 catch up I'm constantly thinking yeah yeah I don't have that background I'll just listen a little longer it's gonna start to be clear and I'm catching up and you know I'm open anyway so I'm not having a problem with what you're saying I'm just trying to understand where it's coming from so then I can start putting it together. That was my problem last night I said as soon as I walked in I said I'm tired I'm exhausted I really can't stay here I was tired all of a sudden and I missed 90% of everything that was said last night because I knew when I walked in the door I didn't want to do this you know and so it wasn't about being physically tired it was about nothing I could have just put myself in that very same mode and I was tired but yet we were up till 12-3 last night and I felt waking when I started coming. Probably should do this but you know I chose it was a choice. Yes this whole thing of resistance or fatigue yeah that's to be expected as you're going into these ideas that's what happened I know that was probably my major defense when I worked with the court was I would just read read read be excited and it was feel like it's a lead weight were like on the the island by and we will take periodic breaks I feel one coming on very quickly but again to it just look at those thoughts even with that that's what I would do instead of fighting myself a lot of times when I was feeling up in the course of whatever I would I would go take a walk or take a snooze go call someone on the phone I wouldn't sit there and kind of like try to fight the ego because the ego likes to fight same with meditation when you're trying to just be still and you have a lot of chatter going on it's nice to hang with it for a little while just to see if it passes you kind of get beyond that but it's not really helpful to continue pushing on thing I will I have to sit here for an hour you know kind of fighting against it but I think that's another good thing just to point out as we go into that and then there's another area or space or level or whatever where there is no effort put into it because the more you effort at it the more sort of falls apart you know because that's not what you do you know I guess it gets back to that wanting to do something and only in the area ego does that do and get done and not necessarily in that area of the spirit because that's a place that I see more of being in a state of mind in a way of at least that's a wrong and right mind perception because you're still at that level so if you can just choose to be right-minded and change your mind and have that you know take care of meaning to be tired that's great and if you feel like you need a little help a little outside help is it worth to do that whether it's getting up and taking a walk or whatever do whatever whatever seems helpful that's another thing to mention that when we're doing this it's a real free flowing kind of thing to going into this and there may be times where even one person may seem to want to do that and that's fine to wake and wait until we all take a I don't have expectations and we don't have a lot of expectations of having to think well I really could do with a stretch or go a couple coffee or the bathroom or something and and all those things about group expectations but we're in the middle of the group session hold it you know this is that it's real free flowing because we're gonna be going so deeply in things and things like that will come up so feel free as we go along at any time do anything like that thanks the last thing I want to talk about real quick before while we have to stop because Ron brought up the thing of efforts I think it's something that we could take just a quick look at Jesus says that when the mind falls asleep and it's conditioned to the ego it is conditioned to backwards thinking I call it backwards thinking where it seems as if what is happening out here on the outer ring or what's happening on the screen these are projector analogy is causative and the state of mind is the effect in other words the mind seems to be at the mercy of external force that is the one characteristic that identifies ego that is ego thinking backwards thinking so in one sense the forgiveness is just turning it around all this backward thinking where causation seems to be on the screen or the external turning it around like this to see where causation is the mind the mind is positive and that the screen is not positive at all there's nothing on the screen ever and it seems to be a that's what the process seems to be of turning around cause and effect now to get to your thing of effort Jesus said that you know if you if your mind is aimed in this direction so to speak and it's just really attached to backward thinking that initially it's going to take an effort to turn it around as you begin the mind training it as Jesus will say in the lessons you know try to do this you know three times a day or four times a day if you forget try again you know he really is calling on effort he's calling on that little willingness and initially it takes the effort to start to begin to turn it around it's just like with anything once you've passed that way point that is for you once you really start to transfer the training and you start to really remember oh I thought the problem was but that's not it I need a miracle the more consistent you become at that the more you're able to transfer that seemingly more specific situation the mind that cause and effect gets turned around then it's like if you really start to complete the turn around so to speak then you the effort ceases in other words you see that that you see the falsity of the ego and the resistance of attempting to fight the ego or attempting to you know to hang on and justify one substance using the perception ceases and that's the point where Jesus says you start to see that that the ego and Holy Spirit are mutually exclusive before it seemed like a vacillation but with hot with a lot of mind training you start to see wait a minute this is this is simple and you withdraw your mind and allegiance from the ego and then at that point there's no effort required so so there is an effort that's required for the mind training initially and that starts to see and also it's not an effort in terms of form which is what the mind is so conditioned to howl push through this howl we the course you know so many hours each day and I won't miss and the effort can be to get transferred to forms in ritual oh that's a signal but that's starting to take place then then it's like trying to change the form or trying to do something again in form or get a whole of a ritual or she knows change the screen and that should be our immediate red flag that wait a minute here the ego that looks like it's getting involved and I'm giving into the ego if I'm trying to change the screen again I'm glad you brought up that whole area of effort because it's one of those you have to kind of get