 Okay, we're back. This is Dave Vellante with Wikibon.org, I'm here with my co-host, Jeff Frick. Wall-to-wall coverage of AWS Summit. We're here in Moscone, San Francisco. We're at AWS Summit. We were just at OpenStack. Sean Douglas is here, CTO of Service Mesh. Sean, welcome back. Hey, thank you. Great to have you. So we had you on at Service Mesh. I wasn't there, but I watched live. Good show, great event, a lot of buzz. Whole different vibe here. This is impressive. This is really impressive this year. The energy and the size of the event, I think they're giving Oracle World a run for their money. It's only half the size, but I think next year Oracle World is going to be smaller. This is the band tonight. Well, as you can breathe in here, Oracle World sometimes is a little tough to... It's impressive. So now were you at Reinvent in the fall? No, you weren't at Reinvent. I don't know if you saw any of that coverage. But really, Amazon going forward in the enterprise, which is all good for you guys. The more Cloud, the better. So for the people who weren't able to see the OpenStack interview, give us the quick rundown on Service Mesh. And then we'll talk about some of the things we talked about OpenStack, but how they apply to AWS. Absolutely. Absolutely. So Service Mesh is an enterprise Cloud management platform, and we basically focus on the Enterprise 2000, and we provide a hybrid Cloud management solution for enterprises that has very strong security governance and compliance features that enables you to take an application centric view and then orchestrate the underlying infrastructure around that application across any of the public 16 Cloud providers, as well as across VMware, across Microsoft, across OpenStack, and do so in an application centric way, meaning we don't spin up VMs, so there's a lot of people that spin up VMs and they call that Cloud management. What we do is we accelerate the time to value by actually spinning up the entire application and being able to move that around seamlessly and doing that in context of governance, risk, and compliance policy in an enterprise. So we really focus on big enterprise, highly regulated environments. Sorry, there's a bunch of cables around there. Yeah, a lot of cables down there. Don't stretch your legs. I got wrapped up there. Sorry. Chris was a lot taller than you. Yeah. He was very tall. So you're Cloud agnostic. Yes, Cloud agnostic. You obviously see the trends. Where does Cloud fit with the CIOs that you talk to? Let me ask it differently. Are IT organizations finally embracing the Cloud? Are they ready for the Cloud? Do they have their Cloud strategy act together in your view? What we're finding is in the enterprise and literally the Fortune 100 or what have you, we're finding an aggressive movement to Cloud and the really the biggest barrier that prevented people from moving to AWS for production applications we felt was to have the governance in place that they can take and run those workloads and know that no one's going to jail for violating compliance regulations and if you're a financial services organization. So there's thought leaders out there like UBS that have really embraced it and they've just really driven down the cost and accelerated their time to value and there's a lot of people across the stack that are starting to do that. So we're finding that I think that time is now and people are moving to the Cloud and embracing. From the service mesh perspective, we enable somebody to operate that in that type of environment and take what may have been shadow IT or just to develop them out there and incorporate that into their software development and application development life cycle doing maybe dev and test on AWS and maybe they roll something into a V block on their private Cloud solution and then through the life cycle the right place at the right time at the right cost. But I think more and more you're going to start to see that once the correct policy and governance is in place it's not about having a private Cloud or having a public Cloud it's about a Cloud based operating model and a transformation to that. So I think that really the time is now. Yeah so I feel like we're in a multi-game series here you'll have to use sports analogies and there's been a number of quarters like the first quarter was almost with the downturn of 2008-2009 people said let's get to the Cloud, shift things to a variable expense and then it happened and then like you said when things started coming back a little bit the economy started coming back then you had the shadow IT effect and now it seems as though CIOs really have had an awakening and say alright let's see how we can use this for competitive advantage a deeper business integration. Right, it's huge. So where do you think we go from here? You guys are talking now about this notion of hybrid which is kind of the original vision that a lot of people put forth with the so called private Cloud was this notion of control. But at the same time a lot of people have noted that Clouds like from Google or Amazon particularly Amazon and even Microsoft there's a high degree of homogeneity but you guys are stitching together heterogeneous Clouds That's right. So that's not trivial. How do you do that? And what are the challenges in doing that? So the way that we do that is we create an application centric blueprint that can be deployed across any of the public Clouds or private Clouds and now mapping the complexity below that and doing so in a non lowest common denominator way is the secret sauce. You have to be able to expose the value added functionality that AWS is developing and bring that to the surface so when you choose to deploy that blueprint to AWS you get the best of AWS to everybody's Cloud is everybody's Cloud that's not strategic no partner would want to work with us you've got to be able to enable people to externalize the additional value that they're creating. One of the interesting points that you actually just mentioned was that during the downturn people looked at Cloud as a way to buy stuff by the drip and to reduce costs. If you look at how much Amazon has reduced their prices over the last couple years every time you check they're just reducing their price and that's just giving massive margin compression to any of the incumbents for enterprise infrastructure as well as for enterprise software so Amazon's pushed into the enterprise I think it's really just starting to gain momentum and it empowers the CIOs to reduce their cost and then consume what they need when they need and then that's really the advantage of a Cloud-based operating model to be able to spin something up on demand not wait to procure a system for 90 days and then deploy a VM and then build an app you want to be able to spin it up on demand consume it and then shut it down when it's not being used or shut it down at night or maybe have the same shared resources that are doing VDI in the day and then they're doing big data and analytics crunching at night so it's really interesting times. The other thing and you've got a cross-platform view that seems very unique it's almost like Apple we know what you need we're going to define the experience we'll pull together the ecosystem of stuff that we think will help you we're going to listen to you and involve but it's really kind of we've got a great solution ready to go for you versus a couple weeks ago there's a framework, bits and pieces versus an iPhone versus iOS is that I think it's very interesting I really like the services like for example Redshift AWS has put together this Redshift big data solution and if I was Oracle I would be really concerned and if they're not really concerned then they're asleep at the wheel because the ability for those guys to go after data warehousing they're not charging for data in and for AWS it's a service so there's no nine month enterprise sale cycle there's no 20% ELA for support on top of that it's just turn it on turn it off and that enables somebody to experiment with big data and analytics on AWS and guess what once they put the data in there what's the likelihood that they're going to move it out so it's I think that those types of services significantly advantage AWS as well as the enterprise because once you put the data there now you can spin up 1,000 VMs to run a load like on the final keynote today on the rendering farms they were talking about well they could spin up whatever, 10 virtual machines in 7 hours or 1,000 and do it in 7 minutes the other thing that people I don't think give enough credit to if you already have a vendor relationship you're not even really adding you're really just lighting up an extension of what you already have and being able to pay the same way I did drip this huge there's a lot of benefits to that and just one throat to choke if I can continue to get more ancillary services around the core this way both to try and then hopefully to buy it's very powerful and low friction with those models as well absolutely I'm going to say the atomicity of their solution previously enabled you to just buy things and piece it together but now they've also just came out with ops work in cloud formation philosophically it's very similar to what we're doing we're big partners, we're fans and we previously looked at AWS to consume those resources and hope our customers consume those resources and we do a tremendous amount of business every single month on AWS all of our developers every night but if you look at ops work they're doing the software development lifecycle automation around an application kind of enabling DevOps story we do the same thing for the enterprise across all these clouds so we fundamentally believe there's a tremendous amount of value they're creating there before they were doing these atomic solutions now they've got this ops work close the software development lifecycle and then from the cloud formation they have these blueprints that allow you to not just deploy an AMI but deploy an application maybe in the future you'll see exchange or whatever and it'll be deployed in that entire blueprint so we're partnering very aggressively right now with AWS but philosophically I love the idea because that's the same thing that we do we do it for an enterprise across all those clouds so if we were able to map their cloud formations blueprints to our blueprints that provides a path for people to migrate into AWS or out or wherever so I think it's just brilliant how there's just continuing march of power to the developer and just enabling easier and easier developer access resources well you really got a strong sense of that I'm sure at the open stack conference developer momentum it's interesting when tracking Sean the open stack movement for a while when it first came out John Furrier who was very supportive of it said this is a long pass down the field with about a lot of time left it's kind of a Hail Mary against Amazon and it looks like they connected that pass but then he made a comment to me last night he said you know Dave I've been thinking about this in many respects open stack is the competitor to the traditional enterprise guys the VMware's of the world because Amazon's got it's going and it's innovating faster than anybody else he made the point they're the gorilla but they're also the cheetah they're the disruptor I can't think of another example in the industry where that's the case what do you think of that premise that in fact open stack is really as much a competition for the traditional legacy guys as they are Amazon I think you're spot on so I think that open stack is bifurcating the public I mean the private cloud to really VMware and open stack and open stack has gotten so much in my personal opinion investment from HP IBM etc etc to try to get momentum around open stack and to develop this you know if you will cloud based operating system like Linux and I think that's largely to enable people to hedge against you know a VMware only or a Microsoft only solution for these cloud based operating systems I think it's less about AWS I think that for the private cloud for the public cloud clearly AWS is years out front and our thought leaders in that space right so okay and again you guys don't really care your step point is just go cloud exactly for us it's how do we enable the cloud based operating model for enterprises to put the compliance the policy based management orchestration across those clouds be able to move up or down and across okay so where's this all go I mean it was sort of you know entrenchment into virtualization and private cloud and it just feels like when you talk to organizations now there's a lot of pressure coming both externally and internally externally from guys like Amazon just innovating way faster cloud service providers you know growing and internally CEOs lines of business shadow IT's the CIO's head is in a vice I mean he or she has to really make a move here they can't just virtualize or you know improve efficiency a little bit they've really got to make a move here put on your you know breakout the binoculars what do you see over the next five years and how do you guys exploit that well I think it's interesting if I rather than looking forward for a second let's look back first and then kind of work our way forward so you look at virtualization well what did you know virtualization do with VMware initially right increased ROI and the density on the server now you're starting to see the same consolidation increase in density and networking checking out waste yeah exactly virtualization of servers, virtualization of storage virtualization network this is VMware's software defined data center strategy it's spot on but it's just increasing density in ROI move that forward you start to see this the shadow IT thing coming DevOps starts to close that loop and accelerate time to value it for the applications people start to then realize I have this public cloud I can't you know I can't get rid of and I want to get under control if I'm an enterprise CIO I then I obviously need a hybrid solution well if I need one hybrid solution I probably want to go across multiple clouds and balance that so you really need a strong platform that enables you to work across public cloud private cloud, right place, right time and life cycle and right cost and do everything based on policy and stay compliant and stay out of you know go fast and stay out of trouble right so give us an update on the company where you guys at fully funded yeah fully funded we raised money 2011 ignition partners Frank Cartelli awesome guy Frank is a great guy, great firm super supportive yeah we're on fire we are just can't even keep up with the business we're working with all the converged device players we're working with a lot of the cloud service providers just it's coming from all angles it's you know when everything converges it's it's good you know awesome glad you found time to stop by the queue thank you for having me Sean it was a pleasure you know good friend of the GMP Sean good to see you everybody keep right there