 In to the national television network NTN for the live broadcast of the sitting of the upper house or the Senate Which will be presided by president of the Senate honorable Andy Daniel Whilst we are with the arrival of the president which will signal the official commencement of today's sitting I Will just give you an idea of who we have in the house at present the senator's present or Dr. Hebalas Raman we also have senator Mary Isaac Senator fortunate Belarus we have Senator Timothy Manga who is the newest addition to the Senate as he was born in on September 14th of this year We also have Dr. Adrian Oji senator Gabion Ferdinand senator Herman Gil Francis senator Joachim Henry and There are several papers which will be led by the leader of Government business in the Senate who is senator dr. You've all the sermon who will also be tabling four motions and four bills in the house one of the motion six parliamentary authorization To borrow 15 million easy dollars by way of credit from the first National Bank Solution limited and this is to for capital expenditure to finance a 2017-2018 budget This will be paid at a rate of six percent The anum which is due one month after the full drawdown The second motion also six parliament authorization for the minister to borrow 25 million easy dollars by way of credit This time from the bank of St. Lucian limited for capital expenditure to finance a 2017-2018 Budget and there's yet a third motion again, which will be tabled by the leader of government business and minister in the ministry of finance Dr. Ubaldas Hariman and this time to borrow Over just over one million easy dollars by way of credit from the International Development Association To finance the cemetery disaster vulnerability reduction project Also, we have several bills that will be tabled by the Will be tabled by the leader of government business and they include investor Sanusha amendment income tax amendment Land and house tax Airport development, so this is just a rundown of what the order paper looks like which is the agenda That will set the tone for what will happen here in the Senate as we await the arrival of the Senate president President Andy Daniel Several papers will be laid among them. We have the CIP St. Lucia will see IP of course with stands for citizenship citizenship by investment program And we also have salutary instruments Several of them to be laid down among them the excise tax amendments of schedule number one number seven order so most of the senators already seated and as we await the arrival of The president of the Senate. I now take you back to master control We're going to resume as soon as the speaker makes his arrival Let us pray Almighty God by whom alone kings reign and princess decree justice and From whom alone comes all council wisdom and understanding We thine unworthy servants here gathered together in thy name Do most humbly beseech you to send down thy heavenly king wisdom from above to direct and guide us in all our consultations and Grant that we having thy fear always before our eyes and laying aside all private interests prejudices and partial affections The result of all our councils may be to the glory of thy blessed name The maintenance of true religion and justice The safety honor and happiness of the queen the public will peace and tranquility of St. Lucia and the uniting and knitting together of the hearts of all persons and estates within the name In true Christian love and charity One towards another through Jesus Christ our Lord amen The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Ghost be with us all everywhere every more Amen Good morning senators Senators You may be aware that the speak of the house took ill yesterday. I spoke to her this morning She's recovering She's still at the hospital. Well, at least at the point the time I spoke to her I'm hoping that all senators Will join me a family Keeper in our prayers and wish her a speedy recovery Senators, I am going to make a statement here. I am not soliciting a response from senators It's like you to ponder in it and keep it in mind. I was standing order 47 one or should I say 47 47 for States it shall be out of order to use offensive and Insulting language about members of either house Well, I didn't say it says chamber, but I just said house. I would like to extend that a little bit because We are called or we are pointed as senators and Being members of this house. We are given the added title of honorable a simple search of any dictionary the definition of words is used for offensive And I made it I Printed out and if I do not want to circulate because I know our honorable members here You're fully aware, but words like abusive annoying embarrassing distasteful Disagreeable these are words used to describe offensive honorable conscientious honest ethical distinguished righteous trustworthy virtuous and Our behavior not just because our standing order use the word language the unspoken word Can't be language Our behavior can be language. I'm saying all of this Whether it is in the Senate or in other house when we are wherever we are we must always always add a head to the highest of standard expected of us as senators on and as honorable members of the Senate I'm not saying this to get anyone to stand. I'm not Pointing fingers. I'm just saying senators. We lose it. We started to lose control whether it is this house or the other house We started to lose control and I think the earlier we could Nip it in the bird I Think we were all brought up to to believe in us teaching time save nine Senators have also received correspondence Though ill from the speaker of the House of Assembly advising that the following motions and bills will pass in The House of Assembly and forwarded to the Senate for its concurrence Resolution of parliament to borrow from first National Bank of Sanolution limited for capital expenditures expenditure to finance the twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen budget Resolution of parliament to borrow from bank of San diving limited for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget Resolution of parliament to borrow for capital expenditure expenditure, St. Lucia disaster vulnerability reduction project, resolution of parliament to approve draft value added tax amendment of schedule three order, invest St. Lucia amendment act, land and house tax with amendment, income tax amendment. Senators, I have also received correspondence from Senator Mauricio Thomas Francis, Deputy President, who is unable to attend today's sitting due to ill health. And Senator Jerome Gideon is out of state statement by ministers. My apologies. We still have statements from ministers. Yes. Okay, very well. Thank you, Mr. President. Mr. President, as you know, the arts and heritage month was celebrated last month in October. And arts and heritage month is designed to draw focus to our culture and heritage during the month of October. The newly established, and I say newly established, it's under the year old, events company of St. Lucia along with the St. Lucia cultural development foundation and the folk recent center all came together and the one umbrella to deliver this package of events for our country across the length and breadth of the country. The celebrations, of course, kicked off with the arts with the arts component. And of course, in early October, we celebrated the icon series. And we of course, our country celebrated the one of our giant novelists in the person of Garf Santoma. We also saw the crowning of the law when we all and of course she was crowned by her excellency, the governor general. And of course, that queen came from the community of Jack mill. And she was the queen of Queens. As anything else, she came from a field of seven Queens from 2010 to 2016. I think she won the crown last year. And of course, was able to emerge the superior of the bunch of seven Queens that we had across the country. The others of course came from castries, Babano, Marigou, Miku, Derisul and Moshe. We also witnessed in this month or last month a tribute to Monsignor Patrick Anthony, who is the founding father of the folk recent center, the agency that has really assisted our country in realizing the goals of ensuring that St. Lucia, the goal of ensuring that St. Lucia's become or remain even more conscious of their of their folk heritage. There were also many private entities staging activities during the arts and heritage month. And we welcome this. There was a celebration of our Calabash, the national tree. Many of our young people have grown up knowing that Calabash is our national tree. But in terms of the products that could come out of the Calabash tree, we were able to see a lot of that at the Alliance for Cells and we want to thank the French government for their intervention in that regard. We also saw a Creole Song competition, and that was staged by a group of persons in the arts at the National Cultural Center. We are seeing the emergence of Creole theme events across St. Lucia during the event, private events. And that is what we would want to see, not just for Creole Heritage Month, but throughout the year in our country. The highlighted communities for the celebrations this year were Marigou before Larisous, Dennery. And each of them staged a series of activities throughout the month, ranging from storytelling and river washing in Larisous to the Tabou Festival or the Festé Tabou, and ballet and court dances in Babineau. And of course, we also had the Jeunesse Creole celebrations in Marigou and also the celebration of our Indian heritage, because the Indians are also very much a part of our culture. We celebrated the Indian heritage in the community of Viewfort. And we want to thank the people of Viewfort, particularly the mayor of Viewfort and the organization, the foundation, the Indian foundation down there for the tremendous work that they did in that regard. We celebrated, of course, the La Magritte Festival, which retains the Sprite of Place during the month, with the Grand Saint's being held at Larisous, Dennery, and the Grand Fête being held in Labry. Arts and Heritage Month, of course, came to a crescendo in the last week in October, with the staging of the Market Festival or an artist's market in Constitution Park. And of course, that featured the work of a number of local solutions who were in local solutions, you know, solutions featured the work of a number of artisans, jewelry makers, fashion designers, accessories, all kinds of work were on show in the in the Constitution Park over the last, the past weekend. And of course, patrons were able to enjoy the traditional exhibition, which happened at the Cassaries Town Hall on the 26th and 27th of October. There is ample evidence, Mr. President, that St. Lucia has embraced. St. Lucia's have embraced the celebration of our heritage. And we know that there is much passion within the arts community, arts fraternity, to continue investing in this sector. And that's why the government of the United Workers Party has continued to invest. And we made over $500,000 available this year to celebrate our culture and our heritage in the way that we did this year. We want to continue to invite the artists and artisans to continue to bring the ideas to the fore in a timely manner so that we can plan and not just do it two or more now for now, but plan over the long term so that next year, the events can be even bigger and better. And on an issue for crime during these events, we can say that we had incident-free Creole Heritage Month. You know, all our events went out without any major events, major incidents, and we're quite happy for that. We want to celebrate those agencies that provided the support. We want to thank the staff of the various agencies that worked. And more importantly, we want to thank the communities, the citizens who volunteered to ensure that they delivered the events in the way that they did. So on behalf of the government, we just want to say thanks. And as the Minister of Responsibility for Culture, I wanted to echo that sentiment in the House this morning to say thanks to the many citizens and many patrons who came out to support and the successful delivery of this event for the successful derivative. Thank you so much. Minister for Health. Minister for Health. Good morning, Mr. President, members of the opposite side, fellow senators, everybody else, good morning. Mr. President, I just want to report that I attended the 2017 World Conference on National and Noncommunicable Diseases. And coming out of that conference, Mr. President, was everybody's view that we have to look at health care in terms of preventative health as well as community mental wellness. Those were the two outstanding themes coming out of that meeting, Mr. President. And I know that many people of late have been calling on the Minister of Health to speak out about our health care system and the situation of health care in St. Lucia. And I just want to say this morning that we are all aware that the situation is grave. For years, we have had a health care system that is deteriorating and going down into the ground. But, Mr. President, while I have inherited this horrible situation where we have Victoria Hospital that is really in a state of disrepair, we lack a lot of resources to put in that hospital. And we know that many St. Lucia's are going without health care because they cannot afford it. I also inherited the situation with the St. Jude Hospital. And I have to say that we are all aware that this situation has been as it is for a very long time. So I am not going to lay blame on anyone, except to say that when I attend these meetings and I hear the path that we ought to take to avoid continuing in a very unacceptable situation, Mr. President. It is very encouraging to know that we are not alone. However, we are doing everything that we possibly can, myself and the staff of the Ministry of Health. I want our people in St. Lucia to know that we are working our seriously to try and resolve these issues as soon as possible. In the case of preventative care, Mr. President, I am calling on all of us in St. Lucia to take care of our health. Our health is our business. It does not belong to the government of the state. It does not belong to anyone else but ourselves. It is true that when it comes to recreational activity, we are shortchanged, but we still have a lot of areas and resources that nature has given to us. We have our beaches and I do not see sufficient people are making use of that. When we focus on preventative care, what we are saying is you have to try and prevent yourself from getting ill. You do not do things to cause yourself to get sick and then you cannot find the resources to take care of yourself. So, Mr. President, in light of that, we are the Ministry of Health. We have embarked on a study to put together a plan to take care of, to address the issue of preventative care. We will be looking at, Mr. President, and I need to alert everyone that we will be looking at making you pay your health care bill while you engage in unhealthy activity. By that, I mean if you're going to consume alcohol, then you are going to pay for that alcohol. You are going to be taxed in a way that as you drink, you pay for your health care bill. We are going to do the same and that is a Ministry of Health initiative. I must warn you that my Prime Minister has not been told that this is being done. He has not had any input in that initiative. But I want to educate the people of St. Lucia from here that we are going to be looking at alcohol, tobacco. So, you want to smoke? You want to cause other people to inhale your second hand smoke? We are going to tax you. So, while you smoke, we are going to collect monies to pay that health care bill. We are also going to be looking at sweet drinks. I know at one time our soft drinks were very sweet, had a very high sugar content and the local manufacturers moved to address that. So, I am putting everyone on alert that we are going to be looking at sweetened drinks as well as processed foods and anything else that any member, anybody in St. Lucia can draw to our attention that we should be looking at imposing some fine on so that we can extract finance to finance our health care in St. Lucia. We cannot be leaving recklessly and at the end of the day expect government and other people to take on that burden because we know that oftentimes we see people out there asking people to sponsor, sponsor, sponsor for somebody to travel overseas to get medical care, Mr. President. But we have to think of the things not reaching that stage. So, we are saying people will have to start taking care of the health. We have a very, very high percentage of people living with diabetes in St. Lucia. People who are suffering heart attacks. Cancer is one of the leading causes of death in this country. So, we have to start looking at preventative health care. So, when you take that cup of tea or coffee in the morning, I want you to start thinking of how you're going to pay for all that sugar you are putting in your system. How you are going to pay to get rid of it at the end of the day. So, go easy on the sugar. Your salt intake. Yes, you need sugar. You need salt. But some of us are consuming too much. And this is why we have all these high levels of diseases in this country. So, we have to start taking stock and taking care of our health and the health of our children. So, the soft drinks in the schools, that's another one. They must go. And I want to commend the mayor of Cassarise for taking the lead and cleaning around the schools in the city, the primary schools in the city. I know that a lot of us will come down and say, Mr. President, that a person has to make a living. But you cannot make a living by killing other people. You have to find a different way to make that living. And there must be a different way. So, Mr. President, I also want to comment, Mr. President, on the amount of crime in this country. And I know that some people might not agree with me. And a lot of us say we have to defend ourselves. Yes. But we have a justice system. And we cannot take the law in our own hands. We cannot, I am hoping, Mr. President. And I do not know what is going to come out of the investigation where a young man whom I was told maybe, may have been, may have had homosexual tendencies, was killed, Mr. President. And I wish to say that today. That it may be somebody's turn now. But you do not know when your turn will be. We have relatives. We have people. We have family. We have friends. We have children. And we cannot discriminate on people based on their sexual preference. I need to make that abundantly clear in here. St. Lucia is a small island. It is a beautiful paradise. We cannot start engaging in hate crimes in this country. And Mr. President, this is our country. And sometimes I wonder, when I hear certain people say certain things, Mr. President, I'm hearing that somebody slapped somebody and the person shot the person. I am hoping, Mr. President, that this is not the case. Because you cannot take the law in your own hands. How can you take a person's life because the person slapped you? I do not know what the situation was, Mr. President. So I want to refrain on making any more statements. But I want our people to learn to be more tolerant. Because at the end of the day, you have to live with your conscience. We have to raise our level of tolerance in this country. I'm not saying somebody should slap anybody. People have to learn not to abuse people. These are all abuses that we engage in. And even when it comes to beating a child, Mr. President, I know they said spread a road and spoiled a child. But I have one sister who raised two daughters, Mr. President, and there is something that I really admire about that. Because she never raised her hands on these daughters. Minister, I do not want to stop you. But I think statement by ministers should really be about the portfolio for which you have direct control. I'm stretching it a bit to go to wellness, but be so careful and so guided. Thank you, Mr. President. Mr. President, these crimes spill over into my hospital, Mr. President. And we are already challenged in these hospitals. They spill over into mental wellness, Mr. President. And this is why I am making these pleas. It is not just to talk. Because they really disturbed me. I am called in the middle of the night when these things happen, the people go to Victoria Hospital, all the crying, all the mourning and weeping. So I understand what you say, Mr. President, but I just thought I should use this forum as a way of reaching out to our people who seem to have developed a very intolerant attitude. And it all boils down to mental wellness, homeland security. It filters throughout our system, Mr. President. So I just wanted to make these points here today that the Ministry of Health is focusing on people paying their healthcare bills. And of course we are not going to say that unemployed people are going to, unemployed people and poor people are going to suffer because they cannot afford to pay for their medical bills. So Mr. President, I wish to thank you very much and I'm really very happy and excited to be at the Ministry of Health, where I know that the staff are very enthusiastic, they are hardworking. I wish to thank them very much because we know that together we are going to resolve the issue of the national health insurance for all the people of St. Glacier. I thank you, Mr. President. Minister for Home Affairs, Justice and National Security. Thank you very much, Mr. President. At present there are 48 homicides in St. Lucia and this gives rise to a lot of panic among our people, a lot of discussions and a lot of blame is being thrown around because of the number of homicides that have been occurring. It is a alarming and there must be serious action taken to reverse that trend. St. Lucia is not alone in that phenomena. The Caribbean seem to be suffering from that malaise of persons not having respect for law and order and justice and taking and enacting their own sort of vengeance on individuals who they perceive to have infringed on their rights. We have to devise ways and means of dealing with that situation. And yesterday listening to the House, the Law House, I was very pleased with the manner in which the majority of members conducted themselves. With the exception of the representative for Kastri South. When he brought up the idea of the impact report and I felt that to be very unfortunate that he would have brought up that incident and not even give a reason or some sort of rationale for saying or talking about the impact report. I will not go down that line, Mr President. We all know what the impact report contains. We know how it started and we know where we are. This government has shown the resolve in trying to deal with this impact report as quickly as possible. But we know there is separation between the legislature, the executive and the judiciary. The executive has done what it is supposed to do by putting in place a DPP and allowing him and giving him the facilities and the assistance in dealing with this matter. And I think that this is not an easy subject and it's a matter that we need to give the DPP some space so that he can do the right thing. The member for Castle South went further to indicate that the United Workers' Party went in opposition of the campaign. Good senator. We're talking about the impact report, Mr President. Then frame it in the way that it is a statement dealing with your portfolio. It appears that you're taking on exactly what was said by the member. I would like you to frame it in the way it's your statement by your minister as a minister. So handle it in a manner appropriate to your ministry instead of trying to respond to the member for what he said. I'm just asking you to couch it in a different manner. That's all. Thank you for the directive given. So I'm going to throw away from this point. But then I must also make note of the call from the member, the opposition member from the lower house for there to be bipartisan cooperation and discussion on the subject of crime. And so I've taken his suggestion and I'm putting in place a committee of relevant stakeholders who will meet sometime this month to brainstorm and see how we can come up with solutions to deal with this matter. I received some correspondence from raise your voice Saint Lucia and I must congratulate them for actually sending the document to me and telling me some of the views and pieces of legislation that they would like to see brought in. And they would like to see the enactment of the Child Justice Bill, the enactment of the Children's Care and Adoption Bill, the enactment of the Domestic Violence Bill, then enactment of the status of Children Bill and that status bill really talks about doing away with illegitimate and legitimate children. So at the end of the day there will be no difference between an illegitimate and legitimate child and I think that is a very important piece of legislation that we should enact. The enactment of status of parenting, testing procedures and regulations, the amendment of the civil code as regards to succession laws and the removal of references to illegitimate and illegitimate children in achieving priority among all children. And the amendment of affiliation acts to make child support dependent on a means test and not the stipulated $200. I think these are very valid pieces of legislation that my ministry will be looking to make good on. The time has come when all children should be treated as equal and $200 in this day and age cannot take care of a child for a month. And if you are making a certain amount of money then I think the power should be given to the ministry to look at your salary and make a decision as to the proportion of that salary that should go to that child. So I do hope that we will get the support of all members of the House, of the Senate when the time comes for this legislation to be passed. Mr. President, at this time I am the chairman of the council of ministers of the RSS. On Sunday of this, of last month, I think it was the 20th or 29th, I gave a, I made a few remarks at a church service as the chairman of the council of ministers. I think it's important that I read that statement in the Senate so that members and solutions know exactly what I said on their behalf. So with your permission, Mr. President, I would like to read what I said. As the current chairman of the council of ministers of the regional security system for RSS, I am indeed pleased to have been here, to be here with you this morning to participate in this sort of service, to mark the 35th anniversary of the regional security system. Ladies and gentlemen, the motto of the RSS is strength for unity and the core values are integrity, service, creativity and teamwork. I think it could end for an occasion such as this to share our story with you and I therefore ask for a little of your patience as I seek to briefly outline how some of those core values have assisted in enhancing the work of the RSS in its support to member states with the building of a secure and prosperous region for the citizens as well as visitors to our shores. The regional security system was created out of a need for a collective response to security threats, which were impacting on the stability of the region. On the 29th of October 1982, four members of the organization of the Eastern Caribbean states, namely Antigua and Barbada, Dominica, St. Lucian, St. Vincent and the Grenadines, signed a memorandum of understanding at Barbada to provide mutual assistance on request. St. Kitts and Nevis joined after gaining independence in 1983 and Veneda in January 1985. The MOU was updated in 1992 and the RSS acquired judicial status on 5th March 1996 by way of a treaty which was signed in St. George's Veneda. According to article 41 of the treaty, the purposes and functions of the system are to promote cooperation among member states in the prevention and interdiction of traffic in illegal narcotics drug, in national emergencies, search and rescue, immigration control, fisheries protection, customs and excise control, maritime policing duties, natural and other disasters, pollution control, combatting threats to national security, the prevention of smuggling and in the protection of offshore installations and exclusive economic zones. The RSS has additional responsibility to the wider curriculum region as indicated under the Treaty of Security's assistance, shortly named TSA. The TSA identifies RSS headquarters as part of the regional response mechanism. RSS headquarters which is located in Barbadas is the Coordinated Secretariat of the Curriculum Security Assistant Mechanism. As a result, the Executive Director is the coordinator of the Security Assistance Mechanism and a member of the Joint Strategic Coordinating and Planning Committee. The role and functions of the RSS as a unique international security organization paved the way for its critical participation in the development, maintenance and review of effective security policies and operations in the Anglophone Caribbean in pursuit of sustainable inclusive economic development initiatives of our member states. Adhering strictly to that philosophy, Teamwork has enabled us to build capacity on a continuous basis in our member state security forces as well as to assist in protecting the domestic space of these states for the past 35 years. In fact, I would venture to say that RSS stands as a bastion of cooperation in the protection of democratic values in our sub-region. I dare say that this has been more evident in the year 1993 when RSS forces ably assisted by the U.S. security forces took action to stabilize the island of Veneda thereby returning peace and democracy to its people. With the ever-changing nature of security in this vision, this vision was made as made it possible for the system to evolve an expanded role to fit the needs of our small island developing states in the 21st century. From the system's first major mobilization to Veneda in 1983 to security assistance provided to the government of St. Kitts and Nevis in 2016, the RSS has continuously proven its dedication to the region in the quest to maintain the principles of democracy, civil liberties, and the rule of law. The cooperative nature of the RSS proves to be the most profound worldwide as the RSS treaty devised and ratified by our then political stalwarts ensured that issues surrounding sovereignty and bureaucratic wrangling would not inhibit the cooperative nature of the RSS in operational and strategic matters. In fact, this strong cooperative approach fueled by trust among member states has resulted in the RSS achieving a myriad of successes in counter-drug policy and operations, increased integrity and credibility of state security institutions, as well as the improvement in the efficiency and effectiveness of our security institutions through increased training opportunities and the building of the human resource of our police, military, correctional facilities, and fire departments. Even as we move to strengthen the regional response coordination architecture, we recognize that unfunded mandates will be a key challenge while we have a well-laid out response strategy and structure in adequacy and unpredictability of available assets is a significant challenge. The training and practicing of our response action is also subject to the uncertainty due to the persistent resource uncertainty. While noting our economic challenges in the region, I must place on record our profound gratitude to the governments of the United States, United Kingdom, Canada, Holland and France, as well as international development partners such as the European Union, United Nations agencies, and the Caribbean Development Bank for the continued assistance to the RSS. The RSS also cooperates in the area of disaster management and mitigation. The headquarters cooperates with the Karikam Disaster Management Agency, CIDEMA, to train the disaster response team, Karikam Disaster Relief, unit CDROU. Our operational response to disaster and management situation involves the participation of our airing as well as our defense forces, police officers and fire service in the paramilitary units of the police forces. Mention must be made of the unstinting support of the men and women of the RSS forces who have come together unhesitately over the years to respond to every situation where they will require to assist our other member states. The service and teamwork of the RSS was never more evident in the recent response to the government and people of Dominica in the aftermath of Hurricane Maria that devastated that country. To date, the RSS has deployed over 300 police, military and fire service personnel to assist the government of Dominica. I ask that you keep the people of Dominica and Antigua and Barbuda in your presence as those two countries continue with the rehabilitation phase. For most among regional crime and security issues is the location of the Caribbean as roots for the illegal illicit movement of and the region's vulnerability to transnational organized crime. To assist in this fight, the RSS airing has been unswerving in its commitment to assist the member states in the fight against the trafficking of illegal drugs and to brave sometimes unfavorable conditions to conduct post disaster and search and rescue missions. The RSS is also adapting to the ever-changing security landscape that includes increasingly sophisticated criminal threats. The RSS asset recovery unit which commenced operation in December 2015 is an innovative approach to tackle serious organized crime and corruption in the region. The objective of the RSS asset recovery unit is achieved through billing capacity and capability of law enforcement and criminal justice practitioners, cultivating partnerships and the robust application of the proceeds of crime and money laundering legislation. The increased sophistication in criminality that I referred to earlier always has a cyber or digital nexus. In this regard, on 18th August 2017 the RSS has operationalized the Digital Forensic Lab to conduct accurate analysis of electronic data that is critical to law enforcement investigations and successful prosecutions. I must also mention the leadership of the RSS from the first coordinator of the system Brigadier Rudi-Arluis to Mr. Grantley Watson to the recently appointed Executive Director, Captain Ewington Shulun. The ship of the regional security system has been well-studied. We must also recognize all the other staff members past and present who have given invaluable support during this incredible journey. Through your efforts, our security forces are comprised of a community of highly trained professionals committed to strengthening our law enforcement operations. Let me express my gratitude to Superintendent Minister Reverend Adrian Odell of the Befehl Circuit for accommodating us in this morning's service and Captain Al Walcott for his Ministry of the Wood. In closing, I wish to offer heartiest congratulations in the regional security system on the journey over the past 35 years. The vision is proud of the work that you have done but the challenges in the security environment means that we need you now more than ever. Former U.S. President Dwight Eisenhower once said, A accomplishment will prove to be a journey, not a destination. As the RSS continues its journey, I encourage the team to be steadfast and resolute in its important work of service to the region. May this service continue on to many more milestones. I thank you, Mr. President. This was my few words through the RSS and I think it went down quite well with the persons who are there. So I want to thank you very much. If members want copies then I can always endeavour to do that. Thank you very much. People's to be late. Mr. President, I beg to lay the following papers standing in my name. Statutory instrument number 90 of 2017. Fisheries amendment regulations. Statutory instrument number 91 of 2017. Tourist due to free shopping system. Cox building order. Statutory instrument number 92 of 2017. Tourist due to free shopping system. Block and parcel number 0031C482 order. Statutory instrument number 93 of 2017. Price control amendment number 14 order. Statutory instrument number 93A of 2017. Excise tax amendment of schedule 1 number 6 order. Statutory instrument number 94 of 2017. Finance administration act. Resolution of parliament. To borrow for capital expenditure youth empowerment project. Statutory instrument number 95 of 2017. Invest St. Lucia. Dayamon view thoughts. Vesting order. Statutory instrument number 96 of 2017. Invest St. Lucia. Palm. Auger view thoughts. Vesting order. Statutory instrument number 97 of 2017. Fiscal incentives. Rambali blocks. Limited order. Statutory instrument 98 of 2017. Fiscal incentives. Nationwide concrete supplies. Limited order. Statutory instrument 99 of 2017. Price control amendment number 19 order. Number 15 order. Statutory instrument number 100 of 2017. Price control amendment number 16 order. Statutory instrument number 101 of 2017. Excise tax amendment of schedule 1 number 7 order. Citizen by investment units. Report on the financial statements for the year ended March 31st 2016 and 2017. And finally Mr. President CIP St. Lucia annual report 2016 2017. Motions. Honorable minister in the ministry of finance and leader of government business. Mr. President I beg to move the following motion standing in my name. Finance administration act resolution of parliament to borrow from first national bank St. Lucia limited for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget. Whereas it is provided by section 391 of the finance administration act capped 1501 that a minister responsible for finance may by resolution of parliament borrow money from a bank or other financial institution for the capital expenditure of government. And whereas it is further provided by section 41 of the finance administration act capped 1501 that there shall be charged upon and paid out of the consolidated fund debt charges for which the government is liable. And whereas the minister responsible for finance considers it necessary to borrow 15 million $80 by way of credit in this resolution referred to as the credit from first national bank St. Lucia limited for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget. And whereas interest on the principal amount of the credit is repayable at a rate of 6% per annum due one month after the full drawdown. And whereas the principal amount of the credit is repayable in the amounts of EC 127,579 dollars per month inclusive of interest for 180 months. Be it resolved that parliament authorizes the ministry the minister responsible for finance to borrow 15 million $80 by way of credit in this resolution referred to as the credit from first national banks in Lucia limited for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget. Be it further resolved that a interest on the principal amount of the credit is payable at a rate of 6% per annum due one month after the full drawdown. And be the principal amount of the credit is repayable in the amount of EC 126,579 dollars per month inclusive of interest for 180 months. Mr. President as I read earlier in fact Mr. President before I make my contribution on this resolution I need to applaud you for bringing to our attention standing order of 37-4 in which you it states that it shall be out of order to use offensive and insulting insulting language about members of either chamber. And Mr. President I hope that we adhere to such because there seems to be I don't know how to describe it Mr. President our society is becoming that kind of society where we believe that we have to use abusive words we have to use the worst words that you can think of about somebody the worst about people in an effort to try to make yourself feel that you are better off than that person there seems to be that kind of culture in St. Louis nowadays Mr. President and I just want to remind us as a nation that the Good Book in Psalms 90 verse 12 it says that teach us to use wisely all the time we have that was the summits we said that teach us wisely to use wisely all the time we have and I believe Mr. President if we adhere to this simple but profound principle in the Word of God we will not have time to bring down each other bully each other and make ourselves feel better when we deal when we put down others with our tongues so Mr. President I must applaud you for reminding us of this standing order 374 Mr. President the resolution that I presented here this morning it's a very straightforward resolution and it states clearly that it is an amount that we are seeking the Senate's approval to borrow 15 million dollars to finance the capital expenditure contained in the appropriations bill as far as capital expenditure is concerned for the 2017-2018 budget so it's an appropriation bill that we have already approved in the House and all we are seeking here this morning is Senate's approval for the borrowing and what is important in this resolution Mr. President is the source of funding the source of funding we state clearly of course the the appropriation bill will not contain these details it will give you the amount that will be needed for the capital expenditures and the source of funding in terms of bonds, Treasury bills, loans and so on but this morning it is clear what we are seeking from Cabinet or what we are seeking from Cabinet it's not Cabinet but from the Senate my apologies Mr. President very simple we are seeking the Senate's permission to borrow $15 million and the source of that funding Mr. President is the first National Bank of St. Lucia also Mr. President the resolution also speaks of the condition of the borrowing and it clearly states that we will in fact the the interest rates on the borrowing is 6% now Mr. President this is very very important and the term of the of a maturity of period is 15 years or 180 months this is very important Mr. President because I remember having a discussion with the my members of the the staff of the Department of Finance and with regards to this borrowing and the other one 25 million we'll get to that that the 6% was just not something we just came up with or we just got we did our market research we went out and shop so to speak and we had a choice of borrowing the money Mr. President from the Regional Government Security Market RGSM which we have been doing for for quite a while but when we did the analysis within the Department of Finance we realized that if we were to go with the RGSM the average lending rates of that institution for that amount would have been about in the region of 7.3 7.5 percent now giving the mandate that this government has given to the Ministry of Finance with regards to our debt situation we said clearly that this administration this administration understands the situation of our debts in this country we had a very very we had the edge of a cliff Mr. President an edge the edge of a cliff as far as debt is concerning this country it is more or less on an unsustainable path to the point where Mr. President to the point where Mr. President the interest that we pay on our debt today the interest payments on an annual basis is 170 million dollars 170 million dollars which is equivalent Mr. President to almost 15 percent of our current revenues so all the money for every dollar the government receives 15 percent of that amount goes into paying our interest on our debt and Mr. President if we as a government if we as a government does not pay attention and do not or does not hold the bull bite horn by 2030 for every dollar that the government receives it will have to give up 22 to 25 percent of that dollar in paying just interest on our debt so Mr. President as a new government as a relatively new government we see the need for engaging and having a very robust debt strategy and one of the areas in which we say that we will tackle our debt situation is ensuring that when we go out in the markets we want to ensure Mr. President that the instrument the debt instrument that we will undertake must have a long time a long term maturity and that's the reason Mr. President we were able to get and negotiate a 15-year loan with the first national bank 15-year loan at 6 percent all in keeping with our debt strategy all in keeping in managing the debt situation of this country now Mr. President we just are not just looking at our debt situation in isolation as a government we believe there are other areas we need to focus on in terms of our revenue generation and expenditure controls because it's one thing to control your debt and another thing to control your expenditures so we are very very cognizant of the fact that we must pay attention to this aspect of our budget expenditure control so Mr. President I am very very pleased that we have undertaken this strategy number one ensuring that new instruments debt instruments have longer term maturity periods and of course lower interest rates thank you Mr. President honorable senators the question is that parliament authorizes the minister responsible for finance to borrow EC 15 million dollars by way of credit in this resolution referred to as the creditor from first national banks and luscious limiting for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget be it further resolved that a. interest on the principal amount of the credit is repairable at a rate of 6% per annum due one month after the full drawdown and b. the principal amount of the credit is repairable in the amount of EC 126,579 dollars per month inclusive of the interest for 180 months leader of opposition business thank you Mr. President thank you senators Mr. President I wish that you allow me leave to thank you on the report that you gave on our on the speaker of the lower house and we on this side of the house who wish her recovery from what took place last night Mr. President I would also like to thank you on the guidance that you gave to us in your opening remarks as to how do we continue to debate and to refrain from making statements that may injure and of course I will subscribe myself to the least to the appropriate objectives that is necessary in the discussion of this house but most of all Mr. Mr. President sorry I want to thank God Almighty for spending our lives and the lives of these dear senators who are present here and of course as we make use of our time wisely as the leader of government business so as falls in the Psalms that he quoted Mr. President I would like to reference my contribution this morning on a few matters of few statements made in the lower house and of course let me say that it's we do have the privilege and the benefit of listening to the discussion in the lower house and having to seek through the discussion and as it were to report on what is fruitful and what is necessary what is germane to the to the motion that is before us without venturing into unnecessary discussion have discovered unnecessary at the lower house and of course also to add clarity to the motion if certain questions were asked and was the necessary that we do not have to again debate certain aspect of the motion because we do have the benefit and the privilege of listening to the debate and by the distinguished members of the lower house so the Senate do have that advantage and I do hope that members do attend the lower house sitting listen to the debate and thereby fine-tuning arranging statements and and adding clarification so that we could move on with the business of this house and the business of solutions Mr. President some of the statements that I would like to pre-see what I'm going to speak with regards to the borrowing have to do with a statement made or statement made in the opening remarks by the Prime Minister or the leader of government business in the lower house when he cite the issue of making this country resilient for disaster and the cost of borrowing and I thought that was a very important and German contribution by the Minister of Finance and the government of the government of the business the Prime Minister cited in his contribution that whereas countries are ranked as developing having certain developmental status by a per capita income which would force or would cause countries like ours to borrow money at a high interest rate based on how we are categorized he contributed to this house that it's important that the islands or developing states like ours be also be viewed from its vulnerability risk as it relates to disaster and that per capita income that may just considers to be a developing country is not adequate we should also be considered based on our vulnerability status because of the risk and vulnerability risk as it relates to natural disaster and climate change but I also reflected on the issue of indices in regarding countries and I wish to submit that there is also a discussion on corruption index or corruption indices that is also necessary in the discussion of how you view countries uncertain and a lot of I say donor agencies would also weigh in and consider how do we evaluate countries when we take the perception of corruption into consideration and Mr. President it was necessary to bring into the discussion the issue of corruption so we have the issue of borrowing based on just fiscal measures you have the issue of borrowing based on vulnerability in terms of natural disaster and of course you have the issue of borrowing based on the issue of corruption index and there is and of course those of us who venture into social media would see some wonderful positions that St. Lucia Warn's attained in terms of being one of the leading or one of the countries in the islands that were seen as being as having a wide legislative framework and of course were recognized as leading in terms of corruption dealing with the issue of corruption or how we deal how we dealt with business Mr. President this is becoming an issue and for fear of not using some of the terms that may contribute to violating some of the good guidance of distinguished members I do speak to as we as politicians participate in the business of this government the issue of character corruption is something that we need to reflect on personally as it affects how we have viewed internationally and it affects the country as a whole and how we do business internationally so if in participating in the business of this country persons have viewed internationally as being character eroded corruption or whatever it is how is that played in terms of how we negotiate loans and borrowing so I thought I should mention this but I welcome the prime minister's contribution because I think it's a matter of resilience that I would like to debate even more in this house but in the prime minister's contribution I also would like to submit resilience a country resilience is not only based on its fiscal position or its state of infrastructure but based on how the ordinary people live in their society and communities as a matter of fact this is post and foremost and I do speak in the local palace whether we contribute to divide our people in the communities where they live are we making these communities more resilience no we are contributing to making them even more vulnerable for in Dominica some communities that were totally disconnected physical access and communication they had to rely on themselves to survive Maria what are we doing to communities in the nature of how we do our politics and if we were to meet a storm or be victimized by a hurricane like Maria where number of communities are disconnected and are separated how do we expect them to survive and are we contributing in our operations and governance to strengthen the resilience of community by building community empowerment community togetherness so I do start by making the statement from where the leader of the opposition ended in one of his contribution that we must continue to strive to govern this country with humility generosity respect empathy kindness and peace we must strive I'm not suggesting that we will get all of them right but we must work towards doing this as a country and all of us must contribute and that's why as I listen to the leader to the to the minister responsible for security if there's any attempt or any group to help deal with crime I would like to be considered to assist or to lend my voice to support because the issue of crime and violence is the business of all of us certainly I do not intend to politicize not to score points but I was deeply hurt and I said it in a number of quarters as I sat and I listened and I almost came to tears last night when I saw the speaker of the house being carried away not I'm an emotional person and anybody who is sick and I cannot help I feel helpless and I look at the situation it affects me emotionally and I felt hurt last night and I would like for us in this honorable house to join our minds to get on issues of national importance that is challenging and that is why when the statement was made by our prime minister during the election campaign that I will make St. Lucia safer I felt violated one from a religious perspective and we all know those of us who subscribe to our religion religious upbringing you see the most important thing Mr. President that took place on planet earth is when God decided to make man and he didn't say I he said let us make man in our own image but it's the devil who came with the idea of I who said I will ascend above the most high and anytime I hear someone instead of using the community approach to development speaks of I I will do this and I will do that it reminds me of the devil when he said I will ascend to the most high but God did the most important thing in his creation and he said let us make man in our own image that's what I've read in scripture and therefore I was perplexed and deeply concerned as to why an issue like crime that has that it has its challenge for all of us that we have been struggling with for such a long time and I choose to call the police department sometime and ask can I see the statistics of crime for over 20 years and the trend just showed that we are going up so when you take 20 years of our crime statistics and all you see that every year it's increasing there's no politics in it it means that the trend continues irrespective of who is in power that's what it says but who wants who wants crime and violence and would sit in this house and be called honorable none of us and therefore we should not take crime in the manner that it is it was taken on a political platform in the issue so I do sympathize with the leader of security who is shouldered with this responsibility to respond but I've said it before that the police do not go about killing and causing crime my philosophy on crime is that you need to go into the cradle where the parents are rocking their babies and deal with some of the issues and some of the recommendations that have been put forward to you our laws dealing with our families so these are important issues for us to contend with we have sat in a number of other gathering and I've displayed my action towards execution of persons I believe in the sacredness of life and I do not believe that life must be taken and I speak that way as an individual and I'm not afraid to express my opinion where I stand on issues as an individual it may not be the position it may not be the position of my comrade lead on in terms of execution I do not know but when I hear that we must execute criminals to resolve crime I do not share that philosophy I may be incorrect you understand but I do not share it I'm saying that we have deep rooted issues and I am happy that when the minister of health made her contribution she decided to deviate or as she was guided by the president of the house into crime because those persons inadvertently reached out to the hospital but I appreciated the dietitian contribution the member of health made as well for a moment I thought I was listening to my diet expert but it was important and I need to acknowledge this contribution but more importantly I think the whole ambit of laws dealing with families and fathers and their role in families and not being seen as putative members of a family we must bring that to bear and not necessarily increase father's contribution to the family senator just let me remind you the resolution that you're debating I know I know how you started so I'm giving you some leeway but just being guided that it's resolution and worry and secondly so before you end I would like you to make it abundantly clear that when you said when you hear somebody speak of I you think of the devil that you're not referring to you didn't make a correlation between the devil and the prime minister no not at all I said not at all at all thank you for that contribution I'm not in any way suggesting that the prime minister is the devil but I'm saying from my really just a bringing and I said this is how we were taught that anytime when God said because God is a plural term meaning Elohim it's in a plural term God is not an individual we all are taught that God is three in one the God the Father God the Son God the Holy Spirit but and when God spoke he said let us make man anytime you hear I it's an individual thing it reminds me of the devil who said I will ascend above the most high above them and I do not want to make a theology class of this parliament but the point I'm making it was the that the current prime minister on a political platform who said I will but let me move on and the rest of my contribution to meet me to recognize the period of Jeune Creole and of course a very important time for us when we celebrate Creole Mr. President it was a I did not go about buying a lot of the eats and drinks but I recognized in most communities there was something happening and it was beautiful to see Creole festival and first and activities in in St. Lucia some time ago I decided not to because there was traffic issues and I do not like to get involved in Creole day on traffic you know yes but I spent some time in some corners and it was good Creole food you cannot have too much of it because it feels breadfoot and foreign is enough for a day dumpling is too much and some of the myths of Creole I do not take but the language of Creole is what is is important and as we celebrate we bring to the full our own heritage our own uniqueness and therefore the borrowing I would like to meet me to say to St. Creole so I have a question today why does the government have to pay for it to whom government has to pay for it it is necessary to pay for it because it has to balance the money it has to pay for the population to pay the tax and that is what we have to spend that is what we have to do that is what we have to do let us not spend for it because without it because it is not a tax we have to spend to pay for it for the people if we have to pay for it then we have to pay for it to spend not to spend but to pay for it we have to do that because it is not a tax so if we have to spend today also we have to pay for it because it is not a tax and that is what we have to say Mr. President it is not because it is not a tax and that is not a tax that is not so much experience in bi-politics change my life but for me all of this is what I have to do for me to put the government to pay for it and therefore it's learn from the RI for us because it is not a tax that we have to spend the last little bit it means we have to spend That one because it is not a tax that we have to spend its free made it is not a tax they charge everything etc So, So government the population government the the the the the the the the the the the for for you If you was a adorable convince a madam. A madam. A madam. So say I'm not a place. I'm a place. I'm I'm We can't do this without having a metaphor or passing on the right to the right to the moment. We can't do this without power. So Pablo says to the government to work every day. This is the way it is going to be. Exhaust is going to create a mix. But if it's going to create a mix, we can't do this without power. And who is going to have power? Without power and without power. Life is not perfect. Because of the hemisphere. What I've never done before. What does the religion have to do with growing future? To think about the future? It doesn't have any kind of path to do with the future. But for a guy that has come to the wall, saying to me, why are you spying on me? I didn't do that. Because you sit here, I know I have your face and I told you, I don't know the name. But I can't even say the name. That's why the people here are the only people saying that. They are the only people who are supposed to have the reputation, to have the reputation of the people who are not allowed to do anything. But who am I. Mankiti sa. Mankiti sa. Pièce gouvernement qui a poité la haine, c'est un bon option pour poité la haine, dépousse sa vie et paye. Avec pièce on nous a fait qu'ici, y a sa ou sa poité toute la haon vlée en banque. C'est un bon option pour poité la haine, mais dépousse sa paye. Pour poité la haine, et qu'on passe sa vie et paise, qu'est sa qu'il fait? Unibu mette-bae pli weda su populatio paye. Unibu dele voe mon kayo eveig dele unibu wede pa paye deit la haon vlée, pu chata eveig dele le bae la wede. Eko shai set lisi e connet sa. Kotskaku yo u. Kotskaku yo u no pa ni lahapu paye upa sa paye deit la. So sa vau pa upa weponfunu. Delejiz ma monki ku yo mo kuesi e kotskaku upa weponfunu. Pas kia upa ni lahapu paye. Leu poit deit u kupasa paye. Se optioni pa paye. Me kisa kiga wevo leu pa paye deit tu. Wepita sioka kwa zee. Eko leu vie a i puetie deit ki ne se se. Puit deit laka vini pli ho pas kia yo kaga doko wisk. Ma pa kaya le pli noe. Me la ni plis pudi pa kia no sa. No ni pudis ki se. Plispe sa ojodia. Me kom ma ha di. Eko ma kaya vie wepita i. Si o di se plisien. De bagai. Awek ma ha di sa plisie kote. Pu guvena paye. Pli wede pa se pu. Pa le pu mon voti. Ba wu e gen eleksion. An se plisie gen eleksion sa meze. Ne potboun sa participei gen. Si lon koto wale. Si lon koto wale. Ne potboun sa participei. De les souetiei lontan a se pithet oubo hana chans. Pa tutmoun, me la wu gadei. Plisien moun ki participei. O politi ki hana chans wu wepizatei. Ek vini a siza kai pala mo. Pu fo contribution. Se pu sa ma tuju di. Ek lani moun i siya ki konek moe. Awek mo e ta politi kek moe di. Moe pli me le. Pu fo contribution. Pa se gen gen eleksion. Pa se kai depi moe toa pe. Plage la po dobo de pali mo kai fo contribution. Ek jodia ma pa gen gen eleksion. Mi mo kai fo contribution. An non pe payi se plisie. So mo kai di. Yon. Shans lon onion. Pu participei a develop mo peyi. Sa la po vo e pe pla dovan. Ie po nta po no gade decision. No kai po kue tila ha pui. Ek pa gadei konsidue i ales. Desiem. Mi siya posidon. An tan ki kai vini. Lem mo kai participei a po di moe voti ba yo. Ma kai kue tuk siya ba o la ki pala kai vini. Pa se kai. A poes mo mo konet espias ki sable di guvena peyi. E kisa ie po pali a su platform do kai febai. Pa se kai tuk sa. O do do kai fea. Jodia o kawai. Tu e difficile po fei. Mi siya posidon. Pai iya adan a situasion ki tuis. No kai pui tila ha. Ek la ni parol ki di kotei se plisie ka fei. La ni moe ki kumansini. Duita ka na konfianse. E kovidon se a payi sersi. Mi se yo ba kai po no vini siya a su taan ki one ko lela lene plen. Ek di se mo paol sa la. Mi se yo ba kai po kute samosa su shime kadi. Ans a fe kue peyi ttie peyi ko ha. No piti no se peyi ki vono a ba. I'm a I don't know. I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm One of the order, Mr President, 37-1. Mr President, I know you have given the member opposite lots of leeway. And I think he has. You said 37-1. 37-1 Mr President. He has to confine his observations to the subject under discussion. I think he went, he said it very well, I think, but now I think he is just trying, he is trying, I think you need to bring him back, Mr President. Mr Leader of Opposition Business, let me inform you, you have 10 minutes left. Okay, thank you. Thank you, thank you. Thank you for a lot. I will finish in due time. And let me, let me not worry you, Mr Leader of Government Business. I am just using the analogy, the metaphor, to tell St. Lucian's and to the members of this house and to tell Mr President that we must govern in a responsible way that we are, when we are held to account based on how we come in, we can respond. Because Mr President, Mr President, who am I going to talk to? I have one question for you, I want to ask you, I want to ask you a question, I want to ask you 100 words, I want to hear it well. Let's come to the parliament, I want to ask you, I want to ask you, I want to ask you, I want to ask you, Can I say this again in English? Why is it necessary after you have passed the appropriation bill to sit necessary to seek approval from this house to borrow? It's because the law recognized there are conditions under which the house will not permit you to borrow. And there lies the debate, there lies the debate because it has to be voted on. If it was automatic, then there would be no debate. It would have gone through the public service processes and you would have gone and borrowed. I would imagine. Why are we debit? Why are we debating an issue that is of no significance? So I think the law recognized that you can borrow more than what is in the appropriation bill and therefore this house must regulate what the government is doing. Mr. President, I really want to thank you for your patience. I really want to thank the members for listening, but more importantly, it makes no sense that we come here and we do not learn from each other and we do not elevate ourselves from what we've met and what we are accustomed to. I am not here to amplify what I've seen in this house or to echo the words of other persons, but to make a small contribution. As I sit, as I take my seat, my prayers goes to the family of the speaker of this house who fell in. And more importantly, there was a gift, Mr. President, you may have not shared with us, that was given to this honorable house, a gavel by the Taiwanese government or president and it was meant for both chambers that was set in the lower house and I was hoping to sit here. But I just want to close on that note that I got attracted into politics because I want to serve, but something about this house, as a child growing up, I used to hear the word from those who went before me, order, order, order, and that's all I recall as a child listening to St. Clair Daniel probably saying, order, order, order. And that's somebody who loves order, but not perfect. In order, I would love to see that we do things here decently and in order. I thank you. Senator Adrian Ocean. Thank you, Mr. President. Honorable members, please permit me to associate myself with the comments and expressions of concern regarding Madam Speaker, we do wish her a speedy return to good health. Mr. President, I'll be very brief as I try to be. I would like to confine my comments to the resolution concerning the borrowing of $15 million from First National Bank of which I must confess I'm a director and so I will not speak to the business aspects of that transaction. But I would like instead, Mr. President, to make a few comments on the matter of public debt. I think it's an indicator that we're all very, very concerned about the matter of the level of public debt, national debt in particular. And although it is not strictly required, Mr. President, I think it would be very useful as a matter of public record and accountability that when we are asked to approve or consider borrowings that we have something of a summary from the responsible minister to update us as to where we stand as a country with regard to the prudential guideline which has been set for the financial year regarding total borrowing as it relates to the budget. To where we stand, where this particular transaction adds to that total, what is the likely impact on debt service with regard to government revenue and the ratio has already been quoted. And where the interest rates and the tomb of the maturity affects the weighted average cost of borrowing of the government. So that as a country and as a as a Senate, as Parliament, we can responsibly consider the matter. Government will be borrowing, it is inevitable, but I think if we are being asked to consider the matter that the minister responsible ought to or might be well advised to give us a summary of where we stand, a sort of barometer as to this particular action takes us up or down or across or there is no substantial change. But give us a summary so that in considering the matter we can know that we are acting in the best interest of the country and the future generations who will have to repay this over the 15 years in this particular case. We have another matter which is I think 25 million, which again will raise similar concerns. Where does this put us in terms of total borrowing for the year and in terms of how close we are to our potential limits, our potential guidelines for the fiscal year. And so therefore, what really are we being asked to approve quite apart from the sum, but where is this placing us in terms of the overall debt picture of the country. I think it's very important for us to do that. And that's my contribution, thank you very much for the earlier comments from the minister responsible. He explained what the funds, why they are necessary and that there was earlier approval given and then this is a subset of that. All of that information is appreciated. But we also like to see the global picture of the national debt as to where it stands because it is a major macroeconomic indicator and one which speaks to the health of the government and the ministry and the nation in terms of what this says for future generations having to find the money to repay. So thank you very much, Mr. President, members. Leader of government business. Okay, Mr. President, I just want to respond to Senator Oji's concerns. I think, well-chickened, right Senator? Mr. President, currently the leader of government business just allow. Mr. President, I believe over the years we have become very sophisticated. Now we have glasses before we had plastic cups. So maybe we may have to resort to talking about Creole, right? But it reminds me, Mr. President, of the fragility of life. We had a standing glass a while ago and it's no more. And that's why we have to use our time wisely with all the time we have. Mr. President, referring to the independent Senator Oji's concerns, as I said to you earlier, these are relevant questions you're asking. And I must remind the Senate that the, or inform rather the Senate that the Department of Finance is currently working on a public financial management bill. We received a draft just last, this last budget and it is an ongoing exercise as we speak. And one of the requirements of the public financial management, it's here, it's already here. That's not it, that's not it. One of the requirements of within the draft PFM is ensuring that there is a midterm economic outlook. This will be, of course, will contain all the questions that you're asking. But when we are dealing with specific resolutions, I would prefer Senator Oji. And in fact, the standing orders actually make big provisions for asking questions. I think it is standing order number 15. You can actually ask the questions in advance because obviously with the questions you're asking, it will require some research, some analysis and so on. So in the event that you need such information, please feel free to provide the questions to the clerk and the clerk will provide it to me, the Department of Finance. And the relevant answers to your questions will be provided. But I can say to you that, Mr. President, that in reference to one of the questions he's asking, where are we in terms of, I guess, our debt to GDP? That's probably one of the questions. Recently, there was a recalibration, a redoing of the methodology of the way we calculate GDP. And because of that, there was actually an increase in the value of GDP by 15%. And that actually caused our debt to GDP to drop from, to move from, drop from 84% to 66%. Now, Mr. President, this is, we have to treat this new statistic with caution. All that has changed, Mr. President, is just the number. 84 to 66, but our financial and our fiscal situation remains the same. Our cash flow is the same. Our debt burden is the same. And we should avoid using this statistic. Any government should avoid using the statistic of debt to GDP as, I would say, a green light, so to speak, to borrow money. I think understanding of the fiscal statistic is more important to me than the debt to GDP ratio. I'm saying this to say, Mr. President, on the heels of this improvement in the calculation of methodology of our GDP, in the heels, almost two weeks after, an official from an institution, I would say, international institution came to my office, sat with me, and this individual, this institution was trying to use this new statistic as a means of giving us even more leeway to borrow money. And I had to inform this person that our financial situation is the same. All that has changed is just the number, the 84 to 66. I'm saying all of this to say, Mr. President, that we, as a government, we are determined to remain focused on our debt strategy, very focused. So we will never be misguided by such numbers. Now, Mr. President, I just want to respond to one or two issues that the member opposite, the leader of government business opposites, is it the right title, Mr. President? Opposition leader. Yes. Senator Joachim Henry. And I'm happy, Mr. President, that you made it, you clarified or had him to clarify that the word I was not, or the word devil was not this, the analogy he used was not one referring to the prime minister as a devil. But Mr. President, it appears to me that by his analogy that we should never use the word I because the I refers to the devil. So apparently we should never use I, we should use the word we. That's what I kind of deduced from what he is saying, but I do not support or buy with his analogy. I don't support the analogy. Good analogy, good attempt, but I can't, you cannot say don't use it with I because it's synonymous to the devil, okay? Mr. President, he also said that the prime minister said that he would never borrow any money. That's not true, Mr. Pwell. I wouldn't say that's not true, but I think he may have misunderstood what the prime minister said. And I think he clarified, the prime minister actually clarified it in the house yesterday. The prime minister made it clear that he, if he has to borrow any new money, money rather, that revenue or that borrowing, new borrowing, new borrowing must come with its revenue source or revenue stream. And we have remained consistent on this, Mr. President, consistent. And that's the reason, Mr. President, that we introduced the excise tax, the increase in the excise tax from $2.50 to $4 because we are saying that, Mr. President, that first of all our roads need to be reconstructed, our roads need to be maintained, and he will not go out there, borrow new money and try to use our existing cash flow or increase or, sorry, he will not use our existing cash flow to finance any new borrowing. Leader of opposition business. Thank you, Mr. President. Point of order, 46A of the Standing Orders. The leader of government business indicated that the word, as if I indicated that the word devil is synonymous to the word I, I didn't say that. I said when I read that it reminds me, yes. There is no 46A here. 46A of the Standing Order. So the statement that the word I is synonymous to the devil, I did not say that. I said it reminds me, it reminds me. I would like this to be withdrawn. Yes, that's what you said, so that's fine. Mr. Leader of government business, he did not use the word synonymous. Okay, point taken. So, Mr. President, as I said earlier, the Prime Minister and the government's position is that we would not borrow unless we have a new revenue stream. And this is similar to, of course, the new tax with the reintroduction of the airport development tax in terms of financing the airport development. So I think that's about it, Mr. President. Thank you. Honourable Senators, the question is that Parliament authorizes the minister responsible for finance to borrow EC $15 million by way of credit. In this resolution referred to as the credit from First National Banks and Loci Limited for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget. Be it for the resolve that, A, interest on the principal amount of the credit is repayable at a rate of 6% per annum due one month after the full drawdown, and B, the principal amount of the credit is repayable in the amount of EC $126,579 per month, inclusive of interest for 180 months. I now put a question, as many as are of that opinion say aye. As many as are of a country opinion say no. I think the ayes have it, the ayes have it. Leader of government business. Mr. President, I beg to move the following motion, standing in my name. Finance Administration Act Resolution of Parliament to borrow from the Bank of St. Lucia Limited for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget, whereas it is provided by section 39.1 of the Finance Administration Act, capped 1501, that a minister responsible for finance made by Resolution of Parliament borrow money from a bank or other financial institution for the capital expenditure of government. And whereas it is further provided by section 42.1 of the Finance Administration Act, capped 1501, that there shall be charged upon and paid out of the consolidated fund debt charges for which the government is liable. And whereas the minister responsible for finance considered it necessary to borrow 25,000, 25 million rather, EC dollars, by way of credit in this resolution referred to as the credit from the Bank of St. Lucia Limited for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget. And whereas interest on the principal amount of the credit is repayable at a rate of 6.0 percent per annum. And whereas the principal amount of the credit is repayable in the amount of 210,964.21 cents per month, inclusive of interest for 80 months, 180 months. It resolved that Parliament of the Rises, the minister responsible for finance to borrow 25 million dollars by way of credit in this resolution referred to as the credit from the Bank of St. Lucia Limited for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget. Be it further resolved that, A, interest on the principal amount of the credit is repayable at a rate of 6.0 percent per annum and B, the principal amount of the credit is repayable in the amount of 210,964.21 cents per annum per month, inclusive of interest for 180 months. Mr. President, this resolution combined with the 15 million dollars previously, they both add up to 40 million dollars. Mr. President, of significance, referring again to the debt strategy of the government, the intention of the government to reduce or to keep or to put our debt on a sustainable path is that of ensuring that our loans in as much as possible are amortized. What do I mean by that, Mr. President? We pay both the interest and the principal as we go. So at the end of the 180 months or the 15 years, the government will no longer owe these two institutions the monies, the 15 million dollars and the current and the 15 and the 25 million dollars that we are seeking today, the authority of the Senate. At the end of 15 years, it will no longer be on the books of government. This is important, Mr. President, because what we have inherited is a system whereby loans were undertaken and only interests payments were made, only. And when they loan materials or even bonds, Mr. President, the government has the responsibility of rolling over and that is very risky. Let me tell you why, Mr. President. Within one year, 27% of our debt portfolio will be due and that amounts to about 800 million dollars. Mr. President, what if our creditors, the people that we actually borrowed money from, the people that we owe, the principal that are due, principal that are due this year, decide not to roll over, they ask the government, what the money? What if, Mr. President? What if? That's the risk we're running. The government will have to come up with 800 million dollars and what do we have at money, Mr. President? Our budget is 1.4 billion alone, 1.4 billion, and the debt that will mature, the amount, the accumulated amount for this year alone, 27% of our debt stock, 800 million, that's the risk. So we are saying, Mr. President, as a government, we need to change the formula, we need to change the portfolio, change the configuration, let us pay as we go because, Mr. President, with this new method, you are locking the government in being more responsible. Let me tell you why, Mr. President. Because the only focus of the government, the government is no longer interested when you have bullet payments, when you have such, Mr. President, all the government is focused on is that of interest. And most times the government is not even aware of the loan that it is paying the interest on because it's only interest payment I'm responsible for. However, Mr. President, if the government decides to pay both the principal and the interest payment, it will control its expenditures. Because in reality, Mr. President, in reality, even though you do not pay the principal monthly, you got to pay it later on, it is accumulating over time. So we are trying our best as a new, as a government to be more fiscally responsible. And that's the reason why we have taken up, we have taken this approach in negotiating with our creditors. So rest assured, Mr. President, that when this government forms a new government two or three times they are on, Mr. President, this $40 million will no longer be in our books. I'm just being facetious. But any government in the next 15 years, any government, you know, Mr. President, to meet is very irresponsible for a government to come in and just focus on paying interest rates. Very irresponsible. You know, it reminds me of certain parents who would say, who saw Gen-Norm, who saw Gen-Fam. Right? And they would, and then leave the responsibility of the loan on the children. That's being irresponsible. So I believe, Mr. President, going forward, going forward, that is the approach that we have to undertake. So Mr. President, we are doing a lot as a government. We are doing a lot in spite of the NACS, in spite of the NACS, Mr. President. You know, Senator Joachim, I'm not going to start with you, I'm going to continue with that. Sooner or better, better madam, better madam. Listen, every day, you know, better madam, you know, better madam, you know, you know, from the lead. You know, from the lead, madam, if you keep telling people the same thing over and over and over again, that person runs the risk of believing what you say to them. And I know why I'm saying this, Mr. President, because we as a country, we are slowly turning things around. As a government, we are slowly turning things around. What we inherited, Mr. President, I have said it over and over and over again. We had to correct things. We had to put things in place. We had to mop the floor. But you know what, Mr. President? Those who had the party the night before, four and a half years, and leave all the cups and broken bottles on the floor, Mr. President, they knew the mess they left behind, and they asked us to do it in a hundred days. Knowing very well, Mr. President, it cannot be done. It cannot be done because there were bottles all within the crevices of government. But that's all within the files of Cabinet, Mr. President. And so we as a new government, we had to ensure that we uncover and we clean up the mess that we found. And because they know what we are doing, and the results are showing, Mr. President, you got to create a bell from lead and making people believe that a beautiful woman is an ugly woman. Do you know what, Mr. President? And you know that you're beautiful, and you believe that you're beautiful. No one will make you feel that you're ugly. Nobody. And that's what this government, this government is focused. We are focused. We are focused, Mr. President, and we are seeing small shoots of success, small shoots, Mr. President. Mr. President, the naysayers said when we decided to reduce on the VAT from 12 percent to 12.5 percent, they complained, Mr. President. They complained the government going to lose revenues and so on, Mr. President. And I said clearly that less can bring in more. Lower taxes could bring in more revenue. I said that because, Mr. President, economics is not math. Economics involves math, but economics is not math. In math, one plus one is two. You cannot dispute that. But in economics, one plus one doesn't necessarily add up to two. Because, Mr. President, the economy is a dynamic economy. I know it's mind-boggling over there, mind-boggling, I have to say. One plus one in math is two. You cannot dispute that. In economics, one plus two, one plus one is not necessarily two. Because you are dealing with a very dynamic system, a very dynamic system. So to say that we are reducing the VAT from 15 percent to 12.5 will result in lower revenues for governments is not necessarily true because there are many factors involved in the economy. So what I did, Mr. President, what I did was to gather some data from both customs and the income revenue because the VAT is both on imports and the local consumption. And I compared the timeframe before the new rate and after the new rate. And surprisingly, Mr. President, well, not really surprisingly because I cannot anticipate that. The changes, the variance when compared to before and after is very minimal, minimal, meaning that if we had maintained the 15 percent, Mr. President, our revenues collection would have been more for VAT this year or before the change when compared after the change. So it says something to me, Mr. President. It says something to me that the economy is very active. The economy is very active. And if you don't want to believe me, Mr. President, please believe what the Chamber of Commerce put out there, the business performance survey and the positive attitude of the local businesses in St. Lucia. They're very confident of the future. The outlook looks bright. They have employed more people. Businesses have gone up, sales, I say sales, have gone up. Is there a direct relationship between sales and a reduction in VAT, maybe, most likely? Because, Mr. President, the fight to stay alive was very strategic. It was not, Mr. President, a campaign gimmick. It was a well-thought-of plan, Mr. President, a strategy, I should say. Understanding where we were, understanding where we were, the height of taxation at the time, Mr. President, was killing the people of this country. There was massive borrowings, Mr. President, massive borrowings by the government. And I said to you, when the government came in, the last administration came in 2011, interest payments on our debt, Mr. President, was only $100 million. In four years, it went up to $170 million. Interest payment went up by $70 million in four years. And this was happening, Mr. President, in the face of a declining and deteriorating economy, closures of small businesses, increases in unemployment rates. So the government had no choice. Two sources of revenues, Mr. President, two sources, to borrow more and taxation. The government did both, and heavily. We knew you were there. The people knew. They felt it. They felt the increases of taxes in this country. They felt it. And we believe that if you tax the people too much, Mr. President, there is a threshold. There's a critical point that if you tax them too much, you're going to kill the economy. So the strategy behind the five to stay alive, Mr. President, was to give that relief to the people of this country. And that's why we started with the VAT. And today we are seeing signs, positive signs, Mr. President, of this policy. The last report on the labor force situation in St. Lucia. It was reported that the unemployment rate went down from 24.4% to just above 20%. When compared the last quarter of 2016, 2015 to 2016. Positive signs, Mr. President. Positive signs. We are seeing the interest of foreign foreign direct investors coming to this country. These are signs, Mr. President. These are signs. And I know, Mr. President, that there is talk about the prime minister traveling here, there and everywhere. Mr. President, we have heard many times that if the rest of the world, especially North America, sneezes, the rest of the Caribbean catches a cold, what does that mean, Mr. President? It means that the rest of the world, the developed world, Mr. President, has a direct impact, the behavior. When I say behavior, I'm talking about political changes, legislative changes, changes of presidents and prime ministers. All these changes, Mr. President, have an effect on our economies. Changes in Congress, on Capitol Hill, Mr. President. These changes are pushed by lobbyists. If you go on K Street in Washington, D.C. is known as the lobbyists street in Washington and these lobbyists push a lot of legislation at Capitol Hill. I'm saying this to say, Mr. President, in today's world, a prime minister cannot just sit in his chair at a waterfront and accept change in his country. He has to be out there to form the network, to form the networks, to form goodwill, to meet the game changers. That's a different period, Mr. President, a different period. And I was there with the prime minister. I traveled with him sometimes. But my latest was when we attended the IMF World Bank meetings. I know the kind of meetings he has, he kept while he was up there, the bilateral meetings, Mr. President. There are key players out there, Mr. President, key players not forgetting, Mr. President, that our reputation as a country was in the gutters. Don't forget that, Mr. President. Investors were shying away from this country, shying away. And the thing about it, Mr. President, investors and governments, foreign governments, they do not recognize prime ministers. They recognize countries. Countries, the sovereign. So when you have one government lambasting another government and threatening investors from coming to the shores of the country, threatening. And you have, Mr. President, currently a hostile attack on investors in this country, hostile. So you are creating an environment that is very unfriendly. And you're making the work and the job of the prime minister and the government even more difficult. Is this deliberate? Is this a deliberate attempt? Well, Mr. President, I have watched dogs, Mr. President, and figuratively speaking. figuratively speaking, because I do not want a press conference on this, because I know, Mr. President, press conferences are becoming very popular in this country. Very, very popular. The press conferences at one time used to be four or five people. Now I say going back to one, one. I wonder why. More about that some other time. I have watched dogs, Mr. Prime Minister, Mr. President. They never bark at a parked vehicle or parked vehicles. Dogs always bark at moving vehicles. And if you are driving to your destination and you stop at every barking dog, you will never get to wear to your place. Never. This government here, we are focused. We are focused. We know where we are heading. We know the mountains that we must climb, Mr. President. We know the mountains. We came in in the valley, Mr. President. We came in at the valley. And in the valley, Mr. President, some say they don't like the valley. But in the valley, that's where you get the streams, Mr. President. That's where you get the rich soils, Mr. President. In the valley, Mr. President, that's where you gather strength because you know that you have the mountain to climb. And we are climbing that mountain, Mr. President. We are trying. We are trying to pull us down. But, Mr. President, we are focused. We know where we are going. We know where we are going. And we will not be distracted by the naysayers. Because we are happy that we are seeing signs of recovery in this country. So, Mr. President, I am very, very pleased that we are on the right track as far as boring is concerned and boring for the financing of the 2017-2018 budget. Thank you. Honorable Senators, the question is that parliament authorizes the minister responsible for finance to borrow EC $25 million by way of credit. In this resolution referred to as the credit from the bank of San Lucia Limited for capital expenditure to finance the 2017-2018 budget. B, it would have resolved that A, interest on the principal amount of the credit is repayable at the rate of 6% per annum and B, the principal amount of the credit is repayable in the amount of EC $210,964.21 per month, inclusive of the interest for a 180-month. Senator Filion. Thank you, Mr. President. I recognize its Creole Heritage Month as has been articulated by our minister responsible for culture. Yeah, it just passed, October. But we're still in the spirit of the Creole celebrations. And so I heard quite a lot of the language being uttered in the house today which is refreshing and it shows the value of our multiple ability to use more than one language, multilingual society. I want to say that I was very pleased to have heard of the activities around the country. I took some time to engage, as we always do. And it was an incident-free weekend and I think it was heartening for us as inclusion. So I think we should not be proud as inclusions that we had a very cordial and enjoyable Creole Heritage Month and Jeune Creole. I will take the opportunity, Mr. President, with your permission to congratulate one of the members of my community who participated in the pageants that the minister mentioned. She was the 2015 Wen Creole and she placed third overall in the Queen of Queens, Wendela Wen, pageant. And so I want to say many congratulations to Miss Roselyne Popo of Angers in Miku South who did very well and made us very proud and I want to put it on record that I commend her for her efforts despite the very difficulties that she had in getting all her business done. So congratulations to Miss Roselyne Popo and to all the other contestants, as particularly the Queen La Wen Creole 2017 Wendela Wen. Having said that, Mr. President, I also want to associate with the way in which you started this morning by reminding us of the importance of our conduct in this honorable house. I have no difficulty associating with this because I basically stand by those principles and it has been very unfortunate some of what I have observed happening in the lower house. And I don't think that you will have that task of being the headmaster and having to keep us in line in this in the upper house. I think we ought to know our boundaries and I expect us to be able to conduct ourselves in that manner. So I seek your guidance if at any time we may unknowingly depart, but I don't think that would be necessary. Having said that, I think the incidents of last night in the lower house underscores a very important need by the government to consider the election of the deputy speaker. I think it would have been a lot easier because this morning the lower house had to be adjourned. It was suspended and now the members had to return just to adjourn the house. And there's much inconvenience in the process. And I can say as well that the speaker I empathize and I extend my best wishes to her and her family. I'm sure she would have been a lot more comfortable if she knew that she could have depended on her deputy to relieve her at that time. And we are now facing the consequence of not making that decision. And I hope that it signals to the government that it is time to rethink that decision. The parliament, yes, the parliament, the government controls the majority. So we understand that the upper house has a deputy and I'm very happy. She's not able to be here today, but she's always here. And so if anything, you know that you are okay. And we feel that we can continue. But unfortunately in the lower house, it has not found favor with the present government. And I see the parliament. And I believe that it is now time for us to take stock and do something about the situation. So I'm hoping that that is done in quick time. And we will not have a repeat of the unfortunate and almost embarrassing situation that took place last night. Onto the substantive motion, Mr. President, we are here today to deal with the motion of borrowing two sets of monies from two different banks, local banks, $25 million from the First National Bank and another, sorry, $25 billion from, yes, Bank of St. Lucia and another 15 from First National Bank to finance the government's budget. Nothing new, nothing unusual about that. My issue is we are borrowing that at 6% and I heard the government reps, prime minister, and as well as the leader of government business in the Senate talk about that good deal that we found and how good it is to be able to borrow that rate and so on. I have no qualms with that. But at the same time, we must be mindful that while we're borrowing at 6% from local banks, we seem to be prepared to use monies, revenues that are collected from our CIP to loan to investors at 2%. So I want us to be consistent when we look at what rates we get while we're borrowing one way. We are also losing revenue by loaning investors at 2%. So we might want to revisit that and see how well we can balance the two acts of borrowing, well lending and borrowing. There are three interesting analogies and three interesting points that the leader of government business raised earlier when he was explaining, elaborating on the second motion. And they're very interesting. When you use the issue of the old woman whose children would have to be footing the bill when she knows she's dying and the children would have to foot the bill. I think if I got to mention in that analogy that usually people who borrow are people who are able to borrow. They would have some assets or some collateral or some security that they would have used to borrow. And while I agree that it is not wise to leave debts for your children, but it's also important to note that most of these people leave assets for their children to be able to inherit. And if you are going to have to pay the bills of your parents, you will have to, you also have the benefit of the assets which may have more value than the loan that they took. And so the way you manage those assets will determine how effective or how responsible you are. So you have to be, we have to look at the situation and not be, you know, one-sided. You may very well be in a situation where a young man or a young woman has to pay a $50,000 debt, but his father or his mom left him acres of land and a house and so on that valued over a million dollars. What does he do with it? Does he squander it and then blame his parents for having to pay $50,000? So here's the analogy, Mr. President. Our government, in that analogy I understand and he can correct me if I misled, that our government may have left some debt for this present government, but they are assets. And we all know what the assets are. The country's assets are still there and some of it is we have been prepared to give it away. Land is a very important asset and I speak of land. We have land and there are lots of other things that we can use as security for borrowing. We have bonds, we float bonds, you know. So we have to also be very careful when we talk about borrowing that we take care of the assets. And one of those assets, Mr. President, is the human resource. That is our primary asset and every time I stand in this honorable house, I refer to the St. Lucia human resource. I have said it every single time and I will continue to say it. If we manage those assets well, we will be in a position to deal with all our issues. All the burdens that our parents left, Mr. President, according to my loaned friend, the child will be able to manage because he's managing his assets, his parents' assets well. And there's another example he used and I think it's very interesting as well. The broken glass issue, we saw what happened. That was an accident, but I think he put it in nicely. And he said that sometimes, you know, after the juniper yield, I think we had to pass and pick up broken glass. But I'm saying just as it happened in juniper yield, somebody had to come and clean up the broken glass that he had there. And so somebody always has to come to pick it up. And I'm hoping that this president crop in government is not going to leave too much broken glass for us to pass to pick up when we get back into government. So Mr. President, I think the leader of government business this morning, he may have been throwing some very important messages out there that are very loaded and I picked up on them. So just things that we can consider. Thirdly and finally from his comments, we also have to consider the issue of barking dogs. And I think while I was very heartened by the positive contributions that have been made, I think in this honorable house, we are skilled enough to be able to make analogies without referring to anything that has gotten some negative PR in the past. I think it was rather unfortunate that that tomb be used. And my comments under my breath at the time was, that's a bad word. That word barking dogs, I think it has no place in this honorable house. So let's leave it out. Let's find another way to make the analogy of things that people criticize that are not right. You know, and I'm not even going to repeat it. I think we should try to avoid that and keep with the standards of the upper house and don't use those unfortunate and controversial tombs. It has been ventilated elsewhere. I don't think we have any place for it in this honorable house. So, Mr. President, we are borrowing 40 million dollars from two commercial banks. And of course, the government, we expect that. Senator, you asked me to guide you. Yes. The resolution you're debating now is 25 million dollars. Very well. You may, a person, you may. Yes, I'm, yes, I'm so guided. Yes, the resolution now is the 25 million from Bank of St. Lucia. The previous one it was mentioned, so I was just using the total. But let's stick to the 25. We are borrowing money from local banks to finance our budget. And that, of course, is understood. We have clearly stated as an opposition that we understand the government has to borrow. My concern is not so much the fact that we need to borrow. My concern is what happens when we borrow? How do we manage the expenditure? Where do we spend that money? And how do we make sure that that money that is borrowed redounds to the benefits of our citizens? So allow me, Mr. President, to ask, is that money going into social programs? Our playing fields are abundant. Basically, we see some plan being talked about. But I mean, how much is that, how much of it is going there? What about the education programs? The education system, our schools? I will get back to that a little later. What is that money being used for? And I think in the explanations that both the prime minister and the leader of government business gave, there is very indication of the specifics. What that money is going to be spent on. So I'm left to speculate and I don't like to do that. I'm hoping that we will get some more specifics about the areas of priority for spending the $25 billion. I can ask, for example, I heard the Minister for Health quite correctly made an appeal about our behavior and how we can embrace ideas of community mental health and the preventative care. I think that's a very good way of looking at it. We can prevent the problems that we have. But I'm asking, wouldn't it be better that instead of some of what I've heard that the money would be used for, which is kind of very vague, that we could have considered making that a priority at this time and perhaps consider subsidizing medical care in certain areas, maybe in diabetes and mental health, which the minister mentioned. What is priority at this time that we're borrowing and we're not sure if certain very critical areas of priority are being addressed? And one would do that every time I stand in this honorable house, I refer to the education system and I refer to our human resource. And I have not heard one pronouncement made. The Minister for Education was here yesterday. The Prime Minister spoke. I have not heard one pronouncement made that is specific to the situation that we are now faced with in our schools. I heard that there was mention of education reform. And if I understood the Prime Minister well, and it was repeated, we have to deal with education reform. And it sounds as if the repay of schools and the maintenance of schools is sort of just left out there. There is no reason why we cannot handle both reform of education, which is a process. It's not a one-shot thing. And maintenance and repay of schools at the same time. So I am thinking that this present borrowing effort could have given some credence, could have given some consideration to the existing situation, because the situation with schools now is not something that is not urgent. It's a very urgent matter. You have principals and parents in the media making noise about the condition of schools. And yet I have not heard one statement, one pronouncement to say that anything will be done with any of these monies. The Minister of Education publicly said that there were no allocations. And that is why the micro-secondary school was in that state on the first day of school. She said it publicly and she would have to scratch up some money from somewhere. But now we are hearing of 25 million dollars being borrowed with an additional 15. And not one word about this. So I am left to wonder where is the priority? What is it that we are doing and what is it we think is important at this point? So Mr. President, since we are on schools, I want to also see that there are several other factors that we do not want to catch up with us before we get to a point of no return. We know that the present CXC curriculum, the present CXC assessment method is going digital. It's going computerized. As of 2018, the exams will be computerized. And we all know that not only are our schools in a deplorable state, but that most of them are not in a condition or their computer labs. The IT infrastructure and the ICT infrastructure are not in the ship that is going to allow for that type of administration of these examinations. Mr. President, CXC examinations in 2018 begins in May. The orals usually start even in from March. I'm sorry, from April. So if CXC is going to administer exams in May 2018, we are now in November 2017. That's just about six months away. Isn't there supposed to be some measure of urgency to make sure that our students and our teachers and our examiners and our invigilators do not have a headache to administer those exams? What effort has been made and what is there in this 25 million or 40 million to address that? What provisions are made? So since I was not told, I have to ask, are there going to be computer labs upgraded around the island in our 24 secondary schools? Are the students going to get tablets or laptops so that they can be familiar with the use of that to take the exams? And remember, CXC is not a local exam. It's a regional standardized exam. And their standard CXC will not tell you well, they'll give you an extra hour because your lab did not have enough computers. They will just administer the exam and you have to do it within your time. And I'm sure some of us here have children who are attending secondary schools. So we need to ask the question whether these things are not important now. We are six months away from the next CXC exams. And we must ask the question, what is the government's plan regarding the immediate issues? School maintenance and preparation for the challenges of ICT and IT in the upcoming CXC exams. I also want to ask Mr. President, we know that in the recent past, I have mentioned it before, that some of the programs that were offered at our most popular or most senior educational institution, Sir Arthur Lewis Community College, have been compromised. We know that the primary teacher education training program has been stopped. And the Bachelor of Education program that was offered full-time is now offered part-time. And in my deliberations with some of the teachers who are taking up the Bachelor of Education program, they are complaining bitterly because it is very stressful upon them to have to go to work and go to the college two or three times a week, I think it is, to be able to do the program. Some of them live very far from cast trees and it is very stressful. And I am thinking that it could have been a lot easier if these people were allowed, like it was done in the past, to do the program full-time. Any of this money can be allocated to ensure that that program be offered full-time, while these teachers can be at school and sorry, can be at the college for two years, full-time, get this type in and continue the program. Why are people who are entrusting, we are entrusting our children into their care to ensure that we do not have criminals on the road 20 years from now, to ensure that our Minister of Health does not have to be talking about mental health issues. Why are these people consistently being ignored? We need to train them, we need to give them the pedagogical training. We need to look after them. And I know it's a matter of time before the teachers let us know that loud and clear, because they have taken quite a lot and they are aware of all the other things that we've given priority at this time. It cannot be about infrastructural projects alone because people feel that there's opportunity for them to get contracts and make money. It is important that we invest in the areas where we do not get direct cash returns, healthcare and education. You don't usually get cash returns for that, but if you have a healthy educated citizenry, a healthy nation, you will by far exceed the expectations that you will have of a nation that is not healthy. You will be in a better place. And so I say again, we are not paying enough attention to our human resource. Mr. President, we also heard that the South Aloys Community College and that conversation has been in the air for quite a while. That the government intends to turn it into a university college and that I applaud. That would be a great day. But again, I have not heard anything in recent time or even in this allocation here for the South Aloys Community College university idea. So I want to ask, where has that gone to? Are we making an effort to make sure that tertiary education is affordable and available and accessible to our young people and to our older people because everybody wants to be educated? Are we making any effort to make sure that happens? What about early childhood education? And I remember my colleague here, and I think the Minister of Health did make reference to the importance of the family and making sure that we do the right things. Our children at the preschools, the early childhood, those between the ages of two and five, that is where the foundation has to be built. If we go wrong, there is very difficult with all our fancy interventions. The Minister of Internal Security would probably agree that no matter how much we do with the police, if the children that we raise are not raised with the right values and under the right conditions, we're going to have a problem. What are we doing about early childhood education? Our preschools, a lot of them are in a total mess. I can tell you there's one in DIGA that I visited some time ago. They had a little program there and sports, and they won and they were happy. But when I saw where the children were housed, it's no place for infants to be. And these are things that we need to look at. The way we treat our children is the way they're going to treat us when they grow older. So we have to be very careful that we take stock of where we are putting the monies that we are borrowing on behalf of our taxpayers. Special needs education is another area that I want to mention, because more and more, I don't know if it's Mr. President, I don't know if it's lifestyle or habits, but it seems that we are having more cases of children being born with abnormal situations. I don't want to sound like I'm labeling anyone, but disabilities and special needs. Many of our children are being born with all kinds of complications. Maybe it's the diet, maybe it's the air, maybe it's the habits of the parents, I don't know. But we know that as educators, when the children are registered for pre-K and K, there are lots of tests that have to be done now, because we know that many of them come with lots of conditions that are not manageable in the regular school setting, in the conventional school setting. And so special needs education is not just an option, it's a necessity. And right now I must tell you that our special needs education program in St. Lucia is not what it needs to be. I have not heard one clear policy statement made regarding special needs education in the country. So what are we going to do about those people who can learn if they get the right type of intervention early, they can make a valuable contribution to this country? Are we just leaving them alone and focusing on just the regular situation, and focusing on building this and building that, and bringing investors to do what? When we bring investors in and we open up Ojo Labs, who is working there? We have not spent any money to prepare our populace, our children, to be able to take up those jobs. We have not trained them. And so if we are opening something and we have not made the preparation in the education system to get those people to be able to take up those positions, you know what we'll have to do, Mr. President? We may have to import labor. We may have to bring people from outside to take the positions because we have not prepared our human resource base to take up those positions. And I am very worried about that. I hear artificial intelligence, you know, all of those fancy tombs with Ojo Labs. And I am wondering, although I mean, Ojo Labs in itself is another discussion, I don't want to go into it now. But let us suppose that one of those programs had some merits and it requires special skills. Are we going to bring investors here? Give them all kinds of incentives to set up business, set up, you know, offices and headquarters and all of those fancy things I'm hearing. And the people, the staff that has to work there, the people who have to be employed that we say we're providing jobs for, we have not made an effort to make them trainable or to make them capable of taking up those positions. It doesn't make sense, Mr. President. So before we talk about the economy growing and we borrowing money to put into projects, we have to remember whatever projects we do, even if it's a building project that our country has engineers who are certified and can take up those jobs. We don't have to be going overseas every time to import, to bring in labour. And if they are professional intelligence based issues or jobs that requires sophisticated skills that we are showing in our curriculum that we are making an effort to ensure that our citizens can take up those jobs and take up those positions. Otherwise it makes no sense to do all of that because we're just going to be paying people from abroad to take all our local resource away from us. So I believe, Mr. President, we have to be very careful when we come to this honourable house to borrow and to say that we're going to spend the country's taxpayers' money on projects that these projects have to read down to the benefits of our people. Just a word before I end, Mr. President, on the matter of curriculum reform since I mentioned it earlier. I heard that the Prime Minister in his deliberations mentioned it and I want us to just say on a two-air word of caution regarding the issue of curriculum reform. It is not something that you just sit and prescribe. Curriculum reform and I don't want to go into a complicated education debate here. But curriculum reform involves quite a number of things. It involves a number of stakeholders. It involves planning. It takes time. It involves research. And it's something that is spiral. It takes phases. You have to work with it. You don't just come and just give somebody a piece of a document and say, here's a curriculum. In fact, a curriculum is not even a document. A curriculum is a whole set of experiences. And then you come up with a document that you can call either guide or syllabus is and so on. So when I hear about curriculum reform and I am not hearing anything in terms of what is the plan? How is it going to be done? Where is it going to start? We are here and a half into government a new government and I'm hearing curriculum reform. But I'm not seeing any action. I'm not seeing anything that indicates how this is going to be done. And while we're doing that our schools are dilapidating we're borrowing money to do all kinds of things and I'm not hearing anything about that reform being catered for in the funding. So I think Mr. President that if we are going to engage in curriculum reform discussion we must pay attention to the knowledge, the attitudes and the skills that our present crop and our future crop of school leavers and graduates will need to be able to cope with the demands of the modern day jobs the modern day markets the modern day society because you may have skills and knowledge but if the attitude has not been shipped properly you can be very problematic. The worst thing to have is a very smart educated skillful dishonest person. You understand Mr. President? You can be very skilled very knowledgeable but if you have not learned certain values it's very dangerous for the society to be investing or putting you in charge of certain things. So we have to be able to ensure that in all of this we incorporate the curriculum reform idea and include knowledge skills and attitudes that will make our citizens better people. And so when we invest in them we give them scholarships and we put them in positions where they have influence that we don't have to look over their shoulders and we know that they have the right attitudes and the right ethical and moral standings for them to do the work of the country. So Mr. President in wrapping up I want to see that if we are going to of course come to this house to offer rise the borrowing of this money that it must be there must be evidence to back up that borrowing to suggest that we are doing something that will involve and benefit the people. I heard the minister of international security mentioned the 48 homicides. Yes, there was one in my area on Monday. In fact, for the first time since I've known myself being raised in the Deriso community I've never heard of two shootings on the same day and there were two shootings on Monday within minutes. In fact, while the police was on one scene they were called to a second scene. That was like you know unheard of. So it has reached our my doorstep Mr. President and that concerns me because one of them included young people and it's a common thing now and while the minister of national security has mentioned some of the concerns that and I'm hoping that you know the results the interventions are coming but we cannot wait for it to get to that point. 48 murders is too many is 48 murders too many and so if we are going to spend money to do all those things we need to take from that and begin to address the things that cause people to get to behave that way and I think it was mentioned preventative care preventative measures that is where we need to start looking we are too concerned about correction and intervention prevention is the best cure and in this present motion I have not heard anything that suggests that we are taking care of our human resource base to ensure that they do not end up giving us all the trouble that we complain about. Mr. President I want to thank you for giving me your listening ear and I hope that as we go forward we will make we will hear and see that provisions are made by this government to address the causes the issues that cause our people to put the string that they are putting on that that they may be putting on the government and that we take time to invest as much as we can in our human resource not in physical projects alone not in buildings alone not in roads alone but in people in the things that are not tangible but are important and that is my concern that is my recommendation to the government and to this house thank you Mr. President Senator Leader of Government Business Leader of Government Business Yes Mr. President Have a seat Have a seat Senator Mangal Thank you Mr. President Mr. President I would like to take this opportunity to join my fellow senators in this honorable house in wishing the speaker of the house a speedy recovery I do wish her well and I do hope that she could get back to full health at the soonest Mr. President I would like to also take this opportunity to congratulate the Minister for Culture in Saint Lucia Senator the Honorable Fortuna Belrose and also to the Events Committee to the Juniquial Committee the Folk Research Center under the Soleil brand for hosting a fantastic Juniquial in Saint Lucia I think that this year Juniquial was the best that I have seen I do realize that this government has made a substantial contribution to all of the host communities and so by doing so those host communities have also recreated by raising the bar and ensuring that we had a very prosperous Juniquial I spent my time on Juniquial in the community of Marigo where I have most of my interest Mr. President and I saw the hard work that was placed in I want to thank the corporate community in Marigo for coming to the aid and assistance of the Marigo Development Committee and I saw the hard work placed in by this Marigo Development Committee for Juniquial and I want to single out the Chairman of the Marigo Development Committee Mr. Anthony Pierre-Louis for all of the fantastic efforts I saw this gentleman standing up and almost wanting to fall down on his face because of all the pressure that he stood up and he has delivered and I am certain that the same has happened in the other free community host communities in Babuno in Larisos Denry and also in Viofort so I want to thank all of those people for a well-placed Juniquial and I can see that of course the Creole Festival is well and alive and it looked like one of the most celebrated events on the calendar of St. Lucia in fact I think it is more celebrated than even Christmas itself so our culture is in good hands and our people are moving forward well and I remain very optimistic of the future of Creole in this country Juniquial in this country Mr. President I stand to rise and to support the motion before us led by the Leader of Government Business in the House to borrow 25 million dollars from the Bank of St. Lucia at the rate of 6 percent Mr. President I want to congratulate the Leader of Government Business and the Minister in the Ministry of Finance for the fantastic job that he is doing and this government is doing in maneuvering through difficult waters and rather in through the challenges that we have inhibited and acquired and where this country is going forward the Minister for Finance and this government have taken this country in a 180 degrees away from this troubled waters and away from this pitfall and what I may say might be the Niagara Fall that was way ahead and we have turned it around into a 180 degrees and we are headed to safer ground and I remember that a fellow Senator I'm not sure if it was a Senator on the opposite said that our Prime Minister seems to be traveling all the time and seems to be a Roman Prime Minister you've heard these statements over and over again but I must tell them this country is in troubled waters this country has in troubled times under a previous administration and if we are in troubled waters just like in the days of Noah's Ark when that raven had to leave that Ark and to venture out many times and come back so must the Leader of this country be the raven of this country to go out and journey until he can receive that green leaf and to say yes there is a safe ground that we could lay this country on as much as we have rescued it so this is the reason Mr. President we need to move forward and the Prime Minister need to roam and the Cabinet need to roam in order to bring the best to this country this country of our St. Lucia and so we wonder what was happening before Mr. President we had a regime that governed this country for four and a half years and what did they do Mr. President we there is no need to reinvent the wheel we have seen in the first world countries that if there is a recession there are three main things that are done in every single case there is a reduction in interest rate there is an injection of capital and there is a reduction in taxes by taking those three actions you are looking to stimulate the economy in the last four and a half years did we see that no what did we see we saw the opposite and that is why we were heading down that Niagara Falls because we took a direction that is dangerous instead of reducing the burden to the taxpayers of this country we went in and we imposed VAT at 15 percent on the people of St. Lucia and when you impose VAT I can tell you as a businessman for that month I think it was October 2012 I thought that there was a total halt in this country I saw my business and other businesses came to a halt persons who are who are imagining what should we do do we spend or do we keep our money the opposite happens Mr. President when this government with the foresight of the five to stay alive has taken the decision to reduce the VAT from 15 percent to 12 and a half percent this has improved the economy this has created consumer confidence in the people of St. Lucia this is what happens because Mr. President if you have a hundred dollars in your pocket this hundred dollars now would have at least be worth a hundred and two dollars and fifty cents so the item you were buying for a hundred dollars with that VAT you now have an extra two dollars and fifty cents and with that extra two dollars and fifty cents comes the confidence that you should look around and purchase another item this is what has happened with the figures that the minister in the ministry of finance brought into us and I'm not surprised about those figures because the initial figures both from the inland revenue department and from the customs department are showing that there is an improvement in the collection there is an improvement in the rate now we were told that we may have a shortfall of fifty two million dollars because of that two point five percent I've looked at some of those figures and there are certain months in the year at least for the inland revenue department there is an even greater collection of VAT than the preceding the month of that year before 2016 for example the month of May in 2017 there was a greater collection of VAT than the month of May in 2016 now how would that happen if we have a reduction there should be a reduction in revenue but it shows you that there is an increase in the confidence of the people of this country and there is an increase in the spending patterns of the people of this country because of the direction that this government has gone into Mr President this is the way it is and I can tell you that as a businessman I can give you my personal experience with this VAT was reduced in the month of February 2016 2017 and when I looked at the figures of February 2016 in my own business and made a comparison to even January that had more days than February there was an increase in the VAT collection in my private business for the government of St. Lucia over the period of January and that could only happen because of the results of the confidence the people have and this pattern Mr President has continued all over the months thereafter the month of March April May they have been increases in the VAT collection now you may want to say it may just be me that is not the case because I know some of you may have an answer for that but let us look at the other hardwares in this country you've heard them speak you've heard them say that they've been increased in the construction sector increasing the purchasing of building materials you have heard them say so the initial figures Mr President for cement which is a benchmark or a guide that the government of St. Lucia used to assess the construction sector in St. Lucia by the consumption of cement and how much cement is imported and purchased in this country initial figures are indicating that in this year Mr President that there are significant increases in the importation and consumption of cement in this country how can this happen if this economy is not growing how can this happen if this government is not on the right track to take in this economy to the place that it is supposed to be and most of all Mr President you've heard it from the entire chamber of commerce the chamber of commerce survey indicated that there is growth that there is increase in consumer spending in this country and as a result that there is the projected increase in jobs for our people in this country and it is not just only projected Mr President it is also a fact we have seen the statistics from the statistical department indicating that there is a reduction in the unemployment rate in this country there is a reduction in the unemployment rate in this country Mr President so it means by this government reducing that it has assisted in the growth and development of this country and it will ultimately and has started doing so increase the revenue collection for this government Mr President and so let me use this analogy to indicate what has happened before and what is happening Mr President this country in Creole okay so this open. So you'll make a tax, play tax. So you're gonna make a play tax. That's what he's been saying that you are going to convince the pulsa here and they don't have any use of the salmons. We can't take a few of them at all, because they're going to be too busy to pay for the day. It's not busy, we need a salmons. So you'll make pressure and let the pulsa here. You'll make pressure and let the pulsa here and try to take a few of them at all. And then you'll sell them. Who Just like the minister in the ministry of finance said. Okay. Once you impose more taxes on the people, you will kill the economy. So so Pulsa If you are sick, you have to go to the hospital and stay in the hospital. So, the website says that you have to go to the hospital. So, you have to play with it. If you try to do everything you can, you have to try to do everything. You have to do everything you can. And if you get sick, you have to go to the hospital to do everything. It's very difficult to go to the hospital. I would do everything with my cards. You have to go to the hospital. And if you go to the hospital, I would go to the medicine shop. It is difficult for you to go to the medicine shop, Mr. President. So this is the vision of this government. This is the vision of the minister of finance in this country, right? So we're growing the economy in that form. So let Nukai Viet here a lot. Let Nukai Viet here a lot. They will serve up with it. Let by guy will be there. Nukai Viet, guy many people are going to be there. Nukai Viet, guy many people are going to be there. Nukai Viet, kind toward pool. And then Nukai Sa, Nukai Sa, Nukai Sa, I said, Mr. President. So this is the way it is, this is the way it is, Mr. President. This is what we are doing in this country. We are reducing unemployment, we are creating confidence in the consumer in this country. And so we are creating confidence in the voter of this country, Mr. President. And so, I wish the leader for the opposition, business was sitting there, I don't know why he ran out. But I can say, Mr. President, that contrary to what he has said, I do not believe it. He has said, it looks like it is easy for you to win elections in this country, but it is difficult for you to govern. I think this is an insult to the people and the voters of our country. I believe that the people of this country know exactly what they are doing and they know who they are electing to govern this country. And I do not believe that they have made a mistake by electing this UWP government into office because we are delivering for the people of this country. And so, he used the analogy, he made it like that, only for the people of Kailah, because it is difficult for you to win elections in this country, because it is difficult for you to win elections in this country. So, what do you know? I know that government is a part of that. They do not want to win elections, they want to make people elect people. This is what I believe in the new intelligences here. I believe that because you're making the people elect you, what does it do? You are elected, you are elected, you are done with this country. If you think that you are not making the people elect you, if you do not make the people elect you, what does it do? The people have to fire you. And this is why, Mr. President, this is why the people of this country fired them. And I do not blame that woman that he used as that analogy. Okay, that woman is a smart woman. And that is why that woman left him. Because he's not producing and bringing to the house what is required for that woman. All right? He's not doing so. And because he's not doing so, that woman has left him. And that woman has gone for a better pasture. That woman has gone to a better man. He's from Vietnam. He's from Vietnam. That's correct. Mr. President, he's from Vietnam. She's not going back there. She's not going back there because she realized she's getting better from that new man. So he is hoping that come the next four years he will go close to the balcony and knock and say, Angela, come away. But Angela don't even want to see him by the balcony. This is the people of the country. This is how they'll be treated. Angela do not want to see him by the balcony because he did not deliver. And that this new man who's inside of the house sleeping well is working not even five days a week. He's working six days a week just like the Lord asked him to do. And he's producing for this country. And so my brother, Minister of Finance, I must tell you, continue this good job. Continue the work that has been done. Continue the good work for the people of this country. The people are not stupid. They elect the people that they want to govern them. And Mr. President, this is exactly what has happened. When we borrow this $25 million, we are injecting capital into the economy. This in itself is a form of spending into the economy and growing the economy itself. They talk about we come here and we are only borrowing money and borrowing money. And that we are only adding. We said we were coming to balance the budget, but we're not balancing the budget. We're coming to borrow more money and more money and more money. But I'm asking them, why did we get to the point where we are today? We heard from the minister with responsibility for financing in the ministry, in the prime minister's office, said that the national interest on the national debt grew from $100 million to $178 million over their term. This is what they've done. This is the pressure they have created. So this becomes our problem now that we have to deal with. Where do we get the funds for us to be able to service those debts? So we have to grow. We have to do so. Risk has to be taken. But since we are headed in the right direction and we're headed in the proper channels, Mr. President, I remain confident that this government will take its people out of the indulgence. And in the days just like Noah and his Ark was able to rest on top of Mount Arorak, the day for this country is coming when this government will journey its people to safety. I thank you, Mr. President. Did the government business? Mr. President, I beg that this Senate be suspended for one hour so that we can have lunch. Honourable Senators, the question is that the Senate be suspended for the next hour. I now put a question as many as are of that opinion, see aye. As many as are of the country opinion, see no. I think the ayes have it. The ayes have it. The House is suspended. Well, that was the last presenter for the first half of the day sitting of the Senate. And you just heard from Senator Timothy Mangal, the morning session began with a contribution from Senator Fortuna Belrose, who reflected on some of the activities and events in celebration of Creole Heritage Month in October, and also Senator Mary Isaac, who reported on her recent participation in a conference on noncommunicable diseases. Most of the debate so far focused on the motions seeking parliamentary approval for the Minister for Finance to borrow just over 40 million dollars, most of which would go towards financing. The 2017-2018 budget and solutions disaster vulnerability reduction project. Well, this brings us to the end of the first session of today's setting of the Senate. And as you heard from the leader of government business, the Senate will resume at 3.15. So I invite you to stay tuned to the national television network for the resumption of today's setting of the Senate. Thank you.