 People of the Internet welcome to modern day debate tonight. We are debating gay adoption We have hunter Avalon crossing swords with James Hake of the Hake report and going first tonight We have hunter Avalon. So I will turn it over to him for his five minute opening statement hunter. The floor is all yours Thanks very much and thank you Hake for returning for a rematch debate I do want to point out quickly my shirt says no soy So for anybody in chat calling me a soy boy You are officially not allowed to call me a soy boy because my shirt says no soy So you literally it's it's impossible for you to call me a soy boy. Anyway, when we're talking about gay adoption This is definitely a very controversial issue But at the end of the day we have so much data which shows that children raised by gay parents fare Just as well if not better than children raised by straight parents Whether we're talking about performance in school whether we're talking about the emotional stability whether we're talking about socioeconomic Circumstances no matter what factor you measure for gay people or excuse me children tend to do better when raised by Gay parents furthermore there are currently around 120,000 children every year who need to be adopted and Although there are a lot of younger kids that are primarily adopted usually about 50% of all adoptions are children under 5 there are also teenagers and disabled kids who are currently in the Foster care system that desperately need a home and they are considered hard to place because they're older they have disabilities It's harder to find them an adopted family. However gay people LGBT individuals are more likely to adopt Hard to place children so according to a chief executive of new family social data from the national register The national database of children available for adoption and approved adopters waiting for children shows that LGBT people are more willing to consider Adopting hard to place children This is really crucial because where a lot of heterosexual couples are interested in adopting due to fertility issues Gay people are interested in adopting in a different sort of way They are really looking to start a family even if it is considered non traditional this is really beneficial for the child and Just to go through really quickly these some of these studies here We can look at over three decades of peer-reviewed research which shows that having gay or lesbian parents does no harm to the child There are other studies that are much newer that also indicate the exact same thing that children raised by Same-sex parents from birth perform better than children raised by different sex parents in both primary and secondary education and According to uh, I'm not sure which one this is. This is American sociological Association Excuse me. We conclude that there is clear consensus in the social science literature Indicating that American children living within same-sex parent households fare just as well as those children residing within different sex parent households Over a wide array of well-being measures academic performance cognitive development social development Psychological health early sexual activity and substance abuse our assessment of the literature is based on credible and methodologically sound studies That compare well-being outcomes of children residing within same-sex and different sex parent families now I'm sure we will get more into the nitty-gritty of this but overall the consensus is clear Children raised by gay parents fare just as well gay parents are more likely to adopt hard-to-place children who desperately need a home So at the end of the day, we're talking about benefiting children or we're talking about Restricting children from having a loving home on the basis of nothing except for bigotry against gay people and ultimately we're basing that on feelings All right. Thank you so much Hunter for your opening and we'll kick it over to Hake for his five-minute opening Well great to see you again Kaz and great to see you too again Hunter Avalon and shout out to the modern-day debate chat and modern-day debate. It's excellent Gay adoption, I say no and I think that all Common sense thinking normal people know even the the sensible gays themselves know that it's a no a Family is a married father and mother with their own children Marriage and family experts don't know this because the intellectual world including academia and science has forgotten common sense and they've gotten into Oh, nothing is real except for what you make it children want their own real parents though, even even adopted children It's bad enough to be adopted by normal Christian parents who are decent and loving a marriage is a man and a woman coming together to start a family and If they can't help themselves, maybe they get married just because they want to have sex That's gross and that's not the right way to do it. It's best to be self-controlled Same-sex couples quote-unquote couples cannot have children on their own. They have to go outside of it That's why they have the the the adoption thing and the artificial insemination the surrogacy and all that but homosexuality is not about love or Family it's about sex the homosexuality aspect of it is about sex and yes All people are looking for love So they try to have this try to go back into this traditional world with their with their immoral and Ab and unnatural way of being but so they they go looking for it in one another They go looking, you know, the the gays come together and go looking for love for one another But just like men and women commonly they end up just getting screwed instead. They don't love one another there's higher instances of even acknowledged mental illness among the so-called lgbtq so-called community and higher instances of so-called domestic violence between Lesbians and many others in that world Domestic violence like I said, it's prominent especially also among the transgenders I believe There was a viral photograph just to give a little example of a black boy at a black lives matter protest back in like 2014 in Ferguson, Missouri He was hugging a cop with tears streaming down his face. It turned out he was adopted by one of these nicey nice Two supposedly white lesbians who had I guess thought that they were married and they adopted a bunch of black kids and They thought they were do-gooders in the world going to black lives matter protests after Mike Brown The gentle giant got shot and killed in self-defense But come to find out some of those some of their kids were starving. They're going hungry in these lesbian couples homes home and Later on these this lesbian couple drove their kids off a cliff This is an extreme example, but it shows you the The derangement in the mental mental and truly spiritual illness that infects these people And it's bad enough when so-called straight people are all into sex and not into actually loving and overcoming and having self control but to add this is Is just adds to the cruelty towards children and it shows that People don't really care about children. They care about their own ego And having this notion of a family homosexuality and transgenderism and all that stuff prior to the gay hype of the 1970s and the sexual revolution of the 60s It was known that this is a spiritual and mental illness, but then uh with the gay agenda and so many other things women taking over We've replaced truth with emotional intellectualism where we we hide behind um, you know studies and statistics and pretend like pretend like that can define right and wrong And really you have to see for yourself We saw the gay agenda infiltrate science and academia and medicine Children know it's wrong. Even when uh, even those children who have been Raised in gay families When when everybody's celebrating it all around them, they still know that something is wrong so frequently And that's why you see that you see that even in san francisco jlp jesse lee peterson Who might work with his counseled uh people like this And it's it's reality is uglier than what the statistics that hunter has expressed shows So I say no All right All right from there. There's a there's some there was some noise in the background there That's my cat. Sorry. All right. Thank you so much. Hey, i'm uh, just fixing this uh timer real quick And i'm gonna turn it off and that's done. 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Yeah, I mean I I wrote down kind of like the first debate I wrote down some stuff that hake said and I think maybe we can kind of take it from there So it seems correct me if i'm wrong, but this seems to be your main contention about gay adoption Is that a family is supposed to be a married father and mother? Uh, that homosexuality is unnatural And there is mental illness among lgbt individuals Um, and that we've kind of replaced truth and common sense with emotional statistics Yeah, and one other thing that children want their own parents So when you say let's start with that So when you say if children want their own parents, I agree with you children do want their own parents But if they are in an unfortunate circumstance where they are orphaned or in the foster care system then Isn't the better move for them to get adopted? Would you agree with that thus far? I suppose so So if they're okay good, so we're on the same page then that Obviously getting adopted is not as ideal as having your own parents necessarily But if you are put in the the foster care system, it's better to be adopted than stuck in the foster care system your whole life So when you say that a family is a married father and mother A family can be a married father and mother, but why in a family not also be Two dads or two moms. Why does it have to be a father and a mother? Because that isn't what creates a family it naturally Naturally a married father mother will will um Will have their sex and then and then have their children And that's just what naturally it's it's uh god's design if you will or it's nature's design If you will haven't we already kind of established though that obviously like kids come from a Male and female having sex of course, but they're in the foster care system already So the the option here is either get adopted or stay in the foster care system Especially if you are an older child or you're dealing with disabilities What's wrong with getting adopted into a loving family? That might be a gay family because I think that we will have an agreement in the sense that A nuclear family is by far the best environment for a child Two parents married that love each other in a stable socioeconomic situation raising the child is by far the best circumstance But where we disagree is I think a nuclear family can be two gay guys It can be two lesbian moms or it could be a man and a woman I say no to that I mean if there are problems with the foster care system usually a foster Families are supposed to be a father and a mother Who agreed to do this type of service So if there's problems with it, we fix the foster system and not um and not Go to this adoption by the abnormal You know the the gays and the lesbians and the transgenders But if the child is already less likely to be adopted by a say a heterosexual couple due to the fact that they're either older Or disabled and heterosexual couples are usually trying to adopt because they're having fertility issues of their own Right. It seems as if we're kind of down to a dichotomy where we have to choose between Letting a child who's disabled or getting older Grow up the rest of their life or the rest of their childhood in foster care system Or let them actually have a kind loving family who might be gay. I don't understand how this is a bad thing In with that question. Why is a foster family not a kind loving family? A foster family is a kind loving family But why do you need to switch it switch it over to the because I don't I don't necessarily think that a foster family is worse than an adoptive So-called family. Okay. Let let me let me go back then obviously when I'm talking about foster parents Sometimes foster parents they will foster a child for a little while before going on to fully adopt them Other times it's not the the case right either way if we're talking about children in the foster care system Who are currently in need of a home? They're not being adopted or taken in by other foster families if they are Disabled or if they're getting older once you reach the age of around eight You your chances of getting adopted or taken in by a foster family significantly decline So once that's the case and we know that lgbt people are more likely to adopt or to foster Children that are kind of hard to place Then why would we be against that? We would want kids to be in a loving family, right? Uh, yeah, but there is no love in that home. It's not it's not it's not real love I mean, it's there's no love in most homes, but it's not real love. They aren't they aren't doing it out of They're doing it out of a good the do good or mindset. That's why you see them, you know My suspicion about your statistics about how they're the gate the children do better under um Under the so-called same-sex couples Is that they're more well to do they have this do-gooder, you know a little bit upper class um liberal mindset Or be clear you're gonna probably be a little bit more upper class or at least in a pretty stable socioeconomic situation If you are going to be adopting or fostering a child, right because that's one of the requirements So I don't see how this is a bad thing. We're talking about a child or a teenager who's in need of a home Why would we be against gay people taking that person in you're asserting their motives? How do you know that's their motives? There are probably a lot of heterosexual individuals that want to Adopt children out of the goodness of their heart. Yeah I don't know how that's a bad thing if people are doing something out of the goodness of their heart That sounds like a pretty good thing. It's not out of the goodness of their heart They don't have goodness in their hearts people don't have goodness in their hearts They have an ego and they do this for their own selfish fulfillment But I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing It kind of reminds me of a bible verse actually where uh, who was it? Was it paul who talked about even if somebody is sharing the gospel With selfish motives or bad intent as long as they are sharing the gospel and getting that message out there That's good. Even if their intent is is flawed I would say even if their intent is screwed up even if I were to grant you that and say yeah, sure Let's say that their intent is uh, you know, it's just that they they're motivated by ego or something Is that necessarily a bad thing if they're giving a child a good household? And the child is doing just as well as if they are raised by straight parents. Why should we be against this? I don't I I really I'm suspicious of the statistics like I like I've indicated before I think that I've heard that um There's research that shows that children who are raised in the so-called same-sex households they end up with similar issues that children of Of single parent like, you know, the single children of single mothers Have they have more addictions more suicides more crime and more all kinds of mental health issues and education and all that stuff So I would be it's funny that you say that you're highly suspected the statistics because what it sounds like you're referencing there Is a 2012 study that claimed children do poorly when raised by gay parents But if you actually looked at the methodology of that study, it was deeply flawed It was also funded by a group that was trying to get certain results And basically the study was just looking at unstable couples who they classified having a uh homosexual parents They classified that as a straight couple having a child and then one of those people whether it was the man or the woman Coming out as gay and then leaving the family They counted that but they counted that as Raised by a gay parents. That's not what being raised by gay parents is Being raised by gay parents is you are taken into a family where there are gay parents who are already married They're already in a stable environment And they want to take a child in they're more likely to take kids in that are not finding homes elsewhere But they already you're not you're not explaining why this is a bad thing They know their home is in the foster care system right exactly fix the foster care system So if you have if you have this big problem with the foster care system Well, okay, there's this is a multifaceted issue then dude You can fix the foster care system But people have been trying to fix the foster care system pretty much since it started So we can do that but that's a much longer process by the time the foster care system is quote unquote fixed Those children are going to be adults They will have lived their entire childhood without a family and they would have been raised in the foster care system And if you want to talk about poor outcomes kids raised in the foster care system do Terribly whether we're talking about substance abuse cognitive abilities academic performance They do terribly really across the board So I I know I keep kind of going i'm not surprised I'm not surprised to hear that because they they get subsidized, you know by the by the government So there's greedy people who get involved in this game And you have Just like with the uh biased study that That you allegedly debunked The so the uh whole academic world and science science world is biased Toward being politically correct and politically correct right now says don't say anything negative about the gays don't show anything Yes, it is came out and no no the study came out into hold on the study came out in 2012 That said a lot of negative shit about gay people But upon actually reviewing that study even an internal audit by the same journal that originally published that study Came to the conclusion that the study was complete bunk. It was bullshit I accept that that may have been debunked But i'm talking about the studies that you're citing because you're pretending that the gays can do just You're actually make making the claim that gays Gays raise the kids better than the real parents do No, actually better but just as well if not better in certain just as well if not better in some circumstances Yeah, exactly academic performance academia So let's go back though because we keep kind of getting stuck on the same thing I want to move on to the unnatural point. Okay, but You're you're advocating against a child Being taken in by a home by parents that love them Because of what what is the reason here? I don't understand You keep saying well, maybe the studies are flawed. Okay, maybe they are but you haven't offered any evidence of that Meanwhile, we have three decades of peer-reviewed research I don't think that three fucking decades have all been flawed And I think that to assert that you'd have to actually be more delusional At the end of the day, like I think that you need to answer the question really why Why should children who are disabled or getting older be denied a loving household? By gay parents You don't even know what you don't even know what love is. That's not a loving household I don't need you to explain love to me. Hey, then why did you answer my question? Because when I say loving what I'm talking about is a family that is going to take care of them A family that is going to give them the same opportunities as a straight As straight parents and where all available research shows that they do just as well as straight Or as kids raised by straight parents. You're not answering this question. You keep pivoting You're like, let's talk about what love is when I'm talking about love. I'm talking about positive outcomes positive environment So why should a child be denied that? It's not love It's not a family and it's trying to brainwash children and brainwash society into accepting wrong is right Hold on. You haven't that you have not even explained what makes this wrong yet. We're just on the first topic yet We're still on the first topic You're you're essentially telling me that you explain what's wrong with it. Hold on this I just want to make this clear that this isn't like an optics win for me here. Okay. This is you denying uh, good households positive environments and positive outcomes to Disabled children because gay people make you feel uncomfortable. What is your answer here? Why should this be why should gay people be denied a loving household? It's uh, it's that's not a loving household It's not a family. Like I said, um, you're you're acting like it's a you're acting like You're bringing up like a false dilemma of like they're they won't be taken care of at all but you're feeding them into a world where Where they're gonna have these gays trying to brainwash these kids into saying oh this gay thing. It's okay Well, that's a whole other discussion that I'd be happy to get into in a second That's part of there is something there's nothing wrong with being gay. So we can go on that in a minute, but we We all know So because you're Factually incorrect when it comes to the issues of gay people You think that children who are older who are far less likely to get adopted The dichotomy that i'm presenting here is not some fictional dichotomy. It is a fact. No, it's not It is a fact that once you reach the age of eight and onward your likelihood of getting adopted Staggeringly decreases and what's wrong with that? Well, I thought we were in agreement that we don't want children to have to grow up in the foster care system No, i'm fine with that So you're okay with kids growing up in the foster care system rather than gay parents Yes Okay, so what you're telling me now is that you don't actually give a single shit about the outcomes of children Not true Well, you're the one who doesn't care about them. No, if you want to you want to feed the gays egos No, i'm not trying to feed anybody And pretend like to demonize the foster care system my dude You're now i'm not trying to demonize the foster care system I'm looking at this legitimately and i'm looking at this at the fact of the matter Your people are the ones running the foster care system No, no, your people are gonna run the run the gay And your people are the types of people now that are denying disabled children households that would Raise them no, we would show them love and present them with just as good outcomes as if they were raised by straight parents So we're against all of this No So are you clean? Wait, wait, wait, we need to stay on this one subject before we move on right go ahead Do you admit or not? Yes or no that being raised in the foster care system is by far less than ideal Yes, I admit that Okay So I doubt you're going to then admit that it is definitely better or preferable. I will say to have a family Over being raised in a foster care system It's best to have your family. Yes Okay We have already established the fact that they don't have their family anymore. That's why they're in the foster care system Right. So again, we're back to the same thing. I just said you were doing which is Denying the possibility for a child to have a household that treats them with respect gives them equal opportunity Because gay people make you uncomfortable But that's you're you're making up a scarecrow. It's be you're claiming because gay people make me uncomfortable That's not that's not what i'm arguing We all know that gay is wrong. There's something wrong with it. This is what I mean You're you're always falling back on your own feelings that being gay is bad. Obviously, it's wrong No, it's not it's because you think that that now you're willing to literally put no no everybody Disabled kids in a negative environment where they are more likely to be abused more likely to do drugs Just because you are misunderstanding gay people No, I'm not misunderstanding them. You don't care about kids You don't care about kids and nor do the gays really then why am I advocating for better outcomes for children? And you are advocating to keep them in the foster care system. It's a pretense You you have 30 years worth of people pretending that this is right Actually more like 50 years or 60 years if you go To the 60s because this is but prior to this everybody knew that this was wrong And you don't go to an abnormal to solve a problem. What you're doing is salt is Trying to address the symptoms if you wanted to address the problems We would return to actual families But no your side is for the destruction of the family No, and your side is for government subsidizing your side is for government subsidizing these foster Foster homes which only feeds into the corruption of them And you're also for the subsidizing of the of the gay agenda, which is also feeding into the subsidizing any gay agenda I don't even know what that means, but you literally just pretending that making everybody go along with it You said hey, we should really be focusing on fixing the foster care system But now you're against subsidizing the foster care system Yeah subsidizing it is not fixing it That's true, but it's definitely a step in the right direction. No, it's not hold on part of the problem is the strapped budget that they have No, man Yeah, okay, I don't buy that just say no But what you're you're falling back on is that we once thought that being gay was bad We no longer do so therefore we were right before but we're not right now Why couldn't we apply this logic to any other thing that has changed? For example people used to say the right belief is that the earth is flat now We know that the right belief is that the earth is round now I don't know what you believe, but I'm assuming you're not a flat earther If that's the case like we're not going to just cling to archaic beliefs This is what scientific research and scientific literature is it develops and it changes and it gives us better results and gets more and more accurate No, you're mistaken. What's what's scientific about About homosexuality. They can't even have real actual sex You think you're smarter than nature and nature's god So it seems as though you're really appealing then to the fact that it's unnatural. Am I correct? It's unnatural and it's immoral. It's it's wrong to call wrong right and to brainwash children into this agenda as well Oh, I would argue that it's pretty immoral to deny disabled children the opportunity to be raised by a family That will treat them with respect and dignity and give them equal opportunities On the basis of the fact that they're gay that would be uh immoral in my opinion, but that's posturing We can it's not posturing. It's literally my position that you're fighting against right now But let's go back to what you just said then unnatural and immoral. Okay What do you mean by it being unnatural unnatural means that a father and mother come together and have their children and in in a right world we would live by that and um you would have parents who actually Actually love one another Who if they're if they want to adopt they can adopt if they want to become foster parents They become foster parents or they have their have and raise their own families and be responsible for their own children So it's un wait when you say unnatural though, that's Just not being able to reproduce doesn't make it unnatural. Yes. It is So it's unnatural if a woman cannot get pregnant or has fertility issues. Yes, that's unnatural. That's that's an abnormal situation Okay, so you're saying two different things. You're saying unnatural and then abnormal What isn't is not normal is really culturally defined There are certain things that used to not be normal that are now incredibly normal According to how society views it. I'm not dancing anything. I'm I'm explaining why your point is wrong When you say unnatural what that sounds like to me. Maybe I'm wrong Is that we don't see it in nature? There's no natural explanation for this thing Am I right or wrong? Um No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that it's uh by natural and normal. I mean right and proper and according to How how god designed it all things being equal all things being normal All things being functional and healthy Okay, so let's just stop saying unnatural then because what that sounds like you're saying is that there's no evolutionary reason There's nothing in nature. That's why it's unnatural, which by the way is not actually correct There are a fucked ton of animal species that all exhibit homosexual behavior But it doesn't sound like you're saying they're acting like animals and not like no What I'm saying is that your claim that no what I'm saying is your claim that it's unnatural Does not make any sense because it is actually very much natural. There's evolutionary reasons why Uh, we see homosexual activity in animals and in humans. There's over 50 What are those what are those evolutionary reasons if you know so much? Yeah chimps for example will engage in homosexual Sex because what it does is it strengthens bonds and it makes it so that there's less fighting and it helps their survival Lions for example will engage in homosexual activity like, uh, you know Humping each other cuddling nuzzling whatever in the way to strengthen their pride This is something that's been well documented since at least the 1990s We've now seen over 1500 animal species all exhibiting some level of homosexual behavior So that's why I kind of had a red flag open said it's unnatural. Oh, no, it is unnatural No matter what you say, it's unnatural. You're not using the definition of that word correctly then Whatever i'm i'm standing by it is unnatural because a natural way of being Is is sticking with what's what's what's right and the way things are designed When you go into when you go into animal-like behavior and uh falling into of a worse and worse fallen state through Uh sexual degradation and uh perversion Then yes, you can explain naturally these things happen. What's your what's your evolutionary? Um explanation for why the human beings turn into this Uh madness Wait, I'm sorry. I don't Are you saying it's unnatural or it's abnormal because these are two different things that we address in two different ways And this is why i'm not getting anywhere right here both, but what's your what's your evolutionary reason behind homosexuality among human beings and why it's exploded Evolutionary reason. I mean, I'm not sure exactly what we would classify as the evolutionary reason I know there's a genetic you just explain why you just explain why why lions and chimps get into it Why do the human beings get into it in your in your probably because they love each other and they have a genetic predisposition to being gay But you have no evidence for that. Yes, I do the latest research No, it's not speculation the latest research done in 2019 showed that there was a A combination of a massive amounts of genes that play a huge role in influencing sexual behavior Including same-sex behavior. It's anywhere between eight to 50 percent or eight to 30 percent. Excuse me genetic So gay people are genetically predisposed to being gay. This is not something they're just randomly choosing Uh and as far as the evolutionary reason that's probably why because people evolve their genes evolve and they're set up To be more likely to be gay in certain circumstances But when you say it's unnatural what that means to me at least is that it's not something you see in nature because it's unnatural Yeah, when when nature all things normal you don't see it in nature when they when they go into a perversion Yes, yes, you might but it's not it's it's certainly not natural So you're pretending that it's you're trying to force it into being okay and normal and natural and Oh, they love each other. I agree with you that it doesn't happen randomly It happens by design of evil to um So everything that happens in nature is just a result of the fallen state and anything you like is just the right way Like you're telling me it's unnatural. I'm presenting you with evidence of you're doing another scarecrow. I'm not doing a scarecrow You're saying it's unnatural. I'm presenting you with evidence that directly contradicts The claim that it's unnatural by demonstrating There is a plethora of homosexual behavior in the animal kingdom And you're saying well, that's just a result of the fallen state or that's just no i'm talking about about human beings I'm talking about human beings, but it is it is also It is also abnormal to see that in the in the animal kingdom too Then why are there over 1500 animal species that exhibit this behavior? Well, let's get back to the let's get back to the human beings because they don't by and large they they're not into that Even though all those species by and large they're not really into that that much so, uh among human beings it is it is um Not just random It's from the degradation of the people of the society and that's why you see it rising in the culture today where the zoomers Are a huge percentages of them are are thinking that they're into this When they're just lost before we get down to that we we haven't even like fixed this one issue Because we're saying the reason a family needs to be a father and mothers because it's unnatural and abnormal To be gay so we don't want those types of people raising kids. That's your argument thus far So I've already I feel thoroughly addressed your unnatural claim. Why don't we just move on to the abnormal and immoral How are you gauging morals? What makes this immoral exactly? Help me understand um naturally If you will allow me to use that term naturally children want their real parents I understand that occasionally in rare instances that doesn't happen And because of you know, the death of uh of a father or mother or both but Other than that, there's no real reason why children should not be raised by their own parents And we need to fix that issue rather than rather than push them into We already acknowledge that Wait, no, I'm just telling you We fix the issue not fix the symptom You're going addressing symptoms said obviously the best thing for a child is to be raised by the parents that give birth to them But that's just service. Yeah, actually believe in that. No, I do but they're over Why are you a liberal? Because there are over a hundred thousand children that are in the foster care system that need to be adopted every fucking year They don't need when you have an even less likely chance to get adopted when you're disabled We're then talking about the possibility for these people to actually Have a home the possibility for these people to actually have parents that care for them and give them something that they are currently missing out on In their childhood and you're saying that's wrong because kids just want their real parents. Sometimes life isn't fair Sometimes you're actually an orphan. Sometimes you're in the foster care system. This is why I say you don't care about kids because you don't But that's you don't care about them either you we're not supposed to care about the kids The parents are supposed to care about the kids Or the people who are taking care of them are supposed to care about the kids No, no here. Let me let me address the lead class right now. I know I know No The parents are supposed to care for the kids or the guardian in the case of like foster homes Supposed to care for the kids But right now we have liberals who have taken over the foster care system and they're ruining it I I totally get you there and now we have liberals who are acting like they can be gay parents of these Of these kids and that's that's adding another disservice. Yeah, maybe they'll do better in in some physical ways then Then in the foster system that's so messed up perhaps But that's not that's not a solution. That's just addressing symptoms. You're addressing solution What's the solution? The solution is um men returning back to uh To to common sense and take and taking the lead in these things so frequently we have females social workers and um people with a Some messed up mindset getting into this social work type stuff It's so it's so subverted. You wouldn't believe it Okay, even if I were to literally concede that which that's completely unhinged But even if I were to just say okay fine, you're right That is a push for a massive cultural shift Right again something that is not going to happen In the childhood or even possibility the or even possibly the lifetimes of the kids that currently need homes right here and right now What are you going to do they are in homes? They are in the foster care system. I do which is you realize they're in like group homes Where they're more likely to be abused more likely to do drugs less likely to succeed in school Fix that How do you fix it? Please Go in there and fix it have men go in there and uh clean house What does that mean clean house? They're already strapped for workers They're already like strapped as far as financial means go Finance is part of the reason why finances are not why they're getting Shit abused finances are not why they're getting abused Okay, how do you fix it just send men in and have them clean house Yeah Okay, I mean you know what you're doing Men of the town are supposed to look out for their for their community. I mean just you go in there I'm not I'm not in there seeing the the specific instances that you're talking about But people who are in that in that world need to take responsibility Okay, but again, you're not offering a viable solution Maybe if you're able to round up a bunch of dudes that can go into the foster care system and hang out with little kids If that's something you want to go with then fine be my guest, but at the end of the day Why we have that we have to no, no, no, let me I have to stop you there No, we have to address an actual issue that you don't want to you don't want to accept that this problem exists I told you it exists and you're beautiful and your solution to it is a non solution It's either push for a massive cultural shift or send some dudes in there bruh You sound like they're high right now, dude at the end of the day We have kids that are waiting for families that are not getting adopted by heterosexual couples And that's not a bad thing There is a group of people that are more likely to adopt and raise those children And you're saying no Because why? Because they're gay Right You don't you don't so you have no reason here. You're just falling back on well gay bad because it's unnatural Even though it's not really it's actually immoral even though every single ounce of uh, you know research and statistical analysis shows Kids raised by gay parents just do just as well You're against they're not looking at the betterment of you're not looking at every betterment of these children You're fighting against it right now. You are arguing against it You that's this is your pretense and it's the pretense of the people whose statistics you believe But this is not reality when you look at the reality when you look at the individual cases of these people It's not the case. So you see these the oh, yeah You see this this one example of this chad guy who was raised by lesbians And he says i'm normal and I want other people to be normal like me But then when you look into his life, he's a mess himself So your your pretense is that they're doing just as well and on the outside It may look like they're just as well because you're looking at statistics and and all that stuff But that doesn't measure the quality of the real quality of someone's life Yes, it does in many ways. It does. It's very limited. We agree. It's very limited. Are you talking about their spiritual well-being? Yeah, that too. I mean, yes, definitely Yeah, and this is why I keep having an issue here is that you are believing the spirit Well, that's a side the point what the the problem here is that you are appealing to something that is Unfalsifiable you cannot prove or disprove the existence of our spirit of our soul You can however Measure via the scientific method the well-being of children raised by gay parents when it comes to Cognitive abilities academic performance the likelihood to do drugs Etc these are things we can test for and measure for And that's crucial here because that's how we are coming to this conclusion What you're saying is well, what are you actually? No, but what you're saying is maybe we actually have a spirit and then you know the the spirit doesn't like it Not maybe you're feeling it. Can you prove the spirit? Can you prove the spirit? I don't have to prove the spirit everybody who can see you're an unfalsifiable thing Everybody that can see the same thing with what I don't believe it same thing with your what you're claiming No, I have actual evidence over decades that have gone through the scientific method Decades versus millennia, which is right now the best known process to discover truth or get closer to it And you're saying no, we have a spirit but you can't prove to me that we have a spirit This is silly. You cannot prove to me that we have a spirit I don't have to prove it We didn't so then why should I believe it? You shouldn't believe it you should go on being blind and being a liberal and thinking that you care for kids So why should I deprive? Disabled kids and kids that are a little bit older from having families that Give them the potential to have a much better life and living much more fulfilled life Because of this hypothetical spirit that's all inside of us I honestly think that this is somewhat of a false dilemma because what you're saying what you're suggesting is that a kid who's so so called disabled I say handicap or Who's older when he is adopted gets adopted by these gays? And because these are well to do gays who are in a stable environment in a safe relatively safe community This makes them better off But You're not looking at like how they would have been You're not looking you're not looking you're not taking me a case by case You're just studying broad statistics and not the individualist cases So I can't verify or or falsify the stuff that you're claiming You can't even falsify or verify the claim you just made which was written regards to the spirit. Shit You're appealing to some mystical spirit that lives inside of us your your justification has gone from It's unnatural bra, even though it's not it's abnormal bra even though it's culturally defined to well The reason these kids should be deprived from better outcomes is because of the potential that the spirit in them will be mad Abnormal how do you reconcile this dude? Abnormal is not culturally defined and unnatural is what it is unnatural is what it is natural means father and mother and their own children I understand we've already gone through the natural and the abnormal completely wrong Abnormal just because it's become more and more typical So you want to pretend that it's oh, it's just culturally defined. We can just throw that away It is like we know we know at one point it was it was abnormal for women to wear pants It's not abnormal anymore because it happens all the time. It's cultural I know but we're we're talking about we're talking about Uh, people's people's relations They can't even have real sex And you're gonna pretend about any of this get your mind out of the gutter bro. That's nasty I don't need to think about that at the end of the day Then you then get these minds out of there. I just I just can't get over the fact that you right now are Are arguing against the betterment of children. It's not the betterment of children This is your your christian values are really falling short my dude You are literally arguing against the betterment of the children, which I thought jesus loves the little children Are you a christian you're arguing against the betterment of those children on the basis of the potential hypothetical spirit Are you a christian? I am not but I was when I was then what do you know about jesus or love? I was raised a christian Exactly, you just threw it away because you were brainwashed in college or whatever Well, we can debate christianity. Maybe another time. I would love to talk to you about that But at the end of the day, I feel like what you're getting at is that it's wrong because of your christian beliefs No, no even a normal person who is not christian knows that this homosexuality thing is about sex It's not about actual love And yeah, they may want to think that they love each other and they want may want to think that they're helping the world But those are some of the most misguided female minded people just like you are who are um, they don't have actual love they just have feelings and they um, they may do Well in life financially and stuff so they're so the children raise up get raised in a Safer environment in terms of crime and all that stuff but what you're saying what you're acting like You're acting like you're the logical one, but there's nothing logical about homosexuality or the or the transgender stuff There's nothing logical about depriving kids from better outcomes on the basis of a mystical spirit But that's not what you're saying. Yes, you are you sound like you're writing the next script for a My Little Pony episode Like you're not making any kind of argument You're not even appealing to common sense because even common sense tells us Well, if I can't see this thing, then it's probably not real common sense says no, there is no fucking spirit I'm not I'm not this is the thing you're hung up on that still Yeah, because you're willing to take this risk and I'm simply not I'm not a risk You're putting you're putting the children at risk by having them be raised by gays I'm not willing to risk the well-being of children being raised by a family that will potentially love them Will definitely take care of them and provide them with better outcomes on the basis that there might be some existing spirit I'm not gonna do that and I don't think that if you ask any child So you're gonna pretend like you're gonna pretend like you don't know that gays wrong And hide behind hide behind the statistics That shows that they get they're better off under gay parents quote-unquote gay parents And act like that's that's better for these foster kids Well, if all available research shows that they do just as well And then again, we're presented with a dichotomy of live the rest of your childhood in the foster care system in a group home Or be taken in by a family that is going to give you a better life Then yeah, I'm gonna go ahead and opt for the better life for the child I'll opt for for what's whatever's right in the situation If it's right to keep them in the foster home, it's right to keep them in the foster home I'm not gonna sacrifice the children to the gays Okay, yeah, it's not a sacrifice to the gays though, but yes it is it truly is they don't care about the kids It's not loving You don't know that you can't prove that this is just once they don't love each other No, no, you're once again hiding behind these unfalsifiable claims. What's love? What is love then I could say right now that hey, you have no idea what love is Okay, you don't even know what it is You've not watched nearly enough romantic comedies to have any idea what the fuck love means Romance is love I can't prove that and you cannot prove what is in someone's head or if they are truly loving or if they're truly not These are unfalsifiable claims, which is why at the end of the day it's falling flat This is female-mindedness right here my friend. Thank you. I'm glad that you brought that up I did because when you're appealing to this well, they probably just don't like this thing or they're probably just not loving You have no way of proving that I know that they're not loving I just have to know it probably because love means loving what's right loving truth You don't love what's right getting wrong Uh, what makes gay being gay right? Uh, we don't determine if something is right we what we look at it is is if it is uh a moral And then we decide to restrict it if it is wrong There's plenty of things that are currently not quote-unquote right like smoking cigarettes But they are still allowed and accepted by general society. I'm not saying it's right I'm saying that it's amoral. It's not immoral. It's not necessarily moral What it is is that you need to give me a reason why it is Immoral, I don't need to give you a reason because we all instinctively know that it's wrong You look at it. Oh, it's like, oh my gosh, that's wrong. You you even got disgusted by it Wait, how do how do we just look at it and know it's wrong? What is that? You look at it? You know, there's something wrong with that. I can't put my finger on it But uh, but I'm not gonna go along Since if I don't know that this is right. I'm not gonna go along and pretend that this is right Does god support it? Okay, so we're appealing to the christian god then no no it's not the christian god It's just nature and nature's god that the very nature of let's stop going back to the nature thing because I've already demonstrated how Your argument that it's unnatural makes no sense because it is actually very natural Are are those gay? Are those gay chimps and gay uh, uh Lions are they adopting little gay like lion babies and chimp babies? No, but penguins still see same sex penguins will literally get together and then raise children That's nasty But you're so you ask for it if it's natural. I give you an example then you say it's gross You see how you have no arguments here No, come on, but you're comparing human beings to animals human beings are supposed to be dignified I'm not i'm giving you a direct contradiction to your dumbass claim that it is somehow unnatural It is unnatural. I mean, I know that you're saying you're saying in a sense You can say okay, it's natural and I will grant you that um, you can find Uh stories and maybe even statistics of kids that get rate get raised by these well-to-do gays who are like nice They were raised christian and then they turn away from god and all that stuff and get into their gayness and they Raise the children all nicey nice and the children turn out all nicey nice and doing Seemingly doing well on that on the outside, but it doesn't make it right Well, I mean if you want to talk about religion, I mean here's a statistic from williams institute Which shows that 3 million lgbt adults are religious Reporting that religion is an important part of their daily life or that they regularly attend services Yeah, because blind people want what's right. They're looking for love. They're looking for god They're looking for what's right, but they're lost and they're groping about in the dark on how to find it I just feel like you don't have any arguments. You're just saying well. No, it's bad for the kids What makes it bad? It's unnatural. Well, no, it's not unnatural. Well, the spirit. Well, it's not normal You're just jumping all over the place. You're like a little mouse grasping at anything you possibly can. I understand. Yeah, I understand Um, let me let me jump at one other point that I'd like to to make Um, so we're just gonna pivot. Well If you want me to if you want me to go in circles with you, I don't know if there's anything else to say Well, there's not really much to say because what did you want? What do you want? What have I not answered for you? Well, we haven't even gotten past like the second point. I know we haven't talked about what makes it immoral. Okay So what makes it immoral? um Just looking at it You can tell that there's something wrong It doesn't fit And so your your natural inward self can know something is is wrong or know something is not right Without knowing how you know or why why or what exactly is wrong with it? So that's one and I think that we all can relate to this type of thing Frequently, you'll have an inkling that something is wrong without being able to express why and if you don't go a lot If you follow that inkling you will realize. Oh my gosh It's a good thing. I followed that inkling because this was the wrong This would have been the wrong path or if you didn't you're not saying that it's immoral because it makes you uncomfortable like for example I think you would say the moral thing in the eyes of god Is for a married couple a man and a woman to have sex so that they can reproduce Maybe they've already had a child and then their kid walks in by accident and sees their mom and their dad having sex They might have an inkling inside that says this is kind of nasty. This makes me really uncomfortable. Does it mean it's immoral? It might it might well be and it is it is Wrong it's immoral for a straight couple to have sex in order to reproduce. She's married If they're if they're doing it to reproduce and they're married and they're doing it in the right way Then I then it's not immoral, but they should keep it away from the kids So i'm saying if they obviously they have the door shut the kids somehow accidentally walks in It's not like this is something that they planned Yeah, I know that if I saw a straight couple who was married who were trying to reproduce having sex I would feel kind of grossed out. I don't want to watch people having sex. That's very nasty, you know But that doesn't mean it's immoral I think that the even the straight couple needs to overcome the sex too because there is supposed to reproduce They reproduce and then they overcome the sex like you you're eventually supposed to stop It's like we cannot we human beings cannot control ourselves. I get that even even the gays I get that they cannot control themselves They're out of control. Um But you that you do things in the confines of what's right you're advocating And then you overcome it. You're hurting my brain right now Well, I'm saying there is something wrong with couples who have a bad sex life Don't do as well. They're more likely to divorce if you're in favor of true Hold on if you're in favor of traditional values and families staying together Then why are you suddenly against? Straight heterosexual couples who are married god-fearing americans Having sex once or twice a week Like what the fuck dude by getting rid of that you're making it less likely that they're going to stay together You're not getting ready. I'm saying that they I'm saying that they should Know that this is something they want to overcome and eventually they will if they stick with what's right The all this needing to have sex you've seen these they're trying to promote old people getting Continuing to have sex. It's something's wrong with that You're making like a hardcore in-cell argument right now. I don't even know how to argue against this. No, it's not in-cell. It's vol-cell It's christ But I mean, it's it's not christian to not have sex. No, I didn't god himself in the bible says that it's totally fine for married people to have sex and then eventually Overcome it because you're supposed to love god not not be worshiping the body of the woman or whatever How do you you don't have to worship? But that's what's happening among the christians That's why the the country that's partly why this foster system is a mess because Men are worshiping the women and the women are worshiping satan. So our society is upside down I don't know where to go with you. I don't know where to take this with you What you're you're literally advocating now that we need to have more traditional values And we need to have more nuclear families, but you're simultaneously arguing against married couples Having sex which strengthens their relationship and makes it so that they're far more likely to stay together Obviously sex is hold on sex is not everything Obviously, just like making sure you're spending quality time with your spouse is not everything But it's an important aspect that plays a role in your relationship thriving I just I don't even know where to take this when you're saying we should have more straight people raising kids But straight people having sex you're saying is to a degree immoral Yeah, very often it is immoral. They're just using each other. It's not love. That's for sure But they're man, I'm I'm blanking on what I want to get a really long long way for you to kind of admit that You're not in a very happy marriage I'm not in a marriage at all, but um that makes sense Whatever man, man, there was something I wanted to get to um Well, let me tell a story because I I know that there's um, okay, so I've heard a story and this is a true story of a young man Who was raised by these quote-unquote gay parents? turned out to be a Great young man great guy But he because he lived in san francisco area All the people around him were these female minded people where we they celebrate the child of the gay parents more than the The child of the normal parents Like oh you you have two dads or two moms or whatever it was that's wonderful and He was getting kissed up to and even in his And even in his spirit. He knew that it was wrong and there is a spirit like we have a Anyway, we have like an even either an angry spirit or a week or whatever. Um I mean, I heard he knew that it was wrong and then he what's that I heard a story kind of similarly, but what it was is that it was a Uh, a boy who was raised by gay parents and then he grew up and it was more or less acceptable Uh, the school and his friends didn't really say anything and then he ended up doing really well in life Nice and he lived happily ever after well. I wish him well. Um But the point is uh, even in a even in a messed up situation because a lot of people are in messed up situations Uh, it can be like redeemed. He he came out of that Even in that even though he grew up raised and They tried to brainwash him to to believing wrong was right He ended up being able to forgive his his real I think it was two lesbians and they got with a father He he was able to forgive his both the lesbians so-called mothers and the and the real father and uh And moved forward in life and yes, he did have the uh, sort of a well to do type of upbringing in sf San Francisco, but um I'm my point is that Even among like the straight couples and the christians and all that you're right. It is a messed up world But that's not a reason to go even more messed up just because These studies show that they're gonna do they're gonna do better. I don't I don't really buy that I I mean, that's really convenient for you But it sounds like you're nothing copium like it's really convenient for you to say well all of these studies Three decades worth of research, dude And all of them come to the same conclusion Which is that kids raised by straight our gay parents do just as well as kids raised by uh straight parents And you're just saying I don't buy it. Maybe I don't buy your story. You just told me now what? You don't have screwed Well, I'm not the thing that's interesting though Is that you don't like individual stories don't give us actually uh ironically enough the whole story Because you also have plenty of stories. I neither do statistics statistics give us a much Larger story to look at because what we see is a large swath of people Controlled for a certain thing in this case Controlled for kids raised by straight parents as opposed to kids raised by gay parents And then it controls that and tracks those children for a long period of time and tracks their well-being That's far better than well. I had a friend who did this thing and then blah blah blah Like what about all the countless stories of kids who were raped by their dads? Or were beaten by their moms or their their straight parents did nothing but abuse them and treat them terribly Like step parents are much more likely to do that not step parents straight parents Who have their kids biologically? Start to beat the fuck out of them if I were to tell you a story about this It would be ridiculous if I were to then walk away and say that's why straight people and straight couples having kids is bad No, but I'm one story doesn't prove shit No, my point my point was to give hope to the the children who are who are raised in this in these messed up households that you advocate for My point wasn't to give hope to the children that are currently in foster group homes where they're doing the same thing And then unfortunately there are people like you that want to get in the way of children Actually living a better life because you think gay people are weird because the spirit said so No, everybody knows that there's something wrong with it Even you yourself. You're just not being honest about it. No, there's nothing wrong with it But your own stats your own stats Your own stats that you love so much have shown that the the people who are not the parents of the children Are doing all kinds of crazy things to the children because they don't actually care about the children What crazy things are they doing to the children? What's that? abuse So-called abuse sexual abuse physical abuse and all kinds of other things is much more frequent among People who are raising kids who are not their own biological children So then by that logic which that's not even true, but by that logic are you against that parents? Are you against are you against a god-fearing american white family? Who is a white or a woman and a man who have been married for five years adopting a child? Not if they're god-fearing. No, but it's but you are taking a risk when you But you're making a claim that they're more likely to sexually abuse the children They are more likely than the biological parents. Yes, you could make this argument against straight parents adopting also true very true Okay, so it's not an argument or a point against the gay adoption thing. Yes, it is It's an extra point. It's an extra point. You're adding you're adding trouble upon trouble by by bringing the gay agenda into the children's lives They're trying to okay. I remembered my point my last point or if you will um There is this push because kids actually You know your your innocence is spoiled. So you don't you can't see clearly, but kids know When something is off. That's why they try to brainwash the kids. That's why they're Targeting them at a young age in schools. They're pushing for it in the social media. There is a major So-called gay agenda In the world trying to push push wrong as right on the kids because kids will be honest with you And they will hurt your ego real bad. Whether you're fat or ugly or something is wrong And they will be like, oh, what's that's weird and now they're they're trying to brainwash the kids early To be like, oh gay is gay is okay But everybody knows that it's not okay. It's not right. It's not Truly natural despite what you're despite what you say go ahead How do you feel about raising kids to think that it's all a okay to like believe in jesus christ They should be careful with that too. A lot of the the mothers are are miss teaching the children and some female minded fathers I I agree with you. There is a lot of uh messed up Brainwashing and overprotective Like female thinking in the christian so-called christian. I don't know how you would make that into a female thinking thing At the end of the day what you're talking about is just raising children with the knowledge of how the world currently works There's nothing wrong with being gay. There's no problem with it It does no negative uh to society or to the individuals partaking in that behavior All you have at the end of the day are negatives from society on gay people All you have are individuals who are discriminated against or barred from adopting from losers like you sorry Who are then more likely to suffer mental illness or have problems? It's the lack of acceptance that leads to the negative outcomes a lot of the times that gay people suffer from So raising kids to have a general idea that hey, this is what it means to be gay. This is what it means to be straight There's nothing wrong with either of these things So long as you're doing it appropriately Which minds you we would both be in agreement that if you're talking about actual sex with children that is inappropriate It should be uh instantly condemned and done away with But if you're just teaching kids with a general understanding of this is what it means to be gay Hey, you you turned on your disney movie yesterday and you saw the princess and the prince give a kiss Sometimes there are two two men and two women who love each other also and they can get married also Why is this wrong? Okay, let me let me um bring up some some statistics I've heard that um The so-called pedophilia thing is more prominent among the lgbt iq than the than the straights um the uh the mental illness I've heard that the mental illness and the depression and the drug abuse and all that stuff is more prominent And you've admitted it suicide is more prominent Among the lgbt q stuff like I mentioned before the domestic violence is very high among certain sectors within the so-called lgbt q So-called community And so this stuff you're acting like oh nothing's wrong. La dee da dee da But that's not true that I understand that of course there's an issue with And you're blaming it all on how they're treated discriminated against by guys like me Yes, because yes, it is and I will explain it to you very easily So when you live in a society that treats you with contempt or there's a negative bias against you That worsens your mental health This does not mean that actually being that thing Is the mental health problem or is even a problem at all And I know you believe that because you would never say that being a white man or excuse me a white man Is a mental illness because white men commit suicide at higher rates There are external reasons as to why this is and that's why you see the suicide rate among gay and trans individuals Decrease Significantly when they are accepted by their families if even one right the family So if even one close family member accepts them rather than discriminates towards them They are less likely to commit suicide. They're less likely to do drugs They're less likely to have any kind of negative outcomes because the they are external to the individuals Not because they are that thing Okay, so it's you you made a reference to the fact that the family Showing love to the people is what accepting them for who they are accepting them for being gay. That's what they think that they Accepting them for who they are is what leads to the decrease in suicidality. Okay, so that's a stat for you. Okay That's fine. The lgbt is not who they are. It's not an i it's not a true identity Nor is the race thing a true identity, but much less is the sexual perversion or the gender Misidentity a A real identity. It's not who they are If they are told that this is not who you are. This is what you've gotten into because you're in a fallen state Um, and they are shown love then I then I grant you. Yeah, that will help them That this is just a result of the fallen state is pretty much in line with being discriminatory Once again reinforcing this dipshit idea that it's somehow a sin to be gay, which then you're speculating show me your statistics It worsens the suicidality show your advocating for no, no This is my big problem here And this is what I find a lot of your types do this which is where they will complain about the problem like Look at the suicide rate brah. While simultaneously fueling Negative stereotypes in regards to lgbt individuals, which negatively impacts the suicide rate You're contributing to the problem at the same time that you're invoking the problem to argue against that group But these are not problems. These are symptoms of the root issue inside of them What is the root issue? The same root issue that we all have we out. We all have sin and we all have issues perversions and and uh Twisted minds that we have to overcome. We all have vices and uh an anger that we have to overcome I just I don't understand how so you're blaming the christians. Yeah, the christians do have some blame But this is a a lot of it. Yeah Yeah, because they've been weak. They haven't been man led. They've been woman led So that's why they're super homophobic There's no such thing as homophobia So the white evangelical christians who are the least accepting of gay people in america is a result of the womanly led Christianity No, the evangelicals are the most sensible people, but they are woman led. So they're so they're still kind of Their wayward. That's why they're not winning in the country. They're losing So if it's if the gay suicide rate or the lgbt suicide rate, excuse me Is due to the fact that they are fallen within or something. Yeah, why is it then? Why is it then that their suicidality goes down when they're accepted rather than discriminated against? Because they're because they're shown a level of a form of love if you will or an imitation of love So when they're shown acceptance and love Rather than a pushback against their identity or their sexual orientation what you're saying is true Whatever you want to call it Then don't doesn't that follow them that this is external to the the issue This is not a result of the individual being gay, but rather it's external factors that plays a role in the External factors like their own failed parents I thought we just acknowledge that when their parents accept them then their suicidality goes down No, man I don't accept that they said there's the parents failed and that's why they felt and ended up in this in this degenerate mindset and so they They end up they know it's wrong They don't know how to they don't know how to deal with it. So they just accept it But that doesn't mean that they um that doesn't mean that they overcome their issues within Suicide is one. It's not an issue. It's not being gay. It's not an issue It's not an issue to overcome. No, it's not only dipshits like you say it is Every other ounce of statistical fact whether we're talking about whether or not it's moral the harm that it does There's nothing negative here. Nothing There's plenty negative. That's There's plenty negative, man And like I mentioned, they're they're more prone to those other abusive things towards children So you're saying that gay people are more likely to like abuse and molest children Yeah, I think so. I I believe that I've heard that. Yeah, that's completely bullshit Not true at all. You know, ladies Sure the american psychological association looked at a study and or excuse me conducted a study where they found that there was no higher likelihood of Gay parents molesting kids. In fact 90 percent of molestations. I wasn't talking about parents. I'm talking about in general Yeah, I okay even so even if you're not talking about parents just in general No, gay people are not more likely to molest children In fact, then why 90 percent of child molestations are committed by men who are married to women That means but if they're doing it to little boys, that means that they are homosexual Okay, so this is exactly why I knew if we got into this argument, it would be a very uh sad Course of events. Well, I mean, no, this is not true at all. This this is a no. No, it's not actually I understand again that common sense might tell you one thing But unfortunately you're showing us just how far common sense gets you You can listen to the research by a nicholas groth. He's a pioneer in the field of sexual abuse of children It's founds out it turns out excuse me There are two types of child molesters fixated and regressive the fixated child molester Which is the stereotypical pedophile cannot be considered homosexual or heterosexual Because he often finds adults of either sex repulsive Regressive child molesters are generally attracted to other adults But may regress to focusing on children when confronted with stressful situations If a man molests a little boy, it doesn't actually mean that that man Is gay what it means is that that adult is taking advantage of Disproportionate power dynamics amongst themselves and a small child But there is no there is no such thing as gay. It's just a sexual perversion one of many I think we should go ahead and move on to the q&a folks. What do you think? Sure Okay, yeah, I think that this is a good place to end if we could just summarize really quickly We have we have hake saying it's a perversion while providing absolutely no demonstration of this He's saying common sense shows us this thing Whereas his common sense got us actually to the further away from the truth rather than closer and he is literally advocating for the worsening outcomes Of disabled or of older foster kids simply because he doesn't like gay people and doesn't understand the issue Okay, I I say no, that's not what i'm advocating for. He's just scarecrowing my argument I guess I am I guess I am I guess it's just a scarecrow either that or maybe you're a perversion of humanity. I don't know All right, gentlemen, let's go ahead and hit the questions and we do have quite a few ladies and gentlemen I did send a warning in the chat that We have a quite a full list here. So if you send any more Super chats, there's a good chance that they won't be read. So bear warning And I want to let you know folks that I will be doing an after show after the debate about 20 minutes after we end here So hake will be joining me will be a continuing conversation In line with these kind of themes in that respect there will be an after show on the discord as well That is linked in the description below There should be a lively discussion there as well And with that we will go ahead and kick it to the first question on the list From lord dibby 42 for three dollars. They say hunter. Were you a formula, baby? um, no No, there you go from crystal a for five dollars hake. You got this Thank you. Appreciate it encouragement From lord dibby 42 for three dollars hunter your opening sounded female minded Oh, that comment sounds female minded From lord dibby 42 for five dollars hunter Are your glasses real or do you just wear them to look somewhat intelligent? I just wear them to look intelligent. Yeah, no, they're they're fake glasses I don't even need to wear glasses. I just put them on because it's they're cool James wins that block the blue light James coons of modern day debate The blue light the infamous blue light. I'm not even sure that's a real thing Uh the herman kane awards for 199 for a conservative anecdotes trump data every time Nice Trill so sad honestly anecdotes do help add to uh They they provide a real story So you can actually have something to hold on to rather than try to intimidate with statistics and stuff I feel like I It's just sad that a lot of times these these female minded conservatives would prefer a little bedtime story over actual Data, but it's okay. I'm I'm so glad that you're adopting this female minded Term you're a little bit misapplying it, but well, no you coined it But yet you're the one that actually exhibits it the most it's it's kind of funny So you agree that it's it's female mind. You think it's female minded to be logical I don't think you're logical at all. Oh, okay. So you think it's female minded to be illogical No, I like to just use it against you because I think it's really funny. Nice Either way i'm happy Well, I read that with poor cadence, but i'm glad you guys picked it up From lord db42 member for five months says james hake is on fire Happy birthday hakester. Thank you. It was just my birthday back in july turn 40 From the dharma defender for two dollars says homosexuality is natural marriage is not Interesting point. I can see what he means, but but he's mistaken. Um, he is mistaken What makes it natural just out of curiosity because the bible says so or What makes it natural to marry and have children and and uh raise a family That's what the no the actual institution of marriage. I think is what they're talking about Uh, god put it together god nature and nature is god the nature of things Shows us that it's right. I mean you just look at it on its face. It just looks right. Doesn't it look right when you see a happy family So yeah, I've seen a lot of happy gay families too and it it really does make me quite happy I get that sort of inkling that it's really a positive thing and that's how I know it's morally right You're a mess From daniel hackle for tens ten dollars canadian I have experienced a curing of my own homosexuality slash urges through heavy metal chelation chelation And so have many others. There is a strong connection between toxins and sexuality slash crime Get healthy wake up uh Can you read the last line that he said read the last uh two sentences before get well the last sentence before get Healthy and wake up. There is a strong connection between toxins and sexuality slash crime Get healthy as much wake up. Oh Interesting. Yeah, I mean, I'm sure that they're like hunter said, you know, there's There's supposedly a bunch of genes that are associated with this There's a lot of there's a lot of issues that come into our lives that cause different Different issues. It's interesting Gotcha Dharma defender for five dollars says 80 of marriages end in divorce. How many lgbt relationships end in an Unloving circumstance seems facts don't matter to christians only feelings I think it's I think it's more prominent among the gays to be uh To be um, what is that term unfaithful? So i'm pretty sure that the statistics are on my side if you're looking at the right factors But another thing I wanted to bring up if I can uh is I think that the pornography is is causing a lot of Is not helping this situation Well, it's definitely a good point that there is definitely an issue with the divorce rates amongst Straight couples. I mean if we do want to talk about an unloving relationship I I think that's a pretty good point about the fact that a lot of those marriages do end in divorce What was the second thing that commenter said something about christianity? Seems that facts don't matter to christians only feelings Well, you know, this is probably going to be a bit of a fedora atheist move But that kind of is true because it has to be like if you believe that An all-knowing god exists and there was a talking snake and that there was like the parted red sea Or that no is arc happened like you can't actually buy into too many facts because if you do you'll find out that all of that is complete bullshit I I say that there is a difference between facts and truth because there are a lot of cherry picked facts that The mainstream media will bring out to distract you from truth a lot of people lie with facts So there's a difference Gotcha from Oh, I lost my place Fernandez t for 20 dollars says here to show here to show support for hake get a job us number one Indeed, I am showing the get a job sticker right here. I am not get a job But get a job does jessie lee peterson savage moments. Yeah, and I support him and then um Shout out to fernandez t and thanks for supporting modern day debate. They are a worthy channel very nice against entrepreneurship I am for entrepreneurship. Yes. I am for I'm not against it But getting a job working for an entrepreneur is maybe the next best thing Okay, gotcha from lord divi 42 for five dollars says hunter if you ask a question stop interrupting and let it be answered Oh, he did okay. I think sorry. It's funny because we started to talk at the same time. So I was being mama. I was being female minded. I was Trying to be like there there hunter did okay What a mess Gotcha from keck arthur the bastard for 999 says stranger love out of self interest or charity Parents love from biological interest Motivations are different guardians versus bio parents parentship Good, I agree and I think the hunter agrees with that too. He just thinks that it's fine for gays to be adopting Well, yeah, because they're they benefit the children And I mean, I think if you're gonna live you're not a real marriage though, right? I it absolutely is a real marriage and I think that if you are going to live out your christian values I think that having loving families who are together and raising children Especially a nuclear family together two parents raising kids is absolutely the right move When I'm in charge, I'll overhaul the the um foster system and and uh You'll be happy. You'll see You'll see I care about the kids Okay, nice Hake Is planning to take over the world Got it Dharma defender for five dollars. Hey, homosexuality is right morally. What's the argument? What's the argument against homosexuality? You don't have an argument You know what um Like I like I mentioned you kind of instinctively know that that there's something off About things without being able to express it But there are a lot of things that are wrong with it and things that go that go with it It may not be inherent to the thing itself, but there's all kinds of different cancers among the the male gays and All kinds of issues. They know that they themselves know that there's something wrong with it But people just forget there was a campaign to make gay Simo k and it seems to have convinced the younger crowd younger and younger Well, honestly, I mean, um If you want to talk about like the the multiple different cancers or whatever That's more or less a result of anal sex and a good and a good portion of of gay people do not even Engage in anal sex. I'm glad you're doing right now as you're making an argument against anal sex You're not actually making an argument against people being gay people gay people getting married Adopting children raising them. You're not making an argument against any of that You're just saying that a potential downside of anal sex could be cancer Yeah, don't do that. Just like a potential risk of having heterosexual sex with your white God-fearing wife could also increase your likelihood of getting stds if she has something for example That's not really a good argument against it No, man, that's silly and also one more thing. I forgot to say is okay. I think that it's it is morally okay I think my argument in favor of you know gay is okay Is that I see it and I just get the opposite, you know, I feel this inkling that this is totally okay Totally cool. I get like a big smile in my face. I think it's my inner spirit Just approving looking with approval, you know, you have a dark spirit in you man A woman's spirit All right from Dan Zammett for a member for three months extra juicy says h You're both h damn. Uh, why did evolution produce masculine and feminine? So that the woman can follow the man What is masculine and what is feminine? You're asking me I'm just asking generally because what is masculine and what is feminine is mostly culturally defined Roger that uh from bubblegum gun for two dollars says at hunter Should discord mods be allowed to adopt? Uh depends on who the discord mod is most likely no and anybody with an anime profile picture They should be banned as well denied Daniel hackle for five dollars canadian says google mercury poisoning make birds homosexual If you want to understand this issue interesting, man They're turning the birds gay First the frogs now the birds the hermit kane awards for 199 hicks argument. It's icky What a genius Yeah, I mean, it's it's a legitimate argument honestly And everybody knows it No, it's it's uh I mean there is some feeling appealing to this feeling of disgust And then right that's what justifies you thinking it's morally wrong. I mean that is a delusional argument Well, the thing is the thing is you guys are kind of trying to steamroll and say this is right and we're gonna do it But this uh when you let evil out of the closet It just keeps on taking over and just starts oppressing that's the normal christian people the christians are having to go into the closet now Why is it that the christians usually are oppressing gay people? That's not that's not what's happening truly Really, then why is it that it's the other way around the white evangelical christians are the least accepting of gay people Even compared to american muslims and they're the most hated people in america the white evangelical christian men I think you would be quite surprised the amount of privilege that they benefit from in society The fact that their churches are tax-exempt There is quite a lot of privilege and benefits that they receive not to mention Rightly, so complaining not to mention if you want to start complaining about social hatred or whatever I don't think that argument holds up because there's also plenty of societal hatred directed at gay people Nobody should be hating. I agree with you there Rolling down the line from neon noir for five dollar five euros Uh animals also eat and hump all kinds of harmful things hunter. That doesn't make the behavior natural It just means they're animals acting on urges Uh, well the claim was not if an animal does this therefore it's natural It's the fact that there's over 1500 animal species that not only exhibit this behavior But do so for actual evolutionary reasons First thing the second thing would be even if it were actually unnatural in the sense that there was no way To see it in nature or demonstrate any evolutionary reason I would then say who gives a shit because actually what is and is not natural Doesn't determine whether or not something is morally right In fact, there's plenty of things that happen in nature that are not morally right There's also plenty of shit that we do as humans that doesn't happen in nature That is morally okay. For example pooping on the toilet most animals, you know, they're not really a big fan of that That's not very quote-unquote natural But it's just fine for humans to do it this idea that if something isn't natural therefore it's bad or if it is natural It's good. It doesn't really hold up. The reason I responded the way I did was because hate claimed It was unnatural and if we can witness it in thousands of animal species for actual evolutionary reasons The claim that is unnatural is not only a shit argument, but it actually doesn't even hold up Human beings should not act like undignified animals Well, hake, please take a word of your own advice Okay, thank you. I appreciate it No problem From Daniel hackle for five dollars canadian says Anyone else see the irony in all the people who blindly believe Scientism with the same faith. They mock the religious for for without deeper knowledge Knowing yeah, not not at all. Nope Obviously, I think when people are saying Scientism there they are referring to like this idea of blind following the sciences I know that people are obviously going to accuse me of being that person But that is not actually what I do. What I do is I look at actual research I try to find out what has been done. What is the overall consensus in this field? What is the what are the challenges to this? What is the opposing day to say and the reason these are not comparable at all is because One person has faith in something they cannot prove something that is completely unfalsifiable For example, God rose somebody from the dead. God exists. God made the earth things that you can simply never prove Whereas I believe scientific studies because they go through scientific methods and we're able to find Conclusive results that are actually tangible and applicable to the the circumstance that we're talking about So when people say that they're the same things, that's really just a complete lack of understanding in how science works You're talking about having studies that give you the best and the closest available answer to something or get you closer to truth Or you're talking about blind faith that there is some sky daddy who made a snake talk There is a there is an issue in society today both among the christians and the anti christians and non christians That people are relying on their intellect and their intellect is dark They don't really know what they're looking at and there has been a what I say is communist replacement of Looking to the the counselor the man the father the pastor for wisdom and leadership now they're going to academics and these fake sciences like psychology and psychiatry and all that mess And now we have atheism on the rise and it's atheism and the gaze all love to the atheists all love to the gaze and respect But it's it's arrogance And it's blindness and you guys are You guys are everybody is in darkness as the christians whom you hate I really don't mean this actually as a insult, but when you say that psychology is fake that's not only bullshit But I think that you would probably benefit greatly from going to a therapy session once or twice Again, I'm not saying that even as an as an insult I think you should put this delusional idea that that is somehow Fake behind you and go and seek out a therapist you can talk to a strong white christian man if you'd like but It might benefit you hake. Well, I appreciate the well wishes We should move on Let's go with dm for five dollars says hake saw your debate with stardust and it was a good watch Although we disagree on a lot. I think this topic would have been better debate with her Well, I appreciate it. I I like talking with hunter and uh And I liked talking with stardust nice Moving on from danie duncan for five dollars says hunter. Do you believe in a clear discernment of right and wrong? What is the difference between a human being and an animal? Um, well the difference between human being and an animal I would say is probably the fact that we tend to have a much higher level of consciousness and sentience Uh, but if we're going to go about about how we determine what is right and what is wrong I usually like to just start with the basics, which is does this result in harm to me? Does this result in harm to others and does this result in harm to general society? Obviously, if the general well-being of the public is not great That's going to have a wraparound effect and negatively impact me The reason that I have a big problem when people say it's wrong to be gay is that even if you want to appeal to the Bible even if you want to say that the bible is my moral foundation There are plenty of things that god said there that makes sense on the basis of Reducing harm thou shall not murder for example Obviously murder does harm not only to the person you're murdering But even to your own psychological well-being But then when we come to this issue of gay people Suddenly we have no evidence that being gay does any harm to anybody really and that and yet we have to fall back on Well, it's a sin because god says so and that's kind of where you lose me at the end of the day That and the slave versus Uh Okay from uh Lord divi 42 for ten dollars says hunter Hake has explained to you in common sense and logical terms Your argument is a projection of your own deep rooted failures that you haven't come to terms with yet Get a grip Um, wow for somebody who thinks that psychology is fake. They they really read me like a book I am definitely going to go seek help immediately. Thank you very much for that A kind caring and loving message And from lord divi 42 again for five dollars says hunter sex doesn't come from love Sex is to procreate. You're confusing love with lust easy to confuse when in a fallen state like yourself Uh, sure. So obviously the desire to have sex can come from lust But also you can have passionate and loving sex for those of all the virgins in chat who are unfamiliar with this idea Uh, it doesn't have to be one or the other and also no sex does not only exist to procreate If it did there would not be again a plethora of benefits for marriages that engage in regular sexual activity There would not be a lower likelihood of men having prostate cancer if they are regularly engaging in sex We would not see these types of benefits exist if the only thing it was for is reproduction Usually people that say that just have a repressed breeder fetish and uh, rather than just kind of accepting it. They would rather um, you know Project this basically and uh claim that everybody else who has sex To to not reproduce is somehow in the moral wrong And from danie duckin for five dollars says hunter does the moral compass slash lack of ever Come into folk comes into play for companies that find and report research statistical analysis data God bless you Um, I don't even know what that question means. Does the moral compass play a role in how they are Assessing their data. Was that what the question was? I'm pretty sure Um, I mean usually Yeah, usually like sciences and the scientific method is not looking to Disprove or demonstrate some level of morality They're usually just looking for how this thing affects another thing in the most reductionist terms here Obviously, you can gauge certain sciences to support your moral framework You can also use sciences to argue against it. Maybe but no science is not the exploration of morality But scientists do have an agenda and frequently they will try to make their Make themselves seem important So they'll get all excited if they get coverage in the media They will try to say that there's this crisis or that crisis to get funding from the government and all that stuff So there's definitely biases that naturally occur in sciences and especially when there's when there's Um, politically charged issues such as the one we're discussing Yeah, I mean, of course there can be biases that play a role That's why it's so important to have the peer review process And then that's why it's so important to have it on top of that meta analyses What a lot of people I think misunderstand is they think the science is Here's my research paper and then another dude looks at and says all right. I agree with that So therefore it's good. That's not actually the case What the sciences do is they then take a hypothesis and they attempt to Falsify it. They don't attempt to affirm it. They try to prove it wrong And then the more and more they fail at doing that the more that that hypothesis becomes more and more likely to be true Or at very least brings us closer to the truth So a lot of the times people just have a a misunderstanding of how the sciences work As far as biases go the only actual bias that i'm i'm aware of with certain research here is uh The study that said that kids raised by gay parents do badly the peer review process was completely fucked up in that study Gotcha from No, read that one already from robert summons for five dollars says hake Is there any singular argument that is a problem with homosexual parents adopting that is in no way A problem with straight parents um Yeah, um by definition The so-called gay couple Is is already starting off on the wrong foot most So-called straight parents are all messed up. They're gonna mess up the kids All gay parents are messed up and gonna mess up the kids So we're back to just blind assertions. This is like if somebody said hunter. Why is a ford better than a toyota car? Well, because all toyotas suck All toyotas are lame and they are going to crash and they're gonna blow up I don't have to give you any evidence my spirit guide inside of me said so Well, either you see the truth of what i'm saying or i'm not i'm not i'm trying to answer a question like you're saying You don't know that you're making an assertion without evidence. No, it's that you haven't demonstrated why I should believe you But then why are you making I don't have to demonstrate you're just making an assumption that i'm wrong We're in it. We're in a debate. I know but you're saying that i want to demonstrate your position You want to usually yes, I do know you're wrong because what you said is contradictory to the three decades of peer-reviewed research Yeah I know with the peer-reviewed research isn't looking at all this stuff and I would like to see what you're talking about Okay, and then we have another super chat from Robert summits for five dollars says I'm sorry you lead with an argument with you lead in you lead with an argument with I heard hake Hunter refutes the assertion and you ask him for studies Where are you your studies? I'm not into this study thing. I'm not into studies Um, I have some common sense. I have limited knowledge. I could gain some more now I could stand to gain some more knowledge. I I acknowledge I suppose But if I already know that something is wrong I'm not gonna I'm not that interested in Pretending like oh, this is right. I I can listen to things and find out. Oh, this there's some truth to this There's some truth to that like I've heard from hunter. I'm sure that some of this stuff There's some truth to it But I already know that it's wrong and so my point is to put out the truth as best I see it And I'm not into the studies thing. I'm kind of mocking hunter when I say, where's your studies because he's all into that I feel like hake and a lot of his uh, his inbred followers in the chat here would probably never apply this logic If it was something that they didn't agree with so for example If you were talking to like a blue haired crazy lib kuk who said white people are all sickening They're sick fucks. And then you said really why is that and you said? Well, I just know, you know, it's my common sense that white people are disgusting and they're bad I don't think that anybody would accept that for a good reason mind you because that's a shit argument Well, I mean you you can find wrong stuff in anybody for sure No, but what you're saying and appealing to common sense would not be uh accepted by you or your Followers or the people the inbred losers in the chat here if it were applied to something other than gay people I don't know why you're assuming that they're inbred, but they They can see what's what's true and what's not true. You're you're blind And you're referencing stuff. There may be some facts behind it, but you're you can't see the truth It's either you see or you don't yeah, and you just can't see the truth that white people suck All right, yeah, I mean The analogy falls apart as white whites are losing whites are losing our country and we are uh Majorly attacked so on some level there is truth to that Wow, okay Okay From black supreme kai for 499 says in all seriousness without saying I've heard What are some factual stats that you have including source? I'm not into the sources and stats. I I couldn't give you even one So I can I can only give you the I've heard Okay, and uh that will wrap up our super chats And uh that timer is inaccurate. Anyway, so I'm just gonna turn that crap off so With that I just want to mention we did do a poll in the in the chat a little earlier somebody asked Irish brazil asked Can we do a poll to see if there are any actual adoptive parents? And turns out there were only 3% of people watching that were adopted parents 29% were childless entirely 31% are biological parents and 34% answered one day maybe so Do you guys want to react to that at all? Yeah, we need to have more white babies and then white people will suck less Sorry kids. We atheists need to make more babies Thankfully, there's not really much to whether or not that we have more white people or more black people just Having a solid healthy population benefits all of us whether we're talking about the economy or just our general well-being. So Yeah, have more babies sure, but they don't necessarily have to be white babies certainly Well gentlemen, thank you so much for this uh riveting discussion. We're gonna go ahead and wrap it up now Hey, I believe you're gonna join me in a little bit about 15 20 minutes on my channel for an after show It's just linked in the description There's gonna be a after show on discord as well linked in the description also I want to thank the moderators in the chat. Thank you to james for creating this platform Thank you to everybody in the audience and everybody who sent in super chats and the moderators who helped elevate the discussion Thank you. Lastly to the the debaters who are the lifeblood of the show. You guys helped to make everything that this channel is Tell you let everybody know to like the video if you loved it Share it if you want to spread it and subscribe as we have many more juicy debates coming your way Our speakers are linked in the description below. So check out their links. Do it right now Thank you to everybody. I want you to have a great night and remember to keep sifting out the reasonable from the unreasonable Have a great night Thank you. All right. Thank you very much for hosting and uh, I'll hopefully be back another time. See you Take him in Bye. Bye