 It's time for the Lawn Jean Chronoscope, a television journal of the important issues of the hour brought to you every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, a presentation of the Lawn Jean Wittner Watch Company, maker of Lawn Jean, the world's most honored watch, and Wittner, distinguished companion to the world-honored Lawn Jean. Good evening. This is Frank Knight. May I introduce our co-editors for this edition of the Lawn Jean Chronoscope? From the CBS television news staff, Larry Lassur and Charles Cullingwood. Our distinguished guest for this evening is the right Honorable Selwyn Lloyd, British Minister of State. Mr. Lloyd, as British Minister of State and leader of your country's delegation to the United Nations, you're right in the cockpit of international affairs. Now last spring, it seems to me, there was a lessening of international tensions, and this year, this fall, there seems to be a stiffening of them. What shape do you think the world is in right now? Well, I wouldn't be as positive as you are about the present state of affairs. I think it's quite true that compared with 1951 and 1952, there was a definite relaxation in tension in February of this year following upon the death of Stalin. That went on in April and May, and I would say the present state of affairs is that we're marking time. It isn't quite certain which way it's going to go, and that's why I think it's very important that in each step we take, we're very careful indeed not to make things worse. Well, in the light of that idea that we're now marking time, what do you think the free world should do in the present situation? Well, the first thing, I'm quite certain what we should not do is to relax our efforts to build up our own defenses. I'm perfectly certain that one of the things which is making for peace is the fact that the free world has been building up its own defenses. I'm certain we must not relax in any way. At the same time, I think we've got to show ourselves ready to negotiate on any problem, at any time, at any level. We've got to be willing to try and negotiate, and that isn't the same thing as appeasement. Negotiation is not appeasement. We've got to try and settle some of the outstanding issues if we can. At the same time, we've got to be very certain not to be put in the position of negotiating from weakness. I don't think the Soviet bloc understands negotiating from weakness. We've got to be strong, but at the same time we've not got to lose any opportunity of negotiating if we can. Well, Mr. Minister, one of the places where both sides are certainly marking time and where not much negotiation is being done is in Panmunjong. Do you think that the chances of a Korean peace conference are hopeless now? No, I don't think they're hopeless. I myself feel that it's in the interests of both sides to get a Korean peace conference. I don't think it's in the interests of the Chinese communists and the North Koreans to have a perpetual state of tension there. I certainly don't think it's in our interests. And I think we've got to go on very patiently seeing whether we can set up a political conference. I think one of the ironies of the present situation is that it seems to take a very long time to negotiate even the simplest matter. And here we've been spending weeks and weeks trying to decide on the composition of a conference and the details of time and place and so on. Well, that's the way, apparently, negotiation goes the present time and we've got to go on seeing, trying to see whether we can't set up a political conference which I think both sides want. Well, Mr. Lloyd, there are certain dates by which certain things must happen in Korea. Supposing these things don't happen in the next two months, what will happen to the projected Korean peace conference then? Well, because that's a hypothetical question and I would prefer not to consider the worst. But at the moment they're trying to keep these explanations going. We, as you know, I think I've told you before, I went to Korea this time last year or June of last year. I saw some of these prisoners and I formed my own opinion as to their reasons for not wanting to go back to the North Koreans or to the Chinese communists. I think that many of them were perfectly sincere in their objection to being returned to the other side and that's why we fought so hard against forcible repatriation. Well, Mr. Lloyd, the situation in the Far East seems to be rather fluid, but in Europe it's rather more static. What do you think the prospects are of getting a European army there with German contingents? Well, I would hope that they're rather better now than they have been for some months. We believe that the European defence community really is a solution which should give grounds for a feeling of security. I don't think you can keep the Germans permanently disarmed. I don't think you can leave Germany as a vacuum in the middle of Europe, not knowing whether to go east or west. And I think the sensible solution is to have Germany integrated into a European defence community. That will be, I think, good for Germany itself and also good for the other countries of Western Europe. It will mean that the German contribution to defence will be within a European defence community which in itself is within NATO. And I think that should mean security for Europe and, incidentally, security for the Russians because it will mean that the German contribution will be integrated with a Western contribution and it's not the coalitions which make war as a rule. It's the individual states. Well, now if that's the British view, Mr. Lloyd, why is it that Great Britain herself has not seen fit to plunge full tilt into the European army scheme? Well, we have given every support that we can to the European army. We can't integrate our own forces in the European army because our interests extend very far beyond Europe. Not only are we a European country, but we're also a NATO country and also we're the centre or part of a great Commonwealth. And we have interests all over the world and it's not possible, therefore, for us to go into a European defence community in the same way as another country of Western Europe might. But nevertheless, we have every intention of being associated as closely as we can with this European defence community. And as you know, we've got large forces on the continent of Europe at the present time, which in fact are a very substantial element in the defence of Western Europe. And we have every intention of those forces should work in the closest collaboration with the European defence community and the European army. Mr. Minister, as you agreed before, the situation in Europe is fairly stable. It seems to me, except for the joint between the NATO forces in the Balkans and Italy, and I refer specifically to Trieste. Can anything be done about that unhappy situation? Well, of course that is, as you say, an unhappy situation. And like so many other situations, the irritating thing about it is that the interests of both sides are not dissimilar. For instance, the defence of Italy must depend to a considerable extent upon having a strong Yugoslavia allied with the West in front of Italy. And similarly, the defence of Yugoslavia must depend to a considerable extent upon having a strong Italy behind her. And therefore, strategically, the interests of both those countries would seem to us to lie along the lines of a settlement. And therefore we hope that even out of the present controversy, there may come a reasonable settlement for both sides. And we in fact think that the proposition of October the 8th was a reasonable settlement for both sides. And we hope in time that it may be realised to be so. Well, Mr. Lord, you, Britishers, have important interests in the Middle East. Can anything be done about stabilising the peace in that strategic area? Yes, we certainly have very important interests in the Middle East, as has the United States. And that has been a source of constant trouble since the war. One of the outstanding features in that trouble has been the row between Iran and Britain over the oil. Well, we hope that with this new government of Iran, with whom we are very desirous of entering into full and friendly diplomatic relations, we hope with that new government there may be prospects of settling that oil dispute. So far as Egypt is concerned, we've been negotiating for many months with General Nagib's government to try and settle that problem. And again, that's another problem where the interests of both sides are very similar. There's this great base with all these armaments and installations there. And one would think that they are an important element in the defence of the whole Middle East. And we're trying to work out a reasonable arrangement between Egypt and ourselves whereby that base should be available for the free world if any danger should come. And then the other factor in the Middle East is this unfortunate situation between Israel and the Arab States. And that's now being considered by the Security Council. Two aspects of it are. And once more, we would hope that these countries will realise that their interests lie in preserving the peace. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Selwyn Lloyd, for being with us tonight. I'm pretty good for being here. The opinions you've heard our speakers express tonight have been entirely their own. The editorial board for this edition of the Lone Gene Chronoscope was Larry Lesser and Charles Collingwood, both from the CBS television news staff. Our distinguished guest was the right honourable Selwyn Lloyd, British Minister of State. Now, for the most important name on your Christmas gift list, the gift of complete acceptability is Lone Gene, the world's most honoured watch. Throughout the world, no other name on a Christmas watch means so much as Lone Gene, the watch of highest prestige among the world's finest watches. The prestige of a Lone Gene watch as a Christmas gift transcends price. It springs from the countless honours which Lone Gene watches have won. For excellence and elegance, ten World's Fair Grand Prices and twenty-eight gold medals. For accuracy, highest honours in the fields of precise timing. 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