 Hello, and welcome to NEMO's webinar, Museums in 2020 Plus, The Search for Meaning. My name is Elizabeth, and I work for NEMO. As the network for museums in Europe, our main activities are advocating for museums at the EU level, providing training opportunities, providing a platform for museums to exchange and learn from each other, and helping museums to cooperate across borders. NEMO has increased its online engagement, which includes webinars such as this one with the hope that participants can continue their professional development from a distance. We are looking forward to today's webinar, facilitated by Ece Ozil. Ece is the founder of Junior, a hyper-specialized design consultancy and service of innovation for the culture sector. Junior's mission is to improve, strengthen, and transform people's engagements with cultural institutions, while optimizing the business of cultural endeavors. Ece has an interdisciplinary background advocating for a user-centric approach to the culture sector. In this webinar, Ece will share eight museum trends and related design methods to rethink the new kind of audience and physical context museums have found themselves in, and help museum professionals reflect on a meaningful future for their museums. Towards the end of the webinar, please submit your questions in the Q&A round using the chat function. A recording and the slides will be made available after the presentation. So without further ado, I will hand this over to Ece to get us started. Thank you, Elisabeth. Thank you so much. And first of all, it's really great to be with you today. I guess we are all connected from our homes probably. I do hope that you will have a warm cup of coffee or tea to enjoy the conversation today. It's actually pretty sunny today in Milan, so it's already positive, I guess. Some of you may have already participated or watched that Nimo has been running these webinars over some quite time now. And I recently reached a couple of the webinars and I see the Lisa's one and Olaf's one and Sandra's one. I think what I will be presenting today will be complementary to all these conversations. And I really think that honestly, it's a great opportunity to hear what is happening all around the culture sector across Europe. And I'm very happy to be part of it. So what I'm gonna share with you today and talk with you today is actually around these three macro areas. So I will be talking a little bit about design, little bit about the challenges that we have been noticing around museums on the museum's topic. And like Elisabeth already said, I will be talking about also some museum trends. This is to say that I will be sorry for a second. Yes. Something has activated on my screen, sorry for that. So as I was saying, so what I will be talking about today will be actually on the intersection of museums, design, digital transformation and audiences. Elisabeth already gave some introduction of actually what I do. So I'm the founder of a hyper-specialized design studio here in Milan, born specifically for the cultural sector. It's a pretty new activity in comparison to maybe some of the other stuff. I've been running junior with a couple of colleagues and collaborators since 2017. Well, basically what we do in our day-to-day practice is to be what I generally call critical friend of cultural organizations we are working with. And what we do is generally to accompany them through their innovation and transformation journey. We do this sometimes with long-term engagements, long-term projects and sometimes with short design actions and workshops like short-term engagements. I really would like to highlight that we do that through design because it's important for me to say that we hold design at the core of our work and methodology and wherever we can join a conversation around that topic, the impact of design to other sectors, especially in the cultural sector, we are happy to be joining a conversation such as today. So one of the things that I personally have been reflecting over the past couple of years has been actually around the word design, no surprise, right? We've seen the cultural sector and I'll be honest, there is something that actually sometimes wears me a lot about how that word perceived sometimes and how the actions are associated with the term. So most of the time, the word design would go along with the practical, tangible and technical aspects of the field and make no mistake here, I think it's also a part of it. But what remains from my point of view and let me call in this way is kind of a niche to the market is actually the thinking capabilities of the design fields. I would like to underline here that I'm actually not talking only about design thinking, but rather a larger playground where I would be talking more about design and the ways of thinking. So I patiently do believe that design can help in innovating museums. So it's not the only answer, but it can really help. That's why actually I wanted to spend very briefly first part of my presentation on this aspect and share with you and think with you with museum workers as yourselves too. I think that the things that you should be knowing or reflecting on the capabilities of design and design culture. So design has always been actually about people. I guess we are all on board with this aspect. It's about creation of technologies, new technologies, implementing of those, creating solutions, maybe creating products and services for people. So it's about the design is a group of actions to improve and enriching our lives. I would say that if we step back a little bit to the idea and look into the development of the discipline, there are a couple of things we might remember and recognize. While I was preparing this webinar, one of the things that I realized is that actually nearly 40 years has passed when Nigel Cross, British research and academic wrote the article about designer Louise of Noving and maybe it's around 20 to 30 years after maybe David Kelly, the founder of a world famous designing in our studio, which I really love, IDEO brought designing to the sector of businesses. It is actually, I'm mentioning these things to say that actually first thing about design competences that we can talk here is that design brings, yes, a creative one as well, but even more importantly a human aspect to problem solving. So it's more like as an institution it's design helps to rather reframe the question is like for institutions what I'm gonna say towards more like what are the things that I can talk about that are relevant and informing for my audiences, for the audiences that I already have and for the audiences that I might be reaching up to. So design field offers tools in understanding human needs, interests, consumption, usage, enabling us actually to see the full picture, I would say the full picture of experience offer of cultural institutions. Previously to junior actually between 2013 and 16 during my PhD years, one of the things I've been very passionately asking myself would be that what would be the right methodology, the right mix of design set of actions and tools that can be brought specifically into the cultural sector. So as I already made kind of an introduction, my first answer was of course it was design research, right? So it's about giving the right space and effort in understanding people, their context, but in addition also to that, using design research to understand the ecosystem actually where cultural institutions operates, whether they are foundations, museums, archives, libraries and all that. Overtime actually what I got to understanding was that design could help also in the activation processes of holdings and collections. So it would be really helpful about well-arising the knowledge within cultural institutions. So both as collections are archived again, holdings on this part, but also in leveraging the intellectual and institutional knowledge that museum workers, cultural workers, people, people knowledge that is already inside the institutions by working with them directly. So through co-design and offering, let's say, a more collaborative and creative ways of working. Thirdly, design can also bring a holistic approach that focuses on all the single elements of an institution. So it can help to understand products, services, programs, initiatives and in addition to that, departments, how departments would work, how the processes in an institution work and more importantly, how all these elements actually interrelate to each other. So it's about understanding, design can be also really helpful in understanding how a cultural organization, if you see it more like a machine operates overtime and actually how we could rethink that. As of today, well, I definitely think that this methodology offers the right set of inquiry and tools for defining a confident future actually for cultural institutions, including museums. So that's why actually I generally say design can help because through design actually you can have a clearer idea on your audience, on the ecosystem of your museum, have the right set of tools and actually right set of questions as well to think about this future. So I guess this is the part that I would like to talk on design just to give you a brief context of what I will be presenting. And that said now, I will now go closer to our topic of today and deep dive into the challenge we are actually seeing over the past couple of years on the museum side. Here is just a brief context and reference of what I will be sharing afterwards and where all these things come from. This is actually these things that I'm saying like monitoring the museum definition, deep dive in the reddenance and digital transformation of the museum. So all these aspects is actually a parallel work to our daily practice in general. So it's not only for the pandemic, but so we would generally read a lot of documents, reports, we would be engaged in conversations and on the challenges of museums, how they are tackling those. But in addition to that, specifically during the pandemic, one of our references was the report of NIMO. So the work that NIMO actually took on during the past year, the survey on the impact of COVID-19 on museums. In addition to that, actually since 2019, we have been also monitoring the ongoing conversation on the museum definition of ICOM. I think we would be all following that, right? So what that definition needs to contain. Actually, all these conversations and reports and stuff actually says from my perspective loud and clear and underlines the aspects which I would like to highlight today, which is actually also the title of this webinar, the search for meaning. I guess we all realize that during the past couple of years audiences have changed, technologies have changed and have been changing over a while. The responsibilities of cultural institutions and museums have changed. So in this context, we think that museums have found themselves in a moment of self-exploration. So probably it's the right moment as well to asking museums for asking themselves, who am I? What am I supposed to do? What are my responsibilities? What are the ways in which I can be knowledgeable? I can be a point of reference of information, but at the same time, how I can be relevant, so inclusive, maybe engaging for my audiences and how can I be sustainable as well? There are really big, big, big questions about that. So that's why the title is more like the search for meaning because actually it's all about relevance. It's all about relevance for audiences or our communities, partners, stakeholders and so on. And I'll come to that in a second. But before that, there are a couple of things that I would like to quickly share, especially on the topic of digital transformation and innovation. And to explain you in a better way what I mean by digital transformation and innovation, maybe I will be doing a couple of examples. The first one would be, and it would sound really very, very simple, an audio guide, right? So a set of audio registrations about museums' exposed objects. I think that kind of project can be also seen as an innovation in 2021. Another example maybe can be creating a new working group within a museum. So maybe for a new pilot project, putting different people from different departments together, maybe for the first time for a common goal, maybe about creating digital teaching resources. I really believe that that can be seen as an innovation as well in 2021. So I can see somebody maybe smiling now and saying like that has been there for a long time. And maybe somebody else is kind of nodding because the important thing actually what I want to highlight here is that we all actually know also that all museums are very different in sizes, very different in the ways how they are founded, how they are operating, the collections that they have, the capabilities and that they have. And they are actually currently on a different stage on their transformation journey. So one might be more on the beginning of having only on online presence. Maybe some of those are already on their transformation process. So this is to say that there is no one way and static way of dealing with digital and transformation processes and strategies are things to be adopted according to what kind of museum you have. So the question here is more about are you on a full digital transformation process already or you are more on the position to have digital solutions to improve your services like online management of memberships or booking of tickets. So from where I'm standing it's very important to underline that not all the museums are the same and there is no static process to deal actually with the general topic of digital transformation. I would like to share something more on this aspect as well and I really thought that this is very, very interesting. So the data here comes from a survey in 2019 where museums were asked on a EU level the following question. So where do you think digital technologies have the most impact when it comes to the actions of your museum? Most museums answered that question saying first of all marketing but also on the other hand maybe preserving, valorizing collections. So the aspects that is more on the engagement side I would say. And just looking at today tight was very surprising actually to notice that very few museums were actually mentioning the impact of digital technologies on their businesses itself. So on business operations maybe on business model of the museum and this was like pre pandemic I would say 2019 and we dealt with 2020 which really changed many things. So I would say that only a year passed a year and a little bit more and unfortunately we have seen lack of funding long closures that has never happened in time before. So but I guess those things actually helped us also to understand and to be more aligned on this aspect that digital will be also impacting other parts of the operational processes of museums and where things are clearly going to change. Actually like the transformation process also how museums operate was changing in the last couple of years. So we could already map different ways of operating when it comes to specifically to museums and their digital capabilities and the integration of those digital processes already inside. We see that actually museums are actually moving from a centralized model where maybe only one department was responsible of any kind of digital work towards maybe what we would be calling hub and spoke model in which there are digital teams so mostly composed by a mix of different departments and there are more digital people inserted on these departments and distributed in these departments and maybe towards moving even towards a distributed model where the term digital the digital hashtag to things is more like a skill set that can be added into teams. So the expectation would be all the museum workers would be having digital skill sets to their day to day operations and also to the departments as well. We sometimes notice that most of the time also museums outsource these kind of skills also from outside. But when we are seeing this actually there is something sometimes kind of misleading and it's more about what digital means in most cases and like the word design digital might be interpreted wrong in some occasions and would become in other words maybe a synonym to social media as well. This aspect is actually kind of clear if we look at the data especially gathered during the pandemic so we can notice actually this aspect so just some context to that so what has happened from our point of view during this time, during the time of pandemic that most museums that were not maybe digital native already heavily leaned on to social media and because it seemed the immediate answer to keep audiences engaged with the overall entity of the museum since the doors were closed and in order to do that and to cope with that most of the museum leaders and managers have changed the task of their stuff mostly into digital related activities. You can see already from the data that half of the museums over Europe but also in the UK have mentioned that they moved their the workload of their stuff into digital related activities which I think you would all recognize from this from your daily to day work but one important aspect was to that actually these museums also had said that previously they didn't have a digital strategy and even in addition to that most of the museums also said that they didn't have KPIs tools or frameworks to measure actually what they might have achieved in this period. I think one important thing to underline again from this data is that a very small percentage of museums think that they might need qualitative data to understand their actions especially to understand the needs, interest and behaviors of audiences so we can really notice that sometimes they underline having shallow or poor audience data in their day to day activities so to conclude this kind of data and what we see from data is that we are definitely seeing an emergency of a design intervention to museum activities but especially in relation to digital technologies and what digital technologies mean for museums. I think you might be saying okay I got your point this is interesting yes we have been seeing this in our institution or this is an aspect that we have been reflecting but you know there are no simple and single answers to questions in general so it's very difficult to always have an horizontal view of how things are managed especially as museum workers so I can see that the question can be like so as museums what we should be doing in these times so now I will move on to let's say the part of let's say more talking about the trends that we are mentioning and this topic of how we can define a meaningful future for your specific museum as well on this part actually after reflecting in general to the digital transformation and innovation I will be sharing also a couple of what we call trends they are more like reflections changes and kind of opinions ideas around how we can maybe give some responses to this big challenge that museums have been having and in hopes that the content that we will be sharing with you today at least can start maybe an internal conversation within your teams, within your museums at least maybe it pops up a question in your mind about in general about the change for your specific museum there have been already some presentations from Nemo previously touching on digital technologies and so on so what was very important for us to work on this topic of digital was to actually really set up for the right question so we were asking ourselves when we were working on this booklet so moving from the data that I have already presented to more on the ideation parts what we were asking ourselves was actually this question so I will kind of read that to you so the question is how might we help our community of museum workers in identifying key challenges and trends to the changing need of audiences as in engagement strategies and business opportunities and through that offer them content and tools to reflect upon a meaningful future for their museums so I would like to with this question actually there are two very important things that I would like to highlight so the first one is the following we are not talking about an ideological future museum we are more talking about what is the right future for your museum and second thing to that we are not mapping or prioritizing technologies we are not saying this kind of technology is better for you this is more engaging this is the one that you should be adopting we are actually this question what is really important and with the trends that I will be presenting we are actually trying to bring a human lens of what we presented as the data and start a conversation with you and to help you actually through these trends to help you reflect on your own future these are the trends the full trends actually that you have you can have a look in our booklet as well today actually I will be touching upon these ones because what I wanted to spend the right time with today is touch different aspects and to cover different topics so I picked the ones that are touching on the business side of things on the engagement side of things touching on the education side of things and also on the content strategy as well so I know that the content is very heavy and I am moving very fast but hopefully we will be having a right set of questions also by the end of my presentation today so I would be moving to the first one so trend number one this year was what we have called loyalty revolution so it's all about the ways in which we think that audiences have changed and the interactions actually of the audiences with institutions have changed so in the past year we will be leaving most as audiences we will be leaving most of our engagements from home we will be joining exhibitions from home we will be searching for collections from home maybe we will be engaging also with your directors and curators from home so what all these mean this means actually that our expectations and value of being a member of a museum also has changed dramatically so maybe before it was more about when we were a member it was more about an early ticketing option or maybe previews maybe joining an artist walk through during an event might be having a glass of wine at the members cafe with our friends but this year all these stuff were not possible physically and all of these stuff have moved into our homes there are actually two consequences to that and one is more like the service aspect to it which is more about the digital management of memberships and membership options and maybe even a plug and play aspect to it but even more importantly to that it's also about rethinking the engagement offer of your museum but more on the balancing part so how we can balance towards a more physical membership offer because we will be offering engagement offers also on our digital channels so with this trend I think the key actions to achieve is to think and map first of all of course the real needs of audiences what do they expect now what is their offer then how we can reconnect with them and what is the right membership that we need to be thinking to offer them also on a global level secondly it's also about rethinking maybe also in creative ways how we can make a good use of museums existing digital assets and resources especially on online engagement and digital engagement with that in mind I think it's important to understand also on the operational side of it so what it really takes in terms of efforts if you would like to add a new experience offered to your museum and re-know it through that re-know it your membership proposal as well so I can say that in general for the loyals revolution trend from my perspective from my point of view it's actually a fundamental ask because it really pushes our thinking into what it takes to commit an institution nowadays as audiences why we should be becoming members so our next trend I would like to highlight today is accessibility online it's all about macro and micro inclusion of audiences and what they might be look like and how these inclusion activities can be translated into digital touchpoints of your museum this trend is actually leading a very big issue of balancing museums inclusivity efforts on digital and physical channels so it's about bringing also on the other hand some learnings from the physical spaces of the museum because accessibility was there for a longer period of time on that aspect to the digital ones with this trend one of the things that we are actually noticing is the rising need for a comprehensive content strategy in general so not only for social media not only but a more horizontal approach to content strategy especially when it comes to the activation and dissemination of online collections we are also seeing that the activation and communication of online collections will be dramatically will change I would say that and I think this you would even know better than me and some of you will be accessibility experts the meaning of accessibility of course has broadened itself from accessibility of spaces to the accessibility of content so we need to rethink about what accessibility means so I would say that the first thing that is very important is to align what accessibility means for your specific museum make people aligned on that make also people that are maybe not accessibility experts in your museum but maybe dealing with other set of activities and actions maybe they are preservers and so on but everybody I think it's very important for everybody to be aligned on what accessibility means for your museum in that activity it's also very important to identify I would say the digital barriers to your audiences and actually the action to be done to understand the digital barriers and reach research and analysis on their engagement side on their experiences that they already had and also from their expectations from online engagement as well because it is very important to understand how they are living their engagements right now so from this one I will move on to our third trend for today which is education recorded this trend is a very big question from my point of view so this trend is all about reframing both in physical and digital ways museums educative role and also new ways of working between the education department of museums with other internal departments but in addition to that also defining new ways of working with external community members as well so with educators, with maybe academics K-12 teachers and so on so what is going on here in 2020 actually that both work and school life has changed dramatically and we I think lived all of us lived this change so students and also lifelong learners that they were more on home education, home engagement there were blended classrooms for students so that's to say that it's not only impacting students in general but also lifelong learners as well and for audiences going to a museum activity or a course or that kind of natural engagement this year was largely being lost and I'm not going to map all the burdens to that aspect but what is very important here is the teacher community in general have been in a difficulty because maybe they were not digital ready to have education programs in these ways so they were kind of left alone if you will reinventing the ways in which they can manage teaching from distance and help them help and define what actually teaching and engaging from distance how can it become actually a norm so to conclude this trend is a matter of redefining the role of museums and museum educators actually for the whole let's say overall education system and to that end actually one of the things that we are noticing is a rising need of digital teaching resources platforms and content I would say key actions for this challenge is first of all to understand and redefine the educational responsibilities of your museum so think about the responsibilities that you had and the responsibilities that you will be having in the near future think about also the audiences that you have to define that so where actually you kind of have also a civic responsibility maybe we definitely think that leadership support and engagement with other stakeholders will be needed especially for discussing collaboratively new ways of working but new ways of also teaching from distance so I would move on to the next one like this is like talk talk talk I'm making a list afterwards we will be having the Q&A hopefully we will be having a couple more questions on these aspects so I would say maybe final two trends this one called Neo Agile Museum this trend is all about organizational change and new ways of working so it's more like a question about how we can better support and align teams and how we can create a proper solid platform of collaboration and innovation inside of our institution inside of our museum if we have some tech people here they would already see the notice the word of Agile and we would agree that Agile ways of doing things were there for quite some time like I was saying especially for those people who were very native and where they are dealing with today in their day to day practice with the development of digital products but now it's more like a question less technological and project based question but it's more about giving space to new museum professionals as well so maybe less creating less vertical profiles but more versatile profiles also inside your institution and setting the right grounds for enabling that and also enabling a more transparent and efficient workplace this is like another huge trend I noticed that and this really depends on how your institution operates right now but one of the things I can say to approach this challenge would be if you are not already doing would be piloting maybe working groups so start with this kind of prototyping aspect to it so maybe you might be piloting working groups inside your institution dealing with projects bringing people trying to bring people from different departments and kind of see how it goes if you have not experimented with this already and in order to do that of course one thing that would be very important is to have a clear mapping of your in-house capabilities and here I would like to highlight that that is of course in terms of hard skills but also it's very important to map the soft skills of your teams as well I think this will be the final one on the menu today I hope I'm in time I haven't checked timing actually so let's say the last trend would be as you are already seeing collections explained today it's a trend all about people's engagements with your collections online I think this is pretty clear from the title so from cocktails online with curators to virtual tours directors all this period in 2020 we have noticed that museum social media channels have been activated in a very ambitious way so this of course bring a question of an impact and measurement aspect to these activities as well which is very important but what we wanted to highlight more about the expectations side of it expectation aspect to it now that audiences are used to being engaged while staying at home the question is here like what you might be offering even after the pandemic how you can balance what you have been doing in the past period as a newer experience offered to your audiences to that end we think that museums will definitely rethink how to balance new ways of bringing audiences to bringing back maybe if they are opening to online parts and online engagements but also balancing it with the physical engagement and the physical building itself so to make clear that this trend is more about how we can rebalance new ways of engagement considering the digital spaces of our museum as actually I said earlier and we have seen actually from the data that I have presented and let's make no mistake here not to generalize but some part some museums don't have let's say until now KPIs to measure engagement and so if I may we can see this kind of online engagements that we have mapped during the past year we can see them more as experiments if you see like that from now on one of the things that we think museums should be doing is to extract key learnings from these experiments somehow and through that maybe identifying new strategies, more informed strategies let's say where to define a new way of online programming in general and it's also a question of to work on how actually this kind of online programming that has been there for the especially in a very ambitious way in the last year how this can be an integral part of your museum's experience offer so you can map all the things that you have done you can understand what would be the expectations of audiences and to bring that data to inform a better and more informed online programming for your audiences so this was also the part that I would like to talk about today on the museum trends part as you can see I started with design and ended off trends why I wanted to really try to briefly touch upon different aspects so on one part on the role of design and how the role of design can be impactful and can be helpful actually in making change happen we have seen how the transformation process is very varied actually for different museums and then I ended with some of our thinking and our trends to share with you some of the things that we are thinking that it will be important for the future in general for the future of museums specifically for your museums I hope that the content was inspirational for you today and I guess now I'm looking forward to your questions thank you I think maybe Elizabeth can guide me on these parts let's see if I can see some of the questions many things that I haven't read actually hi there thank you so much for this wonderful presentation I'm already seeing a lot of comments just applauding the content so thank you so much for this I mean I had a couple questions actually to start with and maybe allowing everyone an opportunity to formulate their thoughts I was wondering, I mean we speak so much lately about community involvement especially recently reaching out to the local community if you feel that there are specific points within these trends that you've witnessed for museums to actively reach out to their community and configure their future I think this aspect should from my perspective I think this aspect should be already a part of how museums are informing themselves for their audiences one part can be on more like the research part but actually one part that can be very important can be also on the co-design part so I think I'm hearing myself, I don't know why but no problem so the thing that I would like to say is when designing for your audiences it would be very interesting and important to already bring them into your ideation processes so just to explain myself one of the things that in two years ago that we have done was a kind of a co-ideation workshop with a lot of participants also from the public site because we were dealing with a new let's say for a project we were dealing with like defining the the educative, let's say role of museums for their audiences so in that workshop what we have done was to actually already have the public with us and so we recruited some of the people that are let's say lifelong learners and student community in the museum and we have involved them to the ideation processes so from that part I'm seeing many questions so I kind of lost the point maybe I think what you said especially about co-designing and bringing people in for the ideation processes I think that's something that we can always aspire to and try to involve more and more bringing in different experiences already in the beginning of things so already trying to bring them into your activities before already defining them I think that's a big part of the project that's a big aspect to let's say to work so we do have some questions now in the chat we have one here from Andrew who has mentioned accessibility and how do you think this recent trend will take on the positives of digital platforms into making physical collections more accessible for example to people with disabilities well that is a huge I think that's a huge question and it's a really important question because when it comes to actually managing with digital platforms especially for let's say people with disabilities and especially for maybe for kind of blindness or impairness generally what is already done there there are kind of what is implemented and what I see is more like implementation of softwares kind of technical aspects to how to deal with let's say with these disabilities what I think it is very important is that not all the museums need to have covered let's say a huge amount of accessibility issues because it would be kind of kind of impossible so what I would suggest from that part is to really understand what kind of audience on the terms of accessibility you have already for your museum and think about the ways in which you can actually offer right set of engagement also on digital terms so to that aspect I think the digital part of things we have been seeing also a couple of projects on the accessibility part especially for people that are maybe kind of have difficulties in moving so we have been seeing robots kind of tours with robots and this kind of stuff so of course there are digital also is helpful to bring what is inside of the institutions in true digital ways into our homes as well and there are supporting technologies to that as well but one important thing is to really start from who you would like to reach out to I think like it's again the same question like I already said understanding really on the accessibility level who you would like to reach out to, who you will be helping to so if you think that you have in general let's say blind community or people having visual impairment one thing that would be very interesting to involve them and engage already them so that you can already understand their way of engagement through digital nowadays how they lived actually this past year especially for people that are maybe were engaged in kind of new kind of special tours and special kind of engagement in physical spaces so try to understand how this change and how they kind of reinvented maybe solutions for themselves to be able to be connected with culture I think that would be the starting point I think that's really important when we're looking for solutions for specific communities to always involve those communities in the discussion as you were just saying yeah that's wonderful let's see we have a few more questions here so this is a pretty straightforward one or maybe not maybe it opens a can of worms let's see Matias, how do you define is it wishful thinking or is this something that we're really already seeing in the real museum's life actually that's a really good question maybe I was supposed to be touching this in my presentation in the beginning so I would say maybe there is no one single way of dealing and mapping trends but I would explain our way of working maybe maybe this might answer the question so the content that I shared today is the second book actually that we have published and it actually spends our work and the things that we see during working with museum workers over a long time and on also one-to-one engagements so one of the things that we do actually and over and the content actually we started working was in 2019 because we wanted to publish the content in the beginning of 2020 then when we realized that we were in the pandemic we kind of made the process longer to be able to also bring some learnings from the pandemic side as well so one thing that we do is we map interesting what we think that are interesting museum projects so I didn't go into detail today but you can find it also in the book we are already mapping real activities of museums so real things that are already happening for example I will connect to the previous question on the accessibility side we have been mapping some of the activities of the Wannabe Museum the inclusivity platform that they have already set on on to that I think there were a couple of activities from the Wittemuseum as well so this is to say that we map actually different kind of projects that we think that are impactful and impactful and kind of innovative for the future this is the first part the second part is actually the data that I kind of touched upon today so we map also on a more horizontal and higher level how things are changing through let's say desk research in general so following reports any kind of publication survey results and these kind of things and sometimes we gather also this data from European Union projects in addition to that actually specifically one thing that we did this year was also to one-on-one interviews where we have seen interesting projects so we reach out to people and say hey we think that this is interesting can you give us further information on that so actually then this is like a mix of matching information interpreting it trying to see some insights from that connecting data and try to identify what we think that is also important to highlight so again I will connect to the first question of Andrew I really believe that accessibility was a burden in 2020 and I definitely also see kind of lack of projects especially on the digital part so it was also for our mission was to also push the thinking on that part so this is actually how we created that trend I don't know if this already answered your question so it's not like what we think in the future will happen but what we think it is important that it will happen and what is the data actually already showing us that is something that is important that it should be changing again here of course this is not a futuristic future so we are actually talking about trends that are impacting next year maybe two to three years so we are actually not going even that far that sounds like quite a flow of information to keep track of but especially seeing all these reports coming in and interviews on top of that and I'm sure it creates a very useful database though that's great that someone is taking the time to compile all that down so let's see time for one or two more questions let me see there's so many so I'm going to have to choose a couple here I've heard a similar issue from other museum professionals so I'm going to take this question from Victoria regarding piloting working groups from different departments have you seen good examples on how to build cross departmental working groups yes the answer would be yes because I think this is already happening in the past couple of years one of the things that I thought that was very interesting that some of the museums in the US experimented that I've seen in the past couple of years was let's say thinking groups so actually it was more like this they have defined and let's say a high level mission to their museum and things that they wanted to show I don't remember exactly what was the main aspect to that so it was accessibility or digital barriers and so on but what they have done is like establishing a new way of making people meet inside of the institution so each week on a daily basis they would have this thinking team and people from different departments would gather already to think about that issue and this became let's say more like an internal process to project management but also strategy development inside the institution as well this is actually something that we have seen couple of years ago and it was interesting for us to widen that so I personally also experimented on this kind of aspect helping on a project to create a new working group so on that aspect and in that specific project what we were asked for was to kind of review the impact of all the digital touch points of a museum and in that actually what we have done is to let's say select and ask the museum to define key actors that they think that they can bring important insights from each department and we're also the people who would already share let's say what are their expectations where they would like to improve things also within their verticality so we brought that aspect under the discussion of digital and we tried to engage them during let's say co-ideation workshops basically and map already their insights into the process so basically we have defined couple of working sessions I would say and workshops where we would gather together to co-ideate, co-design and see where we can make improvements in relation to the digital touch points of that museum of course there is no one way I think to do things but I think new projects are a great excuse to test that so if you have in the next couple of let's say months if you are starting onboarding already on a new project I think this would be the right time to be experimenting about that so think about what actually who you can involve from your institution that can help you to let's say even make that project more impactful for your audience. I generally hear from this question like how I can communicate the importance of this kind of activity to my leadership so I see that that question might be the next one. I think transparent communication and also collaboration on that site is very important I think that will be also changing as well. Great. Let's do one more if folks have to leave and they can leave but we have so many questions. I'm happy to answer. If it's fine for you of course. Yeah, sure, I'm happy to answer. I also do find this interesting also from Matias asking how do you co-design with people who are not yet in your museum's collection. So I guess this is not only drawing in new visitors or new audiences but also drawing people in to figure out how to engage with them and interact with them in the future. Maybe let me rephrase this if I understood well so the question is more about there is a specific audience that is not already in our collections and we would like to involve them and to bring their let's say set of insights to our way of thinking for the future for our collections. To the design process. To the design process. One of the things might be even so if we are dealing with a prospect audience what we generally want to do is to try to understand who is this prospect audience first of all. So who we would like to be reaching out to. So that kind of question would generally help to identify a set of let's say profiles so maybe some demographics engagement styles, tech nativeness this kind of information. Through that actually again I'm answering from my side because I think there is no one way of doing things this is how I do stuff. So two things that we generally try to do is one is recruiting in general so we might be reaching out to and recruiting agency that could help us to find the people that we would like to involve in activities as profiles and they would help us to recruit that people and we would be asking their engagement we do this also on the research part. The other aspect might be convincing and involving them through other ways so if you think that the experience offer of the collection is not the right way to engage them maybe another initiative can be or maybe another let's say event can be so try to let's say try to already identify a set of actions actually where you can start involving them after that you have a clear idea who you would like to reach out to of course and that kind of engagement will already help you to create let's say a new relationship with that audience as well so that when you are asking for their engagement and for their input they will be already involved in maybe in other ways to your institution and they will be of course willing to be joining and helping. A little outside of the box sometimes to help build those new relationships and that foundation of trust that's very important Great Will I would just like to thank you once more for your time for sharing some of your expertise with us we saw a lot of really great comments in the chat and of course the content will be posted it's all recorded and will be shared but yeah thank you so much and of course for other questions that we didn't have time to get to you can reach out to Ece the email for junior was provided so I'm happy to chat thank you thank you for all and have a nice day yeah have a good one