 Tim says, do companies still need a formal intranet? I haven't heard of people using SharePoint on its own for quite some time. Most SharePoint is more behind the scenes and teams. So what is the need for a standalone formal intranet? Well, first of all, I think it's funny because it's the background. People are starting to realize finally that SharePoint is behind teams. You know, because that was like the best for the longest time. Say it again, so. Yeah, it's like, what do you mean there's a whole SharePoint site behind the team? Like, yep, there is. But yeah, it's just one of the tools in the toolbox. So I just want to give Tim some kudos for understanding that that's the way it works, which is funny. I stopped adding it into presentations, but I would use like the marge with the palm olive. Like, you're already soaking in it, you know? I never use SharePoint. It's like, oh, yes, you do. Yes, you do. Your hands already said, I noticed my hands were so soft, covered in green slime, but soft. Yeah. How far back are you going, dude? I mean. Well, that's what I'm saying. I'm old. People don't remember that. I remember that. I'm on that vintage. I'm on that vintage. Yeah, well, I don't know. I could go on and on with this one, but I'll defer to the other masters in the room. I wouldn't say that. I think like half of us, you know, have presented on this which tool to use when topic. And this comes up all the time. I mean, I had somebody in a session that was giving at this event in the digital workplace conference down in Melbourne a couple of weeks back, somebody in the audience asked this during my session of similar question to this. I said, look, there, I still like, and I shared then the messaging that Microsoft did and they ditched it for a while, but I still use it, which is the inner loop, outer loop, you know, way of thinking about that. And so you think of, and, you know, there are organizations that have, need that formal structured site, which is where we keep our policies, our documentation. It's where our branding standards are, where I could go and find forms and process and all those things. That's that formal intranet. Teams, that's that outer loop. And even further outside of that loop is the, oh, I know, you guys playing the drinking game while I'm talking, but then you have Viva Engage or formerly known as Yammer, which is that broad outside where sometimes I, it's a, there's an idea. I'm looking for help and I don't, it's not a project. It's not a project or product team. It's not a specific group. I don't know where that input is gonna happen, but I know it's within the company. And so I want to create a community. I want to throw questions out there where I don't know where the answer is gonna come from. Then you have the inner loop, which is really the Microsoft Teams, where, look, this is my project team. The six of us are working on this project for this customer for the next six months, where day in, day out, we're sharing notes and having conversations and meetings. That's that inner loop. So that's how I explain that, is that some companies realize we don't need that formal structure and they operate entirely within teams and then do things in one drive, sharing of files that way. Others that need that, that rigor, that structure around the many different divisions to keep, you know. And so it is largely larger enterprises that need that, that have that difference where smaller, more agile companies, you're 50 people, you can probably, I would argue 50, you're starting to need an intranet, but 25 people, you can do things and live entirely within email and Teams. I would have to disagree with that. How many of you cringe when you walk into a client and they have one team for the entire company with a channel for each department? Cause now people are gonna get bombarded with the announcements and everything in Teams and then they're gonna tune it out like they've done their email cause they can't untune from the whole team. How do you disagree with what I said? Because I agree with you that that's horrible, that's where people are trying to use it as an intranet when it shouldn't be used that way. Because SharePoint has two primary purposes, communication and collaboration. So I work in the HR department. I'm not gonna give you access to my team where I have the employee manual. I'm gonna publish that out on a communication site where you can find the only copy. So even though it's a 25 person or less company, there's still a need. Here's where things are built, made and here's where things are published and shared, right? So, and you're not gonna send that out an email. I need them to be able to go find it and not where I have the gospel copy of it here, yeah. So I agree with everything you said. I don't think that changes what I said. You think, you said that people could work in Teams and email versus not having a SharePoint intranet. I think that they can. Okay. Depending on, again, depending on the size of structure, but that's why I said not 50 because even at 50 people in a company, you've got a lot of complexity. Size has nothing to do with the complexity of your collaboration and the environmental needs. There are small teams of, if you're a, you work for an MSP and there's 12 employees, you probably don't need to have that formal intranet. Yet, but as you start growing, then you're gonna wanna have that structure and that exact scenario that you said where it's the difference between what is bread that's being made versus baked and available for people to consume. Yeah, I want people to start with the right foundation and grow into it and grow from there, not start them out with bad habits and bad things. So I'm having that same thing with my son's business right now. They're like, we can do everything in teams. I'm like, no, not really. So we started talking through the why and there's only eight people in this company and they're like, oh yeah, okay, I see why because you don't wanna start them off with bad habits. Let's start off the right way. If we have the opportunity, let's build it the right way to begin with, right? You have to plan to scale. I've got a few different sessions, like you mentioned, Christian, that I do around this and 100% agree. You've got content that everybody in the company whether you're 10, 30, 50, 50,000, everyone needs access to and then you've got content where it's those individual work groups break down and they do that collaboration teams. By default, especially the bigger you get, you're gonna have more teams than just standalone SharePoint sites. Absolutely, 100%, but the phrases I tend to use is like teams is your company public, right? There's no such thing as public team SharePoint sites anymore but it's your company public. Maybe if you're small, share your son's business, maybe they just have one SharePoint site right now and they organize it by library. Okay, it's easy to scale that out when the time comes but everyone's got the access they need. I'm not saying everyone can edit and create an app, right? But then teams becomes that department, project or group, private side. I still consider that part of your intranet but it's your true collaboration, communication, SharePoints you're publishing to use the old school SharePoint word, right? So you all need, everyone needs access to it. Everyone goes to the intranet. It doesn't have to be formal or rigid but it's just out there, we can get to it and then we do all the, like you said, the gospel versions and stuff kind of behind the scenes. I'm just curious about why he asks, he says, I haven't heard of people using SharePoint on it so for some time. I know, I know, I lost it. What does he hang out with that he hasn't heard of? That's not something I normally have. He hang out with us, yeah. How's your SharePoint usage going? So I just think it's funny. The cool kids do. Because it used to be the SharePoint was like just such a bad name and I would get called in to make SharePoint something good that maybe I'm kind of wondering and I'm from a philosophical level and a marketing level. First of all, Teams definitely has dominated the airwaves around marketing. But second of all, like think about it this way. I think Microsoft has massively improved SharePoint in the modern, in all the modern stuff that they've done to a point that we've got comment that people are not hearing about SharePoint. I almost wonder if that's a good thing. Right. Stop calling my baby ugly. She's a pretty baby now. She's so pretty. But that's so much, you look at the, so here's kind of a broader look at those that, this makes sense for people that have been in this community for a few years. 10 years ago, when we were still, everything was on premises. All the conversations were around keeping the servers up and healthy and running and performing and all kind of all the, sorry, Microsoft made up word, performant. To keep everything running. And you don't hear those about those kinds of sessions. Now it's evolved into the services side as everything moved into the cloud. But what you had then where organizations were like, you know, we've got it, it's running and it's healthy and it's working. And now it's about scalability. Now it's about adoption. Now it's about architecture, design. Right. Am I efficiently, I'm automating everything. And so we have the luxury of moving away from those conversations. And I think that's to this point, we're not hearing the word SharePoint because it's just working behind the scenes now. It's just running. But the, I don't know what the latest data is like the last six months. I think it was in November where Tepr even announced, it mentioned this at ESPC, like the number of net new SharePoint sites, it's still growing. Like it's not hockey stick growing. I'm talking about independent of teams. Right. You know, like SharePoint is still, people are still going out there and deploying. We still stand up intranets all day long for new clients. I mean, we, and in fact, in fact to some degree, I have a whole session around, you know, all basically starting with teams. Many people start with teams because they need a communication solution. They need a collaboration solution. And then they come back to us and they say, well, we have teams, but it can't do all these other things, right? Like we talked about, like what Sherry just said, there's things that are missing. And so we have clients day in, day out that we are architecting and designing and creating and building intranets for because there is still that need for all those things that don't exist out of the box immediately in teams. That's what teams are built for. Sharpest tool for the job, people. Use the sharpest tool, the best tool. That's why, and I've shared this many times before, but those of us that were in the room years, a few years back, what five years ago, whenever it was when they announced that we were at the MVP summit in Seattle and you had about a couple hundred MVPs that were sitting in a room, ready for the latest updates about Microsoft Teams is relatively new thing. I think it'd been out generally available for about a year, year, year and a half, whatever it was. Announcing that they were making the all company teams, rooms, teams, a thing. It's like they were all excited about it. And the room booze across the board. People were like, you just broke what teams? Like, that doesn't make sense. That's called an intranet. Like, that's not the use case for teams. But it's one of those things where, sorry, I know I'm going sideways on this, but it's one of the things that very large customers were like, no, no, we want it. We want this thing. And it's part of what's caused the confusion here. And so again, that's why I go back to the inner loop, outer loop. I said it's, can you have 5,000? I don't know what the upper limit now is on a team. Can I have 5,000 or? Should you? 5,000, whatever. Right. Like, yes you can. And those are the ones that I as an employee never go into those rooms. They're just useless. It's noise. It's just. Inner behind. I'm sorry to say that there's a lot of, on the community hub, or that the community site for Microsoft, a lot of places, I just never go into them because it's just so much. And it's just useless to me. Yeah. That's what yammers for. All that banter. That's what yammers for. It's not teams. Teams is supposed to be productivity. This is what alerts and notifications are for guys. Like, if you think about this in any social media aspect, we do not look at every post on the interwebs. Nobody can read them all. I know, I think I've seen people try, but you can't. This is what, this is what curating your feed is all about. If you architect things correctly, you have two issues. One is permissions and two is notifications. If permissions are set up properly and your notifications and feed is curated properly, the rest doesn't matter. I'm talking about Marca. Reach my sister. Yes. I'm in collaboration architecture. For the win. Yes. Yes. Tan, you open up a can of worms, buddy. You're so passionate. I'm sorry. I heard the word yammer and I threw up a little bit in my mouth. Engage. It's not a yammer anymore. It's an engage now. Yeah, it's an engage. Yeah. Engage. No more yammer? No, it's gone. It's been rebranded. It's part, it's Viva Engage now. Oh, okay. Yammer. I have the vintage. I have the vintage. I love this rebrand. I love this rebrand.