 Okay, let's get started. Thank you for your patience here. We had a few technological problems here. Let's get going and talk about landscaping in shady areas. And most of us do have shady areas in our home landscape. Maybe it's near building or underneath the tree. These areas do require special planning, but with the right touch, we can add some fascinating foliage and also some wonderful shades of color, excused upon with the shade. And here to talk to us and share with us, her tips on landscaping in shady areas is Esther McGinnis. She is an extension horticulturist for NDSU. Esther, welcome to the forums. Thank you very much. So thank you, Tom. And I have to admit, this is a little bit of a personal journey for me. Now I've spent the last three and a half, actually four years here in North Dakota, getting settled into my job. So it's finally time for me to devote a little bit of time to my own garden. So some of this is a personal journey. So I have the north side of my house to landscape. So we're getting quite a bit of shade, actually deep shade to light shade. So here are some of the design tips that I'm thinking. Oops, here we go. Okay, but the first thing to keep in mind is that gardening in full sun is a different beast than gardening in the shade. I would argue that gardening in full sun is a little bit easier. You could just select perennials that provide this riot of color and you don't have to think as much about the details. But the same is not true for a shade garden. So shade gardening is more sophisticated because you have to think about the nuances. How do you add interest in the shade? You do it by looking at contrast. So we're gonna talk about three kinds of contrasts, color contrasts, texture and form. So first it's color. So making the shade just light up. You can do that with foliage plants like the coleus and that Persian shield that is just peeking out from under that hosta. But you can also do so with flowering plants too. Texture, I would argue that texture is the most important of the three. Now you're looking at this picture and you'll notice not a whole lot of color, just kind of some blues and greens here, but it's still very much alive. It's very vibrant scene and that's because of the texture. We have a contrast between fine and coarse. The fine texture is represented by the fern on the left-hand side and that nicely contrasts with the coarse texture of the hosta. You'll see the hosta has that really large leaf and then if you look up in the background, we've got a Boston ivy with those three lobes on the leaves but it gives it a wavy effect. So even without much color, we have a lot of interest in this photo thanks to texture. And then form. Form is how your eye is drawn through this picture. So creeping ground covers would draw your eye horizontally. Hostas and other mounting plants give it kind of a rounded pleasing form. And then there are other plants that will draw the eye upwards. So more of a vertical emphasis like the ligularia in this picture. First, let's talk about color. When I'm gonna talk about a color, that is not on the color wheel. And that is white. So white is a color without hue and I would argue that green and white contrast are some of the most beautiful contrasts that you'll see in the shade garden. So this happens to be a photo from Clemens and Munsinger Gardens in St. Cloud, Minnesota. Now, if you're on your way to the Twin Cities and have a couple of hours, I would advise to stop and see these beautiful public gardens. You'll take your lunch and wander through them. But this is the all-white garden and take a look at this picture. Now, what draws your eye in this picture? Now, arguably it's the Annabelle Hydrangea. So Annabelle Hydrangeas are the star of white gardens. They're suitably hardy for North Dakota, being zone three hardy, great in part sun to part shade, so very adaptable. But there's one flaw about the Annabelle Hydrangea that I would argue. So I have a little bit of a love-hate relationship with Annabelle Hydrangea. Love the big balls of flowers. But I hate the fact that it lodges. It falls over, those stems just cannot support those big balls of flower. So thankfully there's a new cultivar on the market. I think it's been on the market probably about five years or so called Incredible. And fortunately, this is better than the species. It's been bred to have a bigger ball of flowers, but at the same time it has a really stiff, sturdy stem so it's less likely to flop. So that's the first thing that I'm gonna put into my new garden. Now, other plants that give you that beautiful green and white color combination would be variegated Solomon seal. So this was the 2013 perennial plant of the year. Now hopefully you've heard of the perennial plant association, they name one plant every year. And it has to be a plant that's not a pre-medonna. It has to be a plant that survives through most of the country, it's low maintenance and is usually resistant to different pests and diseases. So variegated Solomon seal fits the bill and was chosen in 2013. Now take a look at this close up. It almost looked like an artist took a paintbrush and just outlined the margins of the leaves. There are no two leaves that are the same. And I took this picture right after a May rainstorm so you could see the raindrops just hanging off of those white flowers that bell shaped and eventually they'll ripen into berries that are blue. Now if you have kids, you may wanna cut off the berries because the berries can be a little toxic, but if you're not worried because you don't have kids at home, then allow the berries to ripen because that does add a little bit of color. So variegated Solomon seal. It does spread a little bit by rhizomes but it's not bad at all, easily maintained. Brunera macrophila sea heart. So this is a newer cultivar or brunera that's been on the market for a little bit of time. And this just glows in the shade. It lights up the shade with silvery leaves. So this is really good in part shade. Now you don't wanna have too much sun exposure on this because it will burn the leaves but it's great in part shade. Now I have zone four with the question mark and the question mark indicates that we're not quite sure how far north we can go in North Dakota. I've seen it growing successfully in Bismarck and in Fargo, but we don't know how far we can push it. Now if you're living north of I-94 you may wanna consider mulching it until you start to figure out how hardy is this plant for you. What I love about it are the flowers. So this happens to be a seedling but it would have the same flowers. They're just sky blue, just a wonderful welcome to spring and it blooms in May. Now you don't have to just plant perennials. There are annuals that can certainly supplement the perennials in your garden. So this is polka dot plant. This is a plant that's been around for a while and it does come in other colors but this one has that nice white appearance to it. So very economical to plant. You can buy a four pack and purchase quite a few of them and they'll form a nice kind of ground cover for you. So on with the green and white theme of course, hostas. So I'm not gonna talk about all the different hosta cultivars. I would bet that there are people in this audience that have way more expertise than I do about hosta cultivars. I'm sure there are lots of you that collect them. What I'm gonna talk about is variegation. So you have all different kinds of variegation with hostas. You've got Vulcan on the left which has that beautiful splotch right in the center of the leaf and then on the right hand side you have El Nino which has a blue relief with white variegation on the edge. You know, there are all sorts of hostas with different kinds of variegation but I would tell you to use variegation sparingly. Now if you look at this photo, you have more of the plain green and blue hostas and then you have the variegated in the middle and that just provides interest. Now don't overuse variegation. I used to drive by this driveway that had variegated hostas lining both sides and it was too much. It was just too busy. So use variegation sparingly to inject energy into it. And I would argue this is too much variegation. To me this is just too busy. For me when I plan a shade garden I think it has to have a little bit of a serene nature to it. I think shade gardens are pretty much a sanctuary for us. So using too much variegation detracts from that. Now going on to some serious color. So here we have some colias and some orange inpatients. Now these are colors that I was told as a child never to use together. Never use orange, never use pink together. But I tell you, all the landskeepers are using this in a color combination now because it is so vibrant, so much energy. Now we'll first talk about foliage plants that inject color into your landscape and then we'll switch to the flowers. So colladiums are hot. They're really hot. There's been a lot of breeding lately. Some people call these elephant ears but there's so many different colors that you can buy. So this will take part sun to part shade. So quite adaptable as far as sun requirements. Well part sun being like six hours, part shade being about four hours of sun. But the important thing you remember with colladiums is that it's very much a warm season annual for us. It doesn't like temperatures below 60 degrees. So wait till June to put it out. Bring it into the garage or into the house if you have it in a pot and then plant it in June. And then it's really gonna thrive during the heat of the summer. And remember it also grows from the tuber. Those tubers will rot if you put it in standing water or saturated soils. So plant it in a well-drained area. And of course if we're talking foliage plants we have to talk about coleus. Coleus is changed. So don't just assume that you can really nearly buy coleus and put it in your shade garden. There are sun tolerant coleus cultivars and then they're also shade tolerant. So read the label. Very important to see just where does it fit within your landscape and then select accordingly. But you're gonna see that there are some really strange coleus out there. Hortkuture is leading the way with a series called coleus under the sea. And everything in the coleus under the sea resembles some sea creature. So I swear these are all mutant coleus. This one is supposed to look like seaweed. There's another one out there called lime shrimp. So Google it, it's just kind of fun. So you're gonna start to see more of these mutant type coleus. So you may be asking why do I want this in my garden? It's for those gardeners that always have to have something new and novel. You want your neighbors to come over and ask what is that? Well, this certainly fits the bill. More traditional coleus would be like hurricane Jenny here. And the contrast just within this one plant are just amazing to have the chartreuse in the interior and then burgundy and then lined again with a little bit of chartreuse. Just stunningly beautiful. And then my old favorite is fishnet stockings. You gotta like the name. But this is truly just a beautiful coleus. You have a green leaf and then each vein is outlined in burgundy. It's just very uniform and very beautiful. Now this one can take a little bit more sun. But this has been around for quite a few years but it's still one of my favorites. And then here we have coleus paired with a dragon winged begonia. So everybody thinks that okay, if I have a dragon winged begonia, I have to put it in a hanging basket. Well, it does look beautiful in a hanging basket but you could certainly also plant it in the landscape. So here you can see how beautiful it is. And it would definitely look better more towards the front of that landscape. Whoops. Here we go. Okay, hukera. All right, so we can't talk foliage plants without talking about hukera. So hukera is kind of borderline hearty for us. And that's where we come in. So I'm trying to kill plants so you don't have to waste your money. So we are researching hukera hardiness in Fargo, in Absaraka and Williston. The problem with hukera is frost heaving. So we're trying to see which one survived. Now unfortunately, I don't have shade environments in which to test them. So they really get to work out there in full sun. Now we'll be collecting our second year's worth of data here this spring. But I can tell you off the bat, the one that I like so far is Midnight Rose is a burgundy leaf with splotches of pink on it. And unfortunately, this photo just doesn't do it justice. But this one did well for us during the first year of the trial. All right, switching over to flowers from foliage plants, Brawalia or Amethyst flower. So this can inject some purple into your landscape. Amethyst flower is underutilized. I see it sold, but I see so few people planting it. This'll take part shade to really even deep shade. So something fun to plant along with your hospice and other perennials. Terrania or wishbone flower. Now this is one of my favorites. I just usually buy the ground cover kinds. Now there are others that are more of a binding that you would use in a hanging basket. But I just buy the ones that come in the four or the six pack and they do really nicely. And I use them like other people would use standard impatience. I plant a ton of them so they look like a colorful ground cover. So this'll take part shade to pretty deep shade, but it needs to have evenly moist soil. So you do have to irrigate this one. So here we've got standard impatience. Used to be the number two bedding plant in the country, but we're seeing that its popularity is diminished because of disease issues. Some of you may have encountered impatience downy mildew and your extension agents most likely have a publication in their offices on it. So standard impatience and balsam impatience subject to impatience downy mildew. So we're seeing more people switching to resistance species like New Guinea impatience or planting the sunpatient series, which is a hybrid or bounce or big bounce impatience. Now they are resistant to impatience downy mildew. So here we have nice color contrasts going on with the reds, the reds are white elissums, begonia and then of course the spike. And then don't forget salveas. So most people think oh salveas have to be full sun and that's true for most of the salveas. The exception would be salveas splendens. Here you see it's thriving in an environment with the ferns growing in part shade to full sun. And then we have begonia bolivianzas, my favorite hanging basket type of plant. Begonia bolivianzas has more of these strapped like flowers and foliage. All right, so I better get on to texture here. So it's contrasting coarse and fine textures to provide that interest. Japanese painted fern. So the ferns can really provide that fine texture when it's contrasted with something with a thicker leaf. So Japanese painted fern also has colors. So it has silvers and blues in it and then the veins are usually a little bit on the red side. This will take part to full shade in zone four. It does like rich hemacy soils. Onocleus and sydillus are sensitive fern. Consider planting natives. This is a native fern, native to North Dakota. Now we frequently find these in marshes but I'm seeing landscape designers putting these into regular garden landscapes as long as they're irrigated and in deep shade they do quite nicely. But this has a completely different texture, the texture being coarser than the Japanese painted fern. And Virginia. Virginia has a coarse texture more like what you would find with a hosta. This has kind of a funny name. It's called Pipsqueak. Makes a sound when you rub your hand on the foliage. But this is pretty much a three season plant for us. You get your pink flowers in the spring. You get the beautiful foliage through summer and then in the fall, you'll see red coloration. So an actual perennial that'll color up in the fall. My favorite of the coarse textured plants would be Britmary Crawford, which is a ligularia. It has those beautiful purple leaves along with wine red stems. Just adds a really deep element to the garden. For a finer texture, we have Master Ward here related to the carrots, actually. It's in the APACA family. But here you see the finely dissected foliage with the dainty flowers. And then don't forget grasses. So I tell people ornamental grasses are for full sun, but this is the exception. Tufted hairgrass you can take into part shade and it will do quite nicely. It's a cool season grass, so it'll start blooming in June. So you'll have seed heads quite early in the season. All right, I better zoom into form. So with form, we're talking about how the eye is drawn through the garden. Now, I've shown you a lot of plants that are mounding or ground cover-like. So we're gonna focus on adding verticality in the garden, like with the rocket. So the rocket has those beautiful yellow spires of flowers. So they draw the eye upward. A nice compliment to all the other more mounding types of plants. So the rocket, this is a little bit of a trickier plant. I'm not gonna lie to you about it. You need to have part to full shade because this plant will wilt if it's getting too much sun. It does need evenly moist soils. I mean, the joke about this plant is it'll wilt even if it's growing in a bog. So a little bit more care is required to keep this looking healthy. But it does wilt a little bit, just physiologically speaking, but it does perk up at night. Now, if that wilting turns you off, there are newer cultivars, bottle rocket and little rocket. They're a little less maintenance and then of course they're more compact as our yards are shrinking. Couple more plants to draw the eye upward. We have the liktrum. So this is an unusual one. This is gonna add a lot of height to your shade garden. So with the liktrum, it's gonna be four or five feet tall and it's gonna have dainty foliage because it's related to Columbine. So take a look at that foliage and then it's gonna have these spring pink types of flowers but it's blooming in mid-summer. So something very different that can tower above your hostas and add that to verticality. And then don't forget the still bees. There are more and more still bees on the market, all sorts of cultivars. Just remember these really do need a fair amount of shade and moist soils and they'll reward you with beautiful blooms, with these beautiful spires on them. You see how this contrasts very nicely with the round shape of the Annabelle hydrangea in the back. So remember as you're planting your garden, think about contrasting colors and textures in form to add interest in the shade. One last tip, think about planting in mass. Not one plant here and another species there. Think in threes, think in multiples. So three is a minimum and that will just bring a sense of cohesiveness to the garden, adding some rhythm to it. So I hope that this has helped you as you plan your shade garden, happy gardening. Great, thank you, Esther. Oh, they're beautiful shady areas, my goodness. Okay, we got a few questions here and we invite more questions from the audience. How about you showed Solomon seal. Is that the same as Lily of the Valley? No, it is not. Solomon seal is Polygonautum and it's gonna be the different genus than Lily of the Valley. Lily of the Valley is invasive. It will just spread and take over. Solomon seal is completely different. It will spread just a little bit but you can keep it in check. It doesn't have the aggressive tendencies of Lily of the Valley. And it's going to be a little bit taller more like 18 to 24 inches. Okay, how about when you landscape under trees, you have to worry about keeping the soil too wet to maintain your shady perennials, for example. Yes, yes, I do worry about that. First of all, it's a tough environment for the perennials because they're competing with the roots of the trees. So then people overcompensate by overwatering which then starts to suffocate the tree roots. So I tell people to tread lightly when they are around the tree roots. I don't like to see too many plants too close to the tree roots. Okay, how many tips on how do you go about planting under a tree? Well, the first thing is don't add extra soil because we don't want you to smother those tree roots. But the further out you can go, the better it is and the more likely that you will have better luck. So not right up against the trunk either. I mean, so come out a little ways and then dig around a little bit, see where the roots are. You don't want to be disturbing that and you don't want to be adding soil because when you add soil, you are smothering the tree roots. So I really don't want to see too many flowers around the base of the tree. Just come out of ways. Okay, good. Do you have any opinions on goat's beard? Goat's beard, a ronkis I think. So goat's beard, that's another nice one and it has kind of a similar appearance to still be. So that's another good one to add. I only had 20 minutes. I couldn't. That's my fault. Sorry. So you can blame Tom for only giving me 20 minutes. I totally can't ask you that. How about, is there an ivy that will grow in shade in North Dakota? Well, there was that Boston ivy. So parthenicis is a tricuspidota will grow in shade. Now be a little careful because it will cement itself to brick surfaces and once it does so, you're not going to be able to get it off. So that's definitely one that you can grow a little bit in shade. Okay, here's a plant for you. Never heard of, I've never heard of. So please, I hope you have. How about Simicafuga, C-I-M-I-C, got it? Yes, yes, black cohosh, Simicafuga. Black cohosh. That's a great one for verticality. So that has those white spires, four to five feet tall with marine foliage. I think that's going to be more of a zone four, but that is another one that adds that sense of height. So I like that one too. I had that one when I was living in Minnesota. So, okay, sorry again, it was my fault. I limited all the slides here tonight. So we can have a landscaping session later if you want to talk more about this. How about some in seal? Do those berries make a mess in the yard? I don't think the berries make a mess in the yard, but if you're worried, after it blooms, you can cut them off, but I never had a problem. They just kind of stayed there. But when my daughter was younger and I was worried about her wandering in the garden and putting something in her mouth, I did clip off the berries because they're a little on the toxic side. I don't know how toxic, but I didn't want to take the chance. How about anemone? Do you know what growing zones recommended for that? They're different kinds of anemone. My favorite one, anemone hybrid up, robustosema is my favorite cultivar. That is a zone four. Although I've heard people push it into zone three. It's a fall blooming anemone that has pink flowers and the leaves are kind of, look like a grape leaf with the silvery underside. Love it. I just planted that one last fall. Great. Okay. Another one you said you like is incredible hydrangea. Now, are those blooms as white as those of Annabelle hydrangea? You know, I guess I haven't. Look that closely to see if they're more beige as opposed to white. You know, I really don't know for sure. Okay. How about in catalogs, you see some of them see parts shade, full shade, parts sun. Like, can you define how many hours of sun and shade are we talking about or morning versus afternoon? Great question. So let's start off with, which is kind of full shade would be two hours of sunlight. Part shade would be about four hours. Part sun would be six hours of light and then full sun would be eight or more hours of light. Okay. How about that anemone you said really interesting somebody, what was that favorite cultivar again you mentioned? Robustosema. R-O-B-U-S-T-I-S-S-I-M-A. Okay. There are newer ones on the market. I think. Is that the species name? That is the cultivar. That's the cultivar. I think it might be anemone X hybrid. So it might be an interspecific hybrid. Wow. I'm sure if we just Google robustosema anemone that they'll get you in the right direction. Any other questions out there? There's a general question about gardening under a tree. Any special considerations? That's a hard question. It's a hard one. So I'll tell you what, I have planted under trees that has been okay. Now this is not gonna be a flop. This is not about the flowers. There are some people that want to have a ground cover that will work under the shade of trees. So I'd recommend something called Pennsylvania sedge or Carrick's Pencilvanica is a ground cover. Now this is gonna look more like a grass. And that I have grown successfully under tall pine trees. It's done well in that dry shady area. But then of course these are areas where the grass won't grow because it's too shady. This happens to be a forest sedge. So it's used to taking kind of that shady environment. So I've planted that under maple trees. I've planted it under pine trees and it's done really well in that dry shady area. We have a few questions on hostas. There's a comment that they think hostas like an acidic soil. Is that true? Well, now hostas are originally native to Japanese forest. Maybe they come from an acidic soil, but they are very much very well adapted to North Dakota. Cause I mean, we grow them everywhere. We grow them in soils that are eight and above and they do just fine. So I've never seen a nutrient deficiency in a hosta. Yeah, they're very almost indestructible. Except for sometimes somebody says somebody's eating their hosta. You know what that could be? Not somebody, I should say. That would be taxing, hungry neighbor. No slugs, you're talking slugs. Okay, what can we do about those slugs? Well, they're different measures that you can take. The first thing is how first cleaning up the debris under the hostas or other shade plants. So good hygiene goes a long way. So you're removing the dead foliage. The next line of defense, I mean you can certainly sprinkle some diatomaceous earth. So these are little marine diatoms. It's their skeletons full of silicon and it will actually tear the bodies of those slugs as they crawl across the diatomaceous earth. But it only works as long as that diatomaceous earth remains dry. So if you're getting a lot of rain, what do you do? There's some people that are talking about using copper, copper strips around their plants. Now I've never tried that, but it's something I've started reading about. And the other thing would be chemical. There's an iron phosphate product, actually a couple of them, called escargot and sluggo, that tend to be a little less toxic than our older pesticide, which was made from Matteldehyde. So how did you know that answer when you haven't had a slug question for six months? Well, you're already in your summer form already, Esther. Can't believe it. You're naming the products just like that. It just grows as thawing. You're ready for those garden questions, aren't you? How about, how about, where do you get all these wonderful plants from like when it's six? What do you know, like, do you have any, how would you go about it? Is there a certain nursery you're on the state that would have them or go online or do you have any advice for that? I have to admit, I have a good job because I get to travel around the state and I get to visit nurseries too. So I pick up nurseries all around the state, but I'm not shy about ordering online. I'll order plants online too. But I do like to try and visit my local garden centers, particularly the independent garden centers. I do like to give them my business because I want them to be around when I need them. Okay. How about, do you have a favorite type of mulch? Well, you're going to laugh at me, Tom. Well, it won't be the first time. My old favorite, I'll tell you my old favorite mulch, which I could get away with in the Twin Cities was the Cocoa Bean Mulch. We did not have the wind that we have here in North Dakota, so it didn't blow away. It just helped enrich the soil or it'd break down every year. And I tell you, it would attract kids like you wouldn't believe. You'd start spreading this around. It smells like chocolate and all the neighborhood kids would show up. But that doesn't work as well unless you're in a shaded, I mean, unless you're in a sheltered area. So I'm back to using wood mulch now, so it won't blow away. So why do I like kids? Did they help you pull weeds or something? Where are you tracking kids for? I tried, I really tried. I felt very fat again. How about, do these type of gardens work when they're planted into spruce tree needles under a spruce tree? So I would say no. I wouldn't do it right under a spruce tree. You wanna go out beyond the drip line because it's just gonna be too shady and you're not gonna be able to see it. Now, of course, there are some of you that have limbed up your spruce trees. I mean, that's a little bit different. But keep in mind, that's a really tough, competitive environment under those spruce trees. They're really sucking up a lot of water. So the further you can come out, the better. I mean, you can still have the shade from the spruce trees, but I wouldn't plant too close to the base of it. Okay, that's excellent. Any last questions out there in the counties? Okay. Being none, Esther, thank you for that. Wonderful talk. It's so beautiful. You're in the shady area. There's so much hope for shaded areas now. Thank you, appreciate it. Thank you very much. Okay. We're gonna take a five minute break and then we're gonna start learning about attracting butterflies, everybody. So take a quick break.