 Now the floor is open and we can collect questions and also the comments are most welcome as well. Oh, yeah, we have one gentleman over there and we may collect some you know around five questions and we may invite the speakers to rest the pond. So please identify yourself and then to be short about your questions. I'll do my best. My name is Adam Schlosser. I'm from MIT. Thank you all the three speakers for your talks. I thought that we're very stimulating and hopefully my question is a synthesis of all of your points and that is what struck me with the first talk was the statistic that 80% of our greenhouse gas emissions come from cities and that we do have an opportunity to think about this not just in terms of greenhouse gases but co-benefits and then the third speaker talked about in particular different forms if you will of cities and my question is this a City in and of itself is going to have millions and millions of people together. There's no way that we can really avoid the fact that they're they're going to produce greenhouse gases both directly and indirectly and my question is is from that 80% how much can you envision that being reduced by all these different forms of cities that you're proposing and Perhaps maybe another way of looking at this is not just the reduction of greenhouse gases But also the co-benefits how much do we even think is going to reduce just the health effects with the new structures of these cities? That's a very Reading the question and now we have All the lady in front Thank you so much and all the three presentations were very interesting I'm Brinda Vishwanathan from a Dr. School of Economics Chennai My question is directly to Jose When you're talking about co-benefits in terms of the cities, I think that the issue of poverty doesn't come up Quite effectively and I think the two of the examples that you were talking of yoga Karthi and Delhi There are also issues of you know very specific things like solar rickshaws and things like that which have Co-benefits of a very different kind a sense that you provide employment to the poor and you also think of options that are Also sort of more green, but they might be short term But why aren't these also being considered as part of the development process and here? You also have green buildings and things like that which have which also address issues of housing Urban housing in the sense of the for the poor people so but I don't see that come through in in some of your Discussions that you're making and what could be the reason for that. Thank you. Okay. Thank you I think that the poverty has to be Yeah, the gentleman over there Thank you so much for all your interesting presentations are three of you. I have a specific query to mr. Joe's You talked about co-benefits That essentially means that you do some activity and try to reap another benefit or to fit My question is unless you quantify and make it tangible the benefit won't remain a benefit for it for the city government For example, you derive Ghez Mitigation as co-benefit out of a transportation activity in your city Unless you get a kind of tangible benefit out of it the co-benefit would not remain a benefit for the city They won't get benefited otherwise example So it could be a CDM project coming out of An initiator which is not aimed at greenhouse gas mitigation That could be a straight and simple answer But do you find any other tangible co-benefits or the mechanism to convert the corn co-benefits into tangible entity? In any city so far. Thank you Very good question materialize co-benefits. He's also a challenge. Okay, the lady in front and then we go to the back Hi, I'm Rianti from Indonesia I have I think a similar a simultaneous question for the first and third speakers. I Think my first point to the first speaker is that I Understand the World Bank program for mitigation and adaptation adaptation at serious level but Sometimes based on your presentation. I just don't see I Mean like when you when you put them the program as sustainable cities But if you look at cities in poor or developing countries, some of the cities are just They're their emission their emission level is just so low. So why would you spend efforts on? measuring them or In the first place and then also it comes on the opposite side to the third speaker I mean all your examples there were very encouraging, but I didn't see Can you please elaborate more on how you can see this these? Innovations or can be applied in poor or developing countries because all your examples there were are Like some of I mean are done in in developed countries. So thank you And that's that's good and so yes, we have the the lady here Here thank you, sir Thank you for those stimulating sessions. My comment is on Mr. Wang's paper The the urban forms you proposed the compact city We've come to see really that's a theoretical thing Though maybe it could be walkable in some sense, but once the city has developed once it's emerged There really is no way to make it compact again except maybe by by by reducing Distances travel to probably to transport and things like that, but you know making it compact in the real sense of Physically may not be walkable, but the activities in the city, you know can be tamed down or Let me see they can be more efficiently performed and that is what really can make the city compact Thank you Good. We can get a one or more two questions then we Asked the Speakers to respond. I think this is a very good question, you know for building you can retrofit But the four cities we cannot that easy to get them retrofated. So yes, please Thanks very much for your presentation. Yeah adaptation and mitigation is are very important to the city's development development, but I Think in in person the adaptation may be more important to us to cope with the cope with the climate change, but We know that there are many different difference many benefits we can from this measures adapted to cities, but How should we consider the cost of these measures? I think it may be the cost will be higher than the benefits you Mentioned on on the city's development. So I my question is how should we Consider the coasts of these adaptations or how should we balance this coasts under the benefits of this adaptation? Okay, thank you. Thank you. I think that you know urban resilience is Very much a key issue. We have to pay attention to I think we should stop here for the questions And we've got six minutes and the each year typical you are you are allocated two minutes each to Respond some you know 10 questions as a result So I do not have to repeat in the interest of time so you may you know select the questions you want to respond and of course, you know the Power point of slides will be made available to everybody and of course during lunchtime. We can have Discussion as well. So the floor is yours. I think that you know we may Go and you know the order in in reverse. So Mr. Wang you come first and then we may ask Marcus and then you are the last I Will answer thank you very much and all the question is very interesting and great for our studies and I would explain about the how the This kind of innovations in Implied in our developing countries and especially for some poor countries. I think it's quite difficult called urban planning is a compromising Development policy in all all worldwide. We cannot answer all the package of the problems in in One time because if we do have the urban area and all the people will criticize about the how we do have data Well, we got money and if the urban Planning is suitable for this area. So for developing countries, we need to choose So we for us we should see first thing out about how we have what's the Local results we have and what's the local conditions for example the culture the history and Natural resource and then think about the urban policy If this is a poor country like a poor city, there must not so much private cost and We can benefit from built more neighborhood like the car free neighborhood. It's not It's expensive thing and it's quite practical practical for example, and then I will answer about the question and The different kind of urban forms It's how it can be implied to balance in the different aspects like you know more economical social and the Environmental protection, I think urban planning and the German policy is a complex and uncertain and We need to when our urban planners do a planning work. We need to consider so much not only the Future but also today and it is not a one solution And we need to consider so much from different aspect I think we need to think out How it's some sample form we need to We need to consider first what's the society structures or the cities and the economical conditions and then we should think about a practical solution and Environmental quality is very important. It should be combat combined with other to expect but The other two is to consider first for example, we have the power to operate this policy and then we can operate but not we see we imply so much innovations like the Public transportation we built a lot of road road in the we want to build in our urban planning, but we Where are we good money? So we need to consider our economic conditions and the social conditions first Thanks. I think I'll maybe speak to the first question First which was I think if I understood it correctly well, how much can we really expect to reduce in particular through actions and cities One thing I didn't mention earlier in my presentation was If you and coming up to that up to 80% figure attributable to the residents of cities If you look at some of the work for example from a new Ramaswamy and others who tried to put in all of the embodied emissions What we've seen is that the per capita emissions of cities are actually as high or almost as high as the national emissions Once you put all of the embodied emissions And again, that's not surprising because of all the active economic activity and consumption which goes on in cities So to my mind The the solutions still need to be concerted global and across all of the sectors energy agriculture You know so and so on and so forth, but I think the point is this and when you look at organizations like a clay C40 cities so and so forth is The it's also just part of the motivation for action with the city saying, you know We'll take action now even if for example in the international negotiations. We're stuck We can undertake Measures and coming back to the efficiency point and these are things we can do today in our city with the decisions that we take And these are consumption decisions with you know, how we move around our city What kind of energy we consume so on and so forth? but also and this is coming to the urban form point again and about you know, the sort of the long-term lock-in about the decisions we're taking and I think it's you know, the Chinese cities are being built up very very fast now But I anticipate if you look so 30 40 50 years in other regions of the world and these are real decisions Large amounts of money being invested by governments by the private sector and these decisions are very very long-term consequences The I think the point is well taken that you lock in this that you would will lock in sprawl But it's a decision about how you want to lock things in if you are building a Metro network or you're designing the sort of the road system and the highway system For and around the city on these are decisions you can take about about how you know, how you're going to design it And and and actually it's a very large feel out there which are people talking about these things a couple more points Actually, I think one of the a number of questions spoke to the sort of the costs versus the benefits And I'm sure Jose you're going to speak to be the co-benefits after this But but I would say this and and I think I speak here from sort of an operational Perspective at the World Bank is you know every time you make an investment every time the World Bank for example goes out and Designs and and takes a decision on an investment project You look at the economic and the financial analysis sort of the the cost-benefit analysis And you try and take all of the costs and all of the benefits including the non-market ones into account And this whole discussion then about the co-benefits. What are they? becomes really really important Because you look at the when you want to take when you're taking an investment decisions You need to look at the alternatives the alternative project designs the alternative investment decisions and also the the efficiency, you know, how efficient is our expenditure, you know and how efficient Will this be just a vis-a-vis the benefits and the returns we're getting The last point I'd like to make and I think this speaks to sort of the urban poverty questions and the adaptation and vulnerability questions Would be this and it's actually a message with David Dobbin and some of his colleagues have been making for a number of years now is that Reducing vulnerability adapting in cities, especially in low-income cities with respect to the urban poor is really a question simply of good Development in cities We've been trying to reduce poverty to address all the issues with slums, you know and so on and so forth on for many decades now in cities In some places we made some headway in other places. We haven't but rather than running around and saying Oh, you know, what do we need to do to adapt now in this city? It's it's it I think when it comes down to it It's all about the good development and continuing to do all of the things We're supposed we've been wanting and supposed to be doing with urban poverty reduction and and and with slums In in the cities of developing countries to do all of that good stuff And that will actually go a long way to reducing vulnerability and helping cities to adapt Okay. Okay. Thank you. Thank you for the questions or interesting I'm just going to pick up few questions that they're more related to to me The first question is how to reduce for example 80% of the emissions in cities for example And I think there is no silver bullet. I can't you just one thing and you've solved all the problems I think you have to work in different Aspects, but there are as I mentioned things that if you can do very quickly If we just give you an example one case in Sao Paulo waste management, they reduce 13% in two years just With a proper landfill burning the metal to generate electricity and they create a fund They got a CDM product a creative fund now There are 50 million dollars that they use for environmental Conservation in the city the environmental fund for the city it means in two years you can reduce Very quickly and and there are some but all there is much more complex like urban form Even the beginning of the discussion cities people thought the warmer form was very important But today people think it's not that important. I just give an example in the US They think they saw this study if you double the density in triple the use of public transportation Just reduce around eight ten percent and the cost would be much higher I mean there are other areas improve efficiency of the house that these things it could give you much more Impact with less money and then I think there is no silver bullet. You have to work in different areas regard the question about poverty Most of the our case you look at some aspects of power not directly But there are some implications for example green jobs and many of the case you look at it like Community-based solid waste management that creates some jobs But most of the impacts are indirect like one in case another in case in India surat For example, you have the plague there in the mid 90s What a lot of stupid poor people dying because of plague in mid like mid 90s And they could clean up and there was huge in terms of health effects And this is where a lot of the indirect impacts are for example when you look at Good transportation for the poor is at bring them more access to jobs, you know, the elsewhere affordable and clean Transportation and in these aspects in general that those that not much come up in the studies They would have organization came up with this study on core benefits in transportation The very interesting look at impacts on health is much higher than the other impacts. It's this indirect impacts They also I Was caught on not to go in in Landsat like in two years ago when the health and climate change look impacts in cities And you look at most of the actually the benefits come from from health indirect impacts for particularly for for the pool and the tangibility I think there are Issues in terms of tangible benefits and economic benefits most of them Is a women's situation, but I think the biggest biggest problem is the political economy You know these benefits not going to the same people is distributed in the average the economy is they all aggregate the aggregate there are Positive the benefits higher than costs But when you distribute and then some like oil companies the other have a lot of power They learn lose and the pool are going to games and it means never happened Some of those actions because of the political economy and look at more and why they have done very interesting Studies on the political economy on this aspect if you look at that and finally the adaptation agree with Marcus I just I have a friend now who works for the government to really did this studies on adaptation And then she came up that the policy they do all these simulations and Don't throw garbage in the river. Don't build in the steep terrain because it's like just good development And I think the best adaptation is mitigation because more you take time to mitigate More expensive and more adaptation you need in the future And then I think you have to focus it is I very I Think that you have to focus much more in mitigation the beginning was that one now the agenda going a lot to adaptation but I think Mitigation is is is is key for for not making the adaptation worse because if you don't mitigate you have to always Run behind the adaptation the cost will be much higher and I think the adaptations is a good development and just Put this on the agenda think climate change could bring this idea to align better because it's just more one more issue They bring but it's just good development anyway There are a lot of opportunities and but how to do I think this debate question you also know the science You know the cost sometimes most of the times the question is how to create the institutions actually Leverages and this I think what what need to do is to do the build institutions and that's it well believe that the speakers have answered all the questions and Yeah, of course, I think that you know the 80 percent Emissions how much you can reduce We can make some very simple calculations in a matured developer, you know urban or metropolitan area some you know 40 percent is from the building sector and then we have now in the passive housing we have energy efficient buildings and if we use sauna water heating devices if we use sauna PV for electricity generation if we use geothermal and then half of the emissions could be reduced at least And then if we look at the transport sector, which he accounts something 30 percent of the total, you know energy emissions and if we have you know this sort of you know Compact cities if we have this you know public transport like a to the transport oriented development And then probably half of the emissions can be reduced as well and then if we go to the industrial sector and energy efficiency and Renewable energy resources would really contribute to a enormous amount of Opportunities so if that's the case probably more than half of the emissions can be reduced with a lot of co-benefits Well, it's very encouraging and we do have the challenges. We have the opportunities and also we have these solutions and and Now we need to finish our session and I would like to invite the audience to join me to thank the speakers for their excellent presentations