 I'll call the ninth regular meeting of the Common Council order so which please call the roll Bowman excuse D-Burg e-Burg Serta Davis graph Kittleson Manny Meyer Montemay or Ratke Sigali Stefan Sushia Van Akron and Vander wheel 15 present forms present approval the minutes are asked for a motion to approve Olderman graph. Thank you your honor I would move that we approve that we dispense with the reading of the minutes of the previous meeting and the same stand approved is entered on the record There's a motion to second any discussion Not all those in favor state I I you oppose motion carries Pledge of Allegiance I'd ask all them in my order to please join us lead us I Pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic For which it stands one nation under God Indivisible with liberty and justice for all Thank You all in the Meyer Before we move on to the public forum. There's an announcement I'd like to make to the Common Council and that is at the special meeting that was scheduled for Wednesday has been canceled Until further notice I received notice from the people who were involved in the presentation that they were unable to Put the presentation together in time and a day asset we cancelled it So that's a reason for canceling so there will be no special meeting on Wednesday Public forum Sue First on the list would be Susan Hunley and Susan. Can you give me your home address, please an avenue? And you will have five minutes. Thank you very much I'm here again to speak tonight about the formation of a room tax commission. I Will be repeating quite a bit of what I said at the finance committee, but Excuse me. Thank you mayor and council for allowing me the opportunity to speak tonight For those ultra persons that were not present for at the finance committee. I do feel several points are important One thing that I did hand out at the finance committee and I do apologize I had planned on getting a packet together for Sue to put in your Agenda or your package tonight, but I did have a daughter get married on Saturday, so I was a little busy in the packet that I did hand out to the Finance committee last Monday night evening was a letter signed by all 11 lodging properties in the city Sheboygan that pay room tax supporting the formation of a room tax commission and The commission would then receive the room tax rather than right now You say that as a common culture act as the commission which really by state statute is not the way to do it you can either have an in-house tourism director or you can Have a room tax commission which we have proposed and all of us have supported those of us in lodging now I've heard repeatedly several people say that it's very important for the police to have input on Where the police station should be built because they are the experts while we feel the same way in lodging and tourism we really do feel that we have a great lots of great ideas and We keep a current pulse on what brings tourism to our area So that's why we feel we should have a say in this not to control but to actually help the promotion of Sheboygan I'm going to try to jump down. I'm sorry to take this with some of the Miss and I did point this out last week about a room tax commission is that we want every penny to come to us And we'd control everything that's not really true the room tax commission would of course allow the city to keep what is Allowed by state statute which would be the 80 20 split and Then we would contract with the CVB to spend the money. We feel it should go directly to the CVB We do not feel the chamber needs to take a percent especially for salary for their director We feel Denny Moyer is very competent But the CVB would meet and I know last week it was pointed out after I spoke that I didn't have a good plan Well, that wasn't if I gave that impression that wasn't true We've talked extensively in lodging about this what I meant to say is until we find out when Denny Moyer does have to attend trade shows and so forth and we have five months from today that we could easily have our plan in place for you and Another myth was that civic Functions would disappear if the commission exists that definitely is not true We would enhance it like the the example I gave was and actually Looking at Alderman Eldenburg now reminds me of his carousel and I did tell him that's such a great idea I I think we you know could become known as the community that has a carousel a lot of people would come They would be at that ban Function, so you know, I'm not saying it would happen overnight, but we would enhance we wouldn't detract We want people to come here. We want this and own tourists Destination one thing that was pointed out is that the chamber has not followed the contract for the four years And a lot of it had to do with promoting the city of Sheboygan itself Well as you acted as the commission rather than having a true room tax mission It was your fault, too You let this fall by the wayside for four years nobody nobody Caught it and tell Susan Hart did an extensive study and was able to show where the contract had not been followed I do believe the room tax should go to promote Sheboygan I think we have a lot to promote in the city if they come to golf at Kohler Kohler is only a mile away if they're in this area one time I don't think they're going to miss opportunity to go to our lakefront We have an art center that's considered one of the top five in the nation with boardwalk Maywood Symphony we have things to do year-round, so I really do believe that an idea is a zone commission if we want to have the CBB promote the city and the county they can form a zone commission what we have to do is at the same room tax as The other people in the commission right now we're the high-end at 8% so if we did have a 6% and Use that for tourism promotion Maybe the county then excuse me. I'm out. I'm sorry That's okay. Thank you very much. You're welcome Next on the list is Dan Verhasselt Dan, could you give me your home address, please? It's 705 fairway drive And you will have five minutes I'd like to thank everybody for their time tonight It's been a while since I've been in front of the council and I'm glad to say that it's under drastically different terms And it probably has over the last 12 months been I'd like to take a few minutes tonight just to thank this council for what they've done and saving shared in park But also inform them about the revitalization efforts that have been taking place in the four months or three months since shared in park has come off the chopping block The revitalization of shared in park is taking place in a lot of different ways. I think the first Focus of it was to answer a lot of the concerns of some of the neighbors in the area and that was to do with safety Number one a lot of the brush has been cleared on the east side of the park Which a number of people have mentioned it's been along with City Hall and May line They've worked together nicely to clear a lot of the brush away. Secondly security camera has been placed in the park Thirdly simple things like picnic tables fryers and grills have been placed in the park for the first time in a number of Years and have been there all summer Sounds simple, but the fact is they haven't been there in the past in the recent past shared in park is being revitalized in a lot of other ways as well The friends of Sheboygan's parks held their first annual fourth fast at shared in park on this past 4th of July Being the primary organizer of the event. I have to admit. I was a bit nervous But I am glad to say that we had over 300 people who were there to enjoy food music and fireworks If you haven't been there to watch the fireworks, I'd encourage you this is the place in the city to watch fireworks It's really a spectacular view and you can see largely all the fireworks Because of its success. We're actually organizing next year's event already The friends of Sheboygan's parks are also looking to launch a children's festival later this year In addition the friends of Sheboygan's parks Continue their fundraiser many donations have been received so far and with these funds our group hopes to be Presenting this council with the request later this summer for some equipment for shared in park I would specifically like to think the Sheboygan press and WHBL for their help to date on advertising this fund drive campaign Also with the help of city hall the Sheboygan police department and the friends of Sheboygan Park Neighborhood watch discussions have begun and are ongoing to develop in the shared in neighborhood The sometimes heated shared in parks over the last 12 months have produced many broader benefits as well for the community Number one a board of park and forestry has been developed and as chairman of the commission I plan to make every effort possible not only to protect and improve our parks, but to grow our city park system It's a fact that parks add to our quality of life and I want to be a part of that Also another side effect has been a grassroots citizen group Friends of Sheboygan's Park has been developed and to become involved with city politics And I think anytime citizens or citizen groups get involved with their government. That's a good thing Vicky Hall co-chair of the group has been organizing city park tours in addition to that at various city parks To educate and help people learn that he is to recreate within our city park system, and that's being met with great success I would lastly like to thank well one last note our upcoming park tours at King Park this coming Saturday 11 o'clock And everybody here is welcome to attend Lastly, I'd like to thank Mayor Perez and his entire staff for all that they've done on the first four months in office To make Sheboygan a better place to live Talk there is no longer talk of destroying parks But talk of improving parks and ultimately when we improve parks we improve quality of life With this council's help I hope to be here in the future talking about more park successes shared in park was a wake-up call But I think it's going to prove to be a great template for this city to use and revitalizing other city parks and neighborhoods. Thank you Thank you, Dan Next on the list of Jason Shane Jason, can I get your home address, please? 1418 a bluff Avenue. I like to thank the mayor and comic council for giving me a chance to speak Tonight. I'm very concerned with your decision. I'm putting such a high cap of 17 million dollars to build a new police station We don't need a Saddam palace We need a police station. I have some questions the taxpayers asked me while I was doing the petition drive for a referendum On this issue number one. I was wondering if you noticed how many houses are up for sale due to our high taxes I'd like you to know your elder men to know That you are pushing the citizens out of their houses due to outstanding high taxes I'd like you to know there's a lot of citizens on set incomes that cannot afford keeping their taxes going up Why are we asking the police department where to put the police station? You should be the ones to choose to cite for the best interest of the taxpayers They're the ones who have to pay for it You elder men have to remember you're in these seats because The taxpayers put you there not the police department I would like to ask the finance department if we really could afford this kind of money for a police station You elder may need to answer these questions for the taxpayers that put you in these seats There are a few elder persons that forgot That the taxpayers put them into these seats as you could tell the attendance at the public input meeting was not good Some of you elder persons left early or weren't even there Thanks. Thank you, jason Next on the list is lee montemay or Lee could I have your home address, please? Thank you, sir My address is 1015 logan And you will have five minutes. Thank you madam city clerk mayor council members My sub's a little different I would like to talk about the parks, but I've been kind of Railroad in that get involved with a problem that we have in in the in the city and so my comments are focused on the Overpopulation of goals inside the city limits We are one of many communities have or having this problem It's a boigen problem. It's because we have the goals have decided to nest here Although I cannot give you an instant solution That would rectify the overpopulation of goals in one certain area I can give you my opinion on a plan to reduce the population of goals It would require a process to be followed for a number of years until the reduction goal has been reached Maybe to the point that this governing body May be required To have these landowners maintain their properties so that to discourage the goals from missing on their properties I would like to thank mr. Ben Nelson of the wildlife special the wildlife Specialists for the usda that provided us with the valuable information of the laws and studies of these birds His attention of our problem is greatly appreciated Let me start by saying that these goals are protected by law Secondly that the areas in question are on private property And I'm going to give you five basic Facts on this thinking the first is that the areas in question Our own private owned lands and they should be addressed as that The goals were in these areas long before we developed the areas for humans Now because the net goals are nesting in these areas They have become a troublesome issue another fact female gulls lay between two and four eggs a year And are likely to return to the same area each year At this rate If the eggs all hatch one gull Could possibly increase to five gulls in just one year Now we know one of the reasons for the large populations The hatch chicks start reproducing the second year of their life And are likely to return to the same areas to reproduce year after year Assuming a low mortality rate The original gull that started laying of eggs could possibly turn into 2400 24 gulls by the third year Now if you multiply that by an example of 100 gulls You got 2400 gulls in three short years Now you got a big problem In an area and if the general public Is there it could be a health issue Our city has enacted a new a new no feeding of gulls ordinance But we may need to implement further measures to control the gull problem Simple not feeding or scaring the gulls for a few minutes Or not productive enough My personal opinion And recommendation would be to have these landowners start a humanely controlled process To reduce the gull population The oiling of eggs after they've been laid seems to be a very humane way to control these gulls It would have to be done yearly During the breeding and nesting periods It would take some years to reduce the gull population But it will work if you follow the process I hope my observations research and recommendation Are of some help to this messy gull problem. Thank you Thank you, Lee And next on the list is Carter Paulus And Carter could I have your home address, please 414 Erie Avenue And you will have five minutes. Thank you. Thank you your honor chamber for the opportunity to speak again before you Tonight i'm going to be speaking about our chamber of commerce In attending the last financial meeting, which was a real eye-opener We learned that while they received 76 percent Or over $290,000 of their operating funds from the city They elected to spend only 37 percent Or a hundred and seven thousand three hundred dollars for the city of sheboygan There is such a thing as specific performance concerning contracts And they have not performed per contract Both in spirit And letter Not to mention financially For the city of sheboygan This was fully explained by susan hart our chief administrative officer The result of this has been a serious lack of marketing of the city of sheboygan To the point of it taking A back seat to the chambers short-sighted policies And stubborn resolve To continue its own way to the city's detriment Many of our city's public and beneficial groups Not to mention our local business community Have had to struggle with little Incorrect Or no publicity at all from the chamber of commerce The finance committee wisely voted not to renew the chamber's contract next year Remember If any business Or any other kind of an entity Got short changed to the tune of 180 thousand dollars like sheboygan did From the chamber you would be in court Before your next breath Where do we go from here? Well paulette enders our director of planning and development gave a superb presentation of where we can go in the future In promoting sheboygan As many other cities do And stands ready and willing to perform for our city We already have the money from the room tax Which will grow We already have the brain power and the technology to run our own program to our city's benefit We already have the combined publicity ideas of our entire city ready to leap into action What we need from you the council Is a unanimous resolution To have the city perform its own needed promotion With the only proviso If you will That the monies collected from the room tax goes to promoting tourism in our city of sheboygan You have a rare opportunity to really start to move this city forward into the future Please let's do it now Thank you very much. Thank you. Carter Next we move on to consent agenda alderman graff Thank you, your honor. Before I get into the consent agenda. I'd like to pull document 949 forward 949 is a resolution authorizing the borrowing from the trust funds of the state of wisconsin the sum of $720,000 For the purpose of constructing and equipping equipping a fire station and for no other purpose At this particular time your honor I would move that the resolution be put upon its passage There's a motion in second to put resolution number 949 upon its passage under discussion There being on so which please call the row Dberg eberg serda davis graff kittleson mani meyer montemay or ratki sagali stefan sushi ben ackron and vander wheel 15 eyes motion carries Alderman graff Thank you, your honor. At this time I'd also like to pull forward item 964 which is a RC a committee report By the city clerk submitting a communication from the shiboyne county chamber of commerce stating their contract desires They would like to see a new room tax agreement for 2006 And the RC recommends that the report of officer officer be placed on file And that the shiboyne county chamber of commerce be notified That the contract for 2006 will not be renewed and will be brought in house I would move that the RC be accepted and adopted and um That the arrow be accepted and placed on file or Just accept an adapter There's a motion to second to accept an adopt 9 64 under discussion I may If you'd all look at The history of room tax That we all received a copy of with our agendas And you turn to um the page that lists The chamber services to include It's about the fifth or sixth page if you look on there And i'm not speaking for the entire finance committee, but I believe this was one of the the big things that we looked at as far as Moving the the directions we did and if you look at Uh what the chamber was supposed to do with their contract that they had approximately four years to do It says coverage for 40 hours a week that was fulfilled Um item two is an interactive website 24 7 with links to the city of shiboyne and bid The websites were not available from the visitor screen And you must go into the chamber's web website To community section in order to see the city shiboyne Item number three is the development printing and distribution of festivals of shiboyne Which was supposed to be a tri-fold that was not fulfilled. That was not done There was supposed to be development and printing and distribution of a shiboyne attractions Tri-fold which was also not done There was supposed to be a retitling of annual visitors guide to shiboyne slash shiboyne county visitors guide That was not done Also Placing harbour center bid brochures in all chamber newcomer packets without charge Currently that is not in the business or residential newcomer packets Annual marketing plan submitted to city each fall not fulfilled the chamber submits an annual report that discusses yearly accomplishments, but no marketing plan The next item is convention and visitors bureau advisory committee composed of 75 percent of city Representation that was done Also, there was develop additional funding for the convention visitors bureau To include other communities supporting tourism with room taxes Chamber cvb Receives 76 percent of its budget from the city room tax dollars Seven percent from other county room tax dollars and from some county entities. They receive nothing Additional chamber responsibilities include provide semiannual written reports to the city detailing services rendered Programs initiated and their impact upon tourism And convention trade within the city for the preceding six months The chamber only provides one written report to the common council and does not break out what the city impact is Also using the city room tax dollars to promote most services directly related To the tourism and convention industry for and on behalf of the city The chamber primarily promotes Sheboygan county in its publications the city of sheboygan is interspersed Throughout the sheboygan county publications the great majority of advertisements paid for by the chamber are for promoting sheboygan county This contract was um Was put into place in january of 2002 and amended um in december 2005 to To include a room tax rate of eight percent the um This has been renewed for one year as of last last year, I believe so the The contract is up for renewal right now. I'm not saying that Chamber did everything wrong because they do an excellent job in in promoting the county, but they are not doing what We as a city expect them to do granted no one from the city looked at this and found this until miss heart Looked up what was what was being done and what was not being done With her recommendation The finance committee voted to uh to move this particular Issue in-house and to work on an in-house If we were a business and if we were operating like a business like many people have said in the past Why doesn't the government run like a business in this particular case if we were a business and had a situation like this We would fire our advertising firm that was doing our advertising for us and find someone new So I wish that I'd hope that all the council members approve This um process to bring this in-house Thank you. Oldly grow up Any further discussion? Oh sarda Thank you your honor. Um, I've also had the opportunity to speak to the chamber and I take exception to some of the things that were pointed out here And I will on a later date share those things because I've also come up with another option because I don't think we can fault the chamber fully Because we haven't they have complied to some of these standards And alderman groth and paulette enders both were acting as representatives on that cvb board And if at any time you took issue with this you had full opportunity to explain your yourself But what I am introducing later on I am and this will be um forwarded to the finance committee Is another option and that is creating a tourism advisory committee And then also giving the chamber the benefit of the delg given the new direction that the city wants to take and therefore I don't feel it's this is adequate time to deal with this issue And I know there's other older persons that feel the same and so therefore i'm going to initiate a three-man hold Okay Please uh note three-man hold almanberg sarda segali For the benefit of the public and the gallery when there's a One three alderman invoke the particular code in our municipal code that allows three alderman to defer any action once On any issue And the discussion ends and that matter will be taken up at the next meeting which may be no earlier than one week That is the way the code reads so at this point we will move on there will be no discussion Three men hold has been in vote and we will move on Alderman groth, thank you your honor Excuse me Alderman susha Thank you. It's a little warmer in here than I expected and i'm not feeling well, so i'm going to excuse myself Alderman susha you are excused Alderman groth Thank you your honor um Then getting back to the consent agenda items 9 1 through 9 17 I would move that our all all our o's be accepted and placed on file All our c's be accepted and adopted We pass the resolutions and general ordinance There's a motion in second under discussion Yes There being none so which please call the roll eberg Surda hi davis graph hi kittleson mani meyer Montemay or wrecky sagali stephan van akron van der wheel and deberg 14 eyes Motion carries Communications and petitions uh 9 18 to 9 25 to be referred reports of officers 9 26 to 9 47 to be referred except for 9 47 if you will please note 9 47 will be referred to salary and grievance not financed resolutions introduced 9 48 people to lie over 9 50 By alderman groth authorizing the establishment of an escrow fund with respect to certain outstanding bonds Alderman groth Thank you your honor um i would move that that resolution be put upon its passage There's a motion in second resolution number 9 50 under its passage under discussion Not please call the roll Surda davis graph hi kittleson mani meyer montemay or wrecky sagali stephan van akron van der wheel deberg and eberg 14 eyes Motion carries 9 51 by alderman groth Authorizing the borrowing of $4,900,000 and providing for the issuance and sell of water utility revenue bonds therefore Alderman groth Thank you that resolution Along with 952 which is a resolution Authorizing the borrowing of $3,595,000 and for providing for the issuance and sale of general general obligations bonds series a for tiff number three and 953 which is A resolution authorizing the borrowing of $3,140,000 And providing for the issuance and sale of general general obligation Refunding bonds Series b. I would move that all three resolutions be put upon their passage Motion to second to put all three resolutions upon its passage Under discussion alderman sagali Thank you, mr. Mayor if alderman grafker, please Explain these and go into a little bit more detail for the people and the general audience of watching tv What all this means to them, please Thank you, mr. Mayor. I would ask that finance director who is here and then I asked that karyl worth who is with cubic Thank you I would ask that the floor be open to her to Suggest the council with those issues. There's a motion to open the floors are second second All in favor state. Aye. Aye. Can you oppose motion carries mr. Gibhart karyl Please Thank you We've been karyl worth of rbc dean and I have been working along with joe trueblood On some of these issues. There's two letters that are on your desk that do outline the issues And karyl will review those with you and So there's some under the water utility of a new project for the reservoir and for refinancing some of the previous issues and then we also have a series of refinancings for our tax incremental financing district number three our business park And also for our general purpose capital improvements and a small amount for tax incremental district number 10, which is our water street district And I'll turn it over to karyl to review with you Thank you I have prepared two memos that address the First of all the two resolutions 950 and 951 Both of those resolutions are for the water utility And what we're doing there Is this as part of a financial plan for the water utility? The water utility issues revenue bonds Revenue bonds are repaid from the revenues generated by that utility. They are not supported by tax levy So what we're doing here is We're refinancing some existing debt of the water utility They have 1989 and 1990 revenue bonds outstanding at very high interest rates. They're over 7 So we're going to refinance those And by doing so we're getting rid of some of the restrictive covenants and in the old resolutions And we're going to start off with a brand new resolution in 2005 That will be for the 4.9 million dollar issue First of all the 1989 bonds Are callable beginning october 15 of 2000 and what that means is that The city has the ability to tell the existing bond holders We are stopping your interest payment on october 15 of 2005 It's about 400 000 outstanding and that interest rate is 7.4 So obviously it's to the city's benefit There's about a possibility of about 60 000 of savings by calling in those bonds Of course when we call in the bonds we have to come up with the money To pay off that 400 000 So some of that is going to come from existing reserve funds that are designated for that purpose that Is in accounts at the utility and some of it we are going to need to issue part of that 4.9 million dollars for We also have 1990 bonds outstanding They are not callable until a year from now october 15 of 2006 That means those bond holders are promised their interest payments until that time So what we're going to do again, we're going to use some utility funds on hand And we're going to create an escrow We're going to buy special governments from the federal reserve That are designated specifically for this type of purpose We take those governments and we place them in an escrow account With an escrow agent And the first resolution at 9 50 That appointed jp morgan trust company as an escrow agent Under an escrow agreement that says we'll take those governments That you buy with utility funds on hand And we will escrow those principal and interest payments until the call date On october 15th, and then they will call the bonds. They will notify the bond holders to turn in their bonds at that time Once that escrow is established and that date would be september 1st of 05 Then they are considered legally defeased. They've been provided for So that means as of that time we will have either provided for the 1989 bonds By some refinancing with with the 4.9 million and utility funds on hand And we will have provided for the 1990 bonds by creating this escrow from utility funds on hand So that pretty much explains what's going on in that first resolution and then that second resolution obviously is related Because the fact that the 4.9 million It's going to as I said provide some of the funds for the refinancing of the 89 bonds It is also going to provide funds for the new reservoir project And any type of engineering expenses that the utility is is experiencing and providing for not only that project But as well as a future intake project Also when you issue revenue bonds You have to provide for a reserve fund So that is part of this 4.9 million because it is not supported from tax levy That's the security for the bond holders. You say well, what happens if you don't have the money if the revenues don't come in in time Well, you have a reserve fund. So that's also part of that 4.9 million So that's money that's just kept by the utility in a special restricted fund and cannot be used for any other purpose So that's what we're doing here with the the resolution that's authorizing the 4.9 million We are not borrowing the money as of today The resolution is authorizing to proceed with a sale And that means that um, I and my staff at dane rousher Will take the this document has an attachment called a notice of sale We will prepare what's called an official statement, which is like a prospectus on the city and the utility and you'll get a copy it looks like a phone book right now and um We distribute that nationwide And we solicit bids on this from underwriters on your bonds nationwide That bidding process will occur on on on august 15th So this resolution is authorizing to proceed with the sale So on august 15th, we would come back to you and say this is the results of our sale We had so many bids here is the lowest bid And then we will also present to you another resolution that incorporates those sale results It will also incorporate all of the covenants that are in a typical revenue bond resolution So that will be the start of a brand new 2005 revenue bond resolution and we will have defeats the 89 and 90 revenue bonds Okay Okay I mean, so golly did that answer your question or do what you wanted to do? Yeah Would you like me to cover the other two resolutions if you okay, um the other memo that I had uh was Related to the um The other two dollar amounts. They're called um general obligation refunding bonds And what we're doing there is simply looking we monitor the city's existing debt And see when we can save you some money And we have um some issues outstanding back from 1991 And 93 that were done for tip three And they're at very high interest rates compared to today's market And so we took a look at um what happens and they're callable remember that term callable october 1 of 05 That means the city now can tell with a 30 day notice to the bond holders. We're not going to pay you interest past past october 1 so We've done some analysis and have found that The city could save um approximately 280 thousand dollars by refinancing Those bonds issued originally for tip three So so that's the first resolution that resolution 952 and again that resolution is setting the sale to occur On august 15. So we're not doing that yet tonight. We're just by that resolution Um authorizing that the sale should take place on august 15th and allowing us to proceed with that process The second resolution or actually the fourth resolution, which would be 953 Is the same type. It's a general obligation financing It's for bonds that were done for Primarily the city capital improvement projects again for the intention of saving money Right now the number is approximately 80 thousand dollars that we would save by refinancing them The reason we have them split apart is because the revenues are coming from different places The bonds issued for tip three have the tip increments coming to pay for that debt service Bonds issued for capital improvement projects have the debt Tax levy paying for those purposes. So when you do the refinancing It's important to keep them separated because they are coming from two different revenues So it's just as the revenue bonds are they're coming from the revenues of the utility So that's kind of a quick summary of um what we're doing Oh maddie. Thank you. I just want to point out For people listening on tv that the savings are not one-year savings. They're multiple year savings Thank you all very many Any other questions? Thank you carol. Thank you. Appreciate that. Thank you. Thank you rich We will call the roll on 51 951 952 and 953 Madam clerk davis graph kittleson manny meyer montemayor ratki sagali stefan van akron van der wheel deberg eberg and serda 14 eyes oceans carry 954 all in the graph Thank you. Before we do that. Can we just go back to um, excuse me Item number 919 Which was a communication and a petition that was um Referred to um several committees These are the questions That I was able to write down and alderman kittleson Help help me look over those and um These were from the july 20th input session These are being referred to the city plan commission Public protection and safety committee public works committee as well as the committee of the whole These are some of the questions that were asked at that listening session and we're trying to get answers for them I know several people have been wondering When they're going to get the answers But we had to bring them into council in order to refer them to committees now that the committees have them We should get the answers back within two weeks if Four weeks at the most I would guess so I just wanted to let people know that Thank you all man graph for clarifying that Alderman stefan Thank you your honor, um Let's just point it out to me. We passed document 9 9 Which was an rc by finance recommending filing various documents Could I ask that we reconsider that document? Can you make a motion to reconsider please? I would so move that's motion to reconsider item 9 9 Is there a second there's a motion as second to reconsider 9 9 I have to reconsideration as RO 138.0506 by the city clerk submitting communication for a few of the rest of the Uh, we're asking you to divide the finance to make it and we were told it was in the middle of the night But it's not going to be appropriate to give you this chance to speak Excuse wait, wait, I'm not clear what you're doing all the staff and you're trying to reconsider to take a separate vote Or just for explain explain Okay, let's take a vote on the motion to reconsider so that we can reconsider the issue Do we need a roll call for that too? No Okay, motion to reconsider 9 9. There's been a motion made and a second all those in favor state I Any opposed motion carries Okay, there's a motion Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. You're making a motion. There's a motion a second Second Please sir Need to take a vote there was a vote there was a The question was made to divide now we need to vote on the on the motion to open the floor I believe there was a second to that Okay, all those in favor to open in the floor. Please state I Any opposed Floor has been open chair recognizes. Yes, sir Please Okay, my name is steve rasmussen. I reside with my family at 1812 north 29th street here in sheboygan And the reason why I asked to get your time tonight is on March 10th My wife was driving on cali mid avenue in front of make a right hand turn on the north 25th hit a icy patch And made contact with a road sign She called me at work wasn't sure what to do. I told her you definitely have to call the police department report it So she went to the local bank Police department came my wife is instructed that there was not convening citations Nothing was going to be issued the road sign gets hit a lot and often And the officer and my wife did not see any damage to the sign On my way home that night. I usually drive home that way as well. I looked at the sign didn't see any damage I thought what sign did you hit? So she cleared it up for me when I got home the reason why I'm asking for your time tonight as we received an invoice in the mail invoice number 47608 dated june 14 And the issue that we have is not that My wife made contact with a sign or encountered a slippery spot But just that it went from march 10th to june 14th before we heard anything from either the police department the city Or anybody regarding this matter and to get an itemized Invoice without anybody contacting us in my mind is not good business practice So what I'm here to ask for is that this matter be just overturned Be cleared off the table And I guess that's what I'm asking for at this point so Any questions Followman graph. Thank you. You're on your arm rich get part. Can you address that? As you did in the finance committee Mr. Gabbard I spoke to one of the supervisors in public works and They stated that they had to assign A crew of two men, which is their normal crew From the regular work site to work on the sign And then I'm not sure at what point they did that in reference to the timeline that mr. Asmusen referred to But then they had a return to their to their site of work And the combination of that was one hour of time that was charged for the two men Um After they did the work it does take some time. There's some Delay for them getting the charges from their motor vehicle System the rental charges to us and for us to produce the invoice so I I don't have the exact timeline of when the work was done versus when you know when we Received the information for the billing, but that's the general process I can't shoot much more than that on it, but if there's any questions, I'll try Any other questions Alderman Manning. Thank you, your honor Perhaps for tom holton. What work was done in the sign? Mr. Holton I'm not sure exactly what work was done The crew must have been called by the police department somebody to Respond up to the sign to see what was wrong of it, but I guess it was just bent somewhat but As far as I know there wasn't any billing at any materials It was the two men and the vehicle to go up there respond to the call and go back to what they were doing an hour's time Alderman sagali Thank you, mr. Mayor. Um, if I may please ask is this a normal practice? I mean, is this something it's just not this gentleman that you sent this bill to it's everybody anybody who has done Something like this. Yes. Okay, and me we ask the amount of the bill, please Okay, but this is normal practice We get called out yesterdays for an accident. Yes. Okay. Thank you Alderman manner will Thank you, honor Um, if I heard correct, you were told there would be no, uh, I'm sorry No, no citations or or anything like that Right My wife was told that I was not there. I did not talk to the officer Mr. Holmes, would you please speak into the mic? Um, I was not told that directly directly that was uh information provided to my wife At the time she spoke with the officer I guess my question is At what point was he to be notified that he was going to get this bill or was this bill the notification? And how long did he have to pay it? Mr. Holden I think your department issues a The bill that's 30 days. I think upon receiving the bill to pay it I found us with the question right If I may your honor, please do um I guess what I'm getting at is he thought that he wasn't going to get any fines or any citations His wife thought that but this wasn't a citation. It's just a bill for For going up to look at the sign and straighten it out Thank you Any other questions? Alderman manning Thank you, your honor I just don't know what work was done and I would like more information from the work crew Did they come and touch it and say yeah, it's okay? Did they bend it a little bit? Did the officer have a perception that they should look at it read bend it or something? I'd like a little more clarity before I vote So it was on the police report that the sign was slightly bent slightly bent. Okay Thank you Any other questions Somebody needs to do something with this. I would move that That the rc be accepted and adopted And that that document be placed on file There's a motion to to accept and adopt Plate and put the document Number 05062 on file under discussion Even a roll call All those in favor say aye Any opposed? One no motion carries Two noes. Thank you very much. Thank you, sir Moving on we are at 954 By alderman mani ratki sagali mayer and davis Authorizing the city attorney to engage in the services of special outside council for the for the council And the law and licensing committee in the matter of the hearing on the issue of suspension or revocation of the tavern license of three gems incorporated Alderman mani Thank you We need a motion to spend yeah, I move The suspension we need a motion to suspend the rules we can deal with this tonight. There's a Any objection to the suspension? Not please proceed. We don't need no objection. Please proceed Law and licensing dealt with this issue. The party in consideration was open after revocation of license Required closing at midnight. They were open after that And we're not following stipulations and therefore we need a hearing to look at revocation or at least a significant penalty So so moved to pass the legislation. Thank you There's a motion to pass resolution 954 any further discussion? Not would you please call the roll madame clerk. I'm sorry gruff Kittleson mani mayer Montemay or ratki sagali stefan van akron van der wheel de berg e berg serda and davis 14 eyes motion carries 955 of 957 will lie over with one notation on 955 And that one will be by alderman stefan not alderman berg 958 to 963 to be referred Report of committees 965 By salary and grievance recommending the establishment of a policy to review the hiring of city employees Effective immediately during the 206 And eliminating the creating of new city positions Alderman grough Thank you, your honor. Um rather than Moving to pass that I would refer this ask for I would make a motion to refer this to finance There's a motion to refer 965 back to finance is there a second There's a second under discussion under discussion your honor the reason for this is because this is going to be um Involved the 2006 budget quite heavily and it's asking for a hiring freeze of city employees affected immediately And as soon as this would be enacted we'd have that but because we're not quite sure of what all the governors budget Recommendations are doing as well as we're waiting for What's going to happen with our our present union contracts and so forth. I'd like this sent to finance Thank you under discussion alderman sagali Thank you, mr. Mayor. I I guess this is um troubling about the freeze and all that I guess I need to have some clarification If we're not able to hire a police officer If we're not able to hire a fireman if we're not able to replace any of the public works People that are gone. How can we even start to think then of trying to do? Tourism committee and have a department head and staff included if there's freezing there's freezing across the board am I correct? That's correct. Okay. Now if somebody retires You are saying that you are not going to be replacing those people No, I'm not saying that I'm saying we'll follow this rule There are ways to get around it you have to get three quarters of I think it's three quarters of the council This is similar to the to the present But what I want to do now is send this to finance so that we can discuss it and see exactly what the What effect this will have on our our city budgets as well as what affects the The governor's um actual budget when it comes out and when it's written we'll have too So we have to work together on this in order to bring out a good budget for 2006 Okay, now I see the firemen here and I see the policemen here And I would like to make a motion to open up the floor so that the firemen and policemen can discuss this To see what would take place if this does actually uh be enacted If I may please make a motion to open up the floor There's a motion second to open up the floor. I'm sorry. Who's seconded the motion? Mr. Alderman Davis And are you opening up the floor anybody wants to speak or I'm I'm opening up for the city employees Fire please public works Understand it understand the motion opening up Alderman. I've got alderman danburg first Under with the motion to open up the floor only Oh, well, I was going to make a comment on the document. There's a motion to open up the floor at the moment Okay, uh alderman eldenberg My comment was other than opening the floor. Okay Alderman stefan I have no problem with opening up the floor. I guess could we just Put it to one person for each department or something. So I think it would be a great suggestion Good amendment to you Okay, we'll open up the floor to one person Per department that wishes to address the council a new hiring freeze Pardon me Hold on. We're not calling you yet Okay On 965 By celery and grievance. There's a motion to open the floor for discussion. All those in favor state. I You need a pose Motion carries we will open the floor who would like to go first mr. Firefighter mr. Wally ensley ensley Could I have your name, please? Okay, thank you I'm sorry my fault. That's okay Mayor Perez fellow council members. Thank you for opening the floor When I first saw this resolution on your agenda um I thought obviously I had to address it representing the Shabuigan professional firefighters as their president We have remained silent on this issue of staffing for a year and a half We are presently Short on the fire department for firefighters as I speak this evening This is a major concern of the firefighters and it should be a major concern of the older persons This is a critical critical issue We have worked with our fire chief We have worked with our staff. We have worked with the older persons We know the budget's tight. There's no doubt about it in the past year and a half. We didn't replace three people Now we had a man retired. Uh, I think at the end of may we're so we're short for people We understand that the budget's tight. There's no doubt about it When I saw the resolution that was going to be brought forth tonight My concern is I don't have a problem and the fire union doesn't have a problem With you putting a hiring freeze on new positions. We have no problem with that. We know there's budget problems our problem is We just want the people replaced That have retired in the last year and a half The shabuigan fire department presently responds not only to fires Not only that every ems call in the city every single ems call Nosebleed broken bones stroke heart attacks seizure diabetic coma heart attack we respond We respond to auto extrications confined space rescue trench rescue high level rescue ice rescue water rescue in the summer gas leaks gasoline leaks from cars on the street natural gas leaks Emergency lockouts when somebody has a three-year-old or a baby in their house and they lock the keys in we respond to that and we We open the door for them Check on welfare somebody hasn't seen their neighbor. They call the fire department. We go over break the door in we check on them Smoke detector checks for the elderly and people that can't afford batteries. We put batteries in for them We do fire inspections. We do pre-plans We want run the fire prevention programs in the school districts We handle any hazardous material call that comes in The meth labs that you've been reading about in the city of shabuigan Not only the police officer side by side with us very dangerous situation You might have read in the paper you get a whiff of it. It could kill you. It's as simple as that And we assist invalids In the city We've had many large fires in the past three months. You've probably read about them in the paper Three fires at country village in the past two and a half months on the south fire south side of shabuigan Had a major fire about two and a half weeks ago at athon ontario It was time insurance on the first floor a church on the first floor And I believe 15 or 16 apartments. It's a three-story building on the second and third floors They had two major house fires in the last month And we will continue to have those unfortunately The safety of our children and our families is a number one priority for the firefighters We're sworn to serve and protect That's the oath we took and that's our job no matter if it's putting speedy dry in a gasoline leak Or letting somebody in their house This staffing shortage Is putting a very hardship on the city residents The only people that know the shabuigan fire department is short staffed Are the firefighters themselves and their family members their wives their parents grandparents No one in the city when we respond to a fire call The major fire we had the last two major fires when we talked to the neighbors. They said hey, good job. Nice job I said, do you know we're short staff? You gotta be kidding me. I said we're short staffed. Yeah What those four firefighters would do if we had them if they were replaced today? What could they do? What would they do? They'd pull an extra line at a fire They cut a hole in a roof They'd go in into a primary search Rescue someone We have something on the fire department when we go to a fire presently We have what they call a RIT team A RIT team is a rapid intervention team. What that does if we go to a house fire We work as teams No one No one goes in by themselves two firefighters grab a hose line. They go on a house One man's pumping the engine obviously somebody's hooking up the hydrant Somebody's climbing on the roof to cut a hole and some people are doing search and rescue What a RIT team does Rapid intervention team there are lifeline If I'm in with another firefighter and the ceiling falls in on me and I call mayday We have to have a RIT team To rescue us to help us We don't have RIT teams We don't have the people to do a RIT team We didn't have a RIT team at the major fire on 8th and ontario We called a RIT team at country village Didn't have the people there the RIT team. I mean, what are you going to do called a RIT team? We set it up probably 15 minutes into the fire It's a critical critical deal We want the firefighters in the city of shaboy and want the people to know We'll work with what you give us We're four short Can we do the job? We're doing the job. Is it safe? No Those four fires fires are vital to our operation If those fires would have occurred the ones i'm referring to on 8th and ontario on that friday night It came in at 7 10 p.m If that fire would have happened at maybe two in the morning Maybe a police officer would have spotted it. It's kind of in a it's downtown But there's not a lot of people around the parks right there. We probably would have had fatalities In that fire We had 14 firefighters respond to that fire We had 17 firefighters on duty that day Three of the firefighters had to stay back to prepare in case there was another call Now if you could envision firefighting That's a three-story building with 15 apartments Fully charged with smoke When we got there we had five initial people from the fire station right outside here We pulled up one man put the pump in gear. He's got to stay with the pumper The officer got out one man pulled a hose line We had one man on a hose line fighting that fire Dangerous unbelievably dangerous. We have a dangerous job But we would have liked to have that extra man there to help that pull that hose line Myself and my partner had to go upstairs because people were coming falling down the steps And our orders were to do a primary search. That's our life safety is the number one thing in the fire service And that's what we were told to do and that's what we would do No red team We waited for the other trucks to come in we put the fire out Yeah, we did We just want to let the people know and sheboygan No one knows that we're running short. We are not asking for new people We know we know the budget's tight Please Please when you're looking at the budget Replace those four retirees. We've tried it We've worked with the city our chief has management union. We've we've tried it We want a year and a half. Someone is going to get killed or maimed If we don't have our full our full people We're short for now We will have three retirees the middle of december that'll put us at seven We right now have a man that might be going out on disability as a severe injury We don't know we will for sure be short seven people At the end of december and rather than come to finance or come to salary and grievance and say hey, guess what guys? We need seven eight bodies. Where were you people? You're dropping this on me now december. What are you kidding me? We want to make it known Being reduced to four people On the fire department it also affects us No one in this city That i'm aware of except firefighters and their family members know that we Presently are parking a fire truck. It's parked right now as I speak at station four on the north side Manning staffing shortages That's what we had to do Chief said gotta park it. We don't have enough. We don't have the people. We can't man it If I lived on the north side of shabuagan And I was paying my tax bill and I thought We're parking a fire truck. What are you kidding me? They are it's parked right now. It's parked right as I'm speaking At the end of 2003 when they initially said there were going to be budget problems The fire chief and the staff went to the union and said hey, you know, there's no month We got to we got to deal. We got to deal with this. So what did we do? Oh, what are you going to do? I guess we'll try, you know, okay We didn't like it We had to reduce staff in the end at the end of 2003 11 days. We were running short We parked the fire truck two days at the end of 2003 In 2004 we ran reduced staff 71 days. We had to reduce staff. We parked the fire truck 14 days 2005 Right now We've run reduced staff for 74 days fire trucks parked right now 14 days already this year We've passed last year As president of the firefighters our firefighters Wondered, what does it actually cost the taxpayer in the city of Shabuagan to maintain the fire department? What does it cost? I I didn't know I asked our chief. He didn't know I asked People in the city nobody knew So what the fire union did was we do what A lot of government entities do When they set the tax rate And typically what they do you'll see in the newspaper. They'll say your taxes are going up so-and-so On a hundred thousand dollar assessed home This is what your tax bill will be and that's pretty easy for people to figure out So what we did We took a hundred thousand dollar assessed home in the city of Shabuagan On the 2004 tax bill last year's tax bill Now you have to remember The tax bill in the city of Shabuagan is made up of six sections six sections state county the city school LTC and the rec department Well, the state county LTC and the rec department make up 30.5 percent of your property tax bill almost a third The city of Shabuagan makes up 33.5 percent of your tax bill About a third And the school district takes up 36 percent of your tax bill So if you owned a house in the city of Shabuagan for a hundred thousand dollars Last year your tax bill was three thousand one hundred and sixty seven dollars That's what you paid on your tax bill for your house if you had a hundred thousand dollar home A third of that bill because we wanted to know as firefighters How much did it cost for fire protection a third of that bill is a thousand fifty six So if you're following me a hundred thousand dollar assessed home last year's tax bill three thousand one hundred and sixty seven dollars total a third of that is a thousand fifty six Well, when you look at a fully staffed fire department with the four were short You paid seventeen dollars and fifty eight cents a month for fire protection. That's what that's what people paid last year Seventeen dollars and fifty eight cents a month for fire protection and EMS EMS protection any call any emergency call that would come into the city That's what you paid It's less than your cable bill less than your phone less than your heat less than your gas. It's a pretty good deal We also took it one step farther We called the assessor's office because a lot of guys said, you know what? Yeah, that's that's nice to know But how many houses in the city of Shabuagan you think are assessed at a hundred thousand dollars Because we wanted to kind of get an idea of of you know where we're at Seventy three percent of the homes in the city of Shabuagan are assessed at a hundred thousand dollars or less Seventy three percent. So that gives you a pretty good idea. That's three quarters Of the taxpayers in the city. We're paying a hundred thousand dollar assessment on their tax bill or less Naturally, if your house was seventy thousand or sixty thousand you were paying a lot less than seventeen dollars and fifty eight cents a month for fire protection We took it one step further Talked to my insurance agent this morning. I said I need a figure from you Okay A hundred thousand dollar home in the city of Shabuagan. What would I pay for fire insurance? Two hundred and forty three dollars a year. He said we're a class three When it comes to fire insurance a class three the best is a class two Nobody's a class one. Milwaukee's a class two. We're a class three. That's excellent. That's that's phenomenal I said what if that same house was in the town of wilson that hundred thousand dollars? What would they pay for fire protection? They're a class nine They would pay Three hundred and ninety three dollars a year. That's a difference of a hundred and fifty dollars on their On their homeowners insurance for fire a hundred and fifty dollars Pretty wild figure In closing. I appreciate the time to talk to you Again, we have no problem with a hiring freeze for new employees. We just The firefighters union is here in force have two battalion sitting behind me tonight And a battalion working tonight We believe in this We're not getting anything out of it What are we going to get out of it? We just want the four people filled so we can perform the utmost Of our profession And right now with those people being short. We just can't do it In 1993 money magazine rated Sheboygan the top seventh best place to live in the united states In 1995 we were the fourth best in the county For violent crime rate. We were the fourth best we had the that's how our violent crime was 1997 we were rated fourth in the county among world class manufacturing small business Rated fourth 1997 best place to raise a family readers digest 1999 third best place to live under 250,000 population year 2000 golf digest third best golf course in the us seventh in the world 2002 top eight places to retire in the country And 2004 the seventh safest city in the nation among metro areas under 200,000 people Let the citizens decide if 1758 is a lot of money. I don't think it is In 1994 when the shop go building collapsed, we worked hand in hand with the police department I was there it was unbelievable Unfortunately, we had one death and two paralyzed people but public protection and safety 1998 the great Sheboygan flood We had firefighters swimming if you can envision this swimming in apartments that were had seven feet of water in Where people were hanging on to cushions a foot from the ceiling Thank goodness. We got there when we did you had police officers. I know for a fact Leaving their squad cars swimming down union avenue in seven feet six feet of water Because there were cars that only had maybe four inch gap to the roof of their cars and they had to check if somebody was in them Doing what we're paid to do doing what the taxpayers pay us to do And in closing I'll just tell you a short story two weeks ago My partner and I went to a call at exactly 4 30 in the morning on a wednesday morning We responded to the call. It was an assist an invalid call We do those daily Almost daily. It's part of the service Went to the door. I was met by a woman senior Said hi guys. He wouldn't let me call you for an hour and a half I said, what's that my husband? He was embarrassed. You guys have come here before he would not let me call you I said, that's part of the service. No problem. Where is he? He's in the bedroom We walked down the hall went into the bedroom there. He sat right next to the bed Said hey, sir. What's up? He says I just can't get up He's a large man big man and his wife was probably five foot 100 and 100 pounds So my partner and I after securing and making sure he was okay, which he was Got under his arm pits on each side lifting him up to his walker We said you want to go back to bed or you want to what do you want to do? He said, well, can I just can you walk me out to my living room so I can get in my lazy boy? We said no problem. We walked him out Set him in his lazy boy And talking to him. I have to get information for a fire run We have to get information on those calls name data birth phone number and I asked his wife. I said, how old is he? 91 91 And as we were closing up my partner and I were just going to walk out and the woman said thank god For this service. Thank god that you guys do this. I said Part of the service and I'm not telling you that the pat us on the back. I'm not That's the service that the citizens of shabuagan deserve And that's what they expect and that's what we provide When I walked out to my rig, I looked at my partner. I said, that's what it's all about man And he said too bad people don't know we're short staffed and I said I know I thank you for your time. I know you have a hard budget ahead of you All the firefighters are asking is that you please please look at replacing the people that have retired We have homes in the city of shabuagan. I can tell you right now. I've been to them There's 10 people sleeping in the attic tonight guaranteed guaranteed We get a fire there Does one person or those two first two people help us out extra you better believe it Thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it. Thank you mayor for allowing us to speak Thank you Is there anyone from the police department that would like to address the council Mr. Edson Thank you mayor All the persons Eric could you just give us your name for the public? Eric Edson. I'm the president of the police union Thank you As police officers, we don't have much free time as a fireman. So I don't have as many comments as My counterpart but But walley walley expressed a lot of the things that I was going to say also And it's nothing that I haven't said to this body before I know there's some new people here since I've last addressed the council I think I was here maybe a year not quite a year ago when this came up Previously about a hiring freeze and my concerns of public safety and as it relates to law enforcement and I told this story then I don't really feel they need to get into it tonight but you know our city is growing and People are coming here from other areas other big cities with criminal intent And our job is getting more dangerous every single day And the longer that we we run short staff The more dangerous it is for us as law enforcement officers having to go to calls alone Or just with one other officer And the more dangerous it is for the public to not have those officers available to respond to those calls One of my biggest concerns is we're working a lot over time to fill staffing needs We our administration feels that we have to staff our shifts with a certain number of officers to provide a service to the city And to fill those shifts. We're going to having to staff on overtime Even though a lot of people think all we do is drive around in our cars and stop at the mini marts for coffee And don't it's you know, that's obviously not true Law enforcement is a very stressful occupation And you put an officer in a squad car handling calls, especially in the summertime like this when it's extremely busy For 10 12 hours at a time with limited breaks in between That's dangerous for that officer. He's we have to make life and death decisions In a in a stamp of a finger It's not right that the citizens have to accept that Quality of service when it could easily be rectified by Hiring the number of officers that our to allows us to have our table of organization Right now we're allotted 91 officers And presently we have 85 And one is scheduled to retire in about two weeks So that'll bring us down to 84 and we've been operating this way for years for the last Three to four years. We've been short anywhere from a couple officers down to seven or eight Um, I don't mean this with disrespect, but this is you know, and not having any prepared comments We're tired of it. We're tired of feeling like we're not important to this council From things like the police department building, which is a whole another issue to municipal court To all kinds of other things bargaining with with the city We don't feel that our service is valued by this council And my only way reason for saying that is because we've been running short for so long We don't want extra. Well, we want extra guys, but we're not asking for extra guys to staff our street crimes unit Our drug unit all the other community service projects that we're trying to do. We're not asking for that. We're asking for The to fill for you guys to fill RTO to the number of officers that were allotted. We're tired of running short We're tired of providing substandard service to our community. We want to be full staffed I don't mean to slight the other uh city departments It's important to have your garbage picked up. It's important to have the streets plowed But at three four o'clock in the morning when something happens in your house, who do you call you call the police department? We responded to calls as simple as People with bats in their house. They don't know what to do. They call us. They have someone breaking into their house They call us any myriad of calls we respond to we're the ones that people call We have to have officers there to respond when someone calls 911 It's as simple as that I ask you to fill our to don't enact this freeze on filling positions We're not asking for more people. We're just asking to either get up to where we belong with our to It'd be great if we could have more officers But i'm i'm asking you and i'm telling do not enact this freeze This is going to be very detrimental to our service and to the community. I one last comment I know we're talking about hiring more officers coming up here I know that officers that do the background checks they go out to these bigger cities to recruit people to come here They talk to why you coming to shabuigan. You're from a big city in california out on east coast Why do you want to come to shabuigan? It's because of the level of service that we do provide compared to places out there. We have it fantastic here We don't want to see that go away for all the things that Wally said about you know rated the best city for this and the best city for that We're proud of that. We don't want that to go away and it's it's i'm afraid it's going to go away with the Level of crime that's been happening lately. If we don't have the officers there to handle it to respond to the calls Those distinctions for our city are going to go away Thank you very much for your time Thank you, mr. Edson. Is there anyone from the public works department that would like to address the council Is there anyone from any other department that would like to address the council? okay, then we will move on to the Resolution 965 by seller and grievance. There's a motion to refer it back to finance committee almond monachron Thank you. The honor Ed suric is here maybe he can explain it this freeze better I think these people have got this freeze wrong. We're not cutting the teal This is new people we're hiring above the teal that I understood it It's not If it's on a teal they can hire it's the last person if they're adding new people That it will have to come to the council Maybe Ed suric can clarify what you're talking about step to the podium Alderman, please understand that this this is a motion to refer it back to committee It's not being voted on to pass or not to pass. Mr. Suric. You would need to be on the other side, please And next time you can't jump over either Thank you Excuse me, mr. Suric. Uh, Alderman eberg. Did you have a question before this? Or a comment, please do sir. Uh, yes, uh, thank you your honor. I think Um, mr. Suric will likely explain that this is not a freeze It is a process for reviewing hires And I think uh, one of the reasons is how eloquently our employees speak about need if there is on the referral One of the pieces of the referral deals with new city positions And if I might read that part it said be it resolved that no new city positions shall be created effectively immediately and during the calendar year 2006 Unless reorganization results in reduction of existing positions or by approval of three fourths of the common council I think that's the significant part now That would be a freeze on establishing new positions The question is where would that most impact it would impact on the municipal court It would also impact on bringing the tourism department If you would into a city government and my guess is those are likely areas that we should closely scrutinize Were perhaps that three quarters majority would be a valuable threshold to set Thank you. Alderman bird Alderman staffen. Did you wish to comment now? I can wait till I okay Alderman eberg Did you wish to wait? Mr. Suric here he told us That if the people are on the to and there's money in the budget They can they can go get their people You don't you told us that at the salaries and grievance committee that if there's If they're on the to and they're short and money's in the budget they can be hired No, I let the miss quote. I think what I said was that and the committee is here, too Is that if if a position is vacant? It's it's budgeted. It's on a to the department head can bring it to salary and grievance and salary grievance can improve the replacement of that person now the way the Program works and Alderman Berg explained it well, too. Is that it's it's simply a process. We've been in For as long as I've been here. We've been through Found the same procedure and that is again if it's a budgeted position There's space in a to the department can bring it to salary and grievance if there's a change in the position either in a job Description or and in some rearrangement between the table organization it and as in the past It's come to council. So this is really nothing new. It's just it's kind of Refurbishing what we've done in the past Okay, thank you. Alderman graph that you wish to address Only to say what you did your honor and that was this what the vote is on here Or what we're talking about is referring this to finance. It's not enacting it tonight or anything like that That's referring it to finance and by doing so. I think I think you may be saying that All these questions can be answered all concerns can be addressed I was going to say if the members of the police and and fire and public works want to come and address finance I'm sure they can on this Thank you. Thank you. Alderman growth Alderman serda that you wish I guess I'll just refrain from my comments because we're just Talking about referring it now. So that's fine. Thank you. Alderman serda. Alderman stefan Thank you your honor. I wanted to thank walley and eric For their presentations. I think it is something that you know finance will have to look at You know, I do hear from people constantly about Taxes taxes taxes, but I've never heard anybody say, you know, I want less cops on the street I don't you really need a two-fire fighters one's okay. So we you know have to take that into consideration Referring regarding referring it to finance. I just wanted to make it known that I'll be out of town at next week's finance meeting I'll be asking the chair to hold this So you might want to check the agenda before you just show up in mass. Thank you Thank you. Alderman stefan any other questions from mr. Surrick Yes, thank you. Not not a question for mr. Surrick, but an amendment to the referral The amendment Will hold separate for a vote the last further be further be it resolved That will allow us to confirm tonight that no new city positions shall be created effective immediately And during the calendar year 2006 unless reorganization results and reduction of existing positions Or by approval of three courts of the common council that would then primarily allow new positions to Stand with three quarters of the vote of the council while the finance committee deliberates the Portion that deals with the hiring process for positions that are already open Alderman serda Under discussion i'm trying real hard here to reframe because i'm being reminded that we shouldn't be speaking on this issue That it's going to be referred back to finance. I would ask for that same courtesy any type of changes Let's just get it to finance. I don't want to be amending this document now I'm refraining from my comments and I would ask everybody to do the same Thank you. Alderman serda. Good point Alderman stefan. Yes, I guess I would just ask the attorney has a point of order. I mean it seems like the amendment is Directly opposite of what the resolution says So I don't know I don't know that you can refer it and then pass a portion of it That seems to be the heart of the whole thing The amendment is a hostile amendment which changes the whole characteristic of the motion has been made This is why I agree with all in serda refer it back to committee. Let it be discussed There are any amendments can be made during finance committee and any department head or any employees are welcome To attend if there's not enough space whether it finance committees or hell Say so it'll be held here or at some other place. It'll be accommodating to you We welcome your input. We hope you will be there and and we hope we can address this issue at the finance committee There's no need to get Messy about this process here Pardon me Alderman van der wheel on that on the referral thank your honor. I was if this is legal I was just going to call a question in the referral Could we have would you be willing to withdraw your motion? No. No Was there a second to your motion? Motion dies for lack of a second. We will call the roll on referring it back to committee 965 by cellar and grievance Please call the roll Kittleson Manny meyer montemayor ratki segale stephan van akron van der wheel Dberg eber serda davis and graff 13 eyes one no motion carries 966, uh, we'll lie over to august 15th meetings. Are correct city attorneys? Yes Lie over ordinance introduced 968 969 lie over Matters laid over I'm sorry. Alderman graff 966 is lying over to what meeting? August 15th august 15th. Thank you. This is pursuant to their request Everybody get that Thank you. Alderman graff As I said 968 969 will lie over 832 resolution number 780506 by alderman graff stephan montemayor susha and davis authorizing a transfer of appropriations in the 205 budget Alderman graff Thank you your honor. I would move that the resolution be put upon its passage Second there's a motion the second to put the resolution upon its passage under discussion They're being non. Please call the roll graff kittleson mani meyer montemayor radki segale stephan van akron van der wheel Dberg eberg serda and davis 14 eyes motion carries other matters referred referred by law 970 an hour old by chief of police Submitters quarterly report for activities commenced in april 1st 05 and end in june 30th 05 It asks for a motion to accept and file So moved Motion the second to accept on file under discussion Not all those in favor state aye Any opposed motion carries 971 will be referred to public protection and safety 972 will be referred to public works 973 will be referred to public protection and safety 974 will lie over 975 will be referred to the board of parts and forestry commissioners Other matters mr. City attorney 976 is communication from wendy sapransky 2403d cross creek drive in favor of having a beach area dog run and suggesting checking other communities to find out what they have to offer And that will be referred to the park a board of parts and forestry commission 977 is communication from blue harbor resort stating that they will be holding their october fest event on September 24th to thank the public for all their support in the past years and making various requests including Requesting that they are allowed to have beer and wine in a designated area outside of the licensed premises That will be referred to law and licensing and public works 978 is communication received by the mayor from charlene dickie regarding taxes and the city and concerns with the proposed cost of the police facility That will be referred to the committee of the whole 979 is a resolution to authorize a referendum election to be held on the next April 2006 election on the question of whether or not to issue general obligation bonds in an amount not to exceed 8 million dollars for the public purpose of paying for the cost of a new police station that will lie over 98 is a Is submitting the harbor center marina balance sheet from operations dated june 30 2005 is submitted by skipper marine That will be referred to the marina and harbor committee Oldman gruff motion to convene and close Thank you, your honor. I would move that we convene in closed session Under the exemption provided in section 19.85 1g of those constant stats for the purpose of conferring with legal counsel For the city of shabuigan who is rendering oral advice concerning strategy to be adopted by the body With respect to litigation in which it is likely to become involved and under the exemption provided in section 19.85 1e and there was constant stats where competitive and bargaining reasons require A closed session for the purpose of considering a letter of interest in obtaining city-owned parcel of land There's a second There's a motion to second. Please call the roll kittleson mani meyer montemayor ratki sagali stefan hi van akron van der wheel deberg eberg serda davis and graph 14 eyes Motion carries will take a five-minute break and we'll convene in closed session We're back We're back in open session Alderman gruff with respect to the uh, vacant land offer to purchase With that one your honor. I would move that We drafted an ordinance from the resolution rc Do we need to draft something from the floor? To approve the offer to purchase as well as the added covenants Is there a second Any discussion All those in favor, please state aye Opposed motion carries With respect to 967 by special committee on risk management Recommend and filing the document submit a notice of claim and claim in the matter of anthony c bone a versus the city of shibuya and the mayor Juan Perez and the nine the claim and direct in the city attorney to send a notice of disallowance Alderman gruff and I would move that the rc be accepted and adopted There's a motion a second to adopt 967 under discussion It's not please call the roll eberg serda davis graph kittleson mani meyer montemayor radke sagali stefan van akron and vander wheel 13 ayes motion carries All those in favor state aye We stand adjourned