 We are having a huge Labor Day blowout sale for t-shirts at minepumpmedia.com. Just go to the store section. All t-shirts are $9.99 each. That's a substantial discount for all shirts. However, sizes are limited. And once the sizes are gone, they are gone. So get over there and get them now. Again, minepumpmedia.com, the store section. The sale ends September 4th. That's Labor Day at 5 p.m. Pacific. If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Minepump. Minepump. With your hosts, Sal DeStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. In this episode of Mind Pump. Oh, we got the boys here. We did. This episode. You know, when we first started Mind Pump, we didn't get any sponsors for a couple different reasons. Number one, it's usually supplement companies that sponsor. We're inflammatory. In fitness. And we're very raw. We're very brutal. We have a lot of integrity, which turns off most companies because. Especially supplement companies. Especially supplement companies. Which is what our most podcasts are sponsored by. That's right. That's right. And of course, fitness people are most fitness people are sponsored or connected by. We turned a lot of people away because of that. But one company that believed in us and approached us originally was Camara. And we liked their product, but we weren't sold on them until we talked to a couple of the founders, Frankie and Theo. Great, great guys. Genuinely great guys. Great guys. I consider them family because of that. I think. We're very loyal to them because of that. They 100% went out on a limb, I think, when they first got connected with us. I mean, we were sponsored by them well before anybody else came along. That was, first of all, legitimate. I mean, we had a lot of like bullshit stuff come our way when we first started. When you were small time. And these guys were here well before that. And so there is definitely a connection that we will forever have to them for doing that. And Sal said it, you know, they are incredible at spotting talent. And not because they found us, but because of all the other. Oh, Juju Mufu is one of them. I mean, Chris Hall of Jerry that we just, yeah. So I mean, they've got. Getting into drone racing. I mean, they're making moves. I mean, we call them the Red Bull of coffee, right? So they've got the Red Bull approach as far as they look for outliers. And I love that's what I loved about them was they did not want us to be censored. They were not trying to change our script or nothing. Nothing. They didn't change our message whatsoever. They just said, we like what you guys are doing. We believe that there's a huge need for what you're doing. We believe that you guys are going to be huge one day. And they're like, just do your thing. Do your thing. We want to be a part of it. Yeah. And so we really like the guys, but this episode is great. Great conversation. There's some funny stories that are told. So you get to get to know the founders of Camara and why we like them so much. They also talk about a couple of their new products coming out. They have extra virgin coconut oil in these individual single serve packets, which I think is brilliant. Oh, it makes it super convenient to just put that one serving size into your coffee. That's right. And then they're also coming out with a whole bean Peaberry coffee, which is supposed to be incredible tasting, which you can find the Peaberry coffee at kameracoffee.com. That's K-I-M-E-R-A-K-O-F-F-E-E.com. It's limited edition, by the way. So get on there because it'll run out. They tend to sell out on things like this really fast. They've got a really excited fan base. Enter the code MINDPUMP for 10% off. Also this month enroll in any maps program or maps bundle and get maps prime for free. Maps prime is the program that teaches you how to prime your body before your workouts, one of our more popular programs. So we're giving it away for free if you enroll in any other maps program or maps bundle. However, super bundle, if you do the super bundle, which is one years worth of exercise programming, which already includes prime, we're going to give you prime pro for free. You're going to get the pro model. So you'll basically have everything. It's a massive promotion. It's an exciting one for us. We've gotten a lot of fantastic feedback on all of our programs, but especially maps prime and prime pro. Those two, I could say, by far have given us the most positive feedback. So you can find out about those programs or enroll in those programs at mindpumpmedia.com. So without any further ado, here we are talking to Frankie and Theo from Kimera Coffee. So Frankie, be honest with me now. Let's say your music career just fucking blew up. Are you sure it's Primo producers? Let's pretend it didn't tank. What Kimera even exists? We actually broke up. We didn't tank. Oh, really? Oh, who slept with whose girlfriend? I just want to correct you right there. We look for creative differences. Who is the Justin Timberlake of the group? Did we start already? No, yeah, sure. Don't worry about it. We're rolling. We're rolling. We'll figure stuff out. We're rolling hard. Did you guys make any money? Yeah, we probably made like 200. Two hundred dollars? I sold a bunch of CDs from a back of my car. There were 100 heirs to friends and family. They were 100 heirs. You guys got to buy dinner at Chewie's. Just groupies for days. Because I was looking at you at dinner. I'm like, he's good looking. He should be doing something in music or something, you know, but you did. He actually performed at my wedding. Yeah. No. Yeah. Yes. Yeah, I got it. If I ever get married, I'm making you come do mine now. Did you have like dance moves and like hand things and all that to like go with it? Okay. This guy practices dance moves in front of the mirror and all that shit. No way. Yeah. Oh my god. Yeah, I do. Wait till you see it. You're committed. I love it. I love it. There it is. It sounds good. Let's put it on. I got it. Hold on the fuck. I'm going to give it to you on the TV. Dumb dick. Look up there. We were... That was unnecessary. I really, I just do not know what to expect right now at all. Oh. There's cock fighting. There's cock fighting in the video. There's a lot of bestiality. Wow. Bestiality. We're going to get flat. Is there any fucking of carrot cop in the video? No. Thank you. So, great reference. This is, that's our other partner numbers. Not the dark though. Yeah. Great mustache. Yeah, you like that. It took me a month to grow. Costumes are good. Yeah. Shit. This is great, man. You know what you guys remind me of? LMFAO. The Dominican version. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Just a lot, a lot younger. It's like... Better looking. How, how many years, how many years goes this? It's like if Menudo and LMFAO had it good. Like four years ago. Oh, this is only four years ago. It's not that long ago. Yeah. That's a good beat, dude. The Italian in me likes it. I want a fist pump to it a little bit. How have we not put this on the forum yet? This 100% is going on our forum. He's embarrassed of it now. Fuck that. I am 100% not embarrassed. Bro, he was singing earlier to us. Dude, this is fucking awesome. This is great. Look at it, look at it. Be honest. Be honest. He sounds like an angel. How much money do you put in this video? Frankie, be honest here. I want to know something right here. When you, when you were doing this, I mean, did you guys have goals of continuing to pursue this? I did. Obviously you put some work in it because it's fucking good. Yeah, yeah, dude. I was, you see that script? That's where all my ideas for the videos now come from. You were the creative artist. Yeah, I'm really creative with this type of shit, but you see that Spinaroonie? I worked on it for like six months. Spinaroonie? Spinaroonie. You made its way up to the head spin. That's great, dude. This is awesome. Is that Mario? Check out my other part right here. What is it? I don't know what I mean. I won't get back. No. Squag hot is cold. That's true. Trust me. It pays those. Put the drinks down. Fist the cuffs. All the ladies come play with us. You know what, dude? We're going to make this shit go viral, dude. You know what we should have done is we should have played this and actually made Frankie sing in the mic to this or the audience. I listened to it while we do it. I can barely remember these lyrics. Oh, really? I mean, if I look at it, then I can make that. It's like scene wrap. Scene wrap? Look, look. He sounds like a song angel. Who's the Rick James guy? He used to work in my... He was my dad's gardener. How much did this cost to produce this? Nothing. It was actually our friend owns a nightclub. Wow. And those are all my buddies. And he just did us a solid favor. So that 200 dollars is all profit? The video editing friend of ours, you know, we gave him like 100... You gave him two CDs. Two CDs. Two CDs. He gave him some free cologne. You guys doubled your money the first time. That's pretty... You could tell people that. Dude, we're still going to post this on the Internet. This is one of the main highways in Dominican. Check it out. Yeah, I like it. This is a great video, dude. The after party right there. Good job. Yeah, turn it off. He wasn't acting there, was he? Because he looked like he was really drinking. Yeah, he was just passed out. He got super excited. He didn't actually know he was in a dance video, so... He just thought he was partying. Yeah, he thought he was partying. He's fucking partying. So great. So what was the name of the group? It was Primo. So that's the name of the group. Yeah, Primo. Wow, so how many songs do you guys do in the album? 15. Yeah, so if you go to SoundCloud, you go Primo, Producers, you'll find all our songs there. You don't get paid on any of this? I'm a little embarrassed about this one. Oh my God, more? Is that, that's numbers? Yeah, that's numbers. That's our CFO. Right here? Yeah, dude, he's really talented, and he just... This is a part of himself that he doesn't like exposing. He's a professional. Probably shouldn't have put on YouTube then, but... He's got a nice voice. That's a good point. Yeah. That's nice, man. Good deal. That's hilarious, man. How far do you guys go back? You know... Um, middle school? Oh, okay. And how far do you guys go back? We're in the same school, but we... All you guys? Yeah, when we moved back... I'm three years older than Frank, so when I moved off from Boston in 2003, Frank moved back from Miami, and we're all like, we got together to watch fights, and that's when we started hanging out. Wow, so you guys go... I mean, I remember you guys telling us this when we first talked to you guys about working together or whatever, and that's one of the things we liked the most about you guys, because you guys were genuine. Boys first. Yeah, you guys were genuine friends, and that resonated very strongly with us. I mean, you can't just go into business with anybody. People do that all the time, dude. I know. You know? And Frank and I, we did all types of business. We first started doing dehydrated fruits. Yeah, let's not talk about it. Wait, hold on a second. We gotta talk about this, man. Hold on, so you guys started a business on dehydrated fruits? We're like, we gotta start something together, and we started... And dehydrated fruits is where you started? No, what is... A flavored apple. Horrible idea. What is it that made you guys think that, like the entrepreneur mind in both of you that said like, we gotta do something together. Obviously, your friends, we grew up... I got lots of friends and I still talk to you since middle school, but I didn't go do business with all of them. What was it about your guys' characteristics that you both were like, okay, we gotta do business together? I think I always wanted to prove to people that we can do something in Dominican Republic with Dominican Republic products and... On an international platform. On an international platform, yeah. Oh, I see. Yeah. Is there not a lot of companies doing this? No. Not at all. Really? So you guys... Mostly, we export raw material. So you guys recognized... You guys recognized... For example, I'm sorry. Oh, no, go ahead, go ahead, go ahead. For example, like cacao or like chocolate. We have really big companies that export that and sell the raw products to like Hershey's or Goodiva. So you guys thought to yourselves, good friends, all of you have roots from Dominican Republic? Yeah. And you guys were proud of your roots and like, okay, we need to do something with these materials that are coming out of this country. Or just really smart fucking businessmen and you saw the opportunity. I mean, all of that, right? Yeah, I always thought that the country had so much stuff to offer and I wanted to show the world, we're not just a tourist place, we have all this amazing product and it'll hopefully motivate people to do other stuff. Like they'll find, I don't know, something, a t-shirt that's produced in DR and they're like, I want to do these t-shirts. Stuff like that. Wow. So... I mean, we're also like privy to all of these crops. I mean, they're in our backyard. So, you know... Now, did you guys travel a lot when you were kids to the Dominican Republic? I was born there. We were born and raised there. Yeah. Yeah. So we actually went to an American school over there. Like all our teachers were like... Yeah, because you guys speak English. Canadians and Americans. Okay. So that's, I mean, I had one Spanish class there. It's optional. Spanish class was optional. So, talk about your first businesses that you guys started to get. Talk about your failed businesses before we get into the successful one here. Those. Yeah. Well, it was called Manzanitas, which is like apples and small apples in Spanish. And it was just like dehydrated apples with like cinnamon flavor and chocolate flavor and... The company that we actually started is the company that now sells chimera coffee to our American company. Because that company was still alive. It's like a throwback. We used to bring DJs. It's the most massive pivot I've ever heard. Yeah. It's called Dry Apple. Dry Apple Industries. We used to bring DJs over. We had a fight league there. We put three big events like with 4,000 people. What? Yeah. It was on TV. I fucking love you guys. The thing is that I had a beach bar and I had like access to all these promoters, all these DJs. And as the beach bar, I hosted events, like big EDM events. My venue had like Tiesto, Swedish House Mafia, all the big DJs. And I had the know-how on throwing events. So we always like mixed martial arts and stuff like that. And I'm like, you know what? Fuck it. Let's do it. Let's do some events. I mean, I got the know-how. I got the contacts. How old were you when you first started your first business? Because you guys are young. You're not old guys. So I mean, you must have started, you guys were kids. 26, yeah. What, where did that come from? Like, where'd you get the balls to do something like that at that age? I didn't want to be an employee. I had worked in Boston as an employee and it just like, they work you to the ground. I mean, I love it because that's where I get all my like, my base and the foundations and work ethic. But I didn't want to like retire when I'm 65. And then like, have a 401k with, oh, now I have a million dollars when I'm 65 and my body's like, I can't use it, basically. So you guys all had this kind of attitude where your parents are entrepreneurs? Yeah, real estate, yeah. Oh, okay. So you guys had some good examples. Now, what inspired Kimera? Because you guys did the fruit company or the dry fruit that didn't work. Was there anything else after that or was? The fight league. The fight league. Now, did that, was there any success in that? Or was it just? The last event. Well, break that down. How'd that work? Like, what exactly were you doing? We were like hosting a MMA fight, like a card, a fight card. In a coliseum. Okay, on every bit of it then. So you guys would write a coliseum. Yeah, we actually feel. Explain how that works. And not a lot of people understand. Understand how that's a real legit. I had buddies that were like club promoters, did stuff which is kind of similar, like explain that process, what that's like. So we basically, we loved mixed martial arts. So basically I was the matchmaker. Frank put together the event. He had all his knowledge from like the EDM parties and everything. So he handled everything prior to the fight. Yeah, logistics from like sound, lighting. Right. You knew all the tickets. You got all these connections. Yeah. So now where does that come from? Were you just, were you really popular? Were you in your area? Did you have lots of friends? Obviously. Well, it's a small community. Okay. It's a small community. So we travel in the same circles with most of the people that were buying our tickets. Plus like when I used to host the events in my beach bar, I had all these contacts. A lot of people knew me from these events, from the beach bar. Like it was a really popular beach bar that was like 30 minutes away from the city. So like it was, I mean, it was a big deal. So like a lot of, I had a lot of contacts. So this is freaking awesome. I can't believe you didn't know this about you guys. So how, okay. So now walk us to how you guys started Chimera. Where did that come from? And who had the idea to do it? And what was that like? Well, I was actually listening to a podcast in a car about, it was a Joe Rogan podcast. He had a coffee expert. And during that time, the Dominican Republic had closed the deal with Godiva and Nestle for supplying their cacao. Well, I was listening to this podcast. I was thinking, man, Dominican, Dominican coffee, like nobody knows about Dominican coffee. They go to the store and it's like Colombian coffee. And we have, we have similar, like our mountain ranges are similar to like Jamaica, you know, like our weather. So, you know, the Jamaica, Jamaican blue coffee is like one of the best coffees in the world. Now, why, what makes it so good? You said about the mountain ranges that what, what are the characteristics of, you know, what kind of landscapes and stuff contribute to good coffee or why? Just like the soil and climate. Okay. Yeah. It's like it's high altitude. So it's like perfect. It's like a perfect soil, perfect climate. You know, it's high like high altitude. We get breeze, you know, we get the cool weather, the nice soil. And we also get the sun and then shade. And what kind of beans are these? These are Arabica? Yeah. Okay. Arabica, Katera. One interesting note is that that we didn't know until we started getting into this world that the coffee beans, they need to be shaded by other plants. Sometimes they use avocado plants or any other native plant. So the farmer or plant, this plant, this large plant there to shade it to give it. Oh, wow. Yeah. For that season, it'll have a different flavor than the next season, depending. So we'll be testing it out. Depending on what he's growing next to it. Yeah. Right. So what's typical? So avocado or something? Avocados, what we have. The plantains as well. Yeah. The plantains. So most of the time, it's probably the farmer needs to grow avocado and he'll put it there. What about artificially shading it? Would anyone think that artificially shaded? Is that something you would do? Is it? I think it would be, the farms are so big, it would be too much money to invest in. Okay. It makes more sense to grow something else to do that. Easier. Yeah. It's quite easier to do that. So you said you were listening to a podcast and then what happened next? Oh, so I was listening to a podcast and they were talking about coffee. And they were also talking about all these, you guys also, you talk about doing something for yourself, not being in those nine to five. And we were so, I have another real estate development company and I was frustrated with payments and everything. Like having a nine to five? Yeah. And having a nine to five. So I call Frank and I'm like, Frank, I have another idea. This is like our conversation. That's how our conversation is. Yeah. And Frank probably was like, this guy. He came at me with the whole coffee idea and I'm like, dude, another gourmet coffee. I don't, I don't. Yeah. And we were actually, we were taking like brain vitamins and coffee. And it was like, I found myself being really productive on both, on both things. But then, you know, separately, not as productive. So it was kind of like, wait, this is fucking, you know. This is an idea. This is, this is really, there's got to be something to this, you know. There's, it's like synergistic. So before you guys started to merit, like the tropics and coffee. Yeah, you were already supplementing. You were taking. Yeah. Neutropics, drinking coffee, you noticed together. I was like really concentrated at work and, you know, I substituted it for my pre-workouts. And, you know, I really liked the effect on it. And then we started talking. He did, Theos was taking the same thing, you know, stacking the same things. And, you know, we got to rapping and, you know, the idea was just like from a conversation that we had, we were like, yes. That's great. This is it. Yeah. Let's fucking try it. How hard it was. I imagine it must have been a long process to figure out how to throw something in there, not make it taste like shit. Yeah. 52 prototypes. That was all during that time. My, I was finishing up a building, so I was super busy. So Frank took the lead. Like, I'm like, we should do coffee. Let's add Neutropics. Like, we decided on that. So during that, probably it was like a year, a year and a half for it, was just like Frank experimenting on stuff. I bought a science scrub and some glasses and a little peachy dish. Essentials. And I was just basically like opening up the Facebook accounts, like doing all that like behind the scenes stuff. And Frank was like getting all this and I'm like, okay, Frank, we need this for the FDA. Go FDA, go take care of it. And he's like, okay, let me do this. Let me come up with this formula. We reached out to a lab in Virginia to get a little help because a lot of, you know, the mixes were coming out really, really bitter, really acid-y. Coffee tasted like shit. And then, you know, when there were a lot of little intricate details like, you know, if it's a food product, you have to have generally recognized as safe food additives. You can't just throw in any Neutropics. It's a bitch. My sister is going through this right now. They're trying to start. My brother-in-law is a hardcore downhill mountain bike guy. And he's creating a basically like a healthy whole natural Gatorade. And the hoops that they have to jump through because it falls in that category. Because they wanted to do it as a supplement. They thought they could do that. Yeah, you can't. So it's a bitch, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a lot of things that go into it. And, you know, our list started like at 15 different Neutropics. And then, you know, when it was a food additive, it, you know, lowered it like maybe like seven. Plus the cost. The cost of it, yeah. How long was this process of 52 prototypes? About a year. Yeah, a year and something. And a lot of money. Did it cost a lot of money to do that? Not too much. Okay. Not too much. I mean, Neutropics aren't that expensive if you buy them in bulk. Probably like a couple of hundred dollars. So a year of just doing this, now you hit the right. Like, okay, this tastes good. I like the effects. How'd you know when you got it? How did you both go, oh, this is it? Or was it like? We had a blind tasting. Yeah. Oh. With friends. Yeah, with about 12 friends. Yeah. And they got crazy. Yeah. They noticed it. They noticed it. Because you know, I didn't, you know, we, we didn't want to be biased or anything like that. Yeah. So we're like, let's, you know, let's have some people try it. Was it that obvious? Was it like, oh, shit. No way. We're like, almost all of them were like, oh, this is it. They definitely felt it. The thing that I've noticed about Camara and that I get messages the most on is for people who typically have issues drinking coffee. And what I mean by that is like, if I drink, so I'm sensitive to caffeine and if I drink coffee too much and have too much caffeine, I get edgy or I'll crash. So I'll get this energy spike and then I'll drop and crash really hard. And that's, Camara is the only coffee I've ever had where I can drink it pretty regularly. Otherwise I have to really stop after a few days of drinking coffee, but Camara can do it more regularly. And it's attributed to the, I guess, the new tropics. Yeah. Yeah. It's got to be. Who's, who's most? Probably like the, of the Elphianine. Yeah. Who's most responsible for finding the talent? Like who's the one who gets grabs, Chris and Jiu-Jitsu and search like who's. Yeah. Cause that's another, I want to talk about that too. Cause you guys are, I think you guys are very, very smart with how you guys are. You can spot talent. Advertising your, obviously you've shown us that. Yeah. I'd say it's 50, 50 Frank and Frank and I, we have, well we, we basically Frank and I have a budget that's split half and half. And we can choose basically whoever we want. I'll send it over to Frank. Like Frank, I found somebody, do you like this? And most of the time, like I'd say like 99% he'll say, yeah. Cause I want, it's someone that I looked at, but I want like the whole team to, to know about this person. So that's why you see, I practice no Giso. I do like the no G guys. Frank has his interest. Numbers doesn't have time to deal with, with ambassadors. He's busy behind the scenes. Yeah. Plus we don't like him coming out too much from his dungeon. Yeah. You've got to be, lock him away all day. Yeah. Is that because you shut down the door or what? No, no, no, no. How often do you guys strike out? Is it often that you guys pick someone you're like, Oh, that didn't work out really well. It's not what the relationship is it 50, 50? Are you nine times out of 10, right? Like how often do you hit it? Well, the thing is that, you know, you already have a, on Instagram, you already have your portfolio. So if your feed sucks, you pretty much know what you're getting into. Talk about that a little bit. Cause I think there's a lot of people that are trying to build their business through social media and being a big company that picks up on, on these things and decides, hey, let's affiliate ourselves with them or let's sponsor this athlete. What are you looking for? What are you looking at? Okay. Well, people, the first thing that you have to do is stop taking pictures with your fucking phones, right? We don't want any fucking blurry pictures. You know, you need a, you need to buy, if you're actually going to make a career out of this, you need like good equipment, like a DSLR. They're not that expensive. And if you're actually going to, you know, try it to get some sponsorship out of it. You need high quality images for, you know, companies to actually use your shit. That's a big deal. Yeah. So I, I, you know, I tell people a lot of too, with like Instagram, you know, I actually, I'm sorry, I'm sorry about that. You could use like good iPhones or good Samsung. Cause now, now smartphones. Yeah. Now smartphones can, you know, you're big on landscape. I remember you giving a shit for that. Using landscape video. Horizontal. Yeah. Yeah. I'm super anal with it. When people post a picture and the landscape isn't horizontal, it's like the first thing they teach you in photography. Yeah. Well, let's, let's talk about why these things are important. We know details. Yeah. Like people don't really understand that. They don't understand that. There's, there's reasons behind why that's not just cause you like pictures nice like that. You're looking at it from a business perspective. It's the likelihood of somebody, because the picture is professional, I'm more likely to read the caption and then from there, what it could end up leading to, right? Of course. Of course. I mean, I tell people a lot to just, you know, pull your, your Instagram page, since Instagram's we're talking about visual stuff, you know, pull it away from your face and that, from a bird's eye view, when you just look at all the image, do they make you want to click on them? Do they make you want to look and see what is this picture all about? Or what does he say? Or this is a great shot and want to comment. Think about it like that, you know. Dude, with everybody on Instagram and everybody using social media, you need to find a reason for people to get, look at your stuff. You know, why? Why would people want to look at your stuff? Right. So who found, which one of you guys found us? Frank. Oh, okay. I listened to you guys. Yeah. So excellent. Yeah. He was trying to get with you guys for, for a long time. Yeah. We went to one of the fit expos and we saw like all the hoopla with the shreds booth. Yeah. And then I didn't really know shreds then, but then I started, you know, after seeing like the circus they had on, like I started seeing the, the CFO, dude. Frank. From a business perspective, it's interesting. Right. That's what's interesting. I'm sure your mind works like mine where you saw it and you're like, are you fucking kidding me? Like I started diving into all their stuff to see. I was like, wow, I can't believe this company. Frank bought a Lamborghini because of them. Yeah. I had to sell everything I had. People please buy the coffee. And we were, we were early. I think we were one of the first people to really call them out. A lot of people, if you've been a long time listener, you know that, but if you weren't a long time, because now they get all kinds of shit. Everybody's hating on them and talking about them, but I don't remember anybody else hating on them. Back then they were the cool kids. They were coming, they're on their way up when we were like, uh, dude, I just found it really funny that they were like, this dude is like hopping on a helicopter. He's like, you know, a close-up of him shaving himself, putting on this, this like a crisp new shirt. And, and then he's like, yeah, you need some BCAA. I'm like, what the fuck? I'm looking at it with my shaker cut behind me. BCAAs have to do with you fucking hopping on a helicopter. Right? Right? It makes sense. But it's fascinating as fuck when you look down and you see 100,000 people like this, right? It makes you go like, what the fuck? Are the dude hopping out of a Lambo? And then, you know, with the shaker and the protein. So we were talking about this the other day, there's actually, this is a company that's on the rise right now, are these companies that lease these cars now for time periods? Like here one hour, you can have a Lamborghini. So people are taking these Lamborghinis and taking these doing photo shoots and stuff with it. I guess getting that point where that business is on the rise that you can actually make some decent money renting to people so they can look like. You know what, to be in all honesty, like I've been reading some marketing books and I'm one of the books that I read, there was a chapter called Fake it till you make it. So I mean, they kind of basically, that's where it comes from. But I do think it's, I do think that it's starting to change because social media, you're starting to see now that it's realism is more like, like we'll do a photo shoot with me getting out of my Jetta. Like that's what we're gonna do next. You know what I mean? Yeah, but all professional, you know? All professional looking though. I mean, I think in the long run, it's better just to be real. Yeah. You know, that's what's gonna get you longevity. It's what you were saying. You were saying that you said, we were the first ones on hating them. You're not hating, you're being a realist. Yeah. And a lot of people are like, he is hating because it's like an easier word. But when people, when I call out people on social media, they're like, you're a hater. I'm like, no, you're a realist. This guy did this. It's wrong. And he's doing it wrong. And I remember when we said it, it wasn't like we just shit on the company. It was like, dude, I got mad respect for the guy who did it. You know? He saw in a beautiful opportunity and was on top of Instagram faster than I was. Literally built a business through Instagram. That is a million something dollar business. Plus, I mean, I think it was, what was it valued at? His company? Way more than that. Yeah, yeah. No, no, no. He did really well actually. Yeah, I don't remember what it was, but I mean, he's made a shit ton of money through Instagram. And I find that very, very fascinating that someone could do that. That's crazy. People can hate, we can hate all we want as far as the cheesiness of it and this and that. But I mean, that's, you got to brilliant. You know how they did, you know they actually own a lot of the pages? All the pages, the big pages. So they got in so early. It was so smart to get in early. He owns like, you know, Shredded Academy, you know, bodybuilding, you know, all those big ones that are got like 1.5, 3 million people and they're just pictures of Shredded people, the whole thing. It's owned by Shredded. So then they use, they sell people, they sell the people to get on their market. So I would pay $600 for them to post me on their page. They're making money revenue that way. And then in addition to that, they're marketing themselves through their thing. And then they build multiple pages up. So they have like 10 of these. And so a guy like me who might not know this comes in, I pay $600 for this page, this page, this page, this page. And it's really all the same people. I'm advertising too. I don't know it because it's spread across these different pages. Bro, look at that, bro. It's pretty smart. In 2012, oh, is that 2012, if that was, or 13? 13. In 10 months, they made a $3 million business. Shredded's turned into... What does it say after the comma? He says. That's a good point. That's a good point. Yeah, can you get real? Hey, he looks older than 28. Yeah. Well, you know. He's not 28, he's gotta be older than 28. I mean, that's decent. We were rallied at $100 million a couple of months back. He says, he says me. You say it is. He says, he says, the strategy that you guys have for building your brand, I really respect because you go to different, you go to different avenues, different sports, and you tend to find talent that isn't necessarily massive, but has some kind of a reach. It's the Red Bull approach, right? Who was doing it before Red Bull? Do you know who did that first? They really were the first ones to do that. I mean, is that what you're doing? You're trying to find like, okay, this person looks like they've got all this talent, they're going to grow. Let's get in now so we can kind of grow along with them. I mean, essentially, that's what you want to get. Yeah. You want a smart business. We ask, I ask numbers all the time, like, tell me something you're passionate about so I can go look it up. It's hard to get stuff out of him. But I ask Frank, what do you like? So maybe Frank likes yoga. So then I'll look into yoga and I say, I found these yoga people running sometimes because you start focusing just on little things after you get. So it's good to ask people and ask even your team because even though I speak to Frank every day, sometimes I don't know, maybe he's interested in a go-karting. Yeah, I think it's a little mixture of somebody that might have a big following, but we also have people that just have really nice pictures or are really talented and then our feed looks good. Right. Like you saw that, some of the videos that we do on become the legend or the motivational videos. And you see the clips on the athletes that we have and you see the quality and you see the coolness about it. And then you're like, wow, yeah. So what has been the greatest challenge for you guys right now? I think like we're going through a process right now and it's funny as you get to a new level in the business, comes on new challenges. And right now we're definitely in this place where it's like there's so much that we want to accomplish and get done and we just need more manpower and it's almost time to again reinvest in that and it's again dips into our pockets to do that. But if we want to scale this and grow it to the next level, these are the things that are necessary. What are some of the growing pains that you guys are currently going through and that you've gone through before? Well, I think that e-commerce is just like a beast of its own. Like it's like Amazon and shit like that. Well, no, not really Amazon because Amazon is like pretty much takes care of itself. Amazon is the easy one. Yeah, Amazon is the easy one. But you know, there's two things about like your website, like how do you drive traffic to your website? And then once you have traffic there, how do you retain it? You don't want people coming in and then just leaving and not coming back. So you got to like set the correct traps in place to retain those people or like offer them something that's attractive to them. And once you have them, then you have to cater to them and preserve them like with your let's say you offer them a really cool subscription email. Something that has like some value. So, I mean, right now I would say that our single biggest asset is our customer list. Yeah. Do you guys run into a lot of challenges in the beginning? Like what are some hurdles that you had to overcome as you guys grew? Oh, well, learning about that business. Yeah, but there's small hurdles in even like the exporting stuff. Some of the times it got so difficult like getting permits in the DR or getting permits. Just bureaucracy. Yeah. And it's good that we were three business partners because at one point I told Frank, like that's it. I don't want to deal with more phone calls. Like it's done, the project said. And then Frank would tell, no, come on, let's do it. I'll handle this. And the same thing when he goes doing it, he's like, the formula doesn't work. Let's whatever. It's never going to work. I always had in my mind, like if it was easy, everybody would be doing this. I'm just going to just keep on trucking, keep on doing this fucking thing till it gets off the ground. And that's the way I approached it. How long did that take? When was the turning point where you're like, oh shit, this business is. Yeah, like about a year. It took about a year. Like to take off. Because before we took the business off, it's a little bit different than just having a US coffee business because we have to import the natropics into the Dominican Republic. And then we have to export. So in order for us to have like exemptions on taxes because we're exporters, we need to like file a lot of permits and stuff like that in the Dominican Republic. And we have to file, let's say, for each natropic, we have to file something. And we have to make yearly projections and have all these tables and charts. And we have to submit all that and then have meetings with them. What a nightmare. And explain the business. So there's a lot of red tape that goes into this. So it's a little bit different. Here in the States, I believe you can, if you have a coffee company, you just maybe like buy the beans off a middleman or like have someone export the beans to you and then they handle that nightmare and you just pay whatever you have to do at the port or maybe you could do like door-to-door delivery. Have you ever thought about growing the coffee in the DR and then bringing it to the US and then doing the neutropics and everything here? Well, it's cheaper over there. It would be too much expensive. Oh really? Like the manpower over there. Plus, we really like contributing to the farm community. Dude, those guys are so happy that we're there and when we go there, all the locals, we have a charity over there with the owners of the coffee for a while. So we contribute to the school children. And we had Jujimufu go there in December and it was really- That was cool. It was fun. We had a full blowout event with like a buffet. We dressed up as elves, like fucking fools. Jujimufu came out as Santa Claus, jacked Santa Claus. All the moms like tossed their kids to the side and started rubbing up on him. We're making Jujis like sweaty body. You know, dude, he's such a- you know, what a perfect guy to do that with, dude. He's just like that. Oh yeah. He's just like his Instagram. He's a funny guy. He is. He was one of our favorite guests to get a chance to get like to know. He's such a smart guy too. Such a smart guy. A lot of- I don't think a lot of people realize how smart he is because- He was an IT, bro. Bro, he is. He used to build computers. I know. He's- He's a nerd. Very, very bright, man. And when you get to talk to him off air and like really dive into his mind and like what he's trying to do, and he, god, he learns fast. Talk about not judging a book by its cover, huh? Fuck yeah. You know what? And you guys found him early. Way early. He had 3,000 followers. 3,000? Holy shit. That's a testament to your guys' ability. Yes. You guys found us way small. We were, when you signed on with us, that was really early. I mean, we're, god, probably five times the downloads now compared to when you guys signed up with us. I think that's- I mean, which also we have this incredible deep loyalty to you guys because of that because I think that is so cool. Well, at that time, especially, I mean, we- Nobody wanted to touch us. We're hard to sponsor. You guys were so controversial. Yeah. I'm like, yes. Yeah. I love these guys. Yeah. How much do you feel like we've told you every time? Because you've been listening since almost day one. I mean, yeah, you guys are pussies now. That's all Doug's fault. I tell these motherfuckers. Yeah, I see Doug. Oh, Doug. He's censoring you guys. Tell them, right? Hold on to spread your wings and fly. How many honest episodes do you think you've listened to? He's all 10. I mean, why are you putting on a spot like that? Because I know he's listened to a lot. I know it's not five. I know. Like, six. No, I don't know. Maybe like 40. Oh, that's awesome. I like when you guys talk about your daily lives, like your relationship with your wives and kids. That's- Do you know I got a great opportunity from- So my buddy, Brennan Obendezio, is he was on Fox, Fox One Sports. And so he was connected to the producer of Fox. And Fox actually owns like 40 different podcasts. And at this time they owned Fighter and the Kid. And I got a chance to actually talk to him on the phone because, you know, and this was early on in Mind Pump. So, you know, of course I knew the reality of like Fox picking us up like we just started, you know. So I'm like, okay, they're not going to pick us. Indeed, down inside, I'm going to swing for the- I hope I strike it with this guy so much. But that didn't happen. But what did happen was I had a great conversation with him. And he gave me a lot of good tips. And one of the things that he attributes to Fighter and the Kid's success is their ability to storytell and to share their personal lives. And that was when we put that- Well, we- We naturally did it kind of right out the gates, but that was something that we- We try and make a conscious effort to do more of that. Especially these two guys, I'm always trying to push them in the direction of sharing their stories with their kids. Because I feel like being a guy who's not a father, there's so much that I've learned listening to them that's made me go like, oh, shit, I would handle that differently. I'm glad I heard that. I'm glad I heard that dialogue. And I'm like, God, if I feel that way, there's got to be fucking thousands of other people. So- Of course. I definitely think that- I mean, you've got a lot of point of views here. You're a dad, right? How old is your kid? A two-year-old. Oh, man. No sleep? Are they terrorizers? Yeah, he's a little shit. He does pull-ups. Frank's doing him pull-ups and improving his grip strength. All right, yeah. Two-year-olds are very energetic when you give him coffee. You know what I mean? Yeah. You saw that? He has like one or two cups a day only, right? Yeah, I just- Yeah. You limit it to 300 milligrams of caffeine. Yeah, 300 milligrams a day. Somebody's pissed right now. So, yeah, he likes dipping his finger into my coffee. Oh, really? Yeah. Yeah, but I don't even notice. Like, sometimes I'll just put the coffee on the coffee table and he'll come over and I'm like watching TV and he'll just dip his hand in there and start drinking the coffee like, no! Take care. Stop that. How many different areas are you guys into? What I mean by that is I know you guys have athletes in MMA, obviously podcasting. Oh my god, do they have drone racing? They've got freaking- You were just telling me yesterday about, or maybe this morning that you guys work in the gaming world, video gaming world. You guys got into that. We've been trying to get into that. We actually work with a guy that we sponsor him. He's the league announcer. So he does the play-by-play. He used to be like a professional Call of Duty player. And so we've been working with him for a while. He's out in the UK. He's really good. His hashtag is follow DK. I'm not really a big gamer. So Theo Hansel's that. Yeah. Unless you consider- So is that your lead? Unless you consider a part of the pool game. So are you the drone guy too? Yeah. Because that was early. You were on that early too. My two best friends that grew up with are so geeked out on drone racing right now. And it's hilarious because that was like two years ago. It was two years ago, right? When you picked them up. And that was the first I'd ever really seen it. I never even heard of it. And each year the drones are getting faster and faster. Oh, that's crazy now. It's on ESPN now. It's like a legit- The spectators, if you put on the goggles and say a spectator you want to follow drone one or drone two or drone three. And I think that's what's cool. And I think it's going to be the future sport. I think you guys are fucking visionaries. I think you're 100% right. No, it makes so much sense. It's so- So check this out. My girls- So Katrina's company just now hired three full-time employees that all they do is fly drones. Three pilots. And then they call them pilots. So they're- It's a construction company, right? Yeah, it's a construction company. And they have now have hired a position in the company that did not exist one year. Not even fucking six months ago. It's now a position enough to where they're hiring three people that this is their new job now to do that. So you got to know that these guys are going to get contracts like this. I mean, I'm in construction. And before what you used to like back, way back in the day when, you know, my dad first started his construction company, he used to hire someone in a helicopter. And that was so expensive. So now everybody like if you have like a construction website, you want to put like all the developments from like that type of angle from like a drone angle. So you need to hire someone. Everybody that's doing a building pretty much. So when I see stuff like that, and then you see something like drone racing, which will become the pros of doing flying drones, can do anything, any condition. Like you got to know that's their fallback plan, right? You as a kid, you get to have fun, build these cool ass drones, make some money through sponsorships and shit. And then your pivot is the possibility of you actually working for a large company doing this. That's the future. And you got to know that. And you see now when you go to like the Spartan race and some of these big events, all you see is these drones all over the place, shooting all different angles. I mean, you're going to see more and more of that. So brilliant that you were on top of that, man. I mean, the drone shots are just so epic. They make whatever video you're doing just feel epic. Yeah, it's on the list for us as far as the new toys. We just, you know, we just picked up, but did you boys see the webinar, Doug's, what was it Doug called? What's it called? Sling studio. Sling studio. This is, oh man. Like one man can do the job of like four camera men and you know, somebody that's managing the whole thing. So it connects to your iPhone, it connects to GoPro, connects to the DSLRs. Like you could connect it to anything. You could have six different cameras, different types of cameras, all Bluetooth together, Doug's controlling it all through his iPad. It's pretty awesome. Yeah, it's cool. So how did you guys, so do you have Chris with you? How did you guys end up meeting up with Chris and as you guys traveling together? Chris actually wrote to my email, not Chris's buddy Kevin wrote to my email. Yeah, my manager, my business manager. Yeah, and I said to Theo, yeah, it makes sense and I want to scrap with him. So I want to fight him. So here we are. So it was animosity right from the beginning, huh? Yeah, so talk about that. So that's legit. Well, Chris, so your guy reached out to him, was that because you told him to or he was looking for good matches for you? How'd that happen? He knew that I loved coffee. And I think that he saw you guys and saw that you guys were, you know, entrepreneurs and had a sharp eye and were cool. And all of your pages and feet is awesome. So I think that was kind of like, he saw synergy there. Yeah. And Frank likes to like beat up on you ambassadors so he's like, get this guy up, set it up. It'll validate me. It's not, it's not, you're not gonna be able to beat up on him like the gamers. Yeah. It's not the same. Yeah, yeah. It's not the same with those. Yeah. Well, he should work your way up the ambassador line a little. I've been training though. Yeah, okay. I'm assuming Chris is tougher than the World of Warcraft kid. So Chris, you got quite a pedigree in boxing and in kickboxing. What do you think about this upcoming fight that's coming up here, dude, with McGregor and Mayweather? I mean, it's, it's, everyone asked me, and like, I'd really give the simple answer. They're boxing. So the boxer is going to win, you know? So it's, I think it's going to be really tough for, for McGregor to transition. And from, from, from my experience, I've worked with a ton of MMA guys in my own sparring, my own training. And I literally, I literally came from an MMA gym. It's just the pace is going to be so difficult for, for McGregor to deal with. So he's going to get schooled. I think so. I think. Well, you and I were talking at dinner and I, and I, what I thought was, you said that what I see is like, what, we said four rounds. You said, anybody has two rounds, right? So maybe he gets to six and he can hang there. And by that time he'll wear him down. And I told you that the line is seven or seven and a half. He goes to seven. Yeah, I said, I said five or six rounds. I think that McGregor is big enough, strong enough that he'll be in there for a little bit. And like I said, he's got a couple rounds in him. But I think the pace is going to catch up pretty quick. And Floyd's really, that's one thing Floyd is any is good at. Well, the best thing he's good at is really being smart and seeing his opponents and analyzing at the moment. You know, he's always seeing where a guy is, seeing where he's hurt, wearing his out of breath, how he's breathing. He literally analyzes everything that's happening in the ring. That's what I mean. What he's known for, he goes that, that those first one to two rounds, every Mayweather fight you'll watch is kind of slow paced. And you can see he's filling out the guy's rhythm and he'll even lose rounds. He could, I could see him losing around to McGregor in the first couple rounds. That's why you need to keep it to two rounds. Like we're doing, we're doing two rounds, two rounds. That's all I need. That's hilarious. So are you guys all watching the fight together or what? No, that's August 26th. Oh yeah. I'll probably be back in a minute. You'll be back over there. I see, I said last night, and Chris agreed with me that I think McGregor's just going to disqualify himself. Yeah. I think he's going to start getting his ass kicked. I mean, bite his ear. He's going to throw like a kick or do some like a legal move. That's like the first thing I thought was going to happen in terms of how the fight is going to end. And I go, you don't think it's going to go the distance? I'm like, no, I think that once McGregor realizes that he can't hang, he's going to try and make it really, really rough. And I think the refs are going to be ready for that. So. And then that'll be a wonderful setup for a part two or something like that. I think it's a great call. But I think people that are, I think the fact that they have allowed all the hype to actually get in everybody's head that McGregor actually has a chance. It's just brilliant. That's what boxing promoting is though. That's how it's always been. You try and make, you try and blow things up. Make people believe that the underdog can win. It's funny that I totally feel like I can see this being, could be a really boring fight, to be honest with you. And I still have got to watch it. Just because. Honestly, I hate all of it. I hate that. I hate everything that's going on in the promotion and what it's doing for, you know. Well, because you're a boxer. Exactly. So you get this guy who's never fought before and he's going to chance to fight a, like literally a living legend. One of the best fighters, best fighter of our generation, where guys like me have been dreaming about fighting guys like this for our whole lives. You know, and this guy literally is, this has been a two-year campaign. Don't you have like a big match that's going to happen right around that time that like nobody's talking about? Triple G, right? Isn't it in Canelo? Which is an awesome fight between two absolute studs in the sport. Like some of the, two of the biggest names in the sport and it's being overshadowed by this sideshow. Right. You actually have a pretty, I'm surprised because even at dinner you didn't say anything. I expected meeting somebody of your caliber that is exactly, that would be almost pissed about that because like you said, that's, that could be your paid day. It should be your paid day. You've put the work in. If you definitely have a better chance than- My goal when I had the Pacquiao fight was, if I beat Pacquiao, we were going for Mayweather the next fight. And that was who actually Pacquiao fought after he defeated me. He went right on Mayweather the very next fight. Oh, I didn't know that. Like that was literally the semi-final for the Mayweather sweepstakes. Damn. So that was, that was, so now like seeing this is like, fuck. Now walk me through what that was like getting ready for someone like Pacquiao's. Pacquiao is fucking the real deal. Another living legend. I've been saying this too, about the McGregor Mayweather fight. I'm like, McGregor picked, I mean, obviously he's the biggest, bigger, bigger guy, but if he fought Pacquiao, totally different situation. Like he's got a really good chance of getting really fucking hurt with Pacquiao. Pacquiao's an offensive machine. Mayweather's not so much, you know, so stylistically- And he looks like he's been hitting the Mexican supplements. Oh, is Pacquiao getting jacked right now? I mean, that's been, they've been saying that for years, but, but yeah, so back to your question, and I'm about, you know, how did that come about? You know, I basically, with boxing, especially when you're coming from where I came from, which is basically a homegrown, grassroots kind of campaign to get to where I got, you just got to beat a bunch of people you're not supposed to beat. You know, and I was an underdog for, you know, much of my higher level career, and I just kept winning. You know, I ended up beating Ruslan Provotnikov in a fight that, I was, I believe the odds opened up at 14 to one. Oh shit. It closed much closer. I think it was finally like six or seven to one. I know people that won a lot of money on my fight that night. And a testament to your will, in the first round, he hit you with a really big shot that blessed your orbital bone. Have you seen his Instagram? I saw that picture. What did I? Yeah. Pretty much had a purple grapefruit on my eye for most of the fight, but yeah, he came in with a left hook in the first round, and literally, people, this is what people don't realize in the public, like how dangerous punches really are. I came with one punch in the first minute of the fight. It broke my orbital in three places, my nose in two, and my eye was shut. Damn! Shut, one punch, literally, one single punch. People don't, people don't understand how good we are at punching. You know, like, it's what we do, you know? So, it's really dangerous in there, yeah. It's a salt. And that was four months before his pack-yell fight. Yeah, that's another thing. He had that busted eye. So, we were talking about that last night, they're like, that's not enough time for that to heal. I'm like, no, it's not, but you know, like, what are you going to do? You going to turn on the pack-yell fight? You take the opportunity when you can't, you still fighting, right? Absolutely, yeah. We're looking to come back in December. Oh, that's awesome, man. Tomorrow he's fighting Frank. Yeah, I'm going to be his tune-up. I want to talk a little bit about your journey into becoming a pro, what that was like. I mean, what inspired you to be a fighter and then what was that like trying to fight your way all the way to becoming a professional athlete? Yeah, so that's a great question. I literally played every sport you could think of. You know, we talked about swimming earlier. I swam, I played baseball, I played football, I literally played everything. I played baseball. The whole team aspect for me didn't fit. Like, it didn't make sense for me. Even as a child, I was like, you know, if I had a bad game and we won, it kind of felt empty. And if I played really well and we lost, I was pissed. So I'm like, this is, I don't know, this team thing doesn't really make sense for me. Swimming was cool because it was more individual, but at the same time, I wanted to punch people. I wanted to fight. I grew up, like, I had an older brother and he's, he's, you know, he's been a big part of my life and kind of my upbringing too. And he's just make me fight kids all the time. Like, oh my God, we had his baseball games and he'd be like, yeah, my brother couldn't, my brother couldn't run faster than your brother. And I'd be like a look at him like, kid's two years older than me and three feet taller than me. And I don't think I, all right, all right. Then we'd race and I'd lose. He goes, yeah, but my brother kicked your brother's ass. Oh God. And then I'm like, again, and I don't think I can. But, and we'd do it. We'd be in a ring of older guys and I'd be literally like, like scrapping, scrapping kids, you know, fighting them all over. Did you have any technique back there? Not back then. Not at all. I was just, you know, I was just winging punches. I'm looking at him like, why are you doing this to me? At one point, did you realize you liked it though? Did you go through a phase where you're like, I'm kind of enjoying this because I'm assuming after enough street fights, after you've been beat up a few times, you actually get pretty fucking good at it. You know what it is? I was fighting so many people that are older than me and my brother used to kick my ass so much. I was just, I wasn't afraid of anybody my age or anyone even, somewhat around me. So like, and other people kind of noticed that like, yeah, he's not worried about these fights anymore. Like, this is, this is kind of cool to watch him, watch him go. And then I got into martial arts and then I like, didn't ever look back. I think I was eight or nine years old and I started training martial arts. What'd you start with? Chinese Kempo. Oh, sure. Yes. That's where I started. And we had a few. So my sense, a Robert Morrow, he, his father was a former boxer. So there was a lot of boxing involved in how he did his, his, his training and, and his, his style. So when we sparred, we sparred like full contact with boxing gloves on and, you know, like, it was, this is kind of before the advent of, of, of MMA and we kind of brought a lot of that kind of all around fighting involved. I have a similar background. I'm a black belt in Billy Blanks Tybald. Yo, Billy Blanks could fight his ass off too. Like he was one of those guys that I looked up to as a kid because he was a, he was a legit professional kickboxer. So you just played it when you saw him on the infomercials? Nah, I was like, good for you. Dude, get the money. Yeah, right. Get that paper. You probably did make a lot of money in fighting back then. No, not at all. We'll talk about what that's like to, coming up financially through the ranks because I'm assuming for a boxer it doesn't really get decent financially until you get up to the professional level. So I love kickboxing and I didn't leave it because I didn't like it. I left it because there was no money. I won two world titles. I was undefeated, two different weight classes, two organizations. I fought some of the, I fought gosh, I'm literally all over the world in kickboxing. My biggest payday was like four grand. Oh, wow. As a world champion. True time world champion undefeated. How fucking bullshit is that dude? Yeah. Just wasn't very popular and it was also, again, that's when MMA was really picking up. So kickboxing got really kind of shut out. People were boxing fans or people were MMA fans. Kickboxing got stuck in the middle. Like, all right, you guys are sure. That's so crazy to me because kickboxing is so like. Awesome. Yeah, they're so entertaining and crazy. It doesn't, why is it not caught on? It doesn't have a pedigree in America like boxing does. If you go, like I remember, if you go to like, for example, in Japan, right, and you watch MMA in Japan, the crowd doesn't boo when people hit the ground, like they do in America. They respect it. Because Japan has a judo pedigree, a grappling pedigree. Also, they understand it. And here in the U.S., we don't. It's boxing. So, you know, it's just, it's just different. Ooh, stand them up, your frags. Yeah, exactly. We're here. USA, USA, USA. And that's just it. And so in the U.S., I mean, it's you, the box. And now MMA is starting to grow. So that's the other thing too. So I always find it, you know, when I first started watching, I was a big boxing fan as a kid. And then when UFC started, we were huge fans. And, you know, I remember I'd have friends that did martial arts, like the traditional martial arts. And I'd tell them, like, man, you get your butt kicked by like a boxer who's only been doing it for like a year or two or whatever. And then I remember in school, there was this kid who did a little bit of boxing. And then there was this other kid that was a black belt in like Taekwondo. And the kid who was a boxer, we had them fight to see who would be. And the kid, I mean, kick the shit out of them. And I don't think people realize just like, how effective of a fighter you can be if you practice fighting and how ineffective of a fighter you are if you never practice fighting. Like you can throw all the punches and kicks. But if you never get hit or hit anybody, you're not doing it. So Chris, how did you not go, I mean, I would think someone with your pedigree would highly consider MMA, like going that direction. Like what made you go the boxing direction instead of the MMA direction? Yeah, so this is really the way that I put it. I grew up watching boxers. And I remember watching with my grandpa, my grandfather was from Argentina and boxing is big down there. And he used to talk about these guys. Like they were like gods among men. So I grew up idolizing boxers. There wasn't even MMA when I was a kid. So like I don't have that memory of looking up to Randy Gattur. Because when Randy Gattur was popular, I was already boxing, already training like that. So like even now, people are like, oh, what about boxing? I'm like, I don't have a passion for, what about MMA rather? I don't have a passion for that sport. And these sports are so dangerous that if I don't have a passion for it, I can't balance out the risk versus reward for that to make that jump. It's funny you should say that, Sal, because when I look at myself in the mirror, I go, with great power comes great responsibility. Whenever I'm going to go to concerts or night clubs or bars, I just can't be throwing these hands around. Or cruises. Or cruises. When you're about to pop open that bottle. Not too proud of that. Wait, wait, wait, what? This sounds like a story. Sounds like there's a story involved there. What was this? Dude, I don't. Was this this recent trip? I don't encourage fighting. He can't say that on air. I don't encourage fighting. Oh, don't worry, Doug, and it's all this stuff. I don't encourage fighting, but yeah, I got into a little scrap about six years ago on a cruise ship. I mean, it was on a 31st of December. It was like 130 a.m. You know, everybody was up on deck having drinks, New Year's. I mean, come on. And I was with all my cousins, my little cousins, and we had these four dudes just passing by us and yelling racial slurs at us. Like, freaking beaners. Oh, wow. Your wetbacks. I'm like, dude, I'm not even fucking Mexican. You asshole. Insult me correctly, you motherfucker. That's what I say to people. Like, you didn't insult me. Insult me, right, you dick. And then my little cousin goes to the bathroom and I see that they ambush him and they grab him by the throat. He's like, screaming, Frankie, Frankie. And I stand up and I like rush over there and the dude that was holding him down, he's like, fuck you, what are you going to do? And I just punched him right in the face. And you got him in a guillotine. I got the other dude in. So you punched one dude, guillotine, the other motherfucker? Yeah, I did that. Damn, nobody caught this on video. The security ain't problem. That one went viral. I did a triangle choke on him, but yeah, I don't encourage anybody from, I don't know, no fighting, man. It was really expensive for me too because the guy sued me for assault. I had to go to jail for like four days. Holy shit. What the, are you serious? Miami Dade, shot out to my homies in Miami Dade Correctional Facilities. Still doing something. Shot out to Dante and Negron. Four days? Four days, because it was like... You did real hard time. I did hard time. When I went to, when they got me in the system, I had to go through immigration and they didn't, they just put me in there without going through immigration. And the immigration offices were closed. So they had to wait till they opened. Yeah, they had to wait till the... It was a long weekend, right? Yeah, it was like everybody was on vacation. Oh, you were so big. So I got, yeah, they threw me in there like Saturday morning, and they put in my request on Monday and then got me out on Tuesday afternoon. What was the lawsuit? What was he trying to sue? Assault, assault and badminton. Well, you knocked out his teeth. Yeah, yeah, it's permanent damage. When you permanent, do some permanent damage. This was six years ago? You know, because your teeth don't go back. You knocked his teeth out? Yeah. That was a small detail you left out. Like if I told you a story and I punched somebody, you're not a very good storyteller. If I tell somebody I punched someone, I'm definitely gonna let you know. Well, like I said, I'm not proud of it. And you forgot. You made that point already. You can forget it. It's funny because when I punched the dude, okay, now that we're, you know, it's the story telling. Disclaimers overdue. The elevator shaft was right behind him. And it had a sensor. And when it senses people, it opens, right? And this guy went in there and when it senses people inside, it closes. So it closed. If you fucking got. Yeah, I punched him inside the elevator shaft and then it closed. And then it was really funny. It's like a movie. Yeah, it's like a movie. So like when the scrap was over, the elevator shaft opens back up and he comes crawling out like the walking dead and his mouth is like full of blood. He spit his teeth out. Where's teeth? Did his teeth stay on that floor and he went down? I don't know. He said I'm right. So Frank called me. He called me like on the third day, he called me from jail and he's, I'm going to let him explain this. And he's like, man, I even had to do a three way here. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Now he'll explain. Well, no, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Hold up, hold up, hold up. Frankie, you are terrible story teller. That sounds like somebody fucked me. Okay, I didn't. You were the one doing the fuckish. Listen, there was no fucking going on. Yeah, there was no fucking going on. Sure. You know, my ass is still virgin. He meant a three way call. When he called me, he didn't tell me, then I'm like a three way and then he explained like, but explain that three way call. That's a good story. Yeah, so inside the cells, they have like pay phones. And one of the ways they make money is that you get money in your account and then you make calls, like collect calls and stuff like that. So they make money off that. But nobody had money in their accounts. I guess they're like expensive phone calls. I didn't see how much they were, but I used to be doing phone calls, like calling my uncle collect. Like three times a day. So yeah, like three times a day. And like after the four, yeah, and I'm like, nobody's using the phones here. I'm like, what the fuck is going on? This is like $100. And everybody's like eyeballing me. I'm like, chatty Kathy on the phone. And then like, yeah, this fucking one dude, like is eyeballing me. And I know that he's got something going on in his head, like just looking at me. And he decides to man up and like roll up on me. He's like, yo, white boy, let me get a three way. I'm like, what? He's like, yeah, tell whoever's on the other line to get my number on the call. I'm like, mom, can you put Uncle Junior on the phone? One of my friends in here wants to make a phone call. And then she puts, you know, obviously I'm not going to tell my mom that one of the fucking inmates wants to do a freaking phone call. So I'm like, I tell my uncle, okay, dial 555-33 whatever. So he dials up this chick, right? And he goes, okay, Darnell's on the phone for you. He's like, give me a phone. So I pass him the phone and this guy just fucking goes off on his girl, like you haven't put money on my account, bitch. Wow. I need to pay my bills, blah, blah, blah. Dude, and he just fucking goes off. And my uncle's listening to all this shit. And you're standing down with your guy. He's like, fucking bitch, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like just standing, like just picturing my uncle just like, hmm. Oh, this is his environment. These are Frankie's friends. My nephew's in, yeah, Frankie's friends, right? And then when he's done, he passes the phone. He doesn't even say thank you. He passes the phone to me and I go, Uncle Junior, can you please not tell my parents that this just happened. He's a very nice guy in here. He's a very nice young lad. Okay, so I didn't make any more phone calls after that. How much did your phone calls end up crossing? Did you see later on or what? No, no. My uncle never told me how much they were, but I mean, they weren't that long of phone calls, but I stopped making calls after that. That's hilarious. That's hilarious. I can't, I can't. Did the guy win the suit? Did you get, did you get nailed for it? I mean, did I what? Did you got sued? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I settled. This was before, this was six years ago? Yeah, this was before, before. Yeah, so I also had my bologna sandwich stolen from me. I was sipping on like my son kiss and this dude just takes my bologna sandwich. In jail? Did he ask for it? In jail, yeah. Legit, is it legit? Yeah, legit, he didn't. He literally just grabbed your bologna. He can say he grabbed my bologna sandwich and he's looking at me eating my sandwich. And I'm like looking at him and he's like, what, you gonna eat your bologna, boy? I'm like, nah, nah. I wasn't hungry. Yeah, I'm not even hungry. I hadn't eaten like two days. I'm not even hungry. I lost like five pounds, bro. The food is shit in there. Well, you're like, no, I'm paleo. Yeah. And like I broke, I broke my, I fractured my knuckle. So I had like a crazy fever in there. Because you know what I'm saying? Yeah, there's a lot of bacteria in your mouth. So I guess when I like punched the dude in the mouth, like I had some bacteria. So my hand was full of pus. What? It was just like. Yeah, this story keeps getting worse and worse. Yeah, it's terrible. I had a, you know what, you were, you might be worse than Justin at telling stories. You like, Bill, like he tells like, oh no big deal, I was in jail. That's why I like it. Then we move on, then we go back like, oh, this happened, this happened, this happened. This is the third time I've liked this story. There's new, there's new. New development, I'm like peppering in. New development. Really important details. Yeah, yeah, like the best part to the story. Yeah, people's teeth coming. People keep buying out. Character building event. Turned you into the man you are today. Yeah. I would say. You know, right after I got fucked, I got released. What? You talked earlier about the website and nurturing leads and the funnels and stuff like that. Who has to, who had to learn that part of the business? Was that something that you already, one of you already knew or did you have to go out? Did you hire someone or did you learn all yourself? Like. We, at one point, it was just basically learning by mistakes. Yeah, trial and error. Then we hired someone, which I would suggest anybody, because that whole SEO world and those little like Google search and Google ads, it's a whole other world. Well, yeah, more like the social media. We hired someone like getting the traffic into our website, but like retaining traffic, we're handling that ourselves. Our partner, CFO numbers, is really good at like web design and stuff like that. So he seems seamlessly like integrates all these apps. You know, with like the pop-ups, the mailing lists. I love his nicknames, numbers. Yeah, he loves numbers. He gets off on numbers. What are you guys' nicknames? Do you guys have nicknames? Just Frankie and Theo. Okay. We just tell numbers like, okay, we want this on a website and he'll just go to town and do it. We need a number. So I imagine he's doing all the split testing and comparing all the stuff. Yeah, he does all that. Yeah. So we don't have to worry about that at all. Do you feed him bologna sandwiches, like slide them under the bar? Get back to work. He does, what's that exercise that he does? He does some of that cardio yoga shit. No, it's this guy, Shanti. Oh, Shanti, the T20. T20, the Shanti. Yeah, he does that. He does that in his living room. And he like swears, swears right. We're going to send him last anywhere. I'm getting cut. I'm getting cut. I'm like, no, you're not. He has that saying also, man, if you see, he has this, the Shanti. Apparently the people that do that have like a number or something. Numbers, I know you're going to be listening. Your workout sucks. You know, it's funny is so we're hiring a company right now. Rhino digital media that's doing, going to be doing all this side of our business for us. And that they use him as an example, as like one of the better like internet marketers in our fitness world. Like Shanti gets to everybody them. And then what's the other one that you keep showing, talking about is Tony Horton. Tony Horton. Tony Horton. That's the P90X, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like the, I mean that's, it's crazy what a what a monster that is now. I mean, it's, we hired like three different companies and ended up firing all of them trying to find, because what was tough for us, which I'm, It was just snake oil people in the marketing. Yeah. Because everybody knows they need help with it, right? That it's a big piece of the business. And then getting somebody who can actually deliver our message. And it's tough. In an authentic way, you know, something that jives with us. It can't just be. So on, at least on, on my side, like we were collaborating with Quest Nutrition on some like social media stuff, like giveaways and stuff like that. And I got to wrapping with one of the executives over there. And it was really eye-opening because, because she told me that one of her biggest assets were her email list. And that was like, whoa. That was like really eye-opening to me. I'm like, dude, we need to like, you know, really pay attention to this. Like, you know, that can 10X, 15X your business, just growing your email list. Well, we were talking to somebody in, and I don't want to say it is, but we were talking to somebody who's in the marketing world or whatever, has an email list that's massive, like half a million people, like 500,000 people. And they were telling us that it's worth like $100 million. Yeah, 150 million. Just that list alone. I mean, it's absolutely incredible how important that is for, you know, new, I guess the new business, right? Because it's all, it's all eventually going to be that way. Yeah, because I mean that, that email list is like people that are really interested in you. It's not just random people. It's not like random people. What were some of the things, so do you kind of in your head, remember about where you were as far as how many emails you had and then what did you start to do to really increase that? And has it doubled since then? Or is it like? We're doing it now. We just started focusing, after Frank had that conversation, we brought it up in a meeting. So we're focusing on our email list and we have special subscribers, get special offers. Our email list was growing. It grew pretty fast from us, just, you know, from our Instagram. And it was pretty much like, it happened kind of organically. We didn't, I mean, we didn't implement any, any, let's say, what they call traps or, you know, anything on the website. We had like a basic, just a basic subscribe thing, but, you know, it had no... For the newsletters. For the newsletter. But I mean, we weren't pushing it. Just like a banner up there. Yeah, and we weren't even like nurturing to it. We weren't, you know, we didn't have like our newsletter now has like valuable stuff. Yeah, I like it. Funny and fun. I like what you guys said. So. There's some value to it. That's good. Yeah. And that's important. So what do you, you guys are, you guys have more than just coffee now. You guys have other products. Let's talk about that a little bit and maybe what you're doing, moving ahead. Like what are you guys looking to do? We're launching now whole beans, coconut oil, and... We have the seed stack, like a cow. Yeah, the seed stack just came out about two months ago. That's been a game changer in my life, too. Which Adam loves, if you would ever fucking share it with us. Honestly, that thing is like, Adam what? Bro, you send, you guys, by the way, you guys send your care packages to him. He eats all that shit and we don't get to taste any of it. So we're, okay, we're exchanging information after this because Adam is a hogger. I was gonna use it, though. That's how I justify it. Bro, I will use the shit out of seeds. I'll put seeds on everything. You don't get to pick and choose. You're gonna use all the products or you don't get to sacrifice all of them. That pretty much changed my life, man. Like my digestive... You got good poops now? Oh my God. Dude, I mean, you know when you have like a high protein diet? Yeah. Which most people as large as me tend to do. You're massive. When you have little log jams. Shit. You need silky shit. Don't look that up. So we have the seeds. We have the cacao. We have the coffee. Coconut oil. We have the cacups. We're developing the Nespresso pods. Yeah, we get a lot of requests for Nespresso pods for Australia and Europe. They don't use cacups over there. And the nut butter, the sea almond butter, which should be out in January. What are sea almonds that's different than almonds? Grown by the sea. Yeah, they're grown by the sea. They're also known as tropical almonds. They're hard to harvest because the outer part of it, like the nut itself, it's really soft so the seed inside crushes really easy and it's really thin. But we found a way to back home, we found a way to re-roasted and we grinded it up. Frank developed a formula, which he mixes in with coconut oil, which will also be coming out. It comes out really creamy. Super creamy. It's a little bit more salty. It has a little bit more flavor just because it's living next to the sea. That environment. Do you have launch dates yet? How close are we? Maybe like January. We don't want to throw products. We have to do it right. The coconut oil should be it left the country last week, so it should be in a couple three to four weeks it should be in the market. The seeds won't be the nuts won't be told. I want to know what's coming next. How soon should we expect it? The coconut oil within a month, it should be in our store. It's single serving. They're single packets. You can take it to the gym and put it in your pocket. They're one table spoon packets. We designed them especially thinking about cold weather. When it's over 70 degrees it gets cold like ice cream. Something you have to scoop it out. If you have a packet you could just tear it open and toss it inside your hot coffee or throw it on your or take it on a plane and it'll dissolve in like 25 seconds. That's excellent. How are the whole beans going to work with the new tropics? It's called Phase 1 by Chimeric Coffee. It's basically what we use for our Peaberry. Peaberry if whoever doesn't know it's actually a mutation on the coffee plant. Every coffee plant yields about three to five percent Peaberry. It's really hard to harvest because you need to use it by hand. What happens is instead of the cherry developing two seeds it develops one whole seed. It tastes different. It has a less acidic flavor. It's a little fruitier. A bit fruitier. We're using that. We're going to sell it in whole beans as our Phase 1. You guys eventually want to have a light roast, a dark roast, a Peaberry I mean it makes sense. We have We can do it. What are you hearing the most from your fans? What are they saying? You said the K-Cups. What's the biggest one you're hearing right now that you guys need to tackle? I think we're doing that now. The whole beans. The whole beans and espresso. Those have been the big ones. You were talking about yesterday about nitro sealing. Yeah, so our next batch, not this one. This one's batch 18. So batch 19, we bought a big nitro sealing machine. Potato chips, they're nitro sealed. That's why they last so long. It's basically a way of just guaranteeing freshness from three to four months from now. It's going to taste like you just got it. So I could buy 20 bags from you. We just roasted it. We could have gotten a big vacuum sealer, but we didn't want the bag to look ugly. So that's why we're putting in, the machine that actually does it sucks out the oxygen, puts nitrogen in, then sucks it out again and then puts nitrogen just to make sure all the oxygen is gone. What causes the oxidation is the oxygen inside the bag. We should do that for marijuana. Seal the marijuana and we could sell it the next year for a year. You guys used to sell marijuana where you were pedaling drugs before pedaling maps. Hold on a second, it's a plant just like coffee. Calm down, everybody calm down. You'll do your first time here. Help start up two cannabis clubs. The first two medical marijuana clubs in the Bay Area. So I was a part of that whole movement here. There's like 170 now. That's why you were rocking dreadlocks back in the day. Back when you had hair. So I started there but I actually even got into the growing side of the business and so I had farms. So I had outdoor, indoor crops, all that stuff and I'd pay attention to the market changes for cannabis throughout the year. It's hard to get certain strains and certain types at certain times. It's probably similar for coffee, right? Depending on the weather or whatever, it probably makes a big difference. So because of that I would strategically I'd seal them all and then I would release them out at certain points of the year when the market was better for them. So like a certain strain that was outdoor at a certain time of the year is much more valuable than any other time and then vice versa for indoor stuff. So I used to learn how to do all that shit way back when we were doing cannabis. That's a good business to get into now. Yeah, kind of. Yes and no. I tell people, I think the time to get in it was when I was in it when everybody was scared as fuck. Now like saturated, right? Yeah. And you know, it's everybody wants to do it because it's not as scary. When we did it, it was really scary to do it. When we went down to get our business license, I remember they didn't even have anything under marijuana. I had to be like this herbal supplement like shop is what we had to get it under and so just the laws regulations, they were so uncertain. It's different from city to city and state to state. So there's no consistency in it. There still isn't a lot of consistency. They're trying to drill that down and all that's really happened since I've been out of it is more hands are in the pot and more regulation which is just making it that much more difficult for people to actually do it legitimately and make money and I got tired of I didn't like where the industry was. It wasn't it wasn't my passion. I saw where it was going and the business side of me saw that and like, okay and I had a great opportunity but I love fitness. I'm so much more passionate about that. This is what I love to do but that was a little ride learned a lot. You guys could do a blend CBD throw in some cannabinoids We get a lot of offers from that. We've gotten some companies. Can I just tell you right now, your coffee does parallel with certain strains not even going to lie. Some of our programs may have been created under the influence of that combination. You may or may not. I had a guy send over concentrate with THC infused and hardcore. Dude, we got some interesting emails. We had this one dude shoot us an email saying if we knew anything about doing coffee enemas and I'm like, wait what? Sounds like a mind publisher. Neutropics will shoot right into your system. I'm like, no, but you can go ahead and stick coffee in your ass. Let me know how that works. They call it chimera culo. Well, I'll tell you what, man. One of the main reasons why we like working with you guys is because we like you guys. That's the biggest reason why we support you guys so much and why we like working with your brand. You got a good product for sure but it's you guys that we like the most and so we appreciate it. Thanks for coming down, man. Good having you guys here. Thanks again. Mind Pump is still offering 30 days of coaching and it's still free. All you got to do is go to mindpumpmedia.com and register for 30 days of coaching. Also, if you go to YouTube, you can watch Mind Pump TV. We post a new video every single day so don't forget to subscribe. Lastly, you can find us on Instagram at Mind Pump Media. You can find my page at Mind Pump Sal. Adam's at Mind Pump Adam at Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Superbundle at mindpumpmedia.com. The RGB Superbundle includes MAPS Anabolic, MAPS Performance and MAPS Aesthetic. Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Superbundle is like having Sal Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Superbundle has a full 30-day money-back guarantee and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at mindpumpmedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support and until next time, this is Mind Pump.