 Welcome to the very first episode of 420 grams coming to you, absolutely live, we're covering a breaking story, a developing story, FC Goa, if you follow Indian football, FC Goa, the current table leaders in the Indian Super League have sacked their head coach, Sergio Lubera. We're going to figure out who Sergio Lubera was, what the trouble was, why at this crucial juncture did the club make this decision, and what's going to happen next. And of course with all the juice, as always, is this handsome young lad. Brother, let me tell you first before we get into the juice. Yes. Since so many years, in the confines of the studio, I was a little lazy. Okay. From the last two to three days, whether it was the transfer of Bala Devi, we made contacts with people there, we've been working for so many years. Okay. Even today we've called, we've called a lot, I've called in the morning, I'm asking what's going on, what's not going on, it's satisfaction, and because on Instagram, there are a lot of young boys, we keep asking, brother, we want to get into this, how do we get into this field? Shoot the studio, first go to the field, make a name, make a name, give a little trust factor, and after that, the satisfaction, the story that comes out, it's a different kind of fun. Okay. Yes. In this time, when the people are awake, good things are happening, you too, you have a journalist awake. Yeah. I can do a turnaround straight away, don't worry. No, but are you going to share the secret behind this turnaround or not? No. Chiching. Okay. There's something else also that you have to do to get to this stage, which we'll talk about separately. Coming to Sergio Lobera. Yeah. So basically, when did basically trouble start, what's the scene man? So trouble apparently started brewing somewhere around October last season. Now, Lobera was in his third season as head coach of FC Goa. Contract was up for renewal at the end of the season, which means the three-year contract was up for renewal. Right. Conversations, of course, began with the management, which is pretty obvious in world football. If your contract is up at the end of April, April-May, maybe that's when your season comes to an end, you'll start talking six months in advance and contract negotiations go up through our time. Absolutely. So October will... Also because I think, six months later, free agent type, right? Yeah. So then I'm back up, right? Yeah. Negotiation point of view, say, and even for the club, if someone wants to steal your manager, let's say, poach your manager, then you're not up for any compensation in exchange for that. Exactly. So yeah. Yeah, from both sides. Both sides. And generally, that's when, of course, five months before the contract was up for renewal, you start having conversations. Oh, yeah. And so when Mr. Lobera, of course, went to the management, the management told him that, look, we do not want to have any discussions right now because out of fear that it might impact the season. And this has seen world over as well, that sometimes if your contract negotiations are not going well, and you know, somewhere down the line, they're not going on, you realize, look, I don't think I'm going to be continuing with the club. It can seep into your management style. It can seep into... And the players get a sniff of that. Players get to know about it quickly. Right? So he said, we won't talk. And Lobera said, look, we need to start talking right now. And eventually they didn't talk. And as the months went by, Lobera said, look, since you guys are not coming to me, is it okay if I start looking outside? Because I need to secure my future as well here. Months are going on. Now January's month has come. Before that, I think they must have talked about this, that can I talk outside or not. So apparently the club then, from then on, sort of developed a lens on Lobera as to there was a certain amount of disinterest in his styles of working. And that was seeping into his sessions. That was seeping into his preparations. And they kind of got a sense that it was impacting the players. Because eventually what happened and why this red button has been pressed of red alert button which they have taken here, it's because a large number of the senior players have gone to the management and said, we don't think this is working out. Something needs to change because something is not going right right now. Wow. See, when the player, see, what can you do in the end from a management point of view? If you have players, then you have to take notice of the fact, right? If you're losing your dressing room, apparently, that is what everyone has said, he lost the dressing room. But like from the story that you're telling, it seems to me that the whole thing of losing the dressing room started or the disinterest or whatever it is. And we can see that the two wins in the last three games, they've won two and lost one. Yeah. Two almost comebacks where Kerala and Odisha managed to almost get back in the game. Yeah, they came back. Yeah, yeah. We'll talk more about that later. And then the loss to ATK. So results also display some of that, I guess, that things weren't working as they should work. Yeah. But it doesn't, don't you think it starts from the fact that the organization is not keen to hold on to the coach? Possibly. And then obviously he's thinking about what next, I don't know where my next job will come from. And if something is going on there, then what is the setup, what are the scenes, who are the players, then your already focus is on the next thing. It's a bit of a divert, right? Yeah. So in this situation, I think miscalculation is not there. Why miscalculation? I mean, we're sitting here in Delhi in the studio and talking, and no matter what we can do, but we have to go a bit deeper to understand exactly what has happened. Now unless the club comes out, or Lubehra comes out, and then you have mud being thrown at each other, saying that this is exactly what happened, that is exactly what happened, which has happened world over. You've seen managers come out, hold press conferences, or you've seen team management come out and do the same, till then no one will really know what's going to happen. Yeah, and I guess till the both sides don't tell the story, then nothing will change. But if you, why am I saying this, what am I saying, if I have called X number and people, then among the X numbers, 60-70% have all corroborated to the same story, saying that he lost the dressing room, saying that the players went to the management. You remember like our first podcast that we ever did of 420 grams was on a certain Nikolai Adam, right? What happened then? The coach was doing really well with the under 17 World Cup team. They did a good Goa Mejo tournament, gave a good display of themselves, right? Suddenly the players were unhappy, no one knew about what was happening, unless you were part of that close net survey. They went up to the management or the AFF, and then they had to take action. That's it, sure. I mean it's similar. That's a very different case man, there two allegations of all kinds of, all sorts were there, and also there are juveniles involved, right? Fair enough. But brother, if you are from the senior, from your playing 11, there are 8 boys coming to the management. No, I understand the players that if the coach, for whatever reason, whether personal, professional, contract, any other reason, if the coach has lost interest, then it will show in the training sessions, and it will show in the tactics. And then also players also start thinking who will come next. Because the players get to know everything. Of course they do. They are having these conversations behind closed doors. But I mean, at the end of the day, it's a small, yeah, it's a small net group. It's a small net group. And people are always talking. 100%. You put a bunch of men together, I mean if they don't gossip, what else will they do? Yeah, you brought out the tactics part, huh? Now this of course got the management thinking as well, that when you prepare for the season ahead, sometimes when you're talking about someone, you say good, bad, okay? What is working? What is working? As far as what was not working, the management feels that for the last three years, they haven't seen much change in the team. Now while you have to give full credit to Loverra, bro, he's brought out an ethos, a playing style, which we never thought someone in Indian football could execute. And they've been consistently doing it for the last three years, which is the way they're holding on to the ball, which is the way they use that extra man in midfield that goes to defense, or the extra man from midfield that comes into the middle, they're always creating that extra man for those 1v1 passes and moving the ball around, right? No other team in Indian football does that, not even Bengaluru FC. So they have their own unique identity, which is I feel even tougher than going and winning a championship, because with that, you get a perfect connection. The first time I saw them, I was covering ISL in Chinnai, which is your stadium, I forgot the name, Marina, something Marina, Marina Arena, right? I saw them playing there, full back, which was your stamp there, I forgot Players must have been really close, but you could make out the coaches given them the directive, no matter how close you are, you don't have to hit the ball long, you have to find your own player, you have to find a small player, you have to pass a small pass, no matter what the scene is, you could make a mistake. They made a few mistakes in that game, so that ethos and the identity he's given to the club, no one can take it away from him, but for some reason the club thought that the car would not grow ahead, because apparently... You could have extended it for 6 months, no, because the fact is, you are now a table leader, okay? So the Champions League spot has also arrived, now. If you win the league, you get a Champions League spot, that is the real thing now. So then, if you are saying that you are a top coach and you have done what you are doing, and apparently he was on a salary of close to 1.5 to 2 CR a year, right? We should make him the highest paid... I don't know, I am not too sure. No, as in, let's say we guesstimate. Guesstimate, reports. Reports are not an average assessment, our players are getting more than that much. Are there too many? Or it would be around the top? Foreign players, so I have heard Roy Krishna is getting 3-3.5 of bordering 4, I might be wrong, I am just saying that bracket of 3-4. We should have been footballers, God gave us some talent, and some of us would have given us our legs, if we didn't have injuries, we would have said that. But going back to it, so if he was apparently on that kind of money, 1-1.5, which if you compare to world football is not much, but if you compare it to Indian football, it's a lot of money. 15,000 to 20,000 USD a month, somewhere in between that, right? So clearly in negotiations, he must be asking for more, he must be saying give me 3-3.5-4, which meant that the club then has to think, is it worth it? For someone you are paying that much, how much do you have to show for it? You have 1 Super Cup, 1-2-3. Beyond that, there are chances that you might not even stay on top of the league, because they feel that there is a little bit of a derail here in the campaign. If you want to stay on top, then you need someone who is constantly on you, right? So I think that is one of the reasons where they sort of then said, okay, maybe it's time to pull the plug as far as Llobera is concerned. So what happens next with FC Gordhan, who takes over at this point? What's the plan ahead? And how much of an impact do you think it will have on them for the rest of the season? I think as far as who takes over now, no official statement as we speak right now has come from the club, right? This news broke late last night. Late last night, if it broke, which means it must have happened somewhere last evening. Then he might have trickled a little and come into that space. So till now, no decision has come out. Currently, as we speak. But I think you have a certain Derek Pereira there, man. He is head coach of your under-23 team, a much respected figure in Indian football. I think the obvious looks like it will go to Derek Pereira for the end of the season. Because your style of play, it is so unique, that you constantly pluck someone from outside saying, let's change it completely, because he has played all the games. But you know Derek very well, he is not that kind of coach. But Derek has been in the system for the last two years with FC Gordhan. With the reserve squad and we don't really... No, no, he has been with the senior team as well. So the thing is, Derek has been there, shadowing what Lubera is doing. Which doesn't mean that necessarily he will play the same way, especially if he thinks that... If he thinks you need to change something. I mean, if we are saying that the club wants to change something, management wants to change something, then whatever will be new, in his mind, it will be that I have to do something different. This time of the season, I don't think you'll do it, because the thing with his club is, the players who brought all the foreign players, they were all very unique to his system. Ball playing foreigners. Right? Now you will come to him and as a coach you will say, I have to change this, you are a fullback. Jahu, you become a stopper back. It won't happen. You will still want to play in that sort of a way. So, in a sense... I mean, you don't have a choice. You don't have a choice, you don't have a choice. You can do it from next season. Next season you can do it. Fair enough. So, basically, then the guy who is getting shafted is Derek in all this. I don't know. Because he gets like a setup that he hasn't necessarily prepared. He has to play the same way. And he is coming in at a situation where they are topping the table. So, on the one hand, if he... I don't know, of course... If they top the table then? This is all speculation. But if it will be crazy if he goes on and they win the ISL title, he will be the first Indian coach to win it. This is a very long talk. Because today, East Bengal has announced his new coach. He is another foreigner. So, will we do another life after this? Sir, life... I am saying honestly, I am speaking that our Indian coaches and I mean with all respect for all of them, have they been hidden in a cave? Have they been buried somewhere? That means, whatever you see, they are being brought in by foreign players and foreign coaches. But isn't this a rule? What is the rule in this? It is the rule of the license. They are playing in the I-League right now. What is the rule in that? There is no rule in that. Derek is an AFF A-license holder, man. Of course, yeah. So, I mean... And I think that rule has been laxed. No, no, wait, not A. I am pretty sure... Pro, pro-license. He is a pro-license holder, sorry. So, others are good pro-license holders. Yeah, along with Savyo, who is a pro-license holder as well. So, my point is that... I feel like our good friend, Nnedi Singh, also might be a pro-license holder. A-license to their several. Look, we don't judge us on facts. No, but yeah... We talk with our hearts. So, we sometimes have some facts here and there. If you get them, let us know in the comments. But... Nnedi, sorry, I forgot. But, I think... Because... I don't know... Do we have to talk about East Bengal Mohan Mughan? Can we talk about that? No, but... Who is going to be in that game? That too, at this stage, when no one knows what is going on. I... So, Indian coaches, if they go to Gofa and hide in that context, then they should be hiding good things from them. No, sir, it's a bad thing. You mean, the top talent of your country here, that is being managed by foreigners? Yeah. Indian talent. Yeah, yeah. I'm talking about Indian talent. No, I agree. Indian talent is being managed by foreigners. I absolutely agree with that. So, where do you have to be connected to? If you have to go ahead and choose an Indian coach for the national team, which should be the way forward, when will you choose? Because there is no relationship. So, they will say, I'm going to be a 22-year-old basketball player here. You suddenly brought this Indian coach. Why would I do that? There will be no respect. There will be respect only when he becomes my head coach. He will beat us for a year. He will beat us. He will say, run. Do this, do that. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. So, but... More than any of that, if he's the guy who decides whether you play or not. Exactly. Exactly, man. I mean, whatever the management style might be, right? Yeah. I completely agree, man. On the one hand, we talk about how much coach education is going on. How many coaches are being formed. How many people are being certified. They are being licensed. They are going here, they are going there. We have so many technical tie-ups right now because our technical director and the head coach of the national team and the men's team at the moment, EGOS team are from Croatia today. So, in terms of signing, deals, at least memorandums, were signed between the FAs of the All India Football Federation and the Croatian FA. To exchange coaches. And then you've seen another coach come in. Facts. We don't specialize in facts. Sorry. Yeah, so, and the German Football Association was dealt with. So, all of this is going on. But then, on the other hand, when you are in locally domestic, in clubs, in your tournaments, you are not getting the opportunity to give opportunities to Indian coaches. I don't know why, I'm not getting it. Bro, even I'm not getting into it. I'm just saying, let's, if we get back to Lovera, and we were saying what signs were being shown on the field. Right, results, nothing is a bigger indicator than results. At least from a management point of view. That no matter how much you fight, I think there was also a fight going on. They wanted to sign another foreigner. A seventh foreigner. Right. Apparently the management was, you know, they were not, they were not coming to, So it's seeming to me like, this is just a matter of budgets. No, bro, this is not a matter of budgets. This is that also, the management apparently, they feel, because, see, what are the things exactly? This is not it, but they feel that they have a good enough squad to do well without the coach also. They are playing for themselves. No, I mean, someone else will come, but the squad is good enough. So I think that is my point. That is why they want to put Derek there. We have someone of that standing. Sure. Waiting in the wings. And he's seen the way you work for the last two years. He knows the players. It's not like they've brought in too many changes in their playing 11s. It's been pretty much the same players, as far as the foreigners are also concerned. One, two, Indian players are mostly your boys, and foreigners are working for you for two years. So they all know how to operate in that system. Now you talk about the system as well. Three games in particular, Kerala, Odisha and Chennai. Versus Kerala, 26th minute, 45th minute, they took the lead. 2-0. Game should have been dead and buried. 53rd, 69th, they came back into the game. So then 83rd minute, they scored a winner, and they won that game 3-2. So a lot of the players felt that they were playing in that similar way of always moving forward, always moving forward, not knowing how to shut shop. Shut shop is also a way in football. Same thing in Odisha as well. 21st, 24th, 26th minute, you've taken the lead. Game is over, bro. In the 26th minute, you've scored 3-0. After that, what was the name of the striker who pulled out for the rest of the season, the main striker, you've given him the lead. You've given him the lead. Then they've come back, 59th, 65th minute, 3-2. In the 90th minute, 4-2 has finished the game. But nervous moments nonetheless. Game against Chennai as well. 26th, 41st, 45th minute, 3-0, sir. Game over over there. 51st, 59th minute, they've come back. 63rd minute, they've scored a 4th. 90 plus 1, Chennai has scored a 3rd. So clearly, there's a trend, bro, of shutting shop. You can't see it. I'm not a management person here. I want to say this clearly. But the result, if you show it to anyone who watches football, then you'll say, they don't know how to shut shop. You can see it. You've lost 80-2-0. But that's what, I think, certainly or not so certainly, that's what the league is asking for, right? Hit the goal. Hit the goal. Like in IPL, there's a counter of 6, in ISL, there's a counter of goals, right? So, and goals do make games. I mean, there's no doubt, however you do it, you might not enjoy the style. Fair enough. Especially to a market, which is not very evolved. Yeah, like a 6-goal game, it's like a bonus. Like, if you, compared to one nail to the Arsenal, sometimes even a nail is a beautiful game to go on. No, of course. You need to understand the game. But that's what I'm saying. It's not evolved, right? Yes. In that matter. So, that is another large topic. Life will go on for the whole day here. And today is the day of the budget. And we thought to give you a little break, that's why we came in the middle. Yes. So, this is the main topic. This is the topic. So, while going, if I ask you this, because I've talked too much here. No, of course. What's the legacy of Lubehra? If there is a legacy. I think, when you talk about Lubehra and Indian football, I think he deserves a chapter. If not a chapter, a mention for sure. Just purely for the way he's made his team play for the last, now two-and-a-half seasons because he's cut the leaves on two-and-a-half. The style of football, I don't think we ever imagined that an Indian team can play the Spanish style of football which is to keep possession, hold the ball, technically making players better. Yeah. If you talk to some of the coaches, some of the Indian coaches, I think the perspective might be that there's a reason why Indian teams don't play that way. Yeah. If you're talking about evolution, then evolution isn't just about the audience or the fans. It's also about the players, the coaches, the whole ecosystem is evolving. So, I think many Indian coaches might believe that it's preferable to get some basics right, to understand how you're spreading the ball, what your positioning is, get some basics in place and do that for a time. Because also, how it translates at a wider level into the national team, that's also vitally important. If FC Goa today has built up itself into one of the most followed clubs in India and we can say that definitely. Yeah, definitely. In terms of not just pure numbers because Kerala, people are like devoted to the sport like nowhere else so their numbers are just, you can't match. But they've managed to bring all, I think, achieve in Goa what ATK has not been able to do at all in terms of, right? So in that context, some of their players, and you see that there are national team players in the Goa squad, right? So, what is the mentality that they bring then when they come to the national team? How do they fit into Ego's team as a system, which is not going to be necessarily, most of the time, the same, you know? Though he is trying. So, of course, he'll try because it's the same, the pressure comes from the fans that, what are you doing in Afghanistan? What are you doing in Bangladesh? What are you doing? So, the same, I mean, it's a difficult thing, man. It's enjoyable to watch. Definitely. Definitely. Yeah. And it's given us a lot of goals. So, what's the legacy? I mean, these are all fledgling clubs, kids, small clubs, new clubs, old clubs, whatever we say, end of the day, first 10 years, if you write something in the chapter, their name will definitely be there. Absolutely. Absolutely. But you have to remember one thing, that their style of play, if you come back to normal, foreign rule, 3 plus 1, that won't work. How does it work? Yeah. Because your style of play is predominantly working around the strengths of your partners. Yeah. And then you've got a couple of good Indian players who are also supporting actors. Yeah. Right? Absolutely. But nonetheless, it was a clear identity, where we are still in a phase where majority of the clubs don't have any identity because you're changing players, your coach is changing. So, there's no identity. Absolutely. According to me, rather than winning titles to build an identity, to build an Aethos, and for that, to seep into the viewer, that is your biggest achievement. Hands down. So this is why, maybe one of the reasons why fans have rallied around this club. Absolutely. And you go, you step in, the minute you almost literally land at Goa airport, you see these colours. Yeah. Right? Yeah. The first round will be okay. Okay. So there's some breaking news happening, so we're going to wrap this up right now. We'll do a follow up with FC Goa player and maybe some fans. But for now, there's been a shoot out somewhere in Delhi or a shooting somewhere in, at Shaheen Bagh, guns have been fired. We're going to switch in a couple of minutes to a different anchor and get you that breaking story. Thanks for watching this for now.