 I'm Keena Nisley and this is The Life of a Land is in its Real Estate on Think Tech, Hawaii. Today we have a great show on to be or not to be a real estate agent. We know the real estate market is great right now and everyone's thinking, oh I should jump in and get my license. So today I have Anthony Pace from Keller Williams Honolulu to share with us should you be a real estate agent. Hi Tony so welcome to the show. Hi Keena thanks for having me on. Yeah it's great to have you so tell us a little bit about yourself. I got licensed in 1985 and it was about a year after I had seen a program on TV about buy real estate no money down and I was like oh I see real estate being a fascinating way to create wealth and I had gone out and bought a couple of properties with a friend of mine no money now as a matter of fact and I just had such a love for real estate that I started talking about it to everybody. People had asked me about you know am I licensed or I have a car and I said no I saw maybe it's a good time to get in. So I got my license in 1985 I got my broker's license in 1987 and I've been in the business ever since then and this is all I've done for the past 35 coming up on 36 years. So wow so what did you do before real estate? I was a criminal investigator for the Navy out of Barbara's point which is now part of Kalala. Wow all right great so let's talk about what what is it to be a real estate agent is do we just get to go show pretty houses all day? No you know there's a lot of education involved and it's it's knowing the market it's providing great service to your client you know finding out the wants and needs of your client whether they're a buyer investor you know a homeowner or a seller and just kind of like going from there. So you talk about knowing the market so how do you get to know your market because obviously if you're someone who's just getting into the business do you automatically know the market? Well you know the data in our system goes back probably above a good 50 to 20 years and so you can research you know any part of the market that you want to be engaged in so if you want to work the white team market it would be good to study that over the last 20 years to find out the peaks and the valleys the highest appreciation of lowest appreciation what buildings have low maintenance fee what buildings have you know higher maintenance fees which ones you can do as a condo towel they can for short-term rentals or if you want to specialize in the keep you want to go to the keeping market so I think in the very beginning everybody wants to go ahead and you know know everything there is about the real estate as far as I know why but you can't do that. I remember like my first year in real estate my first transaction was up in Makaha $55,000 purchase but you know back then I was willing to go to Makaha for $55,000 sale right but I wouldn't be able to do that now because like you know you have to specialize a little bit more so I think you kind of have to pick out a market study it see where the highest sales are the number of turnover and then you basically figure out what your income can be if you can tap five or ten percent of that market. Okay so you have been in a number of years because I'm also an agent but I'm on year four so I have been lucky enough to only experience a growth over over the past three years that I've been you know really active in in real estate but you have definitely been in a lot longer so what have you seen in the ups and downs in the shifts what kind of what have you experienced? Well in an upmarket you kind of see an increase of people getting their real estate license because it doesn't really take that much to sell a property. However as you're experiencing now in the market you're working with buyers that they're getting beat out on multiple offers you know you may be representing a buyer that's competing with 40 other people they get kind of burnt out so you have to be able to advise them you know a good offer to structure like how long are they going to be here for you know there's people coming in that maybe only be on the island for a couple of years it doesn't make it that doesn't make any sense for them to buy at the moment or versus renting okay so the more knowledge you have the better you can service your client. On a downside of the cycle it's a little bit more difficult to make sales because there are less buyers less sellers going around and they tend to gravitate for the more experienced agents that can get them through a difficult market so you know in an upmarket you can take the property that sold for 800,000 three months ago and price a new listing that's maybe 825 is easy right now you're in a down market and the price that the property that sold 800,000 dollars three months ago may only be worth 775 or maybe a little bit less so you always have to get or jump and be ahead of the market because otherwise you're behind the market and then you see and you see less and you see more and more people getting out of the market in a downside. So everyone talks about you know the crash in 2008 what how did you ride that out? The crash in 2008 it depends on where it depends on where you work out right the crash in 2008 really affected mostly the west side and I want to say from say Kuniya all the way out to the Makaha side because the way that the real estate cycle goes and why is that the central business district goes up from price first and then it kind of spreads out to all the other areas of the island and so normally the Makaha side is the last place to experience great growth appreciation but it's also the first one to come down so it's in the opposite effect right so it's the first it's the last to go up the first to come down so I specialize in town you know people in town they tend to not over leverage their properties so we didn't see a lot of short sales we saw people that had the ability to hold on there was a lot of less you know there were less deals to go around but I had been in the business at that point you know 25 25 years and so I had good market knowledge I could tell clients you know where to where to price at um if they were selling if they were buying I could kind of tell them just this building you know has appreciated them more over the past 10 years and made the property next door for various reasons so you kind of want to know all that you want to do all that research so I'm getting in the business like right now it's good if you're not out there looking at property on a daily basis and the area you want to be researching you're not going to not going to last that long so okay so what changes over all the years that you've been in real estate have you seen technology has made a big impact in our business um you know we used to use operate after prior to every information where um when I came when I when I got in the market with no such thing as the internet so you know if you wanted to take the limit of a property there was basically every other week you had an mls book which looked like a phone book and had every single listing that was on the market but it wasn't updated for the following month so you would call on properties that were already in escrow um you know and then everything became online and then you had companies come in that now take the data and push it out to you know Zillow truly uh realtor.com so if you're not keeping up you know two things one if you're not keeping up with the technology you're going to lose your clientele to the technology but those people may be using technology but they're still using the realtor so some of the people that I've worked with you know especially on the mainland they've gone out and research properties on their own through Zillow truly our realtor.com and when they find the right one they'll call me about it and I can tell them all the nuances about the property to the neighborhood so I think technology has changed a lot in a good way but for the people that don't want to embrace it you know they can't keep up with it and they're getting on the market. Oh yes so definitely um so what would you advise someone to get into real estate right now? Absolutely I mean I came into the market in um 1985 it was a little bit of a difficult market it was you know 12 interest rates you know a three bedroom two bath while the prices were low at you know I bought my first property at 12 and a half percent 115 thousand dollars my mortgage payment was was 12 30 you know fast forward you know 20 years later you know I bought our property for 200 my mortgage payment was like a thousand fast forward to today you know I could buy something for 400 have a mortgage payment less than what it was back in 1985 so we've seen a lot of changes over the market and I've made a living through every single cycle so it just depends on on your determination in your drive and can you outlast your competition? Yes um it definitely is it's tenacity and and a lot of work but um so what makes a successful agent what have you seen over the years for people that have been successful? Knowledge you know knowledge is first and foremost um the ability to communicate effectively with your client and make them realize that you really have the best interest in hand and heart and that you're not just looking at them in the paycheck because you end up because you tend to go the extra mile for people when you really care about them and you've given the right advice like forget about how much you're going to make on a commission and think about is it a good is this property a good fit for them is it a good time for them to buy where do you see the market going the better off waiting until the rates come lower questions come down to every situation is a little bit different I mean I've had clients that have you know pursued properties I just told them it's not a good fit for you don't work at the seller and they were pretty substantial commission but dealing some you know pretty high end luxury stuff but you know they're respecting for that and will come back to me no time and time and I'm not a good fit for everybody every buyer every seller every client that's come across my desk um but I know what I'm capable of doing and how I connect with my people and keep them engaged so yeah so it is I mean I have found in the years I've been in you know very short years it is very relationship based absolutely I tell my clients there's one thing you're approved for and there's another thing of what you can afford so I you know you do have to watch out for them because that that can be very different um and what the lender says and really you know what do you want to spend so is it free to be a real estate agent it's not free it's definitely a low barrier to entry um you know I never went to college so I don't have a college education I did go to back to school later just because I didn't need a degree or I didn't you know I didn't need to pass a test or to pass a class but I think in today's day and age it's probably you know five or six hundred dollars maybe a little bit more to take the real estate class maybe a couple hundred dollars for the exam depending on how many times you pass it or fail it I should say um and if you're going to be joining the board national association of realtors with LMSP you're probably looking at about you know $1,200 so I want to say if you're interested in getting into the game or the business is that at least $2,000 that you're going to have to spend a lot of money again so that's just to get licensed and get started that's not you know your your business card your marketing your website you can decide to get one so it becomes expensive yes so it does so what is I know everybody doesn't make it and I'm sure you have seen I mean I've seen people come and go in in my four years I'm sure you have seen a lot of people come and go um over the years so what what is the biggest cause of failure well real estate is it's uh it could be it can be a difficult business right like you like you may not you know you may not look I have a passion for real estate I have since I bought my first two properties and I love real estate and I'll probably work until I can't work any longer but this is it when I made a commitment in 1985 to get my real estate license this was the only path I saw for the rest of my life now 1985 1986 those weren't very good years for me um and I'm going to tell you like I I don't want to say I was starving but you know times were hard but I just persevered because I just didn't want to have to go out and get a regular job and you know the more time and more energy the more effort you put into the business the more money you can make so really the only limitations in the business are the ones you put on yourself yes so I will say the only the only pitfall I see is that it we have to work hard I work still work very long hours as do you because I'm usually bothering you um but what are the other pitfalls that you see besides the long hours um you know change in business you know the market changes you know people are used to doing business a certain way and all of a sudden technology comes in and you can't you can't adapt to it um not enough not enough clients want to do business with you so you're always struggling for the next deal and at some point in time I mean and you can't do this on a part-time basis you know I mean if this is going to be you know how you're going to make a living it has to be your career not like I'm going to go do two or three days two or three deals a year and expect to make a good living so it's and you got to be self motivated you got to wake up in the morning you're going to do all the things that you need to do the prospect to take care of your clients and then you've got to be highly motivated and self motivated definitely um I totally agree with that it is definitely every day getting up asking yourself what am I going to do today to generate money or generate do with my take care of my clients what am I going to do today um I'm sorry to interrupt but it doesn't mean to it's a stressful business right you there is you really don't have that much control right like you go out and you sell a property whether you represent the buyer of the seller after that it's really up to the buyer and the seller to make the transaction happen and then you have escrow then you have mortgages you have title issues you have survey issues pest control issues there's like anywhere along the way that deal can just fall apart and some people just you know they can't handle that yes and when a deal falls apart that means you don't get paid um but and I still have I don't leave I know you don't either I don't leave my clients at the at the closing table like I don't walk away I continue to um work with them they're your clients for life and you're the one they call when hey my toilet just overflowed do you have a plumber do you know I can't get into my garage do you remember what the code is you're the one that's still there yeah yeah and I mean I know you're the same way you are you are with your they're your clients forever yeah I think more so I think more so you know more so with COVID happening is that um I became very engaged with my clients I did you know Zoom calls or or FaceTime with um because you know you really couldn't meet them face to face I believe in technology to a certain extent but I don't like text messaging I I always anytime there was an issue or I needed something or something to be done I always made a phone call and they appreciated it and so I've carried that you know for the last you know seven or eight months since you know COVID happened um and I think my business had increased you know this past year and has just rolled right into 2021 yeah so yes the market has stayed very good we've stayed very busy so we've kind of talked about the bad stuff but what do you love about being a real estate agent oh I love seeing people getting the keys to their home you know like their their their face light up when they find something and they get to move in um so it's really all about the client you know it's really all about that just like see I like see people with happy endings yeah it is I I feel that way too I just you know we talked about it yesterday it's like it's like a win it just feels like you've won you you made their dreams come true and and you're there to help them so especially if it's a difficult you know especially if it's a difficult transaction because you've had some of those that you even you have called me on oh yes and and to me and I feel like each transaction is definitely different it's a little bit of a game um you know to see you know see how many how many items are issued that you can that you can handle and then you realize like wow like I'm really worth you know it's like this is a business that the longer you're in it the more value you you bring to the table yeah I think like once you get going you have a long journey and do a good job like there's no reason for you to get out of business until you're just it's time to retire yeah and it it does feel good even when you know you get through your j1 inspection it's a time inspection it's a time to celebrate you you that's a huge obstacle um so you've got to celebrate it and I mean we we kind of talk about how hard it is I talk about the long hours we work but it is a great career and if you love people especially so um yes so was the boom that we saw during COVID um what you expected no I don't think anybody expected it I think most people had assumed that the the bottom would just fall out of the market and just be tanking and you know we definitely saw a low in sales when COVID first happened you know everything was shut down but what happened was is that you know people wanted to go out and you want to buy something they had they still have real estate needs and it just happens that inventory got that short um decreased you've had a lot of people coming from the mainland say hey I don't want to be in LA if I'm going to have to quarantine I want to be in Hawaii and so we had a lot of mainland people come out here too so we've had you know some of the biggest sales in the last you know probably five or six years that happened that happened during COVID. Yeah it was I remember sitting in a with Colette in a shift meeting because we were anticipating a big shift of the market downward and it was a talk on how are you going to keep your clients engaged how are you going to make it through the shift and then COVID hit and I I too thought we were just going to plummet and it every day it was just like okay how can I reach out to my clients today how can talk to them today you know sending handwritten notes just to keep everybody's spirits up and make it through we didn't know how long and so I I didn't expect this either so where do you think the market is headed do you think we're going to keep this pace up or what do you think it's again we don't have a crystal ball so you can't hold us to any of this but what do you think I think as long as I think as long as rates stay stay where they're at because that is definitely feel the market in a big way because you know people that couldn't afford any more than say like a few hundred thousand dollars can now afford like double what they could have you know a couple of years ago so I think as long as interest rates you know stay where they're at the market will continue the way it's at and as long as the world has some sort of an order to it it looks like they were coming out of COVID with the vaccines travel you know is happening again I think it would be a good good market for you know a few years to come still you know if you may see a little bit of a shift to where there are not multiple offers you know like there have been but I think it'll be a good market for the next few years so all right so we do have a viewer question and she says that everyone knows a realtor one or two or even three even have realtors as family members how do you choose one realtor over another without creating bad feelings amongst your circle of friends um so I recently I'm working with a client now that has a couple of other realtor friends and we're all friends together for probably the last 20 years and everybody has serviced their real estate needs at some point in time but they had a need a different you know they have specific property that maybe wasn't a good fit for the other two realtors and so they came to me and I don't think there was any hard feelings with the other people um at least that's not what I'm told but you have to make the choice as what's good for you as the client has the buyer as the seller and that's kind of how you have to look out for yourself and you have to pick the agency that's going to have your best interest whether it's a relative or not a relative or a friend or not a friend so yeah so with that I mean what what what should people look for in a real estate agent something that has the best interest at heart someone that's gonna you know be there with their sleeves rolled up you know and do whatever it takes to get you the house or to sell the house that you want um and no hard feelings between the two of you right because you you know you can part ways with your with your realtor at any given time in transaction you know if you're working with one of your best friends or a good relative and something goes you know south you know can you maintain that that familiar or that that friendship you know going forward all right well we hope we answered the viewer's question um let's touch on one more thing that you mentioned earlier about education so as a real estate agent are you one and done you take the test and boom you never have to look back no absolutely not well first off there's requirements every two years you have to take a number of classes I always try and oversee the number of credits I have to take because I like learning I'm very learning based I like to study what's happening on the mainland because a lot of mainland trends follow Hawaii um like the last downturn in 2000 that began like 2006 2007 that was the peak of the market Hawaii did not suffer like it did on the mainland the west side took a bit of a dip but not like it did on the mainland so you always kind of want to be prepared to see what the trends are on the mainland because you know Hawaii's out where you know two thousand miles away the mainland we always we always lag we always lag so we always have to be a little different so yes there is a lot of education I know there's a lot of options to get different certifications so do you recommend that agents when they come in start working on those different certifications do they make a difference I think if you're going to go into commercial you kind of want to go for CCIM which is almost like the College of Equivalent of you know commercial real estate um there's a GRI classes there's the CRS classes there are a number of designation classes that you can take if you want to specialize working with say you know the elderly or you know military there's all kinds of designated nations that you can get and even if you don't want to the designation just the fact that you're learning more and more about engaging with different types of clients throughout the market when they work with them or not is always a good thing because you maybe answered some maybe didn't answer someone's questions better than someone else and that's a good thing you want to be of service contribution you want to be educated you want to be well rounded yeah all right well that is the end of our show and thank you so much that was awesome information and if you are interested in becoming a real estate agent or you'd like more information about becoming a real estate agent you can reach out to me you can reach out to Tony we're both at Keller Williams we both would be happy to answer your questions and I will see you all in a couple weeks and we will have a lender on to talk about where are the rates going and you know what does it well what's the Federal Reserve having store for us coming up all right again thank you Tony thanks for joining me thank you my pleasure and thank you for watching the life of the land is in its real estate thank you thank tech Hawaii and I will see you all in a couple weeks