 Welcome everyone to the August 11th Amherst Massachusetts Conservation Commission meeting. Thanks for being here. I know it's hot in the middle of the summer and the motivation threshold is especially high tonight so thanks everyone for coming. I think the first item on the agenda comments for me. I don't have any except. I think all of our hearings are being continued. Right. Is that right? If you haven't had a chance to look at everything, that's kind of a heads up. But we do have a list of other topics that might take a little bit of time but hopefully we won't be at a late night tonight. I'm pulling for not late tonight. So with that, Dave, I think is on vacation so he won't be here Aaron. If you want to go ahead and give us any updates, our first hearing starts at which is continued starts at 730 so we have 25 minutes to get through some stuff. Yes, let's do this. So I included minutes for you guys for the last two meetings. One edit I will just note that I found is that on the I think it's the July 14 minutes I did not include the list of members present so I will go back and add that I just noticed that last minute. But that's the only edit that I, I was able to see unless anyone else has them. I move we approve the minutes for 714 21. Okay, voice vote, Larry. Hi, lecture. Hi, Anna. Hi, Leroy. Michelle. Hi. Awesome. I'll do it again I prove you, I move we approve the minutes for 728 21. Seconded. Okay voice vote, Larry. Hi, lecture. Hi. Hi, Anna. Hi, Leroy. Hi, Michelle. Hi, and I'm an eye. All right, excellent. So we got a request for a land use application to use Mount Pollux for a wedding on January or I'm sorry on. Wow, on September 16 at 430. My concern that I had about this one was the number of cars and I don't know if that's really of concern that late in the evening from 430 to 630 but it seemed like a lot of cars to take up the parking lot. How many was it? There's only 10 people. I don't know if there's a lot of cars. Yeah. Wasn't there a wedding coming up there shortly with like a van or something. There is. So this wedding is on the 16th, which is. A Thursday evening. And then there's also a wedding on the 18th, which is a Saturday. So two days later, there's another wedding. That's already been approved at that location. It's a Friday afternoon. Yeah. I mean, what's the, I don't know. I mean, I think we live in there. You could probably get. Probably get five or six cars in there, I'd say, I think is what Anna was going to say. Yeah, so it's really, my phone just started making lots of noises. Yeah, like, I'm not worried about it. I think it's, I think it's a okay. Yeah. And I say that most likely they won't be able to park there. So we'll figure out. Right. Okay. The only thing that I just have a, maybe this doesn't impact this. Sorry, I'm doing this. But like, just to make sure they know if there isn't parking there, you can't like park on the neighbor's property park on the, you know, like, just to make sure that's very clear. Yeah, the nearest parking would be like South Amherst Common. Yep. You might mention that just mentioned, they probably know this, but just mentioned. I think there are like three people there. They can't like say you have to leave because we have a wedding, you know, yeah. Is there parking on the backside? No, I wish there was like there's on the access from Middle Street. There's no parking either. Nope. You might in the process suggest they reduce the number of cars from four to three. You know, just in case there's other people up there. We could just say yes to four, but just knowing that like, yeah, it's a risk that they take. Yep. Yeah. And then I would just encourage that maybe we just sort of include those standard boiler plate conditions that we typically include like, you know, they have to clean up all of their trash. You know, they have to kind of leave it the way they found it. They should have the permit with them just in case maybe put it in their car window or something like that. They got to pick up the wedding bouquet. Yeah, and then no vehicle access to the top of the hill. You know, those sort of basic things from out politics. Sounds good. And they're also aware that the park's not closed to the public. Right. And they have to share it with the members of the public. Yeah, there's, there's like, I think, six to 10 boiler plate kind of conditions that we included on the last one. Similar to that. Perfect. Okay. We need a motion to approve land use application for a wedding on 916 21 at Mount Pollack's. I move we approve this land use application for a wedding at Mount Pollack's on September 16 2021. With the conditions as previously stated. Second. Is that a second flutter. Yeah, we both got it. I got you Larry. Voice vote flutter. Hi. Hi. Anna. Hi. Larry. I shall. And I'm an eye. Right. All right. So, this is going to be, I feel like a fast night. Okay, so let's let's talk about enforcement. Okay. So, I'll give you guys a quick rundown of what happened there. We issued a certificate of compliance. The property was sold. The gentleman who bought the property. Within maybe a week or two started installing. Preparing to install a paved driveway and not just a paved driveway, but expanding the driveway pretty significantly for the pavement. I got a phone call from. The building inspector basically saying they got a complaint and I was able to stop work before the pavement paving started, which was very lucky. And I've been going back and forth with the new owner trying to figure out the best solution. He had, I told him. Basically, I didn't think it was worth kind of. Moving forward with the. Paved driveway because I know the previous applicant had proposed pavement and that it was denied in favor of gravel. And also, I think that the previous applicant had asked for a larger driveway and that we had asked them to reduce the size. So for them to come back and expand the driveway and ask to pave it, I was afraid they were just spinning their wheels. He did reach out to Bucky Sparkle and Bucky Sparkle basically told him. The same thing. Because he was the representative for the previous owner. They, where they're at right now is basically they'd like to restore it back to its previous condition. And they said to sometime next year, they'd like to come back with a proposal for previous pavers. So they can, you know, try to present that. Next year, once they have adequate engineering right now, it's impossible to get an engineer. It's just so busy out there. So, um, basically my recommendation is as follows there, they are wanting to restore it, but they technically can't do any work because they are under a cease and desist right now. So, um, my recommendation and they were, they were working with Ward Smith was basically to. Issue them an enforcement order and in the enforcement order, allow restoration of the driveway to its previous footprint. Um, requiring erosion controls, um, requiring that it be, um, you know, resituated in its previous, um, driveway location and that, um, if he stabilized with topsoil seed and mulch just like it was previously. So, um, I don't know if anyone has any questions about it, but that was my recommendation of how we proceed just so they can do the work. They opened it up pretty good. Yeah. Um, I guess they had to prep it before they paved it. So they, they, it was pretty wide. It just looks like packed gravel, but it is a larger footprint than what we originally approved. Yeah. And I don't know why I did upload the pictures, but for whatever reason, they're not, um, not queuing. It seems reasonable what you just said. Yeah. Yeah. I've seen the site. Um, I agree with the path Aaron chose. I think that that's the best possible plan. Um, and unless somebody has some strong objection to that, I think. You just need to draft. Motion as. Aaron highlighted. Screen. Okay. I'll, um, move to issue an enforcement order to allow restoration of the driveway to its previous footprint erosion controls must be provided and unauthorized driveway location must be stabilized with top soil seed and mulch. Second. Anna's got the second voice vote. Blusher. Hi. Roy. Hi. Larry. Hi. Michelle. Hi. And I for me. Okay. So now we're just getting warmed up here. You want to talk about can't nav. Um, So the situation with can to nav is. Um, there is in your packets. Um, A report from. Ward Smith. Ward did, um, Reach out to me. And I don't know why this is not. Letting me see it. We'll pull it up. Um, they, he's gone out. He, he. Has evaluated the footprint of the wetland that was, that was, um, Impacted by the work. Um, And he. Basically has come up with a, a restoration plan. For how to restore that impacted wetland. So. There has been effort made to. Put the restoration plan together. Um, where we left it with. Um, Pete Wilson was that he was supposed to submit. A restoration plan. Uh, to restore the wetland to its previous footprint. And. Also because there is suspicion that the wetland has expanded from its previous footprint. Um, that it be basically reflagged and that the, they would have to. Um, get those flags picked up, put on an engineered plan and see if it impacted any of the previously approved subdivision plan as far as stormwater was concerned. So they got sort of one piece of it done. This was supposed to be done by August 1st, uh, 2021. They got one piece of it done, which is the delineation and the restoration plan. However, um, the, getting the plan on paper. Um, with an engineer's evaluation has not been done yet. So, um, unfortunately, I mean, this is one, you know, we issued this in November of 2020. So this has been going on for a long time. Obviously nothing has been done to date as far as a restoration. That's just been sitting there. Um, I requested of them. Um, And basically. See if I can grab the email. Um, I was emailing with. Tom read it earlier today. Let me see. Oh yeah, there is. Um, So my request was that they. Because I knew they weren't going to make the August 1st deadline to submit whatever they had as far as the restoration plan so that we could take a look at it tonight. I recommend that they provide, provided an email from a surveyor with a date certain of when the survey would be completed. And I also said, if you're requesting additional time for the engineer drawing, please request a definitive date by which the plan will be provided to us. I got the plan from Ward. That's basically the response I got. And then I emailed them again tonight because I hadn't heard anything back on the other items. And I heard from Tom reading on behalf of Pete saying he was in touch with, um, The survey or Randy Iser and he would get a date of when he expects the work to be done. Um, but there was no word from Pete Wilson, the owner on it. Um, he just said he would defer to Pete on the engineering, but suspects and extension will be needed. Yeah. So Harold Eaton, like the surveyor now is like a six week lead time just to get surveyors on the site. So my guess is that there's a pretty good faith effort here. Um, but as you said earlier, Aaron, it's impossible. It's impossible to get help within a month, basically with stuff like this right now. Um, unless you think it's, that's not a good read of the situation. Well, I, I'm, I'm empathetic to a degree, but at the same time, like in February, I called Randy Iser to say, can you get out there to, to survey the, the wetland flagging and he's like, yeah, I could get out there this week. And then, you know, the owner was saying he couldn't get out there. He couldn't get out there. Their survey or couldn't get out there. And they never even called the survey or who originally did the survey. And it ended up being like late April before we heard anything from them. Um, so there have been serious holdups on this. And previously the lack of action, we almost ended up having town council get involved to. Kind of put their foot down. In terms of like trying to make something happen. If you guys recall, we actually instituted fines on this site in an effort to try to get them moving. So. Remind me, this is restoration. And as far as the property is concerned for what they want to do, that's gone back to square one, hasn't it? We're, they're starting all over on that, aren't they? The area that they, so they, they basically, leveled a whole section of wetland on the property and they have to restore that. This is the restoration. But didn't, but didn't we, didn't we decide that they're going, they're going to make a request for a determination. It's going all the way back to the beginning. Yes and no. We thought that the order of conditions had expired, but the state instituted what this tolling period, which basically was almost like an automatic permit extension act. Due to COVID. And so while we thought it had expired, there was this, you know, Act of the. Right. The governor or whatever to, to extend all permits. And so then all of a sudden the permits valid again. So the permit is still valid. The subdivision is still valid. The commission could revoke the order of conditions. I spoke to the EP about this. I'm not recommending that we do that, but I'm just saying. In the event that they're not. Cooperative with this. Moving forward, the commission is within its rights to do that. And I've, I told them that on site. It's not the route, obviously that I would recommend. We like to be, you know, to work with people, but the bottom line is this. It's been almost a year since the original enforcement order was issued. And what has been done is. It's been a year. It's been a year. It's been a year. It's been a year. It's been a year. The flags were surveyed and we have a restoration plan, but. Or a plan, but not any action as far as instituting the restoration plan. I would really recommend whatever we do moving forward that we set some pretty hard and fast deadlines. And I'm less concerned to be honest with you about. The. Subdivision and more concerned about the wetland. So that's kind of where I stand with it. They seem to be interested in installing and not following through. So I agree with you. I know, but how can we be more urgent? I mean, I don't know. Like. Go ahead, Fletcher. I haven't really gone. Do you, how do you, how do you like the restoration plan? As is. I mean, we're talking. Are they. Is. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. They know what they have to do. And they can't move forward with the subdivision until that's done. So. That's kind of where I stand with it. Well, they seem to be interested in installing and not following through. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Like. Replacing that wetland that they paved over. Filled in. Right. So to be honest with you. They, what they did was they converted a wetland. So it was originally a forested wetland. And now it's a. Sort of scrub shrub open. Open. Meadow wetland. And then they moved it. They moved it. They moved it. They moved it. They moved it. Established. Oh, I thought they. They wouldn't. They excavated. There's a picture of an excavator sitting in the middle of it. Right. They definitely compacted it. I don't know if they actually brought in Phil, but they definitely moved some earth around as far as on the site is concerned. Got it. Okay. Sorry. I thought they, for some reason, I was under the impression they brought in Phil and like, they're moving. They're moving it. They're moving it. They're moving it. But when in trees, they were working in. But I think you raise a really important question Fletcher is, should they be required to take out. Any volume of material that they brought in. And I'm not sure that that was anything that. Like. Unless there's pictures of people bringing in Phil. Unless we had topographic survey of the entire area, returning to its previous condition is difficult. And I think it's important to note that the site is that them taking out the trees made the site wetter. So it expanded the footprint of the wetland pretty dramatically. And that was kind of like creating their own hardship. And so now that that's done what's done is done and. To me, the most important thing is revegetating it and get that, getting the system back to a healthy place. So that it's functioning. So I would say that. Maybe setting a deadline from which this restoration plan needs to be implemented. I would say as soon as possible, like maybe by October 1st or October 15th. It would be a good deadline to say it. These plantings need to be installed. By then. Clearly this season. What is the, what would you say is the back end of the, of a fall planting season. I mean, October 15th has historically been. But obviously now with things have been quite a bit warmer. The growing season is definitely extended. I would say maybe closer to November 1st or November 15th, even it depends on the year. Is there an economic side of this? How much is all this going to cost the builder. The owner. That's not really part of. I mean, I don't know. I mean, I don't know if that's a concern to us, but it's good. It might be of concern in terms of stalling. The concern is, is it going to live? Yeah. That's why I'm asking. Red oak in the middle of it. Like the, there's a lot of trees in this area. So you have plant red oak. It's basically shaded. It's like, they're trying to re-vegetate with early successional species. And it's not going to be like an early successional species. I mean, red maple will probably work. Yeah. You know, green ash, maybe. Maybe, you know, spice bush, maybe. Red oak, no. Birch. Yeah. Which hazel, maybe. Hazel nut, maybe. Because it's too sunny. You guys think that it won't survive. Not sunny enough for the red oak. Yeah. I think, I think obviously with the red oak, he's, it's the buffer zone. So I see what he's trying to get at, but. Like a more music. Oh, yeah, but. But I hear you try to get, I mean. But you're more concerned about just get this thing vegetated ASAP. It's, and we're talking specifically Aaron, the area that has expanded as well. Or just that footprint that was on the original survey from. They have to restore. The wetland and the buffer zone. That they were not permitted to alter to begin with. I mean, there was current, the current, the current footprint. Wetland footprint. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, it's. Yeah. Where it's expanded and, and into the buffer zone around it. I think the one exception that we made was that the driveway area. That was approved. We wouldn't require them to restore that because if they're just putting a driveway in there, there's no point in planting and restoring that area. So what's the smart thing to do here in terms of the wetland. So if the wetland currently, if it was a forced wetland, it would have been a lot longer, but it's still a perhaps wetter scrub, shrub, shrub wetland, maybe not disturbing the wetland as it is. And instead focusing on smart. Like well-informed planting of the buffer. To stabilize might be like a better use just looking through this list. Like it's going to disturb if it's truly like a functioning scrub, shrub wetland right now, which is kind of like looking at the wetland. So if we were to look at the wetland, if we were to look at the topography, what it might be, then maybe disturbing that is not a good use of time in dollars. And would actually hurt the wetland more. And what we should instead focus on is like improving the buffer and protecting the wetlands, you know, I mean, I would look at somebody like the, the two 14 Pomeroy as a good example here. Like they, you know, they had a lot of, they had a lot of, they had a lot of, they had a lot of, they had a lot of trash hogged and grubbed entire sections of wetland. And the wetland was coming back, you know, in a short period of time, they did put in, and granted they hit the jackpot in terms of when they installed, like right in the middle of the rainy season this spring. And I went out there. I'll show you pictures later tonight. It is gorgeous. And the plantings are thriving. I mean, from that standpoint, I'm like, eh, I, they've damaged the wetland. I think that they should be required to do the plantings in the wetland, but I, I hear what you're saying. I mean, from where I stand, if the plantings that they put in don't survive, they have to replace them. If they don't, you know, if it less than 50% survive, they have to do some replanting anyways. I don't know. It's a tough call, but I think that they damaged it and they should, they should have to. So I go back to the current footprint. Are we in this with this restoration plan? Do we say anything about that? They have to, they're not resurveying this current wetland. Yes, they are. And that's what they're dragging the heels on. Right. That's right. And so, but Ward Smith didn't do any, he just kind of delineated his own wetland basically. So we don't have like a plan view of this. We don't have a plan view of this. Right. You don't have a drawing. Right. I know we were just talking about that, but I just wanted to confirm that. No, I'm agreeing with you. I wish we did. Yeah. Michelle, did you try that? Did you have something to add? I was just wondering what's coming back in the wetland. Is it like while people are roses or is it maybe species? Cause. It's a great question. Yeah. I haven't seen any pictures of it. Yeah. I'm trying to remember when our site visit was, cause I could try to. I might have been earlier than that. Right. Let me see if I can just get my finger on it really quickly. If not, we can continue with discussing while I try to hunt it down. So the other way we could, other direction we could go here just while Aaron's looking, as we could say, okay, we need a survey with a plan view of the restoration plan and location of planting. So we could say, we could say, we want this restoration plan. And by this state so that we can like best evaluate. Use of. Restoration plant. Resources and how functional that will be. In the wetland. Or we could just say whole hog. We want this restoration plan. Executed by X state. I kind of changed my mind. It looks like we should probably get some stuff planted ASAP. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Hold on just one sec. It was five, seven, 21. I'm sure it's come back quite a bit since then. Yeah. But you can see the stakes. So this is where the previous wetland was located. And then you can see where a portion of it was filled. Or where the damage was done when the vehicle was sitting on it. And I have those pictures. I can show you guys. I can show you guys. I can show you guys. This is new to her. This is the driveway location. This photo. These are just taking pictures of some of the flags that they put to, they, we required them to reflag the site. You can see the rutting where they had a vehicle. So that's multi. Yeah. I was just going to say that's definitely. So he's going to have to. I'm assuming if it's all rows now, like, they're going to have to knock it back somehow to put the plantings in. So I think the more the rows is going to start to. Probably already four feet tall. Right. But all. Watchers favorite plant. What is it? Multi flora. Yeah. I love it. Yeah. It's vicious. I liked it. I liked it this morning when the mosquitoes were taking me away. So this, I'll just do a site comparison. For Michelle. So she can see kind of the timeline of what. The first photo is. Eight four 2017 when the original delineation was done top left. Top right. This is the photo. And what's interesting is see the tree leaning left. Over the excavator. You can kind of see it there. You can also see it in this picture. So you can see that the. The excavator is like right in the middle of the wetland, like here's a picture with the stakes with the wetland boundary. So you can see that it's sitting right in the well and. Okay. So I retract my feeling that maybe we shouldn't go into a, what might be a functioning wetland and plants. I think we should. Fully restore. And I guess. Given the two possible scenarios, one being we need a surveyed plan in order to evaluate the restoration plan or. We need you to institute this. That's in this restoration plan ASAP. I guess I would go with the second option. But if anyone has any other possible scenarios. Are ways to encourage us to be excited or outstanding questions. Please. Let me know. I mean, my recommendation would be say. The plantings have to be done by October 1st. And then I would say. I would say. This project, no work can begin on this subdivision. Until the flags. For the wetland are picked up by survey and a revised or a, you know, a plan is provided to the conservation commission that's been evaluated by an engineer stating that it still will function. As it was originally designed. And that until we have that. And it's still in a cease and desist. Because then. Yeah, because then, because then it's like, okay, well, if they decide to wait, then it's kind of at their own peril. Because eventually, even with the tolling period, it's going to expire. Yeah. So October 15th seems reasonable to me. Okay. Two months. Yeah. Erin said October 1st. Oh, well that's, that's okay. I mean, I was just throwing a date out, but that's fine. Well, just then we can say like that's the end of the growing season. Not arbitrary. Or the end of the plant of reasonable planting season. Okay. Does that give you enough to go with Aaron? Yes. Yeah, I think so. Right. Well, that's good. I'm glad that took a little time to. I'm glad we spent some time talking about it to be honest, because there's been a while since we've. I apologize. I feel like every time we talk about that site, it's groundhog day. And I have to be like, And I confuse it with other sites. And then once I remember which site it is, it's like. Yeah. So I'm sorry. I apologize. I was totally up to some in the same boat. I'm always like, wait, can't nav. Yeah. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I have to pull it up. Yeah. I'm sorry. I continually call it Carver. Because I get the names. But I have to tell myself can't, it's Canton. They can't work in the wetland. We just get like little pictures with all the neighbors that came on like a popsicle sticks. That's honestly, I'm starting to get it by the names because I'm like, okay. Tom Reedy or, you know, like bacon, Wilson is with this one. And then yeah. Yeah. I've got it now. Yeah. All right. So do we need to. Do any. No, we don't need to. Don't think so. I can convey this. I'll just put together sort of a formal correspondence and convey it to them that this is a deadline and. You know, Take it from there, I guess. Okay. Thanks, Aaron. But I think getting it restored by, by, you know, the, the enforcement order was issued November 1st. Of last year. So if we can get it restored within a year, I'll be happy that we've actually taken, you know, that some action has taken place there. Okay. That's a great, great plan. Sounds good. All right. So it's 736. Is it okay if we address the hearings? Of course. Yep. So our first hearing. Was scheduled for 730 and it was the, um, and rad. So SWCA for confirmation of resource area boundaries at 52 fearing street. Three, three, six and three, four, six North pleasant street. Um, so this is from maybe a couple of meetings ago. And it sounds like they requested a continuation. Um, So. Unless I see we have four attendees. I don't recognize any of that project. Aaron, do you. Hey, let me stop sharing so I can see who we have. Um, Edwin Ganser is a, um, in a butter. Okay. So, um, if anyone, so what will happen now is we'll continue the hearing to our next meeting on August 25th. We'll be at 740 PM. Um, Edwin, if you have any comments or questions, um, you can raise your hand now and ask them. Otherwise we'll move to continue the hearing and encourage you to join us again, um, on August 25th. Oh, okay. And then I'm going to give you a chance to talk. Give me a second. By them. Aaron, I think you have to make me a co-host. Oh, I'm sorry. I don't have a chance to talk. Sorry. And by. Edwin can speak. Okay. We can, you've joined us. Unmute yourself. Hello, I'm Edwin. I'm in the butter. I live, uh, at 43 fearing street. And, uh, I don't really have much more news to report. I do want to say that, uh, I've been irritating committee with these emails and, uh, Aaron has been so polite in answering them. I'm really impressed. With how seriously you're taking this matter. And you came out and did a site visit. And, uh, I'm really pleased. With all the work that you have on your plate that you're taking this issue. So seriously. The water has pretty much receded now. The book broke is bubbling along. Um, and, um, it's still very pleasant here. And, uh, I, uh, I just, uh, I just want to say thank you for your taking this. So seriously and getting a, uh, an outside reviewer to come in and take a look at this. I think the neighborhood will breathe more easily knowing that you're, uh, You're, you're working on this. So thank you. Great. Thank you, Edwin. Thank you for coming. Yeah, we're looking forward to seeing, um, what comes out of that third party review. Um, so again, yeah, if you would just plan to join us on the 25th at seven 40, would be when we would continue this hearing too. And hopefully we'll have heard from SWCA with the third party review by then. Uh, is it, I, I don't, is I thought that SWCA was not going to be doing the third party review or am I hearing something different. Um, Emily Stockman is going to be doing. SWCA is the original. Sorry. Right. That's what I thought. Thank you. Okay. That's all. All right. Do you think that'll be here by that time? Uh, it's difficult for me to say the, the check was given to the treasurer's office, received by the treasurer's office. It's really, it's with procurement right now. And, um, I know that they're short staffed. So, um, I did, I sent them an email today asking, um, um, letting them know that we're, you know, we're ready to go and, um, encouraging that hopefully we can move forward as quickly as possible. Um, but I would say let's continue in the hope that we will, everything will move forward by then. Um, and yeah, we'll take it from there. Okay. Sounds good. Thanks for coordinating that, Aaron. Thank you, Edwin. Hopefully we'll see you on the 25th. Thank you. Yep. All right. Um, so with that, we just need a motion to continue this hearing. Two weeks. Oh, sorry. Go ahead, Anna. All right. I was going to say I move we continue the hearing for, um, wait, not 52 fearing street. Isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. Sorry. Sorry. Yes. My God, my brain. Easy peasy. Lemon difficult y'all. I move we continue the hearing for 62 fearing street to August 25th at 740 p.m. Sorry. Second. Thank you. Okay. Voice vote. Fletcher. Hi. Larry. Hi. Anna. Hi. Leroy. Hi. Michelle. Hi. And I am an I. All right. Cruising on. Um, the next is the NOI for, um, new foot bridges, fog bridges, replacement of foot bridges, et cetera. Um, at various locations on the Robert Frost trail. Um, it sounds like Aaron, we still want to continue that one. So, um, Brad, um, our land manager and, and Brendan are here to present. Um, and so what I'd like to do is, um, allow them to sort of present the project, um, so that you guys can get a sense of what's going on. And then we're still waiting on DEP comments. So that'll give us a chance to review DEP comments, get responses. Um, if you see the plans, then we can schedule a site visit. If you're comfortable, um, I've seen all the sites. Obviously all the staff has seen the sites. It's relatively minor work. Okay. All right. Then I just promoted Brad and Brendan. Hi, Brad. The panel. Hello. How's it going? Good. How are you? Hi, Brendan. We can see you too. Hi. Um, so yeah, I think I don't know if Michelle has, has met you guys yet. Um, we have a new, um, commissioner Michelle. So if you guys just want to introduce yourselves quickly and then explain the project, that would be great. So I'm Brad board a week. I'm the land manager with the conservation department. I'm Brendan Kelly. And I'm the assistant land manager with the conservation department. Is now a good time to talk about the project. Um, I think we're going to be able to talk about the project. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Michelle, just for some background. Brad usually joins us kind of once every six months to give us updates on like various, um, activities and management and maintenance and all the work they're doing out there to maintain the conservation land. The right this time of year is a super hectic time for them. So we don't usually even see them this time of year. Um, but we'll hear more from them. Um, so we'll get a chance to talk to them more than, but just says a little bit of background. Okay. Yeah. So we're actually hoping to do a, uh, kind of meet and greet with you guys on this platform. Uh, pretty soon, maybe in like the end of the fall. All right. It would be good to show you some pictures of the stuff we've been doing. Okay. Sounds good. Yeah. So as far as trying to get a map, I was just trying to get a map up so that you could just get an overview of the locations. It is. Okay. Take it away, Brad. All right. So our goal is to install four bog bridges along the Robert Frost trail. Two of them are going to replace bridges that are already there now, but they're kind of an unsafe condition. And then two of them are going to be proposed new bridges over areas that are wetlands with heavy traffic from the Robert Frost trail. So one of them has some random boards or sticks, uh, that, you know, people kind of jump from stick to stick or board to board over. Um, and the other one that's proposed is, uh, people are just kind of hopping between routes or trampling through the mud. Um, uh, the new bridges that we're proposing on all these are going to be constructed with pressure treated lumber. Oh, that's a good picture of it. Actually. That one is the one over in Bayberry. Um, so yeah, the bridges are going to be constructed using pressure treated lumber. Most of the lumber is going to be a free cut off site. And then we'll haul it into the wetland to put together. The goal overall is to protect the wetlands by installing the bridges over them just so the traffic goes on the bridge and not trampling through the wetland damaging it. Uh, we've had a ton of traffic this year on the trail. So it's, it's a pretty good time to be doing this. Uh, one of the bridges is Aaron noted is in Lawrence swamp down south, uh, two were in Bayberry kind of in the middle of town, just below Amethyst brook. And, uh, one of them farther up north on, uh, the South Black Hills road. That's kind of the gist of it. So, um, just to kind of take it to connect the photos with the, with the plans. Um, this is site one on the map that I shared. Um, so this is the one that's for the South, um, that's down off of station road. Um, and so the plan is there's an existing bridge there. That's the one, um, where it shows it's like about to collapse there. Um, so this is this bridge and then, um, taking, removing that and, um, replacing it. Um, so these, the sites were all delineated by art Allen. Okay. That was my main question was just to make sure we're being consistent. So as long as we've got them all delineated and we're well outside bank fall. Yep. Instead. Um, site two was, so these are the two Bayberry ones that, um, Brad was referencing two and three there. Um, and then the other one, um, was sort of west of Echo Hill and south of Amethyst Brook on the Robert Frost trail. And, um, one of them is an existing footbridge that is similar, similar to the other one noted, um, needs to be replaced. And then site number three is, um, the Wetland. Um, and there's a lot of damage there. So the idea would be to concentrate foot traffic on a proposed bog bridge and all of the, so the. Footings. Um, in this case, one footing is proposed in the Wetland. And two, one is also on, on either side of the Wetland in the buffer, but the idea is to restore this area of damage. And then site number. Okay. So I'm sorry. So that's, I'm sorry. Um, this is site number three there. So you can see that it's definitely getting a lot of. Um, Erosion. And then this is site number four. This one is up off of flat hills. Um, Up here, uh, just west of flat hills on the Robert Frost trail. And, um, this one is another one that's kind of a really. Um, And the idea is to concentrate, um, foot traffic over a bog bridge. There would be three footings placed in the wetland on this one. Um, and then the areas in green and blue would be restored. So the wetland, the bank and land underwater would be restored. And just to talk a little bit about alteration and restoration numbers. So you guys can get a sense of that. Um, I'm sorry. I don't want to jump ahead here. See you guys got DEP comments. No, not yet. We did not get them yet. Oh, did not get them yet. Right. Yeah. Um, so we were looking at this as a, as a mitigation project because of the number one, the two, the two foot bridges that are existing are really damaging the bank and the idea is to lift them up. Put the footings outside of the bank and then restore the ground. And then we saw those photos. The other areas are heavy foot traffic damaging the wetland. Um, and so the idea is to concentrate foot traffic over these bog bridges. And so as you can see, like, these are the restoration numbers. So for bank and 93 square feet for the wetland, 1147 square feet, land underwater, 1192 square feet, boarding lands subject to flooding. Uh, 20 square feet. And then for alteration. Um, the only area where there's really a proposed alteration that significant is on site number one, which is located in a hundred year flood zone. And it's because the bridge is increasing in size. And so we have to account for the square footage of the increase in volume from the bridge construction. We're trying to lift it up. So it's higher outside, you know, to get it up high so that it's outside of the outside of the bank and hopefully outside of the flood zone as well. So we're trying to have elevations out there because these are not surveyed points. Um, but we are still trying to figure out where we would compensate for the flood storage. That's, um, another to be determined item that we're trying to work out. And what time of year are you guys thinking of doing this? Are you going to try to get it in this fall? Yes, we are. Okay. The flows are dropping. So it should be okay. Pretty soon here. Okay. Any other questions that Aaron and Brad for, and Brendan for any info. Yeah, I mean, this is a super simple trail restoration mitigation project. I think we're just trying to really dot our eyes and cross our T's in the same way that we ask every applicant to. So that's really thinking about the Amherst college application process when I was double checking about. Bank fall dimensions and things like that. So thank you for being diligent. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Great about Brad on this in terms of logistics or anything else. No, I think it should be pretty simple and straightforward. Actually. Okay. Great. Any questions from the commission? Okay. So it sounds like as soon as we get DEP comments, we'll see you guys again, most likely. Um, but otherwise, unless anyone had any comments. David Haynes is here, but I'm guessing that's for. Yeah. So I don't think we have any public comments. So we are just looking for a motion. To continue this hearing. I move we continue the hearing for the Robert Frost trail. Improvements to August 25th at seven 45. All right. Voice vote lecture. Hi, Larry. Hi. Order. Sorry, Anna. Hi, Michelle. Hi. Hi. Hi for me. Thanks. And then I'm an eye. Thanks. Great. All right. Thank you, Brad. And Brad for jumping on tonight. Nice. Yeah, thanks guys. Keep up the good work. Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. Thanks for having us on the, the other thing you guys, if you have a chance, you should check out that Stanley channel. Yeah. Yeah. Awesome job. I also saw you guys have been working on the KC trail coming down onto hot brook. Oh yeah. That's coming soon. Yeah. I'm guessing. All right. Hang in there. Thank you guys. Thank you. Thank you. Have a good one. You too. You did it. Okay. Cool. Thank you. Great. Last hearing on the agenda. Yes. So this is 214 Pomeroy Lane. It looks like Erin, you were out there and have some site photos. We're still waiting on comments from national heritage. So it sounds like we're going to continue, but I also see. David is here. Yeah. Promote him to a panelist while we're discussing this in case he has anything to contribute. Yeah. And there was a memo from their council as well, just sort of on interpreting. The regs. In terms of the commissions. Sort of variances and. Yeah. I don't know. Kind of a lot of legal language, but I'm sure Dave can break that down into more. Digestible bites. And I will flip through these photos while Dave is talking. Let me. Stay there. Oh, there is. Good evening. Nice to see you all. And press was watching you guys. You're very effective. And, and, and the legal ease. I will try to paraphrase it's that's legal ease. I've got a whole nother section of stuff that I presented. This is the wetland restoration area. These are really. They came out well. Erin is absolutely right. It's a, it's a combination of the really good plants. And. From the New England wetland plants and also the fact that when we did this planting, it was absolutely pouring, pouring rain. In a thunderstorm. And we use and stayed stayed rainy for about three or four weeks after that. And it turned out really well. Good success. Straight. We did not this area. We did not. silky dogwood in along with winterberry and high bush blueberry and with speckled alder there was so much regeneration of the silky dogwood that was taking place we did not plant anymore we've got a very good density of the vegetation it's you're going to be happy with it also this photograph shows that the the stakes in the monumentation have been installed they were installed everything has been done according to the timeline that was in the restoration plan so we're on top of that the only thing lacking so far is me submitting a monitoring report which i do want to get to you soon also the the area in the riverfront area was restored that's also within the natural heritage habitat so that that has been done the owner applicant has we've discussed there are a few invasives that are coming in there's a little bit of purple loo strife in here the owner was going to take care of that there is some multi-flora rose which we all love and that that we will take care of appropriately a little bit later there's also some bittersweet and other and multi-flora coming in in the riverfront area natural heritage area that the owner will will be taking care of that that's part of the restoration plan so anyway we're doing well with that the proposed uh and so the notice that's the restoration plan the notice of intent is for the restoration of the agricultural land and agricultural use on the property and the buildings just as a quick summary uh snagging point or discussion item last time came up about we are requesting to actually go down to basically the wetland boundary but leave a five foot on undisturbed soil uh layer outside of it and question came up about how was that justified and why how could you do that and so I prepared a letter outlining why justifying why we should be given a variance for that and I've also included in there an opinion from attorney Michael pill that states basically he in his opinion the the the requirement of a vegetated buffer does not apply to the agricultural land as per year but that's a that's a legal thing but I just want to say that that what we're doing here is they're trying to restore this area to a piece of farmland it was farmland historically it was farmland back I mean they everybody uses a date 1941 and that's when the previous owner bought it and started farming it and use it as a poor farm but historically and and this has been a this has been farmland uh since colonial times and we all know that all all the all the land has been so anyway but this I wanted to document where the this was farmland until the previous owner died about 12 years ago and it fell out of use as agriculture and being maintained as agriculture so it does no no longer has a qualifies for existing land in agriculture exemption so that being said the everybody sort of said well where was the line so I've I've given you in my report their aerial photographs that show uh 1990 through basically nine 2019 and the configuration of land and this whole parcel this whole southern parcel most of it was agricultural land was open field it was pasture there were cows on it it was open land erin if you could could you scroll down or in those aerial photographs that show the in my letter let me see if I can is this the letter that was just submitted or is this a different one so one that was submitted on the 4th of august it should have been in the package last week yes anyway but it it clearly shows that the land was in agriculture and the fields actually were in the wetland in a lot of places and and what we're asking for is to go down to the edge of what is currently being delineated as wetland and so if you we can see the aerial photographs they were in there they were in the package yeah I'm getting there it can be just all about 2010 I can't remember what the date was they started it started growing in um so it has been in agriculture historically it was in agriculture so I wanted to bring that up also the work does qualify as I used to uh I requested a limited project status and it's not because of the wetlands protection act because we don't need one under the wetlands protection act all the work is in the buffer zone no work is occurring within the wetland within the wetland boundaries so it doesn't need a limited project status however um under your bylaw in in terms of if that if that undisturbed buffer zone here these uh this is 2019 this is these are the existing conditions um basically sorry I don't know why my computer is being haywire so wait just sorry David just sorry to interrupt you just to summarize to this point what you're saying is because the land has always been in agriculture and we have evidence of that we can say that under state wetland protection act or under the wetland protection act you know it's okay to work to come up to within five feet of the wetland and now you're about to address what how the town bylaw handles the situation correct correct and under the state act you can work right down to the wetland boundaries okay and so I don't need a wetland uh a limited project status for the work under the under the wetlands protection act mark stinson pointed out in his his comments that we didn't need it we shouldn't have asked for a limited project because we didn't need one under the under the act however I was asking for it to justify it under your bylaw and allow us as a as a variance process to allow uh you to permit it down to the wetland boundary okay I see and so it does qualify as new agriculture it's being done with an NRCS uh plan um there's no grade changes it does qualify for for I'm sorry I should and it's it's actually from what I understand from reading michael pill's memo because our 30 foot no disturb applies specifically to development so um for example residential development has a 30 foot and commercial development has a 30 foot but agriculture is not specifically addressed um so so that is why sort of that that 30 foot is not a um it's not like there's a separate provision of our bylaw that says any work that occurs has to have a 30 foot no disturb it's specific to certain types of work that are proposed including residential commercial um you know industrial uses and that sort of thing thank you that's very that's a very good summary of how he he did put it he also pointed out in his letter that one of your interests is promote agriculture and so he felt that this would be that would also further back up your your uh being allowed to permit something like this um so it does qualify as a limited project in that as as new land and agriculture all fertilizers and pesticides will be used in accordance with the state and federal regulations they really don't want to do that they don't want to have you know they want to do it as organic as possible um so it does qualify as a limited project and you could approve it under that the the owners of the property were grew up living next door to it and and it was had cows walking all over it and everything else and when they then the owner died and it went fallow and then uh there was a um they were work the there was a plan coming forward of the 14 lot subdivision for this property and they wanted to preserve it and so they wanted to they wanted to restore it back to the agricultural land and that's that would that is the and maintain it as open space the northern portion of the property has got a forest stewardship plan on it that's been reviewed and approved by dcr and it's their goal to that that main focus is wildlife enhancement uh invasive species removal educational values they're they want to tie into the to this to the school right next door and maybe they have some trails through there that think people can use um there will be some uh you know forest improvement but that has to come forward with a forest cutting plan that hasn't I don't don't believe has come forward yet so so their their goal is to keep this as open space um and and to turn it into a viable asset for the town is farmland and providing uh food and uh whatever they want to restore the buildings they want to restore the barn their intentions are good and unfortunately got a little bit ahead of the the brush I've gotten in there before it shouldn't um and but that so that's just the preserving it as open space as opposed to a 14 lot development um um and also the the reason we'd like to go into the buffer is just to give us a little bit more farmland I mean they're trying to offset some of the costs of this by by running it as a farm and so the uh that 30 foot zone would eliminate 0.8 0.8 acres of land which is 12 of their land which would be nice it would be good to have them be able to use that to recoup some of the financial um the barns and existing structure will be rebuilt back on the existing footprint and foundation and something that I'm sure you routinely allow so sorry mate may I just jump in so we're talking that um so far though regardless of the amorous bylaw this is actually not limited this shouldn't this wouldn't even fall under a limited project correct well so limited projects are when you are altering resource area and you can't comply with the performance standards so in this case because they're actually not encroaching into the resource area um and the I think the big question is riverfront um because that is also um natural heritage area and I mean they they sort of overlap one another um and I think uh the question from natural heritage was just because the area that was identified as sort of um the area to be farmed was it wasn't entirely clear if that was going to be hayland um or if it was going to be you know crops that were planted there and so I think that was that was like the outstanding question as far as resource area impact right and that and actually we we were we'd never proposing to do any more work and well under this application in the riverfront area there were ideas thrown about about doing some work in that area to help improve the turtle habitat and we put that on hold for a while um in terms of the and so there's no work that's occurring within any resource area so it doesn't require a limited project and I just threw that status in there to if we if that 30 foot buffer zone was an issue this is another reason that you could allow it to go inside of there as a limited project in the under the bylaw only and not on okay yeah that's what I was getting at okay in terms of natural heritage uh we had a converse we had some emails go back back and forth today I I I didn't realize you had to send them the hard copy to get the clock going again I thought it was all everybody was doing everything electronic nobody wants any paper anymore um and so they Rebecca started looking at it again and she came up with a question and that's what we proposed within the natural heritage area is mowing it once a year between november 1st and april 15th which is a dormant season for the species we're concerned um and two things back for the question is how do they know are they going to know where that line is on the ground during the season because where's the line between the productive farmland and that that basically wants a year mowing of that area and and so I talked to the clients and and talked to them about doing is a row of plantings of fruit trees not trees and probably and fruiting uh shrubbery along that line in some sort of a pattern I've sent that back to Rebecca as as a suggestion and I have not heard it was the end more closer to the end of the day so we we haven't heard on that yet I'm expecting it will come to some resolution of some some sort of solving of the problem something like that yeah did you have a comment I just want yeah I do have a comment and I want to just just for the sake of putting this out there from my perspective I have no problem with what they're proposing to do on this application I think that they've gone through the process they've really done a great job restoring the wetlands they've put up barriers to prevent any further impacts to the resource area everything is very clearly marked on the site my only real hang up is natural heritage being satisfied but other than that I really don't have a problem with what they're proposing so I just want to make sure that I put that out there because I know at the last meeting there were questions about you know the variance and I think it's clear that the 30 foot no disturb doesn't apply to agriculture and um I think that it's clear that there are no resource areas being altered in this proposal it's all buffer zone related work so there's that limited project provision where you can't comply with the performance standards isn't even triggered under the wellness protection act I'm just putting that out there because I don't want to I mean if other folks have concerns by all means but from my perspective I just wanted to share where I was coming from yeah that's great Erin so maybe commissioners does anyone anyone have any clarifying questions about either what's been done what's planning to be done or like where we are in this process are we all kind of clear on the decision that we're making here okay yeah so my only I I share your um assessment of the situation Erin I think this has been a long process but um the results are that the both the resources are in better shape and ultimately the plan for the use of the land um is is um well intended and beneficial um I I do get a little confused about with this agricultural kind of lack of clarity with agricultural land and like how we can enforce our 30 foot buffer so will it always come before us in this situation for us to make this decision Erin um I'm just thinking about like are we making a decision that um is going to change the way we think about how we can protect that 30 foot buffer and other locations around town um is there a precedent that we're setting I guess I don't know no and I'm gonna I'm gonna open this up and flip to it really quickly so you can see where that provision falls under so you can see kind of how clear it is but just give me one second to get there okay I could be alone in that concern too I just um we have a lot of agricultural you know hanging farms along major wetland and river resources in our town and I just want to make sure we're clear I'm gonna think uh excuse me if I can just step in agenda there's um if it's existing agriculture it it's it is exempt um I'm not sure well I don't know is your your I think your uh your bylaw has the same exemption that follows the same exemptions at the state so the moment they're we're hanging a field down in the wetland and and pulling out Marche there that's that is still legal okay and if they were doing it if they've been doing it in agricultural use prior to inception of the wetland protection act and they it's been in continuous agricultural use haid as hayland and it's not legal yeah okay okay um but I but to get at your question Jen like residential lot subdivision lot commercial industrial driveways parking areas other roads and then vernal pools have their own separate um you know the 100 foot but these these setbacks these no work distance setbacks are specific to these uses these proposed activities yep that's pretty damn clear okay great well that's helpful thank you David and Aaron for answering that did anyone else have any questions or comments um okay well so what would be helpful at this point it sounds like we just need to come to a resolution with national natural heritage so we have to continue this to our next meeting anyway um is there anyone anyone else needs in order to close this hearing would we anyone need any more information because we will hopefully vote on this at our next meeting yeah and I mean and Dave I'm not sure what your thoughts are on this and Jen what your thoughts are on this but one option is if we closed the public hearing tonight and issued the order of conditions at the next meeting similar to what we did with Tefino that's an option and that way it kind of gives the applicant some closure but of course that means that we're going to have some kind of resolution from natural heritage that we can incorporate into our conditions at the next meeting so um that the clock starts ticking on the 21 days so it's really kind of you guys could you could you drag I don't know how you set up your writing of your orders of conditions could you have it I would prefer if you're not gonna if we're not gonna close it tonight you want to know the conditions yeah I'd rather keep it open in there but if you could write a draft the order that you would approve next time because they would like to get started on the barn and things like that and and and start working with it before the end of the season and I'm assuming I'm going to be giving you a revised plan that shows what we're doing along that limit and also we're going to actually ask for and a little bit more fencing along the along the trail uh that comes down the west side of the property but anyway um so okay so it's um keep it open yep okay the issues that come up that we could address next time and then but get the order of conditions that would be a great favor to us and I'm not ready to close tonight I didn't try to get one again but it didn't happen okay no that that all sounds episodic to me Aaron unless you have any final concerns no I'll be ready to run with it um and basically I'll just have it drafted and say here's my recommended conditions I recommend to approve with these conditions and then just kind of get it out the door okay awesome um last question for me are either Jason Venditti or Venditti or I know Mickey Marcus would have been here for the fear and he's loved in this project right yeah they're here for the Lincoln the Lincoln street discussion which is following this okay got it thank you you're welcome all right so no doesn't look like we have any public comments so with that I think we just need a motion to continue I move we continue oh go you want to go for it all right you got on all right move we continue this um hearing for 2014 Palmyrae Lane to September August 25th at 750 pm second all right voice vote Fletcher hi Anna hi Larry hi Leroy hi Michelle hi who did I forget I think that's me I'm an I thank you very much yeah thanks Dave we'll see you in a couple weeks be good take care um yeah sorry about my voting problem guys when I'm like looking at the scroll on the top of my screen you all change order like in the middle of when we're trying to do a voice vote as long as you get us all we don't care about the order how do I lock it Anna can I lock really good question I think it depends on who talks yeah that's why it changes but you're doing a good job you have not okay I just want to let you guys know I'm not it's like a technical issue I'm having okay moving on so that was our last hearing right yes now we are going to um where do you want to head here Erin we're going to other but informal discussion of Lincoln I have apartments correct you must be why make easier okay I'm here I got you so they've requested a like a sort of five minute informal presentation on um there is an existing order of conditions for UMass for their operation maintenance plan um and so they're basically presenting what they're proposing underneath that order of conditions umbrella okay great I appreciate that I was involved in that blanket NOI process and this was one thing that was important so thanks for being here um Mickey and Jason how are you eating all uh you know if I can just start for a second I'll let Jason uh describe the projects but um we sent Erin a plan that was done by Weston and Samson engineers and a new mass is planning to demolish uh two apartment facilities uh one um the north village apartments and the second is the Lincoln Avenue apartments both of them have portions of the work in buffer zone in the orders of conditions it requires a review by conservation agent or the commission so the plans have been submitted they show erosion control around the entire developed part of the property there's no new work um and uh because both of the properties have more than uh one acre of work they will go through the sweat but uh Jason can just give you an overview of what's going on and what the what the university is planning getting you all yes uh the reason why we requested this rather than just doing this standard notification process that is defined by our comprehensive notes of intent we wanted to um after having a couple meetings that we had had with Jason Skeels and Gilbert mooring and Dave Zomek and others um we thought it'd be best to kind of plant the seed in regard to where we are so when you see the type of work that is on going on the campus in multiple locations that you knew what was going on and you didn't think that there was something that was uh differential or varying or impeding of any resources areas so that's why we really wanted to come in uh tonight and discuss with you and kind of lay out where we're going um so in short the campus has basically selected a developer that is going to uh it's under design right now in regard to developing the pros both parcels of the north village and the Lincoln apartment sites and right now that is a very early in the design process we have included the town actually they have the current plan set that we have we thought it'd be best to actually include them referring to Jason Skeels, Gilbert mooring and others in the design review because they're basically within town they're distilled from our normal campus properties so this process that we're going through here as a notice of intent will be forthcoming um when we go to further design processes right now we're looking into the demolition the campus is really going to procure the demolition by itself to allow that to happen sometime early summer but due to multiple reasons and COVID being one of them the campus has agreed to basically procure those through the developer to allow them to do the demolition with their construction management firm that they have so basically Suffolk is a construction management firm they have filed the SWIP they have begun the process of starting to dig safe and those kind of things but what really what we wanted to do is tell you that you'll see as part of our filing for the comprehensive notice of intent you'll see that we are doing demolition we are making you describe the resources and the SWIP notification process that we have and the measures that we have but basically what I wanted to be here from the campus's point of view is to instill to you that we'll be coming back in front of you with a notice of intent with the development process that we're still reviewing the town is reviewing also we're right now in comment stage so we're awaiting comments from Guilford and Jason others as we are also providing comments back to the developer so but basically that's what we're here for is to basically tell you that we're looking to start demolition sometime early August right now it looks like I say early August it's already the 11th but we actually don't have a firm date for when that contractor will have a basically demolition contractor mobilizing to the site we have basically have assurance that we will be following the construction plans that we had had originally laid out to be followed which basically follows all the script ball applications that we have we've coordinated all these plans with Jason and Guilford and we were basically just wanted to you know tell you guys what's going on is why we're here so we wanted to be an informal conversation just so you know what's going on and basically tell you that we'll be coming back in front of you for a formal notice intent for what development will look like but it's too early in the stage of design to be able to present that to you so that's pretty much why we're here no I appreciate that I was part I think Fletcher at least Fletcher and I were both here when we did the comprehensive NOI and I know this was something that was like a big part of that was making sure that we had this open communication especially with projects like this so I really appreciate that you guys are here and made the time to notify us Erin do you have any concerns based on looking at these plans I mean I'm I've got them on my computer so I can like see what's going on here and it looks like the erosion controls and pretty good shape from what I can read as I zoom in and scroll around um it's a 300 series plan so like 300 301 302 are are the north village apartments and they show the all the erosion control yep whole site yeah I got that yeah plan C 303 is Lincoln and that shows the erosion control they're using uh post ox straw bales uh silk fence straw bottles there's a a plan called D 100 that has all the erosion controls I found that one yeah my apologies I should have mentioned my I'm sorry Erin I should have mentioned the current schedule that we're seeing from the development team and the demolition contractors that they're still procuring uh right now it looks as though they're going to start fully on north village which we think sometime mid-august land of august when I say mid-august we're already in mid-august they just just filed a dig save so that by itself on campus terms is 10 days so we still have a lot of permitting they still have a lot of permitting to go through so it's probably not going to be into probably like the 23rd or so of august that they'll even mobilize to the site the current plan that they have which the campus is part and partial to is that north village will go first and then Lincoln apartments will follow so Lincoln apartments is probably not going to start until mid-october it's probably a good timeline to gauge here the timeline is still dynamic in regard to how it sequences through with north village and notifications on roads we want to make sure that towns included in their sewer that comes through um that we want to make sure we relocate properly this there's a lot of things to coordinate still so those that that coordination of Lincoln apartments is a little uh delayed in regard to that probably won't start until mid-october north village is looking to probably be somewhere around the week of the 23rd just to you know should I mention that I'm trying my apologies for interrupting again no that's good to know thanks she said and yeah that's helpful thanks for I think I was had was on the right plan but that was helpful mickey thank you um Erin yeah I was just gonna say it would be great if we could do a pre-construction and also if I could have contact information for suffix during the process those two things would just be sort of a standard thing that I would do for every site to make sure I can get out and look at erosion controls and have the contact information for the contractor just in case any problems come up during the project life great I don't know if this is informal so I can just smell like a back and forth thing so I can say so I have asked them for that exact same thing we have asked for that type exact coordination to be discussed with the development team as for we have balfour betty campus solutions who has hired suffix who are then gonna procure a demolition contractor we also share that concern of who do we call who do they call if there's an incident on site I mean I take the worst case scenario there's an accident on site did they call the police they call you mass police go town police and respire all those things are going to be resolved over the next couple weeks we have asked for a formal meeting with them right now it looks like that's going to be on the 23rd just as it again to mobilize the site I was debating actually inviting Jason skills to that is that something Erin you might want to attend for some portion of or should we just follow up with you some kind of correspondence saying here are the contact information in regard to who you should be contacting and yeah I mean I my primary concern is looking at erosion controls just making sure that they're installed prior to work so I don't want to any time from other folks if you know if literally it's it's generally like a five to ten minute walk I get the call I go out there I walk the line I say green light and I have the contact information for the contractor and that's that's basically what I'm asking for yeah we have not seen their sequence plan we anticipate them starting in the front of the complex towards North Pleasant Street and working the way all the way back towards the end and considering that's like a 32 acre site that could be a month and a half two months before they actually out get to the all the way to that west edge those are the things I might want to include you in regard to their sequence and schedule so yeah yeah and I mean I can be on call like if they know you know the first section of site is going to start this date I can come out and look at it and then if they know the second section is going to start they can just I can you know provide my cell phone number to you guys so that I can they can just reach out or email me and let me know and it doesn't have to be like a big formal meeting on site with everybody it can more or less leave after that so yeah so yeah I understand what you're saying yeah so you know I'll do is I'll uh include you in the correspondence that we're going to have to set up the communication chain because a lot of that's going to be like life safety and first responders and all that stuff that goes with normal construction projects considering that north village is distilled from campus it it warrants us having a further conversation than we normally do you know we build all these buildings all over campus and we have that protocol of how who gets called when and on what type of search and dance but this is a little different so we'll probably include you in the first kickoff of hey just so you know here's the correspondence that we have this is the person sitting on site this is the name of the person doing inspections for swip and those kind of things the stuff is related to you but you might be included a longer list of correspondence like as relates to the town you know we're working around town sewer we're working around town drainage that comes off into a pleasant street so there are other factors that correlate to the town that we want to make sure we're inclusive of correspondence too so sounds good great thank you for that extra effort for the communication hey John I can just add one other thing so the way the orders of conditions are written for UMass's work so this type of project falls under maintenance but it does require the commission to review and say yeah that's okay but new work does require a notice of intent and that's why Jason was saying that you would expect to see any redevelopment to come back before you as a new project with a notice of intent on a full NOI right gotcha yep so you're just notifying us about the demolition yeah good got it yeah great the design team the developer has hired um you've seen before we've been in front of you before so it's it's very similar team that has been busy before in fact SWCA now sorry mickey but I always call you knowing environmental still have it but SWCA and niche environmental or niche engineering has worked with us on actually I think somebody who here still when we did the ILC which what it's called now then new academic classroom buildings what we called when we permitted it when we went for and did the port of dam to hold back the pond to do all the work the restoration of the dike and we recommended what you guys agreed to which is great that we install more techniques units south of the pond to allow that to be protected rather than downstream which is then we think successful we have actually had a lot of debris that's coming down the tambourine there so as we further that permit process you're actually gonna see niche engineering probably with SWCA with us I think to basically come in front of you again to say this is what we're proposing right now that design is not furthered we don't know exactly what's going to happen with that development site so far they're basically not truly adjusting tambourine more than their development is going to be to the west of the overflow piping so we had thought initially that we would do some kind of head wall reconstruction some kind of improvements to that right now we're not sure if that's going to be in there and again this is very informal I told all this Jason and Gilford a couple weeks ago so I just want to tell you the campus is still evaluating options to that we still are seeing a lot of runoff that has a lot of sedimentation a lot of debris a lot of concrete blocks bricks sticks etc that are coming down tambourine that are getting luckily getting caught by that storm separate unit that we put in excuse me we're taking this unit that are put in that's before the pond so I'm very happy that we put that in there and eventually you'll see with SWCA eventually us coming in front of you to talk about a pond management plan that's much more further than anything you've seen before we'd like to a redregging and we're coming to go through that process too so I thought I'd take the opportunity while we're here in front of you to say just so you know the campus has a lot that we'd like to talk to you with that we'd like to include you with that we're trying to be aggressive with which is all great stuff but right now it's too early but we didn't want you to see demolition ongoing and think oh boy here's UMass doing this without telling us all of that is going to be formally coming in front of you with an NOI and we'll have this design team that's for that project presenting it to you there'll be probably a separate effort that's going to go on on directly related to tanbrook and campus pond stuff so that's I just want to plant those seeds that I anticipate over the next couple I would say 18 months we'll be seeing a lot more of you guys which is good for us because these efforts are part and parcel to ms4 and where we go from here so we're looking for that partnership going forward so yeah I know mickey you came in front of us before about the campus pond dredging too so right this has all been on the radar yeah much appreciate we're looking forward to that we don't want to dredge the pond until we know what's going to happen with the head wall and we don't know where the exactly the complex that's going to take over the Lincoln apartments is going to be we're not sure if that head wall which we think is an opportunity as a campus to further protect upon if that's going to be in that project or we're going to create a separate project to manage that so that's where we're coming from as a campus but again you're correct Jen that that is exactly what we'll be seeing you guys again for all these efforts so which we think is great that part is great great thank you thank you you're talking about um uh daylighting tanbrook and making like a little river walkway by the Lincoln apartment don't open it don't open a can of worms we're in discussion all options are on the table we want to improve water quality we've um we've had a couple rain events in July we've got a couple rain events in July that have tested the ability for us now so that uh that used to surcharge over that parking lot a lot and we had debated at the time before before put the storm scepter in and before before that door came soon in we had debated whether or not that was going to be something that we consider because it'd be we thought a good thing for water quality and storm water management but since we've now cleaned out that culvert to the point where it actually water is going to the pond that's improved water quality to the pond so it's changed our dynamics that the buoyant fields that used to flood don't flood as much so there's a lot yeah there's a lot to that so yes Fletcher will be indeed looking at at this stage I'm not sure if that development's going to do that we've debated it and it's not defined as to what's in the project or not but because services urban heat island mitigation you know living classroom functioning wetlands are better for air quality and water quality culverted water is not the healthiest water we agree we know just like nobody knows it better than you guys though so yeah we're studying it actually started uh separate studies even with campus uh agents referring to academics to like start tracking water quality separate from ms4 just so we can start informing that a little bit more so yeah measure flow in there too yeah did it rain in july not sure i couldn't over 10 inches over 10 inches at my house record should ask a hydrologist that question i don't know that's crazy yeah yeah all right well this is great i really appreciate it any other comments or questions commissioners okay well i think i was gonna say my only comment would be that over the over what's come up along the way we should do some focusing on tan brook overall we've got fearing we've got other things tan brook should be focused on we were that's where fletcher and i have been not been going there larry thanks for coming in yeah like the train and to punctuate that we we are we are trying to do something internally um brand so more to come on that later i don't want to do anything but yeah we're the same way it's the hot topic for us to yeah yeah big thinking on that okay well thank you both i think in the interest of time i'll we'll let you go um we've had some pretty epic summer night meetings lately so we really appreciate the communication um and we look forward to seeing you again soon thank you all for your action all right thanks very much okay all right so i'm gonna this was like a sneaky long one well i'm gonna come in like a lion and go out like a lamb we only have we only have one certificate of compliance uh 31 fox globling i was out there today the site looks fine um so i would recommend that we issue a complete certification out there if anyone wants to see pictures i'll pull them up i'm comfortable um pulling erin's guidance on that uh so i issue is it just issuing certain you said sort of certificate of compliance issue a full certification full certification thank you um i move the issue a full certification of compliance to 31 fox glib lane second okay nobody talk voice vote selector hi larry hi michelle hi anna hi loroy hi and i'm an i okay that's it that's all i got for you all right that was super productive thank you that was like how we wanted the the noi with you mess to work so i don't know fletcher if you remember how much humming and hawing we did about that um but that's good because erin that way you are in the loop um so that when people are calling and their rainstorms in the middle of october and they've got that whole site opened up at least yeah well and just so you not you guys know because i know we had that um rda for amherst college i encourage them to follow the same exact process as the um o and m plan for amherst college so they should be coming in with that at some point okay cool that's great all right any um final comments or questions all right awesome um i guess we just need a motion to adjourn i got it uh-huh you didn't you just said you got it that's what i'm saying so i'm with you i'm with you so moved okay so moved okay i think we're gonna give it to larry oh we need a second we need a second we got a second from anna voice vote larry hi anna hi fletcher hi loroy hi michelle hi and i'm an i hi thanks everyone thank you guys you rock stars enjoy good work till next time see you soon