 French lick. Okay There we are guys We are alive on the metal voice, you know another tribute To our friend Steve Grimmett, but this time around we have a Nick Bocott who's spent Years with Nick as a badmate as a friend But before we begin I just want to outline sort of the what's going on in regards to the funeral Let me just bring it up. So for everybody out there you can still first of all I'd like to say that the GoFundMe page is still up It's very expensive the funeral and the aftermath of the funeral the you know Steve as we mentioned many times Was not a rich man He was always I guess will say struggling in a sense Of course being handicapped as well later on in his life. It didn't help his financial matters So any money that you can you know send their way to the Grimmett family much appreciated The link was not put up by the Grimmett family is put up by friends who were you know passionate about helping The Grimmett's out nearly especially Because the funeral costs were so bad and there's a lot of bills to be paid after the funeral So if you can you know lend some support there much appreciated number two on Wednesday the 7th oh And by the way the link is in the video description for the GoFundMe So in this video description there there is where the GoFundMe page link is number two Wednesday September the 7th at 2 p.m. UK time, which is 9 a.m. Eastern Standard Time Steve's funeral will be held at Toxbury Abbey After that there will be a the There will be a wake held at the Watson Hall in Toxbury just a few minutes away walk away and They encourage everybody to show up. There's gonna be a glass of Raising a glass for Steve and a bit of food for everybody And in this event will also be streamed. I hope I didn't forget anything So for the people around the world who can't be Physically at this funeral the event will be streamed at the link will be shared in the description as this video After we finished here. Okay. I hope I mentioned everything if I forgot anything Nick, please You know advise us. Cool. I will do first and foremost Two things Jimmy and Alan. Thank you so much for the heartfelt Tributes you've already paid to Steve Because I know they meant the world to me I know they meant to will to Millie and the Grimit family and probably to Fanzel of the world as well so thank you so much for that and Just a minor point. It's Toxbury. It's and that's just That's just a weird English pronunciation For this mispronunciation, it's kind of this thing. Yeah, talk talk Spurri sounds cool. It's gonna Yeah, I will confess. I never learned to read Toxbury, thank you Right off the bat, you know is there we'll just start off by saying Nick. Thank you so much for jumping on Just you know, tell us your thoughts of Steve and you know and just finding out of his passing You know, but let's just start things off like that. Yeah, you know Well as as we all know, you know, sadly Steve lost his leg a few years ago while on tour in South America and You know that obviously didn't help matters, but Steve being Steve Got back on it. I was gonna say got back on his feet got back on his foot as soon as possible after that and got back on stage And if people think I'm being horrible by saying that that foot joke My first conversation with Steve, you know, I called him after after the surgery and we started joking about hey But like the next time we played together and it will become grim reaper again We should both dress as pirates so he can come on the big leg and you know And that was Steve's spirit, you know the thing I loved about Steve Grimmett and it's a common place A thing for people to go after someone sadly passes. Oh, they were the best person ever and that's not always true I'm afraid to say but in the case of Steve He was an exceptional human being as I know both Jimmy and Alan. I'm speaking to you right now I can attest at no ego very selfless Very interested in others. He made you feel like he was talking to you not like you were talking to him and Wonderful sense of humor and he was a glass half full guy, you know, I think there are two types of person on this planet Some view the glasses half empty and emptying even more Steve always thought as I was being okay It's half full. Let me fill it again And that's just a perception thing and it paid dividends for him obviously because What he achieved in his 62 years and it's horrible to say that 62 is way too short Was quite remarkable not not just the grim reaper stuff, but that onslaught record keys What a great album that was in search of Saturday why that didn't take them to To be the big five. Yep, exactly It should have been the big five based on that album It's really that good and unfortunately it didn't for whatever reasons the music industry that we all know is a fickle thing It just didn't click for whatever reason it didn't go viral it to use common Like modern terms, but yeah, he was that he was always, you know that the biggest compliment I can play Steve apart from his voice which goes with that saying is I was looking back and I honestly can't remember him ever getting really angry and shouting at someone Because that just wasn't in his nature Like he would get sure he would get upset, but he didn't get nasty or obnoxious or curse someone out He would just try and fix it. And you know, that was part of his persona, which is why Which is which is why I think he impacted so many people that met him because he had that Like he had that aspect of himself that he was a real guy and you can't phone that any of you can't fake that So yeah, but and the voice kind of like I said goes with that saying I mean Prior to me for I formed grim reaper with another singer back in 79. I think it was god damn old but anyway, um, the We were very much so there were three local bands that really sort of were big in our very small local area And by big I mean we were the ones on the on the little circuit And there was a much much more prolific circuit back in those days pubs were pubs would have bands play clubs would have bands play So we were grim reaper Steve was in a band called Medusa and there was another band called Rothschild Yeah, and what is that attack attack attack? Yeah, and they were really really good, too They were and everyone we go up weren't your rivals. It's like no we supported each other Like you know on the on the see you in hell video we borrowed stuff from both Medusa and Rothschild to make that, you know And it was just so What happened was well actually what happened was Medusa kind of fragmented because two members went to join Rothschild and Paul the old singer and the original green reef was more van Halen meets David meets um thin Lizzie because he was much more of a full line at kind of a singer And not that I I'm anything I shouldn't even be in the same sentence as Eddie van Halen the late great Those were our influences And you know Steve was in Medusa and so once he became free and then grim reaper was on the verge of signing to heavy metal records Which was our first real release apart from the demos was we were on an album called heavy metal heroes Which is probably has the worst album cover ever made in the history of metal, which is saying Which you say it looks like it was drawn drawn by a five-year-old blindfolded in the dark. It was really I'm looking at fear no evil here. I don't know if that's hard to beat too Well, you know, that's that's sort of one of our the problem is the bar was set with this. That's the problem Yeah, the bar was set really well with that one actually and I was maintained by the way going off off topic But you know, we always branded ourselves the ugliest band in the world And I'm always convinced that the reason to see you and how remains the best selling of those three albums of which I'm all I'm proud of them all Is I've always maintained the reason that sold the best as we were smart enough not to put our pictures on the back cover That had a negative impact moving you know what you know what it is you guys are like me and Al We're just regular guys. We're no models or anything. We're just regular guys, right? But I guess back then right If you weren't like up here in terms of looks and so forth, right? You were considered You know, you know, not normal in a sense, right? Yeah, you had to yeah, it was it was a very but funny enough, you know, I My favorite bands back in the era were not sort of good-looking bands, I guess, you know with the greatest respect to the guys and Judas Priest, they you know Rob is I think mr. Halford's one of the finest singers to ever walk this planet and I think steve belongs in that bracket But you know, he wasn't Sebastian Bach, shall we say? Who was also a great singer by the And a funny guy, I like Okay, when you first go ahead in the eye of the beholder a because in Lemby's autobiography He said he finished second at David Coverdale and sexiest man alive one year or so Yeah, go figure right. Yeah, and I'm amazed the blind people knew where to vote. But anyway Um, I just lost my train of thought Um When you first heard Steve sing Like like the first time you go, oh gosh, this is like an A-list singer here. You know, this is this is not your regular you know Graphy new wave of British heavy metal singers. This is this is the real deal here was that what were your initial thoughts? Well, what's interesting is and I had this conversation with a friend of mine the other day is that I was aware of that, you know, I would go and watch Medusa and they were great And Steve's voice impressed me, but you don't really get you don't realize how good he is until you're actually standing in a room with him You're playing the guitar and then he opens that math and the first time he did that I stopped playing And only and a similar similar thing happened with a I'll let something out of the bag now. Hopefully I'm not some I'm touching wood here. Hopefully I'm not going to jeopardize it one of the um, this is one of these off This this this conversation has already gone so far off on many tangents. So I'm going to take you off on another tangent um One of the few good, you know, once again looking at covetous being the glass is being half full as opposed to half empty one of the blessings Covid gave me and I mean this sincerely was It enabled me to do some quarantine jams with steve with um, I did it with We have a mutual friend called steve stein who's a great guitar player great youtuber And him and steve did an album called grim stein Way back when well not way back when maybe about 10 years ago And when covet first hit in the lockdown started, um, steve stein phoned me up and said hey, I'm going to do a quarantine jam with some session playing friends Well, he's he's he's got a drummer friend who's a session player. He's got a really great bass playing friend who plays in the band hairball Brian And Joel steven that's the drummer who only plays sessions, but you know, actually does Does like stadium gigs with big name players He said would you like to be involved and I went I would love to be involved. What's the song? He said, uh, heaven and hell and my brain immediately started to make excuses as to why I couldn't do it because Ronnie james deal with is one of those guys who's up there again and if it's going to be an okay singer I you can't do that So I would think you got if he tells me someone who I don't think you can match I'm gonna have to be busy that they paint I'm gonna wash my hair Exactly well put sir well put no I'm off to do a modeling gig. Sorry can't play it. Yeah, so um He went. Oh, no, it'll be he said good question. He goes steve. I said steve as in grim it he went. Yeah, I said I'm in Yeah Steve crushed it. I don't know if you've ever seen that but it got to like 600,000. Yes. Yes, we did. Yeah, which is quite ridiculous and then we went on to do Steve was a big covered elf and so we did uh still the night then we did um Number of the beast which was a lot of fun because we got my good friend Courtney from the iron maidens on it as well and we got craig gas the amazing impersonation comedian to do the intro and then And then the last one we did and he did it magnificently and actually rust grim it On that video rust grim it steve so much he did the made the video like he actually edited. Yeah school And then we finished with slight with slide it in no was no slow and easy Oh, yeah, it's it's I get white snake confused because of all the double entendre's they have but yeah It was slow and easy versus slide it in and um my My grand plan was to once coven was finally over and done with which sadly it's still not over and done with Even though it's not in the news anymore. Um, I wanted to finish it off with see you in hell um, we never got a chance to do that unfortunately, so I was talking to steve stein after I heard the dreadful news and I didn't and I didn't post anything until I heard it from Like the family like million rust There's so much fake news. I remember years ago some idiot posted that Phil candler passed And he was he was he was actually in brazil or somewhere and that His family found out via some idiot's post and he and he didn't and he hadn't passed it was false news But he broke he ruined the family's life for god knows how many hours until it was proven otherwise and so I'm very aware of irresponsible posting so Once it was confirmed Then I sort of crafted my sort of I I guess for once for the better word my eulogy to steve or at least my first one and Then I was speak to steve stein that evening and we were talking about stuff we could do to help the family You know because as you've correctly pointed out and for those listening any even if it's 50 cents Please throw something in the go fund because the funeral is extremely extremely expensive and as you've as jimmy correctly pointed out there will be an aftermath and You know steve we never made any money from grim from from grim reaper We got to tour america three times. We got to do things. I never thought we'd do and I view that as my payment You know being on mtv Yada yada yada, but you know this I I haven't bought anything from funds from grim reaper But I had an amazing time that had the time of my life But to quote hunter s. Thompson the late great You know don's a journalist. I think his my favorite quote of his many great quotes was I think it goes something like the music industry is a shallow plastic trench where thieves and dogs roam free and good men die like dogs There's also a there's also a negative side Which is perfect actually thieves and pimps he said thieves and pimps run free And good men die like dogs dot dot dot. There's also a negative side and that sums up the industry You know everyone from elton john dan who's one of the richest guys on the planet Was ripped off blind by the industry, but that's just what it is But what i'm trying to say here is that everyone might they might look at spotify and go wow grim reaper We got a million streams of such and such Me and steve haven't seen a penny from that yet So and that's going to be about 30 cents. I think all right. So so steve told me and alan Actually, I want to state this again the link to the go fund me which was not put up by the grimmond family. Yes Is is by friends concerned friends who want to help out because milley's got way too many bills And she wants to also make sure that this is streamed and he's got the right send off It's in the link of this video. So just click on that. Give what you can like nick said just give what you can That's all we asked for, you know, and hey, it's the 31st anniversary of rocket house to share that With with the link in case you've got friends who how dare they aren't watching this. So yes um There's just so many questions the money aspect. So steve told me and alan a few times. Yeah that there was Funds there was money sitting somewhere frozen But he couldn't not get access to this money until the court cases were resolved He also told us that the music guild set them in the uk set them up with lawyers To sort of go after that money that was never Paid out to you guys Maybe you could expand on that a little bit. Yeah, I could one of the I'll I'll I'll just finish the initial thing Sorry, yes So going back to the scene how things so I I said to you know myself and steve stein were talking about that And steve said it would be kind of cool if we could do that and maybe bolster the Like the go fund me and stuff which which we knew was going to happen because of concerned friends and um Once again the problem arose of who do we get to sing it? and I I had three choices and my first choice was Because he'd done stuff with steve recently Like it like just prior to covet. He did something with steve. He has a very similar voice And said it was recent not sort of 30 years ago And I think that's kind of important And the other reason is the first time I heard this man open his voice On a stage when I was playing guitar. I did the exact same thing I told you about when I was playing with when steve on this matter. I stopped playing Wow And at the risk of name dropping which I'm now going to shamelessly do It was I think the it might have been 2000 Maybe 2010 or two or a little bit earlier. We did a dime We did a dime bash actually at well, we've we've always done the dime bash at nam But we did one in the hilton hotel And I turned up early for soundcheck And it was myself um Jason bitner was from shadows fall now and overkill was playing drums um On guitar was this little Guy with the goatee scot Ian or something from Amazing guy amazing player. Who's a scrawny informer? Yeah, some From some band called arctic or something Yeah Yeah from the train band and the other one And the bass player may he also rest in peace was paul gray From slipknot and we were playing I think it was a kiss song or something and Then ripper showed up and grabbed a mic and started singing and I stopped playing and i'm pretty sure that did as well Because it was like the holy mother of where did that come from? so I found out I I contacted ripper and said hey, you know we want to do this as a tribute and hopefully to help raise funds and Awareness because a lot of there's so much white noise and on social media right now Stuff gets lost really quickly and ripper god bless him as agreed Nick sent it to him. So you just froze this for a second So yeah ripper said yes, and we've already I've already recorded my parts We've dropped the song dance to eflat And myself steve and the drum have already recorded their parts brian's on tour with hable he'll get back And I believe once again without trying to Russ is going to edit the video. So we will we'll do that obviously post funeral but just to keep the To keep the celebration of life moving forward and I think that's really important now to To celebrate the life. Yes, it is sad It's extremely sad. We're all grieving But I'm also grateful and this might sound like an oxymoron, but I'm grateful that I'm sad because If I wasn't it meant I didn't I never knew steve or worked with him and and that's me's an unacceptable alternative. So We've had ripper on the show and you're talking about a fantastic voice, but very similar in steve very down to earth a very You know just loves the loves music. I mean he'll play anywhere anytime and he's just a great guy as well ripper Oh, no, I like I nick nick just just pause right there pause right there The diligence compound said I made a donation. I hope this helps. So if anybody makes a donation, I'll read their name Just just to be cool, right? Go ahead nick. Apologies. Yeah, so yeah, but I agree like the last time ripper came through fort wane I got up and I played What did we play? I think we played metal Was it uh, no we played grinder like I I just Binder and his voice it's just like like to play a song like that with a voice like that behind you It's like, you know, one of my one of my bucket list one of my favorite going back to anthrax one of my favorite anthrax songs is madhouse And joey invited me to play two shows opening for twisted sister with his band when he wasn't in anthrax And we played a bunch of anthrax songs But one of them was madhouse and to play that riff and then hear that voice come in The same kind of thing goose bumpy stuff. Anyway, so yeah getting back to them to the money stuff Trying to make a very long and messy story short and not too messy We grim reaper one a couple of battle of the bands competitions We got we got some serious interest but the majors weren't interested in in metal bands in england really they'd already got iron maiden and sax and yada yada And diamond head they just signed diamond head. So we ended up signing a deal with a company called ebony And see you in hell was recorded in two and a half days in What you guys would call welfare housing? It's called a cancel house in in england, but it was literally in hull Which I think see you in hull we always often do Frickin like a portana is a semi detach which means his his neighbors and him shared the same wall His student his his desk was in the kit. What was effectively the kitchen? And we recorded in the front room the tea room Yeah, and we literally like bass drums and first guitar because I double all the guitars They were recorded live So we literally got all of so we got bass drums and guitar And most of the second guitar was done in day one and then day two was guitar solos and vocals number three was just making sure we had Day two and a half was making sure we hadn't missed anything and that was it And the reason we could do that is we'd been playing the damn stuff for two years And if we couldn't go in and play it Right off the bat then we probably shouldn't have been there. Anyway long story short. We were just happy to have a record out Then rca got interested And that's when things started to slowly but surely You started to go what's going on here financially because By the time we got to rocky to hell, which we actually started recording with this plan But but but never finished it. He'd gone literally and I'm not I'm not kidding. He went from a From this council house, which was welfare housing To literally a castle in the country Like a mansion by a self-standing Monolith of a place And it's like and he had a band called shy. He were really good whose vocalist also sadly passed away. Tony And he had a couple of other bands But I think we were the one that made him the most money and it's like I'm pretty sure he didn't It wasn't through his entrepreneurial skills. So Long story short our management And rca were looking at this guy going there's something you're not you should not be where you are financially so They wait they what happened was when when rocky to hell was about to After he sent the first tapes of rocky to hell back to rca and advance went to him Of which we were supposed to get a percentage and we never had a percentage prior to that They waited 30 days until after we were supposed to get that and then Management went you're in beach to contract your empathy And this is where this is where he gets interesting and quite sad as well So this guy was so stupid He decides so we signed directly to rca america He decided so and then they said we're gonna Screw these tapes. They're not they're not as good as they should be We're gonna put you with max norman. I was like what I'm gonna record with the guy who did Some of my favorite albums including, you know, the two ozzy albums Yeah, so, you know, because up until then I was effectively Effectively the producer daryl johnson just hit record and mixed. He didn't produce anything. Well, the arrangements were mine and also steve's obviously with backing vocals and stuff So it was interesting after two albums to go in a studio with max And have him going yeah, that's really good bit changed this this and this and I had this devil and angel On the you know, like the tum and jerry thing the devil's Tell this short guy to f off and the angel was going It's max norman you moron listen to him Go back and listen to look at look at your favorite albums max norman is the boss Pause pause right there. Okay. Marcy douglish. He's making a donation and every time there's a donation I'll just pause you and just want to be polite here Uh, and you know check out her new cd as well. Okay, go ahead So, yeah, so anyway, so so we get to record an album that I think did demand justice In terms of what we were capable of because max norman is like you said the man Alan and um, so we but we basically we did that we did the tour with armad saint and halloween And it was okay back and make another record and then daryl johnson sued us. It took him a like a year to sue us So he decided to take out a counter lawsuit against the breach of contract So he sued the band But this guy was so stupid. He sued the wrong rca He sued and i'm not going to mention the guy's name because yeah, well, just I think we should Like I hate it when someone does something noxious and you know his name It's like I don't care to know the name of this person, but I'll just say he's an asshole Excuse my french, but so he sued rca england So he spent a bunch of money getting a lawyer To sue rca england and rca england they told they called me up as like the Our a and r person was literally after she goes she goes I wish I could have been there for the call because the guy called and said hi I'm legal counts for rca and he goes. Yeah Glad to hear if it's all you see when court. He goes. No, you weren't he goes. Why not? He goes you sued the wrong rca It's rca usa and he said and and the guy said and just so you know Just so you're aware you can't just take white out and Get rid of k and put s a because it's a different legal system And he couldn't afford to sign he couldn't afford to resue And under the american situation So we just ended up landlocked in this ridiculous lawsuit, which is why and we were in such a bad financial state We actually got you know free legal counsel and anyway Oh, it goes the story goes on and on and on it It eventually split the ban because because we literally were landlocked And steve offered the onslaught gig We tried to use it as a lever and rca said you know what nick We think grim reaper's done. We just want to keep you and this is a great gig for steve So steve went to onslaught and i went to america But that's pause right there pause right there scott britain says i just donated he says he'll give what he can God bless you scott god bless you So anyway, so what happened was so either what so i so me and steve part on the best of you know I love steve to death, but we both think we both knew we could either He could go on with onslaught who had who on paper were going to be the next big thing And I I went to watch a rehearsal. I went to watch them rehearse. It was amazing I went to see them recording out in new york because they recorded while I was there Or we agreed that you know the best thing to do as much as it broke our hearts Grim reaper at least had to go and hold if not Like on temporary hold he got to onslaught. I'd go with rca So anyway while I was in america I got a call from someone they said look we know you can't because the legal stuff you can't Be directly involved, but will you let us know everything you can about the situation? With ebony records and it was actually someone from he said you will not be mentioned We will not reference you at all But you know what what can you tell us? And it was it was there was a big tv expose a tv show Like did a 60 minutes on this guy as a thief basically like they exposed him on national tv And he went bankrupt within two weeks because all the people he was doing business with went you know what We're out. No, we're not distributing your stuff. No, you're not doing this. No, you don't have credit And I think he lost the castle. I don't really care And his wife that his wife who was who was who was implicit throughout it, you know, she was his evil twin Had the audacity to call me because I'm I'm trying to sue daryl for for um I'm suing for divorce. I need your help and it's like I'm giving you no help because you're Can you make him out to be a bad person? You mean like you were so So karma. Yeah. Yeah, karma's a bitch and to quote and to quote um To quote bring me the horizon's Amazingly resistant and it has no deadline Oh, uh, yeah, yeah, because it doesn't but anyway, so yeah, so he so there's a bunch of money there But where that money if that money still exists. I don't know because When someone goes bankrupt the banks get first dibs Yeah, I mean, you know, it's an iconic album to see and how is any truth You know the counts I read the story about the the council flat where you recorded But you also had to stop by like five o'clock in the afternoon because that's when all the neighbors were to come home from work Right. Yeah, which is which is which is why it took two and a half days as opposed to a day Yeah, but but but but like steve told us this was rehearsed. I mean, it wasn't like, okay guys Let's write songs on one day. These are the songs were down, right? Songs were down. You're just going to record them like our And the funny thing was too is that the album ended up being a lot like we never played the songs that fast But everyone just you know, you get that red light favorite on christful recording. So we wait a second the drumming I want to know about the timing on the drumming. This which is iconic in itself, right? It's sometimes it speeds up a little bit. It sometimes it goes slow a bit Yeah, that was that that was that was just what we were, you know Rock and roll. Yeah. No. Well, the funny thing is it's sort of like like we live in a day and age now Where everything is gridded everyone's got pro tools or garage band and they're looking at this damn grid But if you listen to the iconic records, not that i'm saying We we let's see when hell's iconic banished, which imagine but if you listen to led zeppelin Or you listen to that first guns and you listen to appetite of destruction Or for destruction rather you listen to the rolling stones the The tempo does this and it it'll push in places pull back in places And it was and the rest of the bands like that's just how we played the song It's okay. It's coming to the chorus ramp it up then slow it down And I've heard people trying Like like like they tried to uh, what do they call it? Like they can like they can actually auto correct stuff if you auto correct led zeppelin's looseness It becomes garbage relative to me. That's rock and roll. No organic It's got to be organic and that's what I and that's part of the charm of this album It's the organic Sounding nature of it, you know great songs organically sound Yeah, yeah, so it wasn't quantized was the word I was looking for you can Piss a button, but I mean this is this this is how This is how rock and roll it was though. I remember on one song. I went I kind of screwed up that chord and the the Mixed the producer went out. I'll just pull it back for that part. Don't worry about it Yeah, so it didn't even redo stuff and the only punching he could do was punching a clock He didn't had a punch in an act so the klaus klaus isakson says donated. So thank you very much klaus Thank you klaus but yeah I thought when we spoke to steve he mentioned that there was like a Maybe a partial fourth album that was in a can somewhere but from what yours is described I don't I don't know if there is the secret fourth album No, we we actually were the we actually did some stuff like we did a bunch of demos for for for rca And I wanted to call the album nothing whatsoever to do with hell just because yeah Kind of been done Yeah, it's been done. But yeah, so the answer is like, yeah, yeah, we did a bunch of stuff and I think someone some One of these I think someone got a copy of a copy of a copy and tried to put it out but Yeah, we did There were like I think there were five or six songs steve and myself penned. We also did two covers we did We you know because arcy was saying we need something for the radio And I was like cold sweat by thin lizzie. So we did. Oh, yeah Which is a great song and I think and we also did call me by diamond head But you know, I I still have them I still have the eight track. Well, the friend of friend of mine lent me one of the cheap eight track real to real Machines and I've I've still got the the master tapes, but I don't think you can find a machine that would play that stuff, but You know, so it's like it looks but it was like it was never finished. It was it and You know people ask me, you know, do you feel bad about grim reaper? You know, like the like the nick bokot grim reaper nick bokot steve grim it form of Of grim reaper finishing where it finishing and yeah, I am sad, but One of my favorite interviews ever was because I I became a journalist Well, I became a journalist during grim reaper and I know this is not one of your favorite interviews Is that what you're saying? No, no, no one of No, no one one one of my favorite interviews one of my favorite quotes with like like like past interviews Yeah past interviews Was with with with one of my heroes michael schenker and I was in a circus magazine because I I did the guitar column for like Oh, yeah, I remember that. Yeah Now that you bring it up, I remember yeah Yeah, which is a lot of fun because you know, it's like, okay, let me get the straight You you you want me to talk to someone I like and you'll pay me for okay good Like I'll do and that's what we do minus the pay business Exactly, although circuses checks towards the end did start bouncing, but that's another story Nobody gets paid No, um, but so I remember asking michael, you know, because he was if you look at michael schenker's career He was in ufo for a relatively short amount of time And he was a kid. I think he was 17 when he did rock bottom in the studio something like that And so this was in you know He'd made, you know, maybe seven or eight msg albums by the time I interviewed it Which would have been the mid probably the mid 90s. No. Yeah mid 90-ish. So I said I said michael so, um Looking back, why do you think you're you're you're relatively short life with UFO why those records are held in such reverence and is it okay if I if I if I use bad language on this show Or do you rather not You know, it's fine. It's fine. Go ahead. Go ahead as long as it doesn't get too crazy. I guess So he said Michael's and I'll never forget it because he because you had that act you you had you had his wonderful german His two tonic accent which which which I cannot impersonate but I'll oh I can Yeah So his answer was so, you know, so the question was once again Why do you think those relatively few that short amounts of time in those relatively few albums are held with such esteem and deemed iconic today and he said his answer was It was because we never got the chance to make the record that everyone went why the fuck did you make that piece of shit? He got in and he got out Yeah, and that eventually happens through every band where you go I just hope you didn't ask him about his brother because me and alan have asked him about his brother And just goes off on all kinds of tangents. Oh, no, I love michael shaker Yeah, there are certain things you can't ask michael, but yeah, what a great guitar player, but anyway, so I'm kind of I'm Even though it was only three albums that for whatever reason and if you if you had told me in 1983 which was when when steve myself wrote see you in hell that you know Almost 40 years later Kids who weren't even born would have patches of that on their jackets crazy. I would have told you I would have driven you to rehab myself to be honest Let me ask you this the iconic scream at the end of the song see you in hell Which is the money's that's the money. That's the money note will say right? When you first heard that you go, oh my god, what is going on here? I mean, what were your thoughts? Well, it's just that was that's what steve was capable of I don't know if he could circular breathe or not, but yeah, he could he could hold those notes and you know the funny thing is with with with with someone like steve is that He's the same as rob half it in a way that you think yeah, that probably took 15 hours in the studio Then he'll do it like Consistently not not one time but every night and that's what get oh, yeah. Yeah. He wasn't trained. That's what he told me He wasn't like a maybe he had some lessons. I'm not sure but he was not a trained singer. He just sang Other great thing is you could tell you know that they say we were we were likening him to like ripper and if you listen to Like there are certain there are two ways of getting high one is to do the Oh, what's his name? his eye Just in hawkins from the you know like you can do the falsetto darkness kind of thing And that guy killed it at um the dave grolford the food fighter's taylor hawkins tribute. By the way, I thought he was magnificent But but yeah, he's you kind of the You know like the falsetto thing or it come from deep within and the singers I like like the um Like the ronnie james deos the the rob halford's the david wanes may he rest in peace the yes Like like the joey belladonna's of this world and the steve grimmett's It comes an an obviously ripper. It's coming from the diaphragm and it's this huge It's a it's a it's a side, you know, you can seismographic proportions in terms of the power It's not the note. It's the power behind the note that gives it that the balls, I guess Well, toddlatori who was on our show that we did with milley a few a week ago, I guess He said it best, you know a great singer is you know when you have the chest voice and the head voice and you're not You don't notice the transition No, right And it's because the chest voice is or the head voice is just as powerful as the chest voice And that's what you're you're alluding to yeah I mean I think but basically like it came from within like like like to me it's it's it's heart and hands You know it's it's like it's like it's it's it's heart and head And then just his larynx, but also the lungs. Yeah Yeah, yeah, you know We met steve when he was going with steve grimmett's grim reaper And what I take about from that at that time is the great friendship between you and steve because it's like steve Have at it, you know, it was go everything's always always amicable as seen between you and steve I'm not using grim reaper get out there and keep the songs alive and that's that's the way I remember And at that time Yeah, well, I mean that that was our our agreement was sort of If I ever do something if I ever did a grim reaper thing, which I probably wouldn't I would call it nick but unless he was to sing it would be nick bokot's grim reaper and He went yeah, I'm gonna do the same and so But you know and thankfully there were several occasions We did sweden rock. We did a big be headlined a festival in chicago Played arizona. We played fort Wayne actually and also played the the whiskey like we headlined the whiskey, which was great because When we came through LA that was one of my bucket list gigs. I wanted to play the whiskey go go It's like no, you can't play there like you're too big. It's like come on But so anyway, we went years back years years later and it was just grim reaper Did you ever like have that urge to say, you know what a call up steve and say, you know, steve Let's just do this let's just do one last tour as grim reaper you and me Let's go for it. You know, well what we what I what I didn't I think there's actually something on the It's someone filmed it. It's it's somewhere out there on the internet after steve lost his vote after steve lost his leg I actually went on I went on public records saying hey Let's do the album that that that never was and steve Between us and everyone else listening because it's just just between the three of us whoever else is listed sas Yeah, steve steve wanted to do it too, but he couldn't because of the because the record contract he currently was was was on And I and I and I and I and I got that it's a shame, but I get it, you know It's like he he he made an agreement with with the company. So that was deemed never to be but So so I just to clarify so the fourth grim reaper album you wanted to finish with steve. Is that it? Yeah, I would like I wanted to do I I wouldn't do it with any other thing I mean, is is it repairable? Is there like did with the digital world that you can just go in whatever? Songs you have from that fourth grim reaper album And you're using today's technology The answer is that's something I I was actually thinking about that that the other day Just seeing if I could find if I could get a if I if I could find someone who had that machine It think so what kind of machine is it is a four and a three four quarter It was a it was a fosdeck eight track. I think it was called the a eight So so it put eight tracks on a relatively thin piece of tape So so you'd need the heads like like you'd need the correct heads But I think if if we could pull if we could pull steve's vocal off it we could reverse engineer everything So in other words if anybody out there if anybody Somebody must have it Was it real to real or was it cassette? No, it was real to real. So it was it was it was semi professional. It was really cool. Actually, it was a great machine Actually, I had a fosdeck's four track, but it was a cassette one Right. Yeah, that's they actually took out they actually took it to eight track But it but it but it was on quarter inches opposed to half inch of memory serves me correctly They managed to get eight it they managed to get eight tracks on a quarter inch. In fact While we're doing this. Yeah, I think it was called the fosdeck fosdeck a eight. So if anyone's got one of those Yeah, please see nick And ricks out to us on behalf of grim reaper fans everywhere. Please contact nick We will put you in the credits of the fourth album. Oh not in hell. Yeah This is nothing to do with hell. Yeah, nothing whatsoever. I think was the What about I mean, okay, so you what about touring where was that ever sort of on the table, you know, saying to steve I know there was one offs here and there, but was there were Um, well, there were we were actually talking about on the on on his next on the next run Which which he which he kind of had scheduled out Mm-hmm, and then kovat hit and stopped everything I think I was going to try and join join the band for like five or six Of the show was in succession. So it became like a tour within a tour Because like I was friends with all of his like his bandmates like his Like his bass player and um and guitar player and steve grimitz Grim reaper and reaper. Yeah, it's a mouthful. Yes. I know sg's gr Actually, strange enough. This says steve grimitz grim reaper if you look carefully, yeah Yes, no, I can see it. But the and thanks for wearing that by the way the the check is in the mail After the lawyers kind of find the money Well, listen to this. Oh, I'm nearly grimitz saying nick. We'll talk. I have a cunning plan about album number four. So Something's going on something's brewing Okay, good. I know steve is working on something. So yeah, like cunning plan. That sounds like something right out of black Yeah, yeah, if you listen to this millie god bless you and hey Hang in there. I'm late. She's watching she she uh, she you know made a wonderful statement on alasha. We did And anything you guys out there can do to support her and her family You know, uh for the funeral and after the funeral again, I will say it again. The link is in the video description Please help them out. No, yeah, so millie to be continued now. Now. I'm kind of intrigued but now What was I gonna say Yeah, so we were talking about playing and stuff so steve's as you probably know Steve grimitz grim reaper was was gonna play was gonna be the headliner of the night before the wonderfully named and wonderfully Curated keep it keep it true. Yes. First of all in germany It looks like i'm flying out to play that show with With with the band and we've got some special guest vocalists Which will be a wonderful tribute and the and the organizers oliver if don't know if he's listening to this But he is oliver says hey nick see you in a few weeks. I just saw his message oliver True. Thank you oliver for making that happen. That's truly And and they've made commemorative badges Which is just wonderful. Just wonderful. Wonderful. Then it's you know, I know steve sitting up there with Sadly too many of my friends have passed. He's probably sitting up up there with dinebag right now Having a black tooth going. Yeah, where the badge damn it Get your pool, but that will be done. But but yeah, it's um, you know, and I think I think it's behoove and upon us to Like to keep that fire burning because like that that voice is timeless in my humble opinion As is as is steve's legacy and I like said i'm extremely proud of those albums. The fact I you know, I teach at sweetwater now and I signed it. I signed an album just like literally on friday when my people was brought it in And he's like 16 for god's sake. So he was he was born 20 years after that And I'll never I'll never forget like like when we played the first big show Well, the the chicago show was great. But when we played sweden rock There was a signing session afterwards and I would say 95 of those who queued up and there were Shockingly large amounts of people god bless them um And they all had vinyl or CDs, but most of them had vinyl they were um They were all born way after the after that the albums from which those songs were called were recorded. So That's that's the beauty of metal in my humble opinion. That's that's why I think Heavy metal isn't like it's not a fad. It's not a this is nice. Wasn't it to quote lemmy one of my favorite lemmy quotes um, it's a lifestyle And if you're into heavy metal, it's it's it's it's it's four life Yeah, yeah, you know We definitely agree with that me and alan, you know Now we're talking about 11 12 years ago like our objective when we started this a long time ago Was to make sure that the grimmets and the bowcots and the grim reapers and the saxons, you know, they had a voice To sort of express themselves About their new music or their old music and sort of keep it going keep it the legacy going And that's sort of the goal of the metal voice from day one I can dare But it's also also to get the younger generations to know a lot of these great bands that Unfortunately, it took, you know, some for some fans it took steve's passing for them to go back and read Visit all these albums. Yeah. Oh, sometimes, you know, it goes, but it's you know, it's funny You bring it up. It's because You know, I was fortunate enough to be extremely close with with the late great dime bag And yeah and his his His his better half readers done an amazing job in like maintain making sure his shadow Has has nearly endured has become bigger if anything There's been a lot of cuffuffle about the the pantheri reunion or the panthera celebration and From from i've been asked about it a lot because I was fortunate enough to be good friends with both viny and dime and um The thing is there's there's a whole generation of people that love panthera And I see it literally on a daily basis because I teach panthera a lot There are kids that were born after the band was done But we've never seen it and when it comes to the when when it comes to the choices The the thing about panthera is it was a family vibe. That's what I loved about working with dime so much becoming so close with You've probably seen the discs behind me, so But it you became part of a family and it's still a family that family enjoys like like whenever I see Grady champion or reader or or cat Or wires. It's like or bobby tongs It's like time ceases tweaks. Do you do you forget how long has passed because it's like you were with yesterday And the one thing I can say with regards zack and charlie benantes charlie benante not only is an amazing drummer And a great riff writer too like charlie's Charlie's written a lot of the riffs for anthrax that people aren't even aware of and he can play a mean guitar He was close with both brothers, especially close with dime and zack And and dime were like brothers. There was a brotherhood there. There was a mutual respect. I was involved in that classic In the in the guitar world cover story with zack and Dime on the cover from start through finish That's one of the favorites a couple of days of my life even though it's a blurry memory because we drank it off to kill a small But there was a there was a genuine genuine camaraderie and mutual respect That's timeless, which is why I know daryl and I know daryl and vineyard up there smiling because it will give kids who've never had chance You know rex and rex and phillip is still around They're gonna go out there and do the best thing they possibly can and the one thing zack wild will bring to the table Even though this is off topic is Is is he will bring the the character energy that dime had which was an important part of the pantera thing It's not just the notes It's the attitude with which they were played and that was one of the reasons I love playing with steve is that he wasn't phoning it in ever He meant every single word be it a scream or not And that's why I think his his his music, you know, his his voice will remain Held in such high regard because you can tell there was a genuine passion Like it came from within it came from the heart. It wasn't like oh, this is the line. Let me sing it like this It's like no this his his heart was telling you how to sing I Think rock it a hell like see you in hell is of course we'll call it considerate the the classic of all classics, right? Well, thank you sir. Once again check the mail, but rock it a hell Will be that's another level rock it a hell. I find is especially music wise I don't think it was appreciated enough at the time even though it did, you know sell, right? Yeah, yeah, it did pretty good This album will be appreciated more as the years go by in the decades past Just the vocal just everything about this album is so it's like an underrated gem That's what i'm trying to say when you listen to his vocal ability His singing on this album is just off the charts. I mean, this is A complete a list singer. This is not this is you're talking about like like you said before this is like the ronnie james deal Level you're talking about rob halford level you're talking about bruce dickinson level Steve was up there. Yeah, no, steve. I mean, I I've always said I've said this I said this when he joined onslaught steve in my opinion is one of the top three or four vocalists to come out of england ever In the in the rock field. Yeah, let's see what and you know, and it's you know, that was the great thing I'm really thankful that you know the all of the bad that came from the ebony lawsuit the good that came of it Is the fact we got the chance to record with max norman and max norman masterfully pulled the best out of steve At the time and also he pulled the best out of the whole band. It was it was a holst Max's recording psychology was brilliant Well, and nick I gotta say that opening guitar solo the wasted love still blows my Head apart every time I listen to it. How many years 30 for 31 years later? So you had a great great part of that success as well, obviously. Well, thank you Yeah, the the the irony of that wasted love is that was actually written by myself and the and the old singer st Paul In fact, it was actually written after he'd left grim reaper. We Even though he didn't turn up for a signing which I thanked him for immensely after said, hey, you know I'd hate you for a couple of weeks, but thank you for not showing up Because because I would end up with you know We'd have done an album with an even worse label than and then everybody Yeah, I've got to tell you a story because it's like the like heavy metal records It was run by a guy called paul birch And and he ran it from his house, but he was allergic to birch trees and that You just can't make that stuff up And and I remember going going there when when when when when he showed the when he showed us the album cover like He didn't he didn't like our humor. It's like cool. What So did the kid who won this elementary? school competition, what did he get or what did she get for drawing this and they were like That's not funny. Look at it. It's awful You know what me and alan talk about this a lot and I'm just gonna bring it up. Okay Like when you go alan, you're frozen by the way. Yeah, he froze. Yeah Hang on. Let me just see what's going on here. Hold on. You might just drop. I think he's like in mid laugh Oops wrong one. Here we go. It's a good pitch to be frozen though. Maybe you know what I'm just gonna I'm just gonna pause and wait till alan comes back and I'll just put a picture Of you and steve in the meantime and we'll just talk from an audio perspective I'm just gonna grab alan back. He got him and I'll text him. Okay Hang on You gotta love technology. No, this is this is real time folks. This is live. No, this is just as like the first album Yeah, no edits. This is an so we're recording in a welfare house Jimmy's in the kitchen. I'm in the front room So what happens is when somebody drops off it kind of ruins my overlay. I have like an overlay With the logo and all that stuff. So I have to sort of regroup But once I see alan jump back on And we'll talk about when you get back Sort of the evolution of album covers how we went from like a complete masterpiece of you know album artwork To sort of like not to say they're terrible, but you know sort of You're going from the best to sort of you know less, right? Right. Yeah. Well, it's it's that's the trouble with I think you know inadvertently by accident that that first album cover raised the bar really high That's it. That's the problem, right? That was the problem. You know, you're going from the greatest album cover to But I mean, what did you think of you know the next to uh, the next to album cover? Well, funny enough that the guy who did the The the the guy who did the second album was a very talented drummer friend of mine The third album cover was done by gary sharp who's now no longer with us any more sadly Gary did the first album cover as well Okay. Yeah, so it was just I mean, but the one were you a little disappointed. That's what i'm trying to say Were you a little disappointed or you said, yeah, it's not too bad No, it's it's it's like, you know 2020 hindsight, you know hindsight towards 2020 as they say No, I I still like them for what they are, but that first one you can't touch it It's kind of like it's like one of those album covers. It's it's kind of like sonic temple by the cult Not strange strange enough and you know, we've talked about this. I bought this album. I believe I saw it in some magazine. I had no idea what the music sounded like And you know as a young guy who's like 16 years old or 15 years old I was just completely blown away when it was released And I bought it solely on the image Well, I mean that was the whole thing. That's one of the things it's funny But someone else I've been told that by a lot of people The most impressed the one that blew me away the most just because of What a nice person he is and how genuine he is was Dave Grohl Like the first time I met Dave Grohl was reader introduced me backstage at some Some I think it was a revolver a metal gods awards. She goes, hey Dave's still here. Do you ever met him? I said no, I'd love to so she introduced me to Dave And she was about to say who who I played with and he goes, I know who you are. You played with Grim Reaper I love that that And I thought he was just gonna say he goes that he and he said there's one song I really really like and I thought he's gonna say see you in hell because that's one a lot of people know by default by de facto and he said liar Great song and and it was like that was never on the radio So it's that holy shit this guy did own the record and I've since I've since got to spend some quality time with Dave Brohl because he works with us on the ride for dime stuff and dime bash like he he He actually barbecues for everyone and it takes him a day to do it So we had a long you know readers like Dave Dave likes to come come and hang out and we had a long talk about how things have changed I remember back in the day. I love vinyl because Vinyl had two great things number one. You got a 12 by 12 piece of art Yeah, and if it was a gatefold then you've got a great story and credits and everything else And vinyl you couldn't go over 20 minutes aside. Otherwise the quality deteriorated Because of this of the groove. So it was a great quality control as well But I would buy records if I could only buy one album. I'd go to the record store I'd put the four I wanted out and pick the one that I like the cover of the best Okay, here we go. Here comes allen. Okay Okay, I'm gonna bring on allen Uh, there he is Okay, here he is Yeah, I like the story. You probably just went to starbucks So the last thing I heard is a guy named birch that was was allergic to birch but not maple or oak trees Yeah, it's just alleged to birch trees as I just said at all But anyways, so yeah, we we were going back to and then we started then I started making fun of the album cover And then we got into album covers One of the reasons just so you know one of the reasons Grim Reaper and a lot of people like when I remember myself and paul had this conversation And we had a bunch of names and grim reaper came out and I said that should be the one And a lot of people were like what that is that tempting fate or something? It's like no, it's just a name for god's sake But one of the reasons I chose it is Because one of the things I think that iron maiden did that was really really really smart Was the creation of eddie They created an image that was nothing to do with the band but nothing to do with the band members But was everything to do with iron maiden Yeah, yeah, it became sononymous kind of like like how dave mustaine has vik rattlehead Yeah, but you see that vik rattlehead, you know, it's You know, it's mega death if you see the war pig with with You know, it's a mud ham And we figured it would be great to have some an image that could be instant relate instantly related to the band and also Cover up the fact that we're extremely ugly I don't say that So so we actually once again, I say, you know with the greatest respect see your optician because they've obviously failed miserably but the We actually named if if you if you go back to the very first karang we were ever in as with steve There was a there was a grim reaper behind us Like an effigy of a grim reaper that my father actually built for us And and we would so and it's also in the first video. So we actually called it freddy In in homage to eddie and I'm sure you know where eddie came from, right? That was the head And this once again this ages me I went to see Neil k He's been on the show. Neil k. Yeah, Neil k did a talk Neil k the dj responsible for like the new wave of british metal resurgence again Because because he had that that heavy metal disco heavy metal disco what an oxymoron I call him my uncle I call him my uncle by the way So good, but they existed. They were great. He was big enough to do a tour So he did a tour And the the opening band the the headliner was a band called rage that used to be called nutsell vice versa I'm not not sure. I can't remember the correct order, but they were really good But the opening bands were an unsigned saxon and an unsigned ironmaid And they had the And they had the original head Which was basically a paper mache head with a hose pipe coming out of the mouth with dry ice. It was great Did you see iron maiden back in the day? Did you see the the the early gigs before they got signed? I know that there was a sort of like thing between you and iron maiden, but Did you actually see them the paldiano years and yeah, I I like I saw them like like the show i'm talking about I was at manchester university. I saw a place called you miss which was the university of manchester institute of science and technology They had this huge ass hole there And they actually put an ep out called the sandhouse tapes that I still have but that that was on their own label And yet it was paul and it was actually the person It was actually the guitar player the blonde guy with the flying v prior to um What was the name of the guitar player on the first hour carry warp i'm Warp i'm warp i'm yeah, that there was that maybe there was a lot of them There was a lot of them we we could say there was a lot of guitars the blonde guy. Yeah, the blonde guy with the flying v blonde guy But you had a keyboard player at one time Yeah, but the but but the rest of the band was intact apart from of you know, it's like it's obviously It was obviously clive as opposed to nico back then but yeah, they were that was doug samson You're you're you're talking about doug samson On drums you could be right. You could be right They had a revolving door for a while, but but but the main players were there. Yeah, I love I love diano Yeah, me too. Yeah, diana's the best What was what was the gig like was that electrifying just curious? Yeah, of course It was one of those things because it it was you know, you you would read, you know, this was pre-internet so social media was sounds which then Jeb this was even before karang existed So so so jeff barton was like one of the metal guys sounds and then you had you know, the malcom domes of this world May he rest in peace as well Another great guy malcom um Yeah, so you had this we had this weekly magazine called, you know Weekly publications for three of them new musical express Melody maker and sounds and sounds was the one that went towards the heavier side of things so That's where I you know like like like the pool the pool de marco version of Or woofer as we called him our version of grim reaper. We covered Get your rocks off before the first let death leopard album came out because I Because I bought it on bludgeon refolder Based on the karang on the sounds piece. So Yeah, there was a it was a it was a wonderful time because you couldn't If you wanted to find something You had to go search like you didn't you couldn't go on youtube and go Oh, i'm not gonna bother to watch the opening band because i've seen this something it's something someone phone did on their phone and it Sucks you went because you were scared that you might miss the next van van halen Yeah, yeah and It was electrified was really cool and and you had to you had to trust people you would buy things You know when I was taught to growl. He said you said, you know, I miss those days where I would buy fanzine So you'd buy a fanzine, which was like a podcast back there effectively Someone would photocopy something You know, they they'd make something they photocopy then you sent them three or four Pounds and they'd send it to you. So I'd get stuff from america. It was freaking great and You would take chances based on like said artwork. I would buy albums I bought the virgin steel album based on the artwork and it was a damn good album Yeah, no You mentioned circus magazines. I remember doing the same thing with hip raider the up and coming bands I think I bought killer dwarfs anthrax I'm forgetting a few just based on those little snippets of up and coming bands, you know Yeah, and you and you'd listen to what other people you admire said was good So I bought an album called I bought a band called head east based on richie blackmore saying they were great And you'd find some gems that way, but you had to go and be you had to be shorelock home She had to go out there with intent, but that was that was the fun part of it, right? Oh, I loved it. Right. And you had to have a good network Yeah friends, right? Yeah of friends that who and by I don't mean likes on facebook just because you know I've got a lot of friends on facebook who I wouldn't if they introduced me on the street. I wouldn't know who they were Not I mean, it's it's it's a different kind of networking And that's that's that's how the grim reaper thing started was Like sand started to run heavy metal Charts put together by by djs Like the bailey brothers and people like that So I would network with I would network with those guys and that's how we got our first chartings And that that was just by me sitting down With a like handwriting a letter to them with with a demo tape and then putting in the mail and hoping It was it was you couldn't email anything. It didn't exist Nick a mike jergen says hi to nick for me, please. So like jergen says hi to you Mike's a great dude. Hey, um When when the band sort of got some momentum right, um Tell us about that sort of trying to break into what was the strategy to break into north america Well, the the the strategies are breaking to north america was And this is down. There's a guy called walter o'Brien who will who is who will make it to the funeral. God bless him Walter Walter was working for I think he was either working for combat records or metal force Omega force records he wanted to he wanted to get the license for see you in hell because he liked it so much The the the man who we whose name we will not mention went no You're not big enough if i'm gonna license it to an american company. It's got to be a major um walter was friends with a lady called um wendy goldstein Who was who was in our rca? and He sent her the tapes and that's how it happened. So rca licensed us and then and then america became a real thing but you know like like, you know, that's one of the funny things about the Like the record industry back then is that the only way An english band could afford to tour america unless you were independently wealthy was you needed the backing of a record label And they would basically give you a tour advance that that that you then had to pay back from But it was all good, you know, so the same with the video We'd like to make a video it's gonna cost 25 grand and guess what you owe us that but we we in good faith They're gonna loan you that money Yeah with interest. Yeah Well, actually, that wasn't interest but they were taking they took it from a percentage of money But I get it they it was a business. It's called the music industry and you know, I've always maintained that as As a skill, you know, we got screwed by I I can't blame rca at all because we were screwed by ebony not rca but The someone someone goes okay. I think this band's Got a chance and you know, if you go back to the mid 80s Investing over 100 grand in something that was a gamble. That's a pretty because they won't get that money back So, that's right. Yeah, it goes tits up there and they're screwed. So yeah, so and and and they would give a band three You know, I was maintained that in in today's In today's recording industry Queens right would never have got the chance to make the masterpiece Which is operation mine crime because they would have been dropped after the first or second records because they didn't sell That's a very good point, too Everyone looking for instant gratification and not and not every band comes out of the gate like friggin van halen What was your contract like if you don't if you don't crack a hundred k You know a hundred units sold whether you dropped. Was there anything like that? It was it was it like It's been a long time since I looked at contracts and and But it was basically okay Each each record had had had more money behind the like does that make sense because you've also got to remember and this is I'm not trying to stand up for the recording industry at all No, no, but They like all of the like the advertising all of the advertising that sort of went into it all the radio promotion All that sort of stuff that was on their dime as well So they would and and they would also and you know like like rocky the hell They paid max They paid for the studio. We owed them that money, but they paid for that stuff Whereas with ebony we didn't ebony went here's the record. See you So Which is probably where he got a bunch of money from but but but but anyway, so Yeah, it was like they like they were tiered but it was always it was always to the favor of the record company like Like that you read someone someone signs five-year contract worth 10 million dollars They can drop that band after the first album and not owe them a penny Unless they had really clever lawyers does that make sense? Yeah, yeah, yeah So they would keep you the more money they would so they would That I guess they would look at the return from album one to see if it was worth the risk investing In album two in the hope that that that curve the wave continues. Yeah, you know what? You know nick and we talked about this and I talked about this with everybody Let's say you wanted to start a business and you had no money and I gave you $200,000 and in that $200,000 that included promotion for your business and included tv commercials It included, you know, you your living expenses included food So I give you $200,000 to start your business and I'm thinking in my head I want to make my money back plus I want to make a little extra Yeah, and then you say well, what kind of deal it was this and then you start screaming bloody murder wait a second You're supposed to give me this money I don't want to pay you back. You don't get paid until I get some money back Well, so I mean we always tend to look at the artist But we never really look at the business side of things and not to say artists don't get screwed Don't get me wrong. I'm just saying there is another side to it Oh, no, there's another side to it and and as and as sort of and you know, there are Everyone has a horror story. I cannot say one bad thing about yeah, I cannot say one bad thing about us Yeah, they were extremely gracious in fact to give you an idea of what of of what it's of a record label's belief in an artist In the post grim reaper thing like so that so like when when it was decided that the only way forward for myself and Steve was Steve to go on to onslaught which as I said amazing just an amazing album And great vocal obviously dur So I came to america and I formed the band. They said, okay, you can we'll relocate you to la or or new york Where'd you want to go and I instantly said it's got to be new york because it's condensed and it's and it's hyper And they said, okay We've got you know, you know, we'll pay for this we'll pay for that We'll pay for a rehearsal place three three days a week. So they all this money up front And then you know, give us a call after two months and and then they left me alone So after two months give us a call them because because we want to come and you know I would check in with them all the time because they were my friends But they said, okay, we want to come and see the band So I put together the first like the first iteration of a band that was called barfly They came down and we played like six songs and they took me to one rca took me to one side and went What are you doing? I said, what do you mean? What am I doing? I said, this is this is grim reaper with a really good american singer. I said, yeah, no crap. That's what I do They said, no, no, you don't understand Listen to this skid row record. This is what we want. You know, oh, jeez Like like we want we want this to be we want the lightest of those songs to be the heaviest Yada yada yada. Anyway, so I put together a different like the band evolved And it was a really good sort of I'm biased obviously It was a really great collection of people great players great singer Actually, we got the singer from toxic the band toxic You could sing his butt off And we started making an album with a guy called jack ponty who who's it's remains a great friend He wrote songs with bon Jovi era smith pretty a love a a list of the guy And the ica kept coming to the studio and they got so excited about the record that they actually went, you know what? We would like michael wagner to mix this and i'm like Holy shit. Yes. Well, and I didn't have it wasn't my yes. They'd already made the decision We're just telling you This is gonna happen. Well, this is the dark side of the record companies now, right? We have the money and we're telling you what to do We have the money and I was like, this is amazing I'm I knew it was going to add, you know thousands upon, you know It's going to add an unknown quantity that went into thousands onto our bill and I didn't give it down Because it was a michael wagner's mix was extraordinary Brilliant man Became a great friend long story short The label were convinced the band would go gold Prior to playing one date. So they got we're going to do this We're going to do a bus tour of radio stations yada yada yada And then within a month just as michael finished the record they fired the president A new president who cleaned house So barfly went from the hey guys can't wait for the first platinum record So like who are you and why are you in the building? Yeah, that's the dark side of the record industry. That is and at that point like the band disintegrated And while I was extremely proud of that record A part of me is maybe a little bit grateful that it didn't sort of Sell out my my image if I even if I have one So I'm still the grim reaper guy, but the thing is and I was on the verge of going back to england after that And as a journalist and then a friend of mine who worked for martial applications Distributed in america approached me with regards to a demo and then I became the martial guy So I stayed within the industry But from the other side of the fence and to be honest with you after walking after three tours and playing Playing the texas jam yada yada yada I'm not having anything to show for it apart from some really cool guitars that I was given as an endorseee I kind of preferred the view of the industry from the other side of the fence Yeah, while but yeah But but but you're right. It's sometimes the artist An artist will this is bullshit. I sold 80,000 records It's like yeah, and the record label lost how much money to give you those 80,000 I'm not and I'm not defending the record labels either I'm just saying that there is a balance And the record companies at the time did take advantage of that balance as well Oh, no, it took advantage of artists as well. And I'm not saying they didn't don't get me wrong Nobody get me wrong There is two sides Yeah, you know, I think at the end of day, I think that the thing to end it up is that as a young naive like michael jackson Who's no longer with us obviously he got to the point where he could go? Okay, I want 50 of the royalties where I'm out of here or whatever percentage But if you look at it now, you've you've you've got bands like journey I think and death leopard have done it recently where they've actually re-recorded their classic stuff So they own it. So they own the masters. That's how Oh Steve you're frozen now. Okay, you're good. You're good. Nick. Nick. Oh my god Yeah, so what was he gonna say? So I remember I remember one of my favorite I think I mentioned this to jimmy actually when we were talking pre this interview I remember like seeing Seeing an interview with with with joe elliott During the hysteria tour and they just eclipsed six million record sales or something And that the it was how does it feel you know after having because that record damped for a while That record didn't do what it was intended and then I think then pour some sugar on me exploded it and then And then what's it called? Yeah, the whole album was a single basically every time animal and yeah But um So it's so they exploded and I remember never forget reading the interview and he went Yeah, it's really good another 800 000 records and we'll be built like we'll have paid the dead off It's like You know they like they spent a year in a studio doing that record so that and that's you know And you've got to remember if you're in a studio Every beer you drink Ching Every coffee everything. Okay. I want to ask you about this you and steve. You're on the road You know first three albums the hell theme How much flock did you get in the us from the let's call it the southern states? We're a little more. Um, you know Sensitive to hell Did you get you know the people come into your shows breaking your records and saying these guys are satanists? Kind of like our in maiden did no what happened to them, you know Yeah, we didn't get it to that level like you you you would you would get the naysayers You would get the you know, oh so so so so you are satan worship business that I always likened us to Like the hammerhouse of horror movies You know those like those great movies made by you know, peter cushing and all those guys And it's like we're we're i'm about as satanic as peter cushing and it's just it's it fits that the image fits The music but it's it's it's it's fiction not fact Yeah, yeah, yeah, and and and there was a sense of human and as steve has currently pointed out and milley's underlined as well That seer and howl if someone actually listens to the lyrics it was based on the temptation of christ not Not it's not like a um Like it's not one of let's not come enjoying. Yeah, let's go to howl. You and me. Let's have some beers and howl Yeah, it's that that that kind of wasn't that that's not satan's air b and b ad That was actually from the other side Yeah, but yeah, so and it was all done tongue in cheek, which is which is part of the reason we wanted to do do To call the last album nothing whatsoever to do with hell, but we got some bro. We got some brutal reviews So and but but we would thank the reviews for it when i'm so we As far as in america were concerned. We didn't exist until 1984 when seer and howl was voted a writer for cream Voted it one of the tests one of the 10 worst albums of the of the last 15 years So what we did was so we sent a 13 black roses as a thank you That's what you should do but my favorite review and i think i'd like when someone we issued the the album Um, they asked me to write the write some sleeve notes. There was this one review where this guy said listening to this the seer and howl his review said Listening to this record is about as pleasurable as giving yourself a frontal lobotomy with a blunt butter knife You know what that was the that was the problem my friend with back then too like a few journalists called the shots And they can make or break bands that was the problem too, but it didn't it didn't break us You know like sort of you know beef some butter didn't break us that's right made us after the fact and um My but my favorite so he finished the he finished that review off with an after this record my dog died of I think but but I think my fate and this is straight out of spinal tap We we got a review in like rip magazine. Um, uh, what was it called hustler magazine embraced You know Sexiest guys in music Because because they had a sense of humor as as did we and they when we both saw through each other's facades And you know rip magazine came from Was like like was born from like hustler public Yeah, I don't know like like long friend was involved, but My favorite review was the one in playboy off see even hell which was just two words Is not recommended Was it it's I love that stuff Any publicity is good publicity. Yeah, and my favorite one of my favorites sort of Sort of priceless moments was when karang did some end of year awards In 87 or 86 or something and they put The and they had an award called the grim reaper award for obvious band in the world goes through this It's great stuff. But anyway, so yeah, so I I'm of the same I I look back with fondness not with Not not with regret or bitterness because I through Through grim reaper and the stuff I did with Steve. I got to do things. I never dreamed I would do Yeah, the you know from playing from playing the texas jam through just touring america three times Through being on bewson butt head Through through being on mtv Through having this interview now under very sad circumstances, but the fact remains as I've said, you know the legacy For whatever reason as in jordan That was all possible because of a guy because what happened was and I never finished the story When steve joined the band the way I wrote changed Yeah, yeah for obvious reasons because you and it lent towards heavy stuff, you know some are old Oh, you don't do as much flashy guitar playing as before it's like no, it's about the song of the guitar player And you you did have a great tone I you know, you had a great get tone a very distinguished tone on all the alms I should say that I know we give a lot of kudos to steve But your guitar tone is allen was saying your solos and your tone were great Well, thanks. Yeah, like like we took pride in it and it was a team effort, which is why you know Which is why we both agreed that unless we were both in the band it would have The person the only put member who was involved be it me or he it would be that then grim reaper not And I think what allen was saying in the beginning was how you guys like gentlemen, you know sort of It wasn't like l.a. guns, right? Everybody's got a version or rat or it was you guys were gentlemen about it And even when steve spoke to me and allen about it, it was Very gentleman agreement, you know very a nice gentleman agreement about it and And I think that speaks volumes, you know about both of you, you know, well, thanks Well, I think the bottom line is that like without steve It wouldn't have been grim grim reaper. I like think so his voice my riffs were the Key and and people said why don't you do it with someone else? And it's like I don't think I could write I would not write the same with a different voice. So I would never call it grim reaper for that reason Yeah, because it like like to me steve is an implicit part, you know is an integral part of the very important factor To quote unquote. He's the voice of grim reaper and may ever that remain Yeah, and I just like to point out a footnote and I think milley told me this and steve told me this You know, he was a christian and he went to church. So all the people out there were saying, you know, you know, hell and satan all that It was tongue-in-cheek. Like you said it was it was more christian bale is not really batman Well done. Yeah, exactly Actually say paterson now It's it's it's funny how, you know perception is people's realities. Like I actually played a church And they are the and the pastor's that yeah, you're not gonna believe it the guy he wrote see you You know who crow wrote see you in hell is now is playing this next song for us Because it's funny. It shouldn't be You know, it's Life's too short to take so seriously and you know, the the woke movement is a petrifying thing Yeah, let's not get into that right now I got a lot to say about that Although Although I will leave one of my favorite products. I mentioned jack ponte before right jack jack ponte Some a very smart guy like like he's now in in the financial world making killing Someone asked him what woke, you know, what does the term? Why do why do people call themselves woke? And he said woke is a term for people who'd like people not to realize that there is mentally all as they really are Or words that effect I love that and we will leave that notion there But you can't even order a coffee without upsetting someone but anyway But yeah, so back to Steve Yes, so again, I'm gonna say this in the description of the video. There is a donation link You know set created by friends of the family And you know, there's a lot of expenses be at the funeral and after the funeral So even though it's kind of like the the target is sort of maxed out a little bit just keep going It's all good. The money is what much needed And what you're doing there by you know giving a donation. You're really helping out Steve and his family, you know, who were not rich by any means who lived the modest life And they need all the help they can get and I can say that because I'm gonna say it well said that man and We got exito Who said donated a big fan and anybody who donates right now? I will we'll mention your name in your comment and that's our part doing our part, you know Nick is there anything as well jim right the streaming of the Yes, the streaming of yes and the streaming of the funeral and we'll say september 4th 9 a.m. Eastern Standard Time in North America and 2 p.m. UK time There there will be the funeral that will be held and after the wake There will be refreshments and drinks and a toast to Steve All provided to you by the Grimit family Especially Millie leading that Bring what you want. They said bring with the shirts that you want Celebrate Steve the way Steve wanted to be celebrated And there will also be a streaming link of the funeral in the description that I'll put afterwards after I get that I will put this in this video. All right. I've said a lot Alan nick go ahead. Yo, jimmy you asked me correctly if you if you you think you said september 4th It's obviously gonna be if it's wednesday, it'll be september 7th Wednesday september the 7th, excuse me and if it's 2 p.m. And if it's 2 p.m in england, it will actually be 7 Yeah, if it's p.m. Which it is. Yes, if it's 2 p.m. It'll be 7 p.m. Eastern time No, no, no, no, no, it'll be it's a five hour difference. Yeah, so 2 plus 5 is No, it'll if it's 2 p.m. It's 9 to 10 10 to 11 11 to 12 top the 1 went to 2 It's 9 a.m. Eastern Standard 2 p.m. UK time somebody. Please get a calculator and figure this out Old money pythons get where you think you never say the number right if it's 9 a.m. Here It's 2 p.m. There, correct. Well, you know what? I'm a I'm a I'm a dumb ass. You are here in central. We're eastern Yeah, no, no, no, I'm actually eastern. I was just doing the math the wrong way. You were doing the opposite way Yes, you're dying the opposite. We're behind nine a.m. We lived yes Yeah, but you know you come from it's okay. I screwed up the date. It's I screwed up the date So we're even right 50 51. Well, here's here's the true comedy of that. I have a degree in mathematics I just forgot plus and minus boom So it's just a dash off It's I know Millie Millie teased you earlier She was when we interviewed her about a week ago She mentioned that during the the covid period that she was able to go back and go through everything the steves ever recorded So I like that little wink emoji. She gave you on Watching this I'm anxious to see what what they discovered during that time. So Oh good stuff. Good stuff. So Yeah, but you know the and the what the great thing about steve is like I said, it wasn't just his voice It was the man behind the voice and that's what so we thought it's not just remembering a voice It's remembering a man Who who touched a lot of people not just through his music but by meeting them and being by being extremely personable Yes, and that's a common story. I heard steve. I can't believe how nice he was because he made me He wasn't like you'll see some guy signing. It's like this Yeah, like they didn't look at people And but but you'll get the true greats who who who understand that their audience is everything and have definitely Genuinely appreciate them Like the steve grimace this world dinebag was one such character jim marshal not a rock star But to some people the ultimate rock star because as kerry king said made us all sound look good Jim was the same way. He was very personal with everybody and Ditto slash I've done autograph sessions with slash with marshal He takes time with people quarry tailor same thing and that the latter might shock some people. Yeah quarry tailor made A person's 10 seconds seemed like three minutes because It was just the two of them and there's a gift to that And and it's and you can't fake that you either feel it or you don't steve felt it and that's why people Like they like they felt some they felt a connection because it there was it was a genuine connection because that's what steve was genuine some nice words Alan any closing remarks? No, again, let's help out milley and then the grimace family and Thanks for having nick on today sharing his insight and this partnership and the years of friendship with steve Really, thank you nick. It's a pleasure But we got to have one more often That was a lot of fun. I really enjoyed it. You know once again From the bottom of my heart Which might or might which may or may not be black Uh, thank you both so much for the time and the genuine passion and empathy You've thrown into like paying tribute to our to our mutual Very dear friend steve grimace and like I said, you know Amongst the grief i'm going to reiterate I'm incredibly grateful that I got the chance to have him honor me by considering me a friend and writing writing partner because that's priceless And you don't meet many people like that on this planet and If I wasn't sad it would have meant I didn't meet steve would know him and that's not acceptable. So i'm happy. I'm sad as sad as it is A lot of fun since that was but I think it made sense. Yeah frank potvin says rest in peace steve. I just donated to the funeral Scott saying we love you steve nick milley. I will definitely be watching the funeral and I will be blasting grim reaper Klaus says great show. Thanks guys. Have a good one milley sing Thank you everyone support and donations and keep in mind again. I'll say this over and over again It's not milley who started this donation page. It's a friend of the families Who who graciously started this because You know, some people need help, you know, not everybody's as fortunate, right? Yep, and uh, thank you milley for you know being brave And we're gonna have her back When she's ready to be back and we'll have more on steve because we want to keep the memory going too, right steve was a friend of ours and we you know And and we appreciate the music that you and him created and the music he created afterwards and and you know, it's important And going back to me and alan's original mission statement Of you know keeping you know supporting our our friends and our heroes, you know that we grew up with You know and making sure they have a platform too Yeah, and I'd like I just like to reiterate say this if you haven't got steve's later stuff get it Especially, you know the onslaught stuff to see grim it's grim reaper stuff The lion's heart stuff get it all that that that voice is impeccable immaculate and brilliant on all of that stuff And what's funny? What's not it's I just got a text Well, I got a text this morning from a friend of mine in LA Saying think in a view because I was just I was eating dinner at the whiskey No, the rainbow and they played see you in hell of the pa So it's kind that I find that Thing things like that eternally touching and what's even more touching is people weren't just aren't just playing it because of steve's Heart wrenching passing they were playing it anyway Because because for whatever reason people like that song and so all of those of you who do thank you If you like it donate to steve because He's part of your music heritage Yeah, yeah, I'm stretching this out a little bit because people are donating and I want to mention their names. So, you know Squishy cakes. I love that name. Squishy cakes Squishy cakes just made a donation also posted on metal pages on facebook. Thank you nick for the great music Thank you. Squishy cakes. Thank you. Yeah, but thank you for the name and the kind words Yeah, like you probably find it's like it's that's probably Chris Jericho, but anyway And and as I wait for other people to donate to mention their names nick just tell us about sweet water You know, you know, just tell us about the school and what you do there. I'm just curious Well, I work I work for a company called sweet water who were really big internet concern in the music industry in america I've known them and the owner for many many years because I used to come here as a marshal As the marshal guy doing demonstrations and training They have a great Culture the the store here is ridiculous. The customer service is second to none And I figured this was going to be my last port of call before I retire And I wanted to finish in a great place. I was fortunate enough to work for Jim marshal for many years And you know, then Jim passed and I realized that my allegiance to Jim was With the man more than the brand as great as the brand is hence the reason I have Jim on one arm. Wow and mr My good buddy dime bag on the other because they both had a major impact to my life I had the good fortune of working for fender for a while and getting to work alongside one of my all-time heroes, mr. Edward van Halen On the wolf gang launch amazing human being what a legacy he left behind Hopefully him and steve having a beer right now. Yeah, and um You know, I've I so I do I do what they call I'm a content creator. It's a horrible name. I'd make videos basically Apparently, so are we So I make content so I I knew people, you know from from from rudy sars So through Dave Mustaine through whomever they will have me do Jim root yard cruel retailer yada yada Most of the more buddies of mine, which is great. I do lessons online for them as part of the social media content I do product reviews How to do this how to do that kind of thing and then in the evenings to keep myself sane And because I enjoy it I play forward what little knowledge I have via teaching And that's huge fun for me And yeah, it keeps me Keeps me saying, you know, it goes to show, you know, like most of my friends You know, because I'm an old geezer Most of my friends of my age have been retired for a couple of years I'm in I'm in no financial position to do so. But the one thing I can say is that A lot of my friends who are retired Aren't that happy because they spent 40 years of their life doing something. They didn't like that much And I'm still doing what I love So I'm still working, but I don't consider it work even though I'm probably working harder than I ever have worked. So it's all about this And metal and music in general because it's the and the thing I love about metal. I said at the starting to say it again The sense of community Is staggering and that was You know, and myself and Steve had a bond. So, you know, we we would go for a couple of years without talking But but when we either met in person or online Or via a zoom or whatever It was like we just seen each other yesterday And that once again is a reflection on What how good a friend he I hate to use it. He was Past tense is is horrible is hard to use. But yeah, he was one of those, you know, we all we all have friends that we thought were great and Five years 10 years 15 years lady after a minute. You've run out of things to say No such thing with mr. Grimmett On that note You know nick again, thank you so much everybody. Thanks for watching everything. Thanks for donating and we'll have you back Nick, it'll be a pleasure. I took this to get you, you know to sort of spark the connection with us But i'm happy in a way it did And we'll keep the memory alive of grim reaper and yourself, of course your legacy and steve's legacy Well, I run right back at jimmy and alan Unfortunate circumstances, but happy to have met you and now you're stuck with me It's a pleasure. All right. Have yourself a wonderful day. We'll talk soon. Thanks. Thanks gentlemen. Thanks