 103.9 FM, WOZO Radio, Knoxville. Ladies and gentlemen, Digital Freethought Radio Hour. Hello and welcome to Digital Freethought Radio Hour on WOZO Radio, 103.9 LP FM right here in Knoxville, Tennessee. Today is Sunday, August 23rd, 11 a.m. And I'm Larry Rhodes, Doubter 5. And as we, as usual, we have our co-host on the line, Wombat. Hello, how are you? Hey, I got a poem for you. Roses are red, violets are blue. I don't care who I offend. Black lives matter. A little poetic license there. Yeah, yeah, free verse. Yeah. And our guests today are Judd Pirat Higgs. Hello, Wade. Oh. Red leader. But Boudreau and George. Hello, George. Digital Freethought Radio Hour is a talk radio show about atheism, free thought, rational thought, humanism and the sciences. And conversely, we'll also talk about atheism. I'm sorry, religion. Religious faith, God's holy books and superstition. And if you get the feeling that you're the only non-believer in Knoxville, well, you're just not. There are several atheist, free-thinking and rationalist groups that exist right here in Knoxville. And we'll be telling you how you can connect with them right after the mid-show break. And did you know that there's a streaming atheist calling video show? It has been for over 10 years here in Knoxville. Did you know that one? I keep telling people that they need to get into this because you have the opportunity to play as like a tiny human in a village full of tiny little different animals. And you can gather bells and you can give them to your friends and you can like fish. It's amazing. It's really cool. But it is. Check out what's the name of the thing I'm talking about. It's a really great game. It's a really great game. One of these days you'll find it, but we'll tell everybody how to find it after the mid-show break. And you can actually become involved in that show or this radio show by contacting our groups. Wamba, what do you have for us today as far as topics? We're going to be talking about death today. We're keeping it light. Keeping it light on death. But before we begin, I throw it up to our own Dread Pirate Higgs for our daily or weekly invocation. All right. Holy Ghost, Father and Son, Christians insist there's not three, but just one. And the one is still tripled if your soul is not crippled. But I think they're just having us on. That's good. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Rah. Rah man. Okay. That was wonderful. That was wonderful. I like that speaking. Rah man. Rah man. Rah man. Thank you guys. So how's everyone doing Dread Pirate? I love that shirt. I love the color combination that's going on this morning. How you feeling? Yes. Doing great. Doing great. Enjoying the last best stages of summer. It is. I feel the cold coming on. It's crazy. Yeah. I like it now that the weather is going to moderate a bit. I can get back on my bike. I don't like riding in 90 degree weather, but I really look forward to the fall for motorcycle riding. Oh, I thought you meant like pedal bike riding. I was about to say I didn't know you were a biker, Larry. I'm a biker. The other kind. Very cool. Very cool. Very cool. Eric, it's been a while since I've seen you. How you been? And I've been well. I've been missing it. The timing has not worked out lately, but I'm glad to be back. How's your music life gone? Like the full band, any new songs, new inspirations, nothing? What's going on? We have not been playing at all. I've been trying to do my own projects a little bit. I got everything set up to record. Nice. I just need something to do. Maybe we'll collaborate. Cool. Nice. Absolutely. Let's figure something out. I'm working on stuff always. Dale, I can see a big chocolate dime behind you. What's going on there? I don't think it's chocolate. Oh, he's on mute. He doesn't know it, but he's holding up a chocolate dime of looks like the bush. Anyway, as he gets his. This is a sculpture. It's a sculpture. How about now? We can hear you now. Can you hear me now? Yep. You must cut me off. This is a sculpture I did of George Bush for a prominent Republican in this area who then gave it to Lamar Alexander. Okay. Very cool. Looks good. Looks nice. What's the material? Is it clay? Yes. Looks almost good enough. Well, originally I made it out of a type of a polymer for him. They had a bronze finish to it, but then I cast a few out of feces. Cool. Cool. Nice. All right. Keeping it real. George, how have you been? Oh, just fine. Still in love. What's the romance of George Brown? I'm going so proud for us. Still in love with my occupational therapists. Yes. We're wishing me luck. We're batting for you over here. Okay. Well, I'm doing great. I mean, without God, I'm healing up. Not bad. The woman who drove me to the surgery is an atheist. And just before the anesthetist, anesthetologist. Anesthesiologist. Yeah. Anesthesiologist announced his name. She said, I'll pray for you. She's an atheist. Nice. Her prayers have manifested in my shoulder. Cool. Cool. George, you want to start the topic on death for a while. And you've been really great and patient. Would you mind leading us on this conversation? Well, I have just a little story. This is my lightweight story, but it's a little story. Okay. Yeah. It's about my son. When he turned six years old, he went on a hot dog bench and he would eat almost nothing else. Every day, every meal, it was hot dogs. Now he had an infatuation with pigs since he was very little. And he loved stories about pigs. And I think there's a name for this one when we give a human persona to an animal. Anthropomorphization. Yeah. And one day it sort of dawned on him. He asked me the question, for me to eat pork, does the pig have to be killed? And I said, yes. And the emotions just flashed across his face. If you're kind. Right. Yeah. And you know, it's like he had to deal with the paradox of loving to eat his hot dogs and knowing that pork went into them and that the pig had to be killed for him to enjoy his hot dogs and that he loved pigs. That's my story for today, my lightweight story. It sounds like death is more common and around the corner than we tend to let ourselves consider or be open to. Well, you know, I've been thinking as an organic atheist, myself being raised with it, I had to come to terms with the concept of death as a finality pretty early in my life, you know, the realization of it. And, but I did not have the indoctrination that people have of believing that in death would be a relief from the suffering of life into the hereafter forever at the right hand of God or Jesus or whoever you want. And that's what got me interested in having this discussion. So where do we all come into death from? Yeah. How about we set it up with Larry first? Larry, how do you feel about death and where's your position on it? Oh, volume out. What he was saying about death without suffering, I think that should be a basic human right, the right to be able to terminate your own life if you're suffering becomes so great that you can't deal with it. There's some chronic diseases that are very, very painful. In my particular case, I had an ant back in the day when, you know, back in the 60s, I guess, she came down with lung cancer and it took her seven years to die, seven years of laying in a bed, not being able to get out of the bed, you know, dealing with bed sores, et cetera, just, and there was no such thing as euthanasia at that point. And today, it's still not legal in most of the countries, most of the advanced countries. And we need to have legislation that will allow us to take care of that, to do that. I want that option when I'm, if I ever get into that condition. The other thing I'd say about death is that, well, I think it's the end. I mean, there's no reason to believe that any part of me will transcend the end of the death of my mind, of my brain. There's no reason to believe it. There's never been an example of a soul in history. It's 13 seasons of the ghost. Oh, no. Don't get Larry on Soul. Don't get Larry on Soul. So much of it. But I'll just let it go there. I know we're correct. We have a time constraint, but I did want to get that out. Eric, I want to know how you feel because I know we have talked about this before and like the finality of life and does death give it value? How do you feel? I think we have a new topic coming up from this conversation, the concept of dying versus death. And like, do you feel like once worse and should we care more about one than the other? What's your opinion? Yeah, I'm with Larry on the suffering bit. It seems like the best thing to do. And I think it's the utilitarian point of view is to maximize happiness, right? And if you're dying and you're in pain, is that, I mean, I think in a, is it, would you say a deontological point of view? Like, you know, death, you know, is a binary yes or no thing and it's a bad thing. So we want to, you know, prevent it at all costs. Right? Even if you're suffering and, you know, Peter Singer famously was, you know, favor of euthanasia, someone was, you know, babies were born and only going to live for three months and horrible agony. But if you look at it from a binary point of view, it's like, no, death, we can't, you can't kill anyone. You can't do it. It's bad. I'm just going to, before we head over to Dredd, I want to see like, is there a more sympathetic approach that you have? Cause like it's easy to look at death from, you know, 10 miles away or maybe even like 60 years away, right? And say like, it's a binary thing, but when it impacts you or like the people that you love, doesn't it become much more of a empathetic personal thing? And like, how is your personal relationship with it? Yeah, I guess that, that's what I was going to lead with with my conversation on death is it's strange and I think it's helped me kind of stay with atheism at such a young age. I didn't have much death in my family growing up. I've been to very few funerals, you know, and I definitely count myself lucky for that, but it's also coincidental, right? So, you know, had I been, you know, showered with, you know, deaths in the family and immediate family and really close relatives and friends, I think, you know, that can shake someone. Yeah. So in some ways it, it kind of helped me, now I don't know how well prepared I will ever be for a really close death. It's probably going to hit me pretty hard. But, you know, at least, I don't know. So it's hard for me to, to, to empathize really closely with that because I just, I haven't been around it a lot. So I'm hoping that my atheist perspective or at least just a willingness to say I don't know and not assume that there's an afterlife gives me better terms with death when it does happen personally in my family. And I think there's worth in that. Dredd, I'm going to throw it over to you. I saw you, I saw you had some things you wanted to say on death. Well, I was, I was actually swatting out of fly. I can still kind of see it up there. Yeah. It's just driving me nuts. Hey, Dredd, you're on the floor. You're on the, you're on the swab as they would say. So you're sitting on the plank or you're standing on the plank, my bad, bad you feel. Or are you watching someone jump off the plank? However it is, what's your opinion on death? How have you come to terms with it? Well, you know, I guess, you know, it's just a crowd here. I have a, you know, a different perspective than that's because I spent many years as a firefighter and first responders. So, you know, have been very close to it. But when it's, you know, of course, it's different when it's somebody else and not someone in your bubble or your circle or your family or whatever. So, but it does help frame those closer experiences and put it into perspective that, you know, this is just one aspect of existence and that, you know, death is going to visit us all and that's that essentially. But one thing I think about as well is that, I mean, life is, is not a quantitative thing, you know what I mean? Like all things just have one life and, you know, some people who don't want to, for instance, kill a pig to eat pork have no compunction about swarming a fly, you know what I mean? And those things in terms of life are equal. And so I think that's, it has been for me anyway, an important and important sort of reflection that life is life is life is life and if it's a plant, it's a fly, if it's a human being, you know, the value is essentially the same. Are you saying that just after telling a story about how you're trying to swat a fly? Yeah. These atheists are so hypocritical. Can you believe it? Can you believe it? I won't leave you on that. I'm going to give you one chance to say your piece on that. I've always thought like, hey, I know it's unfortunate, but the fact is, I care about the quality of my life and I'm stronger. Like I'm not saying it's right, but I'm stronger than a fly. So if you get near my ice cream, you're dead. That's all. Let's do it. I'm not saying it's right. Don't put me up on a plaque, but I'm going to do it because I'm stronger than you and I'll give you the same credit if I was a fly in your ice cream. All right. Dale, I'd love to hear what you think about death. Got the floor open. What's up? Man, why is he always free just before he's about to talk? What's going on there? What's going on there? He's smooth the entire time. I've witnessed it probably. Yeah. We are struggling to connect, stable connection with Dale. Dale, how about this? Why don't you just reset your camera and audio and you can come back in. Critical care and emergency rooms and three different hospitals and I'm probably seem like. It may have to do with his bandwidth and his videos are okay until it starts talking and then he needs more bandwidth and it cracks. I don't know how someone explained to me how Internet works. I thought they all like it's just zeros and one like silence is zeros and ones too, isn't it? Like am I wrong? It may depend on his service provider as well. I mean his phone service provider. How wide they how much bandwidth they give him. Sure. And just how far away the cell tower is. I'll throw in my two cents on death. I've been thinking about it since, you know, I've had, I've had a loss in my family Mike. My father died when I was young and there was always the condition of. How do I do? I don't know if I want to go into it too much. I don't know if this is the show that I have the time to like really go into it. But I would say like death does happen. It sucks when it does happen, especially when it's to you. And it sucks when it's something that you're constantly thinking about because I there is the impression that, you know, based on the color of your skin, someone's lives can be more meaningful or more valuable than others. And in a particular state like this, if you are listening to this and you, you feel like, you know, you have a lot to contribute with conversations. You feel like you want to understand people, but people don't want to understand you. We are here as a voice support. You enrich this world. You matter. And if you ever need help in like learning how to communicate with people, Dred has a great YouTube channel. I have a great YouTube channel where we go out and we try to talk to people and we try to go out and build understanding with other people. And Eric also has a really great community in Knoxville that reached out to, I'm sorry, not Knoxville, Kentucky, that reached out to me and introduced me to a wealth of great people who are willing to sit down and talk with people about subjects and try to understand from them, not just preach, but understand in a group. And that's worthwhile. And I recommend that if you don't have that kind of community, start one. Not just steal the worth, because it's worthwhile to have that. There's one thing I said, if you die, it sucks for you. I have to differ. If you're dead, it doesn't bother you. I mean, it's not good while you're dying. But there's a meme going around the internet. It says, it doesn't bother you when you're dead. You have no sensory perception of it. It just bothers the people that knew you and know you. And same when you're dumb. It doesn't bother you, but it bothers the people around you. Oh, with the memes. With the memes. Dread pirate. What do you got to say? What's up? So one of our regular viewers, Min, has asked this question. He says, mind pirate, would you do SE on a religious terminally ill person when he says that his dream about paradise gives him peace about death? Is this a question to the group? Well, he asked that of me. I certainly would. I would if I have consent. If I have consent and that's what they want. Yeah, that's an interesting point of view. I'm not. So my opinion is I'm not there to tell him he's wrong. I'm trying to understand why he's right. And if he's on the death bed, he might tell me something that's worthwhile to me. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, like SE is not an argument or debate where you have an opinion where you're trying to tell someone you're trying to understand from someone and you're working together to figure out if they just use a reliable way to get there. That's it. Eric, it's interesting because another of our viewers here has said, of course not. What fool would do that? So there you go. Yeah, I would say to those people, hey, there's options where you can have meaningful conversations with people. Absolutely. Have their consent. And I think if you got consent and everyone's having a genuine, nice conversation about understanding, no matter what the topic's off the table. Eric, what's up? Yeah, so maybe to the point of the contrarian comment here. So maybe where the person's going with this question is if you do have consent with the person, but if you know that your skills are so good as a street epistemologist and you know that you might actually give them doubt. They're on their death bed. They're at peace. They're willing to, they're happy to go to this paradise and you take a little bit of that away from them in the last few moments of their life. Is that maybe that's where they're going with the question? Like would you, would that be a good thing? I wouldn't take it away from them. It gives them comfort and their hour of need. But I mean, it's a lot of people say, would you talk, would you tell your grandparents when they're like 80 years old, would you try to talk them into atheism? I personally don't think it's worthwhile to take away what comfort they've had pretty much all their life. But it depends. Are they out there crying or raise money for a church and for a religious organization? Are they voting for evangelicals to go into office? If they're just living their life and trying to enjoy the last few years, they have what's the purpose? So here's, here would be my thing. A conversation takes two people. And in my opinion, Socratic Examination is a conversation. And if you are uncomfortable, potentially removed, put instilling doubt in someone that's trying to have a conversation with you, you don't have to have that conversation. And you can back out of that because they don't have your consent to do an SE. So that's your opinion. That is absolutely valid because you don't have to engage. And if someone's like, actually, I am interested in getting some doubt. I am on my deathbed. I would love to have an opportunity to just think about this rationally once because I'm terrified of going to heaven. It doesn't sound like a fun place. I heard you were an atheist. Can we talk? Yeah. The only thing I like about Jesus is his abs. I hate everything else about it. This can't be real, right? Can I talk to you? It's like, hell yeah. Let's talk. Yeah. I'll be happy to talk. And we'll see if there's like a good reason. And if it turns out, hey, I actually did Jesus Christianity Israel. Dang it. It sucks. But oh, well, at least we know something that's true. But we'll work together. And that's the whole thing about it's consent. It's positive. It's a conversation. George, one thing before we head out to our break, what's up? That if it was me, I think that it's important to have for me to have understanding and compassion for the, for this dying person, you know, to be sensitive to where they're at. Yeah. That's it. Yeah. I agree. And consent works both ways. So, uh, hey, guys, we're at the bottom of the half hour. Larry, why don't you take us out? We'll do some music in between. Okay. This is Digital Freethought Radio, R&W OZO Radio 103.9 LP FM right here in Knoxville, Tennessee. And we'll be right back after this short break. I remember studying hours and hours on end for the ACT and wanting to get that perfect score. But I felt so ashamed because I was extremely unhappy. And I remember telling my mom and dad, seriously, like, this is how I felt. French way. 3.9 FM. Come back to the second half of the Digital Freethought Radio Hour on WOZO Radio 103.9 LP FM here in Knoxville, Tennessee. Today is Sunday, August 23, 2020. Uh, let's talk about the Freethought groups that you can join right here in Knoxville. First, there's the Atheist Society of Knoxville founded in 2002. We're in our 18th year. We have over a thousand members and you can find us online by searching for Knoxville Atheist or go to KnoxvilleAtheist.org. You can go to meetup.com and find us there. If you really want to join us, join the meetup, then join the group there. Another large freethinking group here in Knoxville are the Rationalists of East Tennessee. They've been around for more than 20 years. Just go to rationalist.org and click on upcoming events. Earlier in the show we said we talked about Knoxville Atheist calling TV show broadcasting here in Knoxville. Well, it's called The Free Thinkers United Coalition of Knoxville Online and you can find their videos on YouTube. They stream every Wednesday night. I believe it is and maybe Monday night. You'd have to go and look for it. Go to YouTube and search for four words Free Thinkers United Coalition of Knoxville and for their earlier TV shows you could search for Free Thinkers Freethought Forum Knoxville. There are types of the show should be on there but we had it on the air for 10 years. If you're interested in getting involved in the TV or this radio show come to an ask me to rejoin us online on our Facebook pages Atheist Society of Knoxville Rationalist of East Tennessee you could be our next co-host or guest with us on the show we have co-host Wombat, hello Wombat we also have Boudreau the red pirate Hicks George and Dale what are we talking about now death we have the lights I thought we were talking about our favorite scenes from Christopher Nolan's best trilogy the Batman trilogy and my favorite scene is when Batman goes into the interrogation room with Joker there and he's like fewer feedback fewer feedback fewer feedback fewer feedback so we're done responding to comments that are listed on our last comment feed also we have a reddit group street epistemology or rslash street epistemology we have other links that you can leave feedback on at the end of the show feel free to check them out John Cawart quick comment he just wants to say this was a fantastic talk he's talking about our last topic which was science versus religion what changes the most also Nathan Matthews says and I'm reading this without making sure there's no cursing so please be good please leave time comments but it says Nathan Matthews says for any intelligent life in the universe that has curiosity such as we do should we expect to see religion as much as science the desire for answers leads to methods of discovering science but does this imperfect development always lead to creating religions if so maybe in an odd way we shouldn't be ashamed of discussing our religious history of intelligent life we are imperfect aliens are imperfect it wouldn't be that crazy of a thing to bring up in a conversation and I was like thank you very much for that feedback Nathan so like maybe there is some common ground there if we were to bring up religion with aliens they might be like yeah we had that too or like yeah we have this too it's kind of cool all right Dredd Pirate you had some comments that you'd like to go over yeah so Min made a couple of comments and he brings up he says based on my understanding of the Kubler-Ross model religion more productively something that secular sources tend to lack and then says what is your suggestion false hope is a as a temporary cure and may even lead to bigger problems in the future it's always good to question things one thing I'd like to say about that is religion doesn't have a lock on hope you can hope for whatever you want nobody knows what the afterlife if there is one is going to be like be aware that hope can be used as a hook to lead you around by the nose yeah be aware of that even to the point where you're willing to lie to someone on their deathbed that's how deep it goes and so another viewer says the only time I didn't have time to feel or think anything I came back but if I hadn't I wouldn't know anything about it yeah it's the interesting thing like the hardest part about death is dying I think a lot of people tend hey Dredd Boudreau I'm gonna fill this out at you there are a lot of songs about and I'm only throwing this out specifically to you you'll see why there are a lot of songs about dying in like metal of course but you also have your alternative rock that tries to be kind of hooky with it and then even country songs will have like their nice serenades of lost loves lost dogs stuff like that do you think death culture is becoming like this new thing like we used to maybe see it as something we're afraid of in the past we may came reverent of it and now it's sort of like this comical character with a hood kind of looks cute with like a skull face we can turn into like an anime character like is it as scary as a culture now and what does that say about culture ah that's a good one yeah I guess being that we are a lot more connected to other cultures and other groups I think we can kind of talk about it a little more freely imagine if you go back far enough it's this mysterious you know death will come especially when we didn't know a lot about you know biology and diseases and how they might take you early but yeah I suppose you know we really do kind of characterize death as this like you know got the sickle and the or the sith or what is it and then yes there you go and the hood yeah we kind of kind of joke about it and make it kind of silly maybe that's a good way to that we're kind of confronting it like we're coming to terms that it is a thing before compared to just ignoring it the entire time yeah yeah I think I think George has his hand up yeah George I did because the question of course is coming to me about what do you learn in Christianity you know traditionally what do you learn about death because as I see it death is presented as a transition into the afterlife right you know as a musician you know I come to Bach's cantatas in which I find that death is presented as a release from the suffering of life you know as presented to the peasants in the congregation Larry what do you think well it brings me back to this great sacrifice that Jesus should are supposedly made for us you know he died for our sins he died for every one of us but in Christianity really death is just a change of address nah he just continued living it's the classic jokes I like the most I shouldn't grown and smile at that it's still good it's still good he was God he was God then he was person then he was God where's the sacrifice did he just spend a bad weekend for you basically it Jesus is bad weekend coming to you in theaters when COVID is gone rated PG-13 right Dret we're going to throw this out at you what do you think we've how do you think we've evolved as a culture as far as accepting death and has the prevalence of it in like media like music and art and like as caricatures is that an indication that we're coming to better terms with it or is it like we're obfuscating the matter so just can you rephrase that just a little sure how do you think my dog was walking around so I oh you have a lot of walking dog yes of course how do you think we evolved with the concept of death over time like say a hundred years ago to now like have we improved our relationship with death now that we seem to understand it better seem to be more aware of it so I I think even you know the medical establishment is starting to come around to some degree and you know you know the idea of assisted dying you know certainly Kevorkian blazed a trail there and I think you know over time people are becoming more comfortable with it I think also as as the shift towards non-religiosity grows and gains some momentum people are you know less inclined to you know have this you know delusion about afterlife and reflect on the reality of existence I also think it was interesting about Kevorkian because he was citing in a lot of his work Hippocrates or the guy who we based the Hippocratic Oath off of which is like it's not about putting in guys organs in a jar or on a table and connecting them and making them live as long as possible it's about quality of life that we should be really concerned with and even that was true even back when we had the first doctors so like what we're trying to do is doctors improve quality of life not quantity and there's dignity and someone saying this with no hope in the future cute doggies though alright so del we'll throw this out at you we're going to hope we're crossing our fingers what do you think culture needs to learn more about death if we're at this point what do I can you hear me yeah yeah perfect what do you think culture stands to learn I have no idea perhaps you should throw that one to somebody else I don't understand the question fair enough what do you think culture has left to learn about death I think I think quite a bit it seems like the more we know we're still we're still plagued by it in every way and in terms of you know losing a loved one and I don't know maybe maybe science can kind of kick in at some point and you can record someone's entire life if someone say science I have things I want to say there are a lot of PhDs on this call so like respect you to Eric but yeah maybe maybe at some point we could never lose anyone because you could basically revisit any part of their life at any time I don't know I don't want that I don't want that I'm thinking science fiction I'm thinking okay okay to where we actually deal with life in a different way it's like I would I would like at least culturally for us to listen to scientists more with the concept of death I think particularly with this COVID situation that if we listen to scientists first and predominantly only really we would have saved a lot of lives and that we can still be in that position where we can save a lot of lives and the anti-intellectualism that is pushed not only by the current administration that we have but also by just the tenure of well I'm smart you can't be smarter than me therefore and I'm a patriot therefore I don't have to wear this mask therefore I don't have to wash my hands and I can cough right in front of your face it's not a big deal let's hang out with each other I forgot who raised their hand first George why don't we go to you Larry afterwards and then Dredd I forgot what I was going to say Fair enough Larry what do you got about death he didn't have anything he really wanted to say about that particular question but I was just going to open the field do you have any thoughts on death that you'd like to share with us me? yeah well if you want to experience death usually the closest thing that I can think of would be to go under general anesthesia where you have no sense of the passing of time or a sense of self or anything like that you go under no idea of the passage of time it's about as close as I can think of that's coming to avoid being an avoid you just take a nap and stand and emerge it seems safer sorry no you have a passage of time when you sleep really don't have that sense of when you have general anesthesia okay George where you dream you have something like that George what you just said having recently been under anesthesia I received a text message from the anesthesiologist saying what was your experience would you care to post this on a social medium and I replied hey man I was unconscious what do you want from me forget about it yeah Del you had some lingering points sorry I was going to say that I've worked in emergency rooms and critical care units in several different hospitals I've probably seen about 200 people die most of the time it's when they don't have a chance to say something before they pass away and then you have the individuals there are intractable pain or they know that they're going to die and one of my instructors I was asking about this how should what should you talk about how should you address the fact that the personnel knows that they're going to die too eventually and his suggestion was that you take your clues from the person if they want to talk about some particular aspect of dying then be open to them if they don't want to and they want to ignore it that's their business you talking before about how to address death and for me that's worked quite well yeah I was thinking like science fiction jumping off what Boudre says and combining with Dale is like a training camp for people who need to come to terms with death where they go to a building get put under and then wake up with no passage of time and then should you charge someone for that though it seems like oh man you literally wasted my money because it's any of that it's the most dreadpilot where can we find your stuff at well we are live streaming right now on my youtube channel at mind pirate m-i-n-d-p-y-r-a-t-e and it's eight o'clock in the morning here in BC Canada Pacific Standard Time or Pacific Daylight Time and we run from eight to nine so that's where you can find it very cool Boudre I know you got a lot of stuff going on you've never plugged your band before but it has a soundcloud account and I'd like to hear the music that was on there again where can I find that and where can we find stuff from you in the future yeah so Orange Whip is the only original band that was ever in where we actually recorded quality stuff don't say that well you can always be your harshest judge you can always be your harshest judge but we do have a soundcloud search Orange Whip one word we got it from the Blues Brothers who wants an Orange Whip Orange Whip Orange Whip Orange Whip so it was a fun band we did a lot of original stuff but then we also covered a lot of different music including Cream's Disraeli Gears album which was fun nice and then Foo Fighters too right a bunch of Foo Fighters covers no not that bad no that was a darker time we don't bring that up where can we find your stuff in the future I know you're working on a podcast pretty soon right yeah man I'm waiting on my co-hurt to sell his flip his house we're going to get back into it but we our current plan is to do some podcasts from the from the water on kayaks and recorded nice I keep promising guys I'm just saying make the podcast about flipping a house and why it's hard for a friend to do that then you're good maybe that's the way to do it George you better have something to plug yeah a little micro story on the way out here about death that just occurred to me way way back during the 1960s I set up a harpsichord for an internationally famous harpsichordist that Carnegie Hall in New York her name was Sylvia Kind and I looked her up recently she liked my work and I looked her up recently online and found an obituary for her in the Seattle newspaper in which the nurse who attended her on her deathbed said that the harpsichordist said I think I'm ready to die now and she did well pregnant but with dignity I like that so it's bittersweet Dale if I want to find out listen I have an internet connection and a bleeding question I've had my entire life was how did Jesus do it I've been thinking about that myself all the time and I'm like can't I combine the technology I have access to and these lingering questions to figure out how Jesus did it can you give me a clue of what I should do I could give you a clue but I don't understand what you're saying if you're wanting to know about howjesusdidit.com that's a place where you can go where you can find out how Jesus did the miracles oh man that is exactly what I'm looking for howjesusdidit.com and you can find out all you need wonderful do you put your sculpture work or artist's work available for commissions online or anything like that do you have anything like that no I've sold a few pieces long ago but I don't don't do that anymore fair enough fair enough you can find my stuff at Let's Chat that's this channel right here we do socratic examination SE whatever you want to call it and I strive to learn how to talk to people about anything and try to understand them in the process and I think it's a worthwhile hobby you should check it out you can see that Dreadpart does the same thing too Larry does the same way too I've even had Boudreau on my channel doing SE with folks everyone does it differently that's okay there's going to be variations but it's good to show that you can inform how you what you're comfortable with and what you can send to in this chance to give people the opportunity to think critically about what they believe to be true and that's worthwhile Larry, what do you got to say? Well, anybody who's interested in what I have to think or say about religion I should visit my blog on digitalprepa.com make sure you click on the blog button I have a book on on Amazon it's called atheism what's it all about you can find it there in paperback and in electronic format if you're having trouble leaving religion beliefs behind you can go to recoveringfromreligion.org and maybe get help from them if you'd like to listen to our broadcast they are available through iTunes, digital luminary podcast.com et cetera et cetera just go online and do a search for digital free thought radio hour if you have questions for the show you can send them to askanatheistat noxfolatheist.org then we'll answer them on future shows we're going to start having shows that are dedicated to listener questions maybe this month maybe next if you're watching this on YouTube be sure to like and subscribe to be notified for new episodes are coming up and remember everybody is going to somebody else's hell the time to worry about it is when they prove that heavens and hells and souls are real until then don't sweat it enjoy your life and we'll see you next week right here in Noxfolathe it's 7 o'clock on Wednesday and streaming online as well say goodbye everybody goodbye everybody goodbye your lives in the night