 Yeah, so it's fine, it's all right, it's okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, David's on his way back now. Yeah. So. So. Hi, Andrea. So that'll give you a bit of fun. You wait to eye with us. We need to go up a little higher. Down trap, you know what we are? Cool. OK. Sounds good. Sounds good. Right. I just need to plug it in here. Oh, it's there already. It's in about five minutes. OK, plug it in here. Cool. Yeah, that's much better than this. Sounds good. Sounds good. And this is actually, this is like a 3,000 euro. Great sound. Gotcha. We're good. OK, do they want to do the presentation there? Can I ask them to move it or not? Yes, please. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Congratulations. Thank you. Bring your legs up. Thank you. Thank you very much. Always. Thanks. Yeah. Thank you very much. Good morning everybody. Good morning. A very warm welcome from the German acetatech. My name is Brigitte Detier. I'm a very heavy job to rebuild it. First of all I would like to thank the acetatech of Norway, the international acetatech and the sand festival for hosting us, not only this morning, also for the whole week. It's a great pleasure to be here. And we had wonderful discussion, for example, yesterday in the EC encounter about, not about walls, about devils, but I think perhaps it's very near close to each other these themes. Secondly I want to thank my colleagues that will run this panel with me, the members of the board of the German acetatech. Julia will introduce them. The members of theater Strahl in Berlin, because they will make the last director seminar. It's an upcoming venue from the German acetatech every two years. We have an international director seminar in different cities in Germany, where we invite around 30 young directors over the whole world. The message is going to all the acetatech centers over the whole world and they could send one person to enjoy one week and they work with the topic. And the last topic was in June this year and the topic was walls. And we want to discuss with you about this theme because now we have 30 years ago the Berlin Wall is falling and that makes a lot of with us for the society, not only in our country. As you know it's a theme all over the world and we have so much walls now in our society in different countries, new building walls, and so we want to discuss with you what are the walls in our work. And I'd like to say also very much thank you to my really near friend Schell Moeber from Norway, from the company NIE. We've made a performance together, it's shown in the World Congress in Malmö in Copenhagen, Berlin 1961, the play about the wall and he will join us through the panel. And we will build three groups, but now I give to Julia, also a member of the board, she will introduce all the people and then she will say something about the three groups. Okay, thank you. Hi, good morning. Can I sit or should I stand? Okay, I can stand. No for the country, it's a mistake here. Yeah, yeah. Okay, so I'm very welcome also from my side, I'm very happy that we all can be here. And I will just do a short introduction as Gitti just said of the people we brought. So I would start by sight next to me is Stefan Fischerfeld from the German board and the EC, he will be one of the groups. Then it's our pleasure that one of the authors of the play that the people that came to the last director seminar, they could watch a show in Berlin called Berlin Berlin and the show was produced by Théâtre Strahl and it was written by four authors from different generations and from East and West Germany. And so here's Zina, one of the authors, I'm very happy that you're here. And also there is Karen, who's the co-artist of director of Théâtre Strahl. And who do I see as my care from German Azite as well is here to be part of one group. Shell, we already heard, he's famous. He did lots of work. One of the shows he did at the YET about the building of the German wall and they showed it in the World Congress and in the same year he achieved, he received the artistic award for artistic excellence from the Azite. So we're so happy you're here with us to help us discuss. And who do I see out? There's Jutta from Cologne. She's also a board member and she will be part of one of the discussing groups and she's also very involved, as Gützi said, in the director's seminar. And there's one more German lady I would like to say from the German board, it's Rebecca. She will also be here. She's from Bremen, she's very nice. She's from Bremen, but she's very nice. But she's very nice. That's not why I said that. So, what's going to happen? Actually we would like the workshop, we figured it's misleading because we're not actually working or moving or doing real exercises but it's more about the discussion. And so we would like to have you in three groups or invite you to three different groups on three different themes. That might be interesting, hopefully, for all of you to discuss and question. So the first group is about staging history. Do we make art to create memories? So this group will be done by Jutta and Kevin and Maike. And they would like to discuss how real historical events or even fictionalized ones come on stage and how they might influence our collective identities, our collective memories. So this is the first group we would like you to invite to. If you would like to have another theme, you can offer us something else. So for example, the second group, they have chosen the title Historical Events on Stage. Whose voices are heard, whose truth is told. It's more about who is making, who is creating our collective memory, who is actually represented, who is taking part in these processes, who decides which stories are told on stage. And Stefan is one person who is very interested in this theme. So he will be on this group as well as Lina, who is the author. So yeah, you too. So that's the second group. And then we have the third one that has the title Politics, Cultural Policies and Artistic Oppositions. What is our responsibility as artists? So this group is about to discuss more like offstage what are the walls, the barriers that we are facing in our society, in other institutions, and what can we do, what do we have to do, what's our attitude towards these barriers and walls we find around us. Is that not clear? Okay, perfect. So who is doing the group? Oh! Well, I thought you might have figured out who's left. And so, this is Giti, Shiel and myself doing this group. Very sorry. Maybe, did we already say who is going where? I only could mention that the third group is staying here because if you decide to go in this group, we have the live camera for the live stream for the website. Here in this room, who is not willing to be on the live stream, not could share in this group. That is the only thing that's clear. But I don't know where are the other groups. Okay. In the corner, there's a small spot. Okay. And Stefan and Dina are right outside the door so that you don't have too much noise in your mouth. Okay. So I will just say again, we have the first group that is discussing do we create art to, no, do we make art to create memories about these different ways of creating identities and memories. This is group one that will go here. Then we have the second group with Stefan about who is representing whose stories are being told that will go outside. And then we have the third group about politics and our responsibilities that will stay here. So take two, three minutes. Second. Second. Second. Second. Second. Second. First. Third. Second. First. Fourth. First. Second. First. First. in this direction more than this time. But it's better than seeing that it's going to be possible so we can run around. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, then now. OK. Let's do this. Come over to the circle. OK. Yes, where my backpack is. Yeah. OK. It's a little bit less. OK. OK. OK. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. OK. Yeah. So maybe if we could make it a tiny bit like most people could just come a lot closer because the air is also still visible. It's not all that. No, it's not all that. It's been holding here, sir. Now! No! No, I mean. No. Yeah. Yeah. You managed the whole thing. Well put just pass it. Put just a like it, ehhh! Yeah! So, that is a little bit strange, there, I say. The post-its you have. I have a post-its. So, a second warm welcome. And perhaps before we start, you make a short introduction round so that we know with whom we're talking. So, please, say your name, say your profession and say your country. Will you be... Yes, my name is Ingrid and I work for the book coming out with the work for children and young people in Sweden. My name is Borger. I work for the Anorak Theatre in Belgium as a school medium. My name is Rania and I'm the secretary of the street and I'm from Serbia. I'm from Serbia. I'm vice-president of the vice-president of Serbia. I'm employed in one of the visual theatre for children and I'm a player. I'm Susanna. I'm from Munich, Germany. I'm modern classical theatre person. I do the photography work and the PR. My name is Nila. I come from the Kinderfestival in Hamburg, Germany, which is an international theatre and music festival. Yeah, hi, what's more? I'm Julia. I'm the director and the dramaturg in Germany and I'm on the German acetate board. And I'm Brigitte, as I already said, but I've not said that I'm running a company in Stuttgart that is used as a Stuttgart called Yes and also make every two-year international festival called Schöne Aussicht Breitbühel, the next in June, 2020. Welcome. So, I'm Sheld. I'm a theatre maker. I'm the artistic director of NIE. As you heard before, beside that I also work with a Norwegian performing arts network. Is that right in English? It's kind of. And I also work with a project called Kluden, which is going to be a national venue for young audiences in Oslo, where I'm at the moment also artistically. I'm Diana. I'm president of Aceter Södvija and I'm kind of there, the program there also is Aceter Södvija. I'm basically an actress and I'm a pedagog. And this is it from Södvija. Yeah, I'm Lauders. I'm a manager of a theatre for young Europeans. And I'm a playwright and director as well. Hi, I'm Jamie. I'm an actor and playwright from Adelaide, Australia. Yes, I'm Rebecca. I'm running a theatre in Bremen, young theatre Bremen. And I'm a drama tourer and also a member of the Board of Artists Germany. Hi, I'm Nicholas from Belgium, Brussels. I'm not running a theatre. But at least I'm a director and an actor and a cinematographer. And I'm part of a collective. There's more, but that's enough. I'm not either running a theatre. I'm currently in a blister. But I'm from the same north and all the way. And I'm also a drama tourer. I'm teaching people to be teachers. I'm Ellen. I'm from Södvija, a network for conforming arts and the show box festival. And I also work with PR and communications. Okay, thank you very much. Yeah, I asked a big question. I asked a big question. Yeah, as I said before, this group is more about taking it off stage and asking which walls are we confronted with in our artistic works when it comes to other institutions or gatekeepers or changes in society. And this means we would like to discuss not only or not at all, maybe continent of forms on stage, but rather like what is our position, our attitude, our responsibility towards actual conflict or changes in our society and our governance, whatever. What are you dealing with right now? And to find out, we would like just, we will hand out some posters. Yes. I would like just to note you one comment or statement or question that you would like to discuss in this group concerning this question. Okay, so far. You can put a question, you can put a statement. You can also fill up two post-its and two sentences if you have more than one statement. And after that, we will put it on wall. And then we could all read it. And then we asked to make a sign which topic you want to discuss so that we have a democratic process that we could discuss two or three topics with the most signs. Do you have also the how to make the sign? Oh, this one, yeah. I mean, there's three possibilities. The German way is across. You can also make like this or you can make this one. It's just a joke. We need a long time to this morning. Don't bother us or not. Now just start writing your comments. And then we would go on. Anyone else on the panel? Sorry? Yeah, repeat it again. Yeah, the question is like what do you feel is our responsibility or attitude towards actual barriers in our society or the institutions around us? What do we feel like are barriers we always hit or which words do we need to overcome or what is our responsibility towards changes in our society and how can we take action even offstage? Metaphorically, are there new walls coming up in the society? Are there new obstacles? Yeah, how can we? Or also the question what could be, how great it could be with our art not to support systems or how far we go to sell our art to be in the system. All these questions are possible. Yeah, yeah. The question is valuable. Yeah, it could be like a short statement first. One word, like you think this is something and then we'll see what we can make out of it. We don't have to put the solution or an answer. Where is the wall? It's here. It's a colored wall. Very nice. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And we'll need more paper. We have a lot of paper. We have to pay a shell in Euro and then you get it. Yeah, perhaps. Oh, yes, of course. It's good. It's so good for streaming. I asked the people last year if they had a question or comment. Oh, very nice. So far. Nobody. I'll look up. Yeah. Are we finished or? No stress. No stress. I understand. You are very famous. Oh God. Very nice. You have to go through the next one. At the end, you will be a member of German acidity. Yeah, I'll get the German acidity. We? No. So thank you. We are for showing you. So we get an invention from us. No, actually, I wouldn't say it now. Did everybody post something? I still see some posts over there. Yeah, I can check. I can check it. I feel like this is on the wall. Maybe somebody has worked on this. Yeah, you can put up as many as you want. But then we now have to make space there, that everybody is going around and read them. And put a sign. If it is he or she. They try. Maybe we manage three, we will see. Yeah, so you have three crosses. You can mark on three posts that you like the most. You would like to count. Sorry about the counting. No, this is just a preparation. After we finish counting, it's all good. Yeah, democracy. Democracy is very important. It's a long process. Yeah, absolutely. We make more, we make more. Oh, yeah. Oh. They know democracy. You can see it. It's a green. Green? I thought you were from Greece, that you knew everything about democracy. No, she's from Switzerland. They don't know so much about Switzerland. Neutral space. Yeah, yeah. So you would make three crosses, or three marks, but try not to make it on your own. That would be a perfect process. Yeah. It's not like a campaign. Oh, yeah. We can go through once. Yeah. And go back and make crossings. So let's check it on your own. You can do it. Invising here. Or you can do it. Or you can make crossings if you like it. Yeah. A cross isn't seen. Yeah. We can only have she cross. We can organise it. In the German aspect. We can go in the line like this, and down this way. We can read it a little bit slower. Yeah. Come to play. The Haitian. Is that worth you? Could someone read it out now? No, I think it's better with his short process. Yeah, we have time. I mean, this is a part of the... Sorry. Don't take too long. Don't take too long. It's so much closer now. And we... Yeah. We can read it quickly. Yeah. We're not going to publish a PhD at the end. Yeah. It's not a Eurovision. No, it's not a Eurovision. Maybe you. Let's start. Are we serious? Yeah. That's good. It's good, it's good. I'm coming. It's my second... I've heard people talk about it. Twice. People talk about it. Oh. Yeah. Yeah. We call you in the air. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's good. It's good. Good. Yeah. So. of course, that right here is from the bottom. Yeah. Yeah. No, the third people don't know. No, but they think, like, yeah. Here's the line. Oh, I won't. This is very important. Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you. Thank you. Sorry, I forgot. We need the phone. Do you know all the way down this train? Yeah. Yeah. First time in no way? Yeah. First time here? Yeah. Yeah, she's been a lot of times, but it's my first. Yeah. Yeah, I love it here. And this is the end of the weekend summer, right? Which is the start of autumn. Yeah. This is the middle of our winter, you know? It's so lovely. Okay. Yeah, it gets so hot in Australia. I hate it so much. It's just the heat in Australia is lovely. But, you know, I wish I had a strong weather that would go here. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, avoid summer. So avoid, like, January. And the skin. Yeah. Well, if you wear sunblock, it's not so bad. But yeah, just watch out. Yeah, sunbelt anywhere again. But yeah, there's 24 hours on the plane. Two more minutes. Yeah. Oh, my Christ. Yeah. So this was meant to be a short trip. Yeah. Not long. A year or so. Yeah. It's very lovely. Yeah. We are very lucky with the landscape that we are in there. It's really beautiful. But yeah, there are, as with anywhere, there's lots of problems. Which is South Australia. So, you know, the ones that are Sydney and Melbourne, which are the east of the States. Yes. South Australia is kind of, they make fun of us as being, like, the little backwater. I mean, the small town. It depends on those two. But I think it's nice. I know. Are you coming during the year? It's a long one. You know. We'd love to be. Yeah. We just launched our own theater company. Yeah. Yeah. Are you coming? Yeah. Are you coming? Yeah. Which? What? You've got the macro. Yeah. Yeah. I'm leaving. Wait for me. I'm leaving. I'm leaving. Oh, would you... I've got this far, far away. I've got to go back to G. Oh, really? Yeah. Yeah. Wait for me. Yeah, I'm going to go back to G. All right, wait, wait, wait. We just want to be more business. Other shops. I can't wait. Yeah, yeah. Most of the people in Australia. Yeah, yeah. They're all made. Yeah. Yeah. They're all made. Okay, 30 seconds. Okay. Four, four, four. Sit down and wait. There's an election. It's bloody. We have the topic with line. You started, yeah. We have three topics. The winner is R. The winner is R. Yeah, I have to know. We have one topic with nine points. It's a little bit like your recent song contest. Nine points. Nine people want to talk about compromise. How far are you ready to go in general politics? Okay. So this is the one. Do we start? Yeah, but we read the topic with eight points from Lithuania. Is the theater in danger of becoming an echo chamber? That is with eight points. And then we have five asking the question, what is our place as artists in the face of an increasingly hostile government or society? Does our work matter? That's a bit the same as this one. Yeah, this is why I picked it because I felt like the question is very similar to both of the others actually. Okay. But perhaps, I don't know if it's a good idea, but who is writing that? And perhaps the person will explain it a little bit more what are the thoughts behind that? I knew it. I was thinking about, you know, this is live streaming, so I have to be very cautious. But not. That's the point. The point is how far we are open to say exactly what we feel like and if it is concerned, obviously it's everywhere in the world. The same thing doesn't matter the circumstances that we are working in. But it was thought that Milena and me have changed. It's always interesting in these kinds of gatherings when we find out that all of our colleagues all around the world doesn't matter the circumstances, the political way of the government and all these things are. We are having the wall of having administration in every sense of the world, not only a political one, but the general cultural policy, the way how the administration is working and all these things. So we are most of us here and everywhere when we gather we are facing the same problems but the circumstances are completely different in all of the world. So we are dealing always with the problem how far we are conscious of the problems. We may be perhaps in our circumstances know how to fight, but then you always come to the world where you have to cross across the wall and face with something that you won't be as a person of integrity as an artist. You don't want to cross it, you know, like a barrier of the politics or cultural politics or general politics or right or left to wing or whatever it is. So that's the question. How far we are capable and willing as an integrity and artistic integrity to go further on because of the common wellness which we are automatically, we want to do if we are working and dealing with the TIA. I mean, this is a responsibility as well. Whenever we go to TIA I'm feeling like we have to work for some better goal not only artistic our personal artistic way. That's the question. If you are in Germany or Serbia there is a moment when you have to cross something that you want as a personal artist or even if you are only thinking in your way as a personal one, are you willing to go further beside how we are going to make a compromise? Are you willing to do it? What is the cost? Do you measure the cost? How do you balance in between? That's the question. Maybe I understand it in this way. I would love to see how you who have put this understand the question because this is also giving us the answer. I think this is the way. I understand it a little bit in another way. Yes. I understand it in that way. That is also a question. If we feel the responsibility for our society are we also able to overtook political positions? Is it a question to finish some day with the theater and go to the education ministry or to the cultural policy? That is a little bit what I think when I read it. This is also a way to think about it. This is a very big spectrum of it. It would be nice because this is how you understand it the way it shows how in our national, in our lives, in our countries we understand this question. That's the way how we can get the answer. Very good. May I ask you, when you say are we able to take one of the positions in the politics, is it a good thing for you? Sometimes when I really and that also depends a little bit or has a connection to the chamber, sometimes we had also the feeling we talk now for one hour and we have the same ambitious and we have the same wishes to change things, but how could we reach the people who think in another way? And then I said, perhaps why not? It's not as bad as all. I think as an artist, I think it was Kostovsky that said this, you have to be very good at changing between the silk shirt and the armory. So the quick changes because you have to be sensitive to the blood around you and you also have to put on armory to fight. And for me, Teter is the best weaver to work against compromise at the moment. But I don't know if the society continues to change as far as it's changing now in maybe two years, it's maybe not the age. Maybe something different. Maybe it's graffiti. But I think what's also very interesting in that point is are we aware of our own work and how far we go to protect, not to protect, to support systems to be able to make our art. So that means how easy we make, yeah. It's also an important thing because I understood the question as how far would you like to go not only in an artistic way but also in a human way to do the thing that you want to say on scene but sometimes the scene is not the good instrument or something to say what you want to say. So like for example, we did one's play that we played inside and the Tribune, the audience, the chairs were on the street and everyone could go on it, everyone that passed by. And we asked, we said in the end, one week before the premiere, we said, okay, we will not play it. We will ask the natives to give them stage to say what they want to say. The Muslim neighbor, she was angry for stuff in the street. So we gave her the platform. But then the theater that gave us the money were quite angry because we didn't do our job. We didn't play. And she said, I pay you for playing and you didn't play. But you made a theatrical event. Yeah, exactly. But that was already a bridge too far. So that encouraged us to do this more in fact to say, okay, but if this is not possible then how can we watch people and how can we say something to them? So yeah, it's also a thing of the boundaries made by the bureaucracy because that money should go to acting people and that money should go to street workers or something. But yeah, if you mix it up. Any other thoughts? I have a question from... Oh, sorry. I understand the question like this. Is the traditional theater building a wall itself? Yeah, because it's mostly white middle class people with money enough that goes to the theater. Unless you do something else. Unless you go on the street and get a microphone. Yeah, and it's also close to the echo chamber. It's very close to the echo chamber. We're the same people, two the same people and dealing with our interests. Yeah, it is very much the architecture of the building and in fact it's quite some problems. There are literally a lot of doors in between the street and the actor person. And I think it's also the image of art. The image of art that people think that is not for me. Also if you are in a new building or not in a building with three doors to go and you have only one door it's really, really hard work to have the image it's open for all. And that is the image of art. That is something that I'm intellectual enough. Do I understand? And to be honest we also make often art and like it also. If it's not so easy readable is it a little bit risky? Or perhaps also with less stuff and the fantasy grow and blah, blah, blah. So we have our own language that is sometimes not open for everybody to be honest. Can you also? If someone else wants to say something I find it scary and interesting that in the times of growing populism and growing polarization things that actually was a very positive thing in the 70s or 80s a new theater building in town is now a symbol of them and us. Because I don't know how you say in Germany but in Czech Republic for example we say it's the people that go to the pub and it's the people that go to the cafe. It's the intellectual, it's the elite against the people. So this gap is growing and then the building also represents that gap. And then so if you, I mean I don't know if you sometimes read threads in discussion forums but that's like, at least in this country now it's like burn all the buildings, throw the people out on the street there shouldn't be anything to it anymore because you should give the money back to the people. There's a trick also because this is a trick when the artist want to be separate like artist, this is art I'm doing something very special with you and then this is how it started all these differences in between the ordinary audience and the art history. On the other side these people, on the other side the artists are in a way and I wouldn't say guilty but it is on us to work on it to self-defense the art history but not to make the wall. That's the point. On the other side it's you know so many things are going on in a way that I understood what you said I think what we can do about in a way when you have the money from somebody to do something like play or like calls from the funders from the funds, it's always like giving you one chapter, one topic so it's really, you have to be very clever how to write the application to fill out the question but to work your art. That means that it is now at these days the artist has to be really tripled in one. Not only artists, it's really heavy so it is really like what else I have to do to make the thing which I am for that I would like to work toward somebody who don't want to go into the walls of the building. It is really huge task and we have to work a lot. So being here as a artist from parts of the world not all over the world but from different parts of the world do you have any thoughts or do you have any experiences or ideas how to meet with this so how to contradict or as you are saying we always have these expectations towards us or we have to deal with all these political ideas what theater should be about have you found a way to not to compromise or to contradict or do you have any ideas what we could do also as international organization to make change happening in this regard. I think it's style is quite local and also I think that we should use the same weapons as the populace like popular theater I really like it but it's a kind of taste also I think like Carnival and like more parties or something that are happening, things that are really happening here and now is not knowing that they are audience or something that something is happening like something is going is passing through there is a building that now is a television studio a new television studio or a new company or whatever once we made a new a tourist office an abundant building and in Molenbeek I don't know, it's famous for the terrorists I love Molenbeek and we made a tourist office and we said okay well there's a brand new tourist office which was a bit and people really came into book trips or to have a deal with us to make an airplane full to Egypt or something and then we said okay but yeah you cannot go to Egypt but you can travel to the future or to the moon you can do a safari but yeah it's inside and the animals are close to my human mind so really then we reached not an audience maybe or not the expected audience also was in newspaper but also the neighborhood and the people that were passing by so I think it's quite often a challenge of using the popular or the known signs or the known keys or something to to go because people actually quite often go to theater without knowing like Karnabal or like shows or yeah because I I'm dreaming to do once the opening ceremony of the Eurovision Song Contest because you reached so many people but they never do something cool okay yeah I think also one way might be to have more real representation so why not invite your local music to the theater and have a dialogue with him on stage or have a dialogue with him or make it into a space where you also really talk with people you don't agree with and see what happens of course you have to have mediators and we've been doing this a little bit in Norway now in the local center but it's a public dialogue that's made like one to one dialogue so there's a newspaper that made you you write your opinions and then they will make you with someone who's got the opposite of you okay yeah yeah because I wrote the thing about the echo chamber and I really feel it strongly over the last days I mean not if you play for young audiences and play for your audiences you get all the responses then someone will scream around if someone is kissing and it will I mean you have everything but in the public square I find this more and more difficult and how could we break that wall back into society so is it our problem or is it the society's problem it's our problem I know how long five more minutes oh my goodness yeah echo chamber but what I really believe in is making theater with the youngsters so because you could really see so in our theater we have a lot of speak loops we call that and workshops for youngsters and they make productions five, six groups and some of them are really growing up in theater they are in the fourth or fifth year and I don't know if that's naive but I really believe if they get in touch with art and then they will not be a right wing populist I'm sure because it's a little bit something like what my opinion is that they often people have that opinion if they have the feeling nobody is counting on me or nobody sees me and I think if you going through theater then you learn how to get opinions you have a behavior and that is one I go for and that's a reason why we work in this field that I really believe that making art make a better world not I don't know how far we come if they only watch our shows I think much more farer than they practice by themselves that I believe this morning we talked with a man that made 30 years or something a theater in Hungary and now he was very disappointed that the voters were once his audience and now so he didn't achieve to plant the seeds yeah but people change and the times change you remember 30 years ago Urban was in the movement he was standing there when they were breaking down the wall into Austria and today he's been building a new wall the same person yeah something that occurs to me is that perhaps theater itself isn't quite the right form anymore in the sense that perhaps something that we could be doing is to take all of the actual techniques that we work with and applying them to things like online video and social media there's been a huge shift in the way that particularly young people consume culture and in my country the subscriber rate for the main theater companies is going down and down partly because the old ones keep dying off and many people don't the young audiences aren't really coming in as much yes of course we all love theater we all wanted to continue but particularly to break through this echo chamber effect there's a lot of people on YouTube for example who make these incredibly polished, incredibly stylish theatrical videos usually debunking some right wing talking points or addressing some topics that people don't really if you see in the theater it's very much diluted and put into this form that's not quite as potent whereas these people tend to cut straight to the heart of the issue and actually have a dialogue and if that's what we're trying to do by breaking down echo chambers perhaps it's more about using all of the style and all of the stuff that we love but seeking out different ways to deliver these messages trying to get people in from a different route and then get them back to the theater yeah because that has to be to me yeah I think I think personally that this could be a way to do PR but for me theater is really the most optimistic thing in the world because we are people together in a room and there's someone on stage but you're also part of what's going on on stage and I'm here with Gitti and I'm here with Dana and as I can look to her as I look at the performance it's really a collective thing which happens there and then and which I find very very optimistic because it's working really against looking into you for and it's breaking down but not everybody has is lucky enough to live nearby I know I was grown up on the countryside I was grown up with movies and there's no possibility around the theater where it's coming in your landscape okay now I live in a city child and youngster TV I just did a project with teenagers here in the festival the team project the other days and one of the ambassadors in the project she grew up on a farm in the mountains and she's never been to the theater and then she moved to the city last year but she always wanted to be in the theater so now she's died into it I mean you can long for it but I think that this thing because I'm doing a performance festival for young girls in Germany since 10 years ago and the most important task for us was to find people young people who don't usually go to the theater I thought well you separate them from the ones who go to the theater again if you only take these youngsters so we really try to mix them up but I think that's a problem in general no matter if you have a theater where people can go to or you go out and do projects with youngsters you always have to try to mix people and make people meet that usually don't meet I really spend a lot of time in building bridges to different people and then you are in some sort of institutional social workers to institutions like well you can use schools for that but you can also find a way where they meet outside of school so I went to places where people even in parts of I can only talk about Hamburg in that way where maybe theater is far away but the young people meet in there free time I went to big pop projects I went to different sports clubs where they meet to everywhere basically and I was really running around with my players and my little movie that I showed to them and we're talking to them and still I have the impression that I only reached the ones that I meet I mean I'm only one person who is doing that I can't be everywhere in Hamburg but I'm going everywhere in the moment where they have to apply and play for our festival I really run from part of the city to another part of the city and try to meet people and talk to them as audience members or they play get the stage they get an artist that helps them build a performance of only 15 minutes but we have different groups whatever is important to them very few minutes I think it's over any more perhaps it's something that is so much just it's correct I want to make a small point here we talked about echo changers that people same people talking about the same things agreeing about the same things are saying in this book we see it on Facebook everybody are there in an echo chamber agreeing on what they I think this is in the theater but as soon as we do an outreach into first of all our audience or others I think as soon as we do that then the echo chamber goes down because for example young people they are not in an echo chamber so they say what they think they say what they want so if we just do that listen then I think we will get out of our echo chamber you had a revolution with making a lot of theater with youngsters in Iceland and that means you also had a lot of youngsters coming to the theater we do it on our theater we do it with young people and they are acting in our productions so we get a lot of feedback for example using other medias we use another medias in our production because they want it so we use stop chat whatever and that's the thing you just go with the flow the flow of what's going on modern times modern times new times for new generation new challenge for all of us I was just wondering is there any like you said like you made the suggestion of changing the media and also from what you said before I had the thought with that because you said we should use popular things that people actually like that was giving me the idea that actually this because we talk about it's so complicated and it's so hard to do and people don't like change so that maybe when we do more things that are actually people want to do it doesn't feel so hard to come to the theater to change your attitudes because you do something that you actually like and then you start discussing it and then you start rethinking it that if we want to make things change that they come from a positive energy and not from okay this is all not working and so we have to work hard and we have to do lots of things we don't want to but like look for the fun side of it party and the party but also because that is now positive to say we use the things what youngsters use in their life to make it as a party but on the other side for me also is you have to do what you have to do because on the other side we have this talking that you make shows that will be good sell and then you know in some countries you don't have to make a production about migration about homophobia so we don't touch these things because we want to sell and that is for me unbelievable burning issue then not to go with this system and that is for me a question am I able also to let my job when I to leave my job when I get difficulties so if we get stronger more stronger and stronger right wing parties and I always have the feeling I will show my opinion very very strict and I will never work when they are the people who gives the money then I will go in a supermarket and sit at the cast I don't want to work because we had that a long time ago and people love their kind of art to direct or to act so much or to dance that they do it also for systems and they can't face yeah it is also about the commercialism that you are talking about because we are pressed to earn the money because theater is very expensive and then and don't forget that theater never have been very populistic I mean it was always a some percent of the average of the popularity in a known country it is always like that you can't change this but doesn't mean that we necessarily need to to let us afloat what is what is the opinion of the majority because we need to make a commercial thing to sell it and to have it for mass, it doesn't have to be mass but it is that we have to talk and to find out what is that compromise in a artistic way that you really make art arty thing and with arty thing that we exist and work so this is really I don't know it is obviously that we don't have any recipe but it is that we have to be aware of just to be clear I just want to use the shape yeah yeah I understand that you can make a bingo evening about migration don't leave in the box we don't thank you we will now go in a big circle and we will hurt also from the other groups what they want to say I think we are so in the course so it is a free sample chair okay yeah okay okay are all coming are all coming we we have something having a common performance from all those countries yeah yeah we changed the seats of the chair of the chairs of the chairs of the chairs of the chairs of the chairs of the chairs of the chairs of the chairs of the chairs I need to go because we have a meeting thank you for thank you so much continue continue how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you how will you Welcome back everybody. We now give a short report from our group and then we had also the time perhaps to discuss and take questions. We started with our group and then we have to change the seat because the camera will have the presenter of the group exactly here. Okay. Okay, so we had by a democratic selection system we chose three main topics or questions that we wanted to discuss. I would just read out these three questions or statements. So the first was compromise. How far are you ready to go in general politics or in pacing cultural politics? That was one question. Then the other statement was is the theater in danger of becoming an eco-chamber? The third one was what is our place as artists in the face of increasingly hostile government or society? Does our work matter? So maybe you can imagine that actually found out very soon that it's not possible to really give an answer to any of those questions but there was only just a quick scratching of anything and what we stated was that no matter what country or background we are coming from which institutions that the world of administration or the general cultural politics of our culture is often seen as a wall or a barrier that we have to deal with and that our programming our ways of getting funding are often like compromised because you have a certain theme that you have to deal with and you have to find your way like how can I enter my art and my interest into this funding program and there's often this feeling of I'm compromising a lot to do my art and this was felt as a general problem all over the places and here also there was the point that where's the line actually that I don't want to cross so how much compromise am I willing to take and to to bend my things and where's my personal deadline or my the wall I don't want to cross so and then we were actually oh we have even a question from the livestream that was asking whether the theater is the theater building isn't a wall itself like because of the echo chamber that we are actually staying within our walls and not communicating really with the society or all parts of society but we stay in our always the same questions always the same topics and problems but we never move on because we always stay in our own thinking systems so we said yeah that's a problem that we also feel it's going on and so I'm just trying to wrap up that some ideas were like if we want to break walls we can start by a local change like in our own place and maybe take some of the popular ideas of other movements in the society and like open a tourist center where you don't book a flight to Egypt but the future and like meet what people are interested in and like try to adapt your methods and your yeah your ways of addressing to make it more accessible to make it more easy for people that aren't used to get in touch with you so there was one part of outreaching programs also like really doing work with youngsters with the people and try not to separate them by because you have to have the kids that are from a risky background and so you leave out all the kids from a safe background and then get another separation so it's also like building walls by programming special projects so try to mix it up and the other thing on the other hand was like if I really want to be able to look at the mirror also the next day there are some things I cannot do and there will be some where I have to say no and this is what so there are two points of actually changing like how do I address and how do I go out and maybe find new chemicals for my artistic work but also like what is my change like how do I have to change maybe in the way I'm producing or I'm communicating to the gatekeepers to say no this is not this is not the way we will do it this is not a this is the theme I want there's no taboo in my work you can't tell me not to play on a certain theme or to only work with special people this is too much these are the hot seats so we were the group number one thing in that corner over there and it was the relevance of theater about historical events and the experiences the group had made so far with this kind of theater and in the start we described in from our different perspectives in the countries which were sitting together which were Chile, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland and Germany we described our and France we described our experience with what kind of wars are we dealing and what kind of theater we made or experienced to deal with this and there were two topics mainly one was migration and one was history we had to go through and we saw that the kids in our audience did not know at all about it like Holocaust in Germany is really difficult to still keep in the memory of the tune of today and all together we have the subject of racism of new racism dividing groups producing new wars around nations and inside society as well and then we discussed different ways to reach the audience by our work and we were collecting methods a little bit but that the time was not enough but we were doubting how do we reach the audience and how can we figure out if we reached them and what did they get from it and we were discussing this a lot and there were was maybe maybe you could say the elder in the team they were saying that theater makers we have those lists and there are so many things we have to talk about it and we are tired of having to talk about something and we want to make a theater that is filled with our our own subjects and themes and and the younger theater makers in the world really did a pletoy to do this work and to trust in the young audience that they will understand work about historical events as well and that it's not a bad duty that it's a very important duty we have because and that was important to see again that history is repeating at the moment when you start to forget about the sins of the past and so what we also figured is that the ways to get our audience is to create empathy and to find out what is the relevance for them today when they need an entrance in in this story we are telling or in this theatrical experiment we are doing with them and to find different ways so we figured out we have the duty to tell the stories of the past we have the the duty to find good ways to do that so that it's not historical lessons and what do you have to get? not at nothing as a feeling this is the starting point of getting into into communication and into sharing our experiences and our strategies we were just wanting to continue just at the same time I feel as well yeah yeah go to the hot seat I hope there is another group at the beginning at the beginning we were talking about how to get access to historical topics as a writer and to create a space for younger people to have access to historical topics yeah and in the discussion we had the topic that it's really important to point out the perspective or the different perspectives of different voices or just one perspective of an author who owns history so it was our big question and whose voices are heard we talked a lot about the second world war because we all we're all aware that the grandfathers and mothers are dying and it becomes a really an opportunity a big thing to to keep this to keep the stories alive from different perspectives for instance or he told a man told the story that that he's he said the story sometimes are very irritating it's not easy his father went went because of poorness went to the Nazi army because he was Norwegian so he would love to tell this story but he doesn't know even about his mother if he would like that he tells this story but there's so many irritations and and and moments that you don't know but the only way that what it came to is to tell a personal story to tell it's through a personal story there was one thing and we talked a little bit about the situation in Hungary that for instance we you get money to tell tell other to tell the history in another way you get money to tell it's not only Hungary of course it's in any any all over the world we're not talking about that that you get money to tell the right story about the proud Hungarian the proud German whatever yeah and this is the the opposite of actually most of us are trying all the time but what is if you don't get a funding anymore for the complex stories and so so we said history is actually something a wall itself that gets bigger and bigger and bigger every every time and the only way to break through the wall is to tell an individual story because otherwise I talked to to youngsters in Germany who said we know about Auschwitz we know about this is very bad we can't hear it anymore so that was building a wall of shame and whatever but not reaching the heart and then there was another big thing about last thing about a conflict that is for instance was between the company of ariana muskin and who wanted and it was about who can represent on the stage if you make a play about i don't know indigenous people and this is played by white male actors or something some people have a big problem with that and it's a fantastic thing that these discussions are raised because there's a new conscience about minorities and about about rights human rights so but so it's it's sometimes very good and another thing that was that we talked about how do we do with the classical literature with the heritage of our countries because they are sometimes if you look at them from from nowadays they are deeply problematic they are racist there are things like that so we had a little talk about if we look at the classical literature in our countries we have to have an attitude for that and to have to find a reason why we talk about these these things and in Germany we just did the wedding of some to the mingle which is a story a colonialist racist story about a a man raping a young woman and at the end we said we have to let go our privileges as we are here and to create platforms because we we are creating history but we have to create platforms and spaces for those who have a diverse answer who have another perspective than we have we don't have the truth but we can tell the individual stories so thank you very much to every group to every thoughts and I hope it will not stop now we have to go in further perhaps you are here the next days and we can talk together about all these issues and how about how we could make that art still living and is lively and we'll get their audience and that we don't lose our wish for stories we want to tell and stories as been told so I say thank you again I wish you a wonderful day um there are a lot of possibilities to join us the next year in Germany we have three international points uh we have in February the wonderful festival panorama we have in May theater of the world in the big theater in Düsseldorf and Stefan organized that there it's also a part of theater of our TYA there we could meet there and I make a wonderful festival in June 2020 and I would like to say welcome to everybody of you and to continue talk fill our baskets to make good art thank you very much thank you for the wonderful gummy bears yeah that is that's brilliant that's brilliant bears brilliant bears