 We're at Lorenzo White at DC 30 in the Blacks in Cyber Village and after the talk we started talking about your experience at DEF CON and what was your first year at DEF CON? So my first year was either 2014-2015 and you know I was in corporate America I've been to plenty of corporate cyber events like RSA a couple times and other smaller events like that you know the normal run-the-mill corporate. So I heard about DEF CON, knew how to come, showed up my first day in a suit and tie, I think it was a regular regular conference that's like oh no this is not looked around walked back to my hotel room change it came back so. And when did you end up spending your time at DEF CON that year? Man it was it was great so every conference I've been to I learned so much in that first conference I've ever learned. Everything's hands-on so when people are taught to actually learn to interact it's not just a bunch of vendors trying to sell you stuff it's actually a learning experience best begging for your buck for any conference I'll tell you anybody that but you want to get a cyber even if you just want to thinking about cyber come here expand or say anything see if you want to do it you can see you can go try whatever you want to do hacking if you want to do you know DRC to someone here doing it. I think like one of my favorite things about DEF CON it's like it doesn't matter whether you go at the villages whether you go to the contests like well all those things are fun you can find those things online. What you get at DEF CON is the people you meet and the friends you get and being along the way is you meet them one year and then year after year it's like it's coming back to camp or something like that where you're meeting all the old friendships yeah absolutely that's great. My first one I actually only knew one person here and he was the one who told me to come out here and then you know every year start learning to meet more people I ran to him one time the whole time we were here and then every year you know and then a part of the local got tied in more of the local group and a lot of people there go too so then going to all the beach sides and everything around all the other cyber events too. And it started coming to one CON with one friend, found a few more friends and now it's a village. Yeah and I was a village and like this year I brought my nephew and another mentee of mine and they're young and fresh out of college so they're here to learn and get them plugged in as well.