 about 15 seconds or so. Okay, you're live on YouTube if you want to take it away, David, all yours. Welcome everybody to another presentation, another get together for the, or with the Hyperledger special interest group in the area of media and entertainment. So today we have with us both on Zoom and also streaming live on YouTube, Mr. Matt Mason, who's chief content officer over at Palm NFT Studio, which is certainly one of the more intriguing and adventurous players in the NFT space. You may have noticed in recent news that they have at very least three major projects on the go, the one that has attracted most attention even in the mainstream press is the apparently long standing project with Damien Hurst, the British artist who sometimes listed as the wealthiest living artist on the planet, which may or may not be true, but he has a project with these guys called The Currency, which is connecting NFTs to a limited series, I think of 10,000 prints, is that correct, Matt? That's correct, yeah. And is that the Cherry Blossom prints? It is not, it's a new project called The Currency, which is a brand new thing that's just revealed today. Okay, because certainly he's in the last week or so, his Cherry print paintings have, what have certainly been most visually prominent in the news, but the second project, as far as I understand, is with HBO Max on the Space Jam movie, is that correct? That's correct, yeah, that launched yesterday. Excellent, so some of you might have seen back in the mid-90s, I think, the Warner Brothers crossover, so the animated slash live action family cartoon with Michael Jordan, which now is in a reboot or a remake or a continuation with LeBron James, so there are NFTs in that area of animation, and I think you guys are also dipping your toe into collectibles with Major League Baseball. Yeah, Major League Baseball announces they're gonna be running exclusively on Palm, on a new platform running on Palm called Carnegie Digital, which is a new platform from Galaxy Digital Fanatics, which is the largest sports merchandise company in the US, Mink and Gary Vaynerchuk are the three founding partners there. But yeah, that's one of many new platforms launching on Palm. Great, so with that very brief context, at least in terms of what you might have bumped into in the recent press, I'll pass it over to Matt, who's gonna give us a brief introduction to the background of the company, what they're busy with now, how it works, and then we'll have an extended Q&A for anyone and everyone to ask the questions that are most pertinent to their own professional concerns. It's all yours, Matt. Thank you, great. I'm gonna share my screen. I'm gonna run through a quick sort of high level presentation. Can everybody see this slide there? So Palm was started around a very basic, but pretty profound idea, and that is that the blockchain is going to become a creative medium. And this is really the sort of future that we're starting to scratch out with NFTs in 2021. But this idea that the blockchain itself is something that is going to give creativity new power. And the way that we think about it is, if you think about the world before the internet, we collected physical objects that meant something to us. That's how we conferred value, conferred status. That's how we demonstrated our allegiance to different subcultures. And then Web 2 kind of devalued some of that activity and some of that behavior with social media, which gave rise to new modes of expression, new ways of people connecting. And we think Web 3 is kind of the best of both worlds. It's about social objects. So objects that can be both digital and valuable. And the blockchain is really the creative foundation of all of that and up until now, we thought about the blockchain as cryptocurrency, as DeFi. But what NFTs are really starting to show is that the blockchain can be a paintbrush, it can be a building block, it can be an open door into a new story world. And we really are thinking about the sort of future of art and distribution as the most powerful form of fan engagement that we've ever seen. And a revolutionary force that's going to, it's going to really drive culture in a number of new ways that we haven't even done to think about yet. So when we started thinking about how are we going to build this, the idea of Parment of T-Studio was the brainchilder. Dan Hamer was one of the co-founders and CEO. Dan was leading the protocols group of consensus, leading the largest team of devs working on Ethereum 2. And really started to see that what was happening with the NFT space in earlier this year was a tipping point for one of the better term in terms of people understanding crypto. And Dan's idea was, well, hang on, we've got this amazing software, this enterprise-grade stack of consensus that's powering all of DeFi, it's powering MasterCard and UBS and Microsoft and many other businesses. We've solved the scalability problem. If you take that software and you pair it with a different consensus mechanism to solve the sustainability problem, then you've solved for most of the things that people right now are struggling with when it comes to NFTs, namely scalability and sustainability. And this has sort of led people to develop on different chains. We've seen lots of activity on Polkadot and Tezos, away from Ethereum, and the rise of new protocols like Flow, which are specifically designed for NFTs in case of Flow, but all of these players are having to solve the scalability right now. They're not where Ethereum is and DeFi is not about to jump onto a chain other than Ethereum. It's pretty clear that Ethereum is where all the money and all the sort of supply chain stuff and all the things that creators will need to connect to to really build industries. It's already on Ethereum. And if you look at the layer two solutions on Ethereum, they're also to try and solve for scale right now and they're not necessarily building specifically for NFTs. So the idea behind Plan was kind of twofold. We can create a new network, Optimize for NFTs that's operating as a side chain on Ethereum, that'll be 99% more energy efficient than the current approach of work system that Ethereum is using. And then we can build this NFT studio as well, this collective of artists, of entrepreneurs, people in the fine art business, the entertainment business who came together and really wanna think about this idea of the blockchain as the medium. And that's a super fluffy thing to say but what it actually means is we can start thinking about the really hard problems of NFTs right now. All of our competitors are either solving for sustainability or scalability or both and they're building to solve that because we have out of the box software from consensus that's already solving those two things, we can start to think about the really important questions such as what is an NFT? What does an NFT mean in music? What does it mean in fine art? How do you use it to do social engagement like we did yesterday when we partnered with Nifty and Warner Brothers to release 90,000 space jam NFTs that were available for a tweet or for signing up to the Nifty's platform? How do you do things like that and what does social engagement look like with NFTs? How do you let artists really play with the idea of physical and digital with a large scale project the way Damian Hurst is going to do tomorrow when he launches the currency? So this is, we've really been enabled to start asking some hard questions about NFTs and to create some really, really elegant what we're kind of thinking of as concept cars. You know, we feel like that 2021 we're in the horseless buggy stage of the NFT industry. So we're referencing the industry that came before nobody really knows what a car is yet. And we want to build concept cars. We want to build really cool social objects across different mediums and different verticals designed for different audiences that bury crypto complexity but make really, really interesting use of the blockchain so they can appeal to everybody whether they're crypto native and they like the design of what we're doing or whether they're just a fan of the franchise or the artists we're partnering with who just wants this cool thing from this artist or from the story world that they love. And that's what the studio is really designed to do. So bringing projects onto the palm network helping usher in the best in class talent and IP and really showcasing what you can do on palm and then building the tool set and working with a governance community on the palm network to roadmap the tool set that creators need you know, whether that's royalties whether that's staking NFTs whether that's new ways through fractional ownership or making cool changes at the token standard level but that turn into fun mechanics at the fan level we'll be working with the creative collective to really roadmap everything that we're doing at the network level. So we're really lucky in that we've got a great team. You know, I think most crypto projects run as good as their founding teams and to have consensus which is obviously the largest pure plate blockchain company, Hay Day Films founded by David Heyman who's the third highest grossing film producer in the world behind Steven Spielberg and James Cameron the producer of the Harry Potter films and many others. And then Joe Hayg founder of the Henney group who manages Damian Hurst, Gerard Ritter the estate of Francis Bacon and many other finances. We really do have kind of best of breed talent across every vertical that matters in terms of tech in terms of fine art and entertainment, DL Flow which is one of the things that really attracted me to this project. I was lucky enough to be asked by Dan to come and be employee number one at Plarm. My background's in crypto I was previously CML Kraken but really my background is in distributed technology and media before Kraken I was head of marketing and chief content officer at BitTorrent where we built a distributed content ecosystem for people to legally distribute work through BitTorrent using artificial scarce torrent files which we started in 2011 and still going but was really a project that was thinking in much of the same ways in terms of using distributed technology the way that the NFT ecosystem is doing that but I grew up in London I was a pirate radio DJ for much more teams in early 20s, most part of the dubstep scene and the grime scene and lots of the really great electronic music that came to exist in the UK because of an illegal network of distributed radio stations operating across power blocks and that's what got me so excited about the idea of people just being able to do things without middlemen or without points of centralization it was an idea that was ingrained in me back then and I feel like NFTs is really that idea of scaling the speed that I've never seen and so I'm really excited to be part of this company and this moment in time. This group I think knows who consensus is and what consensus is about but the reason we think this is such a big deal to have consensus as part of our founding team and our DNA is because consensus controls the entire stack of software around the NFT ecosystem which is for the most part built on their one Ethereum most developers are developing using Infura Truffle is the number one development environment for smart contracts you have Chorum which is enterprise grade Ethereum software and then all the way around to the consumer facing Neville, Metamask is the most popular wallet for NFTs so when you look at NFTs and how they're built, how they're made, how they're distributed, how they're paid for consensus is really there every step of the way and one of the great things about POM is that it's natively integrated with this entire suite of software and is using much of the same software under the hood if you're developing on Infura you will be able to develop on POM we've had people who are already running on layer one who are using Infura get their entire stack up and running on POM inside of 30 minutes so it's a really, really easy integration it's very, very easy to get up and running on POM if you're already using Infura and you're already using the consensus stack which is great news for a lot of developers. So as I said, we're building for scale sustainability we feel like we have a head start there on the sustainability piece we're using a rotating proof of work consensus mechanism we are at present a side chain which is the downside of that is it's more centralized and our roadmap is that we will become a layer two running on Ethereum before eventually rolling up into Ethereum two so we are roadmap to sort of continue decentralizing over time but from now most of the nodes in the centralized ecosystem we're using are not controlled by POM they're either controlled by consensus or other partners but we are already the minority on the POM ecosystem which is great and something we feel good about and it's that commitment to decentralization that we wanted to be committed to even from the start when a side chain just made more sense in terms of getting up and running now but as I've said, what we're really focused on is imagination, is building for NFTs we just feel it's so early and nobody really knows what these are yet including everybody who works for ARM NFTs studio and we really try and remind ourselves of that every day we're getting to work on what we think are some of the most groundbreaking projects in the space and we've only announced a very, very small amount of the exciting things we're working on we're working with some amazing partners on some things that are blowing our minds and we know that this part is going to continue changing rapidly we think in a year or two that the phrase NFT will probably go the same way as the phrase cyberspace because eventually this will just be how people this is just how we're going to do things is how we're going to distribute content that we care about the most and that we want people to interact with in different ways we think NFTs are going to disappear in a way that they just become something that's everywhere and used in so many contexts that they just become part of the fabric of society we're excited about what they mean for journalism for nonprofits, for film, for all of the finance for remix culture that there's just so many applications that collectively nobody scratched the surface on yet so we're really, really committed to thinking about that and keeping most of our focus there in terms of how the system works this diagram is just a what this basically says is an ethereum it's all on ethereum that was very important to us coming out of consensus the bet has been placed on ethereum at consensus already and everybody working at palm everybody we're working with is very much thinking along the same lines in terms of this is where he's going to be it doesn't make sense to build anywhere else so and having a stack on ethereum specifically for NFTs just felt vitally important we don't think we'll be the only stack running on ethereum we're already competing with a handful of other layer twos and various people in the space we know there's more coming and we think that's fine there's probably room for everybody if NFTs are the future of media distribution there probably isn't going to be one giant company controlling all of media distribution in the same way we've seen on WebT it just runs against the grain of everything the cryptos are now so we're excited to see competitors we're excited to see lots of people developing on ethereum and off ethereum although we think that's probably not the right thing to do but there's just so much great stuff out there and we think there's room for lots of different sidechains and layer twos that will effectively serve the same purpose as media formats did if you're thinking about physical media distribution in terms of the leadership team so Dan Heyman I've already mentioned we haven't announced this formally yet but Meredith Baxter who's also was leading the Pegasus team a consensus eth1 and to Cordead again is our new CTO I'm serving as Chief Content Officer I'm really lucky to be working this team and then straight Shrader is our Executive Creator Director who's formerly ECB Advice and also worked with me at BitTide and Nozilla so has again a strong background in decentralized layers on Web2 we are hiring rapidly we've got a bunch of other amazing people who've joined in the last couple of weeks that will be announcing shortly we're growing a really big team really fast and it's the most talented team I've ever worked with and I've been lucky enough to work with some really talented teams in my life but I've never been more excited about a group of people that's coming together quite like this one our founding partners already mentioned David Heyman, Joe Hague and then Consensus and Joe Lubin of course very, very, very involved and it's great to be working with talent of this calibre at the kind of board level it's really amazing and the thing that we're all passionate about on the studio side so it's this network that we're building but it's also the studio and it's really offering creative services to partners you know, it's a weird moment in that NFTs are exploding everybody wants to build NFTs almost everybody wants to build them on Ethereum and it's really hard for a lot of IP owners and rights holders and creators to even think about how they might do that nobody even knows to be thinking about I need to find a solidity developer to help me and of course all the solidity developers retired in the last couple of years because they made so much money on their Ethereum in 2021 but it's just harder than ever to build so we really want to help people build and we're putting together an amazing team an amazing stack to make it much, much easier to scale projects quickly for rights holders and artists and other people that we're collaborating with so looking at some of the things that we do we think about strategy a lot you know, everybody in the NFT space will tell you the same story and is that you get 10 to 20 people a day often very famous, very impressive people or brands coming to you, trying to sell something they've had gathering dust in a back room somewhere for years but they think it's going to make a great NFT and that's shit for sale the market has moved on what we're seeing from NFT buyers is there's a real amount of fan fatigue and the larger the project is the larger the brand or the IP or the artist is the more creative they need to be in terms of how they're thinking about using blockchain I've heard more artists than I care to mention say to me well, if that little people guy can get 69 million imagine what I can do and I feel like a lot of people who are not who are new to NFTs are really missing the point of crypto art as it exists right now this is a culture this is a space where people like people and others existed for a really long time and had big followings and they may not seem big to a giant megastar but this is a real culture it needs to be protected and it needs to be invested in but the idea of everybody using NFTs is also about it so when an artist or a creator or not a right holder comes to us saying they want to do something with an NFT we want to help them do the right thing we don't want to help them put out something mildly interesting that they've had gathering dust in a closet for years to an audience who's not going to buy that we want to help them think about the blockchain as a medium and that means incentive mapping that means thinking about game mechanics that means what's interesting about this studio is we've just started to invent things that we're doing because we need to I've never heard anyone else talk about NFT CRM or NFT customer-consumer-customer relationship management which is usually something you think about with email you sign someone up for an email and then seven days later you send them an email and 30, 60, 90 you keep reactivating them and you measure the lifetime value of that person and you have a relationship with them through email email's been pretty much the most effective marketing channel for CRM to date I don't know what the lifetime value is of the user of an NFT yet in terms of an NFT that they engage with over a period of years I know that it's higher than an email address because NFTs are places of emotional connection it's not your inbox it's going to be a social object it's going to be the place where you're connected with that artist or that IP or that creative work and if that work starts talking to you you're going to react in a different way there's so much to think about and this is me picking one thing off this list but we've got an entire team thinking about the entire spectrum of creative and marketing and technical product services that you might offer in relation to NFTs and every day we hit more questions and answers and if we weren't doing that I would really, really worry because I think if we don't know how little we know at this point then we're going to fail and again, you know, an amazing group of people that are coming together economists and token designers who I think in their wildest dreams didn't think they'd ever be working at creative studios and there's a recovering economics graduate I take great pleasure in that there's this new discipline emerging I think in the next 10 years economists are probably going to be some of the most highly paid people at ad agencies because bonding curves this team are mechanisms that people who are thinking about how to market food and drink and toys to kids and all kinds of fast moving slow moving consumer goods are going to have to start thinking about the blockchain as a medium and economics as a new creative lever so it's going to be really interesting and we'd like to think of ourselves as kind of being at the vanguard of this whole thing so like I said there's not much we can talk about that we're doing but the few things that have launched one thing was Juventus FC which launched on a platform called Gear it was a fairly conventional kind of auction of an NFT but I know that Juventus team is planning a lot more through the fall and Gear has got some really amazing brands coming to the platform as well so we're really excited to get Gear up and running on plan Candy Digital which is going to be the exclusive home of Major League Baseball which is a huge win for us so all of their collectibles will be launching on plan and then tomorrow it was just announced today but tomorrow Damien Hirst is releasing his currency project which is a collection of 10,000 handmade works that he's been creating since 2016 that are currently all in a safe in London each one of these has been paired with an NFT he's selling the physical and the NFT together for $2,000 for a flat price I think this is probably the cheapest Damien Hirst she's been able to get since he left our school in the late 80s it's certainly much cheaper than original Damien Hirst scope or anywhere so it's really exciting for us that he decided to do that but the most exciting thing is this whole project isn't about buying a Damien Hirst it's about experiencing his journey with Damien Hirst so in a couple of months he's going to give everyone who bought an NFT a hard decision to make they're going to have to decide do they want to keep the physical original handmade work in the safe in London and if they do he will send that to them or do they want to keep the NFT and this time next year so July 14th 2022 he's going to burn all of the NFTs that people didn't want to keep and he's going to burn all of the original artworks that people didn't want to keep and his whole thing is he just wants to see which one is more valuable he wants to see how people treat this what the secondary market looks like he literally wants to make a currency which I think is the thing Damien Hirst has been kind of moving towards his whole life in terms of being a critic and an accomplice of capitalism and consumerism I mean it just feels like the most perfect crazy thing that he could do and it's so exciting to us that NFTs finally allowed him to think in this way and actually sort of create something where the line between money and art gets really running slow which is really exciting it was definitely a headache to think through with the SEC but that's another great reason for being part of consensus and having that background is with NFTs a lot of the legal challenges are actually more difficult than the engineering challenges so it's really good to be buttoned up and have a good legal team it's certainly mattered on this project I can stop here if you guys like or I can talk a little bit more about some of the things we're thinking about in terms of different strategies and creative ways to use NFTs I don't know what would be useful to this group I think that'd be great if you'd just like to talk through some of the more whatever specifics you have left we've got plenty of time for questions afterwards Great, okay, sure these are just some very generalized thought starters just some of the things we're thinking about without sort of naming names or talking about specific projects so one of the things we're thinking about is interactive art blockchain lets you play with economics and lets you play with time because NFTs are network aware the behavior of people who own NFTs and things they do with NFTs you can use to affect the the appearance or value of that NFTs in some ways and one of the things we're thinking of is doing some interesting stuff with ideas around genesis NFTs or one-of-one NFTs that that can control an addition of many so there's a couple of different examples that we're doing works at this in but one way to think about this would be imagining a social network in the social network you can use filters you could sell those filters as NFTs you could do an open addition of millions of filters that an influencer gave away to their fans and then the influencer could sell a one-of-one and the owner of the one-of-one could then change that filter and when they change their one-of-one it'll change every filter every open addition of NFTs of that filter in the network at once you can apply this idea to a game you can think about it in a different way you can have many people controlling one rather than one controlling many you can do many to many you can do different groups controlling different NFTs and then the way that they they are architected affects how they interact we're thinking about this in a number of ways across social networking across music streaming across gaming and a couple of different other mediums as well but it's a really cool idea and you know there's other groups out there acing cards done some really amazing work thinking in this way and we're really excited about projects like this because you know this I think is one of the examples of why blockchain can just be so much fun and you can bury or you don't have to tell people about crypto and they can get excited about this and understand why crypto is interesting what digital original means and what a one-of-one is versus one of many it's just a really interesting way to show people all of the value of the blockchain so dynamic objects that transform with macro plot lines is something that we're thinking about so we're working with a lot of IPs we are working with very complex story worlds and on our team we've got we've got creatives who've worked on some of the most high profile IPs and franchises of our time in terms of box office and reach in terms of size of triple A games where they've had to think for all of their careers about how do I this complicated story across this film and this movie and this theme park and these 20 happy meal toys and this thing happening over here and what we did yesterday with Space Jam Warner Brothers was really kind of just a taste of some of the things to come that we're thinking about in terms of how to just make something super fun and create a really expansive set of collectible cool objects that are dynamic the fans can do amazing stuff with you know I think there's so much room here to play with you know if you think about if you think about giant IPs whether it's a lightsaber or a wizard hat or some object that a fan can own where that object is an entity that can accrue value depending on how much the fan does and always the fan engages with the franchising if they use it in the game it accrues value if they use it to unlock the new movie it gains more value if they take it to the theme park it knows who they are and it gives them a slightly different experience if they go into the branded hotel in the theme park and it knows who their favourite team is in the franchise those team colours will be in their room when they go into their room there's no ending of ways you can think about doing cool things with this and that's you know that examples of the kind of giant franchise level but this works for any artist and I think you know there was a lot of great talk about Kevin Kelly Kevin Kelly's a thousand true fans at days when NFTs really started growing earlier this year and you know if you can do this really interesting engaging dynamic stuff for just a thousand people that love your work they're going to continue to award you they're going to come on a journey with you that you wouldn't have been able to take them on before so we're very excited about the dynamism here one thing another thing that we think has got a lot of potential is the idea of a DAO which I'm assuming everyone in the school probably know something about already but you know one of the interesting things about NFTs is you're seeing this kind of Venn Diagram of people who are interested in from people with crypto experience and creatives who've just got no idea about crypto and most creatives we talk to we start talking to them about collectivism and participating in a new economy and having a voice and being able to decide on the framework of that new economy they get very excited if you start talking to someone who's not crypto native about a decentralized autonomous organization you lost them at the world autonomous it's really hard to explain so many of the core tenets of crypto people who are not crypto native and the DAO thing just seems like well you know you can build a DAO around your favorite sports franchise team you can build a DAO around your favorite kids IP where there are different gangs or leads this is just a great idea and it's got so many other applications other than here's our github and here's our Discord join our DAO so we're working on some really fun projects we're building our own creative collective DAO that will be called a creative collective and not a DAO but we'll have a github and we'll have a Discord but it will exist in many other ways so it will exist in real life it will have events it will have all of the things that we think a community needs to have to be to build up a cool community that the creative class wants to be a part of it so we're really focused on this idea both at the studio level we like to really think about you know how can you use a DAO to achieve creative goals and engage fan bases so one thing we've seen a lot this year is really cool sort of merge and burn things I think CryptoKitties from Dappelabs was the best first example but we've seen lots of others Street Fighter 2 on the Wax Chain and we love this mechanic and we're thinking about it in some really interesting ways going forward one thing we love about this is the way you can apply this to music so merge and burn games can be trading cards or there could be drum breaks and baselines and synth chords and if you can merge and burn sections of songs together with your fans to make new songs well then your fans can earn money with you in terms of fractionalised ownership and being part of that song creation process and we're working on a few projects to that end which will we think not only show a new way to think about remix culture on Web 3 we wanted to try and monetise remix culture end to end on Web 3 but in no way impacts all of the unofficial remixing that happens on Web 2 because we think that's so valuable and so useful for creators across all mediums but we also think there's a different business model for streaming here we've talked to anyone who's thought about music streaming over the last 10 years or you've listened to that conversation you'll hear Spotify and others say we're paying all of our money to the artist and you'll hear all the artists saying we never get enough money from this and then right in the middle of it all there's lots of labels who stay very quiet whose market cap has tripled over the last 10 years and you know we're not sure it needs to work like this and we think Web 3 works slightly differently we're building a couple of different web music streaming concept cars that you know we don't think in any way cut labels out but might create different economics that are slightly fairer and more sustainable for the streaming services and the artists and then by default also the labels so we're excited about that I'm working on a few examples there Generative Art is just another really interesting thing that we want to play with and we are working with some really cool IPs but again this is an idea that sort of gets back to the idea of the remix which on Web 2 has always been a mind field for brands and IPs and artists because if you just give everybody control of something you don't necessarily know what's going to happen and a lot of the time that can be really good but sometimes not with Generative Art you can let fans make their own work with the parameters of what they make it with in a way that's still interesting to the fan and we've seen this with crypto puns with creeps and weirdos with lots of more recent projects and we love this idea when you start applying this to story worlds and actual storytelling and getting fans involved at that level you're going to come up with some new ways to develop franchises and we're working with some of the most high profile creators of franchises in the world to create franchises this way that we'll start as NFT projects before becoming full-fledged movie theme park ride game that will take about five years to develop but we'll start very soon as a very simple NFT that gets fans in from day one so we're really excited about stuff like that Collective Action is something that we're thinking about a lot and we're working with a bunch of different nonprofits and this idea that again fundraising the place that happens the most is knocking on doors and emails and NFTs offers something new in terms of a perennial fundraising social object so how do you partner a great artist or great creator with a great nonprofit or cause to do something really interesting we have a lot of artists coming to us in this question, we have a lot of nonprofits and we've been able to pair several groups of people together that we're really excited about in terms of the things that they're working on and the impact that they're going to be able to make because of again what you can do with an NFT you can map entire areas of the planet and slice up that map as an NFT which you can then give people the rights to adopt and sponsor and they can see it changing dynamically over time and this is stuff that you can record on chain and you can do collective network aware mechanics with the entire map or just certain sections of it so looking at lots of projects around sustainability and the ecosystem something that fits with us for sure, it's a big focus for us there's also something lots of artists have come to us and wanted to know can I do something about this we've had lots of different bands especially coming to the same I want to do something with NFTs but my fans hate it they think it's like driving a hummer because of the eco-impact I understand there's ways to do this without that but that's not enough what else can we do so really thinking about how do we how do we help the creative industries have more of an impact in terms of corporate social responsibility and other industries too I think this is going to be a major major application of NFTs unfolding over the years so the Metaverse is one thing we haven't really talked about but I really think this is where everything's going and I've long been bearish on VR but I'm just seeing so many amazing applications of AR and Metaverse now and ongoing and things that are coming up in the next couple of years that we've been able to preview it seems fairly inevitable that this is happening and so your filter and your avatar and your social the way you look in-game and the way you look on socials and the way you look in real life those things are going to blur and if AR is going to be tied to identity then NFTs is a way to put provenance and creativity that's going to be really really useful and so we're thinking a lot about AR applying the Metaverse and outside the Metaverse and stay connected and network aware so we talked about NFTs by CRM this is something across every vertical over the next year across music, across film, across games across journalism, across fundraising I really really want to understand this number what is the LTV of a fan for this artist for this film for this non-profit what is the LTV of their wallet address and getting them a really cool NFT I think it's much higher than the email I really hope I'm right about that because I think that's really the key to this thing scaling what we're seeing right now is NFTs changing hands for millions of dollars we think that's going to be a tiny sliver of the market and 99% of NFTs will be given away for free there will be about engagement there will be about incentivizing fans to do cool things together that add value to an IP or to an artist and do create revenue but most of it is just going to be about getting people to do things and recording behavior and rewarding behavior so really thinking about that deeply is something that we're pretty committed to and then the last thing I've got here is fractionalized ownership so letting people actually participate in a project on the ground floor this is just going to change how we develop films how we develop music how songwriting happens how journalism happens there are so many different applications of this idea the hard part about it is securities law it's really hard to sell something to a fan if it doesn't exist yet it's a security if it does exist and you publish it somewhere you give them a chance to own a piece of it it's not security and so there's thinking through that there's clarity on this from the SEC and other governing bodies around the world in the next couple of years it's going to be tremendously helpful but this is a really interesting piece of this it's going to change the entire business models of various verticals across the media industries so there's a lot thanks very much for listening to all my galaxy-brained ideas about NFTs I hope maybe some of them come true and I'm really excited to take questions and talk to you guys more so I'm going to stop sharing and let's get into the Q&A thank you very much that was really thorough so we have three ways of asking questions we have the chat here on Zoom we've got the comments on YouTube or if you just want to unmute yourself and ask that it will also be great so please do as you will and let's see how disorderly it becomes who's brave enough to ask the first question Hello Matt thank you for the presentations I've been fantastic I'm very excited I've spoken to Daniel and some of the other folks at FOM about this work it's the kind of projects that I think get a lot of attention and that also is a unique way to do it especially today's announcement with the online art and the decisions it's going to be an interesting experiment beyond the actual technology but the experiment of what people decide and how the market dictates what they will decide and when do they decide it it's all going to be like 20 minutes before their deadline is everybody going to make a decision based on what the rest of the people but there's a lot of great stuff that you're doing one of the questions that I have and I work here is when we talk about quorum specifically from a consensus perspective there's always a question as to is it Hyperledger Bezu or is it Quorum Go which is the native quorum project so question for you is it Hyperledger Bezu all the time on these projects or do you have options I'm going to get way out of my time here as I'm the non-technical person that Dan brought in first but I hear Hyperledger talks about 100% of the time in terms of how we're doing things right now I don't know if that's always going to be the case it's definitely a question I will field Dan and I'll try and get a good answer for you okay great Pegasus is the Bezu brand it would be great to as a follow-up David we can get a technical deep dive as well specifically to Bezu and we know that there's it's agnostic some of these platforms will be agnostic as well what about museums you guys do anything with museums at all galleries I mean not well galleries yes museums in particular yeah we've been talking to a number of museums collections but yeah I think the the exit through the gift shop model is going to apply to NFTs just as much as it does to physical things and being able to give people in museums really interesting live experiences when they're there together I mean that's a venue where you've got a captive audience you've got a group of school kids or group of tourists who are all standing in front of one physical artifact together and you know I think today that's people with headphones on or listening to a tour on their phone in future that's people interacting with a network aware objects they're in the museum that they can take home with them that can unfold and will have a story attached to it and CRM and will keep them connected to that exhibit and educate and there's so many things that you can do there so yeah that's the long answer the short answer is yes we're talking to and working with a few museums and are you doing anything specifically with education I mean to help younger users to familiarize themselves with your technology yeah I mean I think yeah we are and I think that's you know in the case there's this very explicit cases that get this race to museums and this is part of what we do education has to be something that we do and so we're designing projects that we speak to that but I think the really high impact piece of NFTs as far as young audiences go is you know kids are so much more in tune with currency and the idea of having multiple currencies and finance like I was talking to someone the other day about this who grew up in London it's like we both in memory of money was talking about was a bank in the UK came up with these like cartoon piggy banks that you could buy or you get for opening an account I just think you remember this was the first time I thought oh yeah money that's weird I should get some of that mum and dad have some of that and I was like I think six or seven and my nieces and nephews who were that age already already have like V-bucks accounts and robux accounts and most of the money they're going to spend is on digital goods I have so many conversations with grownups so I'm trying to explain why anybody would possibly ever buy a JPEG but if you talk to a seven year old about NFTs and they're like what's that so well you know all those skins you bought in fortnite that you've lost because you bought a new xbox well it just means you can take them with you forever that's the best idea they've ever heard so in terms of education when you start thinking about things like staking you know staking quickly if I'm trying to explain staking tezos on kraken that's hard if I say to a kid here's a dog and if you keep this dog in this kennel it'll have puppies that's also staking an NFT and suddenly that kid is like okay that's cool and I understand that at some level this is a token huh why doesn't my money work like that so I think the generation that kids that grows up on NFTs is going to stop being very demanding of their banks when they grow up and we're going to see a bunch of new financial services that banks can't even imagine they're going to have to offer right we've got three questions for you well while we were talking the first one is what will be a good strategy to convince or invite traditional artists to know and then embrace this technology and the NFT world yeah it's a great question you know I think it's the I like the drug dealer strategy for this first one's free kid to give someone an NFT and it is it's like a drug it's like it's an intangible experience so the first time I don't know if you've all had this but I've discussed this with lots of people and I think there's something here it's like the first time you buy an NFT you feel something and you feel a connection to it and maybe that was just me and my friends who like NFTs and lots of other people like this is stupid why do I waste my money on this but there's something about owning an NFT that's very intangible and so I think giving people NFTs so that they can understand what it means it's going to be really important it's something that we're very very committed to at Palms you'll see lots of that lots of that from us second question would Palm work with games to create unique skins or a way to craft any NFT items and work with the ecosystem yeah absolutely so this is something we're doing a lot of we're working with games to do this and we're working with brands that don't currently have games to build social objects that feel a lot like games and you know it's just everything that NFTs are about is going with the grain of where gaming already is and I think the good thing about NFTs is it gets away from a lot of the grind mechanics and a lot of the kind of loot box stuff that is really starting to wear thin on a lot of gamers and it gets more into doing things that create real rewards and meaningful connections with other gamers and with the IP itself and being able to be a lot more imaginative about how you do those things in ways that actually create way more value than if you do kind of you know check back everyday loot box, grinding and stuff so yeah gaming I think is probably the biggest opportunity for NFTs third and final question do you see Palm as a competitor or a collaborator to existing platforms that are already known for innovation in the meta such as Async, Artblocks and NFT20? Yeah so all of those people mentioned we know and love really and look up to and they're all doing amazing amazing things you know I just think this entire space because on one hand there's this huge land grab going on and there's this wars between we're definitely competing with other sidechains and crypto platforms for projects and we hear from people that are talking to that we know that we're competing with two or three other people and it's definitely competitive but none of that stuff really matters and every time I hear that something else went somewhere else well that's fine because it's year zero with this and so all of the people mentioned here I don't think of as competitors at all these are all platforms that we would like to see running on palm these are all teams that we would like to see doing cool things on palm and we're just excited to see them doing cool things off palm because frankly these three are some of the most inspiring groups that I know about in terms of what they're doing creatively in blockchain with that I think we are done with the questions so thank you very much indeed for such a thorough presentation and in the meantime actually as Daniella mentioned what we'd like to do is maybe get one of your colleagues on to talk about some of the nuts and bolts of the mechanism slightly you know from the engineering point of view yeah absolutely yeah I think we can definitely set that up maybe Meredith or CTI or Alex Skeen who's joined us from who's working on Hitek Nook and he's now come over and is working on products on palm he could be great I know everybody's going to be busy tomorrow but we can definitely set that up in the coming weeks for sure especially as it relates to Basu obviously that'd be super cool yeah Alex and Meredith is probably the best bet for that okay well listen thank you so much for doing that yeah thanks so much, really appreciate it really lovely talking to you you too, see you soon have a good night, thank you