 Now, I finally get an opportunity to say good evening to you all. So thank you, all of you who have reached here on time, and thank you so much, all the panelists for being here before time. You know, we've had a short conversation to ensure that, you know, we make this conversation that we have useful to all of you who have come and joined us. Just to give you a little bit of a background, you know, of the health and wellness industry from the perspective that I have seen for the, especially the post-pandemic, the last two years, it's very clearly, you know, it has been split into two parts. One is healthcare as we know, which is more of the illness-oriented industry, the whole ecosystem around it, the hospitals, diagnostics, etc. But there's also a well-being space, which is you don't have to be unwell to become better, to become healthier. And then the whole industry around the health and wellness, and which is represented by the panel that is joining us here today. But the one thing that has really emerged very strongly out of this that I have observed is that the power of personalization beyond the messaging. You know, we are in an industry where everything that we do is creating an impact on how personalization is there in the outcomes of the patients as an outcome of whatever we are doing, creating personalized experiences, and which makes it imperative for all of us to start thinking how we can personalize the messaging so that people know what they can expect. So that to me appears to be an important design thinking. You know, it's beyond, I mean, it's a mindset that needs to change, and that's what we are trying to understand from the panel here based on their experiences, their observations of being there in the industry and creating the messaging that they do. So, Sanyukta, you know, let me begin the conversation with you. How do you think that the industry is actually embracing innovation out of the box thinking technology while we are strategizing the marketing messaging and marketing strategies for the health and wellness industry? Hi, everyone. So I think, yeah, there's a lot, like you're saying, the industry itself has evolved, so I've had the good fortune of I worked in FMCG and then I worked at Abbott for a bit, and then I moved back to FMCG and now I'm with Kaya, which is kind of a mix of everything. So speaking from experience, I can tell you a few things. I think you were talking about in the earlier conversation that we had. You spoke about the fact that there's so much that is not communicated, whether it's from the doctor's end or whether it's from the patient's end. And I think that's where design thinking can play a huge role. So for example, even something as small as how a patient could communicate what they are feeling. So I think, yeah, there's so much loss in translation between each of these conversations, there is so much that is not told, and then so much that can be misconstrued because of that. I think that's where marketing can play a very huge role in terms of translating just the colloquial speak of the patient to the pharma company, to then the HCP or the healthcare professional and how do you kind of tie that entire bit up? I think that just the language, the human language itself can be oversimplified. That's one. Two, of course, if I have to pick again at Abbott, another example was when we had actually tied up with Goki for the gut health division and we realized that that was where we were talking about service plus pill and going beyond just recommending a pill for the patient and how do you kind of help them actually improve the quality of their life or lifestyle, so to say. So I think that's another good example of where you had Luke Coutinho as the brand ambassador and there was so much to do with dietitians, physiotherapists, psychologists, which was again like a completely untapped space into pharma. I still think there's a lot to be done there because everything kind of begins in the mind and today most of the illnesses, like you said, it's not necessary that you're ill, but it's largely because of our mental makeup that we end up, the weakest part of our body kind of gets impacted. I think that's again where there's so much of digital innovation that plays a role. If I have to pick up examples of what we have done at Kaya, here we have actually leveraged the power of AI into our website to kind of ensure that there's a lot of skin analysis, diagnosis that happens right there. We're working on creating a chatbot where you can actually, you know, schedule your own appointments because today fewer and fewer people want to speak to the call center, fewer and fewer people want to wait for appointment booking. I mean, they're so used to even our food order today happens online. So why should it be any different when it comes to health and wellness? Another example is I think doctors. You spoke about the fact that about diagnostic chains, right? So we've actually been using our dermatologists as our brand ambassadors. We've just coined a term called skinfluencers where they then become the voice for the brand. They then become the advocates where they are at the center of everything that the brand is doing. I think we were also discussing about try and man matters and they were talking about a lot of webinars and coaching. And there's so much today in the space of advocacy that actually harnesses the power of digital and innovation and kind of brings that to life. So, yeah, I think the possibilities are endless. I think there's so much that each one of us is doing, learning from one another, constantly innovating. And I think it's just getting, while it's getting more and more simple, probably it's also kind of making it a little complex because today you have too many data points and I would leave that question to somebody else to kind of take that up. But what's happening is that because we have so many sources of information today, how are we actually then using it? Are we getting one view of the customer at the end of the day to really know who we are talking to? Because there's so much conversation around cohort targeting and persona building and personalization, so to speak. But does anyone really understand the consumer end to end? And do I really know how to talk to you, so to speak? So I think yeah, there's just, it's a very interesting topic. Like you said, it's a Pandora's box, we can all go on talking. So I'm not gonna take up too much of time, so yeah. Absolutely, I think this is brilliant, what you brought out because what happens is that I was listening to a speaker in the morning in the digital conference and they said that technology can be really complex at the back end, but in the front end it needs to be simple. So for the user, it needs to be very, very simple. And while you can use technology, AI, et cetera, to bring it out in front of the patient as to what they personally need. But for building the trust, you have skin fluences because you can't promote your own product because they'll just run away. Geet, let me come to you. I mean, since we were talking of personalization, what is your opinion, is the role or the impact that personalization can make in the health and wellness industry? And the reason I'm asking you this is because you have products which are oriented towards men and then you have another app which is working or a platform which is working towards kids. How do you create personalization while marketing or creating marketing strategies? Sure, thank you. If my colleagues would have seen that this is the question asked to me, they would have said it's a match made in heaven because this is exactly what I keep discussing all day and I'm pretty much obsessed with it. So there are two nuances that I would love to talk about which we've sort of figured out over the last couple of months in our journey of trying to personalize things for the user. And the nuances are in how things change about the role of marketing when it comes to health care itself. Because unlike normal marketing, when it comes to health care, I feel the biggest difference is that here the role of marketing is not that somebody is buying a product and your job is done, it's actually driving health outcomes. And health outcomes more often than not is not typically driven by just a person buying a product. You have to be with that person. You need to give personalization as an experience and not just as a marketing tactic. So that's the first nuance and I'll go a little bit deeper on that. And the second is that the role of marketing for the longest of time I think has been to stand out in the minds of the consumer to answer the question as to why should I go with you, the why was the important aspect. But as consumers are evolving, I think the role of marketeers and the role of marketing, especially in health care, is not just about why, it's about why should I choose you, what should I choose, how should I use it, will I see results, when will I see results? There are a lot of questions in the mind of consumers and typically marketing is inadequate to answer all of these questions. Therefore, closing the loop on my first point, if you really have to be with a consumer, then all of this needs to translate into personalized experience for the user, which traditionally cannot just happen by communication being personalized. I think a lot of people also, for the longest of time, I think marketeers have been discussing about, oh, if it's personalized, you will see better CTRs, you will see better open rates, and things like that. But I think when it comes to health care, because the goal is a lot more complex and a higher level goal of driving outcomes, which is typically spread over a couple of months and not just in the instant of purchase, I feel that you need to have a very strong buy-in from the consumer himself, because health care is an investment, especially when it's not just about ill-being, it's about augmenting yourself to being better. There has to be a buy-in from the user as well. So the role of personalization in marketing today, I personally believe, is not just that you will be able to convince the user better, but the role is instead that a consumer should feel that, oh, yes, this is for me, and the buy-in is stronger from the consumer's end, so that your partners, when it comes to driving health outcomes, and not just a person buying a product for themselves. And I spoke about the four or five questions that consumers have in their mind. I think marketing becomes complex, and how we think at least about trying to personalize experiences for the user is as you ask each question, and the user gives different answers, you see there are different personas and different parts of personalization for the user. So the more questions that you're trying to answer for the consumer, that becomes a path for you to personalize experiences for the user. I do believe most of us today, at least while we are trying to pursue personalization, what we are actually doing is mass customization and not personalization. I think there's a lot for us to unlock in terms of saying that, yes, a user truly feels that this platform is for me. When he opens the app, what he sees is different completely from, let's say, when you would open the app. So that's something that we are trying to do. Driving health outcomes really, really requires a huge buy-in from the consumer. People are at different points of journeys in their health care journey, so we have to customize it and personalize it for them. So therefore, I really believe that personalization is the only way to go about solving health outcomes for the users today. So Geet, apart from talking about personalization, you brought out a very important aspect, because when you look at the people who founded companies which are related to health care, a lot of them that I've observed have a purpose behind it. There's a reason they got into health care businesses. And many times as a founder, you're not able to bring out that why that you spoke of in front of the audience, in front of the target. And I think that is a role that the marketing teams have on their shoulder that they need to brilliantly do it in an effective manner so that the why is known to the consumer. The second thing, you use the word persona, that brings me to the next question, British, this is for you. When we are talking of creating a persona, in fact, all the marketeers have used this word all the time, but today, when we were talking of personalization, we are trying to understand and today we have a technology of AI, blockchain, et cetera, to help us understand and go beyond what you said, mass, what did you say? Mass customization towards personalization, real personalization. So how do you think, Prithish, can we use data and analytics to create that journey towards personalization in trying to understand your customer in the first place? Yeah. So love to be a part of this amazing panel and representing the whole digital well-being industry, healthcare industry is just beyond my teams. Now if we break down healthcare and digital healthcare servicing into components, it will be diagnosis and then you provide a solution and then the customer fortunately sees results, right? And that's when data analytics, we as all of us are leveraging user data to first diagnose what the user is going through, right? Now because of our privilege, we sit in Bombay, right? And many other metros, we have amazing doctors who know what questions to ask and what are the common problems a customer or a person will face in a particular age bracket. But let's say someone who's sitting in a rural town in Bhuvaneshwar in Odessa, right? The healthcare facilities there are not that great. So this is when companies like us and a lot of other people who generate questionnaires or head tests and apps to understand what parameters and user attributes we can take from the customer and provide a very customized and personalized solution for them so that the result which they intend to see, let's say in six months down the line is properly curated and given to them, right? Now let's say, and we have heard this story from a lot of our parents as well, right? That the diagnosis only was very wrong. That the doctor suggested some medication which only addressed X problem of the customer but did not address Y. Versus when you take all attributes of the customer, let's say he's facing issues with his energy levels or with digestion. Now hair fall can just be a symptom, right? Unless and until you address all these problems that he's facing in his life, he's not be able to basically feel more confident or solve for hair fall. So the nuances are very many, right? People come from various stages of life, various lifestyle problems, various genetic problems and having like a structured approach to first diagnosing all the problems that are there with the user and supplementing the solution as per their problems is what data analytics leverages and that is how marketing is solving this in order to deliver results, right? All of us are sitting here only because whatever solutions that we generated using diagnosis are providing results to the customers, right? So that's how brilliantly we've been doing it so far and it'll only get better. AI machine learning is just a fancy way of saying it's a complicated way of if else, if else loops, right? And it's only because of the power of questions that we are able to diagnose it better and the solutions are now out there, right? It's just matching it with the right problem. So that's how data analytics is evolving. Also the treatment process is way longer, right? It doesn't stop with just providing, let's say the medication, right? They have to follow it through. So based on the user pattern of using these apps and website, we understand who is basically consistent on the journey, who is dropping off in the middle or who got bored of the treatment, right? So we nice them using various messages and calls from the hair coaches and all these points so that they get back on the treatment and do not divert from their journey and help them achieve the results. So that's how data analytics simultaneously plays a part with the whole product, tech, and marketing to provide the needed results for the customer. Vinita, let me come to you. When we think about marketing, whether it is healthcare or any other industry, you can't ignore digital today. I mean, I was listening to the morning sessions that 40% of the budget is now towards digital. So I think one comment that I heard in the morning was very powerful when they said that, you know, digital is becoming the new media, the mass media, the new mass media, right? When we're looking at digital, social media is a very important aspect of how we are marketing or reaching out or engaging with our audience today. What do you think healthcare companies can do to use social media to connect with their audience and also promote the products or services that we have to offer as a part of the healthcare and wellbeing and wellness industry? Sure. So right before the panel, we were discussing like, you know, how healthcare and marketing, it doesn't go together because there is some sort of resistance from the users that, you know, it looks more like a push-based effort, whereas healthcare should not be, like, you know, we should not be pushing something which the user don't want to take. So social media is a great way to kind of, you know, show the personality of the brand and create a pull. I think a lot of other panelists touched upon that you have to understand what the core issue is, right? For example, Hairfall. Hairfall could happen because of multitude of issues. It could be because, you know, you have vitamin D deficiency or some chronic illness, but you can't just tell them that, you know, use our product and then you can get rid of Hairfall. So it is the owners of healthcare companies to educate the users through social media or other channels that, you know, they can make the right decisions. Other thing is that, you know, social media, I mean, everybody here knows that it's a great way to touch a lot of people, but I think from a healthcare perspective, it's a great way to not only educate, but also to learn. Because a lot of times when, as a marketer, we build personas, it's based on who our ideal user should be. But unless and until you don't talk to people, you don't engage with them, you don't know why or why not they're buying. So I think their social media can really bridge that gap, you know, to just kind of solidify your understanding of why the customer is buying from you or who you should target. So I just want to close it by saying that, especially for healthcare, basically for any brand, but especially for healthcare, it's really important to take the owners of educating your users well, really safeguarding their interests and, you know, understanding that whatever you are doing should add some value in their life, be it in the short term or long term. You know, it's very beautifully, you are articulated, the role that social media is playing. But I think, you know, when we are a healthcare company or someone who's dealing with wellness or well-being, there's a lot of responsibility that we have when we are interacting with our audience. And I think social media is also creating a lot of, you know, something that we are missing earlier, but because of the advancement of technology, we are able to now have a two-way conversation if you really use the technology well. And what you really brought out was a very important aspect. It's not just about creating education or creating awareness. It is also about listening in terms of what is needed or what is the feedback. And I think the second aspect of social media that I personally feel that can be really impactful is creating an influence. You know, because something that you can't do yourself, the other influencers can do for you. And that has created a faster acceptance of receiving the knowledge and information about the company and the products that we do. So thank you so much for sharing that. Shubhadeep, Subhadeep, yeah? Shubhadeep is correct. Okay. Whatever we do, whatever we are trying to do, can't be without challenges. I have not come across anything which has been like straight success. So what are the challenges that we as marketeers are facing? Specifically when we are trying to innovate and do something which has never been done in the past, when it comes to healthcare and well-being industry. And what, if there are challenges, there has to be a solution. So if you can identify the challenges and share with you, share with us, what could be the possible solutions to those challenges? Sure, sure. Thank you. So I look after the child nutrition category at HealthCart. And I'm very intrigued by my position here today because I have to talk about the challenge while most of the other people have talked about the solutions, right? But okay, let me start with the challenge. So there are two aspects to this. One is marketing and one is healthcare. And the third aspect is innovative marketing. What we understand by that is usage of technology, AR, VR, augmented reality, or whatever the technical terms of those are. But basically what it does is gives larger than life immersive experience to the consumer, right? So we've seen the recent Britannia ads, AI ads, and we've all been very fascinated. But those are done to trigger and experience kind of trigger a very positive reaction and affinity quickly, right? Now coming to healthcare. Healthcare is a tricky area. So here, this marketing is driven by providing information. Now information is boring. Now using technology, suddenly you try to make information very, very appealing. It's tough, so I'll take an example from Prahaya. You use AI and make baldness very, very lively. I don't know whether you'll get consumers or lose them, okay? So how to present information is a big challenge when it comes to technology for healthcare companies. And the second thing I think is plethora of information, the massive amount of information that we had to give because we have products and then 20, 30, 15 ingredients, each ingredient has a role to play in solving some specific aspect of the health problem, right? So how much information can you really pack with the current attention span of consumers which is less than three seconds probably, right? Why should anybody see your ad at all? No matter how much digital you are using or whatever you are using, right? And the third aspect is information at two points. One is moment of truth when I'm searching for it. That's when chats, et cetera, maybe are helpful. But when I'm not searching for it and you're pushing it on my Facebook feed or my Insta feed, am I really wanting to know that information? So that's the challenge, okay? And now coming to solutions, I'll just take two examples out of what we have done at Gridzo and Gridzo is, I used to call it a personalized child nutrition brand but after today I'll call it mass customized probably. But we have a huge number of SKUs. I mean, Gridzo is a child nutrition brand for children from the age of four to 13 plus and we have huge number of SKUs catering to, you know, minute cohorts of needs, age, gender, health goals, et cetera, et cetera. And we kind of customize and cater to consumers with specific needs. Now you can understand, now we have with 30 SKUs, you cannot really give all that information in one ad, right? So the first challenge was how to identify the right person. So we went through a lot of learning and we figured out a method through which now we've been able to figure, we've drawn a matrix of the key benefit, the key cohort and the key outcome, okay? So these three are triangulated and we do not launch with one content. We'll launch anything that we do right now in any of our campaigns. We'll launch with multiple of campaigns and in this three axis, okay? And the second part I think we're about providing information in an interesting way. We experimented with gamification and that really worked for us. So we kind of created a game where the mothers will go into their regular routines with their children. They'll pick up things that they are cooking or giving to the child and the game would tell them what kind of calories, what kind of nutrition benefits are going per day. Along with that, it will showcase how Gritzo can help and help in the child's growth. So it's like one content which gets customized through an AI-enabled engine at the back end as per your need. But it's one content when I push it through Facebook. So I think that was one of our very, very good campaigns. And real life examples. So yeah, that's about it. Thank you. Awesome, awesome. Thank you so much for sharing that because while we just wanted to add to the challenges, right? And obviously a lot of our companies have our specific R&D teams who do the research. But even now if you go to any Google or like social media app and you search a symptom, it will eventually lead to cancer, you having cancer, right? Because there's so much information and noise like you rightly said. But you have to trust the experts because there's so much work that has been put in. So that's one main challenge which I would like to add to. Also, it's the expectation of the results, right? I think people are so used to getting deliveries in 10 minutes right now that they also expect health care to solve problems in like a week or so, which realistically is not possible in our. Any good treatment would take a longer duration to provide those visible and sustainable results. So yeah, these two are. I think brilliantly put, you know, and what really also came out was that the challenges could be there, but the solutions need not be very technically advanced. It could be simple things that you could do to overcome these challenges. Shweta, my last question to you and one of the very important ones because you know, when we are looking at marketing, innovation, doing things out of the box, we also are working in an industry which is highly regulated, you know. Whether it is healthcare services, whether it is wellness services or wellness products per se. How do you create a balance between innovating your marketing strategies and ensuring that the compliance, you are complying to the regulation that is there? Thanks, Arubindo. Good evening, everyone, and thanks for having me. I think all that we spoke, you know, will come to nothing if we are not compliant. So I think, especially, you know, when we are dealing with health and I think what we need to understand over here is why this is so. And this is so because when we are in the space of health, we are in the space of trust and credibility. You know, unlike any other category, you know, which is more transactional, let me put it that way. When it comes to health, I think somebody spoke about, you know, health outcomes, it takes a lot of time. So you are in for some time and you are here because there is something which is bothering you and something which not just might be bothering you but it might be affecting your family as well. So trust and credibility is extremely important and I might actually even counter-argue on this. If you are able to build that in a compliant way, that could actually be a differentiator because the sales that you are trying to drive in can help you in the short term but if you have to build a long-term business, a viable business, trust becomes extremely important. So there are a couple of things that I think as marketers and personally I have applied over the years that I have worked in different companies. First is don't see compliance and regulations as a barrier. You know, see that, how you understand. A lot of marketers shy away from even understanding. You know, that's someone else's job. I will go with my campaign, I'll go with my content. Now, who are that function is in your organization, whether it's legal or whether it's regulatory. You see them as on the other side of the fence. You know, and then you say, you know, this is not happening. But how many of us actually understand the laws of the land? Understand the regulatory framework. I think so that is where it has to start from. Second, again, my personal thing that which I applied, which I found it beneficial, is when you're thinking about your campaign brief, involve them. Make them as your stakeholders. You know, make them understand the context. Make them understand your objective as to why you're trying to drive it. I have found in many instances wherein they come with solutions which are even better than what you have thought because they know how to navigate around. So those are the couple of things, you know, in terms of how we should be looking because I firmly believe that this will be differentiated and I think something which I've spoken about. Consumers are bombarded with information which may or may not be right. That is the biggest issue anyone who is selling, you know, in the space of health today right now. Which means it's even more responsible on our shoulders that we do the right thing. You know, and consumers over a period of time, if they get to know through word of mouth or through their own experiences that here is a brand which I can trust, you know, with the information that they're giving with whatever promises that they're making, over a period of time you will have an incredible position. And if I may just also close, you know, something which, you know, was talking about on the challenges part. One of the challenges I feel, you know, because health as an outcome takes a lot of time. Time is, you know, the enemy in this. You know, unlike skin, hair, you know, wherein you have instant results almost, health takes a lot of time. And what happens when it comes to investment decisions? Because it is taking time, you may lose patience. And if you're not consistent, then you may think your campaign is not working, but it's just that it's just taking time. So what are the right metrics you have is extremely important versus just looking at sales. I think, thank you for sharing that, because, you know, what you really brought out was the importance of responsible marketing, especially in the domain that we are operating in health and wellness. And, you know, as a closing remark, you know, what I have taken away is that we are living in an era where healthcare is facing a lack of trust. And that is what your answer brought out, that as responsible marketers, it is our duty to rebuild that trust and look at compliance and regulation with a very different perspective. With that, I'd like to close this conversation. Thank you so much for taking our time to be here and sharing your knowledge with all of us. Thank you.