 Relative to Oracle, Oracle is a whole different ball game. Oracle is going to take its applications and really build a big giant, ironically, hairball around the Oracle applications and the Oracle hardware. Let me dig into that. So Jack told me the CEO, Hitachi Deis, this was on stage saying he wants to free up the data from the application. And he must have said application aside a few times. What you're saying is Oracle is application-centric. They don't want to do that. No, they want the Oracle applications to be the center of the universe, and the Oracle slash Sun hardware to be managing that. OK, so they're really not very, not at all inclusive of other. In fact, Sun used to resell Hitachi's high-end platform. One of the things that Larry Ellison has said publicly when he took over the management of Oracle, said we didn't make enough money off of the Hitachi platform, great product, one of the best products out there. But we didn't make enough profit, so we cut it. We're going to sell our own stuff. Really very profit-driven. Sun is now chasing.