 Hello and good evening and welcome to the Capitola Planning Commission meeting of June 1. This meeting is open to the public with both in-person attendance at the City of Capitola Council chambers at 420 Capitola Avenue and remote attendance. The Planning Commission and staff are attending in person and remotely via Zoom. There are several ways for the public to watch and participate. Information on how to join the meeting via Zoom and make public comment during the meeting is available on our website cityofcapitola.org on the meeting agenda. The public can also live stream the meeting on the City's website or on YouTube. As always, this meeting is cablecast live on Spectrum Communication Cable TV Channel 8 and AT&T Uverse Channel 99 and is being recorded to be rebroadcast on the following Mondays and Fridays at 1 p.m. on Spectrum Channel 71 and Spectrum Channel 25. The recording of the meeting will also be available on the City's website after the meeting. Tonight our technician Eric Johansson as a reminder please remember to turn your cell phones off and with that we will have a roll call to start the meeting. Commissioner Estee, Commissioner Jensen, Commissioner Wilk, Vice Chair Christensen and Chair Westman. Under oral communications first do we have any additions? There are no additions or deletions to the agenda this evening. We will have public comment. This is an item for short communications from the public concerning matters that are not on our agenda tonight. Members of the public may speak for up to three minutes. All speakers must address the entire legislative body and will not be permitted to engage in dialogue. The commission cannot discuss or take action on any items presented during public comment because those items that are not on our agenda tonight. So with that is there anyone who would like to make a public comment? We'll have three minutes and we appreciate it if you sign in so we get your name correctly. Thank you. Check. Okay. I gave you a copy of a letter because I'm not on the agenda but I did want you to have record of my purpose for being here tonight and I hope that we can come to a solution but I was a part of the parkland plan and unfortunately due to expense and extension of permitting process and building and things like that I couldn't afford it. I was offered a space by my landlord which is on a private lot next to my adjacent to my business and that I learned that it also needed to be permitted that I was unaware of because it was donated for her in replacement that I could not find the parklet in a reason for people to come to my deli and be able to enjoy lunch. So after that I decided to go ahead and go back to basics and tried to put in a permit for the sidewalk dining which I originally had before and during the pandemic. I understand that also needs a permit process so a little bit of ignorance on my side but I am requesting that I get an extension because the next meeting is not until July or mid or late July and that will greatly hurt my business if I don't have a place for people to sit. It also attracts people to come into Reef Dog Deli and I think it's overall a good addition for the community not only my business but a place for people to be attracted to. If I'm granted the use until my permit is finalized I promise that I'll abide by all the rules and regulations of the city ordinance. I'll keep the space clean. I will keep all additional signs not present or any flags. My seating area is only between 10 and 5 p.m. Wednesday through Sunday at this point and I'm hoping that I get an extension just so that I can't afford the delay at this point. I'm hoping to make it into 2024 but I'm really hoping that summer helps me get there. I'm also willing that if I fall out of compliance on any of the additions that I put in this letter that I'll remove my seating space immediately and thank you for your understanding and consideration on this matter. I guess I don't need to ask if you have any questions because we can't discuss that. Can I suggest maybe it is part of the agenda in the sense that we're talking about prototype street dining decks and this might be unfolded into that discussion. Well it wasn't advertised or noticed as part of the outdoor dining deck so I don't think according to the Brown Act that we could do that. Susan if I may just make one one short comment. I understand that it's not a part of the agenda and that I know that the next meeting is not till July. What I'm asking here is just for the use of my sidewalk with the tables. We can't make that decision because we don't have the authority to do that without it being on the agenda and an item for a discussion. You know again you'll have to follow the rules. We have to follow the rules and often like to break rules like other people do but we can legally do. I'll leave it up to fate. Okay moving on the next item is commission comments. I have two comments. One is I would suggest that staff you know have already but my dealings with staff is they're very accommodating. They might be able to come up find you a solution but my other comment is I would like to attend the next meeting by Zoom. I realize when we first got off the Zoom that there was apparently that was a very difficult thing but it's all the kinks seem to have been worked out since I noticed there have been some city council members getting by Zoom so. We can definitely work with that. We will have to put public notice where you're at. So what? Public notice in Weaverville. Yeah if you're in a hotel we've got to put public notice and yeah so we'll work I'll work with Austin and Julia on on the how to set that up but it should be no no problem. There'll just be a funny public notice either at the house or so we can talk it through and walk you through all the logistics of that. Staff comments. New comments. I'll have a director's report at the end of the night. So we move to approval of the minutes for May 4th 2023. Anybody have any corrections or additions to those minutes? It's not what somebody likes to make a motion to approve. I'll move approval. I'll move approval. Okay we have a motion. I'll second. Okay we have a motion and second. All those in favor? I was absent. I mean your will is abstaining. All right now we move to the consent calendar which we don't have any items on so we go to the public hearing and the first item under our public hearings is 207-209-209-A and 211 the Esplanade and I believe Commissioner who will recuse herself because she works for the architectural firm involved in this application. Okay this permit is consideration of alternative colors and materials for the design permit, historical alteration permit and coastal development permit for facade modifications in the village area. Thank you Chair Westman and good evening Planning Commissioner. Before you this evening is an application to modify the previous permit that was approved by Planning Commission on April 6th. So the history to this is that the buildings at 207-211 Esplanade it's one structure with four different tenants. The building was damaged on the January 5th storm and emergency repairs and in-kind replacements have been underway. The owner has as they've been opening walls and finding more and more damage they've been wanting to make modifications to the facade due to the facade being potentially historic. Permits are required and Planning Commission review is required and as they continue to work on this project it continues to evolve for one one item that they came up against is at the sandbar they went to refurbish the doors they were realizing the doors were in really bad condition and then while they were with the carpenter the carpenter's space burnt out. So the doors no longer actually exist at first it was there it was a structure the strength of them was no good and now it's not even it's an option to replace them in kind if necessary but so it's just been an evolving project. I'm going to go over the changes that are before you tonight throughout the project they'd like to have new aluminum doors within an antique bronze color this is similar to the door that's installed at Zildes and I believe that a couple of these doors have been installed and if it were not approved tonight they'd have to modify that back to the original design but I think it was just an issue of having to have a door in place the the doors that they were trying to get were backordered and there were issues with ordering them they'd like to reuse the pizza my heart window and move it next door to the bay bar our building official will be working on the energy efficiency of that and making sure it meets code in order to make that move at the pizza my heart they're proposing new aluminum doors also in the antique bronze and at the sand bar the new aluminum doors and antique bronze on the back of the building the the sorry on the top of the slide you can see what was approved previously by the planning commission on the bottom of the slide is the back the side of what they're proposing so there's a different layout for the windows from the lagoon you can see there were two doors previously on the left hand side and now it they're brought it down to one door but a similar similar windows to what's being utilized in the front those are a great product for being next to the water on the rear of the building they were were originally they had ceramic neolith windows around those are very difficult to install and I guess easily breakable so as they were getting to know the product they it was not a good fit for installing over a lagoon on the back of the structure they had asked to use core 10 because the lagoon the lagoon being under I had the staff has concerns with the environment and core 10 tends to drip they do have a covering they've a sealant they've used in the past that's been successful but due to the the lagoon and that risk they're they've agreed to work with staff on the new condition of utilizing a similar product that will look like core 10 it'll be a metal but not core 10 so that we don't have the issue with the leaking this is side by side comparison of what's happening at bay bar so to the left is what was approved the painted wood and on the right they're proposing a wood stain and here is the revised seascape streetscape on the bottom it's a close-up image of the new window system that they're proposing and then these are the proposed elevations and sections so showing the new doors um new materials for the front and back this is um the the sealant that they had proposed on the core 10 and how it would look this is what it would look like uh under the staff recommendation of modifying to an alternative with a it would have a code over a metal one recommended condition is that the roll-up window at 211 esplanade that's a that's the sandbar shall be closed from 10 p.m to close a business each night and during any live entertainment that's really to protect the hotel across the street is where you have a roll-up window we actually for the the wine tasting restaurant right up the street here when we allowed the roll-up window the first that was we got compliance a lot because it just opens up to more noise on the street so we're recommending that change so staff's recommended recommendation tonight is to approve the alternate except substitute the use of the painted aluminum steel framed portal feature at the rear of the facade at my tie beach um and also add the condition of approval that the roll-up windows at 211 esplanade be closed at 10 p.m um and during live entertainment and with that available for any questions i do have core 10 the window the windows around uh i had a little understanding what the real objection was to that i talked to brian about it it seemed like it was just a lot of everybody trying to do everything at once and there didn't so they originally came in with the idea of going with the core 10 and then we came back and said well you should coat it because it rusts so what if it rusts it mentioned drips on the deck which is their property and if we're worried about iron oxide in the lagoon i would be surprised that that's a real environmental effect i'm on the environmental committee um who worry about coli more than chemical pollution and it's not like it's they're dumping their drains in the lagoon you're talking about an occasional drip of iron oxide i guess as an environmental hazard so me there i don't under i don't get why there was all this discussion about them not being able to use core 10 is it just was it the environmental thing was it was it a look thing um at first it was well it was because of the marine environment and core 10 that it it will stain buildings it'll stain when the application originally came in and it was reviewed it had some core 10 over the sidewalk and there was definitely definite concern on the city's part of um one the look of it the stain dripping on the white building and the stain on the sidewalk so you'll you'll notice so that's a city sidewalk or is that their city sidewalk so when you we went around and we looked at some different buildings that have core 10 the penny ice creamery on 41st avenue has core 10 and it's you can see when you look at the sidewalk below it there's a a line of where that sign is from the dripping that's occurred on that sidewalks we just we had concerns the city of drips occurring on our sidewalk with within the lagoon similar concern we didn't do any environmental analysis on it but um the area is actually over the lagoon it's going to be a a trim that comes out over that stands out from the building but that portion of my tie doesn't have a deck right there so it's directly over the lagoon and we just thought it would be smarter to use a different product that's not going to drip they they suggested the coding they've used the applicants suggested the coding as a solution to so that it would not drip the when we looked at the the informational data sheets regarding that product it definitely said that it would not drip for eight years however we're in a marine environment and just that that that is the reason the planning commission could reverse that request but we just I didn't have a hundred percent confidence that forever it wouldn't be an issue so so our building official needs to spend more time on that one that we could approve us that style of we could approve that style if we find out that it doesn't meet the rating then they'll have to substitute it for something else to substitute for another one that will open this to the public anyone interested in commenting on this item I think the applicant is here the Esplanade project from 207 through 211 we um the in uh response to the court and steel if we had to be put on a set schedule instead of if the product the product that um seals the court and seal last for eight years and you want us to quote it every five years we'd be happy to do that or move to the aluminum um powder coated aluminum um product either way um the roll-up doors that are being moved from the pizza my heart to uh the bay bar our single pane um so if we were to be allowed to use or make that um opening a roll-up opening we'd be happy to replace the door or the windows with double pane to meet the current standards um and I can't think any other issues um did you have any questions for me at all I don't have any anybody else on the commission have any I do kind of a clarification so you said that you're okay with the powder coated aluminum window surround I think that's what they're talking about doing isn't moving from the court and steel to a powder coated or painted aluminum at our recommendation uh our rms recommendation or or or like I said using the court and steel and having it I'm just trying to make it easy on you I don't want to have to you know go through a long redesign process or whatever so you know if if the powder coated aluminum is good for everyone that sounds like the easiest quick answer right and so that's consistent with recommendations how about worded so they have and then the aluminum doors I think in planning they okayed an aluminum door they didn't want vinyl windows or doors um and then uh Chris Shaw I know that he's done a lot of cabinet work for all of us here in the community and his business burnt down um about three weeks or four weeks ago and the doors that we were originally going to use uh got lost in that fire well someone with a question I'm sorry so you're you're okay with the rat staff recommendations though in terms of the conditions absolutely yeah I hope so you know how it is it's um the building that hasn't been touched or opened up in 35 years or 40 years and every time you peel something back you have discovered something new so I don't think so no my understanding is that there's still additional stucco to be opened up on the back of the building but the plan is to replace with stucco so I think if anything changed there it'd be internal hopefully not design related no design issues at all or updates thank you very much I want to thank all of you also you you've all been a great partner in this project um there's been a lot of leeway um um help with getting this fast tracked and done quickly and all that and we really appreciate that and I know the businesses down there appreciate being able to get back up on their feet so I want to take the opportunity to thank you all for this afternoon it looks very nice yeah yeah but they've been they've installed a lot of the doors and everything and I was impressed with how well hopefully all the I think it's gonna I think it's gonna be a great add to the community down there it'll be a beautiful spot when we're done just one quick comment just from the community perspective um we appreciate how nice the project lease looks at the end of the day I walk down there a lot in the morning and it's amazing that you guys are doing that much construction and then it's that clean and so from a community perspective it just appreciated that how well it's kept up and cleaned and left on the weekends you know I think we're all trying to advertise to the community that capitals open everything and there could be a possibility with a lot of construction stuff out that people leave with their appearance that is still closed and I think you guys do a great job in trying to help us market that that things are open so thank you absolutely thank you is there anyone else who would like to speak on this item do we have any zoom people we do not that will close the public hearing and bring it back to the commission right I think right but I think what's in staff has the authority to they don't have to use that exact window they just have to use a window that looks like that so I think we're covered yes I'll make I'll make sure it's clear that as long as you know the window will have to comply with building code but do we have a second all right we have a motion and a second can we have a roll call vote commissioner esti commissioner Jensen hi commissioner will and chair westman hi so moving along we're on item b which is an alternative design for the prototype street dining decks in central village location uh 25 public parking spaces in the central village can be used for this and we'll wait one moment while our fellow commissioner gets the chance to report on this item yeah um tonight it's the katie show three presentations uh before you this evening is a request to allow an alternative to the prototype street dining deck in this picture here this is really what we're talking about is the modifications what you're seeing here is what was permitted the metal railing with planters in between and their custom metal railings and cement planters that are were very heavy on purpose and we're looking into alternatives to that this evening so a little background on this back in 20 december of 2021 we the city council adopted the outdoor dining ordinance for a permanent program um in july of 2022 the coastal commission certified that program and in june the city council accepted the coastal commission conditions that were placed on that permit um and it was then certified sorry by coastal commission on july 14th 2022 planning commission adopted the prototype standards in july 21st of 2022 so a little under a year ago the first permit was issued this april it was issued um to britannia arms and since issuing that permit um and i do see that the owners here this evening uh they've run into just the the cost of what we originally thought was a reasonable cost i think we had estimated about 25 000 for three spaces the cost have gone up dramatically and also the lead times in order to order the goods is also taking time but it's really the cost that the reason why we're bringing this back we want to make sure what's ever built in the right of way looks really good but we don't want it to be overly burdensome in terms in terms of cost to the our businesses um so the railings um some of the issues were that the fabricated metal they're installed between each planters this requires custom built railings which is very expensive and a lot of coordination between you know when your planters come in and the custom railings and getting the whole system together and as i mentioned the cost going up and then so before you this evening is going to be an alternative and it's a hogwire fence or um panel which is a welded six gauge mesh panel that's inside a redwood rail framing for a continuous perimeter except for the ingress and egress on and off so we're removing the planters from actually being built into the exterior of the the deck and then having our requirement to have planters within the deck so these materials are readily available we went to Home Depot and made shore and we would be specific though that the welded six gauge mesh panels be of a a black powder coat because they'll hold up better than the aluminum that we saw with without the powder coat and but they're readily available and installation could be done by a contractor right on site which makes it a lot easier the planters the approved planter is a concrete and it weighs over a thousand pounds once you've added the soil that was on purpose for safety reasons we thought that that would be appropriate right now the planter lead time is it's greater than 10 weeks it's a long they're not built in our backyard they're quite far away so they have to get shipped here and then it requires once once they do get here a forklift delivery on site and then a forklift anytime you need to move these so quite cumbersome the alternative that would come up with is we should we're thinking it'd be better to allow each business to pick out their planters they should match throughout the dining deck the idea was that they would match but that the planters could be 30 inches to 36 inches tall so that when you're walking by you can actually see the plants over the railing because the railings at 36 inches placed one at each corner one at each post along the street frontage so if there are four posts along the street frontage there'd be two at each corner and then the two internal posts there'd be two there and then two on either side of the entry planter materials could be fiberglass ceramic or concrete we're actually going to change up this recommendation a little bit Sean spent some time at a pot a potting store today or that had and talked to the owner there and fiberglass if if you if it's around a lot of people it can get dinged quite easily and damaged so tonight we're the one recommended change to this is to only allow ceramic or concrete because they're they'll last the longest and not get damaged easily in a public setting and then traffic safety for each of these decks will have the public works director review and she'll on a case by case basis they can require rated ballards to be placed at the end of the dining decks so in areas where there's more traffic that they'll probably be required as part of the permit so here are some images we based this on the riverview pathway design so there the hog wire is framed in by redwood it'll be the smooth redwood will be specific on the material list and then this is examples of different planters that are available on this slide these are planters that were on the website house.com these range of price from 600 to almost 800 dollars each locally we went out and looked at some planters at a this is on so calav right after you go over highway one there's is it called the pot stop or pottery planet pottery planet and there they had some beautiful planters that ranged from 299 dollars that were 36 inches tall upward but there were quite a few around the $300 price range that would work so the staff recommendation tonight is to allow alternate wood and wire railing and between 30 to 36 inch tall planters for the prototype street dining deck plans and that's the recommendation the another item that came up was that that would be great to get feedback on from the planning commission tonight is as owners are ordering things we were um like for chairs and all the prototype the furniture the timing doesn't always line up perfectly and we've been trying to coach the business owners to just you know plan to build your deck when you know you'll have your furniture in place and you'll have your umbrellas so that it all comes together at once but if the planning commission would like us to be more flexible on that we could get feedback on that as well but um from our point of view this is you know we're finally going to have the the long-term deck in place they get to have over three years once it's installed and then there can be continuations on this further out but really want it to look good where it's in the private in the public right of way and was thinking that they shouldn't get their occupancy until they have all the components such as including the furniture if they didn't have their umbrellas installed we would not hold them up for that but just the the furniture the deck the correct deck the correct railing so with that i'm open and available for questions yeah yes i do um so you mentioned the hogwire well one first question is is english ailes are they to they just um are they meet the prototype standards no the one that is that's not a prototype they'd come in for a custom approval of the deck that they had for covid 19 which is still in the right of way and that was denied by the planning commission back in december i want to say of last year and there's an allowance to allow someone to keep their covid 19 deck up as long as they're making progress on their outdoor dining permit their building permit so they do have a building permit in it's been a slow process though getting a couple of you know submittals on that next question is you showed the planters uh i kind of assumed that out the planters that we approved for the prototype were rectangular planters you showed round all kinds of vessels that were count as planters but are rectangular is that we have a shape that we specify so we did we the prototype design has a rectangular planter what we're suggesting tonight is to be more flexible so that that we can bring down the cost on these so giving the um the business owners the flexibility to pick out their own planters as long as they're we're asking that they be between 30 to 36 inches in height but they can pick color and the materials have to be either ceramic or concrete so other materials like steel or aluminum or red wood or something that you decided were unacceptable yes um so the aluminum can get damaged quite easily also wood needs to be continuously painted and kept up so we're really trying to utilize we're proposing materials that um won't have to you don't need to paint them and they won't be damaged easily they'll have a longer lifespan you're worried about the chipping of the ceramic the damage you know um as i said shone went out to the pottery store today and was and talked with the owner if you want to add any good evening so to that question i mean if you had to say what is likely to be the most resilient material the feedback i got from the uh pottery store was that concrete was probably by far and away the wisest material choice ceramic i think an option but yeah it's going to be more prone to damage and probably chipping and cracking but it's still a sturdier option i would imagine than the fiberglass and the port and steel for example they had options like that i looked at them as well and those are the two that that the uh management there gave me the most reservation on in this particular use uh and finally the hog wire rate uh metal fencing um why do we pick something very specific we couldn't just it up to that's metal why do we pick that particular design um due to again uh so when you're in along a public street there's a lot of wear and tear that happens there's kids that will climb on things um we were looking at possibly doing like the steel um the cords those get flexed really easily and start looking you know they just require a lot of maintenance so because this is in the public street it's on city property we're trying to find something that's cost effective as well as has a really nice look to it and another piece of this is we thought you know where the where this has been used along the river view pathway and it looks really nice it's something that is part of our community like repeating that within the village seemed appropriate um i was just wondering i know that we've gone through this whole exercise over the last couple of years um and i don't mean to discount that in any regard but i just i have to ask if if there's any way to make it easier for the business owners at this point i mean given the the fact that it's so expensive and we have this prototype but which i agree with the um the railing and the hog wire but since we're utilizing wood on the railing um and the setup that is down there for the most part is wood is there i mean i i know we're specifying ceramic but is is there any way to incorporate the wood at this point or just saying that since they look nice we could utilize their existing planters if they meet certain criteria just to make it easy over you know expense wise methods wise construction wise everything it just seems like especially after listening to the reef dog earlier is is there any outlook for that um that's exactly why we're here and so this is staff's recommendation but by all means the planning commission makes the decision here so it's up to this it's up to the planning commission and if you um i mean i understand the utilization of the deck because they're drainage and all that stuff but making it all the necessary improvements to what's what's there i'm just concerned just for the welfare of the businesses tonight you have the ability yeah i do um so um going back um in the previous commission what was approved um there's if i remember correctly there's like selected uh furniture like options and colors and stuff like that and so if that's still staying in place but the planners now will not they could be of any color um so i just wanted you know that the thought process is trying to respect the previous work that has been done by everybody and now interjecting that now that the planter can not they don't have to match they can they all have to match but they don't have to match anything pacific is that correct what we're proposing is that the the businesses have flexibility to purchase um the potters that the the pots that they like we're we're suggesting certain materials i do want to clarify on the the so tonight we were only looking at changes to the railing and the the pots um the furniture itself that's in the the prototype design there's um so many options to pick from we just we stated that it has to be outdoor furniture and it has to be made by one of three one of the three manufacturers that are reputable manufacturers that stuff is going to last so that's the only parameters there is they they can order um they also have to provide be compliant with ADA so they'll have to have one you can't have pedestal tables at all seeds you have to have one area that um for ADA access sorry i so i probably i thought before when it was selected there was obviously manufactured but i thought there was a color palette that was connected with that too so any any restaurant had wide open color palette as long as in there okay great thank you um my next question is regarding um in the report it talks about deck also was that supposed to be talked about tonight or um the decking materials um oh so the decking materials um there's there's two options within the prototype there's treks and there's redwood so we were keeping both options but we were asking that we'd be allowed to add one more color to treks that would complement the redwood better perfect um and then my other question regarding that um my understanding that the permit said that um businesses are will get will be for three years is that correct yes the permit will be good for three years and so there is opportunity there is a potential at the end of three years any investment they make city council makes a decision to outdoor dining or something like that or any commissioners exactly but there's recommendation this investment that they made would be the have to be removed because it's only standing for three years is that correct so after three years it'll be reviewed for like was this a success did we have any issues with coastal access that was really the the reason for the three-year requirement was put on there by the coastal commission so that if there are any issues with coastal access at that point we could say this is not working it's not it's becoming an impediment to getting to the beach and then they could be removed so after three years the the program will be reviewed um and then it can be continued at that point if there are findings that it has not been an an issue to coastal access okay uh that's all the questions I had at this point thank you um by us local control it could get appealed is where it's in I think it's an extension of the permit so it could get like they could call it up they could appeal it to coastal commission just to be clear on the positive decking material you're not specifying that direct use timber tech pretty good old term I think they could they they have to match the colors though there were they're almost the same yeah and and you can give me direction on that as well the colors that we picked for that were really um to um compliment the planters and the railing which are now totally changed so mostly worried about the colors not sorry I'm sorry I do have one more question um so just going back to like I think uh ale house um they're in the is there a on is there a timeline for like their outdoor dining to stay in place with the permit I mean like do you give them six months to get a permit if they don't um go through the process is there time like a lapse time that it expires yes so um as long as their building permit continues to move forward there there's no relapse it was really um an administrative policy that was put in place at this point though I think it would be appropriate for the planning commission if you wanted to give direction on that now that we're looking at other options um to bring down the cost we do have that application in but if there's any direction on if you if you want me to put a the duration was always as long as they had their building permit in I'm just trying to understand sorry for the question um trying to understand the process does they had to have the outdoor dining decks removed by January 1 I think correct and so some were removed from the storm some were removed because people restaurants removed them because they need to and then there were some that were left in place and then they started the permit process after that period or was that permit process started before they were supposed to be removed that started after so I think at that point we reached out to them and said it's time to remove the deck or you have to bring in your permit um yeah and for that one they the permit that they've submitted to the building department includes the the existing deck that's out there so it wasn't they they put in the uh I think either treks or the redwood and the actual deck but they were proposing their planters again which was uh denied by planning commission so they now have comments back from the building department and planning saying you can't utilize you know that was denied by planning commission you have to update it with the prototype so I think tonight they're looking like they're another um one of the businesses that would like a less expensive alternative okay I was just trying to understand this the standards being set across all businesses some happen some don't so I'm gonna take it out and what the time frame is and what the processes okay thank you okay now we will open this item up to the public if there's anyone here who would like to speak uh you're welcome to come to the podium um we appreciate you signing in if you don't mind so we get your name correct in the minutes but you're not required to all right my name is Peter black while I'm with um English ales and not the one who has the wooden um on to some uh Capitol Avenue so never let the chance go by to um and give a second opinion um with regard to damage um I've I've built my own house I've built my daughter's house I've built nine pubs I currently have redwood and treks and all manner of materials either on decks or I'm building um I have a bit of difficulty in understanding why you have some problems with wood when you look down Capitol just about the whole bloody fascia is wood and we don't seem to have a problem with that um concrete and uh ceramic or chip um repairing that is difficult and almost invariably will show wood however if it's damaged you can fill repaint and it looks as good as new with regard to the um the weight if that's a consideration and then the planters that I currently have there I can fill with stone up to three quarters full fill it with dirt at the top and they'll be heavier than any of the other planters that are um being conserved tonight um at the last meeting I mentioned somebody mentioned that the uh the planters were pink and I mentioned that that was the problem with sending a colorblind person to buy paint and that was me so we can match the paint because I have paint left over from when we painted the building what I didn't get tonight I saw different types of planters and some of the prices were 300 600 dollars but that's for a 14 by 36 planter or something like that the original planters me I've got 42 feet of frontage if I had planters on everywhere they would be a downside more expensive than the other one in cumulatively than the other one so like some guidance if I have to put other planters there um how many how much railing in between um but again getting back to what I originally got here to say is um I quite like what I have maybe the maybe the color needs to be adjusted and not be more than happy to do that and I think it's um it's equally as safe and we can bolt those planters to the deck so that um if they did that hit they wouldn't uh they wouldn't fall over 14 seconds left I think that's what I have to say thank you is there anyone else in the public who would like to comment on this item uh seeing no one we'll close the public hearing and bring it back to the commission uh would someone like to start for me oh anyone on zoom thank you there are no participants on zoom no I appreciate you reminding me I for some reason I have difficulty with that um so with that we'll close the public hearing and bring it back to the commission for discussion can I be happy to start because I want to I want to support so I was on the planning commission when this first came up some of you weren't and the the thought was that well this is a this is a public property so we get to weigh in on the design and you want to have you know if it's if it's a public facility you want it like a park bench you want to have some consistently street light lamps you want to you want to have a different street lamp in front of every business so the notion was well let's have let's have some consistency what I've found however is that we've gone down the rattle of trying to be architects and designers and I don't I don't think we've been successful um you know it's it's the it's the classic horse being camel being a horse designed by committee and um so so I would like to back off my position of you know trying to specify the design I like what English Ailes has done now that we've seen these um parklets in in work for a while um you can see how well the owners would when they when they have the opportunity the argument about the wood planters is as well taken um so in my in my attitude is if we meet safety requirements and I would specify rectangular planters at least that would probably be my own design only design feature we would keep the furniture requirements we open up the deck material to any colors and and and then just get an opportunity to approve the designs as they come before the planning commission because I don't think it's I don't think we're successful with this this prototype design so far so that's that's my con I was just gonna add to um bring the microphones all the way up to because I was outside I forgot to mention that I couldn't hear anybody just just a side note that's what I was gonna add but um I concur with um commissioner will I just feel like if they could um if we could evaluate each design as it comes in I think when we when we first took this prototype and started evaluating the prototype there is a lot more parklets being shown and those ones have since kind of petered off especially on the esplanade those ones seem to be a bit more haphazard and a little scattered and the plants were dead and stuff like that so the the parklets that have um sustained you know they're they're they're really pretty and they're they're nice and the um the plants are still living everything looks the businesses that I've kept them going have really done a good job and I I feel like that should be considered moving forward so the original intent then of this prototype was to provide the approval process well and the original intent was that these were going in the public right of way and so there was concern that there be some uh consistency with how they looked in the public right of way um as well as how they functioned as far as uh you know safety and in in the community so I'll I'll also add to that um when we were tasked by city council to move forward with a with an ordinance they asked us to build in a prototype design that would be approved administratively it just needs a building permit and the ordinance also includes a custom design which any applicant can come to the planning commission and apply for the a custom design so in the English ales did come forward with a custom design and it was um I don't remember if it was redwood or the treks but it was it was a new treks with the planters on top and that was denied at the planning commission as a custom design um but for for the purpose of this evening because we have a prototype design in our code we do need to I don't think we can say the prototype design can be custom I think I would have to modify the code so if we want to continue to have that administrative approval process that goes through building we will still have to I'm sorry but be a little bit of the designer in this because there has to be an approved prototype design for people to but we are trying to make it more flexible that is part of this conversation so so we could modify the prototype design based on what you're proposing tonight so our proposal tonight is to modify the prototype design to allow this new hogwire redwood fence take out the big planters and just require planters within it that they can pick from and we were suggesting heights if you don't think those heights you know you can you can be more flexible we tried to come in with a package that was um that we thought would work so but if you don't if you don't want to regulate the planters at all like it's it's really up to the planning commission so could we recommend you know them utilizing their existing planters being wood or not um liking just yeah you could you could require that there's a minimum amount of planters and not be so specific about their design sounds like we could just or you can say they don't have to have planters you can leave it up to them so it sounds like if we just expand the material to include yeah to include wood or or as far as i'm concerned metal or anything that will hold dirt i'm okay with and it's rectangular so that's the prototype we have a rectangular planter not going to specify uh what it's made out of um fencing between planters i don't know can we be more flexible on that as well well currently we're saying the planters aren't part of the fencing it's just the new hogwire fence that will be around the surround so the planters are just on the deck on the inside they're right inside the rail yeah so it's just a railing there's no planter incorporated into the railing it's just just a railing and then we were requiring that they utilize planters um to have a certain amount of planters two at the entryway i want like flagging the entryway and then so one initial i'm comparing this to our eight our prototype adu right that we have this standard adus that our staff approved the counter level but it rarely well they just say oftentimes adus come in with request for custom adus probably the majority of the time that's the case so the way i the way i can envision this prototype then would be okay here's what we're this is the kind of thing we're looking for they take that as a template and they say okay we're not going to vary out very too much from this we'll still have rectangular planters they'll be in each corner we'll have railing we'll have the same deck material blah blah blah but then they can but then they could come to us with variations off of that knowing that they're you know following most of the guidelines of the prototype the way i understand it is right now there are two processes you can follow the prototype design which the city has and if you follow that then you just come in for an over-the-counter permit with this if you want to do something different than the prototype design you have the you can come in and you can apply for whatever kind of outdoor dining deck you want to have just as the ill place came in and applied for an outdoor dining deck but that one particular design I do think that Katie is correct we have in our ordinance a prototype design which allows them to get the administrative permit and if we want to continue having this streamlined permit process we need to have a prototype design right we just need to figure what we're going to have in that design and and what what's going to be the criteria but there does have to be a design and a criteria for it to work in the structure of being part of the ordinance got it yes so we haven't heard from this end of the okay so that being said I would expand the material for I think the hogwire is great I installed it myself and the powder coated stuff is really good animals couldn't do their thing on and it doesn't rust so it's pretty durable um as the planters go I would not restrict them I would not not allow them to use wood I would allow wood to be added look nice it's relatively cheap and since they have a three-year risk of you know I can only put this thing up for three years and somebody in Sacramento who never goes to the coast decides that we can't have this process anymore than they're they're out right so they don't want to spend too much money on something you might throw away for you that's my one concern it's to the colors I would I mean if you go to timber tech or tech I mean you got a wide range of colors but I think the four you've got for this is a prototype that's probably okay those are my thoughts thank you so um I talked a lot of the business down there the biggest concerns I've heard from this the whole prototype thing is cost lead time and I think um you know I'm glad to see I brought up the last planning commission when you're trying to get an update because we hear this all the time but I think issues I've heard um is the planters and it seems like that's being addressed and we're come up with different uh option for those and I could probably get behind the wood planter um as an option would be fine um the next thing I hear a lot about was the railing and the railing has a lot of safety issues from I think we all could say oh cable railing is nicer thing but it does flex and then it gets to be kind of a safety issue for like a kids entrapment issue so with a hog wire wire mesh like that that kind of thing would get taken out of play from a safety standpoint and so I think that addressed it also I think it addresses the turnaround time of shop drawings and you know it's very detailed railing that was approved the first time and so I think to go with those wire mesh tractor supply home depot something pretty readily available so I think that addresses a lot of the concerns with the treks and the redwood those are two options that I think you know pretty well what's readily available and um I would just I would agree with what Commissioner Esty said was I think there should be kind of a parameter of set colors that we could not deviate from because some of those treks colors can't go way off the mark and not that we are designers architects but if you've got four or five of those in a row it could be completely different and maybe get out of control from the standpoint of if the goal was to have some kind of uniformity and so I think um having a set parameter and streamlining the concerns that I've heard and then let the prototype you know they could come in if they meet the prototype they can be off and rolling getting the railing taken care of I mean I'm getting their deck taken care of and start to utilize it I have two questions I would advocate for if a restaurant was building their deck out and they had ordered their materials and they showed proof of purchase and the lead time you know hopefully the lead time is something reasonable that they could utilize their deck where you know we have the you know the whole village has been damaged from the storm everything and I'd like to see some flexibility in that that if they did procure it it's been purchased it is coming but if let's say you know it got delayed for six or eight weeks they commenced the whole entire summer and it's a lot of cost um in what they've already expended um and the other part to that is with the change in this prototype um and if a business has already turned in for a permit um is it the same exact permit fees are there any changes in the permit fee structure that the permit um the review time would be less now um I was wondering if a if a restaurant has already turned in a permit and has already paid for the permit and their fees were let's say ten thousand dollars and now it's streamlined and a new restaurant came in today cruisers came in and said they were going to turn in and the review time's a lot less because there's not as much back and forth on the permit cost would be I'd want that to be reviewed to make sure that because uh one of the restaurants were the first ones out they didn't occur in the most cost and spent the most amount of money on a permit and now it's been streamlined and then everybody else is going to get in so just if you elaborate on that I just want to be sensitive to that sure um so if there's a modification to a permit it um so the first review is usually up to six weeks and then follow-up reviews are typically around two to three weeks so they would be in the the faster review category for a modification so if they came back with the hogwire fence and the new design you know that they'd be on the faster track and we'd also for that modification we could work with them on they're not paying for a new permit this is a modification to a building permit and you'll handle that as they came in like yep an engine or turn around time so yes yeah I mean it would fall under our typical system of um absolutely yeah so someone comes in with a prototype they get it approved over the counter and then Jerry's suggestion comes up which is oh lead times and I can't get that exact same material let's say for example it's a different deck color uh would it be staff's ability to approve that or would I mean is there a is there a range of discretion that you had that's well that's close to the prototype that you'd approve over the counter or any deviation would have to come to the plan so what I was hearing from Jerry was more about the furniture lead time separate so anything anything that's required in the prototype we would not have flexibility on so they would come to us then as they yeah if custom design if they said we wanted to do this beautiful tile work that would be a custom design that comes to you um because treks and redwood should be readily available so I'm thinking like now what we have these down to it's basically um our items that are readily available at Home Depot so I don't see any issues with those but if what I was hearing um Commissioner Jensen say was if if the lead time on this great furniture that is six weeks out he would like to see flexibility with as long as they can show us a receipt that they've paid for it and it's being delivered that he would like us to have flexibility for them to put different chairs out until those the prototype chair okay so that's the same issue though it's so your flexibility what is your flexibility the proto well that's a lead time thing with them with just the furniture so if you'd like us to have that flexibility I'd like to get that feedback from Planning Commission tonight because originally we were saying when the we were not going to give occupancy for the prototypes unless every part of the prototype was out there because um but if you'd like more flexibility so for me my comments are I don't have any difficulty adding wood plan up those can be done uh I did have a question about um red wood railing with the hog wire in it and that's not painted so I'm assuming that the red wood railing with the hog wire is just going to be the natural red wood not something that's going to be we will require a clear coat on it and um as far as the planners concerned uh I wanted to make certain that all of the planters that are you know going to go in the corners of the that they all match and that the planners all be um and I don't know how to phrase this because I know some ceramic fire not a solid color you know they have some variation in them but planners without you know big floral designs on them and this is going in the public right of way and I'm not too concerned if they're all red or all orange or you know how they work out but I think they should match you know be a solid color and um see within the 30 to 36 inches in height um to go forward um for the treks it sounds like we have a range of colors in there that are available right now and I would be comfortable as long as staff felt that what was being put in was you know compatible with that range of colors if it was lightly lighter slightly lighter you know those kinds of things don't really matter to us it's sort of the overall palette of colors that we're interested in um I think that you know one of the things you do learn over time is um you know you have to be careful about temporary things because you know temporary furniture goes in and it never gets replaced but I would be comfortable with commissioner jensen's suggestion if they could show that they have ordered you know the appropriate chairs to go in and they have the tables but the chairs haven't arrived then it would be fine for me to put sort of temporary chairs in while they're waiting for that order to arrive but I would like to know that they have been ordered and they're on their way and we're not going to have temporary furniture go on and on um so um it it seems like we have a consensus and you all can correct me one thing we didn't talk about was the rectangle rectangular shape of the planters um it makes a lot of sense to me but it probably does eliminate a lot of those do we want to sort of take a straw vote on the rectangular shape I think that's what's been that's a consistent thing so I would I would be okay with keeping the rectangular shape as a I would be okay with that I find that would just by exclude any ceramic they did show us one example of a sort of I think it was square but they do have rectangular I I could go yeah that's great I don't think we should preclude I mean we we could say circular or rectangular if we if they want to make something nice like a nice arrangement of circular or different shapes I'm kind of of the persuasion to say that they I would I I would like to see sort of rectangular or square not to open a Pandora's box but now that the planters are going to be on the deck right um are there any concerns that that's reducing the size of the seating on the deck now and so that wasn't before it wasn't going to be on the deck is that true definitely so before the planters aren't around the periphery so if the the planters that are on the deck will take up seating area so if we're going for a more rectangular look maybe considering something like towards the left here where it's a square and won't take up as much a floor area floor space you I'd be fine either way I just want to be sensitive to you know they would understand that wherever they're picked they're kind of giving up seating space right but it definitely will limit um I think concrete will be like one of what like there won't be as much pottery available if you don't allow a circular so just to be clear that's from the experience that shun had so now I'm confused my understanding is the reason we were having the planters in the corners was this really a safety issue we wanted something big and heavy with a lot of dirt in it so that when the cars you know come bumping down there that that the restaurant patrons won't be disturbed or harmed right so now if we're talking about putting planters that or maybe have a small bottom in a round shape and just resting on the deck it seems like that defeats the whole purpose I kind of feel like it I mean sorry I don't mean to go ahead I feel like it seems pretty speculative to to say that you know the wooden box filled with rocks or concrete planter are going to prohibit a car I mean we don't really have any data to support it in that so it's kind of you know saying well one's going to be safer than the other but I mean we have a wooden rail with hogwire so it's I think just coming to the conclusion of what do you want to see just doesn't I mean it seems to be the more overreaching issue and and for that much I mean we could say that just making requirements of you know have a deck like modifying the prototype to just say we need a deck with adequate drainage we need a railing a perimeter railing and then we need some planters of some type to dress it up and with some nice furniture which I'm I would say that the the furniture that we specified before if everybody's in agreement that that's you agree that's fine but making it kind of an ease of entry into this whole transition would seem a bit more appropriate for economic climate so you mentioned something about safety ballards that that's what's kind of my concern right thank you yeah so the our city our public works director has looked at this and in her opinion the the heavy planters could be helpful if a car were to bump but really a true safety mechanism is a ballard so she on on the streets in which cars move faster through the city a ballard would be more appropriate along the esplanade where cars really drive slow it's not as much of a worry and she'll look at each deck individually to decide whether or not it should require a ballard um commissioner christensen is right on track with the staff thought process with this is that we've moved away from the planters being a safety component of the deck and more of an aesthetic um so just to to dress it up and give it some life so that's that is where this has gone because these are not going to protect anyone from a car but we're not descriptive into seeing how many planters so within the prototype what what i'm suggesting this evening is that we require a planter on each side of the entryway onto the decks and at the four corners of the deck and then along the street frontage where the cars drive by wherever there's a post there should be a planter and that will vary on the size of some of our restaurants will have up to five parking spaces so they'll have multiple posts and have to put planters along each of those so yeah it was really an aesthetic to keep the greenery there and the now we're taking away revenue because we're those planters now taking up square foot people sitting at right you changed your whole concept yep i get that wrong yeah it looks like it's a different concept than i thought i approved long ago so how about that the planters can be square or round or but they have to be a minimum of diameter of 14 or 15 inches you know somewhere in that range so they're and that's not very big i mean you're talking about and certainly since the fence is going to be on the outside and these planters are going to be on the inside the planters that we were going to have were encroaching into the inside of that space so i don't think these dining decks are going to end up with significantly less dining space on them with the planters because they were going to have those planters encroaching into the dining deck space before i mean the dining deck was going because i think the planters that we had before we had dimensions on those and i think they were like 14 inches this way they still had to fit those in the space so why don't we just say that the planters have to be a minimum of that size if somebody wants to do more they can do more so that's a great point so that in some areas between the planters they'll be gaining deck space yes yeah i think overall leaving it up to the business owner at this stage i'm in favor for i think um i'll make a motion um that we approve uh staff's recommendation for the prototype um but with the condition that there's um flexibility i don't know if it would be like a toc uh for the uh restaurant uh to use the deck if they have established that the materials have been ordered um and so that they can use that as soon as they possibly could and those are and i think with the outline of the flexibility and changing to what planters at the same time um i i can i'd like to make that the motion if the planters all match yes should they all be the same color i'll go match i'll second that motion okay what about restriction on size the inch minimum so what is what does it currently say um that it has to have a minimum height between a minimum of 30 inches up to 36 inches well doesn't have a volume or dimensional requirement what would you say about for example english ailes using their existing planters modified in the existing prototype like their wooden planters that's the design right so i'll amend the motion then to then say that it'd be 14 inches we have we have a motion in a second oh i thought oh i thought i had to i think that's going to amend it to add to it do you want to oh sorry i had a friendly amendment you want to add to include the 14 inches sure okay so he's adding the friendly amendment second agrees with that okay so so we have a motion in a second more discussion i maybe there's more comments i have a question is there um a minute are we going with staff's recommendation on the minimum amount of pots so two at the entry way one at each corner and then the posts along the main road yes yeah all right we have a motion in a second can we have a roll call vote commissioner sd hi commissioner jensen hi commissioner well hi vice chair christensen hi and chair westman hi i can i ask one more question um because i just i don't i think this question probably exists in the audience too so for the english ailes if they came in with a permit for the prototype design with the redwood fence and the hogwire can they put their planters if they if they meet the height requirement and the width requirement on the interior of this new and it sound to me i think they could they'll have to design it so they have two by the entrance and one in each corner and one along so it may or may not work for them but they'll have to figure that piece out okay thank you i think i have clarity all right now we're going i think staff can you answer your question because we've come we've sort of completed the item we can't go back at this point i'm sorry is there a time limit to um we talked about that briefly and like english ailes they have a time frame to amend their i'm just trying to understand the process from here out for everybody yes so um um they the permits that are in they can be amended so the applicants can come into city hall um unfortunately i am not in the office tomorrow but on monday they could come in and meet with me and talk through this um or meet with shon tomorrow um but the timing is they need to keep their building permits on track um however i do realize that we're into june right now and we'll be open to the conversation of like putting their decks on hold if they decide that they don't want to move forward this summer because it's so late um and that that could be another part of the conversation so um but in terms of if they're not moving forward with their building permit in a timely manner then yes the the prototype the um emergency decks are supposed to be out of the right of way if you're not working on your permit that just fall into the guidelines right now like when you get a permit you have 180 days right yeah we can ask for an extension i mean just right right yeah um can i ask one more question um with english ailes coming in with their custom building permit um i think it was a couple months a few months ago december since the prototype has changed i mean is there any like if they i feel the consideration during that meeting was looking at how they related to the existing prototype and since it's changed so much is there any recourse on them representing their proposal as a custom design um kind of abstract i'm sorry i'm just asking so under the code when you've had a permit denied your you would have to make a substantial change to your application to bring it back in front of the planning commission so um if there's desire on behalf of the planning commission would do that but um that that is the code language is that if something has been denied i think there's also a time limitation to that in which the time a specific amount of time after one year you can resubmit for reconsideration could we make any type of exception if there's any interest and consider no that's the code okay i'm just asking all the question but they i'll be available really we're really not supposed to because um i we'd be happy to meet tomorrow staff will meet with you and and go over it and come up with what your options are because we we just did a motion and a second so we're not going to change what we've said you could you could send that to us or you know communicate it through the staff thank you all right let's move on to item c which is the uh citywide housing element update are we going to have a staff presentation is our consultant going to be with us on zoom so um we do have our consultant with us tonight and can you see Veronica and Brett on the camera yes which should i unmute you can unmute them and then i'm just not seeing that usually there's a little um something pops up here where you can see Brett and Veronica i'm just gonna test that we can hear you okay uh yes um i'm here sure can you hear me baby yes right okay i'll start and then end it off to Veronica shortly so this evening um we're going to go over the the latest on our housing element update um tonight we'll be discussing sorry i'm gonna try to move tonight we'll be discussing uh what is the housing element uh what public outreach has been done to date we'll go over the public review draft um programs and policies and then also next steps i'd like to introduce our team we have Brett Stinson of our design group and Veronica Tam of Veronica Tam and associates so what is the housing element a housing element is one of seven required elements of the general plan it's an assessment of a city's housing needs and how to best accommodate existing and future housing needs for the for our population and our regional population there's a deadline of December 15th in which we need to submit this to the state it does not have to be approved by December 15th but submitted to the state by December 15th and then it will be reviewed for compliance um by the hcd at the state housing and community development so on this slide we show the process for our housing element update we're in step two we're still in the public outreach process we've gone through our housing needs assessment Brett and Veronica's team has put together our first draft of the housing element which has been out for we've started our public review period and the next steps are hcd review of the draft adoption locally and then submittal to the state um for public outreach we've made quite a few efforts we've had we had an online housing needs survey um sorry and that that did conclude this i didn't update that part of the slide but that that finished in march uh stakeholder interviews we're back in November we've had two community workshops one in February one on may 16th um the planning commission has met i think three times on this item uh first in February uh then for a joint planning commission city council meeting and more recently just to announce that the public uh the public review draft was available and also city council had a study session in February um we're continuing our public outreach opportunities so with this hearing tonight and then um we'll have the the draft is available right now for comments and then we'll also have available available opportunities during our adoption hearings in the fall after we get hcd comments the key takeaways from our community workshop a couple weeks back were um to attach affordability requirements to future upzoning density bonus and value capture there was some skepticism regarding the state park sites which continues to come up we'll see if it makes it into the final draft um there was concern over the high percentage of low income and affordable units that were attached to the mall and concern uh specifically that this would um impact the no net loss issues that are required by law um there was also comments made um about uh would like to see more commitment to programs in the housing element update we use a lot of softer language and then this uh the the person who commented on this said we'd like to see more action oriented language such as the city will and then attach specific dates to what we're saying we will do um we also heard um we need to protect our existing affordable housing stock in the city so really putting money or putting effort and focus on existing programs also concerns over constraints to build ad use and a desire to streamline and have more protections in place for ad use um another theme that continues to come up at all of these at the hearings and the public outreach has been the balance of sites citywide often capitol is looked at having like uh the breaking point being the the creek and having um a better well distributed more balanced distribution between both sides and then also questions came up regarding rent control and um i'll be speaking about that during the director's report so um so the public review draft is available it became available in may it's going to be available through next Friday for public comment um and with that i'm going to hand this over to Veronica thank you katie now i'm going to go through the housing element just a little bit more um description about the contents of the housing element the housing element is highly regulated by the state law in terms of its contents we need to hit a lot of um discussions relating to housing element needs assessment constraints and resources opportunities and also looked at how we have done in the past and then last the last part the most important component is what are we going to do in the future now next slide in the needs assessment we did we do need to look at the demographic and household characteristics uh in your community so that we cannot have a better understanding on what the house um what the needs are currently and possibly into the future we need to look at your current housing stock and also your market conditions um whether those your current housing stock is matching the needs in your community and also special housing needs and in terms of special housing needs uh typically under state law those are the elderly disabled households with large uh large households with five or more members the homeless female headed households and also farm workers these are the um uh this specific households or persons that the state decided um state law really mandates this housing element to look at because these groups typically have more difficulty finding decent and affordable housing next slide in terms of constraints and we have the needs and we also need to look at what are the framework of what we can be working with in order to address the needs we have to look at really governmental constraints and governmental constraints means that is development regulations and land use policies what you do to facilitate housing development in your community we also looked at market and economic constraints and environmental constraints now as a local jurisdiction you have very little control or influence over the market and certainly you have very little um control over the environment either but you do have control over the development regulations and policies that you enact as a local jurisdiction under housing element law you are legally obligated to mitigate um development regulations and land use policies that are found by the state to be constraining to housing development next night then we look at resources uh what are the resources that we have available to address the housing needs the number one resource that we have to look at is whether you have available sites for future development and that's where it's related to development standards and also um land use policies we have to in the housing element we have to identify sites that are um appropriately zoned um with um with appropriate development standards that can facilitate and encourage a variety of housing types for all income groups in your community we also look at what are the financial capacity resources that you have to um um facilitate the development of affordable housing and also um important public private partnerships because there's a local jurisdiction again you cannot function as a developer but you can work with developers private and and non-profit or market rate developers in order to provide housing in your community and also like the work of some non-profit organizations that may be providing some supportive services next slide in order to kind of um come up with your next eight years of housing actions we obviously look at the needs that you have we look at the constraints that you you you're um you're facing we look at the resources you have available but we also want to look at what works and what doesn't work in your community what was the housing element actions that were included in your previous housing element the fifth cycle housing element and whether those programs are working or not in looking at the city what the city was able to achieve over the last eight years or so um you as even as a small city you you were able to achieve quite a bit you um updated your commercial zoning to include mixed use practically in in most of your um commercial categories uh you have also adopted objective design standards in order to streamline review and approval of projects um you have commissioned prototypes for ad u buildings so that it would allow homeowners to utilize those um uh pre-approved um kind of plans it doesn't mean that the project is pre-approved but the plans would give them um a head start in terms of designing their ad use in the community you have also created um like adu guidance for the public and also updated your inclusion of a policy um you've helped um mobile home um uh rehab programs to actually provide for rehab location of some mobile homes and then provide down payment assistance now those are more limited compared to what you had anticipated mainly because of the lack of funding um we are including programs in the housing element to really pursue additional funding in the future uh you have also created um a 36 unit 100 percent affordable housing project next slide so in this upcoming eight years of housing element the housing action plan has seven housing goals the first six of them is similar to what you have right now because you've been successful in implementing some of your programs and and the goal seems to be really aligning with the community vision but what we did have to add is the affirmatively furthering fair housing goal which is a new requirement of state law which um then the affirmatively furthering um fair housing really actually um requires local jurisdictions to look at um the housing policies and and and regulations in a very different um uh in an equity kind of lens and so this additional goal um is new to the housing element next slide in terms of the facilitating housing production uh we um Katie will go into that a little bit further but we have identified sites that would that are based on the current the city's existing zoning and general plan we do not anticipate any need to rezone our up zone properties um at this time but there is a new requirement when it comes to providing adequate sites and and facilitating development there's a requirement to replace um housing that's demolished um if the housing is occupied or de-restricted for lower income households we have um you have a fairly robust um adu um environment and also the city has been doing quite a bit to foster that and so um we have programs to make sure that the city will continue to promote and facilitate adu's and mixed use development um one thing that we also looked at is other alternative types of housing in your community what can the city do in the future to look at alternative types of housing that may be appropriate to your community maybe such as co-housing um um micro units um and some other um type of housing that you may be interested in the future uh in terms of facilitating affordable housing development we have to continue the program of mobile home park assistance and preservation of the rental housing those are important in your community because um capitol in general your housing prices high so preserving what you currently have as affordable housing is very important it's expensive to build affordable housing um we also want to um encourage the use of housing choice vouchers and also um incentivize the development of affordable housing in your community through um of a variety of incentives such as density bonus um we want to continue the community outreach throughout the whole process of um the housing element implementation so public outreach doesn't stop with the adoption of the housing element as the city continues to implement the actions um there are additional commitments in this housing element that the city will continue to conduct um outreach and education we also have um the inclusionary housing ordinance and housing trust funds continuing that program because that is one of the probably the key resource that the city has uh without redevelopment this is the one key resource that you have in generating some income uh in all revenue in order to facilitate affordable housing in the future next slide um as i mentioned before that uh you you have this there are special groups that have more difficulty accessing affordable and decent housing so we have a group of programs that address special housing needs um in some of them are relating to complying with state law particularly with zoning regulations such as emergency shelters transitional and supportive housing um employee housing and housing for persons with disability employee housing in here um um deals with employees um housing that's for employee six of fewer employees um and farm neighbors if they're but um you know if there is that such need um definitely also addressing the housing needs for extremely low income households this is also a special needs groups because um um people at the extremely low income who are earning about 30 percent of the area median income they have more difficulty in accessing affordable housing and in order to facilitate um housing for families large households and also um housing for um um female head of households uh with the expectation that a lot of their new housing is going to be located in uh commercial areas um so the city have some policies relating um to um um uh encouraging development of child care and daycare facilities in in more of the commercial corridors uh housing assistance um there are as we talked about there are some households that have more difficulty accessing affordable housing so providing rental housing and home buy assistance uh it's important um the city does have access to some programs available through the county and through the state um to provide assistance to these households and um you will see that also um there is a fairly um um um detailed uh fair housing programs this time compared to your current housing element there are specific actions that the city will take from a fair housing perspective to provide education and outreach to facilitate mobility meaning allowing people to move to different parts of the city and have choices in terms of locations and types to increase housing opportunities throughout the city to have targeted improvements in specific neighborhoods and also to provide tenant protection and anti-displacement um policy so those are the key um programs that we have included and and some are news um some are continued from your current housing element next slide so one thing we talked about earlier and you've probably seen this slide many many times already one thing we talked about um is that you have to provide adequate sites to facilitate and encourage a variety of housing types in your community the the way to measure that requirement under state law is the your ability to accommodate the regional housing needs assessment and in this particular round the six cycle housing element our regional housing needs allocation is almost 10 times um than what you had back in the fifth cycle and that is certainly a challenge in identifying sites but um but the city staff um and um brett has been um very active in in what diligently identifying sites that are under current zoning and general plan and and we do not again we do not anticipate any rezoning necessary um with that i'm going to turn it over to um katie and she's going to go over the sites inventory again but i do want to emphasize that the the rena regional housing needs allocation is a planning goal meaning that we have to identify sites it's not a production obligation because the city cannot function as a developer you you don't have the ability to control the market and and and and all that but we do the state does use density as a as a proxy to whether some a site is feasible to facilitate lower income um or modern income as well and primarily focusing on lower income there is a default density that we have to um meet in order to to have a site considered to be feasible for lower income with that i will turn it back to katie thank you um so we have a couple slides of the site's inventory in case there's any questions or comments that come up this evening to discuss um but again we've we've we've heard comments of we need to distribute this more evenly throughout capitol us we in the last update after our joint meeting with planning commission and city council i think we um met that goal we got it we furthered that goal um and this is just an aerial map showing the sites as well um this slide breaks down the different zones and how many of the end of how many of the different income levels are associated with each zone and i think one thing that is apparent here is that we're really there's a focused um within our mixed use neighborhoods and our regional commercial and community commercial centers to really bring housing closer to our main transportation centers as well um and our shopping areas to really decrease vehicle miles traveled which is a shared goal for the environment and then when it comes to our single family residential you know i i i think the numbers we're going to surpass what we have in here with 80s alone where but the state really looks at what our adu trends are and they won't let us project it higher with it has to be projected um on the average trend but as recently we came to you and informed you that since november of last year we've had 14 adu applications so and i heard uh this week we received another so it's we're trending up and so i do think our single family homes which are mostly on this side of town will be taking will be developing more of the housing stock than estimated in these graphs so next steps the public review draft is out um it'll conclude on june 10th then we have a 15 day city response period um and it's not like your formal eir where you respond to every comment but it's we take the comments and work and try to better the documents we were working on the document we won't be directly reaching out to everyone that commented but those comments will make it into the packet that goes to hcd to see that we've addressed comments um planning commission and city council that's our meeting tonight and next week next thursday at six p.m actually um yeah six p.m for that meeting and then we'll be submitting it to the hcd public hearings in the fall i did send out a request by email for a special meeting in october just looking ahead it's the third third thursday in october i hope you all have that saved in your calendars and then our statutory deadline is by december 15th so with that that concludes my presentation i really appreciate those it's a very long document uh when you take into consideration the appendices and um so i really appreciate my team working um with bret and veronica has been amazing they're they've been on task and got it to us on time so a lot of appreciation there but thank you planning commission for taking the time to review the document if you have simple edits you're welcome to bring them up tonight but if you have a list of like spelling mistakes or simple edits that we could hold off on those tonight and those could be emailed to me at a later time tonight we're really looking for comments from the public and the commission um regarding this document and uh so that we can respond to it during the response time so thank you and i look forward to hearing comments sure thank you um i'll try and be as brief as possible but i have some notes here um first of all i wanted to um thank katie and the consultants for all the work i'm the reporter as more and more i read i just appreciated all the detail um and all i mean it was amazing to look at our city and a whole different perspective from a document so that was great so thank you for all that um so a couple questions i had um first one was um um it talks about capital is fairly high population density and everything um and it says compared to others in the cities in the state do you have any like is there like when it says it's fairly high population densely what you know how does that really measure out across the state um we could add that we could get more specific in that description as uh in the document we're very clear that we are the most dense of the cities within the santa cruz um county so we'd be happy to add that to the document and find some comparable cities coastal cities all right um the next one in paragraph three on page 144 um um it talks um the report could the report also reflect the goal uh for the city to have workforce housing we talked about affordable housing but um you know i think we've heard a lot about workforce housing and i think it would be nice to highlight that as something as a goal for the city um on that paragraph three on page 145 i didn't see that noted as what i think if that's something you guys look at to see if that's the right place for that to be noted sure um the next one was um on page 312 um uh well on page 26 but then also there's some notes about it on page 312 it talks about the transportation um the metro and stuff um should we include a part in there about the grant that was just passed um recently um you know in that it's notes it talks about that there's four electric buses i think that's the number they threw out but you know they're going over to hydrogen and stuff because the report talks about how bad the environment is um and air quality and stuff and i think it might be nice to maybe update i know that was just passed recently but maybe that can be reflected in the report and so so we read this you know at another level at a different time they can understand that it's not just our city but also the county's taking steps towards that yes i'll bring our consultant up to date with the recent all right um one thing on page 100 it talks about the typical permit process time for the city of capitol you know to encourage development just speaking from a personal level doing being a contractor and doing development we should be you know it the i think our city should be applauded by the turnaround time permits are here um i work on many other jurisdictions especially over the hill 10 months 12 months 14 months and osa so i think it should be applauded by how quick the staff and your outside consultants do turnaround permits and so i uh i appreciate that just from from being a contractor i appreciate that turnaround time but also i think our community should appreciate how efficient that you and your department run the next thing on page 104 it talks about traffic constraints should we also know in the report about the new improvements that are happening on highway one right now they talk about it talks about the improvements from made in 2017 and stuff and i thought you know with the new and i don't know what the exact dollar amount was but the shoulder blessing and i don't know what the exact terminology is but it'd probably be nice to have that reflected that's on the shoulder yep yeah blessing yeah thank you also on page 104 um it talks about water supply and infrastructure i was wondering if we should talk about um and have a reflect what so cal water districts doing with the recharge station that they're putting um again i don't know the exact word so clean water or what's the yeah pure water so cal thank you um i know that's an amazing project that they're putting in place and um and talking to their staff i mean they think that's going to solve a lot of our water issues coming up in the future um sorry i just have a couple more um uh under um you know the city council just at last city council meeting took some action on rank control and i think that'd be great to have that noted somewhere in the report um that the rank control for the um not just the cabrillo mobile home but i think he was also addressing other mobile home like remember correctly um just one small quick thing sorry just on page two on question 20 on page 212 it just doesn't have a date it has just xx so um if we can just pick up that wherever date they're talking about on that meeting and then on page 325 325 it talks about the parks in figure 48 and i didn't see noted that the jade street park was highlighted um and maybe i just missed that but if we can just reflect that and then just in summary of questions um in the air numbers it talks about you know on the western part of capitol there's about 1,350 units and on the eastern side of capitol there's talking about 227 um i don't know if you know off the top of your head or if it could be maybe uh looked at but if you know with on the um west side the number being at the 1350 how many of those units are exactly at the mall and so when we look at what the number really is i've heard the comment from a lot of people in the community about making sure that this has been distributed equally across the city if i know the mall's still on that side but if we took that part of it out because there's an opportunity there what are the numbers per se between the one side to the other side if the mall part was taken out so i don't know if you know that off the top of your head or maybe that i don't know if it should be highlighted but i just hear that a lot and then i try to explain to them that a lot of those numbers are at the mall so those are all the comments that i had out of the report but it was very detailed and thank you for all your work thank you this i think it's 850 at the mall so then that that number drops down to uh 500 compared to the two two seven correct so about twice and just to note um in the last cycle you know we had 600 park at we also had the development on hill street where so there were more units on this side of capitola the last two cycles um but it's odd it'd be an administrative approval if we were to keep those sites in right now because they've been in the in the housing element for two cycles and if they were included in the next housing element so just when you're when you're having those conversations you can also explain to folks that in the past it was actually that we had more on this side but if we reutilized those sites one we haven't seen any interest by those developers to redo those sites and two if we did use those sites um it's more risk to the city i guess in terms of review process but thank you for that question yeah so i'd like to echo the comments about the uh the report i think it's very thorough you know extremely well done i think you've updated a lot of things based on some of the feedback we've gotten um in my review of hcd's comments and maybe Veronica can answer this question throughout the state because we're in the second wave of cities going through this whole we're gonna roll um the majority of the rejection seem to be on the basis of properties that are just the cities are proposing but they're just not um they're not likely to be developed in the cities in the state's viewpoint right there several culver's city i think got nailed on that several in the bay area also were rejected and i go back again to my insistence that the mall is our number one thing um and i was looking for a more positive statement here about commitments to mall development but maybe i missed it i don't know if we have anything we can say that we are doing we along the lines of by this date we will do this um to try to convince the hcd folks in Sacramento that we are serious about the mall development because it's been stalled for quite a while yes yeah not want to get rejected this time around because we didn't you know pay attention to that element of this thing so i don't i don't know if that Veronica if you have any comments about that and what you've seen in other jurisdictions i can quickly just because Veronica's not aware of this our city council has directed us in the um coming year there's money in the budget to really um we'll be studying the most effective way to get them all to redevelop so we've got 25 000 to put into a study to see what what is our our best alternatives in order to help redevelop them all so that that's something that Veronica can add to this document to state that we're we are engaged we do we want to see redevelopment and we're still we're starting to study it so um but Veronica with that do you have additional comments uh yeah i think you know the council um the the client commissioner is definitely true um getting the substantial evidence that existing uses would not impede the development i think that's important but i think the city staff has been in communication with um the mall and and i think adding to this study would be a good um demonstration i think um as we move closer to the review and you know um submitting the housing element we can also look at what additional um kind of more concrete action that the city can take to facilitate that but that's a very good point um it is the most difficult task this round with the housing element and that's the reason why so many jurisdictions are still stuck but i think that's a very good start that the city have with the the feasibility study or however you want to call that yeah because be blunt this thing's going to get reviewed by some bureaucrat and Sacramento that doesn't know anything about capitol so the more concrete things we can put in here to show that we're we are doing the best we can to develop this mall redevelop this mall i think that would help uh get this thing through the state um that's i think we've done a good job of trying to spread it out over the city and address that comment that we've got all over the place but you know we're you're sort of limited by geography and i think that's that's it from my side oh i would just like to ask one quick mall question since we're on that topic before we go down to this end of the table so um at one point in time the city had a million dollars leftover from when the city had redeveloped redevelopment agency that is dedicated to the mall and i believe the city still has that money available and uh i was wondering if it would be appropriate because we all know that you know affordable housing is going to have to be a part of any mall development uh if it would make some sense to dedicate if not all of that money a portion of that money to you know help subsidize affordable housing on the mall when i was on the finance advisory committee last year i asked you malibu about that and he says you lose we have lost the money i may be wrong but i just i recall i will i'll double check on that we'll find out about that but if we have it it seems like spend it it it it might help us and yes okay so um i wasn't sure how to read this document you know and it's glad you mentioned that we were not going over the spelling errors and things because i had a lot of questions about those but fortunately i was able to talk to brian and get a lot of those things addressed but i did have one major comment and that is the executive summary so my understanding is that again was going to be reviewed by some bureaucrat in uh at the hcd sure very confident and but doesn't know about um uh capitola and so i've written a lot of documents and submitted them to customers throughout my career and the executive summary is is a very important and it talks to paul's point which is we need to point out the good things we're doing in terms of cooperating and making big strides towards um towards uh meeting our requirements and the place to highlight those and get them fresh on everybody's mind is in the executive summary so when they see them again deep in the document at page 486 they say oh yeah i'm you know so you know for example the mall that should be highlighted in the executive summary all the things we're going to do about that um you know the fact that we've already approved high density um so we're you know we're already proactively make so you could probably go through the list of of things that are really you know we think are important that we really accomplishments we have done and are doing pull them forward and pop them in the executive summary so that um so that this bureaucrat will have it fresh of his mind um so uh other comments um i was thinking about the the development of 41st street like so so we have a high density along 44 excuse me 41st street that's a that's a good corridor there's a lot of reasons why we want to develop that and it occurs to me that perhaps uh since we also have a rail trail activity going on that we might suggest to the RTC or get at least in their mind that maybe we could have a rail spur going down 41st avenue down the median that would suddenly bring transportation to all the development where we're getting and i'm not saying that that's a necessarily practical idea but if it's a trolley um that they can they can spin off of that and um you just put it in the in the RTC's mind that hey start looking at this this this could be really this could really help with our transportation needs and help with the low-income people get around get to Watsonville get to Santa Cruz so i thought that was at least something that that we can maybe toss forward to the city council or the RTC and say well there's something we can do uh that's not just zoning it's it's actually proactively getting getting an environment for low-income housing um i was going through the document on numbers i uh saw that the on page 311 there was a reference to uh variance on height variance that went up to 50 feet and that seemed to be inadequate to me that uh especially when i do a development on the all and we weren't and we're going to go from 623 units to 850 units and they want to have parking on site that that's you know we're talking three four five six stories i don't know how long how high it's going to be but we don't want to we don't want to discourage that right and also we have the units on a park avenue which are have higher density um we see i have the i have the page number on that but it's the one that has 32 cubic du per ac 32.6 those are that's a three story and so i'm sure that's those are over 50 feet as well and i would think we would want to encourage the the high density units um and so and so things like the the 50 feet seem to be inconsistent with what we want to do as well and then there was also on page five seven no no what was it on somewhere similar question on on parking let's see yeah page 312 table 3 table 312 um there's a parking variance that which is another thing that might be needed to be updated because again on capitolo road we just approve something with minimal parking i don't know whether that exceeds our parking variance or not but we should go through this again and make sure that we are that our numbers and our variances are large enough so that so that the big projects that are going to encourage density and and low-income housing um meet those requirements um the other um i guess the rest of the questions are more in the typo kind of question so i'll i'll just leave it at that um i i think this is a great comprehensive long exhaustive um report um i especially like the provisions that be outlined with the homelessness and and emergency services um i agree with emphasizing um about the model projections but i think that's about i think you've got a lot of it covered i'll i'll email you a list of iphone things that i found in the document so we don't take up time with that right now um one of the comments i wanted to make is um i guess in looking at the fees that we charge for someone to build a housing unit in capitolo right now you know i was a little surprised that you know before you could even put shovel in the ground it's going to cost you basically a hundred and eighteen thousand dollars in fees to build a new residential unit and um one of the bigger fees in there is actually the affordable housing impact fee which the city has adopted itself and in going and because i did read that ordinance today because i was a little interested in it it seems like that particular fee is not going to generate a tremendous amount of money because it talks about you know new housing uh going in basically on a vacant lot because if you're carrying down a house and building a new house the fee doesn't apply you're doing an addition that's you know doesn't increase the square footage of the existing house more than 50 percent it doesn't apply i mean there are all these exceptions in there so i'm sort of scratching my head and going you know how how many times are are we going to collect this fee and then we we don't collect any fees for you know parks transportation um administration you know the whole list goes on and um while we probably don't want to do it at this point in time and this housing element because of our time constraint seems to me we want to look hard at you know what kind of fees we're charging because that certainly has an impact on how many units get developed and since we're going to have um you know additional units provided in town we also want to make certain that our town provides services for those units i mean is it appropriate to you know have a child care fee because we talk about you know the problems that one has in childhood is it appropriate to have a park's fee because certainly with housing becoming more dense and less open space uh you know parks in recreation are going to become you know one of our key components so i would just like to see um you know the city look at that idea in the future uh and i would like to express as everyone else has thanking particularly our staff as well as the consultants on how well this whole process is going i mean anyone who reads this document has to be impressed by the amount of information that's included in it the thoughtfulness that's gone into it and uh we really appreciate all all of the work that you have done we appreciate that and Veronica and Brett have been amazing at our staff so thank you yeah i mean i've seen a lot of housing elements over the years and this is certainly one of the better thorough more accurate ones i've seen in a long time so are there anything else you need from us as a commission nope that that's it i really appreciate how much time i have one more comment you'd like to me and our last meeting we talked about um looking at a couple of sites that were um was that what's the process in that or is that so um we've identified two sites um i've heard from both property owners that they're okay with us utilizing those sites one is across the street from 4401 capitol the road the other is uh the sporting goods store that was on 41st avenue so the process there is it's really um there'll be minimum uh interaction with the property owner we'll get some some input initially from them but then it's really our and we'll take the steps to kind of figure out with what we've developed in our housing element what could fit on that site so and be able to show what you know how it would fit on that site do you have anything to add to that bret i think you're on mute sorry about that yes that's a good assessment we're working with our architecture team on the concepts that are in line with the projected units and the housing element constraints and bullets we are we're we're realizing um with our contract with all the work that's going into this there's definitely um there's more work than they anticipated so i i would like to understand how important those build out scenarios are to the planning commission um to keep this in budget we could possibly just do one site so that um because we're just or um if you'd like the two sites i think i just i need to go back to city council to ask for a little more money to keep us within budget so is there uh is there a i'm not sure i can follow the yeah so so this is one of those this was kind of an optional item when we um when it wasn't part of the scope when we had put it out for bid but our um included this in their work and they're known for their design and be and this is a big component of what they do um so i thought it was important for the public to kind of see how these how projects could be built out and how this density could be achieved on a site but as we're running as we're going through this process um i've asked them to do extra hearings because i think it's really important that we have Veronica and Brett at these meetings so we're the budget for this we're starting to go a little bit beyond this the budget because of additional needs um so we've had one amendment made in order to do that joint session with the planning commission and city council which was a great meeting but it start you know there's there's some items that we're realizing that for all these public hearings it's really important to have the whole team present and so we can either like stay on budget and remove one of the two buildout scenarios or um i can go to city council and talk about this this project and possible need for more funding so my recollection was that we were unanimously all in favor of the one site uh the old outdoor world location we had sort of split opinions on on what the second site so for me personally i would be fine with doing the one that we all sort of agreed we wanted to do i don't think there's that would that keep us on budget then if we had just one i'll need to talk with them about it but that that was one idea i had of maybe if we cut one of those how we can save a little money there so i i agree i agree i think that would be really illustrative to see such a um especially a project that's been discussed before and see how the density would apply to you know specific site i'll i'll pursue that avenue and see yep and with that i don't think we have anything else for you on that subject matter and we don't take any action tonight so can i ask one more let's receive our comments can i ask one more question k sure um uh last meeting you were asking if we found any additional sites potential sites if they're i mean it's not a given it's not a big vacant lot or a vacant commercial building say it's a currently occupied space are those still fair game they are if they're like recently redeveloped or if they have modeled or stories they maybe not so it really it has to be one that's feasible but if you if you have some please email me and let me know and we'll take a look okay okay thank you okay so we'll move on to the directors okay i have a few updates for you first update which is kind of the biggest news is um the the rent control ordinance was passed there was an emergency ordinance passed at city council last week and we're going we also are doing a regular ordinance with a first and second reading and the second reading will happen next week so if you'd like i can bring you an overview at some point we're we're um it was really a fast and furious effort to get that across the finish line because rents were expected to increase today cabrillo but this isn't just written for cabrillo it applies uh citywide um so we're putting together right now kind of a a cheat sheet on what the ordinance means for the residents of capitola and it'll be in english and spanish hoping to have that out possibly by the end of next week so our city attorney's office is working on that the other big update we've all i've had quite a few inquiries from planning commission in the past to keep you up to date on the kaiser project and they've actually withdrawn their application at this point kaiser has decided to refocus their energy into their existing locations and do improvements throughout the county at existing buildings so that project that was on the frontage road is has now been withdrawn um we received or we we recently approved uh our first sp9 application this is located at 204 holister the small red buildings up on depot hill that property um one of the that was actually it's two properties the property to the left sold previously and is going to be a single family home with an adu the property on the right 204 brought in an sp9 project to subdivide the lot into two lots and they're going to keep two of the units towards the i believe towards the front and then uh redevelop and have two and a new duplex or two single lots up to 800 square feet towards the back so um it's interesting uh we're going to learn a lot from this and as we go through the process i can it won't come to you for review but i really want to show you some of the things we put in place and how it's affecting how they're going to build this um so that's interesting uh on on june 22nd at the next city council uh there's going to be a presentation on 10 98 38th avenue by mid pen they've come to they've bought a piece of property next to the rail trail for affordable housing and uh they're coming to the city council to ask for funding towards the planning of the project and so i just wanted to make sure you're all aware of that and to tune in it won't come to planning commission until we actually have either a conceptual review application or a review but i think they'll they'll give a glimpse of what they're thinking for the site i think it's going to have a lot of uh the oriented towards the future rail trail which is just three years out it looks like um on july 20th this is letting you know what's happening what we're expecting so we've this is one at the time of year when we um because of july fourth we're going to meet on the third thursday of the month in july so that's july 20th and in august it'll be the same we'll meet on the third thursday um but at the july 20th hearing right now we don't have much on the agenda we have uh the color materials board discussion which we got an indication of that tonight during the discussion on the outdoor dining of color materials uh we have an application at 4805 crystal and this is for an adu correction 4805 crystal is an adu in addition for an adu so that'll be coming to you we also may have code enforcement for both uh reef dog and castignolas uh due to uh non-compliance with outdoor dining so hopefully those will be in compliance and not on the agenda and at this point we're just unsure with the other projects because there's a lot of um incomplete applications that we need things to come back in in order to make it to a planning commission agenda so um with that that concludes my report so now we go to commission comments um just one thing um i i think i talked about in the last city council uh last planning commission meeting um are we able to talk about the issue um with the obscured window that it seems like every time or was that ruled that it was a code issue um it is a requirement of the code but we can talk about it that we can definitely talk about it just might have to be an amendment to the code at a future time um yeah if we talk about that at the same time i'd love to agree thank you uh i i just had one comment i wanted to say i think i've always thought being a planning commissioner is one of the more difficult problems in the city because we are really you know restricted by a whole lot of rules about how we look at projects who we can talk to about a project you know how that whole system works and um i think it's difficult because you have members of the community approach you or you know you we want to not appear that we're you know bureaucrats who won't listen to and i i have come to recognize over the years that one of the reasons those rules are there is that we really do need to treat every applicant the same way every business in the village needs to be treated with the same act and so um i apologize if you think you know not letting um the guy from the ill place talk or you know us our inability to deal with the reef dog issue it's just that if we if we are going to follow the Brown Act and follow the rules which i think that we need to do that just the way it is i would have had to recuse myself from the reef dog discussion anyway i might not have remembered that you know anyway i appreciate your leadership on that i mean any advice yes one we should be discussing things all right with that our meeting is adjourned and we'll see everybody next month thank you