 Good afternoon everybody and welcome back to our lunchtime webinar express series We're kicking off the series today with award-winning marketer Abigail Dixon Abby is one of CIM's course directors runs her own award-winning marketing consultancy Labyrinth marketing and as host of the popular podcast series the whole marketer So before we get started with Abby's presentation I'll just very quickly go over the format of today's session and how you can participate in the live Q&A We'll be hearing from Abby for around 30 to 35 minutes We'll then move on to a 10 to 15 minute Q&A session to answer some of your questions For those of you registered for the webinar and viewing on the go-to webinar platform You'll be able to post your questions for the Q&A at any time during the session by clicking on the question mark You'll see on your screen If you are watching on a laptop you'll find the question mark on the right-hand side of your screen Or along the top or bottom if watching on a tablet or smartphone If you're watching us live on YouTube, you would like to take part in the Q&A's and future webinars You'll need to register for the session either via the CIM events page Or through our posts on the usual social channels and watch it via the go-to webinar app to be able to submit your questions If you would like to share your thoughts about today's webinar on the socials You can use the hashtag CIM events, which will also pop up on screen again a little later We'll also be recording the session which will be available to watch again on demand on our YouTube channel Just head into the playlist section and select webinar express If you're a university student attending today's webinar, then you may want to sign up to the CIM Marketing Club All you need to do is hover your camera over the QR code that you will take you straight through to the sign up page Alternatively, you can hop onto our website and find it within qualifications drop-down menu It'll keep you up to date with the latest trends Innovations and concepts in the marketing industry, so it really is worth taking a look and signing up So I would now like to introduce our guest speaker Abigail Dixon over to you, Addy Thank you Phil and good afternoon to everybody So welcome. Welcome to all of you. Thank you for taking the time for you That's the first thing that I will say and the second thing I will say is that this webinar Although is talking about successful and fulfilled leadership. You don't have to be in a leadership position to be a leader I believe that as marketers today whether we are leading a campaign a project an annual plan Strategy planning process or a brand or a business. We're all leading from date one The focus of today's webinar is really talking about are you a successful? But more importantly in my opinion fulfilled marketing leader So, who am I as Phil mentioned? I am podcast host of the whole Mark said I'm sure there's many of you that are already listening to that weekly Chartered marketing fellow course director, but I'm also an accredited coach And I say that because there is that overlap that happens between what we do in marketing understanding Consumers needs, but there's also the understanding about us as a human and the way in which we need to understand ourselves But also understand those marketers and our care and so you'll hear me talk about both marketing principles But also coaching principles today There was a whole host of support available out there for you in understanding more about the whole marketing concept Which I'm about to take you through. There is the book. There is the weekly podcast There is a website which is full of resources and free downloads But they're also training programs one of which is in partnership with the CIM and there's also a Facebook community So there's many different ways that we are here to support you We talk about what it means to be whole. Let's just talk about What I am seeing and the first thing that I'm seeing whether this is in businesses that I have worked in Whether this is businesses. I'm working with whether this is marketers I'm training or coaching or mentoring whether it's those that I'm interviewing as part of the podcast and the research they do Overall, there is this feeling of overwhelm. There is this feeling of overwhelm around The breadth of role that we now have in today's marketers But also the fulfillment that we get from that role And my goal is that through the concept of the whole marketer will be able to look at our fulfillment as well As being really great at what we do So what are we going to focus on looking at today? We're going to look at that holistic set of skills the technical skills It takes to really stand in our power power as marketers and think about how we set and lead that long-term commercial agenda and Really take the reins of what I believe marketing should be doing today, which is leading that commercial agenda the next is the soft skills in order to bring and Lead the people in the cross-functional business with us on that journey Not only just within our team but all of our stakeholders and other functions in that business so we can truly lead and Also working collaboratively in order to bring those plans to life because as I always say a strategy is one thing But bringing it to life as a whole different other ball game Also look at the leadership skills the leadership skills to build the type of leader We want to be but also that our marketing teams and business need us to be so that we can Motivated in power the market is in our care and stakeholders in our plans and in our journeys But we're doing so in a way that feels authentic and inspirational and reflective of who we are as a human being and The last but by no means least is the personal understanding because fulfillment for me lies in having that clarity Around where you are going your goals your values and doing something each day that plays to those We can't do something each day that plays to our valleys if we don't know what they are and for that is the area of personal understanding and For us as a marketing leader It's for us to ensure that all of the individuals in our team feel fulfilled in their roles But not just in their job in their lives as a whole because for me Work and life need to be working in harmony in order for us to be feeling motivated and fulfilled So my hope for the next 25 30 minutes is to stir the particles within you Stir the particles within you to allow you to reflect on where you are with your role as a marketer Where you are with your role as a leader and where you are with your journey and your understanding around Your soft skills your leadership skills for also you as an individual and your personal understanding before I start to Stir those particles. What do I mean by whole? I mean a market here that is complete Somebody that are only possesses those technical skills, but also is thinking about their development and their progress as their own careers holistically They are also thinking about the technical skills that are going to allow them to lead the commercial agenda But also focusing maybe on some specialist skills that allow them to do the job that they want to do and that they are currently doing That they are rounded that they have the strategic thinking as well as the tactical thinking and that they're really thinking about their careers and themselves holistically a Whole market here is one that concerns themselves with the what we need to do the how we need to do it to drive back impact To gain that alignment with the widest wider stakeholders But also that is most debated to do so because they are clear on why they are doing what they're doing And why they get out of bed every morning So in summary the technical skills the soft and leadership skills the personal Understanding the what the how and the why So let's just talk about the technical skills for a second I'm hoping through this whole market here concept that we are going to be building passionate marketers Those that are possessing the technical skills to lead the commercial and understanding and the agenda of the Organization but also to be at the forefront of the industry and that means we need to constantly evolve We need to embrace the fact that our profession is a challenging profession yet rewarding profession But it's exciting because it's one that doesn't stand still. We are constantly evolving in our understanding of consumers And how they make their decisions the ways in which we can engage with them The technology that we can enhance and our changing roles and for me Someone who is leading the commercial agenda is able to do the following things The first thing is are you able to set that long-term commercial agenda? The vision the goals where we're going the growth how we're going to get there the commercial targets Are you building that strategy having clarity around? really understanding and identifying and anticipating and satisfying the wants and your Needs of your consumers and your customers profitably that is a definition of marketing and it has not changed as I entered the profession some 22 years ago We want to move from being the support function to sales or to production or to product development or innovation or R&D To be the one that is setting the long-term agenda And in order to do that that means we are going to have to adopt new roles enhance our skills and really step change our development We are evolving but who better place the marketeers to be the change makers Who better place to embrace that change take the reins and really embrace the fact that a true marketeers role today is both part scientist that understanding about how consumers make decision and the science behind what works in behavioral science is Also part politician because not only do we have to set the agenda We also have to make sure that everybody is aligned and on the journey with us But also part artists someone who can dream the dream dream big and bring that to life using all of the tools in our toolkit or in our artist box So those technical skills are about setting that long-term vision the mission the goals those Commercial goals as well as the goals that we want in perception and experience for our consumers and our customers to be getting the benefit from The next is to be able to lead that commercial agenda And that means that we have to be able to own that profit and loss account and it starts with gaining awareness Understanding each line the impact that our marketing can have and the activities of what bring into market deliver It's about delivering Experiences in a true omni channel way not only understanding who our consumer and our customers are Understanding the steps they go through on their journey and tailoring our messages Utilizing our insight and building insight to be able to not only communicate in an omni channel way, but a true omni channel experience The next is to take ownership of the insight work closely with our insight functions But also have the skill set that means that we can not and insight but create and develop our own insight By ensuring that we're collecting all of the data and touch points that are available to us that we have a holistic view of What our consumers and customers needs are and what is happening in our marketplace, but more importantly making it actionable insight Taking what you've learned into presenting in a storytelling way back into the business That shows us not only what insight is But what you're suggesting that we do with it the what the so what and the now what That is living and breathing through the whole organization The next is to be that true voice of the consumer and customer in every meeting in every forum that we are Because we hold the insights into who they are and what they need so we can satisfy that But to also make sure that we are talking the board's language and that we are delivering effective Commercial growth that has a true ROI at the heart of it well's keeping a breath and As I said earlier our marketing profession is ever-evolving so Understanding at least whether you want to bring it into your personal practice or even into your organization What programmatic agile system one system to tribe targeting AI? marketing Anything that is new in a concept so that you at least understand and can keep abreast In order to build our soft skills We need to be able to a think about how we can build that deep rooted emotional connection with our customers and consumers And I'll talk about the skills and behaviors I see in great marketers are able to do that and Also the skills and behaviors I see and those are able to take that strategy and motivate the business to bring it to life So the soft skills to be a visionary and particularly important for those in leadership positions Those are able to dream big by able to inspire their teams in their business Around what that will look like so they can feel that vision palpably The next is to take ownership to put our hands up to be accountable To move things forward different work streams forward to really start moving that dial The next is about the way in which we work with each other and thinking about being human bringing our authentic selves to work But also using that as a way by building vulnerability and connection with our peers and with those in the cross-functional teams The next has been entrepreneurial the ability to see an opportunity But act with pace and bravery to go after it and the conviction to make it happen and the resilience In our ever-changing Challenging industry is things change the ability to move quickly Through that change curve and really had the strength to come back with us. So what are we going to do next to make it happen? The next is we're thinking about what are those skills I see in those market is that are really able to build that deep-rooted emotional connection with their consumers and Those are the ones that have the curiosity ones are trying to understand Humans what they're doing watching people on the bus stop watching people in the coffee shop Not only what they're doing, but why are they doing that and I always say you could only help others into the extent in which You know yourself. So if you don't understand your own personal Drivers motivators wants and needs it's going to make it a lot more difficult for you to connect and build empathy with those consumers and customers that you are building solutions for The next is to have an empathy not only for those in your care or those that you're working with But also though with your consumers and your customers also Empathy means thinking about what it would be like for them for your consumers in their shoes Not what it's like for you in their shoes and having that real Ability to remove your own personal as I call straw poll of one Thoughts and feelings, but actually what it is for your consumer and your customers They are two very different things and removing our biases as much as we can The next is the creativity to think about the ideas and solutions. This is not limited to just creative departments It's also about thinking about work streams product solutions ways in which we gain Experiences we build that move things along and enhance our customer experience and the last But by no means least is being the voice It's speaking up in every meeting in every forum saying is this what our consumers would want Is this what our consumers have said they need to make sure that voice is in every forum So when we talk about The technical and soft skills, I think all of us need to possess those but as do the marketeers in our care So when you are thinking about developing marketeers really do think about am I developing holistic marketeers That have those technical skills But do am I also developing marketeers that have that how that really thinking about those soft skills that empathy That curiosity to move things forward Now i'm going to talk about the leadership skills and the leadership behaviors to stand in your power Stand in your power as marketeer understand and believe in the beauty of our profession and the ambition of what we can do Motivate and support and provide clarity to the marketeers in your care and to the stakeholders in your business But also to lead a high performing motivated team on a day-to-day basis and having the right foundations in place that they can be motivated the first step of thinking about You as a leader is to define who you want to be as a leader Defining your leadership style thinking about how you want to show up daily What's that legacy that you want to leave behind? What do you want to be known for? What are those principles that you're going to bring into the culture and the way in which that you motivate and inspire the marketeers in your care? Are you building a leadership style that's actually authentic and honest about who you are? I think we often arrive over leadership positions only have any experience the leader that's come before us And whether that was a negative or a positive experience Sometimes we feel pressure to behave perhaps behave in a way that has simulated something we've experienced before Or maybe a way in which we think the business wants us to behave And the happy zone should I say is when you are building on a leadership style that is authentic to you But it's also allowing you to build a leadership style that allows you to lead in the business that you are in And really thinking about what does your team need you to be? But how can I do that in a way that feels authentic and true to you? The next is to provide them with that leadership clarity and support and empowerment So if you don't have the clarity on what the vision is for that wider business And I often find that the larger the business the harder it is to really get an understanding of what that vision and clarity is For the business as a whole but what that means for you and your team What is the role that you want marketing to play in your team? And why is that the role you want them to play in order to deliver those commercial goals for your function and for your business? The next thing to think about well, what are those goals that we need to deliver in order to make that success and make that reality? What is it we are going to do as a marketing division or team? What are those goals whether that's to increase your consumer understanding? Whether that's to be the go-to department that people come to in order to get the insights Whatever that may be to make that cultural shift having the clarity for not only your team, but also them as individuals A great way to provide clarity is to really think about What are those competencies or capability framework that I want my marketers to possess? And not just those technical skills that I mentioned at the beginning But also the how that they bring that to life and the way in which they do that through their soft skills and their leadership skills Are you building an infrastructure that allows that goal and vision for your team to come to life? But also have you got the clarity of what that means for individuals? So having built that competency and capability framework, have you built that into individuals job descriptions? Have they got the clarity on the role that they are playing and what that's commercially going to deliver to ladder up into that wider goal? Have you also thought about the development of not only your team And the skill set that they're going to need to be able to possess but also How that what that means for individuals Are you clear on what each individual within your team or within your care needs to be able to Wants to have in their role whether that's aligned to their values aligned to their person their purpose Whether that's aligned for the life that they want to live as a whole or their own career ambitions Often we make decisions For the marketer in our care on their next development step without truly Understanding what their values are and assigning work and projects towards those that allow them to feel fulfilled Without actually knowing and asking the question what they want to do next and where they want to go And it's not always a progression move. It could be to do something they enjoy more It could be something else in a different division It could be something entirely different Making sure that we're asking those questions and having that clarity on what motivates them on that deep level So you are giving them work streams that play to their values But allow them to leverage their strengths Also allow them to grow in the development areas that they want to be part of towards the goals their own career goals that are personal to them And how that all builds into building your team So a question I want to pose to you Now having described what it is that we want to know about the individuals in your care My question to you is how well do you think you know each of the marketers in your care? Are you able to help their build Personal understanding of not only your drivers and values, but what their value values drivers and goals are And by building your own personal understanding and helping them to do that We can understand what lights us all up as individuals in the team But also allow them and be partnering with them to be working towards our goals because that's where fulfillment lies The next is Are we really making sure that we are have building development in their PDPs and their plans? That it's aligned to their strengths their values, but also their personal professional goals Have we given them the clarity of expectations about where we're going and what success looks like but also what that means to them as individuals Are we building a culture in our team as a whole that really not only reflects Our personal leadership style But also the cultural shifts or changes that need to happen in order for the team to feel motivated and empowered Are we empowering the individuals in our care to take risks to be entrepreneurial to be able to act with pace? Or are we putting processes in place that are preventing that and preventing their own growth? What development work streams do we have in place? Whether that's formal training informal training book clubs External speakers inspiration talks events On the job training all the different ways that we can build development work streams to build the marketers in our care and the reason why I talk about being successful because you can give them Marketers in your care all of the technical skills They can feel empowered in their jobs But the fulfillment still won't happen if they're not doing things that get them closer to their goals and closer to their values So we really want to make sure that we are taking the time putting energy into developing not only your personal Understanding but also their personal understanding because that's where fulfillment lies We want to be able to know and own and allow them to own who they are and what they bring to this world To own that and know that that is their strength their superpower For them to have self-awareness of what they are like to be around But also for you to be able to understand how that as a collaboration happens within your team or within cross-functional teams To know what drives and motivates them To really make sure that they have the clarity on their values and purpose But also the clarity on their own soul goals, whether that's inside a work or outside of work And the support that you can give them in order to get in closer to those And it all For you As said right at the beginning of the webinar in order to build successful and fulfilled teams The fulfillment comes in that personal understanding And we can only help others in the extent in which we know ourselves And that starts with defining your own personal goals and values and self-awareness Before you can help others to find their values goals and purpose And when you know What they need To be Fulfilled then we will have motivated and empowered teams But having that clarity is only half the journey. The next is what comes up our limits and beliefs Or the limits and beliefs of those in your team if I think about the businesses and teams that I've led It's not it's not often the lack of clarity or what they need to do It's the limits and belief that comes up about doing it Something that's holding them back something that's preventing them from achieving their goal Or actually action in that that work stream. Maybe they don't think they're good at numbers. Maybe they don't think that they are Have the confidence in order to bring that to life So being able to face into those limiting beliefs together and reframe that together The next is the ability to adopt a growth mindset. So moving from I can't do that to I can't do that yet I'm really making sure that we are focused on Building our skills and knowing that what we skills we have today isn't limited to what we can learn tomorrow We also need to take daily action to move towards our goals and for the individuals in your care to also move towards their goals So they can see progress and gain that fulfillment But also know that they can ask for help and the different help that's available to them Whether that's a coach a mentor a trainer a work peer a buddy Somebody else who's got a skill or someone who's done something that they need to do and to give them advice So my question to you is are you whole? yourself Are you committed to leading whole marketers? But are you also committed to creating a wave of whole marketers because if we are Building this into the way in which we develop our marketers moving forward They'll go on to build and develop marketers holistically in the future So are you ready to take those reins? And as I mentioned at the beginning of the podcast there are many ways that you can start your journey Whether that's looking through the book and understanding the exercises and how you are performing against each of the competencies Whether that's up skilling yourself by listening to a podcast episode That is either in the technical soft skills leadership space or personal understanding Whether that's downloading resources and doing reflection exercises about where you are in your career or what your values are Whether that's joining training programs or being part of this community or others What is it that you are doing to put in place not only your personal development, but the development of others in your care Starting this year. I'm excited to say we will be rolling out a leadership program with the cim And as part of that on the 14th and 15th of september and the 15th and 16th of november We'll be running a two-day course And on that two-day course you'll be able to do just as what we've described today You'll be able to start by understanding your own personal Areas of understand understanding and awareness by looking at what your values are your purposes What you want from your marketing career and your life as a whole as it starts with you By building your increased self-awareness by understanding what drives you and your belief systems But also looking at how you can set goals and have those techniques in your armory To make sure that you are defining your goals that lead you to be both fulfilled Personally, but also know how that you can do that for your life as a whole On day two, then we look at how you define the type of leader you want to be We look at different leadership styles ones that might give you some inspiration about the type of leader that you want to be But also allows you to define what you want to be known for and how that forms your leadership principles Also allow you to not only think about those principles But practical leadership advice and how you can bring this to life So what is that clarity that you are setting for the teams and individuals in your care Around the vision for the function around the competencies that you want them to possess around the goals that you are going for Around that culture that you're looking to create But also that practical day-to-day management of developing pdps Managing creating a culture and making sure you've got that development and work streams in place I would love to remain connected with anyone that is listening here today So please don't hesitate in reaching out and connecting on LinkedIn or listening to the podcast as we mentioned earlier So please do keep in touch I'm now going to turn my camera on as we move into the q&a section of today's webinar That was great. Thank you very much Abby for that So we're now going to have a short q&a session We've already got some questions to get us underway Which I'll get to in a second, but please do continue to post your questions for Abby I selected the question mark by com and we'll try and get through as many as we can in the next 15 minutes or so And just reminder for those watching on youtube today that if you want to take part in future q&a's for our webinars for rest sessions Then you can register for the webinars and join via the go-to webinar Okay, Abby first question for you is Picking up on your points about work-life balance What are your thoughts on the quiet quitting debate that's going on at the moment? My thoughts on the the quiet quitting debate Which actually I'm glad that you said that because I listened to that very podcast this morning on the squiggly career And I think for me it's about really thinking about what you want for your life as a whole And the role that work fits within that and I think as we have come out of Pandemic the great thing that's allowed us is to prove that flexible working does exist And can exist and it's really about thinking though Not just because flexibility is an option, but what that means for you and what that how that fits as your life as a whole so I think is it quietly quitting or is it really just thinking about what work pattern or work work styles work for you as part of your life as a whole before then thinking around How that fits with your career and other elements in your life to get that balance Okay, great. Thank you Could you provide some examples of how you would approach a conversation with your team about their goals on what they think success looks like? You could run it as a workshop about what they think Overall the goals should be for the marketing function Um, but I think personal goals need to be done in an individual capacity So it's about asking them where they see themselves in the next three years the next five years Um, what their goals are that they're going to need to hit to allow them to achieve that It's also allowing them to have maybe some visualization exercises Also reflection exercises to come into that conversation to find those goals But I think what's always clear about goals is that you know, who better place in the market is to do it Get really clear on the specifics of that So if you've got a certain goal to be a leader What kind of leader in what kind of organization? In what kind of organization the values that they have and what do you want to be able to do and what does that role look like? So you're getting really clear on the specifics and then you can bring that to life visually Okay, thank you. Um and continue with the theme of goals. Uh, the question here is can you expand on soul goals? Yes So soul goals are It is a lovely phrase and soul goals are goals that you feel emotionally connected to Um and emotionally connected and the reason I'm going to touch my chest here is because that's where your soulless plexus lives Where your identity lives within your body? Whether you believe that or not And your soul goals are goals that you have either inside of work or outside of work That not only play to your values, but you feel emotionally connected to So for example, if you've got a passion point supporting and empowering like I do individuals and marketeers and you are Combining that with an activity that you are doing because of that emotional connection. It becomes a soul goal. So I hope that helps Okay, um this next question It's a plea from the heart. I think how do we combat the feeling of being overwhelmed that comes with all of this? The list of things that we all need to do is seemingly endless Okay, so The list is seemingly endless. I think first of all clarity and then prioritize So people will say well, I don't know anything about agile marketing I don't know anything about system one and system two thinking do you need to Is the first thing In your line of work Do you need to understand in the business that you work in in the challenge that you have in front of you? Do you need to understand those things? um So first of all prioritize the development in the areas of the gaps that you personally have That the business has or the challenge that you have within your business. That's the first thing The second thing is getting really clear on what you want and what you want to the legacy you want to leave behind And then focusing on the two or three things that really can allow you to do that. So whether that is It's about setting that strategy in the clarity that's never been there before in the business Whether that is about Looking at the culture within your team and really making it more of a motivating empowering versus where everybody is Whether that is around really changing the way in which you interact with your customers and consume By looking at your consumer experience, you know, it's just choosing those three things that are really important I'm prioritizing your time against those The time that's left Is that time for you to reflect time for you to look off to the market is in your care Before you accepting other meetings and other work streams into your life because they're the things that you want to be known for They're the things that you think will have the greatest impact And by you having that clarity you can share that clarity with other people in your team So they know that what you are going to be hanging your hat on and what you're motivated towards helping with Okay, great. Um This isn't so much a question Abby as a as a comment, which you might want to respond to so All good, all good, but the staff need to earn the right to have that, you know to to earn their development It's not a one-way responsibility They completely do and so 100 agree I talk about taking the reins For that individual's career not waiting for the role to come to you not waiting for the development Training course for you to be put on but for you to have personal clarity About what it is that you want from your career and to go out and find that so 100 percent um The role about leaders doing that though is to give you to understand what it is that you do want to be working for So they could be thinking about work streams projects, etc That they can help and support you put you on you're also potentially going to go and present that training course that you want to be on You're also going to potentially be asking for time to go and do a course or go to attend a Webinar or a talk whatever that may be to help develop your Learning or go and spend time with somebody else in your business or outside of your business that might be able to teach you a skill that you don't know informally and For me the the magic happens when it comes both ways when the individual has the clarity on what they want And the the line manager or leader has the clarity on what they want for the team But also what the individual wants and the two meet in the middle Okay, thank you. So um Next question. What is the first thing a leader should do when taking over team in a new organization? Oh, good question I think spend time with each of the individuals in your care and get a real good understanding of what they see To be the challenges what they see to be the current role of marketing what they would like it to be their aspirations And their frustrations are getting a really holistic view about what is currently happening What they want to do to improve and where they want to go Taking that collective thought and then you taking the time out to think okay So what can I help solve? But also where do I want to get them to? And I think you taking their collective thoughts before defining the vision of what you want for a team Means that when you come back and present that in that visionary inspirational way Everybody that's in your care is going to be like. Yes. Thank you. So it's with you for you That's always my first um a top tip that anyone starting a new job is get that new notebook And jot down in that notebook all of the observations that you see in that first 30 60 90 days When you're fresh when you just come into that organization Whether that's this process takes really long or people don't seem very motivated here Or there seems to be a lot of time spent on this Jotting it all down while you're fresh before you come ingrained into the business Means that there's always a notebook for you refer back to but also a collective Analysis that you're gathering from your time there for you to decide which of those you want to tackle first Great. Thank you. Abby. Um We are running out of time, but I've probably got time for just a couple more questions Um, this is a challenge of a different sort. Abby My organization is at the start of a change program that will result in a reduction of approximately 25% across the whole organization How can I ensure marketing and comms resource is valued and retained? How can I ensure the team remains supported motivated and committed during this time? Okay, so the first thing is around if I just ask the first bit first around How do I hang on to my marketing comms budget? Is a route making sure that all of you will spend a scene as an investment and that you are demonstrating that you are measuring it Spending the money as your own and calculating return on investment So that the business can quietly see that you understand the commercial challenge ahead But you are using the money to invest and to grow and move things forward I think the second one in supporting and motivating is about having honest conversations If people see headcount reduction, but they don't understand why In this case, I'm assuming it's it could be around Because of the lack of consumer spending or reduction in market conditions or profit Whatever that may be having that real clarity around why that is happening can often really Allow people to see that it's not necessarily a personal but a business decision That doesn't make it any easier In remaining motivation, but it is about almost making sure that you're making the time to have that honest conversation regroup on and reflect on how everyone is feeling And how they want to do and what they want to do to move forward. So I think pretending it's not happening not sharing why it's happening And not allowing that time to air how it's making individuals fear air how it's making the team feel I think is often what people shy away from because they're awkward conversations But actually by doing that allows it to be aired and for you to start dealing with some of the things that they are faced with Okay, great. Thank you. Um final question then for today Any tips? One more on that Bill prioritization as well I was just gonna say I think one more thing is prioritization because if you have had a headcount reduction We can do anything as market is but we can't do everything So it's about going back to the business and being really clear That if you've given me a 20% headcount reduction, there's going to be 20% less of Of activation or whatever that may be coming out of the team And therefore we're going to need to reprioritize and reset our commercial goals. Sorry, Phil That's okay. That's a fair comment. Um, okay final question Any tips for convincing the rest of the company and raising the profile that marketing should be leading strategy Rather than just a support function. Not everyone in the exact team Understands the true value of marketing. This is a whole chest like this one Okay, so two two key things that you have Well, one key thing that you have as marketeers is the voice of the customer So making sure that you're at least part of the process if you're not yet leading the process by bringing that insight Into the business and anything else that you can bring learnings continuous improvement the effectiveness of your spend Your understanding of the marketplace the customer base your target audience all of that So they're not building a strategy in isolation. First thing The second thing is the commercial acumen If you want to be able to write the strategy You need to prove as a marketing function that you are building a strategy that's going to love deliver that net profit That trading contribution that EBITDA and stop talking And i'm not saying that you are but you know in marketing as we do have our own language We're talking market share. We're talking penetration. We're talking football Really if we can convert what that means to trading contribution and we can see the impact of our actions It means that we're more likely to talk the language and be welcomed into the room before we take the reins Okay, brilliant. Thank you very much. Abby. That's great. Some really good questions and some great answers there. Unfortunately, we haven't time to Ask all the questions that have been posted. But um, hopefully you've you've gained a lot of excellent information from that Q&A session Um, Abby, somebody's just asked to remind them what your LinkedIn profile is, please It's Abigail Dixon you'll find me on that. Yeah, just search for Abigail Dixon Fantastic. Okay. Um, just to remind her that today's session has been recorded and it will be Uploaded to the CIM youtube channel We're not able to provide you with a handout. Lots of people have asked if they could have a handout on the slides for today But that's not possible But abby has already said there's lots and lots of resources related to the whole market that you'll be able to find if you If you google um, you'll stumble across her podcast, etc So please feel free to connect with abby and to take a look at what other resources are available Okay, so um, unfortunately, that's all the time we've got for our Q&A for today's webinar I'd just like to say a thank you once again to Abby Dixon for our fantastic presentation And to the CIM east of england group for organizing the webinar We do hope that you've enjoyed the session and found it interesting and worthwhile We'll be back with our next webinar express on tuesday the 20th september I'll use your time of 1 p.m. With our guest speaker Mike Lander You'll find further details listed on the events page of our website Where you'll be able to register for the session And this is the best way if you want to get involved in the Q&As and submit questions So if you've been watching us live via our youtube channel Remember to register for the session on the CIM website and watch us via the go-to webinar app by clicking on the link in your reminder email So that just leaves me to say a final thank you to everyone for joining us today And we hope that you enjoyed the webinar. Take care everyone and we look forward to seeing you again soon