 Hello everybody. I welcome you today also and so to the master gardeners of San Mateo and San Francisco counties. So before I begin, oftentimes I get asked, well, what exactly are the master gardeners? So the master gardeners are a statewide program that is operated on a county basis. And we operate under the umbrella of the University of California. So we're trained by UC specialists who are involved in current research and education in their area of expertise. So as trained volunteers and representatives of UC, we provide UC research based gardening information to residents of our counties, whether they are home gardeners, such as yourselves, or members of community organizations. And there are no charge for our services, although donations are always appreciated. So let's see. I want to first start about with the advantages of container gardening. So some of the advantages and this actually is a picture of a big planter on my patio. And the reason I just I thought this workshop in San Francisco would be really good is that many people who live here don't have gardens, or if they do, like I do, I like to have container gardening on my patio. Or you might want to have some containers on your balcony, your back porch, your steps, wherever you can squeeze them in. And what container gardening does is it brings the plants up close and personal. So you could really see them as wherever you're sitting. And so here are some of the other advantages of container gardening. They're the portability, we can move containers, and we can move them if they plants need more sun, or more shade, we can move those containers. And that provides flexibility. And even with the seasons, the sun or shade can vary in your outdoor area or, you know, in winter, obviously there's less sun, and in summer, there's more sun. And then in spring and fall, you know, the equinox is an equal amount of light and day. And don't forget, folks, we turned back our clocks one hour tonight speaking of time changes. So we have flexibility. The other thing you could do with containers that's really quite dramatic is you can make grouping so you could bring a number of containers together to really make a statement like three or five, or depending on the size of your containers, maybe one is just the standout and you want that container to stand out by itself. And in this case, you can kind of see peeking through the leaves of my lemon tree, which is in a container, it's a dwarf lemon, and spilling over the sides because remember this is filler, is Calabrosia or a million bells. And, but behind the leaves of the lemon tree is a great pipe that I really don't find that attractive in my environment. So in this case, I'm screening picture was taken a couple of years ago. Now it's fully screened by my plantings. So you can hide some eyesores. And what are some of the challenges of container gardening? Well, some of the challenges are that if you're going to put a number of plants in the same pot, you want to make sure that they have the same needs for sun or shade, or water and feeding or fertilization. So another challenge can be people try to get in too many plants in the same container. So overcrowding. The other challenge is choosing the wrong size container. Many gardeners or novice gardeners are afraid of putting the wrong colors together. And, you know, that if you need more containers do need more frequent watering than plants planted in soil in your garden environment. And another challenge is that people face is that you want the container to have adequate drainage and not be sitting in its own water pool. So an answer to this is many people put blocks or bricks to elevate their containers slightly so that the water actually does run off and drain. So what are some of our typical containers? So some typical containers are one that's featured in this picture of terracotta or clay pots. And plastic pots. These are all pots, by the way, you can find at the nursery and there's there's even a couple of additional ones I don't have on this list. But terracotta, plastic, wooden, one of the disadvantages of sometimes cypress or cedar containers is that they're subject to dry rot over time, and they might disintegrate over time where you're replacing them more often. Stone or concrete containers are super heavy to move. We have baskets, which are more lightweight. There are fiberglass containers that are very, very lightweight and some are even made portable now with wheels on them. And we have metal containers. These can be subject to corrosion. So you need to monitor any metal metal metal containers closely. And then there's the paper pulp containers that you also see at the nursery. And one that's not here is that I've seen more people using are the bags that are hung from a fence or hung from a trellis. And I believe several of the San Francisco nurseries sells these green bags for doing herbs or plants in, and they're very portable and easy to move. So how do you choose your container? So we'll start with that, right? So consider the size of the container in relationship to the growth of the plant that you're picking to go in the container. So a normal good ratio or a scale to keep in mind is that the size of your container should be about we use a one to two ratio. So the size of your container should be one time, one times the height and the size of your thriller plant, which is going to be, we're going to get to that in a minute, is going to be your tallest plant in the container should be no more than two times the size of your container. And a one to one ratio is also considered very good. So a one to one ratio or a one to two ratio. And we talked about sizing that to scale. Does your container have adequate drainage? So the bigger the container, the more holes you may need at the bottom drainage holes for drainage. So an average six size, six inch size play pod at the nursery usually has just one drainage hole and that's adequate. But if you start moving into larger size containers, you're going to need sometimes two drainage holes to three drainage holes, depending on what size you're going to. And does your container have or lack ferocity. And that is like like clay clay pots breathe where plastic pots do not. So another thing to consider like black plastic pots tomato plants love them, because they capture and retain the heat from the area and sun that you're putting the plant. Other plants may not like that kind of environment. So factors affecting the choice your choice also include the mobility of the container. So do you need a plant Dolly. So in this instance, the plant is ceramic. And some containers as this one is, it's probably a bit heavy to begin with because it looks like it's at least, you know, 16 inches tall, and probably 12 to 14 inches at the biggest diameter. So once you put soil in there and get your plants in there, then that mobility factor, which is an advantage of container gardens may go to the wayside. So how do you counter this before you set up your, your Dolly plant caddies. They're also called in the area you want your contain to feature your container plant. And make sure that when you get the soil in there, you can move it easily, and then proceed to your actual planting of your selection. And just keeping in mind that wet plants are really heavy. So with watering and, you know, if you put these plants on drip irrigation, or whether you hand water, when the soil is wet, it weighs a lot more than dry soil. So tips for success. Now these include the master gardeners have the saying to plant the right plant in the right place. And so what do we mean by this. So it's to really know your site and your micro climate for your neighborhood. And if you've lived in an apartment, a house, a dwelling for a while, you come to observe, you know, where the sun hits, is it late afternoon sun, is it morning sun, is it sun six hours a day. And within our neighborhood of San Francisco, it can vary to fog and more fog and cold and wind out in the sunset district, or the Richmond district of San Francisco to over here in Noe Valley, or the mission district or the Patero Hill, where I live. Our micro climate is much sunnier. So begin to notice in your neighborhood if you haven't already. What is the micro climate and what's the specific micro climate of your deck or your balcony, or wherever you're going to put these containers. So that includes noticing sun or shade for how long. When does the wind come up, because a lot of sun and a lot of wind will demand extra water for your planting containers, because they dry the soil out. And where is your water availability. Do you have a hose or a water spigot nearby where you can easily fill a watering can to take care of your plants. Or again, of course there's drip irrigation there's also planters now that have water reservoirs at the bottom, and people tend to like these if they travel, or they go away for any extended periods of time. And then do you have unwanted creatures in your habitat in your garden or back back patio deck etc. Are there deer are their raccoons. We don't see too many rabbits here. Perhaps that's more common on in San Mateo County, but and we don't see too many deer here, but we get our fair share and more of raccoons. In fact raccoons are called the urban gorillas of San Francisco, because they are very, very adaptable and they hound a lot of San Francisco gardeners raccoons are known to dig up tulip bulbs. Another master gardener I know use the analogy that tulip bulb bulbs are like chocolate cake to a raccoon. And I've had my tulip bulbs dug up whether in containers or out in the garden side take measures now with creating these dome like environments to keep them out. We're seeing more squirrels around people in the name in my neighborhood and knowing value or commenting. There's definitely more squirrels raccoons in San Francisco. But if you live, I don't know where everyone's dialing in from out in the East Bay or San Mateo County, you may be hounded by deer that jump fences and rabbits. And then consider, as I mentioned before the weight of the containers and how that applies to your mobility. Why do you choose the right plant? Okay, so if we look at this slide on the left side of the plant, gardeners are usually most inclined to pick the plant on the far left, because it's really bushy, and it looks really full. And it does look healthy, right? So first of all, you want to pick a plant with no signs of pester disease. And you can always look on the underside of the leaves of a plant that you're considering purchasing at a nursery to see if you could see with the naked eye, or if you have a magnifying glass. Are there any signs of disease? And short of that, you can look at the leaves. And are there bite marks in the leaves? Are there, you know, are the tips of the leaves chewed up? You want to avoid those kind of plants, right? But really your best choice between these three options is to pick the plant in the middle. And that's because it has, although it doesn't look as full and robust as the one to the left, it has more buds on it. So what's going to happen is after you plant it, you'll get more flowers over time, where the one on the left is almost at peak flowering right now. And that may be after you get it in your container may already be losing its flowering ability in six weeks or so. Whereas the one with the buds is going to give you a lot of, a lot more enjoyment. Now for perennials. And so perennials are plants that are healthy year round, whereas you will hear the term annuals and perennials, where annuals usually last only a season or sometimes a year. But then they die back. Where perennials give you a lot more life from the plant. And sometimes they come back for several years. So for flowering perennials, you want many buds, not many flowers to enjoy the blossoms, as I said earlier for the whole season. And this rule does not apply to annuals like petunias, pansies, the things that come out that you're going to see in the nurseries in spring. So different set of guidelines for perennials and annuals. So for flowering containers. Sometimes what people have found is in terms of creating a successful container is to have a combination of perennials and annuals or feet. And annuals will give you that real touch of color and will bloom like crazy for a shorter period of time. And the perennials have oftentimes a colorful foliage. So in this picture, you could see that the grass here is the perennial. And that provides both, it's also the thriller in this application, having the most height. And that also provides texture, interest, color, many grasses, people think of grasses or carexes as only being green, but there are beautiful grasses, fountain grass, etc that can be used in containers and give this element of surprise. And that you won't have to be replacing often. And as I said earlier perennials can live more than a year. On average, some can go for two or three years. And there is this disclosure comment, although not always. Some people, depending again on your location and your care may find they have to replace their perennials more often than one year. So here we're talking about just very briefly, because entire workshops are devoted to color concept, the meaning of big city college had a botanical workshop on color theory that was one whole semester. But for just a quick, you know, people ask, well, gosh, what color should I pick for my container, you know, and then how does this go, you know, with the with the container I'm picking and the flowers and the in general working together in a cohesive way. So I think the main thing to draw your attention to is that generally you can pick colors that are either if you want harmony in the container, most people will probably not pick all three of the primary colors. But they may in this application on the very top row in the middle, pick colors that are analogous, like we have the yellow, and we have the light orange, and then the deep orange. So you could do this all across the color wheel to down below at the 6pm position under above you, you could pick a lighter violet, going to a deep purple, and those work well together. Another comment to me is that complementary colors that are opposite and that's on the color wheel. So in the color wheel we have the yellow at the 12 o'clock position and the purple at the 6 o'clock position. And those work very well together their opposite and their complimentary and then also split complimentary which is down on the bottom row in the middle will also work very well together, but to sum it all up. You could certainly if you're interested in color theory there's wonderful books that are out on the subject, but I also tell people, go with what your eye is drawn to. If you you could sometimes look around your house, and if there's certain colors that you like to use in decorating, right. That may be true for the colors that you would be drawn to, and are you and if you're decorating as old and you're tired of your colors, then that's something to look at. But in general, go to what attracts your eye. And that can change as we age and as we progress in time. The colors that you liked in your 20s, maybe aren't the same colors that you're drawn to in your 50s or 60s. So just stay tuned to that and go with your gut in terms of what colors would I really like to see in this container. And if you picked your pot first that you want, you could go around the nursery and try some of the four inch pots in that pot and see how is it working with the pot. You know, if it's a terracotta container, then maybe you want to soften that look with a light blue, or, you know, a green, get some green in there. There's just all kinds of possibilities, but go with what is pleasing to your eye. What is, let's get right into the meat of it here. What is the spiller thriller filler approach. So it's more to container gardening. So it is a principle I will share with you that designers use to create very outstanding and interesting container gardens. But it's not, it applies to us as everyday back garden gardeners, because if we use these concepts, we too can create these stunning lush containers. So what are the elements that we want to see in a spiller thriller filler? Well, one of the elements that I mentioned is height. So that your height in your container is your thriller. So that's going to be usually your tallest specimen. And that can be such plants as cortiline, colladium, there's a number of them. A palm, I've seen some people use palms. Again, this depends on your sun shade ornamental grasses. In this case, we're showing an ornamental grass. That is your thrill component. And your fill factor are the plants that you use. So the thriller thriller adds drama, right? And the filler is plants that you're using to fill in the planter and create, you know, a feeling of lushness in the planter. So the filler plants are really important and each one has a job to do. So they fill in, they bring cohesion and they bring beauty to the planter. And then to create movement in your planter, you want spillers. So in this case, this looks like creeping Jenny in this photograph. And if you see it, it's draping over the edge of the pot. It's spilling over the edge of the pot. So there you have the movement. It doesn't appear static. You look at this container and you see not only beauty, but movement and drama. And those are the factors you're trying to striving to bring to your arrangements. Now this takes a little practice and you may first start with a smaller container to try out the principles and see how you do. And actually this size container featured here would be like considered a medium size container. A smaller one might be like an eight to 10 inch pot and just experiment with it. Remember gardening is, it's part science and part art. So you won't know it's like an artist doing a painting. Somebody said this in a workshop I went to today, but we're painting with nature. So first experiment and try it out in a smaller pot and see what you like, what really resonates with you and see what you don't like, right? And that's how we learn and that's how we get better. So with time you'll be creating, you'll be able to create larger containers if that's what you want. So again, the filler plants packing this middle space with texture and color, the spiller adding movement and gracefulness to the planter and the thriller adding drama and vertical height. So here's some examples here. So thriller is an upright spiky plant. In this case, it looks like okra in the background. We have some petunias it looks like in the middle. And then this is Dusty Miller, which would be the drapey spiller plant draping over the edges. So in all three photos we're embodying these principles again. And I like to tell people, even if you look at flower arranging, right? That I took a flower arranging glass once for one semester. And I liked it, but and I learned a lot. And I realized there were principles from flower design that even apply to this container design because they use the same concepts of thriller filler spiller. In this picture to the far right, it looks like Polius is being used in this application as a spiller draping over the edge of the container. Now, what about, okay, so you have this pot, right? So we're going to use the example of a 12 inch pot. And you have this pot and so where do you put the thriller, the filler and the spiller. So in this case, the normally, and oftentimes I'm going to step back a moment and this isn't to make it complicated, but to be very clear that it depends on where you're going to be viewing this pot from. If you're looking at the pot head on, and you won't be seeing it from the sides, then your thriller can be placed in the back of the pot, where number two is. But if you're seeing the pot from all sides, you know, if you walk beyond it, if you're, if you're walkway up the stairs to your balcony or out to your deck, you're going to be seeing it from the side, the front and the back. Then the cardinal rule is you want number one, which is the thriller in the middle of your pot. Okay, and then in this case it's the yellow. This is a smaller pot and this is a perfect example of what I said to maybe experiment with. If you haven't done this before. In the beginning, this is perfect picture for this. In this case, they've used the yellow marguerite daisy, the angelonia in the miss blue and the shock wave denim petunia as the filler spiller. So the ruler in the middle. The blue angelonia, which is the spiller on the front and back and number three the shock wave denim petunia as it looks like here the spiller. So thriller one, two marguerite daisy thriller. Angelonia is your filler. And three is your spiller or the shock wave denim. So one, two and three. So when viewed from all sides, the thriller plant is placed in the middle of the pot. And then you then plant your spiller and your filler. And you want to make sure when you take those plants out of their four inch pot, that if they are root bound in any way. Or you can simply they have good roots, but they're all you could see them at the bottom of the pot, you want to gently loosen that soil to give your plants a good start. So here's an example of a pot with the grasses as your thriller planted in the middle. We have the creeping Jenny at your spiller going over to the side. And it looks like some pansies or petunias here acting as filler. And by the way, some plants can act as both a filler and a spiller. And many pansies and petunias when they grow, not only fill out a space, but can drape over the side. So one doesn't necessarily, they're not mutually exclusive is what I'm trying to say. And even with a small planter. You can use this concept. So this is a frog planter that has about a six inch opening. And this is actually my planter. I filled it with caliprosia, or a million bells, some geranium here, and, and verbena. So, you know, again, just experiment around and see what you can, what you like, what plants do you gravitate towards. The plants have sense, maybe sense are really important to you. So you want to their scented geraniums. And this one happens to be a scented geranium that's in this planter. So here's examples of lush containers, the one on the right using an evergreen type shrub. Let's go back. And you can use Ivy as a spiller. So many different combination just think about when you look at hanging baskets like what is spilling over, right. So this is this similar container, just planted up differently, but both convey this feeling of lush plantings. And this is my garden. So most of the photos in this presentation were taken either by myself or another master gardener who I acknowledge at the end of the presentation. And this is a, I put this in, because in this application, I'm doing I started my planter, and I just had string of pearls. That's a really another good spiller to have in a planter. And then I added the succulents. And in this case, you could see the succulent is the tallest thing in my Grecian head planter. And so that acts as my thriller. And I have forget me nots that just happened to reseed and plant in there as my filler and the string of pearls as my spiller. So planting. So what do we do to plant up a good container. Well, first of all, let's talk about what we don't do. So why don't we use garden soil. We don't use garden soil in containers because it may contain weeds, pests, or pathogens. And oftentimes garden soil, it's not nutritionally balanced. And it's very heavy. So that's going to make you may think you're saving money, and you are saving some money, but it's going to make your planters extremely heavy. So that's one of the principle three principle reasons we don't use garden soil. So we're not endorsing the master gardeners don't endorse any specific brand, or we just happen to have these photos. There's all kinds of potting soils that are stoned that are sold. Find the one that you like best and every major nursery in San Francisco, you know, we have slow, we have floor grub, we have full flower craft nursery. They all sell garden soils and they all sell a variety of garden soils, and many of them have samples out of their garden soil that you can actually put in your hand and feel. So you want a soil that has good drain engineer circulation. Many people prefer organic soil, because some of the organic soils have mycorrhizal fungi that are added to them. Some new versions of soils have water retention properties added. One thing you can do for your own containers is if you have a compost pile or container, it could even be a small one, you could add some compost to your container gardens to increase the water retention. And I'll talk about feeding the plants. So contain plants, you have to watch them a little bit more closely than you would with plants in the garden. And that is because they need more frequent watering and the more frequent watering and irrigation flushes the fertilizer out. So you will have to feed your plants to keep them looking robustly healthy and flowering and abundant. So organic fertilizers are the best for many reasons, including the salt buildup, which does affect your plant's ability to absorb nutrients like calcium. Organic often have microbes, as we mentioned, and it's less likely to encourage weak unhealthy growth. So there's many different all-purpose fertilizers on the market. And so what you look for and one thing that many people like to do and many master gardeners like to do is to add sure start with their first starting off their container gardening and you mix that into the soil. And that will buy you about six to eight weeks. So please follow the directions on the box when it says to mix in half a cup to a cubic foot or half a cubic foot of soil, look at your bag and how much does your potting soil contain in that bag, and follow the directions because you don't want to burn your plants. And adding too much fertilizer will do that. So there's different starter products out there. And again, we're not endorsing one particular product. But you want to look for something with a balanced, from that point on, after you give it a starter fertilizer with a balanced NPK. And the N stands for whatever you look at a fertilizer product, you'll see the three numbers on the liquid fertilizer or on the carton. And the first one is nitrogen, the N, and the P is phosphorus and the K is the symbol for potassium. So you want to look for a balanced NPK, something along the level of a 10, 10 and 10 would be fine. But, you know, you may find that even a five five and five, it just depends on how heavy your feeders are in your container. The one cardinal rule is no rocks on the bottom of your container. And why is that? Everyone feels like if they put rocks down there, that it's good for the drainage, but it actually is not good for your drainage. In fact, the finer potting soil will hold onto that moisture, moisture, rather than releasing it to the gravel. And then your roots will get soggy and unhappy, and then your plants are unhappy, and they're cheated out of their growing medium. So no rocks on the bottom. If you're concerned about water draining out too quickly from your pot, there's mesh screens that they sell in the nursery that you can place at the bottom of your pot to moderate that somewhat. And those are fine to use. They look like a fine screening material. So putting it all together. How do we put this all together now? It's a lot of information in a short period of time, but here are probably the best tips I could share with you. Water all your plants well. You're adding that starter fertilizer, mix half the fertilizer into the middle of your container, the middle of the container with the soil. When you take on the left hand picture, the plant has been taken out of the pot, and you could see there, this is what I was talking about earlier. You see those roots sort of around the side and the bottom, you want to gently loosen those roots just like it shows in the picture. And that means when you put it in your planting medium, your soil, those roots are already loose and they're going to start spreading out and making a home and burrowing down and getting rooted, and that's what you want. So you start in the center of the pot, like planting your thriller as we talked about, you make sure the root ball has good contact with the soil on all sides, and you definitely can then distribute your remaining fertilizer into the top one inch. So remember you put half in the middle, and then half as you're building up your planter with soil in the remaining one inch, and water well. Now what does that mean? I took a class on irrigation and watering, and the instructor there who was very well respected said whenever she planted, especially a larger, deeper container, she had to stand out there with a hose and water that container. You know if it's 18 inches taller, it's going to take a while for that water to drain out, but on a very slow, like beyond an ooze, but less than basically a steady, weak flow of water. She would have us water the container thoroughly when we were starting it to get the container, the water to drain out one time, and then we would do it again after it was all drained a second time, and then we would do it a third time. And that's only at the beginning, because remember this is all new soil, and you don't want to pump it hard with a forced flow of water, and you don't want to be there all day with your hose. So on this steady, light flow of water, we would do that, and it takes a little time, but you're getting your plants off to a good start with water. So that's what we mean by watering well in the beginning, and then watering well throughout also. And your plants sometimes will tell you, they will tell you if they need water. They'll start drooping or not acting happy. Another test you can do is use a water meter. Many people love those and they use those. You know, other gardeners use the index finger tip where you dive your index finger down into the dirt, and then you bring it up out of the dirt and the soil, and that you see by your first knuckle is any of that soil adhering to your finger. And if it is, and it feels kind of moist, you're okay. But if it isn't, and it comes up dry, the finger test very unscientific, but it comes in handy when you're out there, and you don't have a water meter, and you want to quick check. So this picture I took outside of anthropology and Walnut Creek. I don't normally go to Walnut Creek, but I was visiting a friend, and she was picking up something at anthropology. And these were the planters that they had outside their store door. So I like to throw out the question. And some of you can type in the chat addressing it to everyone. Now that we've discussed the principles of the pot size in relationship to the plant and what makes a successful container. And remember, there's no wrong ideas. So I'm throwing it out to all of you to enter into the chat. What do you think is wrong with this picture. And there are definitely some things wrong here. So take a stab at it, right in the chat, what you think. And by the way, we're taking questions at the end of the presentation. So if you have any questions that you have, you can also put in the chat. This was in Sofira Gardens in Sweden. And again, this was the Gardens of Royalty, the Swedish king and queen, and they have this crown symbol. I'm struck by it because again, you see the principles of filler thriller spiller with the verbina in coming up through the top of the crown as the thriller. Forget me not in the middle as the filler. And then again, the pansies and as being used as spiller in this context. It's a beautiful picture. Here's the same terracotta container. There's just so many choices, but it's the same basic, you know, trying true terracotta container planted with different filler spiller and thrillers just to give you an idea of three ways. And the other great thing about containers, by the way, as as the season progresses, especially if you put some annuals in there in spring. And now we're going into fall. You know, you, you can then take out maybe your thriller stays the same, and your IV is spiller stays the same, but you can pull those out and change them out and get a different look. So on the left is coleus as thriller, and you have begonia as the filler, and you have Ivy trailing Ivy as the spiller. You could also plant edible flowers in containers. We have calendula flowering sage, rose geranium, nasturtium. Many people and I myself put nasturtium and calendula petals in salads. So your tips for growing herbs in container is water, water, water, your soil dries out quickly. We talked about potting soil, caddies placing your containers on a trolley or caddy to follow the sun. I mean, a lot of plants, I mean, look, you're going to look at your labels if you have a shade environment, like coleuses do pretty well in the shade, there's plants that do well. Herbs are heavy feeders. So you would want a slow release organic fertilizer and harvest your, your flowers and plants and herbs often to keep them bushy and to retain the flavor in the leaves and harvest your older stems first and choose herbs of similar size for the same pot. So does size matter? In this case, you can see, and having a monoculture is what this pot embodies here, and those can be interesting too. So this, in this case, we have rosemary aficionalis planted in this bigger pot all by itself. But if you look at this, and if you take concepts of what we were talking about, you have the thriller aspect and that this is growing upright in the back of the photo. It's filling the pot and it's filling over, right? And it's a big pot because rosemaries have very sturdy, long reaching root systems. So this pot required that the rosemary, blooming rosemary be planted all by itself and keep your herbs cut back so one doesn't crowd out another. And if you are planting herbs or mixing in herbs with your remember that Mediterranean varieties like to be planted together. So our Mediterranean varieties are rosemary, oregano, sage, thyme, marjoram, and lavender, where moisture loving herbs also wanted to be. They prefer moisture in their soil. So if you start mixing basil with a rosemary or tarragon with a time, it's not going to work out successfully over time because one group requires more moisture than the other Mediterranean group. So just be aware, always reach your labels, how much sun, how much shade and plant those needing less water together and those leading more water together. So herbs that don't survive in pots. So those include all the members of the mint family. They're listed here. And also lemon ball. And why don't mints survive in pot, because they are spreading plants, they send out runners they grow sideways, and the constraint of the pot, no matter how big prevents them from spreading out. And those of you who have ever grown mint in a garden, realize you could plant it in one patch in a corner of a garden. And in no time at all, it sends out these runners and you have mint coming up like six, eight feet away. So don't plant those in pots. And then I encourage you to be creative. I mean there's a standard pots that we mentioned in the beginning all the different kinds. But look around and consider other pot post possibilities because almost anything can be a container. You can use lots of imagination. All you need is a cordless drill and provide a minimum of a half inch drainage hole. And you're set to go. So let me give you some examples. We'll go through these quickly because I do want to leave time for questions. So look in your garage. Be sure to provide that drainage hole and leave a two inch reservoir for water at the top of your container. We had old paint cans there. I thought those were quite artistic. Keeping on the painting thing theme, we have an old paint tray that's mounted on a fence, happened to love the rustic look of this. That's planted with succulents. It's pretty cool. You can look in your closet. This is a kind of cute, a bit girly, but creative garden party exhibit where old hats were taken. And as long as you put a liner in there with soil and you're able to water it and you never want to wear that hat again, then this is a great idea. Here we have an old kitchen bread box. We have some trash cans that were these, these were actually done by middle, a middle school and decorated. I think they're quite whimsical. But they're doing the job, right. Right. And they're, they're a conversation starter. This I saw at a home and garden show where a desk was taken with the drawers opened and a drainage hole provided and a plastic liner put inside each drawer. And they're overflowing in abundance with gorgeous plants. And then here's, I like this photo because it emphasizes the contrasting colors we were talking about before the purple pansies with the orange salmon colored calabrosia. You know, and then as your thriller, and this is the thriller filler, spiller concept, there's your, you know, your, your palladium plant in the back. Your container must be functional. So many people have used it again. This was a home and garden show rain gutters, downspouts, building flues, magazine racks, toolboxes, old tins in this case, with an old bathtub. All they had to do was leave the plug out for drainage. Right. And then if you need to divide any plants quick afterthought, remove the entire plant from your container. And then use a sharp gardening knife like the Hori Hori knife to divide it into sections. Here's some purses, again, lined with plastic drainage hole provided. This would be for obviously not the wet weather, a spring summer presentation. You have shoes, one of my master gardener friends actually got these shoes at Goodwill and dress them up with succulents. Sand can be done with boots, rubber boots I've seen used on the right, that looks like a pair of old work boots. Again, with that drill and drainage, you're good to go. Here's a sculpture that I actually made years ago. And you can see in this application I'm using it as a cashpo for the hydrangea, which is in bloom. Old pedestal sinks can be put to new use in a garden. And again, taking that plug out for drainage. And I just wanted to share with you some shots of my garden and in bloom. And my garden actually won a flowercraft gardening award. And I'm trying to think now it's 2015. And there's, I have to honor my kitty Silas. And you can see the nasturtiums growing and some calendula popping over. And he likes to kind of nestle right there by the nasturtiums. And then this is a photo that I took. I guess the point I'm trying to make here is appreciate, you know, the beauty that surrounds you. And a gardening instructor said to me once, if you're always working in your garden, and you never take time to really look and see it and enjoy it, then you're missing out on a really important part of life. And that concept from 30, 35 years ago has stayed with me all my life. So in bringing it home to this particular photo, I had a dragonfly that was on my, these are actually geraniums. But look, if you really look up close to that geranium in the background, it almost looks like it's hand painted. And the dragonfly was resting on the plant in a container that I had planted. And I just love this photo. It resonates with me because of that remembrance to take time and enjoy what you've created. So today I want to acknowledge San Francisco Public Libraries and the main libraries specifically for hosting the presentation. And the photographs were taken by either myself or Lauren Laurel Nagel is also a master garden gardener that are in this presentation. We have a great resources for you. Some of these have been circulating in the chat in the revolving chat. So we have a monthly newsletter full of power packed information you can subscribe to the website is here. It's also been circulating in the chat. We are always open to donations to our program. Here's a way to do that. And we have this wonderful resource right here in San Francisco. It's a botanical garden. It's our helpline and they're open Tuesdays from 1030 to 130. Or you can call the helpline. And that's been in the chat. And if you do, please provide all your important information for someone to get back to you. This is the first time for them to call. So this is a surface right that is free to any resident. So you've got a problem with let's say, you know, your citrus tree isn't doing well this year, or you've got certain bugs on your lemon tree. What is it? So you are able to send photos and questions and send good photos, or they'll ask you for them in helping these experienced master gardeners evaluate your particular issue and get back to you with recommendations. We also have a helpline in Elkis Ranch in Happen Bay, and one in the Veterans Memorial Senior Center in Redwood City. Those of you from the peninsula and their hours are listed, days and hours are listed here. And I just want to show this, I have a few little fans here in Noe Valley. And so I use the concept of this was, gosh, this was almost four and a half years ago and it was pre-pandemic, where if any of you ever go to the Noe Valley Town Square on 24th Street and look at their fiberglass, remember I said lightweight on wheels, movable and portable planters. Well, I designed those planters for the Noe Valley Town Square and they're still thriving. We've had to pull out just, I think maybe three plants and there's five planters and they're all in this big half moon shape. And so what's great is they do a farmers market there every Saturday. So the planters can all be moved to the side, right? So other events and concerts can happen there. And then when the event is over, they move them back into any configuration that they want for the town square. So it's a lovely, lovely addition. I feel grateful that I was able to donate to my community in that way. For my references today, I used Pam Pierce Golden Gate Gardening. And I also use another Pam Pierce book, which is not listed, called Widely Successful Plants for Northern California. And I used our Master Gardener Handbook and we have our website listed here for resources for all of you. And that concludes, I'm going to go back and leave the helpline information up for just a couple more minutes. But that concludes my program today. And now I first wanted to start with, if anybody put in the chat room, what was? Ariti, we do have, this is Marcia, we do have a number of questions for you. But before I get into that, I also just want to share that you're getting a lot of thank yous and great information. And there's a lot in the chat. Hopefully you'll have a chance to look at that. Fantastic. Thank you, Marcia. So first, one of our questions goes to the slide that you had about arranging your planter with the thriller filler and spiller. How would you arrange, what plant arrangement would you recommend if you're only going to view the planter from two sides? How would you modify that arrangement? But I was only going to view the planter from two sides rather than just straightforward. I would do the arrangement to be, I would put the, I still put the thriller in the middle. I would put the thriller in the middle and the spiller and filler around it. So the only time you put the thriller in the back and change that arrangement is when you're only viewing the planter from the front. Okay, great. A question about orchids. Now you didn't talk specifically about orchids, but what fertilizer do I need for orchids was one of the questions. Okay, so they sell, I just went to an orchid workshop that another one of our master gardeners gave. Okay, they sell a specific orchid fertilizer. They're usually liquid. And all the nurseries that I previously mentioned, and there's probably more in San Francisco sell that. So I would go in and ask for an orchid fertilizer because they have a different NPK rating than the fertilizers I was talking about today. Okay. Now we had two questions about poinsettias. So everyone must have invested in poinsettias over the holidays. One question is, do you have any tips about caring for a poinsettia that's in a pot? And just to follow that up. Do you, do you recommend transplanting the poinsettia? Maybe you shouldn't transplant it. Is there an issue about, you know, this poinsettia only has three red leaves left. So when would you transplant if you did? How would you care for it? Well, I wouldn't transplant it. Number one, I would not. And poinsettias are definitely, this is the time in fact started probably in February that they start dropping their leaves. So the key, I only have one point set of myself ever come back. And I followed all the instructions. So don't use my experience. As I said, this is a living laboratory. Try it yourself. But it is to keep that point set in a kind of a protected place. Let it drop its leaves. So I found this little corner off my patio that's protected from the wind. And I put it over there and you kind of let it go dormant. And then before it blooms again, you're supposed to bring it into a dark place like a basement or garage. And again, I'm no poinsettia expert, but and then if all is well, you bring it out when it starts to leaf out again. So, but please, I would say for, I would as I'm walking through this and because I haven't had success, I would strongly encourage you to call our helpline. And I have that number up on the screen right now to call or email our helpline and ask if what they recommend. Thank you. Thanks. All right, so this question goes back to drainage holes. And you had some just great examples of different kinds of containers that creative uses of different kinds of containers and, and I could see putting drainage holes with the drill in metal, or some of the other kinds of things you had but this question is about what if your pot, I assume this is ceramic or clay doesn't have a drainage hole in the bottom. Have you do you have any tips for putting drainage holes in ceramic or clay pots. Yes, I do. And this is an experience that was hard learned on my part. So, the next time I went, so I did not have success, I ended up cracking the pot. And that's the risk you take so the kind of pot I think the questioner probably has is actually considered a cash flow, or when there's no drainage hole. So it's meant to contain another pot that goes within that pot. And it's used for decorative purposes. But when I did ask and so this is, I asked my contractor, I said, look, I tried drilling this hole in a ceramic pot and I ended up breaking it using the wrong size bit. What would you recommend. And he turned to me and he said what I'd recommend is don't try it in the first place, or you'll lose your pot ceramic is just too fragile. So, use that pot for what it was intended being a decorative pot that another pot sits within and maybe when you water that pot that sits within you take it to your sink and water it and let it drain. But it's really not recommended. Unless you want to take the risk again it's a laboratory. And he said, you know, you could end up breaking your drill bit to and drill bits aren't cheap. So consider all that before you try it yourself. Okay, great. Do you have any tips for growing basil in containers. The writer says I keep trying and they get woody and the leaves wilt. What would you do. What would I do. Hmm. Well I'd look at the location that you have the basil. Is it getting enough sun basils do like more water. So always look at your conditions. First, like what is the exposure. What shade is it getting enough sun and I base and what about water the water needs of the plants. So, and, you know, realize that you're not alone it's not the first time I've heard this question. A lot of people you know the basils look so good when you go into Whole Foods, you know and they're selling them in the containers. There's an assumption that these are really easy to grow over time and you're not alone because oftentimes I've heard other people report that over time. It gets woody and are you wait a minute. One last thing. Are you pinching that basil back because a plant gets really woody and starts, you know, overstraps, you know, growing too much when it's not being pinched back. So are you using the basil. Are you pinching it back. So I'd say look at those three conditions first. And sometimes we just have to realize as gardeners and this isn't being pessimistic or negative. But there's certain plants we just do better with than others in terms of routine care and it's how much. We have to evaluate this as we go along. How much time and attention. Do I really have for this one particular plant or is there elsewhere I can be diverting my energies. To say not to give up on the basil. Try the other things the exposure, the water, the pinching back. And if you still continue to not have success, then I always say your plants are not your children. You can let go of them. And so take that. And I'm not saying that I take that for what it's intended that it's okay to say bye bye to certain plants. Right. Okay. Here's a question. What spiller and filler. Would you plant with an older existing Norfolk pine. Well that depends on how big that pine is. What size container it's in. There's a lot of variables here. Right. So is the, I would ask the questionnaire to ask, is the Norfolk pine already in a container. What's the size of that container. But for water needs and how much water. Are you giving that Norfolk pine now. And then I would look at those water needs and transport them over to, you know, am I watering this plant just once a week. Twice a week that I need to put some other plants remember we said group plants together that have similar water needs and similar sun shade requirements. Right. And then to be aware of the wind. So, I think that's a good place to start for the questionnaire to address that. Okay, great. Thank you. So here's a question about, you know, sort of getting to your creative use of different kinds of containers. Yes. How do you recommend preparing an old tree stump, or do you recommend preparing an old tree stump as a place for plants, and for growing out of the tree stump and maybe spilling over the top. Are there any recommendations for preparation for that. That's a good one. No, I don't have any personal experience with that myself. I'd say just off the top of my head. Experiment. I mean, for the first thing I think I'd want to do is to get a hose and put water in that tree stump. And is it is the water draining. If the water isn't draining, and it's pooling in that tree stump, then that would not be a good environment for other container plants. So that's the first thing, the water test, right. And I think that would be where I would start in terms of what you would plant, let's say it is draining well, and you are able to put soil in it, and then I would evaluate your son or shade. And if it's a shady environment, if it's around other trees, you might want to plant more shade loving plants, like coleus, impatience, right, those are good combinations for shade. And, you know, you can certainly do a Google search for other shade loving plants, but first do the water test. And the one thing I didn't say about containers is if you're using containers from year to year, and let's say they've sat dormant over the winter. And now now it's spring. And you want to use you like these containers. And of course we want to reuse and repurpose right. And then you want to reuse them again. The one thing that's recommended is that you scrub this could even be a play container. It could be a metal one that you've used you want to make sure that you say on the metal one so there's no corrosion in there, but for a regular container, you want to scrub it out with soap and water and get rid of sometimes bubbles accumulate on the edge of the container. And then another recommendation is that you then soak your pots. Some people recommend an old sink or a wheelbarrow with a solution of 10% bleach to one part bleach to nine parts water. Let those pots soak for 10 minutes. And that's so you don't carry over any any infections whether they be fungus in origin or that were maybe remaining from previous plants that were in that container. It's just kind of a good hygienic appropriate way to get a clean start in the spring with reusing your containers. Right. Thank you. And Eredi, I think this might be our last question. I don't see any more questions in the chat. And we're at 324. Okay, right. This is a question actually about indoor gardening indoor plants. What type of container is best for growing strawberries on the kitchen counter near the window strawberries inside. Well, if I were to start that, I would probably start with a plastic pot and or pots, depending on how many and your window exposure should be sunny. I'm not sure what your success rate would be. And, you know, again, this is a question you might turn over to the helpline. I've grown strawberries outside. I've never attempted them inside. Your success rate might be growing them inside. But the one good thing about your plastic containers is they're going to be more lightweight. And if you do need to move them to an outdoor environment or bring them outside to a ledge or maybe you don't have an outdoors. Or if you're growing them inside, then you might want to donate them to a friend who does have an outdoor environment for them. But I would, again, the lab experiment approach, try it and see what works and good luck. Good luck. I'd love to hear, you know, and for any additional information, you can certainly contact our helpline on that. Have you, Masha, heard anything about growing strawberries inside? No, I haven't. I was almost going to recommend starting with something that might work better in, you know, some herbs might work better. That herbs would definitely be. People grow herbs. That's a good pointer, Masha. They definitely grow herbs on the windowsill. And, you know, things like, oh, gosh, you know, you could try with start out with some easy growing herbs, like, you know, an oregano in a container. I've also grown mentis, again, too big a root system. Gosh, I'm thinking of it now. Dill is a bit fragile of an herb, so they sometimes like the protected environment of being on a windowsill. Can you think of any others, Masha? I was thinking thyme or rosemary. Thyme or rosemary. Again, the Mediterranean family are your hearty ones, yeah. And just before we close, I'm just curious, did anyone put in the chat what they thought was wrong with the picture of anthropology? Yeah, we got some good comments about how there wasn't any color. There were no spillers and fillers. The planners looked dull. And just not overall, you know, small tree, too large. Exactly. Exactly. The dimension was off. Those are all good responses. Yeah.