 Well, this is you. That's Uncle Harold. That's one of the equipment salesmen that sold the equipment. Who was the guy that sold you that first little John Deere skitter? O.J. O.J. Fett or something like that. Yeah. O.J. Self. Well, he worked for a company called Hubbard Gray here in Metropolitan. Hubbard Gray was at that time where you buy your cats from Hubbard Gray. One of the equipment companies. And there wasn't any other equipment company that sold caterpillars. No, it sold John Deere. Well, it sold John Deere. Criterite machinery sold caterpillars. So he would come out on the site with you? Well, or if they needed something they would call you. No, but he was keeping track of us pretty well because we were buying. In other words, he knew that the money was there, see? Well, as a youngster traveling to industry meetings, Dad and Harold's scope of their companies got bigger. I remember we were in Eugene at what's called the Oregon Logging Conference. And the gentleman locked up and says, I can't go away right now, but he handed one of his, happened to be the pilot of the equipment company, a couple hundred dollar bills and said, these gentlemen need to stay taking out for lunch. So we got well treated. You got well treated and you had a personal, they built a relationship. That's the way it worked, and it's still that way. A real good salesman will still be selling you the equipment. But, you know, right now we're running quite a bit of, Dad's got quite a few John Deere machines. And we have one particular mechanic, that papay machine, we don't call the service manager down there. I call Greg Terry. I got his phone program in my phone. I call him directly at my machines doing something. And he responds. Yeah. And this is much later. Now, that was in some big trees, some big logs. Yeah. That was up, oh boy, toward Union Creek. Then over on Yonkaw. That's a big old dugper. Yeah. Of course, that was a sugar pine that rolled it, then the heros pick up in. Yeah. Of course, you've got a big old dugper everywhere. So this is... That's a 35 American hydraulic log loader. See, now that we're getting into some later equipment. Now we're getting into the 70s. D65 Ecomatsu. So you've got some, this isn't a cleanup. No, this is after they had progressed beyond that to being a full-blown, multi-side logging company. Yeah. We were talking earlier about pre-prepping the logs for ships. See, this has a big mistletoe knot on the side of it, called witchburn. So you have to get that off because they can't have a mill. See, you take a power saw and thaw it off. Thaw it off, smooths us a tree, and then the mill takes it. They can debark it or it'll go through the debarker. If you don't, those knots will catch and the thing won't debark it. Change saw, but I think it was a joint. Okay, when we were getting that mill. We have run yellow ones, green ones, and orange and white ones. And I think, way back when as a kid, Dad had some remington chain saws and they were red. This is a man by the name of Fred Brett. He ran this big log loader. He worked for Dad and Harold for years and years. Local guy grew up here in the valley. Unfortunately, we lost him to cancer a couple years ago. So we'll skip the frame. This is just some more pictures of that same log. See, here's that same big Douglas fur log. Okay. Here's somebody loading one here. Well, Fred ran that machine. So which one of these would you like to scan? Actually, one of these would probably be better. Probably this one. Yeah. That's got a better idea because you can see he's getting ready to put it on the truck. Right. People are taking pictures and he's showing off. Right. Waters are like everybody else. These are people on your crew? Well, this is Jim Lowry. He was an old cutter from J.D. Cole. J.D. Cole. Wasn't this Harold? That's you. That's me. That's Dad. Yeah. And then I believe that's Wilbur Boeber. Those are talking to cutters. So we've got more people. That's Wilbur. That's Wilbur. That's actually, we prototyped Sylvie Tree Jacks in the day. Sylvie was an old company that built chainsaw sharpeners and grinders and they built these tree jacks and they were actually prototyping them in the woods. Sylvie. S-I-L-V. S-I-L-E-Y. S-I-L-E-Y. Found here for years. But I couldn't be wrong about it. So it helped you get your saw in there? Well, what you do... You saw it and then make a spot. You put a pocket. And if you've got a tree like leaves down the hill across the road or a creek, you put these hydraulic jacks in there and start pumping up pressure. And as you saw, you can pump up pressure and you pick the tree up and tip it the way you want it to go. Before that, you took wedges in the sledgehammer and sometimes, you know, eight or ten wedges and you just pound it and pound it and pound it. Or in extreme circumstances, you would have a high climber climb up the tree and you put the cable in it. You know, maybe 60, 70, 80 feet up the tree and then you pull on the tree because you can't have it going in the river. You can't have it in the river. And this was without a yarder. You would just fell with this. Yeah, well, this is before the yarders or this is just... I'm sure this is yarder timber and they're just trying to fall it so they can safely buck it up. Right. Because that's a big tree. It's got to be bucked up. Nothing will pull a tree that big tree. Yeah. I remember several jobs that they would be there. Steve Wilson had a crew on one part of the job and Dad and Harold would follow them through the same timber sale at the same time. All the logs went to Steve, but it won his mills. Right. So you wouldn't mill these? No, these were all trucked. There's a load up on the truck. No, that's more than 15, I bet. Yeah, well... I mean, I know 200 log loads these days, so... I've loaded more than that. Really? Well, on private land we load a lot of the pulp. Right. And we can send down to six inches in diameter to the mill with the tops from six inches on down. We process out with our mechanical processors and then there's a little company in White City that takes some chips and the pulp chips. It's all done by the time a mule load boasts up on mule-train short-waters again and there could be three and four hundred piece of mullers. When I first started it, I hated it, but now that I've figured out how to speed up the process... Is that a kamatsu there? That's your first kamatsu tractor you ever bought. So William and I lost track, I think William's 15, so this would be 60. There's tractor, that's something worse than any, right? Well, this... What did you do? At one point they had four. This would just have been the first one you bought. Right. At one time they had lots. You spent money, didn't you? Yeah. And so that was the brand was... Come on. About 200,000. Wow. No, back in that day it was probably about 100,000. So when would this have been? That was in the mid-70s. So you were getting close to the color. See, this scrapbook was about their logging. This was another machine they had. It was a 740 John Deere rubber-tired skitter. Using chokers. Yeah. Just lots of different pictures of the different machines they've had over the years. Right, right. Well, but the machines tell the story. Well, and see... Well, it's easy. What you notice is they've moved from logging just clean up and stuff. This is much bigger equipment. Right. It'll handle much bigger wood easier. And we'd have bought this, those skitters there. And... I don't know whether this was one of those unnamed ones or not. No, no. This was a 740 John Deere you bought. See, at one time, Dad and Harold ran lots of John Deere equipment for years. Factory approached them to run experimental machines. They'd come out and make sure we had a shop facility where the engineers could work on it. So they'd bring us skitters, mostly rubber-tired skitters. No names on them. No, nothing. I might say John Deere, but instead of a model number, it would have an X something on it, like a serum. And the problem was when the local John Deere leadership happened to drop in on one of our sides, and here's these two John Deere machines that they didn't know existed in the face of the earth. So what did you call them? You called them their pre... their experimental. This wasn't, but we ran experimental machines. We worked with John Deere on their skitters for several years. Started in and we went back there, the debuts, where they built them, and we told them what was wrong with the first ones they sent us out. Yeah, they took us to dinner, but the engineers were serious about that. So pretty quick, we had two that had no name on, and they brought them out here, so their men come out and worked on them and seen what we were doing to make them better. We had to fill out data reports on the machine, if it lost oil or something broke off. No. Not so much with John Deere, but I should quote, there was four or five logs of scattered throughout, or even these machines would rotate through them. Just like Caterpillar, the company had some people they worked with that would run, because at the time a lot of the R&D was done. In case, I know John Deere, they would send an engineer out, and he would live here in the Rogue Valley while we had these two or three experimental machines. He never went down to the place where they sold John Deere's. He would tend to this machine without ever telling anybody anything. Then they would go back to the factory and change anything that he thought they should change. In other words, it was an improvement. Rather than to send them to the lab, they sent them to the woods, and with people who knew how to run them. Well, of course, you've got to remember, they didn't have things like computer modeling and vax machines, and you couldn't email, you find a crack and you email it to somebody and get right back to you. Well, none of that existed. So, was this in the 70s? Yeah, this was in the 70s. I can explain a lot of useless details about this particular machine. This machine was built with big wooden locks of it. It actually had two winches, so I could be pulled up most of the turner logs behind it, and there was one more out there by itself. You could grab the winch line from the other smaller winch, and go out and get the odd log and pull it in and then hook it onto the big winch. So, how many logs would you be driving? Half a load of logs at the time. And how many is half a load? And how big they are? Yeah, a half a load is what? About 22,000 pounds? I've seen a full one. I've seen a full 20. Okay, gotcha. Whatever it took. See, unfortunately, they didn't build those logs just exactly the way you wanted them. This is Michael Kaiser. He ran that particular. But a feller bunch would make the logs just like you would. Well, no, you still get all sizes. I know, but what gets through? You know, not the feller bunch here, it's our process. Did you say this was Kaiser? This is Michael Kaiser. Yeah. He run one of those machines. This is Michael Kaiser's father, Greasing, maybe I said Big John Deere, I said Big John Deere, Dallas. He was one of our watchmen. What's a watchman? We have to have somebody live there. When he was outside going, there has to be a watchman there, day and night. In the summer, you have to do a fire watch after you shut down. But unfortunately, starting in the early 70s, you know, you're talking about, even in that area, you're talking about close to a million dollars worth of equipment sitting out there. So you pay somebody, normally a retired logger or something to live out there, so people didn't really need a machine. This fellow was a retired logger that worked with my father in law. He was actually a timber-falling partner of my mom's dad, Michael Kaiser Senior. This is another 35-American shovel. The man is Terry Edmondson. He's an old Deet Falls person. They were a famous family from Deet Falls. This happened to be taken down on Beaver Creek in Northern California, Hawkingland River. So you call that a shovel? Hydraulic log loader or a shovel. It is a shovel, but it's fixed to a whole load log with. I mean, on the skyline. All it had been going on was clear back when dad was in the Willamette Valley for a couple of years in the 40s, they used the steam donkeys, steam power garters. See, that was how they originally logged with donkeys, if we call them donkeys. And none of this stuff, this is all a statement of somebody's imagination. We progressed up and it got bigger and bigger. Now as I run a machine that's fully climate controlled, I can set their nest with buttons on the dashboard and change how much horsepower the engine puts out, how fast the hydraulics go. When was this picture taken? Well, the eight sevenths were around 1980. Probably down close to Happy Camp, then. What was on Beaver Creek? On Beaver Creek. Well, Beaver Creek is what is from Boston Cotton. Yeah. When they went to Helicopter, they called it a conventional one. On Beaver Creek, though, that's fruit growers, isn't it? This was Southern Pacific. Well, that's not where the gold miner sound, the gold mining was. No, that was the first time he ever logged up to Beaver Creek. I remember my brother Morgan was chasing. He was off for the summer. And he files up. He wrecked a suburban coming home one Friday because he was living, he was camped down there, living in the back of the suburban and then he wrecked it coming home. That's a 640 John Deere grapple scooter and grapple were a new innovation. He didn't have to jump off the set jokers. He just backed up and grabbed along with a big hydraulic. More efficient, faster. Everything is faster. Unfortunately, like every industry, it's all about eliminating people on the ground. It's safer. You don't have men on the ground. It gets harder to find people. It's just like these mechanized processors we're running nowadays, cutting mostly second growth, all second growth timber. If you have men out there with power saws buckling in the loggers, all those machines. The processor won't do it. Faster. Get the job done quicker. 80s? Yeah. This was a company picnic. This happened to be the... 25th year the Hanson brothers have been logged. That's what this cake is all about. They used to put on a big, huge company picnic every year for the crew. Had it all catered. Well, that's a picture of Dad and Uncle Harold with their cake. That was the cake they brought us. If you notice, the cake has got all kind of equipment on it. It's a logging scene on the cake. Ironically, this was at the Elks picnic ground, which now belongs to Jim Belushi and he built that big fancy house on the old Elks picnic ground down on the Rose River. How do we keep the morale up? Keep the morale up. That's the Breffbylers. Ragsdale's. Unionization here, in the middle, Hibbert products mill is current. A lot of it is how you pay, how well you take care of people. But you see, there were 49 mills in Jackson County at that time and only two of them were unionized. I mean, and of course, if the mill wasn't unionized, most of the time, the loggers that did that didn't have to be unionized either. We had a, I guess you would call it the Oregon Loggers Association. It was about like that, but it wasn't run like a union. We had originally hands-converting from Watt family, but it got bigger, of course, that one away, but part of it was people, it's how you take care of your people, how you, you know, because that's one of my most deadly memories is the theater. Remember, two instances where people who worked with Dad and Harold came down, camped here, they were diagnosed. The outcome was known. In the case of one of the gentlemen from Chateau, Jess Lowry, Dad and Harold bought a brand new pickup. You know, this is the time they had 20 pickups, so they bought a pickup and they gave it to Jess and they said, on days you feel up to it, go up to the jobs and check the timber followers and look at their log lines and make sure they're following the timber correctly. Because he was an old timber follower. If you don't feel like it, don't worry about it. And then when that, you know, unfortunately, when the end came, they just rolled the pickup into the fleet of pickups and they become part of the crew pickups. And then somebody else got... They bought a little pickup and he ran parts for the mechanics. So the mechanics didn't have to run the town. On days he felt like he could come up there and run the town and pick up oil and parts. In that era, the old bloggers would take care of their people. If somebody got old and they couldn't do it anymore, they would become a watch member. Maybe they could follow the timber and go to work at the shop, you know, changing the oil in the pickups. Or you didn't just throw people away, you... They managed to find jobs that they could do. Had easier jobs that you would make them do. Or, you know, what we currently try to do is if somebody's been around for a while, we try to see if they're interested in running the machinery. And then we'll make the effort to train them to run the machinery. You know, which will get them up off the ground and, you know, it's supposed to be easier. Sometimes it's a little stressful, but... You know, and that's still the way we prefer to do it, is to take somebody, you know, and I've trained several people over the years, and some of them worked out, some of them didn't. Some of them just worked till they passed away or committed suicide or something. So people would feel loyalty towards your company because they knew that you felt loyal You know, you've got to take care of them. And if you have 140, 500, 350 of them, somebody will eventually have problems or get too old. Right. And many people get injured on the job? Oh, yeah. There was lots of injuries. And of course, Dad and Harold always had workplace conversation injuries. Really, well, you've got to. By the same token, they would go out of their way to make sure that... If a guy got injured and he couldn't work in the woods, we'd give him a watchman's job. And then all he had to do was be there on the times because you take this kind of equipment, you didn't walk off and leave it in the woods just where anybody could come and help themselves. Right. Or sabotage it. Well, that was... The Edds had some of that. They get... How was that? Well, they did valve driving compound in the Indians on some machines. It cost them about $15,000. That was right on top of Smith Hill, by the interstate five. The part that really griped my brother was the timber landowner we were working for said, wow, when so-and-so was walking below the freeway, they had the same problem. And they never told us. And you see, that was a case where we were on really steep, rugged ground. We had a watchman, but he was the only place with the parking in his trader house was a half a mile away. And these people actually went and hiked up from interstate five, crawled up the mountain behind the watchman and got into equipment and vandalized. They knew what they were doing. And they knew what they were doing. They got into the machines and went right to where they could do something that wouldn't be noticed by us, that would cause nasty, as much harm as they could cause us. You know, if you go up there and make it obvious, you know, if you break the windows out and take a hammer to a dashboard or something, you break all the gauges, that's an amateur. Right. You slip up there and put something in the equipment that makes it self-destruct. Right. They've got to know what they're doing. These were, I can forget what they call them. They had a special name for them. Well, Earth first was pretty famous for vandalizing equipment. Yeah, but that was longer ago than 10 years ago. You know, the big thing is, now that marijuana is legal, it's not as big of a problem. It's not as big of a problem. It's not as big of a problem. It's not as big of a problem. It's not as big of a problem. It's not as big of a problem. When I was growing up in the 70s and 80s, you would run into these isolated marijuana plantations out in the woods and those people would do many of them. Yeah, you'd find them and you had to watch out. Right. Because they would set traps for you. Yeah. And I know there was times over on the South Umpa River when they'd find one. Well, they'd go ahead and lob the unit and move the equipment away. Nobody would say a word. And then maybe when we were long gone to the next job, if we felt like it, we would call it in or if we felt the people knew who we were, we would just because it was safer for us to ignore it because we had a pretty big exposure. It's good. Was this on Forest Service land? Yeah, federal. See, one of the things that they had to do over there they'd go and get a spring and then they'd pipe pipes all on these plantations where they planted little trees, pine or fur when it was about high as this room you'd find these pipes in there. Well, when you immediately knew what was that. Go into these plantations from pre-existing hiker marijuana plants out in the little trees. Right. Well, you'd be logging in and joining the job well, you might be walking out the road and take a shortcut through the plantation or something or have to have to answer the colonnades and you didn't want to do it right when you're working and walking away from you. You'd find these things. And then you usually got out. Yeah, because something could be behind that. Well, they would just have to shoot you. And unfortunately to this day there's a counterculture out there that's against everything. Yeah, and they're still out there. And you currently see it just like they held their May Day protest in Portland for the most part they were shooting out President Trump and doing this but then you had this 30 or 40 people shoot up all in black with black stocking hats on and they'd be called the Anarchists they'd filter into the crowd and then they'd start exploiting windows and still have that. What was that name those people got on Stanley's up here and we said we knew that they didn't buy anything they only took four or five cows. Well, that was there's a counterculture group that's called the Rainbow Family The Rainbow Family, every couple years set up a big camp, there might be two thousand I know that one year they did it up here on Plonging Creek they were 12-way all vegetarians peace-loving just hippies hippies what they are. But the problem is our friend in the branching up there come up missing five cows. Well personally I love it because it's what I know. But I love to go out and look at a piece of ground and figure out how to get the trees off of it efficiently, safely and not damage the ground. I have personally gone back and logged for Dad and Uncle Harold when I was a little boy and that's pretty cool. And we've come back like I've shown when I mentioned because that guy showed those bulls what. He said this or that, but he didn't say that that would be replanted or nothing. And those are replanted every one of them. And a lot of it created a tremendous amount of pride in local communities. I remember Eagle Point had a tender carnival where all the loggers played Prospect still does. There was ten of them around the valley every year. Well now there's one. Prospect. But I guess there's a lot of pride when you go out and start from nothing and you create something. Create jobs, create money because unfortunately whether people want to believe it or not, the only way you can create new wealth in America is you farm it, mine it or grow it. You can walk a million bankers up in the room with a million dollars and that money might change hands ten thousand times if you don't let any new money in. But you got a farmer or a timber company can grow trees and we can logg them and that creates new money. Or a logger. We used to say three dollars for every dollar. Yeah. Because you've got the equipment sellers you know in our case I remember as a kid Eagle Point had two cafes that were open by four in the morning, every morning. Shady Cove had one. Prospect had one. View Falls had one. Now it's kind of a running joke for me because I used to get up early and having breakfast and they say well why don't you go out to breakfast and I said well on the weekends most of them don't open until seven. I've already been up for four hours. Well you felt like you were growing and of course we had our families and we had all these friends that would work with us. Do you understand? All the employees are technically your friends. And of course the other side of it was you had these friends out in the woods all working together and then you had your hippies you know what hippie is and they would do everything they could to get you. And of course we got our truck drivers and our skitters and our followers and our fellows running the different motors and whatnot and we were always proud of and if they could get out normally you'd get out 17 to 20 loads a day for a loader and if he could get his 20 loads a day you bragged on him a little bit and tied him on the back and he felt pretty happy with it see. In other words you looked after your man. That makes sound strange but that's the way it worked and of course we were the years we were working with Steve Wilson he was looking after us and where he had the mills and everything all we had to do was get the logs to it and to give you an idea there was a a shady cove and his mill was up there that took most like white wood you understand what white wood is white fur and hemlock and that kind of stuff and this old guy we got on him about the height of his thumb before he measured the logs to pay us see he thought he was cheating on the scaling he could call it a long thumb he would stick up and slide the thumb down to read and steal an inch off every log or something we came in there one day and he ran over and he jumped in the pond and he kept threatening and they were going to throw him in the bill pond for cheating and the rest of the cucksaw mill men just stopped and they just had a real ego but you got it those kind of things happened too see yeah, sense of humor but part of it you know I realize I'm talking more than dad just the same way part of it the whole community took pride you know the logger sponsored the little league teams the logger's we had a girl's team and a little league what else we had by a girl's team you understand what I mean the girl's team ladies softball here at Eagle Point dad and uncle Harold pulled the machine out of the woods they're out of here to shop and we pulled the cat down there and dad cleared that and leveled it spread the rock and we had an elderly lady a friend of ours and she'd stand right there and tell us I need that rock there moved there, you need this so and so her son and I were working on it actually it was Helen Harnish's mother for Helen Walemont's mother Grandma Harnish was standing there and her son Elmer was a retired county road person Earl Harnish was a cat skinner and a logger and I remember as a boy standing there and she was ordering him dad and Elmer and Earl around like they were still three little boys down there doing that for the senior center but dad moved the cat down there we leveled it out helped start it well, okay I'll go back further when I was 12 or 14 we picked a seed for Pop Hoover I don't know whether you know who Pop Hoover was they were farmers and over here we had a we call it, we call it the Jap Cove that they called it Lois Lois and when he said he'd come and ask my dad is Harry got anything to do today or nothing? well he can come and pick we get 15 cents an hour and finally I worked in that from the time I was about 12, 13 up to about 15, 16 and then they put me to work because as they got richer they bought thrashing machines and stuff to thrash so they wouldn't have to pick it by hand you understand I'm talking about a sack of lotus clover seeds was worth $30,000 and then then later as I grow older John Hoover that was his son taught me to run the thrashing machine in other words I could run the mowers I could do any of that kind of stuff he taught me that and we were going along like that and then I don't remember just why after we got married they were paying us I think 80 cents an hour and I had a brother that was working for a golf red cedar up here in the mid sawmill and he says I can get you a dollar an hour if you want to come and so we went up the boat chain well they found out that I couldn't figure something so they put me on the carriage helping set the logs out to saw the boards and the old guy that was a sawyer he was a retired we call him shoemaker but once in a while he would forget us and run us clear out in the pond the carriage, see the pond was right at the end of the carriage after he dipped us to us three times I said well let me saw I knew all the set works I started out and he took a dollar and 10 cents an hour now you didn't land anybody in the pond I never put a person in the pond but the guys on the chain was always happy because they got a dollar an hour and that was a great deal more than the farmers could pay see and that's when I first learned to saw because I'd been setting the stuff on the set works for this older guy and he was so old to explain it a little but in that era he didn't have automatic set works on the carriages in the sawmill if you roll the log onto it clamp it none of that was automatic there was a man that was setting a seat on this carriage and he'd belt himself on hand signals and the sawyer would say I want to cut two inches or four inches or whatever and you would manually set that out we used to call that setting on the carriage see and as they sawed it up you'd move along with it you'd ride back and forth on the carriage with the log after we got dumped in the pond sometimes me and the carriage and everything I said well I'd like to get drive saw and I got 20 cents or 30 cents an hour more yeah and of course well I started the first job I remember in the woods I was 8 years old and dad and uncle Harold bought a timber sale somewhere around rice rings and it was the forester was called a leaf tree mark which meant they went through and marked the trees that they wanted left when we were done well it was marked in dark red paint well my brother and Wilbur wrote right most of the timber fallers that dad and Harold had at the time were colorblind and they could not see dark red paint so in order to my brother Morgan was 2 years older and myself went up ahead of the crews and they bought us cases of blue paint we went through and painted every tree to be cut if they had dark red paint we left it alone with all the other trees we put blue stripes on them so the crew could see what they were doing and I think we got $8 a day or something for doing it I remember I was 8 or 9 years old cash to pay check went to school one day with $230 or $240 in my wallet my mother found out about it when I got home from school yeah she took the money away from me oh dear and then when they got a little older we had to take every stick every breath out of every stream we loved I spent a lot of time they'd take rakes and whatnot break all the stuff out of the stream walking on roads picking all the rocks on blue rock it was rocky road but the rocks were just the right size to stick in the tires on the trucks so we hired him and Morgan to go in these weren't big rocks but 8 miles of them one of the more interesting things they were doing a large sail I'd have been 10 years old and they were running two separate landings on the sail they had branding hammer and the ticket put it in an old mailbox and they'd load the trucks the trucks would just pull down put the brand or logs and make out a ticket well for reasons known to who knows why people decided that they could slow down or load it by stealing this is four service ticket books so when you lose them it's a big deal well they stole them so my brother Morgan and I for the rest of that summer we'd be up there every day and while the truck driver filled out his ticket we would brand the logs but we'd set there with the ticket looking at the brand and hammer so nobody could steal and make sure everybody stopped and got a ticket and the truck drivers would bring back candy bars and it was a pretty soft job but they kept people from stealing you know and we would just ride up on the cruise in the morning and they'd drop us off well one time all the crews thought everybody thought somebody else would pick up my brother Morgan and they all got home and dad says where's Morgan and they all kind of looked at each other and dad had to drive up by Fish Lake and pick up my brother who was still setting up they're pretty upset but boy the crew got these kids had more fun with the truck drivers though because the truck drivers would stop somewhere and buy a candy bar or a soda cup or something for them but then I spent a lot of time as I got into my early teen years with my uncle Harold because at the time father took care of all the banking and all the town business and I did not find that very interesting as a kid and I would ride with uncle Harold and he would allow me to do what he can say you know and it really wasn't legal for me to be out there at that age working if somebody strayed upon the job I was trained to disappear until we knew who it was or because the law said you had to be a teen to be in the woods and I wasn't anywhere near you know and I started out running the machinery here on the place because we had to make firecrows and then for fire safety in the summer they'd take one of this Fairwog skidder or something put a hitch on it and put a disc behind it and just get it driving around out here tilling the grass down then the next thing you know I was running the skidder in the woods mother and father put me through college actually was a senior in your evil point put past the school budget and closed the school district and my first thought was I was done with it mom and dad's first thought was oh no you're not and they installed me in road community college and I took the classes I still needed for high school the first year I was in road community college and brought the transcripts back to evil point high school so I actually graduated with my class and then they I stayed right in road community college with the time I had a forestry program an active forestry program and I was I'd have an associate of science in forestry and I love logging I like the machinery I like being out and seeing different things every day I love the challenge