 All right, Andy, we're recording, you can go ahead. Yeah, I'm going to call the finance committee meeting of June 21, 2022 to order four minutes after three o'clock. And welcome everyone, pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021 extended by chapter 22 of the acts of 2022. This meeting will be conducted via remote means members of the public who wish to access the meeting can do so via zoom or telephone. No in person attendance of members of the public will be being permitted, but every effort is being made to ensure that the public can adequately access the proceedings in real time so I, my technological means. So, what I want to do next is welcome the members of the committee and make sure that each member of the committee can be heard. I understand that other members of the AHRA are possibly in the audience and I'll explain what the process will be when we get to that agenda item. But we're going to be starting with the Community Preservation Act proposal so I'll just proceed on that basis. Before I want to turn to the recognition of members of the committee to make sure that you can hear us, hear me, and we can hear you. And again, I'll just go in alphabetical order. Lynn present. Bob present Matt. Jack is absent. So we will note that for the minutes. He could not join us today. Michelle present Kathy here. And I think they were still waiting for Alicia to join us when she does. We'll confirm that she's fully connected technologically to the meeting and can proceed from there. The agenda today will go into, I'm going to go into several times separately because we'll talk a little bit more about the reparations discussion. When we get to it. There will be public comment and there may be public comment I think there's a couple of different times. It says on the printed agenda. North common action as required. All action was taken at the last meeting. There is no action that is required so there will be no discussion of the north common. So there is, there is an proposed order regarding funding for that. There is a forum for the next council meeting. I'm going to go in and make sure the second for the public, what the plan is for the council meeting in the forum. But that is the time that public is encouraged to participate if they are interested in that particular item. We're going to the community preservation act therefore is our next substantial item, and then the reparations discussion. So that is the agenda for today's meeting. And when did you have anything else you wanted to say about the north common that I haven't already said the forum for the north common is at 630 on Monday, June 27. And Athena correct me if I'm wrong. The public forum on the community preservation act. I believe you now said cannot happen until the 18th is that correct. The vote can't happen until July 18 because the order hasn't been posted yet I'm waiting for a final version and then we can post it so it's up to you if you want to hold the public forum. I think it's too late to hold for this coming Monday, so we should hold for one delay. Yes, all right. All right. Thank you. Okay, so the north common to know that the order has been published and will be considered at the council meeting on Monday of next week and the forum will be also on the same date and there's no discussion needed. So that's the end of today's meeting. So with that, I would like to introduce and welcome Sarah Marshall who's chair of the Community Preservation Act committee and she can then proceed to tell us about the recommendation of the committee and will proceed from there. And they hello everyone. Yes, I'm happy to be with you and tell you about our final recommendation to you. I should note that my service on the committee ends at the end of this month so if you need someone from see back in July. Sonia will find the right person for you. So perhaps I can just read our recommend our decision to you and then give you a little bit history and explain how we got to our decision, which was earlier this month. So, we are recommended to see the CPA committee is recommending a borrowing authorization of $800,000 for the Amherst Pellum regional high school district to pursue track replacement option three, as presented to see pack during its June 2. If other planned funding does not reach the option three target and the track cannot be reoriented. The borrowing of CPAC funds will be rescinded. I should note should have should have been put here in the report that the CPAC vote was unanimous eight to zero. We have one vacancy at the moment. Essentially there, there should be nine members but they're only eight, and it was the unanimous vote. All right, so why did we act on this in June. The school school district had submitted a proposal that last fall in the usual application cycle. And it had the same amount of money $800,000 to resurface the track in its current location. And in discussion with Doug Slaughter who who represented the, the school administration. We expressed its unhappiness or concern about how the proposal to resurface the track in its current location. It was inconsistent with the plan in the master plan for the athletic fields that had been developed a few years ago. The master plan envisioned rotating the track 90 degrees and installing a synthetic turf field in the interior. This reorientation would allow then other athletic fields at the high school to be reorient reoriented rebuilt otherwise laid out in a much more sensible and useful manner. In fact, two years ago I think the school district had asked CPAC for relatively small amount of money maybe $150,000 or so to begin the end to begin the design work on doing that reorientation. So last fall, when the school committee or school district then was proposing to not reoriented. We were concerned about that. And we wanted more information. We wanted some explanation of why that was being pursued, rather than the original plan to reorient the track. I should say that no one was in any doubt whatsoever that the current track is in deplorable shape, and very much needs to rebuild to be rebuilt. So that's, that was not the question. We also wanted some more information about the cost since there was no, no real budget backup provided at the time. So in any case we had that discussion with Mr. Slaughter, and then we proceeded to discuss all the other projects make our recommendations to council, and we deferred action on this track proposal, pending new information. And that information was provided to us earlier this month. So understanding that council already has reviewed that information from the regional school committee, which involves their funding plan for building that reoriented track and redeveloped fields, that's what is now called option three. The council authorized the borrowing of the of Amherst's contribution to some of the spending capital spending that the regional school district school committee wanted to wanted to do. So, excuse me, so they already had secured part of the funding for this option three. The CPAC money would be another big chunk of the funding to enable them to get to option three. They will also be going to the other regional towns, asking them to contribute in various ways. And there's going to be a significant fundraising effort undertaken by the Amherst hurricane boosters. And we, and we definitely hope that will succeed. But their fallback plan, if they do not secure enough funding to make the school committee secure, or make them feel confident that they can proceed with this option three, their fallback position is simply to rebuild the track in its current location. We've been assured that the, the borrowing of $1.5 million that this school school committee has already gotten thanks to council's action by understand this all right that that is sufficient to rebuild the track in its place, which means that the CPAC money is only needed and will only be awarded if they can pursue the larger project and CPA all felt the committee all felt very good about that and very enthusiastic, and certainly wants to enable them to undertake a robust fundraising effort by by showing that that we support support that option three rebuilding play. So I'll leave that there for now, and ask if you have any questions. Okay, well thank you. So the committee is. First of all, I want to thank CPA for taking this out of cycle. The town council did vote. An amount in the past. And that's our, it was not, though not unanimous, it was our clear indication of support for this. And if it is acceptable to the chair, I'd like to make a motion. Do you want to hold off and motion or do it up to you. Now I'll be glad to hold off. I just want to see if there are other. Since there are two other hands up. Kathy. I'm playing also with Lynn making a motion so I just wanted to expand on some things Sarah said because and I double double checked it's in the title. I'm a liaison to see back and it's a fantastic committee and we're sad to be losing you Sarah, you've been a wonderful chair, but one of the discussions was the larger project the, this brought option three is track and field and I see that the one that was in a track and field because that was an important distinction for the committee that we were getting everything you just described with this additional funds, the fund raising goes through. We're not just getting a track, we're also getting fields that are more broadly use so I did double check the way the financial orders written it has that word track and field, which I know was in the discussion. There was actually an emphasis on making sure the word field appeared because of the extent to which this will make multiple things happen and why it had such strong support so I it's a comment rather than a question. I should have I should have slipped the word field and Michelle. I don't know if any of the other CPA committees have been have taken this up yet in the other towns, or is Amherst. I'm sorry, I don't believe they have because they just had their spring meetings I believe before this proposal was available to them I'm not entirely sure probably Sean, yet Sean knows. Maybe they'll have fall meetings. I think Sarah's right in terms of a new request I don't think any of the other towns have taken it up but one of the other towns I want to say Pelham awarded some funds already towards this Amherst has already awarded some funds towards this for design work and so this request is for the additional amount that's needed, and one of the other towns have done that already as well. But the point I guess Michelle is since you're not on. You're not attuned to the town meeting, possibly as other schedule, but there's this annual spring town meetings and then everything else has done a special town meetings, so that they would have to have a series to get it done on time. If they would have to have a recommendation from their CPA committee, their select board would have to decide to call a special town meeting and publish a warrant for there would be an actual process to get final approval. We have the advantage of a year on government now. So, with that, I'm going to stop from just one moment to see if there are any members of the who are attendees at the meeting who would like to speak on the CPA issue. This is only about CPA. I do not want to get any public comment on other issues, but I certainly would welcome any public comment about this particular matter. I've seen the hands that come up Sarah back to you. Thank you I just wanted to say for the record, even though it's here in the special report that we, we are all aware that the CPA statute forbids the use of CPA funds for constructing artificial turf fields. We have seen the, the budget breakdown for this that Weston and Samson did this spring for the full project three, and there is plenty, plenty of ways to spend $800,000 for more of CPA money without without getting into trouble around it artificial turf field. That's all thanks. Thank you for having that. Sean or Sonya do we have the order available or up on the screen now and now that it's up and people have a chance to look at it I'll go back to Lynn because you would have been prepared to make a motion and I move that the committee recommend to the town council adoption of appropriation and borrowing authorization order FY 23-08 a town of Amherst Community Preservation Act and order appropriating and authorizing debt for the rehabilitation improvements of the Amherst Regional High School track and field under open space slash recreation. In seconds. Okay, so we've been mostly on the floor now that has been made in seconded. Sarah. Bob, that order Sarah. Yeah, thank you. So see it CPAs recommendation that that this borrowing be contingent on moving forward with that option three. Is there any need to make that clear in this order. That's a Sean question. That it's for reorienting the track not for not for rebuilding it in place. So, I think, I mean we could always clarify it with that. I don't think it needs that clarification because it's very clear in the report what the authorization is for that sort of accompanies it. And I know Sonya will the report be sort of part of this order sort of like the memo goes along with the order in terms of describing it. We can add it to this to page two but it doesn't need to be in the order it's very clear on the report. So I think I would say, no, because we haven't done that with other things we will you will attach the report so that it's clear what the intent of the CPA committee was. Just very quickly Athena can you bring Alicia in from the audience is on our way, Sean or Sonya should the order say of supporting historic preservation or should say open space recreation. Oh, does it say preservation in the now therefore be at order it says fund a grant for the purpose of supporting historic preservation. Yes that that should be changed. It's paragraph down below that's the problem. Yeah, no good catch Athena. So it should say supporting open space and recreation rather than historic. Okay Alicia's here. Can we just confirm that you can hear and be heard. Yes, I was going to do that. At least you're welcome. Can you confirm that you can hear me and that we can hear you so we can confirm your. Yes, hi everyone thank you I can hear you all. Okay, so minutes will show that you've we've confirmed thank you very much. We are started the meeting by recognizing no action is required for no further action is required in the North Common and move to the next agenda item which is community preservation act and that's where we are right now. And Sarah spoken on this committee recommendation. Bob has his hand up Andy. Yeah I see that I just finishing out the question did you change the order slightly. I didn't change it I highlighted where it needs to be changed. Okay. I just wanted to make sure that your motion notes the proposed amendment. As amended. In Kathy or an agreement. Yes, I second. Okay. I just wanted to also add or in that. Maybe we should take out the wording and field under the high school track and field since this money is specifically for the track and not for the field. I guess. So the, the CPA committee was very adamant that we include field and the description of the project I think you're right. Bob, you know, I think actually at the CPA CPA committee I sort of, we had that conversation because CPA track is really the only portion that's CPA eligible or the associated costs of the track. But I think in terms of describing the project the CPA committee wanted it to be really clear that the, that the project is a track and field project and not just a project, but you're right in terms of in the discreet in the project description, but in the order I think it ought to be clean and just talk about the track. That's all. That's just my suggestion. Just trying to put my hand down. I believe that option three will make additional improvements it's not just the track and it's interior artificial field which which CPA money cannot be used for there are like relocating and changing. I forget what you call them the, the, the places for long jumping and high jumping all the all the track and field events. So, I guess I don't I don't want this to be so limiting that the CPA funds could only be used literally for the track. And to Sarah's point there's also some costs associated with repairing the fields where the track used to be. And those may that may be CPA eligible as well to restore those those fields back to, you know, sort of grass or something like it. Right, there may be eligible items. Besides the track that are still compliant with CPA. Maybe we could just put some language in there what to just say, eligible items or something of this project. I just think it. We ought that the, the, the order ought to be as clear as possible as to what the money could be used for. I was thinking the same thing as you before. After the words fund a grant for the purpose of supporting. And then after the word supporting community preservation act eligible portions of some somewhere to get it in there. Hey, can I say something. Yes, we will put any expenditures through that aren't eligible for CPA. So invoice comes through and it's not an eligible request that will not be paid to her CPA. So we keep an eye on the stuff in the finance department it doesn't really need to be in the order. The maker and the second or the motion or comfortable with where it's at and think it's no need to make that addition. I'm comfortable. So am I. And I actually think this is pretty clear given what is being described. I mean it's called project three or whatever option three it's a, it's, it is much bigger than the track, which is why we may or may not get it. In time for January. Yeah. So with that is there any other comments from the committee otherwise I think we are ready to know it is the motion as amended, which had to do with a slight change to the wording of the order that rose from the discussion. The motion on the floor. Matt. Thank you and thank you Sarah and everybody for this. If my connection breaks up I apologize. I was wondering Sean if or somebody could give us a quick update on where this puts us towards the total request for the project where this is in terms of fundraising. Yeah, is that okay Andy if I respond to that. Please. So the, the 1.5 million has been authorized the total project costs was about 4.7 million. So we've got 1.5 in place. CPA authorized about 150,000, maybe a little bit more last year, two years ago. And then this would be another 800,000. So this is sort of back of the envelope. This I think would get us to about 2.4 2.5 total. Now, if you're talking about the, the goal that the school committee set the school committee set believe a goal of 2.2 million in addition to the 1.5. That was already approved so we still have a ways to go to get to that 2.2 million with this 800,000. If this 800,000 approved but in total, we're about 2.4 2.5 million. Yeah, sir. Yeah, I would just note that. You know, we am or certainly hopes that leverage shoots Barry and Pellum will also step up and contribute more money. I'm sorry. It was my understanding that the reason for one thing. The CPA recommendations early is to give confidence for the fundraising effort that is being commenced by others, including the boosters club in the, that was the purpose. Matt, do you have further comments or questions or respond. Thank you very much. Okay, is your hand is still up Kathy your hands up. Just following up on Matt's when we do this at the council Lynn and when we send it forward from finance. I think that chart that shows the 4.7 and where this sits would be good so that we have a context. So it's, there's a one, there's a final chart that adds up to the 4.7 and shows the pieces of it. I just think it would be good that people understand. This is still contingent funding without putting the wording in here. That's just, it's got nothing to do with my support for this. I just think that context will be important on when it's part of the hearing. Yeah, we could put, we could easily put together a chart that we can update regularly for the council. If that's helpful, we could shape it like one of those thermostats where it fills up as the fundraising goes up or, or maybe, you know, maybe a field goal post or something I'm trying to think of what would be relevant to attract but And I think, including the town managers report on a regular basis would be good. Okay. You're muted. I'm sorry. Sorry, Andy, I didn't mean to raise my hand, but thank you. Okay. Anything else. The motion on the floor otherwise I'll call for about Now assuming that Alicia's hand is not up for discussion purposes and that I can move forward with a vote and I'll just go alphabetically with the usual. The resident members indicating whether support and that will be reflected in the report to the council and in the minutes. So, going alphabetically again Lynn. Prove. Yes, Hagner. Matt. Matt we're not hearing support. Okay, thank you. Bernie kubiec is absent. Michelle. Yes. Kathy. Yes. I'm a yes and Alicia. Okay, so it's unanimous five zero with the two resident members who are present at the meeting indicating support one resident member being absent. So, Sarah, thank you very much I too I'm very sorry that you're leaving the CPA committee. It has done some really great things under your leadership. And you will be sorely missed. I'll spend my pleasure and I'm so glad you'll support this. This proposal. Just before I go am I am I right to conclude you do not need CPAC representation at your council meeting next week. I don't think so I think as long as Sean and or son you're there we're fine. I, maybe I misunderstood I thought if you can't have the hearing until if you're not going to act until July. Right, I still think we're fine I mean this is not. If we had never discussed this and discussed that this was coming I would feel quite differently but the order is quite clear and I think we're fine and it's summertime. Right, because I could be there if you, if you need me to. Thank you. Well, thank you. Yeah. Okay so turn this to reparations and just say a couple things really quickly at the beginning. And in a moment we're going to bring members of the age or a, in addition to our one member who's also a member of our committee, who's already here into the room. This is a discussion. I'm going to have to get rid of this is a discussion of the finance committee, we, I know that the HR has had several discussions of this issue. And it's now time for the finance committee to have a discussion. But if we were meeting in the town room. Then others would be sitting in the town room with us. And we would, when there's an interested group present during this committee discussion or a council discussion. It's not that everybody's there. As a participant in the full sense, but everybody's there in the room. And I, therefore, unless there's feeling otherwise from finance committee would welcome us bringing the members of the HR a into the room in that same spirit that we would have if this was an in person meeting. So, seeing no objection, I would say the theme I can go ahead and do that. As I go into the other piece. What my suggestion is for the process of this meeting is, is that we next need to focus on a very important question, which is. Information. Do we need to have fully developed for us to make a recommendation. And is there missing information is it available now or do we need to get some direction to obtain that information. So it's really an identification of information first type of discussion. But in order to do that, I think we have to have some idea of what it is that is being proposed. And therefore, I know that Michelle has presented a sort of different and clear explanation of what it is that is the age or a request. And so I would propose that we begin by asking Michelle to present that to us I think that she has emailed it to everybody on the committee already, so that it's there. It would be helpful. I think if there's no disagreement with the with this to have Michelle make that presentation, and she is the option to show it on the screen as a shared screen or not as she does that. And then that will enable us to get into the discussion that I suggested is that do we have the information that we need in order to take action on this item or do we need to I is there information that needs to be obtained. Does that sound like a workable plan to go forward. Let's see if there's not. And Michelle, are you comfortable to make that presentation. Yes, I am Andy and I'm just wondering if we could bring in Hala and Dr Shabazz. Yes, I've sent them both requests to come in as panelists they just have to accept the request so I see everyone. And with that in mind, I think I should call a meeting of the AHRA to order, given we have a quorum present, I believe, if actually we do, even without Hala, but I think Hala will be here soon. So I'll just say calling the AHRA to order at 342pm. And whenever you would like me to begin that presentation Andy I'm happy to share my screen and do that and make it very brief here. Okay, I think that we need to at least ask each member. Just to acknowledge that we can hear them so if we need to talk to later participation, we know we're set. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, Dr Shabazz, can you hear us. Can we hear you. Yes, I can see everyone and I can hear you. Okay, earth. Dr Rhodes. You're muted. And I can see everyone. Okay, great. And Alexis. I'm here. Hi everyone. Okay. And Yvonne was going to try to join us. Hala, if you can hear us, you've been sent an invitation to join as a panelist so you'll just have to accept that in order to be moved into the room. So can you go ahead, Andy with this? Yes, please. Because I think that's where we're going to come next is you're going to. Okay. So hopefully, can you see my screen here, everyone. Yeah, okay. So I did email this over earlier today. And you'll see there are a couple things highlighted here, those were just additions that came out of the AHRA meeting from 2pm today. But everything else is the same as what I've emailed and before I go through this, I just wanted to really thank the AHRA and the finance committee and the counselors in our first discussion of this at the town council, also the staff for providing input and feedback and recommendations. And as I said in the email, we, we believe that this reflects a significant and meaningful commitment by the town as well as takes into consideration many of the concerns that we've heard as we've been discussing this. So again, here with a base appropriation modeled from the FY 21 actual cannabis tax revenue. And we ask that the policy grow a fund to $2 million so expire when the appropriation has reached $2 million. So we are taking into consideration feedback that we received about the coming three years have asked that we model the appropriation from cannabis tax revenue and do it through certified free cash for FY 23, 24 and 25. And beginning in FY 26, when we're understanding that DEI and Cress and the four firefighters will be more stable and worked into the budget, we're asking for that to shift to a designation of cannabis tax revenue. We have in here that there would be an annual review by the finance committee during the drafting of the budget policy guidelines. The policy procedures would of course be in accordance with MGL and our charter in here in Amherst. The possible use of funds really isn't meant to be a part of any action today, or, or it's more just to give a sense of what the possible funds will be once the reparative justice plan is developed fully. And these come from the National Coalition of Blacks reparations in America. We, many of us here went to a symposium, I think it's back two years ago that reparations for Amherst put on with Cam Howard as a panelist Cam is the chair of and Cobra of the National Foundation. And these are possibilities of course there'd be a consultative process with members of the black community but again, this is not really relevant for any action today. And then we say that the full plan and eligibility criteria will be recommended by the AHRA per our charge in the final report which is due in June 2023. And of course, would be approved would need to be approved by the town council. So I'm going to stop my share or would, would it be Andy would it be best to leave this up or should I stop my share. We can leave it up for a moment. See, because I think that the next point before is whether there are members of the finance committee who have questions that they would like to pose to Michelle about which he's presented and I see Kathy's hand is up so Kathy. Thank you, Michelle, and I want to start out saying in terms of a concept. I totally support reparations, but I also think we the for initiatives on a large scale to be effective require federal and state action. And we've done a show of local support and what we've done when we set up a reserve fund, which now has $200,000 of money in it, and we've provided seed money. So my, my thinking on this right now is you said this could come later in terms of what we might do with it. I think it has to come first, that a plan for who we think might be eligible for the what you've characterized as direct and material benefits, who might be eligible because I think this is we're going to have some challenges and trying to think it through, and I have a bunch of questions that I'd be happy to send in to you. So I'm assuming African American heritage would be one of the first determinants of eligibility. So I don't know whether we thought of is mixed race would qualify, what kind of race basis and what would be eligible and what is there any documentation is in terms of technology oral history would, would the heritage have to date back some amount of time. So for example with Barack Obama, who had a father from Kenya, qualify. So would it have to go back in time. Would we have students, college students at Amherst College, and a fairly high percent of the African Americans who currently live in Amherst or students would they be eligible, any of them at UMass at Hampshire to apply for a direct benefit with Amherst residency for any length of time be required. So these are, and I have a couple other questions with wealth and income matter at all current wealth and income for direct benefits. And I'm not asking you to have answers to them right now. But I think these are the types of direct material benefit which which is what I thought the fund would be mainly for. So to get housing assistance to get business loans any of the things you have listed. And to me, I'm waiting for that report to June 2023 is the right approach before we commit additional money into a fund. We've got seed money. And if there are, you know, other activities like the community benefits we just had an amazing weekend with a volunteer efforts supported by staff with black history and larger issues. I think there's a lot starting to happen in the town of Amherst, and there may be federal and foundation grants to do more. So just focusing on what type of activities might be supported by this and in a fundraising effort, we can certainly enhance it. So, I start with wanting to know that before I would want to put more money into a fund. And I, I thought seeding the fund was the right way to start, and then giving people time to think about the legal questions as well, you know, enabling us I don't want to build up the money that we can't then spend. So that's my overall take. And I will say it's the fiscal hawk side of me where I'm looking at a really tight budget every single year going forward, not just through 2026, and I'm concerned that the commitment we've met to to addressing racism through an alternative to police through efforts that we would like to support after school activities on making sure people who can't pay get funds. All of that requires that we maintain a flow of revenue we don't tie up we don't pre allocate revenues we need to have flexibility so that gets to the cannabis question, but I'm much more focused on what Andy asks you know what who and what criteria might be eligible for this fund, even if it only had $200,000 in it so that that's the questions and I have written them out so I'm happy to send them in. Can I respond to that Andy. Yeah, sorry it's just about to say just for. So I know how to manage. I'm recognizing you of course, but don't hesitate Michelle during the course of the conversation as the presenter, raise your hand just so I know that you want to make a response, but please go ahead. Well, first of all, thank you Kathy I think that everything that you've just outlined are really important considerations in fact at the tail end of our conversation in the HR today we touched on eligibility. So these are matters that the committee has been charged with studying and evaluating. So, eligibility, looking at what the harms were and really getting a focused lens on the harms that are particular to the Amherst community, and then being able to determine what is eligible based off of that, as well as determining through a consultative process with members of the black community what sorts of reparative justice initiatives. The black residents in Amherst would like to see, but in order to do that work, we are, it's, it's very important that we understand what the money commitment is. We have to go out and to begin a process of consulting with members of the black community without having an idea of what our, what our budget is essentially what we have to work with, and also when we're talking about eligibility. It's really important that we understand before we start delving into those areas, what sort of budget we have to work with. So with the timeline that we have, if we were to wait until June 2023 when we've completed all of our recommendations with respect to eligibility and with respect to the reparative justice initiatives that the black community would like to see. We would be out of time, given the way that our budget cycle and that our budget process works. As I said, if there's a commitment that's being made now, and the money is beginning to get set aside now. All of those factors are still going to be in play, all of those, whether you know there's the legal opinion that we're going to need to seek they're going to have to be legally, we're going to have to be able to legally direct the benefits out, whether the community benefits. And so the money isn't going out we're just asking to put the money in, and we're asking to understand what budget we have what commitment is the town making within their means at this time, so that we can start going out into the black community or to speaking to members of the black community and going through a process of consulting the black community. And also as I said really understanding what harm so for example, we know in Amherst that we have racial dominance in our deeds. And they're still, they're not legally permissible but they're still in our deeds and so we need to be able to look at those harms and see who they impacted. And all of that works going to be done but we can't wait until June 2023 and then with what with what committee with what you know we've been charged with identifying a funding stream. What we're doing, and we feel we've made a really solid case, and a compromise here that we feel, as I said is a significant contribution a significant and meaningful contribution, as well as taking into consideration the health of of our of our finances at this time. And right now still to members of the committee, the finance committee to see if there are other questions or comments and then after that I'm going to see if there are any members of the AHRA who want to want to speak. One thing I'm going to notice is that for any members of the public who were, whether you were here before or not, the prior public comment was listed solely to the CPA proposal which we addressed as our first action item, regarding the track and the high school and we were reserving public comment on this agenda item until we began the topic of discussion. So there is another public comment period coming first. Are there any other members of the committee, and maybe we should try and stick to this now or not, but Bob, go ahead. Michelle, can you just clarify what you mean by appropriations that come from certified free cash and FY 23 24 and 25. If there is no free cash, what are you at what's your expectation. That's a great question, Bob. And that's the risk we take here, you know, in our mind and I don't want to, I will speak on behalf of the AHRA but of course, welcome their comments as well. And we're trying to negotiate a deal here. And what I heard from Sean and staff is that and maybe again don't want to speak for anybody is that the comfort level right now with with respect to this and modeling this is that using the canvas tax revenue as a model, taking it from free cash for years is the best way to approach this, given D I crest the four firefighters. It's, I don't know what the backup plan is is if there's no money in free cash, but looking at the reserves right now, looking at the stabilization fund right now I'm not sure what others think about whether it's something to be overly concerned with. And I did see Sean's hand shut up so maybe has something to add to what I said there. Okay, if I hop in any on. Yeah, so I think that's a good question Bob. So, you know, we haven't had a ton of time with this document but what we've seen so far is that it you know sort of sets the parameters of a funding plan for reparations it's something that other people have talked about. We have funding plans for lots of different things we have funding plans for OPEB and for capital and our pension system and our operating budgets and so we have, we have funding plans for lots of things that that the town funds. And so this seems to set the framework of that. And so the nice thing about those plans is that in any given year you don't have to follow them you sort of you let the circumstances of that year sort of dictate and you may catch up later. So good example is with OPEB there were a couple years where we hit some tough times with with the pandemic. And so we reduced our contribution to OPEB for a couple years. And then things turned around, and we were able to make up that that sort of, you know, underfunding for those couple years and catch it back up. So again I don't know exactly how this would work but if we we view this as sort of a funding plan. If there was a year where we didn't have free cash maybe that year there's no contribution made if there's there's no free cash because there was something really catastrophic that happened I mean that would be, that would be something major, if we had no free cash. So I think what we do is that year. I like the part in the plan that says annual review by finance committee during the drafting the budget policy guidelines that tells me that each year, we can look at the circumstances that are going on in that particular year, and make an informed decision. So I think that's how I would approach it as if, if that was the case that year there would be no contribution and then we would look to catch up in a following year when things get back to to where we want them to be. Um, you know I don't know how quite how to frame this but I've just been looking at what we're going to be needing to ask taxpayers for for this new school that we just took a big step forward. And it's going to be a big ask so if I had to anchor free cash and something I would anchor it in into a fund for the school. I'm just and it's it's the sense I have of competing needs and free committing funds and when you said Michelle you need the money before you can figure out what you're going to do with it I need a much better sense of what we might be able to do with it. Before I can consider what the right amount of money is I just don't work from. You know, give me a large amount of money and I can do a lot with it, I really think, having a firmer piece and I had understood when we did the first allocation that there would be a year and we're a year from now where we, we would have more specificity and this clearly is moving in that direction. So it's I have a discomfort but I can understand that as Sean just said with OPEB when we make a decision that we're not putting money into it in advance but to start to pre commit for multiple years in the time period we're in right now. And that really makes causes me a lot of discomfort with this, including the extremely large ideas that are under community benefits. I think these are really big projects that need statewide efforts. When we're talking about new history monuments and new textbooks. I don't think these are terrific ideas but I think they are we are immersed. I don't think we have to step beyond where we think we can go a multi townish effort statewide effort, absolutely. And I think there's some foundations that are going to be willing to step up to these kinds of efforts. So I really do start with some of the direct benefits and you said you know reparations. I think we need to live in Amherst and be harmed so these are just questions I have on this that I still don't have answers to. Because because I do know you did an excellent research report that documented the kinds of things that happened in the town of Amherst. But if someone has recently moved here, 1010 years ago moved here, you know and didn't directly experience those. So what is the level of, what are we talking about on the people that still, still makes me feel like before I can think about funding. I want to know more about the eligibility. I'm going to stop there because I do like the idea that if we don't have free cash we don't contribute. And if we have very tight free cash, if we might be sequestering it in the stable stabilization fund having discretion to make those decisions is what I'm asking about as well. Thank you. Thanks Kathy. I'm going to recognize Lynn, and then I'm going to take a pause from the committee and welcome comments from a couple members of the AHRA who've been seeking recognition. I just wanted to assure them that I would, I do see hands up. But this is largely I wanted to be finance committee and so Lynn. Actually, and I would like to after hearing from members from the AHRA. I would like to suggest a path forward. And, but let's do, let's hear from members of the AHRA first. And I might say Lynn that there are other issues I have one in particular that I want to be able to raise other members of the committee might have other issues that they want to raise so that they don't have a path forward too much. I, you know, you have to judge the timing for that. But if there's no objection I certainly would like to be able to allocate a few minutes to each member of the AHRA who wants to make sure that it's happened and they'll start with. I assume. I know that the AHRA meeting that I was just said you're referred to as Dr. Rhodes and if that's your preference. I certainly will go from here. We have a first name tradition at the finance committee. So, but go ahead you have the floor. In the AHRA, I'm referred to as Dr. Rhodes and Irv simultaneously and every other committee meeting I'm referred to as Irv Rhodes. I answered both of them and it really doesn't really matter. It is not a concern to me. But what I would like to say is that in terms of free cast and Sean was right, you know, if the town finds itself or doesn't have free cash, then we will immediately congratulate Sean and Paul, give them huge raises and put them out as a model to the rest of the Commonwealth. That's not going to happen. So, the thing is, the whole thing about waiting until we as AHRA have defined who is going to be eligible and how they're going to be eligible, etc. Before money is committed. It's, you know, it sounds good. But it seems to me that when you concretize a promise. Then you have said to people in the community, especially to the AHRA, the black community, that you have committed yourself to doing this. And, you know, African Americans, people of color, poor people have always been made promises. And those promises when the bill comes due, the money is not there. It's better to say for us and for me, if I'm going to make a promise to my kids in the future that they're going to have a college education. They're not going to put money aside now, not when they graduate from high school, so that they know it is there and I have made my promise. And I've concretized that promise. So I'm saying the same thing to the town. Make it concrete. Make it something that the community can understand that the town is behind. And given the protections that are already built into this plan. Then, if we do not meet those kinds of criteria that are set up, the money still can be redirected at that point. Or even at the point where we have all the money in there or the process by weight as money gets in there. If the time enters into a situation that requires that that year, the money will not be set aside for that purpose. Then it isn't and Sean pointed out what is happening up there. So to me, make your promise concrete. Something that we can take forward to our communities to say, Hey, the town has really committed itself to this and that the town has put forward a funding mechanism, which we were charged with finding a funding mechanism. I want to make sure that everyone understands the part of our charge was to identify the funding mechanism. All right, and this is an we have identified the funding mechanism. So to me. Yes, you know, Kathy, which you're saying makes a lot of sense. But on the other hand, what I'm saying is, Hey, you know, you're gonna make a promise. Make it a promise that you can stand back up and that I can see that you really, really mean your promise. Thank you. Alexis you had your hand up before Sid and then I have not taken it down so I'm going to assume that you don't wish to be recognized any further. Okay, your hand is up again so I do recognize. Please join us. Thank you very much. I you know I wasn't going to say it and then you inspired me to say it again so I think that I think that one thing that got brought up was very important and we talk about you know, you know days of commemoration or celebration or monuments you know at the end of the day we're talking about symbols. And I think that we really need to come back to the main mission right our intended impact when we're talking about repairing, you know, a relationship between an institution and a demographic of people right so I just want to remind us all that we are you know, taking steps to change systems that we can acknowledge harm people so it's it's an institutional change right an institutional commitment that needs to be made in order to even start to change the institution so that's all I wanted to say thank you very much. Okay, thank you. So, turning back to the committee. I recognize Alicia before I turn the subject a little bit, but Lisa, please. Thank you I just have a quick question probably for Sean. I was wondering if we have an average amount of free cash like in general that we have every year and if there has ever been a time where we turn out with none. Sonya may want to speak to if we've ever had none. Our policy is generally 5% and then anything above 5%. So 5% of the budget and then anything above 5% goes to our stabilization fund. So, we're usually at least at around that 5% mark that being said sometimes the council appropriates from that during the year and take some out if there's an emergency so there could be a year where there may be some sort of emergency where there's an appropriation during the year that reduces it below that 5% level, but Sonya will have so much better historical context of that. Yeah, I don't have it in front of me but there's never been a time when we didn't have free cash, however, there were times when free cash was very minimal like maybe 10s of thousands not hundreds of thousands or millions. So, budgets are getting tighter. So a lot of returns from the operating budget are going to become less and less. So you want to keep that in mind and we're budgeting most of our revenues and local receipts. It's not as conservative as we've done in the past so that might shrink it up as well. Thank you Sonya and just a clarifying question. So have we ever had a time where we didn't meet the 5% in the free cash on those years where free cash was limited. Yes. There are multiple times so that we didn't meet that 5%. Okay, thank you. Yep. This question reminded me of one of the two things that I was going to say when I get to my comments and I'll start with this as we're down this path. I don't have it for before me, but this policy is a long standing policy of the town dating back. I don't think of the year so I'm not going to venture like this. I was going to say around 2007 roughly that it's in. It's available on the town website is called the financial policies indicators. When you look under the budget section for the FY 23 budget and then the other information I think that the policy is in there. The reason I point that out is that when that policy was written. I was on the committee that developed the policy I therefore have some familiarity with how it came about. The reason for the policy in some sections was included sort of is a way of kind of if you're familiar with the legislative process, the statement of legislative history. So that when you look under the section on reserves and free cash and stabilization funds, the intended purpose of the policies is stated in that document. It has been stated in that document so it's written. I think that it's instructive because going to the stabilization fun side is what it does say of course is the free cash as a purpose and but that it can be met, if we reached that 5% threshold and therefore amounts above 5% should be transferred to stabilization funds. The stabilization funds were set up in order to address two purposes one was to be able to assist with capital projects. And the other was that in periods of substantial financial stress in the town. And one of the functions is a savings account and the ability for the governing body, whether it be town meeting before town council now to be able to have the stabilization funds so that it can continue the essential services of the town and move having been on in the unfortunate experience of being on the old finance committee in 2009 and 2010 first years after the 2008 recession. It was crucial that we had a significant stabilization fund for those purposes. You know our schools our municipal services our libraries all relied on our ability to to use that stabilization fund for that very purpose. The action that we took last year was first time we really have this was a council decision of course which he could it should and did make was to broaden purposes of stabilization to serve this other purpose that we're talking about today. So, I just wanted to put that up for context to history. The other topic that I wanted to just mention is that, as you talk about the years in the presentation that we looked at for Michelle. I spent some time last week doing sort of a analysis of future year budgets and it was not a lot of fun to do it, because it's not, you know, back to the much better thing more entertaining things today. But, you know, I was looking at the questions year by year of where we were and what was coming forward in both trying to project out inflation and trying to project out how to keep our commitments that you have already made as a town. Those commitments come in various forms. What is to maintain the ongoing services which is out which are very important to our community, including our schools in our library, but it has a very, you know, covers a lot of things, but also, we have now made commitments to setting up a new town department in public safety, and we have made a commitment to hire for additional firefighters. And as noted, they were the funded for a period of time through ARPA, but I think that FY 25 is the end on when we can use ARPA funds. And so I was looking at years ahead and what I was finding is that the real problem years that I was seeing our FY 27, 28, 29 when I looked at those years because I was trying to go out five years. I was having problems because I kept coming up no matter how I went about doing it. Unless I severely shrunk something that the deficit was running over a million dollars. That's a serious number. On the other hand, I recognize their limits of my capacity to do that kind of analysis. So when I put forward the suggestion of what else we need to ask. I think one of the things that finance committee needs to decide whether or not it's important is to ask Sean and Sonia with Paul's consent to help us model those out years to make sure that I'm right or I'm wrong in my analysis. So, and I think in part of the analysis is also built on my knowledge of the capital projects because I did include thinking about the capital projects as I did that model. And one of the things with capital projects and Kathy's probably would be pained if she had to speak on this yet again, but costs have gone up from where we projected originally and therefore the, the, the model that had been used and the year in more go is not really there for a model that we can count on not only a construction costs going up with borrowing costs have been going up in borrowing costs are also significant part of the model. So, I was trying to factor in all of these things, but the bottom line of it was still that painful conclusion that I just reported to you. So, since we are finance committee. You know, I would suggest that the finance committee. Think about whether it wants to ask staff to go back on that and the last thing I want to say on that is that in the budget book there is a five year projection and I did start from the five year projection but we also have to recognize that the five year projection is probably developed during April Sean can tell us when it was developed a few issues but since it was published on May 2nd we can guess that I can throw in an April date. There's been a lot that has happened since April. Inflation has skyrocketed we are now seeing interest rates going up in huge fashion, and we're being threatened with the possibility of yet another recession. So, all of those things are out there, I think that all of that causes me some anxiety about planning and commitments. Michelle your hands up so I'm finished. Yeah, and I think that I just want to acknowledge what you said Andy and that you know I think we're all taking a bit of a leap of faith here, given all the various factors that we've been talking about and the challenges that we have ahead. But we made a commitment. We need to put ourselves behind that commitment because honestly, and I mean this with no disrespect but when I hear all the various things that continue to circulate come up in these discussions that we have. I hear black people don't matter. That's really truly what I hear. And I know you don't mean it that way and I can't I see that you know you shaking your head and I really understand that that's not what you're trying to say, but that's what I hear. We made a commitment to redress harms that this town is responsible for, and we need to stand behind the commitment we made and all of these other things will work themselves out. We're not talking about millions and millions and millions of dollars. We're talking about what I believe is a very reasonable proposal that we put forward that takes into consideration all of these things that has all sorts of checks and balances. And we don't talk about other things, other services in this town in the same way that we talk about reparations black people matter. We've made the commitment now let's put ourselves behind it. I just say two things because it was a part of my analysis and thinking and doing this. The one is that when I did my analysis, I was making sure that I was protecting commitments where we already have expenditures so the Cres program for example, was one. But another one that I thought about was the schools and I wanted to make sure that as I was trying to figure out. You know, I wanted to treat the schools as as an important part of what we do because I recognize that ultimately education is what gives all of our community. And BIPOC, the ability to move forward so I did think about that. But now I'm going to turn back to the committee and some go to Alicia and then Lynn. Alicia. Thank you Andy. So I just wanted to echo all of Michelle sentiments and just re emphasize that the town has committed. We have a resolution committing to focusing on ending structural racism and achieving racial equity for black residents in Amherst. I know that we have the, we have done a lot of work this year in terms of establishing the Cres department and the DI department, but those are not enough. Those are just the very beginning of some of the steps that we should be taking as a town. So this is an initiative that the town council committed to, and we created the HRA for this exact reason to establish a revenue of funding source for this purpose. And so it is frustrating that now we're seeming hesitant. And some of the reasons are that, you know, our fiscal that we're going to be tight in fiscal years 272829 I think whether we do or do not commit to this, we're going to have a tight budget for those years. So yes, the commitment that we made to this still stands the commitment that we made to ending structural racism and achieving racial equity still stands. So if we do nothing, we are failing to follow through on our commitments. So taking that initiative forward today and making an more specific commitment is how we continue to push these things forward. The school budget and other things that are also very important. They're not linked to the commitment to addressing structural racism, not specifically. And so I think we need to just remove those from this conversation, because all of these things need to be funded. It's not this is more important than that. And so I think we need to figure out in what way are we going to commit to this, because that is what the question is here. So, Lynn, did you have anything else to get Kathy. I'm ready to try a motion, but if you want to keep this going plus I'm not sure that just give it a little bit longer, we can. And then we also want to honor my commitment, recognize public comment. I just make a quick thing because I, I think we've made a huge commitment as a town on the Crest program is in my mind restorative justice, it's trying to end and do and looking forward in a very creative way and it's over a million dollars. And this is not a small investment for the town of Amherst to set up a program like this are schools having focused on who's in our schools are more than half minority kids. And so we are a huge commitment in education to this town and we need to keep it going. So I just think we, we, we need to have the big picture in mind, we've got DEI just got set up. The town is doing extraordinary efforts to populate committees with with people who haven't always been heard to do voices. I think we shouldn't underestimate what this town has committed to in an extremely short amount of time. So I just want to say, you know, this is one program I'm not. I was saying and nerve asked a good question, you know, what budget might make the work possible going forward. And it's, I'm just not sure quite what, which people would, which kinds of eligibility criteria, that's an important piece for me to figuring out how much budget might be needed. And the big issues on the list, I think probably can't come out of this fund so I would that discussion would be a good one to have but I just want to correct the record for saying that we're not making a commitment on racism and structural racism, including justice, if we can treat mental health and drug abuse in a very different way, where people don't have criminal records, that we're helping people, which is what I think our press program is going to be trying to do. We are looking forward to removing stigma from people who couldn't get jobs before because they had one run in over a possession of a drug and I think we have a new group that's coming in that's going to make a real difference. And I'm hoping we see it so I just, I just want to rise to the challenge of saying we aren't committing we, we have committed and we are committing. So I will lower my hand and I don't usually try to get on a soapbox but I was challenged so I had to respond. Thank you, Andy. Yeah, so I think that it's a little this this conversation is really challenging so I appreciate everyone's contributions but I think that like, although the schools serve a diverse group and have a lot of minority students, investing in a new building is that is very much needed is not investing in things like trauma and foreign care supports or investing in adequate representation and educators. Those are very, very specific ways or like textbooks, as indicated by the gray, those are more specific ways that we can address racial address racial equity and trying to mitigate the effects of structural racism. And I just want to re emphasize like very, very strongly while I am so excited about the DDI department, they are not enough that is not enough we are talking about remedying hundreds of years of oppression and racism and harm done to residents and two small programs that are just barely getting off the ground right now is not enough. And so I think that in order to solidify our commitment and to prove to our residents that we are still equally committed to this resolution as we were last year, that it's continuing to move these initiatives forward, and not just saying well we're going to stop and wait here. Let me just take a look for a second. Okay. I think what I want to do is, we are getting past 430 so we do want to set a time limit. But I do want to give both urban animal car a few minutes because they've been very patient and or I think Andy in terms of your model that I hear that you were looking at your model would produce a million dollar deficit. Is that correct. My model would, but that's why I was suggesting that it needs to be tested by the professionals. Yes, and I was not putting counting in additions to stabilization fund so that if we are committed to $200,000 for this stabilization fund for reparations that would make the deficit 1.2 million under that calculation. So, as I understand it the reserve fund is above $23 million if I'm not correct. And that's, that's going to be there and it helps you can be added to. So it's above $23 million. I can't remember the last time I looked at it. So that's one thing to remember. The other thing is that what we are looking at when we look at it in terms of real dollars. The present $200,000 saying cannabis funds if it were then modeled to be put into the stabilization fund for age age already. That's then a quarter of 1% of the entire budget. That's then a quarter of 1%. So, when I hear people talking about this being some kind of threat to the budget. It sort of stuns me. If a quarter of 1% is a threat to the budget moving forward, then we certainly have a huge, huge physical problem in this time. So, to make one point and I'm going to call an ML car response would you just said in that is that the stabilization fund one of the things that we want to do is sometime soon get an explanation made for the finance committee. To what it is that how the stabilization fund fits into the building projects. Because it was designed the reason that we deliberately set aside that large of a stabilization fund was to assist with the building projects and it's a very important element to it. Because if we don't use it strategically, we not only don't have an even payment method, but we have to ask for even a larger taxi exclusion override. And maybe I see if Sean has more to say on that subject. So much more to say on that I think I was just going to sort of add to what or so which, you know, I don't think we are have a fiscal problem but I think we have a large fiscal challenge I think the council has the council town manager the town itself has decided to fund the EI press that wants to fund the EI we we wanted to fund additional firefighters, and we want to fund for new building projects, and in a relatively short period of time. In addition to the climate resiliency action plan and reparations I think when you add all those things together over a span of five to 10 years that does create some real large fiscal challenges, I'll say so. And I realize that 200,000 it seems small relative to the context of our budget, but when you start adding up the additional things that we're trying to fund within that budget. I think you start to see sort of why it is so challenging is because there's a lot that we're trying to do. I'm here now. It's been great to be on this African heritage reparations assembly with her roads Dr roads I've always wished we could have been on the school committee together I wish the boat had gone a little differently, and we would have both been on that we probably could really moved hammers forward into the 21st century, if we have been on there together, everything he said is is is all to the point the one other thing I would just say, which is where you all deliberation has been really concerning to me. You know, Andy, the money is going to be there. You know, I already feel like we've compromised so much we backed away from saying let's earmark can. All right, you know, I was beaten down in the assembly on that and and Alexis and I and whatnot we were beaten down. So we compromise we got this thing we're doing now with you and you're fighting that come on folks. The money is going to be there. It'll be there in the stabilization fund, whatever you squirrel away, and if conditions are different if it's like, oh Chris can't move forward. There's no money or di officer is going to leave if she doesn't get some. The fund is there. Just check in with whatever the successor body is to the African Heritage Reparations Assembly is all I'd say is check in and say hey we the council think we we got a crisis here and we want to we need to dip in to that. Let's say it built up to 750,000 we're going to dip into that 750,000 to do this. Maybe the successor body completely agrees, because it makes them maybe they don't but you still have the power. The money is there. The only piece here is what my chair has said already and your fellow counselor Michelle Miller has said already, it's showing the commitment that we matter, and that the harms are clearly recognized. The historical structural racism, the ongoing, and that we're, you're going to have some ongoing commitment that this is that this is something to work with. Once we can we have this picture, we can go full steam in getting and consulting with the community, bringing forth more specific proposals, getting them legally tested the way the way Evanston did so again, it's not like this hasn't been done. And yes, we will get our specific proposals to all see that they pass legal muster. So, you know, I have no doubt, but we do need this, this support. Thank you. Thank you. Just real quick ask is, are there any members of the public who are attendees in the meeting who would like to be recognized for public comment at this point. And I think I have one hand up from Meg Gage. Can you bring Megan so that we can hear from her and then we'll go on. Hi Meg. Hi, Andy, thank you. Now. Okay. I thank you very much this is a really important discussion. Kathy, it makes me really nervous to say that because of the idea that that means I don't value people of color. I think we should try to have this conversation without assigning motives or appearances to things that we say, because we're having this is a substantial important discussion across several levels both finance and what I wanted to talk mostly about a strategy, as well as town politics. So we're not repeating what Kathy said I want to raise two additional points that relate to strategy the first one is that reparations is an attempt to correct hundreds of years of violent racism growing out of slavery, and many people including myself and Sandy Darity and Kristen Mullen who wrote just wrote this fantastic book last year I think it has to be done at the federal level, if we're going to do and it's it's in the range of $88 billion. And there are efforts at the federal level to make this it'll take a long time to make this happen. And I think you can I know Dr. Shavas has had the same conversations with Dr. Darity as I have. And we don't agree on this but the. I have been convinced that local efforts, if they don't also talk about the national need for reparations and solution racial justice solutions at the national level aren't going to in the end be meaningful and if they don't talk about it they could undermine it because people could think well we did it in Amherst we don't have to do it, you know, in Topeka Kansas or Biloxi Mississippi. The second strategy concern I have is that while I understand the idea that you can't have a program. If you don't know how much money you have. First of all a lot of us have done things with no money. And then the money comes because of the ideas of what we have, but more behind that is I don't understand what the strategy is in Amherst. So, for example, the mention was made about housing discrimination. That means somebody a person of color who comes here from another country will suffer from discrimination because they're a person of color. If that's what we're trying to do which was a really important thing to do then instead of talking about reparations this should be the racial justice committee or the under you know dismantling structural racism and then it would make a lot more sense because there are things in Amherst that we could do that would address that. And it, otherwise it doesn't. So the two strategy questions I don't understand what is this really reparations and how can you do it if it's not at the federal level. And the second is, what is the strategy in Amherst, you know, is it housing is it helping kids in school that I can, I just would like to know more about what it is so that we can have a discussion about whether this is the right strategy or not I could say, I've been doing so much for so many years and Amherst there's a lot more to say and it's not I'm just a person in the public so I'll stop but just add one thing is that I'm on the League of Women Voters Racial Justice Committee and we're going to have Sandy, Darity and Kristen Mullen do a webinar in December or January and we're organizing a book reading group of hoping to work with the library to organize a chance for people to read at least parts of the book before the webinar and we can have that discussion about with with them here. Thank you for the chance to speak and I was sort of anxious about taking this position. My friend. Oh, Dr. Irv isn't there anymore. I don't know. Anyway, but I think it's, I trust that we can have these discussions without judging each other as, you know, whether or not we have integrity but just these are points of view. Over. I'm going to, there's one more person from the public who's asked to recognize public comment. And then I'm going to, at this point we're getting on to the towards the end of the meeting and I need to call in Lynn, who's been very patient and wanting to make a motion. But, Lauren. Yeah. I just wanted to briefly state that I too as a public person and resident and a little frustrated and, you know, my mother had a saying when, you know, I was going up that beggars can't be choosy but I just don't feel like the HR or any other government, a referratory organization should have to come every year to the town council to, to ask for monies I think it would be easier for both those entities and the town council to as, as was said, make commitment and set aside whatever percentage to preparatory efforts to sort of justice justice efforts so that these this difficult conversation about money doesn't have to keep occurring every year and also the ARPA funds are federal funds but I would argue that they don't necessarily reach the people who most have met it all the time because again the structures in the town and it's not unique to Amherst are set in in institutions that have not always, you know, met the needs of people of color it's just how it is and it's more we can do but to always say that, you know, or say that, you know, we're not comfortable or we're not ready to make a financial commitment, I think, is disheartening and, you know, other areas such as Springfield they had a week long. And, you know, sometimes comparisons are helpful and sometimes they're not but you know what the town is doing is is is great but the last thing I'll say is the the school the new school budget which I understand is $105 million that is a large amount and did it have to be $105 million no but that's what you guys committed to and what you voted on and so I'm just saying that you know, communities of color they don't want to always be in the purse strings of the town we want to grow a fund that we can can, you know, we can draw on ourselves instead of like again having these difficult financial conversations every year about the ongoing efforts in the black community and communities of color. Well, thank you. I'm going to recognize one more public comment that I'm going to need to get back to concluding next step in our meeting. But Brianna Owens has also been having her hand up so Brianna. Thank you Andy. I just wanted to urge folks to stop using crass as a checkbox for our commitment to ending white supremacy safety for residents who identify as BIPOC cannot be the bar for restorative justice it really should be the bare minimum. And I just want to say I believe it's really important for black voices to be at the forefront of what is needed and what funds should be used for. Thank you. I'd like to make a motion I'm seeking a second so that I can then speak to my motion. Motion is the following that the finance committee recommends that the town council each year upon the certification of free cash by the Commonwealth of Massachusetts in Paris October, and upon the review and recommendation by the town's finance committee based on the town's overall fiscal health at that time that the town council add an amount equal to the certified cannabis tax revenue from for the previous year in Paris approximately July to the stabilization fund established for the purpose of reparations until such time as the fund equals $1 million. Okay, I'm prepared to put that on the screen. And then I would like to speak to it. So, I have to just say, I have spent a lot of time this week, last week, and even the weeks before trying to figure out given all of the many machinations of fiscal state and local rules. How to get something forward that's in the spirit of what the council has said in the past, but at the same times maintains the flexibility that I personally believe we need by not earmarking and by making sure that our town is fiscally healthy. I share many of the concerns that have been voiced here. I also share many of the concerns that have been many of the pleas that have been voiced here as well. If you do look at our budget book from this just this past year to be here that we are going the year that we just approve this budget in, you see a budget that projects in fact a deficit. Anything projected forward is still make believe it's not final. But at the same time, as we go into the certification of free cash, because of the fact that that budget was put together in March came forward to us in the beginning of May. We have are hearing about inflation. We're hearing about possible other fiscal problems. This motion is an attempt to honor, but set it in the context of the fiscal reality of where we may be. It also is an attempt to set give the AHRA and their future committees or whatever they recommend, at least a dollar amount to start thinking about. I'm not saying it can't be added to. In fact, I have very strong suggestions as somebody who's worked a lot with nonprofits about how to structure some of the funding that they're looking at. It also allows the town manager to include cannabis revenue in the development of the budget each year. But we do end up with free cash. And if we pass this motion, then I would also like to reconsider and withdraw the motion that we approve that we voted on last time. Because first of all, I think it's somewhat sloppy. And second of all, this would take care of this year, and the year's going forward up to 1 million. That's all I need to say. Michelle and Kathy. I'm actually going to suggest an amendment to this. So if Kathy would like to go first, I'm good with that. I have one question. I support this motion. I have one question. And I also support rescinding the motion we took last week or whenever we took it. So, in my reading this, it says add an amount equal to it doesn't have, but before that it has unreview and recommendation so in as an example, if certification of free cash was $250,000 a small amount. Does this add an amount equal to the cannabis tax revenue, if it equal that so it does this tie our hands to a specific amount, or is it, is it flexible enough to not do what, you know, not do you have to come every year and ask for money. And then it's saying this is the stream. So, Lynn, it's just as you thought about writing it because it's got two sentences in it and how would they work together is my question. Right. And, and I, you know, this was written after listening to everybody. And if we ended up with a really small amount of free cash, I wouldn't just say, I am totally and completely respectful of what Irv has said today. Amakar has said today, and everyone else, when we're in serious trouble, then we work together to come out of it. But if we're not in serious trouble, and we have taken care of making sure the budget we just passed in June is still bunch, still balanced, and we've taken made sure that we're still moving forward on our big and small capital projects including improving roads and yes, it gives you that flexibility, but it makes sure that every year we return to this that we return to it with a benchmark, both of what we're looking for in cash to move. And it gives us a maximum level, which could be raised in the future. Then I'm comfortable with the wording then. Thank you. Thank you, Lynn, for this very much appreciate it and also the words that you spoke. I would like to amend this to reflect what the HRA has put forward. And at the last line reparations until such time as the fund equals 2 million is my amendment. And I, of course, would need a second for that. I second that. Okay, there's motion is made and seconded. I want to speak to you motion and I see Sean's hand up to. Yeah, thank you. I to two short points. One, and I know we are not Evanston but just for comparison sake Evanston set aside $10 million their budget is four times hours. My second point is, I did a lot of number crunching around this, especially looking at it from an endowment perspective, which is I think something that we've talked about and that Sean talked about initially when we were setting this up. And so if we're thinking about an endowment of 4%, for example, we're talking about very little money in the first years of this. We're talking about a million to 2 million we're talking about the difference between 40 K and 80 K a year to work on these reparative initiatives that come forward so while I feel that 1 million is a solid commitment I feel that 2 million is the right commitment. It is a very, very meaningful commitment. And if we do consider this in the light of an endowment it will give us much more flexibility to pursue the types of initiatives that I know the, the residents of black residents in the community would like to pursue. Sean. Yeah, so I'm just trying to think about this from a staff perspective in terms of what this actually taking this motion what it means so. I assume each year, we would still have to bring an order staff would still have to bring an order forward. And that order would still have to go to finance committee and be considered and then be brought back. So again, I just want to maybe clarify what this action is and does the town manager have a role in this is this is this guidance to the town manager or is this not involving the town manager. I guess those are my two questions from a staff perspective. It is guidance to not only the town manager and staff, but it's guidance to the council. And the guidance also includes and relies on the town manager and you, Sean, as our director of finance to lay out where you think we stand with regard to our physical health at the time we're looking at free cash. We would require every year just like we did last year, a couple different financial orders that move money one way and move other money another way and move money into whatever. So, yes, it requires a yearly action. Okay, I think as long as we make it clear that this is not a financial order this is, this is right. Yeah. That's my, that is my clarity on it. Okay. I just says, there's been a proposed amendment. Do we have to do we first vote on the proposed amendment. And then we go back to the original of the proposed amendment fails. Is that what we would do. Okay. So I think what we want to do is see if there's any more discussion on the motion. So, seeing no further request for discussion on the motion. I think we're ready to move forward on about the motion in the motion is the motion to amend the substitute 2 million for 1 million. So, it put my resident members in some alphabetical question but I, Bob Hegner on has his hand up Andy's. Sorry. Well, if it's okay to still ask a clarifying question. To clarify, is this asked, is this motion recommending that we transfer from free cash. I know it talks about that in the beginning, but it doesn't actually say to transfer from free cash to the stabilization fund it just says add to the stabilization fund, which maybe is the intent for it to be flexible in that way where it wouldn't necessarily have to be a transfer from free cash but I just wanted to clarify that. The intent that it would be transferred at the time we certify free cash so therefore I assume that amount we certify is the free cash right. Right. I'm just at the bottom or says add an amount. I don't know if you wanted to say from to transfer an amount from free cash equal to the certified because add to the stabilization fund we could do in in other ways potentially. Can I say something. You can have a financial order without a dollar amount in there so this, you can vote this order the way you have it but it doesn't commit us to moving money from free cash we would have to have a financial order that would come forward to the council that you would have to vote. Once we have once we have the money certified. So we can't say a fictitious amount that we don't know what it is do I would not even accept that for us to do that. So let me play out this year scenario. Okay, this year in October, along with having that certified free cash, there would be a financial order to transfer the amount equal to the cannabis revenue which I think is somewhere between 2000 and something to from the free cash that was certified to this stabilization fund for reparations that's in my mind how this plays out. Okay, does that work Sonia. I, you're the financial experts. I'm just trying to, I think we understand the intent. If somebody if it wasn't us I just want to make clear that other people understand the intent. Yeah, from this, from this order we could not just go ahead and move it from free cash we would have to bring a real financial order with a real dollar amount and a real funding source. We have to cancel. And I just want everybody to understand that this doesn't say to us, move it automatically. No, this make this means you have to bring it to us, as we look at free cash and make all of those motions. Okay, in October. If it weren't anyway wouldn't it because it would say, since it says at the beginning recommends the town council each year upon certification and that's can only happen with the town council action. Matt Holloway. Hi, thank you very much Andy and Michelle and the entire group I'm really grateful for this and I think it's incredibly important. I have to admit I'm struggling with this quite a bit. I guess for two reasons, you know, one is that I think this is the this to me sort of infers or indicates that the entire cannabis tax revenue for the town of Amherst should should be dedicated to the reparations which I think is a slightly I heard last time and, you know, I am a little bit concerned that our that our current cannabis program doesn't have any minority or diversity or equity participants in any way in terms of vendors so I, I guess, you know and I gather that we have probably more study to be done around that cannabis revenue stream but it's not, I guess I haven't been totally persuaded that that the entire cannabis stream should be dedicated to reparations. And I realized that that's kind of implied within this order that it's not explicit but I just have to say that that does seem to be a pretty strong implication here especially, you know, based on the previous vote which I agree was a little slippery. But the other thing is that, you know, this does sort of to Sean and Sonia's points this this does feel like a policy recommendation and something that's going to lead to annual sort of debate show I don't debate the right word but there's going to be a challenge annually to make this to make this review and recommendation and for the town council council to, you know, then then make that addition to the budget. So, on some level I guess I would, I would, I would feel that the council should make a policy decision on this, you know, as opposed to being a finance committee issue specifically and, and then I guess my final point is it does come back to me to a response that Kathy raised at the outset which is, you know, to whom are these funds being directed and, and for what purposes you know and I, I totally respect the need for having some money to be able to appropriate towards that. I think there is, I know there is, you know the seed money available and, and I guess as a finance committee member and as a relatively new resident member. I feel more comfortable if I, if I knew what it was that I was funding when a financial decision came before us and I certainly recognize the, you know, historic historicity of this moment and the historical implications of this work but I just I want to voice my, my discomfort here and then, you know, especially knowing I guess that the resident members will be called to vote on first I, you know, I wanted to get that out there because I, you know, I may. I just want the community to come out and support of this to be to be totally honest. Andy, could I clarify something. Yes, please go ahead. So, um, the stabilization fund is just a bank account that we're putting the money in in order to spend any of that money another order would have to be put together for the purpose that we're spending it and there would be debate and it would be a two thirds vote for it to be that. So the concerns about what it's being spent on would really kind of happen at that point. Great. I just want to clarify that. I think that there's, you know, we started the meeting I said, we may not come to a conclusion today. And there's additional information that we might want to obtain. There are a couple of things that I had thought about that did not arise during the discussion so far and I'm going to just mention what they are, because ultimately, it's up to a voting member of the committee to move to postpone consideration until next meeting, which you'd only do if you feel that additional information is essential. And therefore, it's not a motion I'm making I'm just pointing out that it's an available motion. One thing is, is that we've talked about this being an endowment it's been recognized as an endowment and the amount of money that would be available. I don't know how much money is generated. But we are not the Jones library trustees in the separate organization. And as the town. We have limitations on what we can do an investment of town funds. There's absolutely zero discussion about what those investment options are for the town and what can be brought forward in projected revenue from those sources. I think that that's one thing that's kind of just been assumed away in the discussion without any additional discussion about it. And the other, which was alluded to a little bit, but hasn't been really substantially discussed either as whether there's any information becoming available. Cannabis revenue because there's certain factors out there that I can think of that might increase cannabis revenue but there's also a large number of factors that I think indicate a decrease in cannabis revenue. It's really foggy amount and the people feel comfortable knowing that it could go up or could go down and it's partly for our own discussion but partly because I think we owe it to the council. Since this is a recommendation to take something to the council to make sure that the council is fully informed. But having said that, that they were back on the floor for discussion and to vote on only the motion to add to the $1 million to make it $2 million at the very end of the motion. That's the motion that's on the floor. So, when I'm calling for a vote. It's not on any of these other issues right now it's whether to change the $1 million to $2 million. Is there any final discussion on the change of the amount. So, seeing none. I'll go ahead and Michelle's got her hand up Michelle. Yeah, I apologize. I think that Alicia may have lost connection and is planning to be back. So I know that complicates things in this moment, but I'm pointing that out that's important. Because we don't want to deprive the voting member of an opportunity to participate in the vote. It's my understanding she'll be back very shortly, but I don't know. As soon as you know anything as to whether she's going to be able to get back. I haven't heard from her but as chair you can pause the discussion while we wait for her to reconnect. Okay. I'm not going to be the person who's absent from the meeting today and I feel badly about that is bring to be back. But, you know, I've let it go forward with Bernie but I feel uncomfortable about letting it go forward if we can't get Alicia back. She, I believe will be back shortly Andy if you're willing to just wait a few minutes. I do believe she'll be back shortly. So let's change to a different topic entirely we're taking to put aside the discussion the votes and the motions that are on the floor, just for housekeeping measure. That is that you should be getting a poll. I think that's where Athena is where we have it right now for possible dates for finance committee meeting for July. And if this discussion ends up having to be continued because Alicia comes back that's what the plan would be. Secondly, I think we were going to at that point. I don't know if this is his hand up but was, we were hoping that John would be able to give a fresh explanation of what the current plan is for financing for major projects, same time Sean. Sorry, I'm going to be in Alaska that day so I won't be able to know just. Yeah, I was just going to check in Andy. I know we've got quite a few minutes that we have to, and let's say, I don't know for approving them offline or not but I just, we did get a request for some minutes so maybe at that, at the next meeting we could try to get a bunch of the minutes approved. Yeah. I may need to actually call on members of the committee to help, because we found that there was a problem with the last set of minutes that I looked at, and then didn't catch an error on and ordered anyone else which was that I said that there had been no vote taken on the North Cam, North Common Project, and there was. And this is not meant as a reflection on persons taking minutes was working very hard, but things get missed by the best of people, and it's important that we make sure that members of the committee, some members of the committee looks over the minutes and just double check on the minutes, even if it means reviewing key points of the tell the YouTube of the discussion. Andy, I would like to ask that you as chair, divide the minutes up among those of us on the committee that were in attendance at those meetings and on the committee because some may go back even further, and that we individually take the responsibility of reviewing them and trying to bring them back for approval on the 18. I do think this is a serious concern and I like all the members of the committee and even Bob is a non voting member is shaking his head yes maybe he'll do some to that we all take some responsibility for some of these and we try to bring them back and get them done. I can work with Athena because she probably can. She is, she has the minutes she hasn't sent them to me which is, but that has to happen and then she can also work with me to know what's available. Michelle. So we should just go ahead and or Lisa's back. Where in the audience, bring her in the audience is the problem. Okay, Lisa. Please confirm that you're here. I am thank you all so much sorry about that. Okay, so the motion on the floor is a motion to amend. The motion that would change the number at the bottom that for the ultimate goal is one is $2 million, replacing the term, the words $1 million in the motion, you know, see it on the screen. We've had substantial discussion on it we were only waiting to vote until you were back in the room. And what we're going to do is I think go ahead and start with stay with the alphabetical but I'm going to skip down a few and and then go alphabetical from there. So I don't put the burden that was on our resident members to go first. Yeah, Michelle. Yes. Kathy. No. I'm going to say no. Alicia. Yes. I am unmuted. No. And I want to hear from. The two, two million. And Matt. I don't support. So the motion, the vote that has come out right now is we had two yes, three no from the voting members one support, one non support from the resident members and the other absent a resident member. So it remains as $1 million. They're for back to the motion on the floor. And I don't think unless I see hands up. I think we're ready to vote on it. And I'm going to start with. Kathy. Okay. I hate to prolong this. And I would be more comfortable with an amount up to the certified, because it does it's committing us to a specific dollar amount. But given how long it, that other one just took his amount up to so it would be an amendment. And I'm proposing this if I don't know whether there's a second. I think we had a really long meeting. Yeah. That's what I would. That's the way I would word it. If we can ask for clarification, that's an amount up to rather than equal to the certified cannabis tax revenue. Is that correct? Is that what you meant? Yes. Yes. Exactly. Is there a second. I just asked Kathy a question. I don't understand what the differentiation, could you help me understand this. Equal, equal means exactly whatever the cannabis tax was up to means it could be something less. Up to the certified cannon. Oh, okay. I see what you're saying. I would have to, the amount would have to be decided is what you're saying. Well, yeah, you would start to you have a cap on it and I'm, and the notion of that we're building up a fund equal a million I would leave just as it is. So I don't even know whether there's a second to this, how long it just took it to do the first part, but that would make me more comfortable. Is there a second. Seeing no second. Fine. I'll give you a second motion. I'm fine. I'll give up. Okay. So I'm going to start with. Just move down one in the alphabet and start with, with Kathy. Can you just come back to me. I think I'm going to abstain. I abstain. Okay. I was going to come back to you, but. I can make a decision. Okay. I'm going to vote yes. Lisa. Yes. Yes. I support. Matt. I support. And Bernie is absent. Michelle. Yes. So that carries. I think we have four yeses. When abstained from the voting members. And support one non support. New resident members and one resident member absent. Both. Support. Support entity. Yes. So. Okay. Okay. Okay. Turning that up to yes. Four in favor. One abstention. Two residents. No, we, we died. Kathy just changed her vote. Oh. And Kathy, what was it? No, I didn't change my vote. Andy. I've just said the two residents both supported. You said one. Sorry. You said one supported one didn't. So it is. So it is. Okay. So. Okay. Okay. I'll just mention the voting members and two support. From the resident members. Yes. Okay. That's what the. Record will reflect. So with that. I. You have no other business to report. We'll let you know the date for the next meeting. Okay. Unless there's another request for an anticipated item, I think we can adjourn. The only question I have. Andy is. Lynn's. She had a linked one of rescinding. The vote we took last time. Oh, thank you. By doing this, did we just rescind the other? No. No, we have to officially rescind. So I would like to move for re reconsideration. The previous vote taken on. June. Seventh. Yes. And have it struck. And we send that. Resin that motion. Shane seconds. For the sake of time. I will. Two motions to be combined. Two actions to be combined. A single motion. And I will. Start with myself on this one with the yes. Lisa. I'm sorry, Andy. To hold things up, but it's the, it was the motion to recommend the town council as the town manager to direct the staff to prepare an order. Yes. Okay. I just wanted to make sure that we're talking about the right thing. So I'm going to include that in the motion. Is that okay? Yes. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Lisa. This is merely. To allow us to. We send the last motion that was made at the previous meeting since this replaces it. Lisa. I'm sorry, Andy. Can I ask that you read the motion. The motion, the current motion on the floor is to reconsider and rescind the vote taken on June seven. The motion is to rescind the vote taken on June seven. The town council asked the town manager to direct the staff to prepare an order to transfer an amount of free cash to a stabilization fund. And the actual amount of the FY. 22 cannabis tax receipts. And Alicia, the reason to rescind is because this motion already takes care of it. The motion we just passed. The new motion. Yeah. The new motion takes care of this. The current year and future years. Okay. So we will still have something in place for this current year. By voting to rescind this. Motion. Okay. Thank you. Yes. Okay. Lynn. Yes. The outcome is the same as what you're saying. It does. Because this one, the one was passed the last meeting only encompassed. The current year. And this one encompasses the current year and future years. Okay. So we will still have something in place for this current year by voting. Okay. Yes. Bob. I support. Yeah. Support. Bernie is absent. Michelle. Yes. Kathy. Yes. So I think the. Andy. How do you vote? Yes, I vote yes. And we started with. No, I support it. No, I support it. No, I support it. Okay. So we have heard from everybody. And who's present. And it's four. Yes. I'm sorry. And. Both support. From the two present. Resident members. And not one absence from a resident member. So with that, um, back to where we were before, I think we have no further business. I've seen no hands up for questioning for the business. So we are adjourned. Thank you. Thank you.