Uh for me, it seems like the elites in dungeons Uh the elites in dungeons seem to be not doing as much damage for the elites out in the open world seem to be just fine But I I mean, did you guys feel the same way or am I? Um, so one example I can give vagash who's the sort of like the hogger boss of dun morrow He's like the dice yeti level 11 elite He you know at least compared to private servers. He has less hp and he doesn't hit as hard So that's one observation. So I I feel like world elites are also a little bit weaker. Okay. I was I was able to Take down two elites of my level While still having half hp as a warrior doesn't make sense at what level like 25 ish and the The turtles and the black fathom deeps events They did 12 damage each Like that that's like it's a level 20. They're like level 26 25 elites and they did 12 damage Yeah, I think um and that's the thing That's like one of you compares stuff to private servers like you never really know, right? And that's like what save save is like saying he's like it's like it's not a private server So who really knows right? Because you know whenever to stay safe stay safe is like like top one like he's like a top tier leveler And he's had a lot of practice on private servers So That's just like one of those things where it's like yeah, he's seen this a lot But whenever you do so many reps like you can do something like quote the wrong way so many times that like You kind of forget how to do it the right way, right? It's kind of the same thing whenever you you're exposed to private servers so much over and over again There's like little discrepancies that you're like, I don't remember what's real and what's fake, right? So let's go and look at this put. Oh go ahead. Go ahead. I was gonna say I think the only time I've really encountered that and I I mean for me, I don't remember how hard elites were supposed to be but Uh in Hillsbrad foothills the quest in the very southeast corner I think it's called done garrack where you have to kill elites It's like the final part it's the final part of one of the chains there Where you have to like go into this fortress this dormant fortress and fight off the elites there A lot of people in my stream are saying like this seems way too easy to how it was on the private servers Right, I guess they felt like they were too weak in comparison But maybe they were off on the private servers. Yeah, I mean and I think like at the end of the day like you kind of have to Uh, I guess I won't say you have to but I think it's it's safe to default to like, okay If is it right on private servers wrong as far right or wrong on the private servers You can probably default to it was probably wrong But made by the third party not the people that actually made the game Yeah, I think that's pretty safe to say but here let's go go ahead and look at this post real quick before we Will we get too far off topic? Let's see Okay, transition nice. Uh, okay, so um Kyvax responded to explain the discrepancy and mob damage between vanilla and classic beta like a 200 difference Kyvax said hello, we figured out there is an issue with stone skin totem So really this this doesn't really address the issue entirely. It's just for horde or really more specifically for for shamans Right, so this is really just for like one class, but Uh, basically it isn't correctly removing its melee damage reduction when it expires So we've seen an examples given where the player had previously grew up with a shaman and carried forward the effects of the totem Oh, so it's like stacking. Wow. Yeah, we're exactly worth or maybe it's not stacking But at least it's it's uh, it's not dropping. Well, this would be a horde only issue, right? But this this problem is prevalent on alliance as well. So what about retribution? Maybe maybe there's something wrong with Uh, no because whenever devotion or has canceled your armor on your character screen is gone How does how does like what are the what are the actual mechanics of like stone skin totem? Does it Uh outright like increase your uh armor like devotion or it does Yes, it increases your armor. Okay. So yeah, I mean, I don't know Maybe you can look at your your character sheet to test that and if it does that Then uh, if that's what it does then, uh Maybe maybe there's a similar difference with devotion aura. So um But yeah, anyway It reduces it's flat damage reduction. Okay. Yeah, it's it's flat damage reduction. I guess. Yeah So something like flat damage. Yeah, so something like flat damage reduction. Uh, it doesn't show up on your character screen So that's kind of hard to test. That's something that they would probably have to look at Uh devotion or it does show up on your character screen So you could probably assume that if your if your armor is decreased then maybe that's the case. So Yeah So veneraki you're what are your kind of plans going into classic? Um Well, like as far as like what what do you want to do like is there something you want to accomplish Do you want to play with certain people? Like are you going to make your own guild? Are you going to guild leader? Are you going to join a friend's guild? What do you want to do? Uh, so yeah, a lot of people ask me what am I going to do? Am I quitting live? Am I What's the plan and so far I'm just going to do whatever's fun and so far classic seems like the option of having the most fun with My plans are to join a guild that my friend's making sony digital I think the guild is just called classic not exactly the most original name, but I plan on pretty much doing everything I don't think I'm going to try to do like a rank 14 push or anything like that. It's like it's a little bit A little bit a little bit too hardcore for me But I definitely plan on completing all the raids and You know doing lots of world the thing I'm looking forward to the most is Getting geared out and doing lots of world pvp like that was the thing that I always Enjoyed in the game. I'm a little bit interested to see how that's going to work out being a streamer I feel like it might be really difficult to not just get griefed all of the time Um, that was one of my concerns as well like originally going into classic is just as a streamer It's so easy Because the damage is really high. Um, it's if someone wants to gank you they're going to kill you pretty much Um, I feel like Right, you know, if two people come out like two rogues is not really too much you can do Yeah, you know competent players So I always thought like if some people did want to just harass me and prevent me from having fun they could be they could do that but I mean yesterday kind of proved that you can get a whole bunch of people together pretty quickly They can fight on your side as well. Yeah. Yeah, it's going to be it's going to be a bloodbath, especially in face That's going to be ridiculous. Yeah, I'm particularly in face here. I think it's going to be pretty wild um So, yeah, I think uh Like for us like we've talked about that as well Like we're our current plans are of like I'm going to make my own guild states It's going to make his own guild and tips is going to make his own guild On on horde side. He's going to play horde and stacyp and I are going to play alliance So we're going to kind of see like where that goes. Um There are there are a few more bugs I know stacyp you're trying to do like more of a more hardcore thing. I'm more of like a progression style of guild Um And tips you're kind of trying to do more of a hardcore thing too Um, but yeah, I think it's just going to be interesting to see like what all what all is going to happen. Um Real quick, uh, there's there's a few more bugs, right that people have talked about And I know one is like the the strafe bug and I want to uh, I want to show that I want to show that off a little bit in a second. Actually, I'll like log in the game and I'll explain kind of what I figured out. Um No, I have to I have to say really quickly that one of the most disappointing things for me in the entire beta is That I can't moonwalk anymore. Yeah, okay So let's talk about this a little bit. I know they so they got rid of Yeah, they got rid of walk wall jumping, right? And there's like two types of wall jumping and uh, I think we talked about in the last class cast uh With like the difference between like wall jumping and stays there the wall jumping and stay safe while jumping and wedging I just looked at stay safe and triggered in my head Uh, yeah, the difference between like wedging like wedging in your place into a wall Or like being able to actually wall jump up a corner or something So you can like wedge your way into certain spots like getting under kerosene getting under storm wind Uh, some stuff like that still exists are just cool. Um, but just like how like the world has changed And how they're using basically like they're they're down point a client like they've gotten rid of moonwalking I wish that they would add moonwalking in manually like with some sort of Uh, like key combination, right? Like I know one way that I used to do it was I would press like q and d at the same time and I'd be run like strafe running in a circle And then if I held d And then I pressed e right away. I would just flip and I would start moonwalking So like well, can you that should just add like an in-game shop and then you can buy moonwalking for like a hundred dollars Yeah, like a hundred. Oh, it's a moonwalking subscription for a hundred dollars. That's actually a good idea. Yeah Okay, I take it back. I don't want to give them any ideas Yeah Okay, so one thing I want to go ahead and show this. I mean, I this is kind of on the same same uh topic of moonwalking It's not just a strafing bug, but I will show you guys this and this is from my game. I just I just logged in to show you guys So Transition this is something else that I noticed. This is me. Is this fan? Hi, uh, so Uh, what I've noticed is that whenever you're running around, right? You see how my head is facing forward. This is what people talk about with the strafe bug Um, this is normal. This is vanilla, right? You jump you jump and you turn and your character's body is static Right, you see that look at my hips my knees everything's in line However, whenever I open the attack animation Watch my hips. You see that it's much more dynamic. My hips are swinging My character swings across Yeah, you see that don't lie, dude. Yeah, my hips don't lie, dude So I think this is some holdover from bfa. This is also the same thing with strafing like look I I'm I'm uh I'm totally looking the other way I don't know if this is a a bfa thing the strafing thing exactly, but I wouldn't have surprised me if uh if they are related Yeah, look at those hips. Yeah, of course So, uh, yeah, basically that's that's something that I noticed and hopefully this is something they can fix Uh, it definitely is noticeable. Uh, especially for people like me who are constantly like jumping and turning at the same time Uh, but yeah, I that's that's what I've noticed as well And we had the chance to uh, whenever we were in urvine We had a chance actually I brought that up to uh, brian and omar whenever Whenever I was doing my 1 to 10 run my video on the 1 to 10 run and you can see where I'm at the marlocks I start kind of like strafing like an idiot and like jumping around It's like dude, isn't this guy trying to like level? What is he like? He's just freaking thumb it is nuts, dude Like what's he doing but uh, but yeah, that's exactly what's happening. Yeah, that's exactly what's happening is uh They're they're sitting there watching they're like, oh wow, that's really interesting. So yeah Um, it's kind of weird that because I know you've brought that up multiple times It's kind of weird that they haven't fixed that but on the demo, you know, whatever that was six months ago or seven months ago now Um, if I was if I was snow if so if I was wanting a monster and the monster moved My character would move also to keep to continue wanting you would auditor my character We're in vanilla. Wow. My character will just start wanting cross body. You know what I mean? Or wanting that way right without but I'm still looking this way So they fixed that but they haven't fixed your issue and it seems sort of like in the same vein, right? Yeah, it does kind of seem the same vein. I know one thing that like Like time is a resource, right? So, uh, they probably want to address as many gameplay things first like Stuff with like are the talents working right? Is this working right? Is that working right? And then hopefully they go back and they fix that Um, because it is noticeable, right? I know like I think that's something that I like even though like I think some people would probably get used to it or some people would probably not even notice Uh, I do think it's something that's there, right? And it kind of like It's just odd to me that it works just fine whenever you're not attacking But one of you trigger attack animation is is what happens. So Yeah, it seems a lot of people are saying who cares, but I feel like that's part of the charm of the game Yeah, all those little things. Yeah, it just it's supposed it's supposed to look like janky and blocky You know what I mean? Like where you're static like it's not like it's not supposed to be as much like dynamic and Yeah, that's the thing like it's kind of it's kind of whatever for a lot of people but for other people Like it's like, yeah, I mean like if they can fix it then just fix it, right? And for me, it's like hey, if you if you have a hundred little things that are different, um That's that adds up to a big thing, you know a hundred times a hundred is a million So that's a big that's a big number and you don't want that so everything should be They should try at least at some point to get this stuff working out Yeah, yeah, exactly. Um Um Yeah, guys by the way pretty soon what we're gonna do is we will be doing a q&a and stuff and then a classic cast We'll do that through twitter So I want to go ahead and tell you guys so you can go start if you want to start tweeting at us with hashtag classic Cast that's usually what I look up. I look up hashtag classic cast Yeah, so If you guys want to go ahead and send that to us Well, uh, we'll start doing that and if you haven't already please go follow venerookie. Stay safe and tips all their things are on the On the screen as well their handles are on the screen. So you guys can definitely do that as well So we're we're planning on doing classic cast Every week now. So we're we're kind of moving to it to a more weekly schedule and doing a lot more stuff with that So, uh, just to kind of continue, um What's probably been the best moment of the beta so far for you venergy For me the best one. I mean I'm throwing yourself Yeah, um I think the best moment of the beta so far has been You know 60 versus 60 or 60 versus 80. Whatever the hell it was a whole bunch of lines There's a whole bunch of board Just battling in or out the highlands. Yeah with like generals on either side to try to target and take down like I don't know. That was just like classic wow in a nutshell No, I people have people ask me like why why don't people do that on bfa? Like what's the difference? I remember trying to do that on bfa and the service is just like completely lagging out I was like, you know, we are going to do some world pvp. We're going to get together. We're going to go raid the alliance capital city and everyone's just porting in and out and the server's lag out and It was really sad, but Yesterday I was really surprised to see at house. I didn't feel any server lag I don't know about you, but it felt incredibly smooth and maybe that's because there's not too many people on the Servers, but I didn't experience any frame rate issues any lag. It was just Awesome, like just it was it was a good moment. I think that was probably my favorite moment of the whole beta Yeah, there was like a couple things where like it kind of like it kind of hiccuped here and there But what we had like probably over 200 people there at that point like I don't know it was it wasn't one of those things that was like, uh It wasn't one of those things that was like a real issue to me. Um I think that uh yesterday The best moment for me yesterday was a lot of fun We had like the first fight where you guys came in and and it's so funny because like I literally like said like Okay, so this is how they're probably going to want to initiate like a mage will come in and they'll frost no The cone of cold cold snap of a cone of cold and then probably ice block until the rest of the team comes in They'll probably blow us up and I literally look at chat. I was like, oh pepega s-fan like 1300 strats And I'm like, okay Like sure use your retail analogy to like what I'm talking about vanilla 1300 rating is what they're talking about And then what do you know somebody sends me the venruki clip venruki comes in from the side What we had planned. I don't know if you even know this ven so We had A second raid like a smaller group which was my raid at that wall because I was watching for like, okay There's a there's another break in this wall and they can at least alert us to come in Uh, which they did but the problem was is everybody else in the raid Was just kind of like standing right here and I was like spread out spread out nobody's spreading out So what happens is venruki comes in off the side comes in frost nova Kona cold cold snap kona cold ice block literally exactly like what I was saying is is like how you would initiate his mage And just that initiation is so powerful Like I mean one you guys had like a lot of mages and obviously very good mages But coming in with like a strong initiation like that on a group that's just clumped up like this It's just like easy like it's it's ridiculous But uh something else that I've noticed Uh, we're seeing a meta in the classic beta that like nobody has ever really seen or even thought of before it's 1.12 patch 1.12 talents 1.12 items all that stuff with a level 30 cap And people are essentially tweaking out tweaking not tweaking tweaking out at level 30 Very similar to the original release of battlegrounds whenever battlegrounds had like a you know 20 30 so on level cap But yeah, so so a lot of people are tweaking at 30 And you're seeing things like whirlwind acts warriors or just a nightmare So like we came in and it was like We had like Gil Nash and monkey news and what happens is they they joined the raid like after that initial fight And what we do is i'm like, okay I'm gonna freedom those guys and heal them like I don't give a crap like these guys are loaded Like you got no more years like running around with whirlwind axes. That's scary So like we started doing that and then that's whenever like it got really fun for me Actually whenever I was like running around and supporting those guys So it's just cool to see like there's actually a meta developing out of this weird like Beta rule set which is just like I don't know. I think it's totally totally hilarious to me What are what weird things have you guys noticed? Like in terms of in terms of just specifically being at level 30 Well, just the toolkits for each class are so different like for example warriors We don't have any instant attack ability at level 30 for the most part Like there's no whirlwind you to get that at 36. There's no mortal strike You get that a 40 bloodthirst you'd get that a 40 if you talent into it So it's like You have hamstring hamstring. It's not like a damage. It's not a you don't focus that. It's like a big damage ability Exactly. Yeah, like So so basically like just you know being limited in how you play But at the same time other classes being limited in how they play So it's just and again you mentioned whirlwind acts like it's not just the abilities There's like each class has its own, you know specific milestone at certain levels You have access to certain milestones other classes don't they have their own milestones So it literally feels like a new meta. It almost feels like you're playing a completely different pvp game Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I'll tell you like, uh, you mentioned, uh, gnomes gnomes warriors with whirlwind acts I'd tell you gnomes is going to be really good and whatever dual tournaments come up I think that uh, because gnomes have plus 15 racial engineering They can actually get engineering beyond what you can normally in the demo And they'll be able to make net trinkets which no one else is going to have So gnomes are going to have that advantage if they max out their engineering Everyone's going to be everyone's going to be getting gnomed in these dual tournaments. I think I know Yeah, I've been I've been dueling and doing world pvp as well. I think warlocks are looking really good I didn't drew it too strong. Here's really good. Yeah fear. There's no fear like, uh, obviously, no pvp trinkets warriors don't get berserker age till 32 Oh, it's so fun to see all the warriors get feared. Oh my god So like yeah, unless you speck into death, uh death wish which most people probably won't do for a dueling tournament It's uh, it's pretty crazy. That's again kids are so different Yeah, uh, it's a it's a lot different too than the 29 made it because you get new abilities and that could change your ability Also get the um, the new talent, which is really really cool Like I think ice block becomes available for mage when you wouldn't normally have it At 29 versus 30 So it's actually a lot different than anyone's experienced even on like that private service Right. So something that's interesting about the gnome net. I think it's worth mentioning is uh The level requirement the engineering level requirement to use it Is 210 so if you have somebody else make it it is a boe So you can actually have somebody Uh, you can have have a gnome or you can have somebody else make it for you And then trade it to you at 210 engineering and you can still use it. So that's going to be interesting Hey gnomes keep them for ourselves. Don't sell them Keep them keep them for the gnome. The gnome the gnomes are gonna be acting like goblins if uh, If they're gonna be making cash off those things it's gonna be kind of wild So yeah, something interesting uh to talk about like if people are doing like tournaments and dueling and stuff like that So yeah, hey gnome engineers hit me up because I'm gonna need some help Real quick guys, um We will be going into a q&a here Very soon again, you guys can tweet at us on twitter Go ahead and check that out like our twitter handles are up there use hashtag class cast That's what i'm going to be looking up Something that I want to go ahead and show you guys is we did just roll out We did just roll out classicast merch. Let me go ahead and load this guy up. Paul you we rolled this out last week Click click click click click click click where are we at? Yes, so this is Classicast t-shirts So if you guys are interested in classicast A lot of people have been asking about this for a really long time We finally have them after like almost a year and a half of doing the podcast. We're finally doing merch So yeah, we have white shirts black shirts gray shirts and of course horde shirts and alliance shirts So if you guys want to do that That link is right here. I'm going to go ahead and post that in the channel So yeah, uh, you guys don't click links. Yeah me neither. So for those of you guys who are interested You guys can go ahead and do that. So We do have some classicast shirts as well But yeah, so I'm going to go ahead and transition back. Nice. So Very good We're going to go to twitter and we're going to start looking at some stuff Is there anything you guys want to touch on before we go to q&a? um one thing, uh, you asked me like my favorite moment of playing and the beta and You know, obviously that big war was cool yesterday But I think it's all the little things that are like all the little things are starting to add up Like all the little nuance in the game like something I learned today is um I got a dagger and I I had no dagger skill whatsoever And I had to level up my dagger and be like, oh just stack your intellect gear. It helps you Uh, you know develop your skills faster. I was like, oh, okay So I buff ai and I put on all my max intellect gear and I level my skill up faster And I think it's just little things like that that you can do in the game that make it so fun And it feels like it's always something you can constantly learn another example is Like really play I totally forgot you had to play around your mana so much. So like I think on my mage. I have like 10 rank one spells bound right now rank one frost hour rank one arcane intellect And it's like I can put up these buffs to trick people into purging me and they'll go out of mana faster than I do And it's like little just little details like that that seems so simple You learn and it feels really satisfying to actually implement it and have that knowledge over another player Yeah, I think I think that's a really really good point like one of the biggest points of skill um I think one of the biggest things that the kind of like show of your skill and and vanilla wow is It's more about knowledge and preparation More so than it is like the physical skill like the retail game Particularly arenas. I think like you got to have like, I mean, I think faster reaction times this stuff are always better But I think there's a higher skill cap whenever it comes to physical ability in retail. Wow As opposed to uh, or like the modern game as opposed to the classic game I guess is what we should start saying right because it's all retail now But yeah, um Yeah, uh anything else before we uh before we start moving on Let's do q&a. Let's do it. Let's do it. Okay. Let's do it. Yeah, uh, so Um, this is one from device. What are you all what are you all thoughts on the level five? cap for the stress test I'll go ahead and start I think that a level five cap of the stress test is fine I think doing a level 10 cap would have been would have been better because that way you could do the entire zone Level five and you know speaking from a human perspective. That's that's basically north shire abbey and really for most everybody It's like that's that's north shire abbey That's like just the starting area typically or maybe just going out of it and into like Coronos if you're a dwarf or a gnome or something Uh, I think they should have gone a little bit higher, but I think going to five I think it's going to work just fine Uh for what they're going to want to accomplish right because it's not the stress test isn't about like how high of a level You can get it's about the choke points, right? The biggest choke point that they're going to have is log in you log in and everybody's trying to do the first quests That's the biggest choke point. So at that point the farther along that they take the test Uh, the more the choke points are spread out I think that they could have gone to 10 and it would have been fine But uh, what do you guys think how long is the stress test going to be two hours two hours If it's going to be two hours and if the system is functioning the way it did, you know on day one of beta I'd be surprised if anyone gets to level five Unless they do like exploration route or something like that if it's really going to be like a thousand people in each starting zone And five minute, you know five minute respawn timers Well, the thing is it but there's there's like the layering now, right? So like We'll even take into account the layering isn't the layering supposed to be a full realm population size. Yeah It's not two hours. It's two days. Oh, it's two days. I think I think no no no I think it's going to be open. Let's go ahead and reread this actually so we can go ahead and make sure we get a little bit of clarification Let's see let's go ahead and reopen this so we can get clarification. I'm pretty sure it's two hours Yeah, so so the actual test is two days but refresh But um I think they're they're doing like a main stress test Let's see It's going to be from Wednesday may 22nd from 4 to 6 p.m. PDT So it's going to be two two hours for like the main part of it Where the closed beta test realm is going to be unavailable And then I think they're going to open the test like the normal beta realm up after that So basically they're going to force everybody who's who's in the beta to play on the stress test realm Is their point for two hours, but then they're going to have the stress test realm open for uh for two days Okay, yeah, because they said they did say uh, it's going to be open until thursday may 23rd becoming unavailable at 6 p.m. PDT So yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah like like two hours like again based on what we saw on day one of the beta um even having like five to ten other people in like a questing area was like It forced you to wait around for mob spawns If we're going to have potentially especially in the human starting zone The or control starting zone in particular undead starting zone if we're going to have you know potentially 500 with thousand people in each of the starting zone. I'd be very surprised if anyone gets low five One thing that I really want to test is if you can invite people from a different layer and the frequent like How often you can hop layers and I think like the whole layer aspect is going to be the number one thing That I'm going to be just in test Yeah, well Yeah, I think I think they want to see how layering is going to shake out because that's one thing we haven't seen yet We haven't really seen layering in effect or you know, there just hasn't been enough people playing In order for layering to take place, right? um so Yeah, with with the layering there's uh I think it is going to change things because if you're on whatever layer The idea is is that they have the normal respawn times normal everything But because your layer is like the normal realm population size that it wasn't vanilla wow That it's going to be fine, right? It's just that there's going to be multiple layers going on at the same time Where it's like almost like it's like, uh, it's almost like a server cluster except you're not in a cluster servers You're on one server on different layers. So you're basically just breaking it down a little bit more Is it is it gonna do they prioritize layers for like people in the same guild and stuff like that because it would Be weird to not have you're Like you're in a guild and people are in different layers in a specific zone And you don't even see your guildies running around. I feel like that's a cause for concern All right, they did say California um We we were having like a dinner with enus cosis and omar and I actually brought that up I was like, could you do this? Could you you know give preference? You know give preference to guildies on the same layer and they're like, uh, yeah We could probably do that but it didn't sound like it's something that they had thought about but maybe they'll I hope they do that because I feel like that's just gonna develop I don't know exactly how layering works, but it seems like there could be some of the same issues that arise Especially if you can like layer hop like have people invite you into their specific layer and Get away from people that are griefing you and I don't know Yeah, I had a layering issue um where in the barons. I was doing this quest Uh, I don't think it's very like the dervish It's the other it's the other centaur that you have to kill in the tent or whatever And he spawned and then I got layered off and like just disappeared So, um, you know, you definitely see some of that sharding mechanism there But uh, but it's you know, it's a lot less common But is it less common because there's not any people online. I'm not sure but it's definitely kind of still there Yeah, well, and that's the thing it's like it's like being able to differentiate between, um So I was watching I was actually I was actually watching yithicens, right? I was watching sacchar on twitch who is yithicens. He's no longer at blizzard, unfortunately And uh, brian birmingham was in his chat watching watching him and uh, like I said, it was just him It wasn't like a fake account or whatever. It was actually him Uh, and people like he was just answering questions from people like q&a and stuff and one of the things he he uh Noted or one of the things that he said was that one of the interesting things about the beta is like people see something and then Uh, they don't know if it's like They're not quite able to differentiate between it being simply a bug or if it's like a feature, right? Like something like you said like for you it seemed like layering or shorting or whatever But uh, it may not have been it may not have been yeah, it might have been a bug. I don't know, but yeah Right exactly. Um That's uh, I think it's important to be able to differentiate between uh between those things so Oh, yeah, let's let's go ahead and uh Add to this. Let's go ahead and move on. Um What do you think the impact classic will have on bfa and retail? This is from movitz What do you guys think? Uh, I can start with this one. Yeah, so I don't know I after playing uh, the game and seeing how excited people are I don't know if they're ready for I'm actually genuinely Worried that they're not going to be ready for how many people I think are going to be interested in playing and trying it out because I think In my personal opinion live is probably going to be a ghost town for a little while Yeah Yeah, I think uh, I can kind of see it the same way now I didn't quite think that like it would put such a big dent in retail initially Um But I just think the the current like I guess like public perception the the reception of bfa has been very very Like poor, um, like sure they have like a new patch coming out with 8.2 and this and that so like who knows how that's gonna go but uh I do think with I mean you can just see it by it from viewer numbers Not everybody watches twitch. I mean believe it or not guys not everybody watches twitch Not everybody is into like the whole content creation scene or whatever not everyone's into youtube But I do think that it's a fair Uh, it's a fair indicator of how much hype and excitement there is for rito. I know I know guys believe it or not But uh, I think it's a fair. Yeah, I know it's a fair indicator of uh, how much hype and excitement there is Behind classic. I mean like as mainstream there was there was like over a hundred k views at one point We're doing deadlines. You're doing a level 19 origin from 15 years ago and you have 100 k views like That's unbelievable. You know, so so let me ask you this how true of a representation Do you think it'll be so let's say they're on any on a given day? There are 10 times as many people watching classic web streamers as there are watching bfa streamers random example Do you think that that's really indicative that there are 10 times more people playing classic wow than retail? Wow, do you think it's going to be a pretty good ratio? That's a lot that's a lot of people I don't know well Not not sorry. Let me first not that exact ratio, but do you think that's indicative of the actual player base? That's what I'm right. Okay. I see you're saying um I don't know. I mean, is there some like is there a positive correlation between the two There's probably a positive correlation between the two Is it like an exact correlation of like, you know, like a one-to-one correlation between the two things? Probably not, but I do think that there's probably a positive correlation between the two Yeah, I don't know if it's going to be exactly because yeah some of the top streamers They could you know stream anything and they're going to you know retain a lot of that viewership So whatever they're doing if it isn't favor of classic wow, that's obviously going to skew the numbers a little bit but I don't know for myself just The thing that like makes me think classic wow is just going to be completely ridiculous is I've had so many of like my old friends that I used to game classic wow with 10 Wait, you know way back when the game was out that I haven't spoken to in a really long time Like names that I haven't heard and you know five six seven years I was in a coffee shop wearing an alliance shirt And I was like, oh, I really like your shirt and I was like, oh cool. Like do you still play? He's like no, but I'm coming back for a classic. I was like, all right So it's just like All these examples I'm seeing of how excited people are Just like in my everyday life and like my old friends. Uh, it's really it's been unbelievable. Yeah, that's awesome Yeah, it's like it's like running into somebody in iron forge in real life Just like a video dude The same idea I was going to say like to add on a thought a couple times over the last month or so I've looked at uh, if you look on the old skirinscape website and the rinscape through website it tells you actually how many people are logged in and playing and Like that ratio is the same as old skirinscape viewers on twitch always pretty much always really to rinscape three viewers Like the ratios are always the same. Um, so I I think that twitch actually might be a very good indication Of how many people are actually playing these uh different versions of games Maybe no, yeah I mean, I I think the big thing like that surprised me the most is uh, is how excited like like venruki You are and now like after watching your video and stuff And a lot of other people like muscle bra tv um I think even talias and evy tall made a video about it Although I haven't seen it but seeing people that a few months back We're kind of skeptical or we're not really sure about classic like Tally even like a lot of people are like really embracing it now Like once you get your hands on it, it's you see it you play it and it's just it sucks you right in like It's just fun Like you just play and you have the most fun Like I stream and I look over and nine hours have gone by and I'm just like what what happened the whole day Like I literally I literally have to force myself. I'm like, okay This is you know, I used to play a lot of classic. Wow, and I feel like it wasn't necessarily the healthiest thing to Sit and play 12 hours every day. So I'm like, I have to force myself. I want to like go for a walk I want to see the sun today You know force myself to stop playing because I just Am having there's no moment in the game where I'm like, man, this is boring. I'm just every I'm just always engaged I'm always having fun and That's what I'm most excited about. I'm just excited for as someone who's streamed. Wow full time for Six and a half years. It's pretty remarkable to see how many people are just excited about Playing the game. I love I don't care what version it is like just having everybody Playing and being excited and coming back is just amazing. Yeah, and I think I think And here's something that I think a lot of people hope there's a lot of people who like they want to set up this like false like narrative of Some false narrative of like, oh this guy versus that guy, right retail versus classic and How, you know, these players hate those players or whatever and I don't think that's true I mean sure there's going to be like a Vocal minority of people who are like spurging out about that kind of stuff but like the the fact of the matter is this is If one version of the game is good and it's popular and people are playing it then People are going it's going to be better for the other version of the game as well Especially now that they're on a shared sub and all the stuff people might like start playing this I'll check this out. I'll check this out I think that'll be cool. And I think that's one of the things that a lot of people do hope for from classic is I think that you have two separate games for two separate markets of people, but despite the fact that you have this already There's there is some overlap there and you can draw some things draw some inspiration as far as like design decisions go Just just general game design philosophy from classic And be able to implement that back into retail while and be like, you know what? Why do people like vanilla so much like this is 15 years old, you know, there's obviously something And I think like you said it's it's not necessarily a nostalgia thing Like you logged in and you're like, dude, this game is designed. Well, right like you started playing and that's that's how I feel That's how a lot of people feel right and maybe maybe it starts with nostalgia But it definitely doesn't end with it and I think that's the important thing so Yeah Let's see. I'm going to go on to the next question. Um This is a good one actually because I think I think a lot of people Might be interested in this. What's your opinion on websites like raid bots having stat weight simulations for classic? um So when it comes to like stat weight simulations and all the stuff that like retail wow has it doesn't quite work the same way because Every item I mean, there's like randomly generated green items like of the eagle this and that but like whenever you play at max level And like when you're talking about rating every item is individually made right every item is individually made It's it's designed a certain way or the overwhelming majority of them. I'll say unless it's like an up the eagle item or whatever um They're made individually with certain design in mind, right? It's it has like a hidden item level, right? Which item level Doesn't really mean anything like most it does mean something But most people don't use item level as a measure as a measure Uh of power for an item what item level is it's strictly a variable that gets plugged into a formula it's like item level, uh, the The rarity of the item gets plugged into a formula to give you how many itemization points there are And those itemization points are manually distributed for each item. So you'll have items in Uh Freaking brd that are as good as like raid items. You'll have items in dire mall. You'll have items in Uh moan core that you're still going to be using going into nax like This game is designed in a way to where you can throw stat weights out and okay great like Big surprise like strength is really valuable for warriors. You know what I mean? Um, but it's it's not uh It's not going to be something that you can really plan out like that Like it comes down more to best in slot lists and combinations of gear, right? Like this combination of gear is really good because it gives me this amount of stats or whatever and uh That kind of stuff is different than like figuring out stat weights, you know Yeah, a lot of gear in classical bow is very very very situational, right? Like for example on a Shorter fight you might have pieces of gear that have higher spell power But uh, you lose intellect and so you equip those just because you know that you won't have to life tap to get You know before the boss dies, but on a longer fight it might make sense to Drop a little bit of spell power and gain, you know, enough intellect for two more shadow bolts Which will get you through the fight If that makes sense, uh, so you lose out in a little bit of spell power But you make up for it by not having to life tap because you get two two shadow bolts from the intellect So situations like that with there's a lot of trinkets and on you stuff that also like ties into this Um, it's all so situational just depending on what you're doing That it would be very hard to have a clear dry cut answer with stat weights and websites like that, I think Yeah, it's it's uh, like just just giving you that it's not going to be like Sure, like it'll do something but like it's not I don't think it's going to change like the It might change the information that you have available, but I don't think it actually changes like the the like method of how you do things because Like the items are there like the items are the items, right? Like if anything it would be like a character planner would be like the only thing where you could just put Put items on and okay, like instead of actually having to put them on in game and get out pen and paper and do stuff Like you might do normally So, yeah, that's that's what I would say there Hmm uh, this uh, that one actually kind of goes along with uh The last question I will go ahead and talk about it How much do you guys think the classic hive has been increased because of how bad bfa is doing? At least I've seemingly bad like we can go ahead and like continue talking about that. Um Actually, and I think this is a good question for you then like do you feel like Do you feel like it? It's made a big impact for you like people are looking for something else because Uh, I guess bfa just hasn't hasn't had that good of a reception I I would have to say like I don't I don't like to sit here and like bash. No, and I agree actually Yeah, I don't like to bash on bfa But I mean I've noticed it in my own stream where people who have watched me for years are no longer playing and they're telling me stuff like Hey, man, you know, I don't play wow anymore, but I still support the stream and that You know, I put on a brave face, but that actually makes me heartbroken You know, I mean it's hard for me to like find groups of people to run dungeons with or to you know Get in my rated battlegrounds. So I was like, hey guys, do you want to do a bg? Nobody wants to play, you know and It it it was very it was it was kind of difficult over the last three months and I don't know. I think just the way it is right now where you know a content patch drops You know people are excited and then you know three four weeks later It kind of gets boring. It's just the same thing It's just like it feels like every single content patch is just you just on a You know a little treadmill and you eventually get to the point where you have good gear and then the next patch Your gear's gonna suck and you have to do it all over again to unlock the azerite traits you already had and It's just yeah So I feel like a lot of people are excited to play classic wow because yeah, I mean bfa just isn't as good as it Probably could be That's not as good as like you'd hope for it to be for sure. Yeah Yeah, so this is a good question. I think uh I actually want to touch on this because I think this is a really good point and Uh, you particularly see this in a lot of like youtube content, but uh, but yeah, let's go ahead and touch on this Uh, obviously you guys have a lot of experience in vanilla But how do we know for sure that the details you remember are from official and not just the many private servers that may or may not actually be accurate I completely agree. Man taco. I completely agree Uh, I think this is one of the big problems Like you'll see a lot of like guide videos and stuff like that where like people are talking about Like they'll be talking about whatever, right? But they're using like a something that they they figured out on a private server And then like if it's like presented as like, okay, this is how it's going to be in classic The reality of it is like we don't really know we don't really know a lot of that stuff And I think that uh, that's the most exciting thing about classic and the classic beta is that we're going to have the opportunity to find out for sure um I think that uh, you know, you can have a hunch and and this is why like I feel like I started I I'm not a long time private server player specifically Like I started playing again in like 2017 and after like I started playing after I heard about nost Like the nost shut down and then basically up until like I got a little bit after I got banned Uh, well, I was like actively playing but um But yeah, I think like one of the things was for me is that I came in and I picked it up quickly Is because I remembered a lot from from retail, uh retail vanilla So I do think that uh, I do think that it's certainly a thing and I do think that you're 100 right and saying that We don't know a lot of things like just as a group as a community like we don't 100 know for sure a lot of things Uh, or no, I should say don't know everything And that's what's going to be really exciting about classic this beta Everything else about it is because people are constantly going to be finding out new things Like people are looking up this list and stuff like that and like like this list You should do this strategy. This is how you should rage do this thing like consumables this and that The reality of it is a lot of that could change Like I would say almost everything is subject to change and everybody should be prepared for that And I think that's going to be really really exciting about classic and this whole we already know everything Uh mentality, I don't really think it's valid and I Think it's good that it's not 100% valid. So yeah, yeah, and like vanilla itself wasn't even a monolith It's not like, you know private servers Obviously, they're different than vanilla, but vanilla was different from vanilla Patch 112 was very different than patch 1.1. So many things changed challenge changed Mob values changed things that we can see in the patch notes and things that weren't ever presented in the patch notes And on top of that classic itself is not a full exact recreation of patch 112 Because we're getting content released at different intervals, you know, there's a lot of small little, you know Bits and pieces franken patch from other patches. So yeah, the meta is just so different just because like It's taking a very specific portion of vanilla and then, you know Retrofitting it with other sections of the game. So no, I completely agree like it's it's just so different Like it's going to have its own meta and a lot of different ways Well, I'll tell you this like there's this idea that every guild is going to go into molten core and Munch out every boss and have everything on farm from week one and that's absolutely wrong Of course very very good guilds like above average guilds Molten core is not going to be the most difficult raid and of course raids get progressively harder as time goes on You'll be well as harder than molten core and etc etc But you will have guilds Maybe half maybe half of the guilds going into molten core are going to have to progress on garr Like they're going like they're going to wipe on ragnaros. They're going to progress on ragnaros You're going to have a lot of progression guilds Um, not every boss is just going to be a one-shot Yeah, that's one thing I've been very like Look, my my guild is it's going to be a progression style of guild. I do not like talking like I'm gonna walk in there day one. We're gonna hear everything like I like I'm not like like I'm a very like Some guilds are like that like I know like like stay safe skill is is going to be like like you're you're planning on doing like You guys are already having guild meetings and stuff like that like you're you're wanting to play min max hard, right? My guild is not going to be that and I know it's like a progression style of guild It might take us like a couple of weeks or whatever We can get everything down first week. That'd be awesome. But if it takes us a couple weeks, whatever That's fine You know like there's going to be things that we expect because like okay I played on private server and this boss did this and then you know There's there's mechanics that people just have have kind of like, okay We watched this video and we think the boss works this way like you take a nixie a deep breath for example uh where it's actually like People like people don't know how deep breath works like what triggers the uh what triggers like the the What triggers the deep breath excuse me like so it's like don't stand too close to each other Don't do this don't do that like people don't know and private servers don't know so it's Everybody has tried like some weird kind of crazy formula for how how has this happened Uh, but even something like that that's kind of like a running thing. Um Even like nano the the lead of quality assurance on on nostalrius brought that up Like they actually went and visited blizzard and talked to them about it and at the time blizzard blizzard wouldn't tell them Because it was it was actually I think it's kind of funny that they didn't tell them because it's like hey You know like we'll we'll see whenever, you know, we'll see someday maybe and I guess eventually now It's like they knew the classics coming out and all that. Um So, yeah, um I mean, let me go ahead and uh go on to the next question here Um Oh, where are the huge piles of skeletons after pvp events? This is good. I I really hope they fix this Um, I'm really missing them. Probably those make the most authentic vanilla experience So I guess at some point in in the modern game They made it to where like it dynamically like gets rid of skeletons If people die out in the world so that the world doesn't get too cluttered up in vanilla like bodies everywhere Just littered if there was a big pvp battle like I remember I remember walking into black rock mountain and just seeing like skeletons everywhere I was like, oh Must have been a raid that just went by here like like two raids just fighting each other or something And that's cool. Like it is badass It makes the world alive So like you you walk in there and you know like like I wasn't there, but I know some I know something just went down Like it's I I think it's so cool. Uh, and I really I really really hope uh that they do fix that as well Um, have you guys have you had you guys noticed the kind of the same kind of thing? I know I know whenever we were doing the pvp yesterday Like arathi islands look like a janitor went through between every match and just kind of I actually kind of forgot about that. It was like it was like a basketball game Like they're just going and sweeping up off the sweat and then heading back to the bench like I was really surprised Yeah, bones just disappearing left right and center, but yeah, I actually completely forgot that that used to be in the game Yeah, I wonder if they've intentionally Gotten rid of it or this forgot about it or what? I wonder if it was an intentional design for classic beta to not have them there I wonder if it interferes with like service stability or what the deal is, but if it's doable I think it's a really badass feature. I love I love that stuff Because you're right after a giant pvp battle. It looks like it's snowed like there's just like the ground Yeah, for real death Yeah, um, oh, this is a good one. I really hope I really hope they do this, uh, do you think once all the fades Oh, wait. Oh, no, I misunderstood this question. Well, I'm gonna ask my own question. Um Do you guys think do you guys think that they should add Battlegrounds into beta testing and test features from the other phases I think I think that would be really really cool if they added battlegrounds in at some point phasing or sorry at some point in testing In order to be able to test like or some gulch and arathi basin And maybe even av but I mean you wouldn't have maybe low level av now. You couldn't really you know You scale everything down. I don't know it'd be interesting Yeah, and just you know for strictly for testing purposes not because it would be incredibly fun Strictly for testing, of course, right Well, like let me ask you this. Yeah, like this is the thing. I think it'd be badass. I think it'd be a lot of fun I love to do it but What is there to test like other other than a couple wall jumps, you know And like we'll figure that out. We'll figure that out day one phase three Anyway, what what really do they need us to test in the battle? Well, I think I think to that point though It's like you could almost say the same thing about like well, didn't the make the game 15 years ago? You know what I mean? Like I think I think it's it's going to be very similar like some weird some weird random thing could come up Right that like yeah, like I mean there's a number of things right that we've talked about already that people are just like Oh, wow, okay. That's interesting. That's what I think. I think like you never know. So you might as well test it Yeah Me too I think I think it'll be really really fun. Um So, yeah, let's let's go back to the actual question But phoenix cosplay was asking, uh Do you think that once all the phase is finished in classic should they create new content at 60 or should they carry Should they carry over servers into bc and beyond this is something we've talked about multiple times This is a question that comes up pretty often But I think there is a new audience of people that that is probably new here People who maybe haven't seen class cast before um So yeah, let's talk about it. Um, what do you guys what do you guys think? How do you guys feel about that? Like Post I guess post next content So I haven't been thinking about this a lot Yeah, I've been thinking about this a lot and what exactly they could do and it feels like to me There's two routes that could go so you you play with vanilla completely. It's after next and then They decide, you know what that went so well. Let's release the burning crusade now. What do they do? They could either roll over vanilla into burning crusade or they could create A burning crusade realm and maybe you could portal over your or copy over your vanilla character To the burning crusade realm and then you could experience that way But I feel like both sides kind of have problems like they roll over the realms The burning crusade then all of a sudden You're gonna alienate all the people that just want to play vanilla and they're gonna be going back under the private realms Which would be kind of hilarious. I mean not for them, but it would just be such a weird situation And then the other way where they bring out the burning crusade realm now. There's vanilla There's you know the the current realm whatever it may be maybe it's BFA still Maybe it's the new expansion And then you have burning crusade and then you have three realms that people are playing on and it's dividing the community and then Maybe that goes on and they do wrath of the lich king that have to do the same thing I just like don't know where they would draw the line and how many servers they really want to have running at the same time I mean, I think I think wrath of liching kind of gives like a Kind of like an artificial stop point in the sense that you could always say that Oh, this is you know after that the world changed and azeroth changed a new azeroth and stuff So it's kind of like you have that little artificial barrier But um, but yeah, I definitely think tbc there. I wouldn't be surprised if they're already working on it right now When we spoke to john height and oh marganzala's and actually even ian at the event last week or two weeks ago now We asked them straight up. Are there plans for tbc and wrath of lich king servers and they came out and they said Yeah, sure if you guys want it, uh, that's something we're We're definitely open to doing and it's a very stark contrast to what they said during blizzcon We asked that same question at blizzcon six months ago and they said they're not even you know, we're not looking at that We're not focused on that. We're just focused on classic. So the fact that they were so Willing to come out and say yeah, sure. It's something we're down to do Um, I wouldn't be surprised if they're if they're literally working on it literally Right now Yeah, I think well that that answer probably indicates like how confident they are with classic vanilla, right? Like okay, they sort of have everything figured out with classic things are going very well Okay, now we can sort of devote some brain power to maybe classic tbc and start working on that You're maybe right. Maybe they're sort of getting that stuff done and I'm really stupid I don't know how this stuff works But it would make sense to me that the infrastructure that they're Developing or setting up for classic vanilla. They can probably use for classic tbc down the road, right? So who knows maybe just by nature of making classic vanilla. They're already closer to tbc than otherwise Yeah, I think I think burning crusade is probably more important than I think burning crusade is probably more important than like post-nax content Now here's here's the the big issue and you kind of brought this up then is Force progression, right? Like if you roll the servers into bc and then all of a sudden the people who Wanted to play vanilla the whole time. That's all they want to play like now. They're like, okay. What now, you know Like now what like it's over. Do what do we do? So Like maybe like It's it's just that that's probably the biggest problem. I would say Um Historically, I should I mean there's been times where like people have made burning crusade private servers And on burning crusade private servers something that people have seen is that there's a major horde population imbalance like in favor of hordes They've made population balance in favor of horde It's the same thing gonna happen I don't know. I think it's important to have like some sort of character If they did a fresh burning crusade server and they added like uh, like they allowed you to character copy to that So you could keep like let's say I'm an alliance player and I want to play a little 60 so I I keep my character and I care I can keep it there on that server But I can also copy it over and I can play on that burning crusade server and start as I like as if I were going into burning crusade Uh while still having my character where it was where I can play 1.12 or phase 6 vanilla wow, uh as long as possible, right? Or as just forever basically, uh, I think that would be cool We've mapped this out before and it's like some kind of it ends up being some kind of crazy spider web because whenever they do this They're gonna inevitably have to make fresh servers. It's gonna be it's gonna be crazy right fresh vanilla servers Stays that you talked about that before But yeah, I think it's it's just going to be very very interesting to see How they do it. I think certainly Allowing or like adding burning crusade is more important than post-nax content at first They're definitely at first But also doing it the right way to where you're not forcing progression and the people who want to play vanilla can't play vanilla But when you say post-nax content, do you mean them bringing like making new content after next? Yeah, kind of like the OSR is that how many people are actually interested in? yeah, like there's been there's been a lot of people talking about it because um, I think most people probably want burning crusade Um, just because like a lot of people really like burning crusade But it is something that people have been talking about it's something that people want Because stuff has been developed since like really the alpha since before Um, since before burning crusade came out it was developed in the original development of the game like Camerons of time black morasses in the game files Charzan is there, you know, they they made three different versions of Charzan before we finally saw the the final version, right? I think they made two versions and the third version was the final one. I think Uh, the Charzan crypts are there there's so much stuff in the game Hygel is in the game the hygel that is in cataclysm is the same exact hygel As far as landscape goes that was in the original game So there's people that have been talking about it But I think like more than anything before you do all that and go down that rabbit hole I think burning crusade is the most important thing and I think that You will appeal to the the largest number of people and then maybe someday in the future You can talk about some sort of classic plus that is that is what I think personally so Or all I should say almost the exact same I guess as far as I know It's the exact same like from whenever I was running around you can't actually you can't like I guess Through normal means through normal means you can't really get into hygel and vanilla But like it's it's like very very similar, right at least very very similar. I I couldn't tell the difference. I should say so, yeah Yeah, my opinion is like I think that classic tbc is the right move and of course veneraki raises a good point You have to continue to offer classic vanilla Otherwise we're end up where we are right now and if you want to play vanilla you have to plan a private server, right? So if they move on at tbc at the same time that continue to offer classic vanilla um I think a lot of this content like you said like hygel And the older versions of karazhan and like there's maybe an emerald dream raid and stuff like this I think this stuff wasn't added to vanilla because They decided it wasn't a good fit or it just wasn't you know, they they didn't add it for reasons It's not like they ran out of time they they They could have drug vanilla on as long as I wanted right, but they chose to go on a tbc um The other thing is like after next ram is you would end up with big Power spike problems, and I think people things would get really out of hand people already say that and I agree the best time for pvp In vanilla wow and classic wow is going to be uh bwl or zg because the gear isn't too power spiky You know and when people are in t3 and even starting with like aq gear people become really glass canony People are just dying so fast the most fun pvp is going to be probably phase three phase four during uh classic wow So I think that if you offer new content in classic wow like bonus content after next ramus or whatever You have to incentivize it somehow and in mmo's you incentivize new content with gear And I think that adding new gear would One change the meta a lot and the game wouldn't Really feel the same in a lot of ways and there would be huge power spike problems. I think I think the desire for a patch 1.13 mostly stems from the fact that People want more vanilla There's a lot of people that want burning crusade. I want to see burning crusade too But I won't lie. There are a couple of small things about tbc that You know design philosophies or paradigm shifts that kind of take a little bit away from vanilla Or away from from what world of warcraft was back in the day Like not as many materials being out in the world stuff like that flying mounts obviously is the big one Kind of changing the entire like world pvp landscape and stuff People want there's a there's a big portion of people I should say that want more vanilla beyond what's there in classic and uh Unfortunately, I just don't think that's the right business choice. I think tbc is the slam dunk So blizzard will go with that But you know, it's you know, you always think about the idea of man I wish there was there was just more vanilla like content whether it came from world of warcraft or other games I just wish there was more of this type of game possibly a new experience new game entirely But I think that's just what it comes down to Yeah, I mean I would say more so like uh You know, you could go for a slam dunk, right? You could go for a slam dunk But you know coach is going to tell you go for the layup, right? So you can get the easy points with tbc Instead of like trying to show off and do this great big like grandiose like classic plus whatever and then it ends up failing, right? That's that that's that's more so kind of like the way that I see it like you could just say bc is going to be a hit easy layup easy points um Yeah, I think uh, I think that's that's the case for sure um This is something that people keep asking and I think we should address it Uh, do the people who get accepted? No, no, no, sorry. We already talked about that But people have been asking about do you have to be subscribed to uh, wow right now in order to get beta access Uh, I don't know because I think you do. Yeah, they said yes. They said you do I think that's what they said. Yeah, but like they said you do But I've had people whisper me and telling me that they don't have they they weren't sub. I don't know if they're telling the truth Yeah, I don't know if they're just lying and what that's the thing. Yeah, so like they said yes But I I personally would very strongly not recommend subbing For the sake of just like hoping that you get in the beta Uh, I mean like it's your money. You can do with it what you want But I I think that like look if you want to take the chance It's like dude, I will pay $15 for the chance to just play the beta I think it'd be really fun if that's how you feel then then great. It's your money But I like reasonably I would not recommend it and certainly I feel like if you if you do that Just for just hoping for a chance to get in the beta and you don't get in like you don't really have a Right to be upset about it because like I don't know you should you just have the foresight to know that you're like gambling essentially So, yeah So, yeah, I don't I don't know how you guys feel about it Um, yeah, I I think they shouldn't do it like I think it's pretty obvious why They're requiring the sub like it it's it's easy money for them, right? Um I man, I I I would if I wasn't in my position now I Would probably do it but at the same time I would tell other people not to do it I It's I don't know dude. I don't know man. It's like a weird thing because you're like this is so stupid This is so stupid for me to actually waste money on this. Yeah hoping for it But then like you're just obsessed with the game. I guess maybe Yeah, what if you are that one guy who just wants to play so bad and you sub and you end up getting a key Yeah, well then you're gonna feel really good, dude. It's gonna be everyone else's feels garbage. Yeah, that's roll in the dice Dude, that's that big wind fury. That's the big seal of command. That's what that is so Yeah um Let's see we have we have a little bit more time. We're gonna take a few more questions guys um Guys, please if you haven't already, uh, please please please go follow venruki stay safe Follow tips as well. All their handles are on the screen Um stay safe is going to be streaming after this So, uh, we're we're going to be hosting him. Uh, but yes, we do have a We do have a few more questions that we can take let's take some questions out of the chat Actually, if you guys have any questions to chat that you want to give us, um, we can go and take a look at that as well um What is venruki's thoughts on looking silly and low level gear with no transmog like i'm so happy you picked that out Okay, okay. I saw i'm asking a few times. I thought maybe you know give him a shot. What do you think venruki? Uh, can I can I send you photos on discord? Is something I really want to show you? Yeah, a little more Okay, so I took a screenshot this morning. Uh, I'll post it right here. I took a screenshot this morning of my character like right before I went live And that's it. Okay, so There's a screenshot of my character right before I went live and this is a screenshot One of the transmogs that I came up with So i'm kind of known for wearing really stupid transmogs very colorful It's kind of like nothing matches this this one kind of matches, but they look incredibly similar I just thought that was kind of hilarious, but I I like it. I think transmog so I think a lot of the decisions that they made Uh over the years that eventually got us to where we are in bfa had like really good intentions Yeah, but I think transmog is one of those things I I thought would be really awesome initially But I don't actually like it that much. I kind of I kind of like you know showing off I'm a pvp or look at my pvp gear and although it ends up everyone has very similar sets like when you see You know someone in full pvp gear and maybe they have like one piece of pve gear like kind of shows their power level And I don't know I like not everyone looking super duper pretty. Yeah, this is really funny It's just like I talked about this on stream a little bit today where If you look at characters particularly like in the level 30 range like everybody looks so janky Like they like it's everybody looks like their armor was just thrown together partially because it was But it you literally look like a warrior or like some kind of some kind of guy, you know You're a major warrior whatever class you actually are but you're you're somebody training. You're growing. You're getting stronger You're getting equipment. You're forming out in the world and and you're exploring. It's it's very humble. Yes That is a very good way to put it. You're not you're not the champion of the alliance forces or whatever the global commander of the Argus offensive. You're just like a humble little adventure helping people like get bore meat for their village or whatever Yeah, it's it's cool. Like it's just like I know we looked at our guys in uh We looked at our guys and we were doing sm graveyard runs like all downstream and like everybody just stands there and you look like You look like the average joes in dodgeball and it's like these are like the people's champions like this I don't it's just funny because it's like they're not like global gym. It's just cooler Like it's just like these are like the common man. I I love it. It's so cool So, yeah, yeah, and it's very endearing I agree and like as kind of like a secondary effect Like I've always felt like one of the biggest incentives to progress in any mmorpg Is not just like power gains but also appearance gains And it's something that vanilla wow did really well possibly like even unintentionally like That moment when you go from wearing like that freaking rinky dink little cloak thing to like a full-on like cape That's like that's like always kind of like a big little like power moment there where oh my god I got this like visual upgrade. I look more powerful now Um, and it goes beyond that like generally speaking on average the lower level pieces Especially like the cloth shoulders the low level cloth shoulders They're literally like little triangles On your shoulders Yeah, well as you go on like you you go deeper into the game like, you know warlocks You know you start getting your tier sets and stuff like that or whatever pieces you use may just same thing like You know the gear Court like the level of the gear correlates with its appearance almost and like again, it just it adds that layer of progression I'm not just getting stronger But physically I'm looking more like a badass as we get higher level too I think just removing that from the game removes a big incentive to progress. I feel Yeah, I see a lot of questions. I see a lot of questions about like what if they add this like ladder system? Or what if they add like, you know balancing jay? There's a guy is Nice, we're gonna play classic. Okay. Yeah, we're we're classic men and women. Okay, that's that's We haven't even played it yet. Just let it be what it is. Yeah, just let the game be what it is I think like now that that being said the one thing I do want that was not there in vanilla I want like ptr realms where we can do like pre-made battlegrounds So you can play with your friends. I might not be on your realm. I really do you guys agree with that? I want ptr dueling or uh, or battle tournament realms or something like that Yeah, that's that's kind of a separate thing though. That's not really that's not really like in the scope of the game That's more of like a ptr situation Right if they end up doing that because they did because it has no impact on your primary character, right? Right not even on the real server. Yeah, they did that in burning crusade with like arena servers Like they had like the arena tournament servers and people could go there like that would be that would be cool It's not even about the actual game guys like it's it's uh, it's like ptr servers so I have a question for in vanilla was did you only do battlegrounds? against people on your realm Yes, until patch 112. I believe that's when it's changed. So yeah, I like towards the end Yeah, just to hold on just to clarify. I did not say add classic arenas. That's absolutely not what I said What I said was having like a server where uh, basically like in in burning crusade What I remember them doing is you could character copy to to a ptr You can take your retail character or something and then they'd be on a they'll be on test server public test and it would be like a tournament public test, right? And uh, basically you could just dual people and do stuff like that on on said server It has nothing to do no connection to the actual game or whatever where your actual character is on But if they added something like this for people to go like test stuff or people to go dual and Maybe to do like events and whatnot something like that would be cool. So That would yeah, that's not adding arenas Something that that is a whole that yeah, no, you should not add arenas in classic and that's a whole another discussion Which uh, I don't think we have time for today because I think I think it's uh, it's just about time for us to get going So, uh guys Thank you so much for joining us today Obviously again, venruchy. Thank you so much for joining us man venruchy A new big fan of classic so you guys should go give venruchy a follow and stay safe Of course tips out baby regulars on the show So yeah, thank you guys so much for joining us and uh, we will see you guys next time stay safe We'll be streaming so we'll be hosting stay safe and uh, I'll see you guys tomorrow See you boys