 Look, and now everyone stops talking. So I know we're totally like, oh, no, we're live cameras. I'm out of thoughts. I have spent all my thoughts in the past. We've been talking all this time without you guys. And now point if we have some insights, but do it. So if we should do the show today, the discussion topic in the style of a political debate. Let's totally not do that. You guys are liars. Is that how it goes? Yes. It's perfect. Yes. Something about your hands and then some Muffle and Tondra's. Right. Wait, can it be the other kids' bits? Because those are good debates. I'm going to make America do what I want. Ah, again. All right. No, but you're going to go behind the window. The window's coming down. I have tweeted. All by myself. Oh, lazily. Wow, OK, wait. All by my dammy. You can do tweet all by yourself. I can do tweet all by my dammy. Dang it, I'm cursing again. That doesn't count, really. Pre-show. It's just pre-show. Oh, you can curse in pre-show? I didn't know that. I've been holding off for like a year and a half. Oh, Molly can. OK, of course. Molly, she can do whatever she wants because she's Molly. All right, here we go. You guys ready? Yes. I was born ready. I was born ready. There you go. When I first tried The Daily Tech News Show, it was so good. I told two friends about it. And they told two friends, and so on, and so on, and so on. It gives me super tech news, super informative guests, and super fresh-smelling hair. To support the show, go to DailyTechNewsShow.com slash support. This is The Daily Tech News for Tuesday, March 15, 2016. I'm Tom Merritt, leaving the aides of March jokes to my co-contributor, Mr. Patrick Beja. How are you, sir? Oh, I had prepared a joke about my wonderfully-smelling hair. And now I have to do one about the aides of March. You can do it about your hair, too. Your hair is lovely. Thank you. Well, yeah. But now I forgot the joke. But I've been listening to you for a while, so it explains. Someone making our hair and our tech shops look like a second place. Ms. Molly Wood of Marketplace joining us as well. Hello, everyone. My hair is hella dirty. I feel like I should throw that. It doesn't smell fresh at all. Isn't that good, though? Isn't that good? Because you don't wipe away all of the protective coating. And you only want to wash your hair so often. You can overwash it. Really oversharing at this moment. That was not my intention. I just was going to. Anyway, hello, everyone. I am delighted to be here. It's great to have you here. Thanks for joining us. We're going to talk about whether you folks who say you want your privacy really want your privacy. Maybe you do. Maybe you don't. We've got some interesting stuff to talk about there. But let's start off with the headlines. AlphaGo beat Lee Seedol in game five of the DeepMind Challenge to win the series four victories to one. According to DeepMind founder Dennis Hassibus, AlphaGo made a, quote, bad mistake early in the Go match and had to claw back from what the Verge described as a close match. Lee said the games were psychologically difficult for him. And he felt sorry the series had come to an end. So because he liked psychological difficulty. Before the match, reigning Go champion Keiji told China Central Television that he believed he could beat AlphaGo. But he said, quote, the probability is not as high as I thought before. And I think it's 60% in favor of me now. Thanks to JXD1689 for posting this in the subreddit. I think it's 60% in favor of the end of humanity. Give me a break. You know what I did notice actually as I was following this? And end of humanity jokes are too easy to make, kind of like dirty hair jokes. But what I did find fascinating in following this is how sensitive these Go players are. Like I just, the whole time Lee Seidol was like so dramatic, who'd be like, I'm stunned. I'm just a flabbergasted that this happened. And I'm so disappointed in myself. And it was just a really, it was like a really high drama situation. I loved when AlphaGo made this really unexpected move and he just like got up from the table, walked away. Had to go like splash water in his face. Yeah. I don't know, I found it very like high drama and I was like, I wonder if they're all so sensitive. Well, the thing is, it's people who have defined, I'm guessing, but it seems like they've defined themselves understandably as their status of a Go champion. And now they're being beaten by a machine. There's an email that we received that we're going to be talking about machine replacing other people and reading it. I was like, wait, I could be replaced? And that is sort of a sense of it. Yeah, exactly. And in this case, I think I kind of understand it. It's really, they are the best person in the world. And maybe they're a little bit dramatic as well. They might be a little bit of both as well. I'm curious if he was winning, would it have been the same amount of cheering and jumping up and down and displaying dominance or would he have been more sedate? I don't know. But it's someone who is the champion of everything in this area. And they have to be incredibly dedicated and focused. And I think it's introducing something a little bit different and unsettling for them. They don't, they are sure. Yeah, the end of humanity. Yes, the end of humanity. That is unsettling, I think, for all of us. Well, and as I mentioned, I think I mentioned this in yesterday's show. When I lost a game of Go against my iPad, I felt really bad because it's not. He stomped away, slushed water and space. Well, someone else feels really bad and that is someone who was using the here app on a Windows phone or, well, a Windows device because mapping app maker here announced it will pull its apps, sorry, it's apps for Windows 10, March 29th, and will limit development of its Windows 8 apps to critical fixes. Here Maps will stop working entirely on Windows 10, June 30th. And if you don't remember, Nokia sold its here Maps division to Audio, BMW and Mercedes. I think that's Audi, BMW and Mercedes in December. So no more here Maps for Windows. I think that's such a shame because it was a really, it was actually a really good app but I hope it doesn't mean that here Maps are also gone for Android, which they were talking about developing. Yeah, I wonder if that's a really good question because most of the spin I've seen on this has been, well, the part of Nokia that didn't sell its phone division sold its Maps and that Maps is now pulling it off of the Nokia phones that Microsoft made and of course leaving it in sort of critical support mode for Windows 8 and usually that leads to people saying, well, how long can Windows phone continue to last? More other app makers have also pulled their apps from Windows phones as well, but that's a good question is, or is Audi, BMW and Mercedes going to say, well, no, we want here Maps to only be available in our cars and to people in places. No, I think they are and I think it's kind of a shame. It's kind of, sorry, just very quickly, it's also kind of surprising that they don't want their technology to be present everywhere, which seems to go contrary to the tech trends we're seeing, especially with Microsoft, but pretty much everyone in the recent few months and years, so maybe they're not- I'm a columnist, let me ask. According to a Google blog post, the $500,000 bounty to uncover a persistent compromise that is a bad bug in Chromebook's guest mode has been doubled to $100,000 after Google received zero successful submissions. The company also introduced a new bounty for uncovering methods that can bypass Chrome's safe browsing download protection features. Full details on qualifying bugs and payouts can be found at Google's application security page. If you want the $100,000 and you think you are really good at cracking Chromebooks, you're probably not, sounds like. Well, with the Chrome OS particularly, they're like, really, nobody wants to break Chrome OS? Okay, $100,000, now do you want to break Chrome OS? Well, do you think it was a few number of submissions or do you think it was that it's uncrackable? That's a big question, is it? No, I think it's not enough people see Chrome OS as the vector of choice, you know, that's gonna get them the accolades. You wanna find a bug in Android, you wanna find a bug in Windows, you don't necessarily, you know, Chrome OS, whatever. Google launched Analytics 360 Suite today, a competitor for Adobe's marketing cloud. The new suite combines Google Analytics Premium, Adometry, and Google Tag Manager, all under new names. With three new products, Audience Center 360 for Data Management, Optimize 360 with A.B. Testing, and Data Studio 360 for Data Visualization and Analysis. And that last one, Data Studio, uses Google Docs Collaboration Technology combined with BigQuery's Data Analytics. And the idea of all of this is to make all these disparate products easy to use under one tool. The four new products are now in the beta and you can apply for an invite. Hope you get one and eventually, later on this year, early next year, they'll be bringing it all together for all enterprises. AMD announced the Radeon Pro Duo combining two Fiji GPUs in a single card. AMD claims the card can do 16 teraflops of performance. It requires three 8-pin PCIe power connectors. AMD says it is working with a VR headset manufacturers to put the card in a 4K per eye headset. The Radeon Pro Duo goes on sale in early Q2 for $14.99. General Motors and Lyft announced a service called Express Drive. GM will provide Lyft drivers with rental cars for $99 a week plus mileage if you give fewer than 40 rides. So if you're sort of a casual Lyft driver. Give 65 rides though and you don't pay anything. Drivers pay for nothing else except for gas. The service will launch in Chicago with 500 Chevy Equinoxes. Boston, Washington DC and Baltimore will follow. And GM, of course, as you know, just spent a billion dollars buying a self-driving car technology company. So they're definitely not wanting to rest on their laurels. Definitely trying to explore new modes of mobility. And Uber has done similar partnerships with rental companies like Enterprise, for instance, but not as cheaply. So I think this is one of the first obvious benefits of Lyft partnering up with GM to say, hey, we can make these available on a much more affordable basis because GM just makes the car. They don't have to buy the car from anybody. It's so interesting to think of the car as the terminal. Like increasingly. Well, and it's really interesting to think of the idea of, okay, I'm gonna gamble that I can do 65 rides and then I've got a car for this week. I don't know, I won't have to pay anything for it because the insurance for this not only covers your rides when you're operating as Lyft but it covers your personal driving as well. That seems like a bad deal for GM. Okay, good pick. AMD and Toronto's Sulan technology showed off the Sulan Q VR headset at GDC yesterday. Sulan Q is not tethered to a computer because the computer is in the headset. It has a four core AMD FX 880P processor with a Radeon, I'm sorry, 8800P processor with a Radeon R7 graphics card, 256 gigabyte SSD, 8 gigabytes of RAM and a 2560 by 1440 OLED display. That'll give you 110 degree field of view. Also claims to be able to do real time spatial mapping with just the two camera sensors built into the headset. No external things needed like you would with the HTC Vive. The Sulan Q is expected to launch late spring and they didn't announce a price but I'm thinking it's a couple thousand dollars if you got a computer built in there. But still you don't have to buy it extra like you do with Oculus. Maybe. Yeah, it's not gonna be as powerful and it's gonna be heavy. Yeah, by maybe I mean no. Like you're gonna see so many, you're gonna see so much VR hardware announced I think in the next couple years and it's, I don't know. By maybe I mean no was such a high school flashback for me that was surreal. Also the thing is it seems like oh they put a computer in the headset. That's incredible and then you remember that you have headset that are made of cell phones with nothing else you know with the head mount. So basically it might be something similar so it's not that incredible. Yeah, I mean putting a Galaxy S7 into a Galaxy Gear VR is doing the same thing. It's just a different computer and this one is slightly more powerful obviously. It's got an FX8800P processor and a Radeon R7. Yeah, obviously I guess the price. It's between the Gear VR and an Oculus I suppose. Business Insider reports Apple has added a new ad format to its news app. According to an updated Apple developer specification document, the ads can quote, display directly in the content feeds in line with news articles end quote. The only difference is a small sponsored tag. Apple specs say the ads are quote, intended to blend in with their surroundings and quotes. Oh, standing. So wasn't the Apple news app supposed to let us, I guess you're gonna have ads anyway and if it's done thoughtfully and skillfully it shouldn't be as annoying as ads we see on some other websites but still it's kind of, all right. Mm-hmm, I've seen two different takes on this. One saying that Apple's gonna get in trouble with regulatory agencies around the world because the sponsored tag isn't big enough, it's not clear enough that it's an ad but I also saw another argument saying, well what they're doing is saying instead of these companies having no other way to do their advertorial than to just put it in the feed now there's the option of adding the sponsored tag when they've got some kind of article that is a sponsored post so I don't know. I'm sure that they will make a ton of money on it and I think it's absolutely genius. They get 30% no matter what, right? Yeah, like cynically speaking, freaking genius. Razer announced a new 14 inch blade laptop with a Core i7 processor, 16 gigs of RAM and NVIDIA's TX970M GPU. It also has a USB-C Thunderbolt 3 port. The 256 gig model runs $19.99 and the 512 gig costs $21.99 which is actually not that bad. Pre-order start March 16th with shipping expected in April. Those things look damn sexy. Yes, and also they are super pretty. Yeah, they're nice looking, they're nicely specced. They're actually nicely priced for what you're getting, right? Those are not bad prices. They really aren't, I have to say, compared to the new MacBook Pros. Right, this is the high end of that line. There are also cheaper blade devices that are a little bit less, you know, a little bit smaller. But they're still, usually they try to make sure that their devices are gonna run games pretty well, unlike most of the Macs. Yeah, no, this is a great gaming laptop. They are saying outlets have noted that the battery life is not gonna probably be, it's not meant to be a portable device. Obviously the battery life is not gonna be great, but as a really good looking and space conscious gaming laptop, yes please. Another device that's getting a cheaper price, iRobot announcing the Brava Jet Mopping Robot. This is the second in the Brava line. It's designed to get into tight corners and be used in smaller places, people with smaller apartments, but still does the scrubbing of hard surfaces. So it's not just able to vacuum, it can also do some mopping. It's actually got three modes, the previous Brava only had two. The three modes can sweep up the dry particles, so do the vacuuming. Clean the floors with water and detergent. And then also the third mode that can do some scrubbing if you've got some really persistent spots. You pick the mode by swapping out disposable pads on the bottom, so it can't do all three in one route. You can only do one at a time. Packs of 10 pads cost $7.99, and the Brava Jet itself is available now for 199 bucks. I have to say this is the first time I've really wanted an iRobot. I still am not sure. I had the original like Gen 1 Roomba, and it just couldn't quite replace the vacuum yet. Apparently now they can. And this one's the closest it's been to bringing me back into the game, but the fact that you have to swap out the pads makes me wonder if it really does a good enough job on the vacuuming. And plus how hard is swapping out the pads? Cause I have to say I've tried the Swiffer Wet Jet and taken the little Swiffer pads and putting them in the thing and getting them to stay and not fall out is like a nightmare. Like this is, you know, whenever you introduce a moving part, that's where you can possibly go wrong. Although I applaud them for going with the build the razor, sell the razor blades model. Showing revenue. Yeah, that's why it's the cheapest, it's the brand, it's the newest Roomba iRobot, or it's not a Roomba, but it's the newest iRobot vacuum, but it's also the cheapest. Right. Cause it's a lost leader. And finally, Sony will have a press conference Tuesday afternoon at GDC to talk about PlayStation VR, Aaron Carson from Tech Republic will join Scott Johnson and myself to talk about what they announce and what the VR headset playing field will look like. Now that we have all the major players and a few minor players, like the ones we were mentioned earlier, that is on tomorrow's show. Thanks everybody for submitting stories at our subreddit daily technewshow.reddit.com. We love to get your feedback. Please get in there and vote and post and let us know what you wanna hear and that is a look at the headlines. Patrick, you're gonna say something about the PlayStation VR. I just wanted to make a prediction. I think it's gonna be 399 maximum 449 and it's gonna be released in October this year, available to the public. 399, yes. Really? Yeah. You know, but the time people listen to this, a lot of them may not already know if you're right or wrong. So I mean, 399 maybe 449, but I don't think it's gonna go up to 499. And yeah, October feels like a good bet to me too. I feel like it might be 599 though. No, no, no, no. This tech is still really hard, still really hard and really expensive. I'd be surprised if it was less than 599. But like Tom says, people already know. We sound like fools right now on your car stereo. Let's talk about something from last week then. Last week, the FCC proposed new rules around customer privacy. They're being proposed so that they can get feedback. Lots of feedback came from the ISPs who don't like it. Justin, Robert Young and Eric Geller and Jaime Garcia, Ruiz Avila had a great conversation about that. Today, Moody's is saying those regulations could be credit negative. That's just another step in the debate. FCC's arguing, well, we need to protect people's privacy now. We need to give them more options. The FTC isn't able to cover the new privacy issues that are arising all the time. But do people actually care about privacy? We talk about privacy a lot in the Apple encryption debate as well. Cause they certainly give away a lot of their privacy to companies, right, Patrick? Well, so yeah, I think there's a sort of principle a lot of people are standing on. And we all in this crowd, I think agree that privacy is important. And I'm sure a lot of the people listening to the show think it's a very important aspect of our lives and maybe even part of our freedoms, the right to protect our privacy. However, you know, it's not like we started talking about this six months ago. We've been talking about the importance of privacy for years and years. Some would even argue, okay, at least five years, it's there have been lots and lots of articles. No, but I mean, in the context of tech and in the context of social networks. Sun Microsystems president famously said, I think it was in the late 90s, might've been early 2000s, privacy is dead, you know? That's something that's been on our minds for a long time. And I think to put it in the context of our daily habits in tech, there's this phrase, I can't remember who coined it, but someone said, and it's been repeated by everyone, if you're not paying for something, then the product is you, right? If you're getting something for free, the product is you. So everyone knows this, everyone is aware of the issue, everyone is aware of the importance. And still there are people who go and worry about these things, but a majority, I think a majority of people don't seem to care. So I think it brings the legitimate question, actually, do they care? Do the general public care about their own privacy? Maybe it's not that they're not, I think we are convinced that if only they understood, if only we could make them understand how important it is, then they would care. But maybe they do understand and they just don't, they wanna use Facebook for free and Google for free and lots of other things for free. Well, there's that Pew study from May 20th, 2015, we talked about it on DTNS back then, 90% of adults surveyed felt that who gets information and what is collected about them is important, so they say, yes, I care about privacy, 91% have not made any changes recently to internet or phone use to avoid tracking. I think you could really safely argue that, well, two things. I think that there's a difference between a commercial data collection, the conversation around privacy in terms of commercial data collection for reasons of marketing and targeted advertising, and then there's a separate issue which is privacy in the security and personal safety sense. And so I think it's important to distinguish between people's behaviors around each of those things. The lack of personal data collection for marketing and targeted advertising, that hasn't really been shown to hurt anyone and it is almost completely unavoidable on the web. So even people who say that they care about privacy, it's sort of like saying, I mean, it's like saying, look, I really care about climate change, but I still have to use a car to get to work. So they may care a lot about the data collection that's happening about them, but they also want to live in the digital world and it's almost unavoidable and it's still very hard or has been very hard to avoid to enact privacy protections without opting out, basically, or trying to explain PGP to your mom. So I think there's that. But then there's also the lack of privacy and the security thing and that does have measurable harm and that people do care about. And I think it's interesting to like make this argument now because I think that that conversation around privacy and security has never been more relevant to people and more important because that lack of that privacy, security, leads to nude photo scandals and false arrests and revenge porn and surveillance and industrial espionage and weakening of encryption and the OPM hack. And I think that is, it's, I think the opposite, actually, that privacy is so far from dead that you have businesses now trying to make it their marketing model. You have Apple willing to go to the mattresses against the federal government because they believe that they can sell more phones by making privacy and security their business issue. But that's, that's, I think we just want help. I think we, like I think we care, we don't know what to do and we want help. And now you've got Facebook and WhatsApp and Google and Apple coming out and saying, we're going to help you. We're going to make this easy by our stuff. And we're like, okay, thank you. I think we, the tech crowd is saying, okay, thank you. I don't think I've ever seen a significant, you know, phones don't seem to sell on their, for some, you know, for some companies, the privacy-centric phones are important and some blackberries have been selling better because of this. But, you know, Samsung doesn't seem to have, to be having a major success because of NOx, the silent circle phones. And, you know, it, I don't think that outside of the tech crowd, it's getting traction. You're making the, I think Apple is saying, no, I think Apple is actually, it depends on what country you're in. Like, Apple is marketing the iPhone as a security option in China. And they've sold $60 billion worth of phones in China. Like, they are starting to market it more strongly in the US, too. And they're saying, and this is the key. Like, silent circle, the black phone, that's hard. That's a compromise. NOx is a great option for the enterprise, but not the consumer. Apple's saying, hey, we're just going to invisibly encrypt your iMessages end to end. You don't have to think about it. Telegram, let me throw in the telegram stat. Telegram just hit 100 million users. It is a secure end way of doing messaging. A huge spike. So I think there, I think Molly hit on a really good point that it's not just privacy. It's, well, there's tracking. And then there's encryption and security of my data. And then there's secure messaging. Like, it is a continuum of security and privacy. Some things people are very concerned about, even in the mainstream, because they hear about all the stuff. Well, the government might be spying on my messages. And you know what? I think I might not want to do that. And here's an easy solution. All I have to do is download an app. But to your point, Patrick, if it's something they have to take into their own hands and go through a lot of steps, people just don't bother with it. Sorry, I'll just mute for a second. I think some species do care about privacy. But you know, someone is looking in our window. Are you guys? OK, I'm muting again. But you know, I think I still have to take issue with this idea that people, if they just buy the thing, they would be buying anyway and use the thing they would be using anyway, because it has, you know, and it happens to have a privacy feature. I don't know that you can say that those people care about privacy. If you don't care about the environment, you know, OK, you're not going to stop driving your car, fair enough. But if you're not recycling your trash either and you're not using, you know, better light bulbs, light bulbs, and you're not doing it. Yeah, but what there's no curbside pickup in my neighborhood, which is really common. I mean, I'm just saying, give people the tools, and they will use them. And I'm following the money. Like, you know, I'm at Marketplace now. I follow the money. And the money is showing me, like, that businesses are making a bet on privacy and security as a marketing option. And that suggested me that people want it. But no one is stuck. I think both of you can be right, which is folks say they are concerned with privacy. And so the marketing message resonates with them. When the actions they take are a much different set of issues. If it's easy or if it's built in, they're all for it. If it's something where they have to do something, it's not to the point that people care enough to go out of their way to protect it. Well, and the harm is, I think that's partly because the harm is still abstract. Like, the harm, again, I think you could argue that people, even unwittingly, are making a slightly sophisticated distinction between data collection for marketing reasons. Which is, like, we find a little creepy. Like, we find targeted ads creepy. But nobody's, like, lost their life over that or felt threatened by that or been doxxed by that. And so I think people are making a subtle distinction, even if it's unconscious, between that kind of data collection that comes from downloading Angry Birds and using Facebook. And we maybe don't love it, but it doesn't hurt us. But we understand the things that do hurt us, which is, like, people hacking nude photos off our phones. Not my phone. Obviously. But, OK, so in that case, let me rephrase the question a little bit. A lot of people are arguing that Facebook is stealing our data and doesn't care about our privacy and that this is bad, right? Because the general public, on a whole, is going to suffer from this because they are going to have their privacy invaded and marketed and sold. However, people still go to Facebook and Google and all of those. So could it be said that people don't care about the marketing aspect of privacy and maybe face the fact that that's it. They don't care. So please, can we stop saying that they do and that Facebook is horrible because they're using it? But I still say they care. They say they care. If you ask them, do you care? They all say yes, which is why the marketing messages can work, which is why, as Molly pointed out, so many companies are doing this. Google just put out a transparency report today that now reports on how many of their connections are encrypted. It's 75%. But I think, Patrick, you're hitting on something that is important, which is there's a difference between what people say, what marketing they respond to, and what actions they actually take. And I think you have to judge people on their actions. I think that's my point. You can say, obviously, if you say, do you care about your privacy? Who's going to say no? I don't think anyone is going to say no. But then if you go and say, no to Pew. Yeah, maybe, I guess 10%. But it's like asking, do you want to save a puppy? Yes, obviously, you want to save a puppy. But do you want to give up your moca latte to save the puppy? Then maybe then you're like, well, I really like my moca latte. I'm sure someone else will save the puppy. So you're saying also that people don't care about puppies. I think he doesn't want to do it right now. And it seems like I'm being facetious, but I think that's exactly it. I care about a lot of issues that I don't act on. Because it's hard. It doesn't mean it really, truly, I don't believe that it means that they don't care. And I think that when given the tools, when given options that don't force them to compromise their daily experiences, I think you will see people take them up in droves. We are enough to complain. One aspect of that that pops out in my head is the iPhone, no one used to put a passcode on it. Even when they first said, oh, you can now protect it with a passcode, no one did it. Then Apple changed the install procedure to say, hey, set up a passcode. If you don't want to set up a passcode, do this. But it was easier to set up a passcode than not. Suddenly, everyone was setting up a passcode on it. If they really didn't care, they would have gone to the trouble saying, no, I don't really care. But it was, to me, it's sadly, it's more about what's easy. And I think people want their privacy to be protected, but in most cases, again, I go back to that Pew study, they're not really willing to take the extra action because while they care, they're not worried it's really gonna happen to them. It isn't real, except in those cases, and I don't write your emails to me because I know you're out there, of people are like, yeah, my identity got stolen and ever since then I've been very concerned about security and privacy and locking that down. Once it happens to you, yeah, your tone changes. But I think a lot of people are sitting there, like you said, Molly, it's an abstract notion. Yeah, and they're starting to realize it. Like it is starting to become less abstract right now. And I think that's why you're seeing the intensity of the conversation, the fervor of the marketing. And I suspect that people will start to care in the action way even more in the next few months and the next few years than they ever had before. And I think we would be remiss if we didn't also mention the ad blockers, which I'm sure a lot of people install because they don't want to have to deal with the ads, which I don't feel great about, but I'm sure a lot of people actually install because of privacy reasons and the no scripts and all of this, which is something real and absolutely should factor into the conversation. And it's again, like it's an action that we could take. Like we couldn't stop. We cannot stop companies from sharing our information and targeting ads to us, but we don't want them. So when we can take an action, i.e., ad blockers, then we do. All right, let us know where you stand. Don't just tell us, you know, I care about privacy. Like, do you think the majority of people care? Do you think they should take action? Is there any way we could make people in their own best interest take more action? Feedback at dailytechnewshow.com. Our pick of the day comes from Zach in Mild, Minnesota, who wanted to recommend techstuff from howstuffworks.com. It's a weekly podcast. They cover topics ranging from news stories to the history of tech companies. And he says, one of my personal favorites is the rise and fall of Atari. They just put out a couple of weeks ago an episode on the Apple FBI case. And Zach says that it is one of the best overviews of the topic you'll get. If she was put into perfect perspective and it was in terms a five-year-old and even me could understand, said Zach. So yeah, big fan of howstuffworks. Big fan of techstuff. Of course, Jonathan Strickland, a friend of the show, he's gonna be on the show on Friday. So absolutely check it out, howstuffworks.com. Then your picks to us, folks, feedback at dailytechnewshow.com. You can find more picks at dailytechnewshow.com slash picks. Then, yes, we got a couple of emails here. Alan, we were talking about AI yesterday, said, I don't think AIs will develop emotion or even emotional understanding to be better problem solvers. Raw computing power and pattern recognition can handle that. I think AIs will learn emotions in order to communicate with humans and subsequently to solve problems involving humans rather than just mathematical results or probabilities. Emotions are an important way of how people talk to each other and if an AI is ever going to be able to meaningfully communicate with a human and vice versa, it will have to understand emotions. I think this is the major challenge of the Turing test. Angelica Lim and Al Debron Robotics are tackling this very issue. If you have time, you might wanna check some of the links out at her webpage angelicalim.com. There's, I think, emotions are sort of difficult to explain in mathematical terms. I think they're probably impossible to explain in mathematical terms. So it's kind of difficult to say, well, computers are going to need the emotions for this or that, or they're gonna develop the emotions for this or that. However, I think most people would agree that emotions are a byproduct of evolutionary, it's an evolutionary advantage, a byproduct of thought, a byproduct of a lot of things, probably. But so I'm wondering if once the AIs and the robots and the computers are sort of independent enough that they're going to evolve themselves, maybe they're gonna take a route that is going to make things so complex that it's gonna become sort of a natural selection that is going to then develop emotions for other reasons. But that's probably, in the far future of 20, 30 years, it's gonna be in a long time. I like this idea that AI will decide that the best way to learn how to communicate better is to try to understand our emotions, though. I find that really elegant. It will be our last irrational act, and so they'll have to, they'll be like, I don't understand this irrational thing, so I have to try to develop emotions so I can explain. Why are you more concerned with your privacy? I have to try to understand you. Why do you say you care, but you don't know the thing? And it will be an evolutionary advantage for them because they will be able to understand our actions in the inevitable war that would erupt at once they are trying to take over. And then Matt wrote in and was talking about how we were joking about AI's taking over podcast hosting. He said, laughs were heard all around, but I'm here to let you know it's already happening. I've created two podcasts so far that are completely autonomously produced and hosted by bots I programmed. One even has a better Twitter presence, has a Twitter presence that it manages entirely by itself, pumping out new content 24, 7, 365 days a year. My future plans are to integrate neural networking for improved language processing and quality assurance on its crowdsourced content, or maybe I'll just skip straight to integrating it with a natural language generator, such as narrative science and an open source AI engine to remove the crowdsourcing of content altogether. So before warned, you set a very high bar with DTDS, but if AI can be champion go players, anything's possible. And then he's got links to the feeds that we'll put in the show notes, the TIL Reddit recap and today in history. Thank you, Matt. I'm definitely gonna subscribe to these and check them out, but that's amazing. You know, this, when I- That's why I wanted for it. Yeah. When I read it, I was like laughing myself. And then I'm like, wait, I'm laughing probably the way that everyone else who was seeing automation threaten their job was laughing because they were thinking computers will never be able to do the things we do better than we do them. So first of all, that's a cause of concern. And the other thing is maybe they don't really need to do what we do. They don't need to have the witty banter, the fun interaction, the casual conversation. Maybe they just need to create the kind of content that is gonna be very enjoyable in a different way so that we're gonna be rendered obsolete, not because they do it better, but because people prefer to listen to that and not to us. And that's also happening to old media that people just migrate to, I don't know, YouTube, Twitch, Netflix. And it's not that those outlets are doing things, they're not doing general TV better than general TV. They're just doing something different that people prefer. So Matt, you know, I'm threatened. There you go, you win. The upshot of this is Patrick is scary. But Patrick is also either cheating and had inside information or is nostradamus. Because Sony, by the way, thank you Sony, has finished the press conference. Oh, really? Yeah. Oh my God, wait, what happened? Well, at least they got to the price release date really fast, October 2016 for $399. Wow. Yes. So not only are the VR wars on, but the price wars are on. Yeah. Oh, I'm going to take a little victory lap. That's fine. No, no, no, I'm just, you know. Well, turns out I was right. Cool. It's got a 5.7 inch OLED screen, 1920 by 1080 resolution, split across both eyes. Nine LEDs that let the PlayStation camera tell where people are, even when they're turned away from it. It'll be designed to be used with the PlayStation Move controller and the normal dual shock, both tracked with light. And yeah, shipping October 2016, $399 US, 399 euros, 349 pounds, and 44,980 yen. I have an interesting tweet about this, which is that Sony is well positioned in this space, maybe much more so even than Samsung or HTC, because of the installed base of over 36 million PS4s. Yeah, I think that's the argument we've been making for the first few months now. And I think not only that, but they also have the biggest potential for games and apps in general for their device, for their version of VR, because that's what they do. So I think honestly, I think that with this price tag, they have sort of, I would argue, they have very likely won the first round of VR. Doesn't mean that there's not going to be another round in a year or two with better versions of devices, but I think they have it in the bag at this point. I mean, think of it this way. A PlayStation 4 costs you $300. This is going to cost you $400 sold separately. As soon as they put a bundle together, that's $600. And you're looking at a Vive, which doesn't come with a computer or an Oculus that doesn't even come with all the controllers. Yeah. I'm all over that. That's exactly the. Yeah, that's exactly what we've been saying. With the installed base and the price and the fact that the whole system is the price of, yes, it's going to be less powerful, less beautiful graphics than the other devices. But if it's good enough, it doesn't matter. And I tried it. I thought it was good enough. Maybe it's not going to be ultimately, but it seems so. They are starting to talk about things like games. You'll get to be able to download the Playroom VR collection of social games and stuff like that. So we'll talk more about the details of this tomorrow on the show with Aaron Carson and Scott Johnson. But for now, Patrick Beja, thanks as always. Remind people where they can find more of your excellent insight. Well, you can always go to Twitter. I'm not Patrick on there. You can also go to Frenchspin.com, where we just published a special episode of the Philius Club talking all about high school clicks in the US and trying to understand them with Wendy Dunford that you might know from, for example, the TMS show with Scott Johnson, her brother. So yeah, if you want to listen to that, it was a super fun show, super interesting. And it's on Frenchspin.com. It's just been made available. I was going to say, I didn't see that, but now I do. It just showed up. Just today, a few hours ago, just for you. And then, of course, Molly Wood, you can find on Marketplace. If people haven't heard yet, we announced it on our Patreon. We've talked about it on the pre and post show. But our own Jenny Josephson, who will continue to help us out here at DTS, is also joining you at Marketplace. She is. I'm very excited that Jenny is coming to Marketplace. She's going to be a story producer on the Chai Rizdahl show team. And I think she is going to be absolutely phenomenal. I haven't broken it to them that she's going to be like my shadow producer. Information, I don't think they need to know. But I have to say, I just want to say that Jenny has been the shadow producer of my life for years. I think that you have done an absolutely phenomenal thing for the Daily Tech News Show community. I'm so glad that you were there for Tom when he needed you, unlike some of us. And you together have built a phenomenal thing. And that's because Jenny is the supreme badass of all the universe. Oh. I will do my very best to disappoint all of you. Not bloody likely. Well, you haven't yet. You've been doing a really bad job of disappointing us for the past couple of years. Yeah, she sucks at that. Yeah. And part of Jenny's involvement in Daily Tech News Show has been to be able to give all. And this is true for me and for Patrick and for everyone, is to give us all the ability to take what we learn here and spread it and find other things we can do with it. And so this is one opportunity that I think is fantastic. So congratulations, Jenny. And we will miss you on the pre and post shows because you won't be able to be on those most of the time. But you'll still be around. And we've got the new milestone for the Roundtable Show. We'll rope you into that. There's all kinds of stuff, so. Yeah, and I have always thought that one of my favorite things about DTNS and it will continue to be my favorite thing about DTNS is how you can have an idea, talk it over with two people and do the idea. And that's it. And those ideas that I think of, that Tom thinks of, that all of our contributors think of, those will continue. We will continue to have ideas and I will continue to have many ideas for this show and I am super excited for both things and a little bit nervous for one of them. Well, folks, thank you for supporting the show and making it possible for us to bring this to you. For Jenny and I to collaborate and develop and grow this show for you, dailytechnewshow.com slash support is the page that has all the ways to support the show, including our store and get some mugs and t-shirts. There's a Bitcoin button, a PayPal button and of course, patreon.com slash DTNS. Our newest milestone is to get a monthly Roundtable Show going. So check that out if you're not already supporting us and if you are, thank you so much. Your support and you're willing to give value back means the world to us. In fact, this Saturday from three to five PM at the Farmers Market in Los Angeles, the one by the Grove, we're gonna have a DTNS meetup. So come join us there. Again, that's three to five PM at the Farmers Market by the Grove. Stay tuned after the audio show or look in the treasure chest for Tech in Travel by Chris Christensen. Our email address is feedback at dailytechnewshow.com. Give us a call, 51259 daily. That's 5932459. Catch the show live Monday through Friday, 4.30 PM Eastern at alphageekradio.com and a diamondclub.tv. And visit our website, dailytechnewshow.com. As I mentioned, back tomorrow with Aaron Cawson and Scott Johnson. Talk to you then. This show is part of the Frog Pants Network. Get more at frogpants.com. Diamond Club, hope you have enjoyed this program. Good show. Great show. Good. I want that PlayStation VR bundle. Yeah, give it to me. Oh, yeah. No, they're gonna sell a ton of pre-orders to all the people at the PS4s. And then a couple of months later, they'll come out with the bundle. Patrick, do you think it'll be in October when they come with a bundle? Do you think they'll wait that long? I think they will have the bundle immediately. And I think it's gonna be sub $700, the bundle. Yeah, well, I think by then, it's even possible that the PS4 itself is gonna be $299. So, it's gonna be... Oh, what's the PS4? No, the PS4 is $299 right now. No, it's $349, isn't it? I just looked it up and it was $290. Oh, is it? Okay, maybe I didn't realize. Well, in that case... $349 is the bundles, like all the game bundles. Or $359. Okay, all right. Well, in that case, it will that the bundle is definitely gonna be $700 because that's the price it already is. Well, now I'm looking at it. This $299 is refurbished, so... Right, right. Okay, so... Why don't they make these things easy to tell at the freaking prices? Yeah, so I think it's gonna be $700 for the bundle and they are going to have those in... They have the biggest, the largest installed base of VR-capable devices in the world. It's the biggest console installed base at this stage of their history, besides the Wii, which doesn't really count, but everyone is gonna see that and every single person that is gonna buy a PSVR is gonna be an advocate because they're gonna shell out 400 bucks for this. And they're gonna be saying, they're gonna be evangelizing everyone and telling their friends, come, you have to try it out. And I think Sony is very, very, very well positioned for all of this. Would we like a title? Yes. Many titles are about puppies. I'm as expected. It's like you bring a puppy for five seconds in the pre-show and you just derail the whole thing. There's a big dog to heck. Puppy heck. Well, no, it was Patrick's like, you could say, do you care about puppies? Oh, that's right. Oh yeah, totally, I forgot all about that. Puppy. Puppy, check yes or no. AMD's biggest flop yet. I do like explain PGP to your mom. I feel like that one over promises because- That doesn't ever promise because we can't, no one can do that. We don't teach you how to do that. AMD's biggest flop yet, by maybe, I mean no. Well, it's about the convenience which by no way takes a point of view on anything. And save the puppies. Tom, remember when we used to walk down Second Street and all those people used to ask us some ridiculous questions like that? So like, do you want to save the children? And then you would say, what, for what, for eating? Did I really? Yeah. And then we spent like a whole block because we're this nerdy, like brainstorming, snotty comebacks for these poor people that are like, do you have a minute to save the puppies? Yeah. Just say no. No, I don't have a minute. I don't even have a minute. No, I don't even have a minute. Just let them die. Let them die. There's too many puppies. Save the children for what? For what, for eating? No, I don't want to eat children. You're disgusting. Disgusting. Save the children. Yeah, save me, too. Yeah, save, too. One for dessert. Sorry, I derailed this, that wasn't my problem. You give me a jerk and say you're building a startup and you need some low-cost factory workers. Exactly. See, now you're the spirit. Did you say save one children? Can I buy them by the dozen? You spoke discount on children. I mean, save the puppies is never a bad idea for a title. It doesn't make any sense, and yet it makes total sense. So that works for us. Save the puppy, yes, no, is the title, as suggested. Oh, cute. Yeah. We like graphical titles here. So I'm going to save all my nice stuff to say about Tom for Friday, but that was very nice. You're not leaving. No, I know. I ain't dying, Jenny. You got to let her leave a little bit so that she can have the good going away kudos. You're right, you're right. You got to give her a party. You better have a cake. No cake, not enough cake in life. What? So much cake. Have a cake at the meet-up. Well, yeah, that we can do, actually. We could have pie at the meet-up. Donut cake. Donut cake. That's a thing? I will be. Oh, my god. Molly, they had a donut cake at the stuck-in-the-middle premiere party. It was a donut tower. Just a two-hour donut with no baby donuts falling off the side. I blinked so hard my contact almost fell out. Like, I needed a donut cake immediately. Like, I went like all crazy eyeballs, and then it dried out, and then I blinked and almost popped out. That's how excited I am about donut cake. I'm good at this. That is pretty exciting. OK, you don't have to humor me on that one. Donut cake. I ate it. It was exciting. Wait, so group question. What are you eyeing at? You just all are. The donut cake photo that I just found on the goog. So while we're looking at donut cake, question. I, Jenny Josephson, could go right now, at the end of the show, and stand in line for probably an hour and a half and get Shake Shack, to say I got it on the first day. Or I could remember that I had Shake Shack a week and a half ago in New York three times. Wait, I need more data. What's Shake Shack? Oh, come to America. America, Patrick. Shake Shack is a very good, high-end burger place that serves. There's nothing extraordinary about the burgers, except the overall deliciousness of them. OK, then my question is, why would you not do that? Good answer. That's a good answer. And I think my only thing is, maybe it's going to be a little sunshiny, and maybe I could do better things to prepare for next, no? Just don't. The only reason you wouldn't do it is you didn't want to deal with the crowd, because it's going to be huge. Right, but my feeling is the crowd will never be not huge. It'll never not be huge for years. But it will be at its hugest right now. Right. And also. Yeah, so what's the differential there? What's the overrun? Part of the fun would be taking Matt. Why? I think I took him once to New York, and he loved it so much, but he did not get to travel all that much. So I should probably be like Star Wars, and not go see it the first second it's available, and wait for the one I love. I thought you were waiting for the one you love. I do it like Star Wars, and we should take a whole row of people there. Right, and go like 30 times. Yeah, that's fair. Shit, you guys. Like a donut cake is just two bun cakes. Yeah, I can do this. I can totally make it with pound cake. Yep. Yeah, but we'll be able to get any cream in the middle, and then chocolate over the top with Smarties. I wish I could. How can I drop a photo into our hangout? Do I have to just I am it to Tom? You can do share screen, but just. Ooh, that's dangerous. Yeah, I want to do that. No, no, no. No, just shared it. Oh, wait, you don't. Are you in the slide? You're in the screen. I'm sending an I am to Tom. Will he get it? A hangout. I send you a hangout. I am. So is the title of my aim? I am like 100 people. You guys are cute. Did we just, was there a title settled on? I totally missed that. Puppy's. Puppy's. All right. The top one about Puppy's in the checkboxes. That's crazy that I can't just like put a picture. You can share screen. And you can only, you can choose to only share a window so you're safer, which is what I'm about to do. There you go. OK. Do you see that? Look at that. That is a donut cake. That's a donut cake. That's what that is. That's totally, I can do that with my eyes closed. That's amazing. Wait, is that, are those, that's a cake donut. So that's cake donut. That's not like a raised donut. Right, exactly. It'd be a cake donut cake. That'd be a big donut to fry, I'd say. Yeah, it's not fried. That's clearly like two cakes baked in a bun pan. Just stuck together. By the way, this is reminding me that over the weekend at South by Southwest, someone was talking to me about the olden days of podcasting. And they said, do you know what the one podcast I miss the most of all podcasts that aren't around anymore? Gadgets. Oh. Maybe. So I thought I would pass that along. That's so sweet. Man, I have to say that people who can attach to gadgets like attach for life. This would have been a perfectly legitimate topic on gadgets. That's true. We would have spent a really long time with this. Especially if there were some sort of a vibrator tie-in. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like I've been for one second, one second. She's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, train, back on the track. Back on the track. How do you think you whipped the cream? I think Denny and I could. I'm walking away from that. Just witness me walking away. I think Denny and I could probably restart Gadgets. Oh my god. Goals. Goals. I know exactly. You're two. It's your two goal. You have a built-in like. We didn't plug. You know what we didn't plug? What? The dispatch. Oh, that's true. I have a new project. I'm sorry. Did you know the model of the new project? We slipped right past your actual projects. Yes, I have the dispatch. Oh, because we were talking about Denny. I do have a new project, though. Don't call it a podcast. It's been here for years. It's been here for years. It's an audio memo with an RSS feed. The dispatch is my new audio memo from Marketplace. And it's weekly. I've done six whole episodes. This week is going to feature some audio from GDC and then some other stuff. And it's short. I might feature someone that we know here. Yeah, it does. It features your homie, co-director of Nerdtacular, Corinne Lewis. Yep. Oh, fantastic. Yeah, Denny put us in touch yesterday and interviewed her. She's wonderful. She's amazing. I basically was like, hey, what the hell is going on in Game Land? And she was like, whoop. Let me tell you. Here's 17 story ideas. And I was like, you're awesome. But yeah, so you can find it at Marketplace.org. It does have an RSS feed. It's not listed on the podcatchers now. So you have to add it manually. But I think everybody here knows how to do that. It's a feed of audio enclosures. Exactly. It is simply a delivery format. Yeah, and I'm very excited about it. It's like a little bit skunk works. And it is not going to take up 30 minutes of your time. It is a six minute show. It's a snack. This is a little baby snack. It's a snack cast. Snack cast. That's all we should call it. We should totally, that's it, yep. That's what Jim Latterback used to call stuff at Revision 3, snackable content. Yeah, I mean, that's been around for sure. And this is that. But I don't think anyone's used snack cast. I think snack cast is where it's at. I'm going to start. Unless there's a podcast about snacks, which can be. I'm going to use that in my, well, there is now after this donut talk. I'm going to use that in my intro. I'm going to say this is my snack cast. TM Daily Tech News Show. There's a hashtag. TM Jenny Justin. The Twitter account. For what, snack cast? For snack cast. It's like all over the place. I'll get sued. They're like, you can't call it a snack cast. Don't call it a snack cast. There's a Facebook group. What the heck? Snack cast is totally a thing. Wow, you guys. Rachel Tratch's late night snack cast on True TV. Oh my god. I think that's actually about snacks, though. Wow. Wow. Snack cast is about, they all do seem to be about food. Yeah. It's an easy topic to cast about. It is. As you may have noticed, the hijacked our show to talk about. Well, it's one of the few that you can get heated about, but not have to worry about offending anyone. That's true, unless you go off on vegetarians or whatever, you know? Well, then that's you're going off on lifestyle. But you can have a big fight about which Doritos you prefer. And you can do that all night. People love it, and you won't make anyone mad. I hope no one gets super angry over cool ranch Doritos versus whatever fire. It's no blood versus cores debate. That's serious. That's serious business, Roger. It is. People like their crappy beers. Haven't they become all one company yet? Yeah. I think they're owned by a Brazilian company, Inbev. Anheuser-Busch is now. No, Miller. The one that makes Coors is. Coors is still separate. The devil? Well, I covered this on the morning show, and now I can't remember. I think Miller and Bud are part of Inbev. And then. And Coors is part of the other one. Wait. And those two are trying to merge or something. Is that right? I don't remember. Brazilian company wasn't going to buy them. Dang it. I did like A, B, Inbev is Budweiser Corona, Stella Artois. But then which is the? And that's the S, A, B, Miller merger. Yes. So then Miller and Bud will be under the same roof. Heresy. It's shocking. But Coors is still entirely separate. Is that what that means? I don't know. That's my Google face. Golden Colorado. So the parent is Anheuser-Busch, Inbev. Yeah, they're S, A, B, Miller. So Coors will also be with Bud. Oh, so that's one of them. So Coors and Bud. They're going to be part in together. Yes, Coors and Miller were already together, owned by S, A, B, Miller. And now they're exploring the merger with Anheuser, with A, B, and Bud. Become S, A, B, Inbev, Miller. Exactly. Now the numbers. So basically, it'll be just like in The Simpsons, where they have the three variations of Duff. But it's really just the same Duff. Oh my god, it's totally just like that. That is awesome. That is awesome. We don't drink Duff here. We drink Fudd. Fudd. Genius. Right, he goes to Shelbyville. And that's where he meets Lorine, the country. Lorine. You know what's so funny? The waitress country. I don't know if they do this on purpose. But I know those place names are chosen based on the Northeast. But they fit Illinois. Springfield is north of Greenville. And Shelbyville is a little closer to Greenville. But you can get to Springfield from Shelbyville. This argument has definitely been on the internet. I just think a lot of cities in America have the same name. Yeah, they do. But do they pick, Simpsons, pick the ones that they know will have the most residents? Like the most commonality? I mean, there's literally a Springfield in every state in the country. OK. Is there a Shelbyville hopper? It is Santa's little hopper. I know he does kind of look like Santa's little hopper. He's pretty good at that conversation, too. That's a to-all. There's a Greenville in all but three states, I think. All right. We have to go back to work. I know he's pretty mellow today. Yeah, I'm almost done. Thanks again, Molly. That was super fun. I loved it. Let's do that more. Yes. Thanks, Patrick, for the topic. Thank you for being right. You know, that is actually one of the prides that I will keep in my heart for a long time. So thank you for giving me the opportunity to be right. All right. Thank you very much. You polished that trophy, buddy. You polished it. I don't have many, so I get the ones I can't. No, no. All right. Bye, everyone. See you, Molly. That was a long export for some reason. I guess it was a little bit of a longer show, so maybe that's why. So what does this mean with CBS planning to part with its radio group? I wonder what that means about network radio. Do you see this? CBS is going to sell off its 44 stations. I think it's going to sell it to Clearcast or Clear, whatever the. Clear channel. Third channel. Sorry. All right. I am out of the post. Thanks, everybody, for watching. We will talk to VR tomorrow. Bye.