 Hey everybody tonight, we're gonna be debating flat earth and to start us off our flat earth side And we're gonna kick it over to witsett and Karen for their up to 12 minute Introductory statements the floor is all yours guys Awesome, so I share my screen. Thanks for having us Yeah, it's up on the screen now Okay All right let's do it um So we're gonna I'm gonna cover a very basic thing. Let me start the timer Hopefully this audio good. I may not have shared with sound. Sorry. I got a reshare Off to a great start So share sound There we go All right Just to cover some basics here people claim that we live on a ball Not that one's also is embarrassing but according to the globe model There is a point on the globe where the alleged curvature of the earth begins to obstruct distant objects under the globe This point is referred to as the horizon and is marked by necks on the diagram One can determine the distance to the alleged globe horizon in miles by taking the square root of the observer's height and feet and Multiplying by 1.225 or you can simply use an online calculator like this one or this one According to the global very point on the very simple stuff people say that most disappear over the curve of the earth That's how people discovered thousands of years ago that the earth's a ball. We were all told this we've been looked into it That wasn't the case now the globe claim has changed since then which is pretty hilarious So let's define horizon It's the line at which the earth's surface and the sky appear to meet So it's an apparent it's an apparent location Rise on the globe. There's a physical tangible real Horizon called a geometric horizon curve of the earth now We were all stupid clerfs and we can just go out to the ocean and watch at the earth's a ball because things go behind this physical curve But once we started seeing hundreds of miles further than that The claim changed to oh, we never see the actual curve of the earth We can never see the geometric horizon. We only see the apparent one, but I promise there's a real one there And if you deny it, you're crazy, which is convenient. So let's look into this We're zooming in on a boat here as you can see the bottom of that boat is partially obscured Of course, it's in water and you can see the horizon is behind the boats Isn't that interesting? So obviously that part of the bottom of the boat is obstructed Doesn't have anything to do with the earth being a ball the horizon is behind the boats Okay Here's this magical earth curve again looking at a boat and There goes the boats So of course you're changing your aperture as you zoom in and out your optical limit And then you see a horizon relative to that and you see objects. Well, you can look at your naked I'm like, oh, I saw that boat going away. It must go over the curve of the earth Which is what Aristotle allegedly did without a telescope or anything mind you of course And that proved the earth was a ball thousands of years ago So basic stuff the sky is ramping down to your eye level converging into the Horizontal vanishing line that people call the horizon That's actually where the word horizontal came from the word horizon and the ground's ramping up to eye level Converging into this horizontal vanishing line. The horizon is merely an apparent location The horizon is defined as again where the sky appears To meet the ground now of course the sky doesn't actually converge into the ground It's just an optical location So we have a limit to how far we can see relative to optical angles and atmosphere conditions and the atmost conditions also move the horizon back and forth closer to you further away specific angles are called the propagation angles and These are going to be reception and propagation angles relative to your Resolution limit of the for example for the human eye that falls down below 0.2 degrees. You can't see it 0.02 degrees. So anyway, optical diffraction line mirroring zone there if you see this picture obviously the horizon is not physical It looks like the boat's up in the air, but the horizon appears to be down here. That's not the curve of the earth The boat's on the water above it So here's something called um diffractions is looking at Rayleigh criteria from harvard university They did an experiment where they showed two lasers actually begin to converge as you change the Aperture now people claim that sunsets are impossible on a flat earth They're gonna continue to say that until they die probably But this is actually for the honest people that aren't going to lie about the evidence Here you can see you can look at the left picture and say well Let's say that's the sun the circle that is the sun as we change the aperture The bottom of that sun begins to disappear and merge into that line in the middle It's called the diffraction line because you're changing the aperture. This is exactly what we see with the sun So if the earth was actually round and specifically a sphere that's curving at a specific rate In the horizon we see would drop while we gain altitude But that's not what we see as you can see right here. We're going up and the horizon's going up from its original point So that's an optical effect based on perspective that the earth is supposedly curving down away from us But i'm going up and the horizon is going up again As you see here, the horizon's going up and down throughout the day It's just an optical effect in a parent location So the sky appears to meet the ground when it when it's clear outside you can see further That's all there is to it, which is why flat earth exists. We went and tested the globe claim and it isn't real So that's all I really want to cover because I feel like no one ever really seems to want to address this The globe claims there's a physical geometric horizon that blocks things in the distance But what we see in reality is that the horizon is just apparent It just goes up and down it changes based on atmospheric conditions And we have a limit to how far we can see believe it or not contrary to the claims that are absurd and popular nowadays We cannot see forever. You are not superman And you know this intuitively that you can't see forever because that's an insane claim Now I do want to cover this part again because this will certainly come up people claim that sunsets are impossible on a flat earth This is just absurd Again, this is an experiment done by harvard showing the Rayleigh criteria based on the diffraction line So you have an eye level You have a diffraction line and then the angles relative to that diffraction line is what causes it to disappear Because it can no longer be resolved and when you lose resolvability You can no longer see what it is that you're looking at Then it's specifically relative to the reception and propagation angles of what you're observing And that's in relation to the eye level, which is why again this circle here The position of these lasers that are perceived as circles did not change in the experiment What changed was the aperture. So again, it's just an optical diffraction line Uh, the horizon is not physical. It's just a parent And if you're going to claim that there is a real physical tangible geometric horizon called the curvature of the earth You're going to actually need to tangibly and physically prove that not just beg the question So that's what happened the globe changed to move the goalpost to claim like, oh, you're so stupid You can't you don't know we see the curve of the earth every day when things disappear They change it to oh, we never see the curve of the earth, but I promise that it's there So that's pretty much the basic tenets of this discussion. Um, that's a little over half my back here and be but hopefully It's clear some stuff up for you guys because it seems to be a pickup There you go. It's all right Awesome. All right. We'll end the screen share there. Thank you so much for that. What's it gets it? And we're going to kick it over to Karen for your up to six minute introductory statement Thanks for being here. Um, all righty. Thank you so much for having me Well, um What I can say in addition to what wits it said because I agree with all of that and those are all, um, wonderful observations and good points and But one thing that we have done as flat earthers that that I haven't really seen globe earthers do is actually go out and try to physically measure the curvature of the earth which They do give us a given size unlike the the the lights in the sky that we cannot see We cannot actually physically go measure like that is just beyond anybody's capability to basically Go and and verify whether or not that's true. We all are here on the face of the earth and we all have the ability to um, put those numbers to the test and while The the globe math that they give you for the lights in the sky does work out because they put everything so far away You know, it could it could be anything up there, you know The the numbers don't really mean that that's reality But they do give us a size and shape for the globe earth And that is what we like to put to the test because that is that is what we actually are physically standing on so Um, if I could get a screen share Let me see Share my second desktop here This is actually a pdf. It's um, it's a 120 page pdf that was put together by FECore, which is a group of People who were questioning the shape of the earth and we all went and spent a lot of money and a lot of time and body equipment and documented very well Where we went and we tried to measure the Define curvature. Um, every time we did this we found none. So, um, you know This pdf right here is just basically an outline of the measurements we took over like balaton and hungry It was the that is like the largest lake in europe Um, so there was plenty of positions there for us to get multiple measurements over Um, a few over the week that we were there They also that the team went and did the same thing in the netherlands And at each time that they went and measured they were able to observe um things on the opposite side of the lake the source of the laser light And um things that they shouldn't see that were things that should be beyond the geometric curvature of the earth So if you believe that the earth is a ball and you believe That the water conforms to the outside of the shape of this ball There is going to be that should be the place where there should be the most obvious curvature um, but Alas, there is none. Um, I don't really have time to go over the whole Of 120 page document. It is there for um, I can give anybody the link who wants to read it, but um all of the surrounding Data was taken temperature humidity Um distances were were well documented We had we even have a video of it where we took video observation of all of this stuff that was taken Um, and we found that it was in that the measurements were inconsistent with the Wgs 84 uh ellipsoid model that they supposedly say that the earth is So That is why I am a staunch flat earth or I have seen it proven it measured it with my own eyes Um, so there it is that's really all I have to present at this moment How long is that I still have more time? Um Yeah, I was just I looked at the clock just before you began I think you still got what another two minutes about if you want to devamp, but if not we can kick to the other side Um I guess that's good. All right. Let me let me say one thing. Let me uh, Can we please not use fallacies this and we just to talk about the intellectual aspects of the conversation And fallacies are in and miss one intellectual form. They lack sound reasoning. They are invalid arguments Let's not ad-hom interrupt use straw man's use poisoning the well fallacies are begging the question fallacies are affirming the consequence fallacies Hopefully we can be honest and not use fallacies. Thank you All right. Well, I'll definitely try to make sure there's no mud slinging for sure if we want to end the screen share for now And what we'll do is we'll kick it over to uh oszion for uh our globe side Bitar actually just got here. I messaged him about 10 minutes before we started and like a champ He said he would come in here and be the hero of the evening and fill in So we really appreciate you being here bitar and uh Helping us out here tonight with this conversation. So we'll kick it over to oszion for up to six minutes And then we'll kick it over to you. So thank you oszion for being here as well all right, i'm Oszion and i'm here today to talk about the evidence for a curved earth and I am going to do A screen share also right here And it is of drone footage. Hopefully that sharing looks like it is Sure is all right I'm going to be using drone footage to Demonstrate how this footage is evidence for curved earth and against a flat earth and how you can see curve and an altitude As low as 150 feet above sea level I'm not arguing for a horizon curve, but for curved bodies of water. So check this out I got this drone footage of a ship that's a few thousand feet away As the drone ascends the ship appears to get narrower and taller This is because the surface of the earth curves away from the drone as it ascends If the earth were flat and the ship would appear to get shorter and narrower as it ascends But it doesn't it gets narrower and taller as you can see in the footage Why because the earth is curved Let me explain on a flat surface If you have a side view of a ship and the ship and the observer at the sea level The side view will always have the same ratio of angular size and height and width No matter how far away you are from the ship However, as you go up in altitude the angular size of the height of the ship will change at a greater rate than the Angular size of the width of the ship This would mean the ship will appear to get shorter and narrower as you ascend in altitude on a flat surface However on a curved surface to ratio the angular size of the ship's height and width will not be the same At all distance. This is because the surface of the earth curves away from the observer Blocking the bottom of the ship as the observer gets further away As a result the ship will appear to get shorter as the observer gets further away But in the image you're seeing you're actually going up in altitude up to 150 feet with my drone And as you can see the ship is getting taller And it's actually not changing very much in width. It changed very little In summary if a ship is 2000 feet away horizontally I'm not sure exactly how far away it is. I think it's probably at least a thousand feet away As we raise the camera from sea level to an altitude of 150 feet The ship would appear shorter and narrower on a flat surface But taller and narrower on a curved surface As you can clearly see when the drone ascends the ship appears to be taller and narrower This is consistent with the predictions we made about how the ship would appear on a curved surface The pixel measurements of the ship's height and width at sea level and 150 feet in altitude can Burn this as you can see I put the measurements I used in adobe photoshop The ship's height increased by about 20 percent as the drone ascended and the width decreased by about two percent The fact that the ship's width barely changed is because there is a curved body of water blocking the ship That vanishes when the drone rises in altitude And the drone is maintaining a similar relative distance to the side of the ship facing the drone And I encourage you all to do the same measurements on your own to compare A flat earth hypothesis would predict that the ship would appear to get shorter and narrower as it ascends But the fact that the ship appears to get narrower and taller As it ascends Contradicts a flat earth hypothesis because the only way for the ship to appear to get narrower and taller Is if the surface of the earth is curved In conclusion the footage I've shown you is evidence for curved earth and against the flat earth I have experienced curve and I've tested curved and refuted the flat earth model I know that the earth is curved and it is not flat based upon my own testing and my own evidence So the questions for you guys when we get to that Why did the ship appear to get narrower and taller as the drone ascended instead of shorter and narrower Narrower as a drone goes straight up Which would put it further away from the ship overall And I'm going to conclude my opening there A1. Well, thank you for that. Uh I'm gonna say it wrong again. Ozion. Okay. Oh zone like ozone. I gotta try to remember that. Okay Thanks for that oozian anyways Everybody I just want to remind you that modern day debate is a neutral debate platform where we host debates on science Politics religion you name it. We will host it Uh, we have our six minute intro over here for a guitar Who is new to modern day debate and like I said, we just pulled them in a couple minutes ago. So, uh, you know Depending on your interactions in the past you might have a lot to say here or you might want to have a skeptics talk It's okay. Um, but we're just happy to have you here. So we'll kick it over to you for up to six minutes and thanks again Yeah, so I just want to remind everyone that I was invited like 10 minutes ago And I I study software engineering. I don't study like in the same campus as I as I frequent We have our space engineering other engineers, but software engineering. We only have physics one So I don't know much about physics. Okay Uh, as uh, somebody else from the same university I frequent which is but has an university that could be here and No more about this stuff But I uh know some basics which is enough to to prove that flat earth falls Uh, and that's why I took uh, this object right here This object actually has a twisty puzzle and it has 12 sites And if you take uh, uh, let's suppose this is a ball. Okay, and let's suppose this is the moon And here's the flat earth. Okay. So if you have somebody So, okay, can you see that? Uh, it's uh, no, you can see that But yeah, like imagine somebody who is on this side and somebody who is on this side Okay, they're on different sites and then the moon which is uh a ball is uh over here Then the person who is on the right of the paper and the person who is on the left of the paper They would see uh Different faces of the moon The truth is we always see the same face of the moon and that proves the earth is not flat If the earth was flat, we should see the moon from different perspectives Oh, but maybe the moon is not a three-dimensional object Which is what would happen with three-dimensional objects. Maybe the moon has two dimensions Um, let me find a two-dimensional object here. This will do okay If we have a two-dimensional object People watching it from this perspective as the object moves They would see, uh Imagine just the this is a ring. So they would see from the different perspectives They would see different shapes if the moon is two-dimensional Uh, they would see different shapes. We don't see different shapes of the moon Of course, uh during the same time, of course, I'm talking about the same time simultaneously someone here It's someone here the moon Uh, we see the moon differently over different times when I'm talking about simultaneously Uh from different perspectives just you should see something different uh So this proves that the earth is not flat if the earth was flat and the moon is three-dimensional then Uh, we should see different uh faces of the moon if the moon is true dimensional Then we we should see simultaneously. I'm talking about the same time. We should see different, uh Can you warn me, please when I have like 30 seconds left? You're muted, bro. Um Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, all right No, you usually uh, usually I just keep the loose eye on the clock there, but Yeah, you got you got like two minutes and two and a half minutes here Yeah, something else that I want to talk about is that we actually proven on a lab with something called the cavendish experiment I would share my screen uh had to show it to you, but uh, we don't have Like I I didn't separate the the material before But yeah, we've proven on a lab that mass affects mass uh, and what this would uh The consequence of this in a flat plane is that the further away you move from the center of mass of the object The more mass you'd have behind you So imagine as you move towards the ice wall You'd have more mass behind you attracting it and it would feel like climbing up a hill And that of course is not what we experience. I'm not I'm not I'm in brazil right now buildings You are not built. Uh, no are not built sideways because we are uh supposedly close Closer to the to the ice wall So, yeah, uh, because we've already proven on a lab with the cavendish experiment that mass affects mass Uh, we also don't see on the world what we would expect and also from the cavendish experiment and from, uh, uh Uniform circular movement circular movement. I think that's how it would be called in english We can conclude if I'm not mistaken the third law of kapler I hope I did the math right if I remember my high school days, but it's Period square equal period square over radius to the third would equal a constant Which is four pi square over the gravitational constant times the the mass of the of the object. So that's uh, uh, A law, you know from the cavendish experiment and from circular linear movement that should happen You know from from planets orbiting the the same thing And okay, you guys don't believe the earth is orbiting anything So why is it that when we look at Jupiter and its moons like, uh, Europa and guanimida that we can see clearly see Uh with telescopes, why is it that their periods and their uh, radiuses obey this law as they should if they Uh, if the gravitation was true, that's where kapler laws were taken from. So yeah, that's all I had to say All right, excellent. Well, everybody's had their introductory statements there So, uh, thank you everybody for that. We're going to kick an open discussion in a moment here But I want to remind everybody in the live chat to keep it friendly That's what we're trying to do over here at modern day debate And also, uh, we're doing a q and a at the end of this conversation So if you have a question for any of our speakers here tonight and get them in now So they can be asked nice and early. So let's kick it into the open discussion everybody Yeah, Kepler's law said nothing. Let's kick it. Kepler's laws had Kepler's laws had nothing to do But literally gravity didn't exist at all Nothing to do with it. It was he actually thought that uh, uh, sun was singing and it was an acoustic orbit It was based on acoustics So it didn't mean to do with gravity and it just watched the relationship with the stuff in the sky and so that's just not true Cavendish the guy that did it didn't account for electrosaxes just 10 to the 36 power stronger than gravity He's even claimed to be can't eliminate that variable and actually whenever you do it It's consistently falls outside of them are margin of error and you have like two 10 tele Kilogram balls you're trying to measure a force equivalent to like part of one cell And it's far beyond the margin of error and then of course you're just begging the question because you're not controlling the variable of electrostatics And ozzie and what I want to know from you because I'm not going to take over the whole debate But I want to know this right you saw my my intro right and I showed that we took the drone We went up and the horizon rises with the drone Yeah And in your video you showed that the horizon rises with the drone Yes, no it should be should be dropping down away from me and we saw the horizon was behind the boat And and you said that it shouldn't get taller as you get higher Getting further above the waves in the water in front of the boat so that now you can see from above the water No, the water was The water was smooth. It's a lake here on during the summer the waters were very very smooth. There weren't waves Okay, first of all first of all The wave there were waves in the water if you want to show the whole entire eyes again We all we all saw the waves, but it's not even just waves. It's basic perspective, bro I don't know what basic respect. Yeah, so like as you're lower to the ground things ramp up from that point If you go higher Because of perspective it's called it's called reception angles and propagation Yeah, it was a guess I mean, you know, he's still talking to me. It's okay. Keep going with it You realize that things ramp up optically due to perspective. Yes or no Rant so as you get closer to them, they look bigger as you get further away from it It looks smaller. Yes. And depending on the refraction You have in the air it can affect it too Non sequitur. We're not talking about the angular size and I'm not talking about Going very far from the object. It went up to 150 feet. The object is was close in So why did it get taller? So I predicted So I did my own experiment forget the whole body of science Forget kepler forget newton forget everything, you know So if I just go basic perspectives, right basic geometry basic surfaces basic shapes If I was to go um Up Right that when I look at if the object is flat like two-dimensional if I go up I'm going it's actually going to look narrower Faster than it would or it looked shorter Faster than it would look narrower But my drone footage when I go up this ship appears to look taller Faster than it looks narrower. So what explains that phenomenon? Okay Big rent Not answering the question. I'm just going to ask the question again. You brought up angular size. That was weird. That wasn't relevant due to perspective Bro, please answer this question due to perspective as things move away from you in the distance does the ground Appear to ramp up. Yes or no? No Okay, so this is the problem you're denying basic Reality so you can go look at anything you can go look at on the street lights down the streets What happens is the top starts to go down and the bottom starts to go up It's a fact that due to perspective. Um, it's a fact No Finally look at a picture of railroads like if you look at a picture Standing in a railroad and the picture is straight to the horizon. What are the what are the railroad tracks doing? They go away to the horizon So if I I have an elevation too, so it's coming up to my eye level If I lay down flat on the tracks and look down They don't raise up. I actually can't see that far when I'm at the altitude Of the tracks, right? Yeah, I'm knowing basic perspective now. Is this what we've addressed to I am arguing for my footage. That's it So if you want to deny that my footage doesn't show that just more the ship is exposed Because the waves were not blocking the ship. That's fine So they were not waves either the water was not blocking the ships You're trying to claim the waves were 20 foot tall the waves were not 20 foot tall The waves were maybe like six inches tall So there weren't many waves. It wasn't on the ocean It was on a lake Okay, can I share my screen real fast? I want to I want to go back to to what you said about kepler law You said oh kepler was about You said kepler was about uh, uh, uh, kinematics Sorry It's called kinematics, which is how bodies move in relation to each other not gravity Which is dynamics and it would he thought that there was like a Heavenly strong of the spheres that was played and that the acoustics caused everything to move around each other They use kinematic equations to describe the ratio in which the bodies move in relation to each other real fast as i'm sharing the screen Hey ozzie, can you tell me does it do these street lights look like they're going down in the distance? Do the street lights? No, they actually look like they're the same elevation Okay, so now in react now all of these street lights are the same heights Yes, obviously due to perspective it looks like they're dropping down as they get further away everyone all Based on my elevation can see it based on my elevation. Yes It looks like it's dropping down and it looks like the ground's coming up based upon my elevation Okay, so the things above our eye level look like they're coming down Things below it look like they're going up to a convergence point and things get smaller and pressed to that convergence point, right? I'm going with my foot. Are you denying that something would have that the water is not blocking the ship? Are you with the water blocking the ship? Why was the water blocking the ship? Oh, I was a water Why was why was 20% of the ship being blocked by water? It wasn't it was underneath The water because that was there normally floating floating so 20% of the ship 20% of the ship became exposed as my drone rose to only 150 feet in elevation. Why is that this doesn't explain it? This doesn't explain it 20% is a stretch. It sounds like you're not measured it. I measured it. It was 20% Super honest because when I asked you does the bottom look like it's ramping up you said no Now I had to go share my screen and show the whole audience So you're seeing that wait, wait, wait, you're seeing that Well, well, you're pointing out are you seeing the cars in the distance appear like they're taller than they should be Like the cars the taxis in the distance Is he looking no, no Will you please be honest you said that the ground doesn't look like it ramps up due to perspective Everyone heard you say that I had to go get a basic picture of street lights. This is day one perspective. It's Dude the bottom the top of the lights look like they're going down The bottom look like they're going up and it's getting smaller converging to the middle So yes, the ground looks like it ramps up just like I'd laid out in my opener So would you like to not avoid it? Don't avoid it. Well, you acknowledge your 40 might evidence It's nothing to do with my evidence at all You can't explain Why this why the lake was blocking 20% of the height of the ship that was actually above the water Yeah, we can't even get there because that has nothing to do Yes, it does with what you're describing. No, it doesn't literally does that That's why I brought it up But you can't even be honest about it. You can't even be honest and say, oh, I misspoke Yes, due to perspective things on the ground look like they ramp up. So can you please concede? Depends on my elevation how much it Perspectively looks like it changes It'll relevant to my argument. So we're addressing my argument or your argument if you want to address your argument That's fine that we can poke at that. But my argument had nothing at all to do that. But that so why Why was the water blocking 20% of the ship? Water at least low water is below the observer So it begins to ramp up as you increase your elevation Then it changes how much it's optically ramped up because you've changed your eye level thus your diffraction limit relative to the Reception and propagation angles of the object that you're viewing. This is basic riley criteria Of resolvability and angular resolution. Can you please acknowledge that you were wrong? And yes, due to perspective things ramp up from the ground No has nothing to do with what I what I showed In my video nothing at all to do with what I showed in my video So it has so you you still can't explain why 20% more of the ship became exposed When my drone went up in elevation Right, I literally explain that you did not literally. Yes, I did Yes, he did Yeah, so if the ship was flat, right, so wait let Karen be finished man. She's gonna die. Well, I was she was speaking so Anyways, go ahead Karen When your drone goes up in elevation it increases the angle you're that you're viewing angle. So more of it is visible Yeah, like on the on the topic You said you said very simple. You said that when the ship goes away What's it? You said that we don't see anymore due to refraction. That's what you said, right? The diffraction not refraction diffraction. Yeah, okay. Do you know the difference between diffraction and refraction? Why are you asking me when you just completed them? Yeah, of course So our fraction is is based on change from one medium to another how light track travels Which it doesn't by the way from one medium to another and then you have diffraction Which is actually about the dissipation of the light, right relative to obstruction or limitation an aperture diffraction happens when you have an object like That famous pink white album for example that that would be the fraction when the light goes through And when passing through an object Uh, I would be changes. It's rough fraction. Also, that's two different medium Yeah, but diffraction is based on if say if I look out to my eye level So say I'm looking at a mountain that's a hundred feet and I'm standing 10 feet above the ocean If I look out my eye level is at 10 feet So that means that the ocean is going to reach my eye level before the top of the mountain Because they're going to converge down to what's called the diffraction limit or a diffraction line That's where the eyes can no longer resolve The information because of the reception and propagation angles relative to your angular resolution limit That's diffraction diffraction and Rayleigh criteria relative to perspective I would love if we can just cover the basics honestly like yes perspective makes things look like they're going down From above you it makes things look like they're ramping up below you and they go to converge It's like railroad tracks like here and be tried to explain to you flip them on their side. They would do the same thing This is just basic perspective depends where you're at what your elevation is all types of things but Were you saying that I am below the horizon? Are you saying that I am below the horizon? I am physically below the horizon. Were you saying that? I might the horizon is not Was I physically below the ship? Physically below the the bottom of the ship I don't I don't know where you are. No, no. I know he went above it. You went above it. That's the whole point It started at zero It started at the surface of the water or like an inch above the surface of the water However, where the drone height is, right? Okay And then it rose 150 feet in altitude. So did the did the drone start below the bottom of the ship? Below the bottom of the ship. I mean, yes It would be really close, right? Because if the ship is on the water and then your drone's on the boat and it's pretty much the same height But do you agree that well, let's talk about the drone sitting on the beach Do you agree that due to perspective the water is going to look like it's ramping up from the perspective of the drone? Yes or no Could the drone at zero altitude? No, it did not look like it was ramping up So when I'm at the surface of the water, it does not look like I'm it's ramping up. It doesn't Okay, things in the distance as I go up as I go up in altitude. It does. Sorry, I interrupted you I don't get it man. I don't know why you guys deny basic perspective. You can go out and look at a street It shows like a real state of despair Be honest like you're you're denying like basic perspective. We should be able to get past this It's basic perspective So you're you're avoiding my video footage. You're avoiding what I saw with my own eyes That's all we've been talking about. Okay. So so yeah, so I saw I experienced Curvature I experienced where 20% of the ship became exposed not because the ship was going away But because my drone went straight up in altitude in a matter of seconds Now I change your angle of view when you did that. No Wow, so you don't understand basic things, bro. You don't like come on, bro, like So You're not changing your angle of view up and down it is. Yes, but no the angle of view is the same The angle of view is the whole thing's the same The angle of view of the camera doesn't change unless you change the aperture size if I remember correctly anything about cameras So you're seeing the angle of view of the camera changes Were you seeing the amount of land that becomes exposed? Changes as a drone goes up in altitude that would be correct No, the angle of view doesn't change the angle relative to the ground relative to the ground I didn't change the angle of view of the camera at all Dude does your angle of view get wider relative to the ground as you get higher yesterday? I know the angle stays the same The angle stays the same the amount of ground I see the the square footage of ground I see changes As they go up in altitude the angle the aperture doesn't change with my camera angle is not the same as aperture Whatever the angle of view My my field of view with the camera you see it's 150 degrees or whatever that is doesn't change The field of view doesn't change On my camera as it goes straight up in altitude Yeah, that's a strong man. We're a strong man. We know that your your lens has a certain Angle no, no, you're not listening. It's not a strong man Yes, it is listen, dude If I'm like 10 feet tall and I'm looking at a really tall building So there's an angle coming out from my eye Okay Now that the bottom of the angle is going to hit the ground first thus be cut off Thus the angle of perception The viewing angle that is perceivable Resolvable is smaller on the bottom in the top It's smaller as I get higher that angle gets bigger This is basic respect. No, it doesn't change. So the angle of your eyes It's not denying science. So you If you go sit in space Your angle of view is not being blocked by anything So you're seeing it because you stand on the ground Your perspective of the field of view your angle of view that you experience Is less because you're standing on the surface of the ground sure You experience less Science denying Yeah, I'm gonna have to show a video Go ahead It's crazy, but like it's this is probably the problem. This is why karen I brought up horizon and then I slid in really criteria So what I found out is people that have debated this for seven years or whatever They don't like they don't grasp perspective. Yeah, I got to find the visual effects I'm just like like this is a basic part of it The globe thinks the horizon is a physical location that blocks things in the distance No, I don't physical intent. Is there a physical geometric horizon? I don't believe so. No, it's it's sort of an optical illusion where the Sky in the ground converge Yeah, well, that's the apparent horizon, which is painfully redundant, but Yeah, the globe claims there's a geometric horizon called the curve of the earth Okay, right like I agree around the corner. There's a curve at the earth You can call that the horizon. Yes, they do call that the horizon What's your point? Okay, so you do believe there's a geometric horizon I believe there's a geometric curve if you want to call that an horizon they can't That that's the official definition of it from your paradigm called the geometric what's my paradigm? My paradigm was the video I showed Evidence I showed is my paradigm. What's my paradigm? You believe the earth's a globe. Am I am I arguing for science? Did I once argue for science? I think that was bit are right. So are you arguing for science? Are you arguing for the globe? Okay, go ahead I thought you were defending the globe model. I I'm defending that the earth is curved and it's not flat So you're not defending the official globe model. You have your own version of it Oh, I accept testimonial evidence from experts. So I'm okay with that too But what I have actually tested and experienced is that the earth is curved Yeah, I've been speaking muted. Sorry. Yeah, but I still want to go back to what he said about capitalist laws because I don't I don't necessarily disagree. Capitalist law have to do is cinematics. I specifically I even said is you know, taking gravitational law and a circular circular uniform movement We get to the third capital law, which is time squared period squared over radius to the third Should equal a constant, you know, and that's exactly matching and those numbers should only match if Graves works, you know, like four or five squared over gravitational constant times the The mass of the object and then you go when I would just say, oh, Kepler didn't know about gravity Kepler only knew about cinematics Look, bro. I don't know the history of physics. I know physics. I don't study History I know sometimes people Don't necessarily find out people that Things that have their names, for example, newton didn't know much about newtons fractals Like we do today because today we have actually computers to, you know, put the formulas on sylab and calculate the newtons methodology You know, uh, which is basically you take the derivative of the function in that certain point and project it And that leads us to newtons fractals So newtons didn't know about that, but because it comes from newtons methodology has His name, you know, I don't know what Kepler knew or what he didn't know because I'm not Sorry, for sure. Good for you. I know that's why we don't believe in it bro. So he studied. Yeah, I know I know that This law should only work if gravity is true Period squared over radius to the third Should only equal 4 pi squared over gravitational constant times the mass of the object being orbited should only work If gravity is true, why does gunny mead and and europa orbit jupiter? At this rate, why why does this work? Why do why when putting the numbers on this formula with the mass of jupiter come out Why is that? Well, that's how you got the mass of jupiter So you can't really invoke it as if some standard of accuracy to verify your prediction and sure Sure. Sure. I agree. I agree. Why why does why do why do the period of gunny mead and Europa then to the square Equal their distance to jupiter to the third. Why is that? Why does that work? Go ahead. Why is a dynamic question? Okay, the current model claims its gravity I'm correcting the idea that Kepler ending to do with that. He didn't Uh, we could just like kepler did. It's just the name of the lab, bro. It's third kepler I know i'm just trying to explain to you just like kepler did we can use acoustics You can literally say there's a vibrational resonance of the bodies that creates this ratio and relationship of the bodies to Cause them to move around each other seeking equilibrium due to pressure mediation of acoustics And that's what he said it was and he described it He was basically spiritual and said that uh, the sun was guide and that he was singing a song To the rest of the heavenly spheres and it caused the acoustics to make it orbit now The ratio is accurate for the local scale The question is what causes it and why do you think that somehow throws the earth in it doesn't make sense to me Where's the evidence? Why is the earth not thrown towards the sun? Is that why you're asking? Well, no, no, no, like what makes you think the earth is somehow the same thing as jupiter What what do you mean? Why do you think the earth is the same thing as jupiter you're saying like Oh No, no That's what's in contention. It's not a planet the earth is in the center And it's never been measured to be orbiting around the sun the current model says you can't do that Okay, this is impossible. So okay, so My point with that was try to prove that gravity exists. I was not using that to prove that The earth is not is not flat because I believe that one uh One of the steps toward proving towards proving the the fault is actually proving gravity exists If you if you're not denying gravity exists then Then great, then we can go to her So what is gravity? Yeah, you need to find it for me before I have to accept or deny that basically Basically what what I want you to to concede is that mass attracts mass It doesn't don't like even your own paradigm doesn't in but doesn't claim that No, yeah, yeah, of course we have we have you know more modern understanding where gravity is actually the bending of The four dimensions of of course I get I get all of that but in practice. Okay I'm talking about in practice and when you put mass There is a field that that attracts mass other mass In that field you don't you deny that Well, I I deny anything that pseudoscientific nonsense I don't want to take over this whole debate like I did last time I really want cranberry to talk. So I just want to let me explain this one more thing to you and I want to kind of fall back but Okay, I like science So that means I don't like people making up made up stories or ideas I want to do something scientifically and what I can do scientifically is I can use electrostatics To make things levitate to change their weight to change how fast they go up or down I can make orbit orbit levitation You can change their weights by introducing electrostatics Why why not lead and why does it affect different material In different ways gravity affects all material In the same way we can predict how heavy something is based upon 9.8 meters per second squared, right? That's another talking point. That's well. No, it doesn't matter like we need an interruption because you know about the dark No, it doesn't matter if gravity exists or not. Are you denying there's a 9.8 meter per second squared downward acceleration at all. I was in the process of rebutting it You got nervous, but actually gravity isn't constant So when you guys claim that it's a constant, it's provably not a constant We use that value as an average That's close enough It's provably not a constant In fact, it changes at the same location during thunderstorms or lightning storms or rainfall So we know it's not a constant different elements fall a different. Yeah, I have many papers Okay, in what scientific journal was that published on i'm interested Cambridge university published that paper for cambers university Yes, grab the changes according to During thunderstorms in a gravimeter, which is a vacuum chamber that's sealed inside of a building when thunderstorms approach Or lightning storms approach the little bb inside of the interferometric Gravimeter changes the rate of falls. In fact, other elements change how far they fall with the drop tower in the uk What's the conclusion of that paper? The conclusion is that they couldn't explain it with just mass alone. That's all they said They said that we don't know but we definitely checked all the boxes Gravity rate changes but the point is it changes just a little bit. I can explain why No, you can't I can explain what they claim. Why they claim why it happens. No, you're gonna say the mass of the clouds The mass of the war rainwater. That's what the claim is causing. This was not this was void of rain Wait, well then I have to see that paper Exactly. So you I told you couldn't know. Okay. So that so the atmosphere's average of 400 000 volts, right? I think it's something like 400 000 volts from the top of the atmosphere to the I don't want to take over all of it. But but that but that changes too That changes too and it can invert So when the when the electric when the electrostatics invert when you get lightning strikes if go the other way Why don't things levitate and why can't you levitate lead? Why can't you levitate lead? What's the thing right? You guys don't understand it yet. Why can't you levitate lead? It's like almost embarrassing I've explained it so many times. Yeah, why can't we bend spacetime and levitate lead? We don't have the tools to do so Oh, but it's okay when you can't do it I can I can levitate lead. You want to bet money on it? But we know lead falls will use an electrostatics. You're claiming you want to bet money I can levitate lead using electrostatic. I'd love to see that I don't do five money No, I don't gamble But you you can levitate any objects with a coffee Hutchison effect You can levitate any object with electrostatic I'd love to see that because you have to magnetize the object to get it to levitate No, you don't No, yes, you have to you have to have an electric charge That's an opposite priority to the field to get it to levitate magnetize and then you start talking about polarity of Yes, yeah, so it collects negative electrons on the top Positive like or not positive electrons. I'm a stupid But a negative charge on the top that causes it to float in an electric field right Uh, it's if you flip the polarity of the field the electrostatic induction or transference of the medium in the object will cause it to levitate. Yeah lead Yes You know, what's crazy is you guys just don't understand it. So basically you're like, oh, which which is so stupid He thinks electrostatics pulls things down to the earth Well, you could change the charge of objects and uh, why don't things levitate? It's because electrostatics although 10 to the 36 power stronger than gravies even claim to be Is very weak overall In fact to levitate an object you have to introduce a good amount of charge Like I when I do it with my bandagraph generator iron filing styrofoam hair paint chips all kind any object I can think of that small enough I had like 200 000 volts within these uh two Gaussian surfaces and I can make things levitate So in order to make something heavier levitate you would have to introduce a ton of electrostatics But that's how physics works once you establish the principle of physics on a small scale It's assumed due to physics and laws of physics that can be scaled up Yeah, I have a I have a problem with that because my computer for example, he was I was getting Shocks when touching it. Uh, I still have have them when I touched them. It was kind of carpet. Maybe. Yeah But when I when I put my flip-flops on them, it stops The thing is that that actually is a demonstration that my flip-flops isolate me from from The ground so if I touch the ground without being isolated Then the electrons from me and from the ground would equal themselves And eventually I would stop being pulled down and I would start levitating See that's what I'm saying. I'm trying to explain it now. I really want to fall back So just give me a second to explain something I want Camry to talk and you guys talk to her because she's going to duck on you too But this is the point I'm trying to make to you. Okay electrostatics is significantly stronger than Graves claim to be But it's overall weak every object that exists all matter that exists is electrostatic all matter that exists is intrinsically electrostatic This is a fact. Why are you shaking your head? No, okay? Can we name one piece of matter? That's not electrostatic So you're dying the electromagnetic force you're dying strong and weak nuclear force and you're denying gravity Everything's electrostatic now. You're saying I'm denying I'm asking why I'm saying so then I should have ignored you No, because I reject it because I reject your claim. So we don't all believe that Name one object in the world. That's not electrostatic Does it have electrostatics involved in it? Correct Well, everything has electrostatics involved but everything's not made of electrostatics That's just not true. All molecular and intermolecular attractive forces are electrostatic in nature per due universe Electromagnetics, first of all, not electrostatics. Electromagnetics No electrostatics Strong and weak nuclear force and gravity four fundamental forces It's four fundamental forces electrostatics fall under the blanket umbrella for electromagnetic All molecular and intermolecular attractive forces are electrostatic in nature It's in the 36 power stronger than gravity is going to be on the smallest scale per due university It doesn't matter if you deny it. You can measure it. You can test it. It's a fact My point is that it's very weak overall. Okay, so the real thing is objects this this case right here falls down It's more dense in the air. Okay, whenever things are less dense in the air goes up Now the question is what's the cause of density? Well density is defined as volume over mass the compactness of matter So the question is what causes what causes compactness of matter? Well, whatever allows it to have a certain compactness is what's holding it together That's electrostatics. So that causes electrostatic You have a density relationship with the object in the medium That's an electrostatic interaction giving you the buoyant force, which is pressure mediation Which is way stronger than the downward electric bias So in order to make things float you'd have to introduce a ton of electrostatic charge That doesn't mean it doesn't exist. So I have real science I can prove it with an experiment and you admitted. Oh, we don't have the technology to prove ours But somehow ours is wrong and I don't deny I don't deny it. I don't deny electrostatics I don't deny you can cause things to levitate With electrostatics. I don't deny that what I do deny Is what causes mass So what causes things to bind together and you're also wrong electrostatics is a strong force as short distances Right very short distances. It's a strong force. Where gravity is a strong force Over long distances. So there is a difference between the two, but I said overall it's weak electrostatics in short distances is a strong force I can move my hand and deny it like look I said overall it's weak So you're what you're doing now is strengthening my argument. That's all you're doing Up to 10 to the negative 32nd 36th power do you agree do you agree that everything's electrostatic said yes Do you agree that electrostatics is 10 36 power stronger? You said yes, I don't agree I don't agree. Everything's electrostatics Name one thing that's not electrostatic Everything has electrostatics involved in its makeup. Everything is not electrostatics. Everything is made up of um Both sons and fermion fermion. Oh, shit. Oh my god. Did you just went all the way in the deep in the pseudoscience? Can you name one? I don't care. That's not electrostatic name one care It doesn't matter. None of it can be proven. Anyways, he could say whatever Oh, shit. Pseudo scientific times everything has electros everything's has electromagnetic Force right electrostatics is an electromagnetic force And it also has a strong and weak nuclear force. We've created friggin nuclear bombs and blown them up And uh gravity when you deny that You deny we don't need to get into that. We don't need to get into that. I've worked at nuclear power plants I mean you can die. That's what's up. It doesn't mean that you understand it because They claim that neutrons electrons and protons are different modalities of the same thing with the electro weak force So like cool. So you're just making my argument stronger and stronger and stronger What we want to know is you claim if gravity is real your earth can't be flat Okay, can you verify your interpretation of gravity because we can scientifically verify ours and you admitted We don't have the technology to do it. And by the way the highest levels of academia on your side say gravity's wrong We messed up. We need to change it. It doesn't work on the quantum or cosmological scale So you guys should catch up They have no evidence for your belief of gravity and actually everything's intrinsically electrostatic and it's very weak I'm sorry about it. Like I hate to break it to you, but that's just science and physics You're muted bigger Yeah, sorry I want to I want to understand your position. Do you or do you not deny that mass attracts mass? I I deny the idea that mass And uh attracts mass just like newton did he said the idea that mass is innately attracting other mass For other matter is such an absurdity that no man with competent faculty of thinking would ever fall into it Now if I take like an electrostatic charge balloon I rub it on my head and I stick it to the balloon while that balloon has mass the wall has mass So you could say the mass attracts the mass Okay, okay It's a yes or no question. Okay. I have one object with mass I deny I deny it. Yes So they're not being attracted. There's not they're being attracted Is there is there a vector in this direction and a vector in this direction that are the same A value in different Directions and in the same no in the same direction. Let's just stop the different value Do this so in the same same she look it back to it. Let me google translate that But the the value the value changes But yes, they attract but I deny that it's mass itself I just want to read this real fast the first three forces are also collectively called van der waals forces All molecular and intermolecular attractive forces are electrostatic in nature Okay, so you don't you don't you don't deny that there is a vector between those two objects one in this Reaction one in this sense one in this sense if there's enough electrostatic induction between Those two objects in the medium. It's not the matter itself. That's intrinsically attracting. It's the electrostatic relationship in the medium involved Okay, so so if I if I if I touch them Then they'll have the same charge Right because they're not isolated by air anymore. We'll begin to equalize. Yeah. Yeah, and then now they wouldn't have the Vector anymore as soon as you pull them away. They start to have electrostatic induction with the medium again Oh, so you say because because with friction with the air Then the yeah, if you want to call that. Yeah, like and that's provable, right? Like that's provable that like that's why we ground objects because as soon as we pull the ground off it starts charging up again That's why we have to keep it grounded If if what you're saying was true if I were to step up on uh What is the name in English of that thing that tells you your weight? scale scale Yeah, scale. Yeah, if I were to step up on a scale over time, I would wait to decrease So right now I should I I might wait 90 kilograms and I can Of little time I should be waiting less than that if what you're seeing is true and that doesn't happen You would have to introduce a ton of electrostaxi which has significantly changed weight that big No, no, I've explained that those objects are isolated Now they're not isolated anymore Because they're not isolated anymore. There is not a vector between them anymore There's not there according to what you said according to your theory. They're not being pulled Uh in each other's direction anymore if I if I step on a scale according to what you're saying Like initially it will say 90 kilograms and after like a few seconds it will say zero Yeah, I'm not no, no, I'm not I'm not saying that electrostax again. I really want to fall back I'm not saying electrostax is pulling everyone down to the earth That's an idea you guys have we we were all conditioned with to think there's some force pulling things down to the earth That's not what we're saying. There's a downward electric current. That's 10 micro micro amps per meter. It's very small Measurable there's always electrostatics and that's what gives you your density and your weight and your mass Like you couldn't exist and have density or mass or weight without You don't seem to understand what this is I do understand you're saying that if I if I touch the scale then I'm gonna discharge and equalize so my weight should change No, that's not correct. I'm why all right. All right. Look. Look. I want what I want to do is like Let's go like I'll talk to you guys about it later I don't want to take over the whole debate because everyone's like they're not talking about flatter Well, I just want to Yeah, over to you as I am sorry. I wanted to kick it over you You have a delay in your voice. Anyways, but I just want to say the direction the current flow changes So too you're saying is it downward current flow, but that that direction can't change Look, dude. Look, here's the deal It's a fact that what I'm talking about can be scientifically proven if you want to deny it That's fine But I would love for us to get back to the point Which is that the earth is not a globe provably the horizon isn't physical what you claim is there isn't there I don't want to take over the whole debate. So like If you want to claim I'm you could never like I've already explained it. You didn't get it It's okay. Can we go back to where like where's the physical curve of the earth? You claim it's a ball We went and tested it. It's not there the horizon's just a parent You have no evidence for the claim that there's a physical geometric horizon anywhere Can we talk about that and maybe maybe maybe it would be good for you guys to address what I said Sorry, it was like to address what I said about uh The moon But yeah, go ahead those lines. I just seen you haven't tested down the lab You just proved a little bit Electricity's can cause things to levitate. You haven't proved what causes things to fall in the lab You haven't done that. Did you prove it with spacetime in the lab? Um, no, we proved we have a Cavendish experiment. We we understand how we understand how mass attracts math You can deny it if you want Let me let me just answer that real quick. Uh, I said just before you get in their batar Hold your hold your thought their batar. I want to get Karen in here because uh, you guys have been talking for a little bit and Karen you must have some thoughts about all the things the fellows are saying here So I want to kick it over to you to just kind of expound what you're hearing here and uh, how you're feeling about this conversation I think um, most of what they're talking about is of no consequence to the shape of the earth personally, but um What one thing that did come up earlier that I think uh, is is really an important question is for ozian and his drone video Like if you believe that that shows you curvature that that low amount of uh of height right there 150 feet why isn't curvature visible? Like everywhere all the time measurable Why can we go to like places like the bolivian salt flats and it be flat for for you know Miles and miles and miles in any direction with no curvature detected anywhere at all at all whatsoever How come there are abyssal planes at the bottom of the ocean that are flat? For hundreds and hundreds of miles. I mean There are just innumerable things that happen that that just aren't they don't Jive with a ball the size and shape that we are given So how do you explain your magical? Where's the curvature everywhere else? How can it can't be measured? I have a document 120 page document where we out and we look we wanted to find curvature We were trying to prove that the earth was a globe because it is not fun to sit here You see the chat to get ridiculed and and you know criticized all the time for Denying this this globe earth that we've been fed to our entire lives and we go and we we can't find curvature anywhere It cannot be measured, but you think you can see it 150 feet with your drone. Can you explain the discrepancy in that? Um first of all chat is mean. Um, they should be nice to you. I I appreciate your opinion But let's go to the topic So all I did was measured that more of the ship was exposed So that what is explained by the size of your nothing to do is why you say in your witness curvature You said then you're contradicting yourself because you said that you played that video and you're like I witness curvature because the boat got bigger But now you're saying it's because of perspective because the drone went up and you saw a bigger angle of view, right? That's why the boat is bigger So the curvature or not I'm not seeing that's why the boat got bigger and seen there's water that was walking earlier when you played your video You said you experienced and see curvature with your video But that's not true. Is it that is true? No, it isn't because there is no curvature to be seen that you can't measure it You're seeing I didn't you're telling me what I experienced and you're telling me i'm lying I believe that you believe that you experienced curvature, but you didn't measure it You took your drone and you went up and down and you're assuming That the angle of view got bigger because of curvature But actually it's become bigger because the drone went higher up in the air I'm talking about where I took a team of people and we went and traveled to different locations across the earth plane And we physically measured stuff with cameras and lasers and all kinds of equipment And we cannot measure curvature We were able to consistently see and measure things beyond the distance that you should Be able to see on a globe the shape the shape and size that they say it is End of story Yeah You guys want to talk about what I said about the moon that proves there anything but what care be just talked about No, I'd have to see your evidence I'd be interested in seeing all that evidence to see how you did the testing and how you took the measurements I'm not denying that you went out and did that not at all I'm not denying that you have a testimonial that you believe is true Just because I don't accept your testimonial as true facts I mean nobody's going to a liar But we just refuted Hey Karen, why why don't you try to publish where you had to make a paper it is published, but no But I can't post a link in here. I can post it in here. I just a tactic It's just a tactic. No, wait, wait. She just dumped on you man. Can you address it? No, I can it. Well, then let me address it. You're talking Address that she just dumped on your alleged globe evidence. Please address it. So I I had two hypotheses I had two hypotheses that either the earth was curved or the earth was flat Yeah, your hypothesis was wrong Okay, so there may be some other factors involved in the Anything I may be straw manning some claim that you had So I said two hypotheses based on basic geometry what I would expect to see As my drone rose in altitude. I did not see what I would expect to see if the earth was flat I saw what I what I How could it be a straw man when it's what I would expect to see when the earth was flat How's that? Okay, okay fair enough. You don't understand flat earth And your arguments are relevant and if you're claiming to have accurately represented flat earth when testing it It was a straw man Is that better set up two hypotheses They're wrong And and one supported hypotheses two and the other one was evidence against hypotheses one Well, your hypotheses one wrong Well, well, then then and then you try to see it was just my eyes playing tricks on me Well, it wasn't my eyes would be my Anything about tricks It's weird. How do you know let me let me break this down really simply the ground appears to ramp up you to Perspective. Okay. So as you looked at that Need a passage as the ground as the ground ramped up you to perspective it ramped up towards that boat as you Lift see so now he's back to square one which he's denying Because my drone makes things my drone didn't go My drone didn't go further away. My drone didn't go closer to the ship My drone went straight up. So it wasn't ground Ramping up. It was the drone going straight up Exposing more of this ship. So you're actually saying All right, wait, are you actually seeing? That the that the water is actually going up No, oh my hearing because of perspective. Oh, that's you don't do you know Doesn't get it. He literally doesn't get it. So it's not actually above me even though my my eyes the horizon rises To my eyes. It's an optical illusion. So the horizon's not really at my eyes Like even on a flat earth their horizon would have to be At my feet level or whatever other structures Around there on the horizon, whatever it would be horizon is apparent the ground is always below your feet Yes, so the horizon would have to be below my feet The right it's not a physical place. Exactly. I covered that in Whatever the no, I don't care about the optical illusion. Whatever that place is The the ground you're seeing at the distance If that was a body of water that as far out as you can see on the surface That would have to be at your feet I have to share my presentation. Would it have to be at your feet? Can you answer the question? It optically rises. We covered it in my I'm sharing my presentation But it's actually at your feet, right? I understand this like this is Can you address this? So when my my drone goes straight up It's not coming further away. It's not going towards it It's not the railroad tracks going further off in the distance. It's my drone seeing more of the ship being exposed Because the water is not blocking the ship Okay, now we're going to talk to the audience and everyone's going to hear this. Okay Sharing the screen here Cover this in my we're having a debate not we're not debating the audience But we're going to hear this and then watch you record it debates are for the audience anyway Exactly the sky's ramping down to eye level The ground is ramping up Towards eye level if I then raise up in a drone It's going to change What the level of that optical ramping effect is because of Perspective if you deny this you deny basic reality, bro And I'm not even trying to be ugly. Look right here. We'll just cover this right here. Here's the horizon. Look, I'm raising up It looks like the horizon is raising above the initial point Now if the earth were actually curving it should be going down away from me as I get higher should be getting further down What do we see in reality? It's rising up which means the globe has to claim that this happens due to perspective They have to claim that the air density, but whatever it doesn't matter. Oh, wait, wait You think this happens because of refraction? It could be I'm not an expert at all It doesn't matter to my drone footage each because my the ship does It literally the ship was not at the horizon The ship was not at the horizon not even doesn't matter to the horizon buddy The horizon's doing the same thing as anything else is due to perspective That's what I'm saying So I can still see the waves when you went up and down with that drone footage You clearly don't understand perspective bro, and that that's the problem here Okay, the ship got taller as the drone went up. You can see it clear as day Well, hey, can you address this video? Keep seeing your video. Why does the horizon appear to rise in this video? Well, the horizon's at the same spot. So it may be your camera angles changing. I don't know Okay, if you got a good drone, it's probably not so you have to deny reality As I'm saying like I just showed at the beginning. You said that things don't I'm not denying anything You said that things don't ramp up due to perspective We had to go pull up a picture of street lights and get you to reluctantly admit it does do that That's because of the altitude of my eyes You're denying it No, that's because of the altitude of my eyes It's not gonna work Well, you're just talking so I'm not gonna let you freaking filibuster You're interrupting I'm not gonna let you filibuster for the entire conversation No, it's whatever Like like it's weird. It's weird honestly because if you think there's a globe that's cool Don't deny like basic perspective to do that. It doesn't make sense I falsified our model for gravity, you know, uh, if we You're according to your model. We shouldn't wait when stepping on the Scale, is that the name? You gotta stick to the curve of the earth, brother. That's the whole crux of the issue Yeah, you don't you don't want to talk about me falsifying your things, right? You want to go back to another point? No, I would dunk all over you with gravity I don't want to be disrespectful to the people that are debating flat earth and just Part of teach you guys basic Sure. Sure. Why don't you why don't you talk about how I debunked your flat with the moon then? Why don't you talk about that? How does that explain that? Explain it's obviously he can't explain the actual facts of perspective and how his entire things easily explain Understanding the water ramps up optically will move on Explain how the moon proves the earth's the ball. Go ahead I think first you would need to tell them what the moon is I remember your explanation You didn't say something about something meaning 2d like there's no such thing as 2d objects in reality Just a weird thing to even say out loud. Yeah, I'm saying if the moon is flat, of course I don't mean its thickness is zero. I mean, it's not that's what you think Yes, I know And yeah, so you're saying that the moon should we should see the rest of the moon if the earth is flat No, I'm saying that people from different perspectives shouldn't should see different faces of the moon Or if the moon was a disc We should see different faces Different shapes. Sorry. Why something is why? Why? Yeah Again, if somebody that is here and somebody that is here The moon is an object over here the person that is on the right side of the paper and the person that is on The left side of the paper they're gonna see different Faces of this object Like the person who's here Let's say let's say Let's say that the earth flatter if it's right here. Okay Somebody that is over here is probably seeing the Oh, this is how inverted is viewing the Uh green side the yellow side, let's say But there's here and somebody that is here is being like this This side in it So if there's a flat plane here They would see different sides of a three-dimensional object And if it was a disc as you move a disc, you know, take any disc Put it in front of you as you move a disc its shape changes from a from perspective so The moon you can say that the moon it is this You can like nothing you can say if if the if the earth was flat We should either see the shape of the moon changing or a different Perspective like different faces of the moon. We see the same face, but it just turns around, you know So I am in the south pole. I've in the south hemisphere. I see the moon twisted some degrees compared to you guys that are in the north Which happens on a flat surface So now so we'll get back over to you're claiming that we should see the other sides of the moon based on where we are So you're straw manning the flat earth with a very Like short distance with solidity in ignoring optical effects of the medium You're also ignoring anything that the moon actually could be we can show electromagnetic polarization showing holographic images Showing it the appearance of spherical nature. This is a fact. All this is a fact. I'll scientific Who cares about silence? So you're assuming solidity and distance So you're straw manning the solidity on a flat earth and straw manning the specific distance Are you saying that it would happen at any distance? And what's the medium Yeah, like unless the moon was really far away, you know, really far How far are you are you saying that it's as far as it starts just in relation to its size So, how do you know how big it is? So wait, wait, you just you just admitted that at a certain distance We wouldn't see the other side. Yeah, but okay, if the moon was that far Then like how fast do you think the moon travels, bro? Wait, what if it was smaller if it was smaller like faster than light? Is that what you think? You see how easy it is to debunk the target if it was smaller then how far it would have to be would get closer, right? What do you mean? You think the moon is a certain size and 238,000 miles away and rotating 10 miles per hour. Are you saying the moon is closer or further away? The moon is closer and smaller than your model claims. It appears I don't have to make specific things about it. But it It refutes your claim, which is what professor Dave said like four years ago. You got to do better than professor Dave Who's not gonna work? That's where you got this argument professor Dave And let's be real, bro Like you just admitted if the moon was a certain distance away, then we wouldn't know if it was really far away Like the stars for example, and they are So far away that you don't see different faces of a star Okay, but we don't know there's a there's a sweet zone Or optically you wouldn't see it based on the amount of the land of the earth that can actually see the moon But this I want the audience to make sure they understand So your whole argument is what debunks the flat earth because we can't show physical measurement of curvature We never see the actual curvature of the earth Karen says they go out and test it specifically with physical tests and measurements and that their earth is not curving I point out the horizon is actually optical We show that oh oh zion or whatever. He's actually just completely misunderstanding perspective All right, so we ignore all that you don't have any physical direct measurements Let's talk about the moon and the fact that the moon we see the same side of it So what's the globe models claim for why we say this you see the same side of the moon They claim the moon they claim the moon is a sphere 238,000 miles away And that it's orbiting the earth 2200 miles per hour And at the same time, it's rotating on an axis 10 miles per hour and that it takes exactly the same amount of time for the moon to Rotate once as it does to orbit the whole earth So it just looks as if it's sitting still and we only see one side of it That's your model's claim just coincidentally it takes the exact same amount of time to rotate as it does to orbit the earth That's your claim You have no evidence for that and it coincidentally at the same time coincidentally at the same time the moon is 400 times smaller than the sun But just magically by cosmic coincidence exactly 400 times closer than the sun So they look like they're the same side. What's the flyer's position? We see a light for the day a light for the night. They seem to be the same side We don't make physical claims about it. It looks like it's in a fluid like medium And we know that with a certain size and a certain distance in a certain medium You would just see the obstacle effect that is the light in the sky called the moon Period. So so we address what can be proven you make up fairy tales. So that doesn't prove the earth What do you think causes Eclipses I'm curious Polarization Polarization Yeah, you can take two polar lenses and move it around. Do we have to cover basic logic here? Like I don't have to answer all your questions about the sky or the earth's a ball You guys think the earth's a ball you claim the earth is curving. Heron and I just told you we went and out and tested it All over the world, but isn't curving It isn't talking You keep answering You say we can't ask you questions about your model, but you get to ask me questions about claims that I don't make You don't claim the earth's a ball. You don't claim the earth's a ball um Not what I said Not what I said We can't you're claiming we can't ask you how to explain the moon The the earth all these other things But it's okay for you to ask us questions about claims That we're not making if I see the earth is a glow I could think there's some I could believe there's some magical force Holding the planet together in the shape of the ball unless you can point to some logical contradiction You can't see there's something internally inconsistent about the claims So you're trying to make that claim I guess about the flat earth, which I don't think you've done So we do like I do I believe the scientific claim about the earth being a globe Now you brought me up with perspective again So yes perspective. I do understand perspective The point I was trying to make was it depends on the height Of my eyes. So if my eyes are below ground level, it's not going to look like that Below the center of my eyes Why dig a hole I dig a hole and they put the the ground at the center of my my eyeball It wouldn't look like that. So like a little bit like a little like um, I don't know I think we've seen that and that's not the case Can we ask point blank questions? Where is the curve? Do we ever see the actual curve of the earth? Yes or no? Yes Now he says it is curvature Wait, wait, so the horizon is the physical curve of the earth There's literally a life feed from the international space station Wait, no, there's what what what dude according to the geometry of the globe You couldn't see the curvature there from the ISS and they use a fisheye lens and they cut it out constantly non sequitur We're not appealing to the authority of the government. Wait, I want to know is the horizon Brody brother brother is the horizon The curve of the earth Is the horizon the curve of the earth? What do you mean? Yeah, man? Is the horizon the curve of the we can you can see past the horizon because the earth curve is yes, that's accurate So is the horizon the curve of the earth that we're seeing yeah, you can like the What we call horizon is like the division between of course land and air it's the line You can't see past that line because the earth is curved. That's why from If you take a camera from, you know, brazil and point it to africa, you know from salvador and point it to london You won't be able to see london from salvador because the earth is curved. Okay, but no one's at you Is the horizon that we see The physical curve of the earth. Yes, sir. I just I just answered you bro. Are you saying yes? Yes Okay, well, it's not though because it constantly changes. So how could it be the curve of the earth? Is the earth breathing in and out? It's it's not hard to understand come on the the horizon. It's it's not I agree It's not hard to understand The earth's not breathing in and out the horizon is not the curve of the earth. Look. Hey, is the earth Look right here. You see my screen. Is the earth is the earth changing sizes right now I don't see the horizon What I don't really see an horizon there. You don't see a horizon I see a mountain range is being distorted by atmospheric conditions. I see something in the distance. Yeah Hey, wait, you guys don't see a horizon here I see it looks looks like a mountain range or something the distance is being Um, included by atmospheric conditions, but we can't see the curve of the earth here Um, I don't see a physical curve of the earth actually sort of looks concave sometimes So we don't see the curve. So the horizon isn't the curve of the earth Is is this a curve of the earth right here? Is this horizon the curve of the earth? It is curved I would see that whole body of water is curved. I measured it the curve of the earth Absolutely, it is Okay, so now you claim that where we see the horizon is the curve of the earth So whenever we see the black swan right here Wait, so wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, let's just don't watch it So wait, is this horizon the curve of the earth? The whole surface of the earth is the curve of the earth Hey, is this horizon the curve of the earth? Yes or no? Yeah, it's it's in the surface all of the surface is curved I don't know is the horizon The curvature of the earth the leading edge of the whole surface the whole surface of your guys Don't understand the globe model. I don't understand the globe model. There is a point on the globe Here we go the alleged curve. This is the globe model You see it's supposedly going over the horizon and that's supposedly the curve of the earth right here Yeah, supposedly going over the curve. Okay So you guys think Is the horizon the curve of the earth The whole surface of the earth is curved your question doesn't make sense Where I am right now I'm standing on a curve of the earth. Yeah, we're all standing on the curve of the earth Do we ever see the actual curve of the earth? Yes or no? Yeah Yes, open the light wait with your drone footage. You saw the actual physical tangible location of earth curve I I demonstrated the water was curving. Yes You're not too scared. Are you asking for a horizon curve? I did it because I'm not responding to a rising curve I showed the lake was curving away From the camera to the ship You're asking about horizon curve Well, are you asking am I seeing horizon curve because I never claimed to see horizon curve I claim to see Because I said specifically that I stand on the curve the and big theater pointed out too Every part of the earth is part of the curve So we did respond so that horizons curved, but you can't really see it Through the perspective, but the whole surface is curved. I measured curve from my drone On the surface of the lake We did Ozzy and Ozzy and you know why I say that we dunk on you Because take debunk and take a couple letters out the middle and you get dunked on and we already did that We already know I'm just I'm balling it so no no you're getting MJ dude tongue out like it's bad Like this is what we're talking about is the horizon we were all told boats disappear behind the curve of the earth Yeah Turns out we went out and tested the earth That does not happen Because the boat looks like it disappears at three miles and then when I go back the next day I can see it from 10 miles away So that horizon is not the curve of the earth Is part of the curve? No, it's not It's just the apparent the official globe model now states because they changed their claims once flat earth came along That we never see the actual curve of the earth We only see the apparent horizon and I promise there's a real actual curve in there somewhere You can just never see it. So are you denying your model or do you agree with that? I'm not denying my model. You're asking me if I can Physically detect the curve of the earth Visually just standing there looking at it. No, I can't detect it, but I can see it Because it's all curved, but that's big in the question. I understand as big as the question So so I went out there and I measured it with a drone and I saw it with the drone So yes, so you can't see the curve of the earth. Where are your measurements? I was in the video footage. I put the number but there's no measurement there because I gave you the calculation. You don't have a calculation. You have measured pixels on a screen That's not measuring the curvature of the earth when we measure the curvature of the earth No, shut up and listen for a second when we measure the curvature of the earth We have specific Locations where we document where people are standing how tall how high above the water surface They are standing exactly how far across the water we are making visual contact of said objects And everything is documented to the t you have nothing you have a drone that goes up and down You don't even know how far out that ship is from the sea You don't even have a little diagram that says I was standing here. This is where I was This is my elevation the ship was way over here x amount of distance away from me That's a measurement a measurement has numbers, dude Like distance didn't have numbers okay pixels But when you're talking about distances and curvature you need to have more than pixels of a boat in your picture, dude Exactly because no when the when the camera goes up and down it changes your angle of view And it makes you able to see more of the ship because your drone is going up and down Which makes the distance this way Irrelevant dude like it's not even anywhere near a fucking measurement. Excuse my language But not even close not even close First of all, I can pick whatever unit of measurement I want if I want to choose to use pixels I can use pixels I can do the calculations Using trigonometry You're measuring the pixels of a ship in a video, which does not have anything to do with earth curvature Which demonstrates the measurement of curvature No, it doesn't it doesn't demonstrate anything. I do understand it demonstrates how You understand anything about what you're trying to talk about Let me say one more thing I can say you need a measurement to be finger-wiss if I want to it could be whatever All right, cool. Yeah. Yeah, you can do what you want to yeah Let me say one more thing and then I want I care. I'm just gonna keep dunking on you It's almost embarrassing but like I just want to point this out So the audience understands what we're talking about So they claim the ursa ball that's curving Which means when you look out in the distance you can only see so far Because the earth is curving away from you so it's going to block things in the distance Like if you're a little ant on a basketball and you look out curves going to block things in the distance That that blockage that hump that curve would create a horizon You understand that so the horizon that you see would be the curve of the earth It would be a physical geometric horizon Like you can't see around a curve of a corner in your house. Okay Basic stuff here geometry would be a geometric horizon a tangible physical location that obstructs things in the distance Now we went out and saw wait a minute at horizons not where it's supposed to be. We're seeing hundreds of miles too far So now you guys change your position. So what we're asking is Where is the actual? physical location of this alleged curvature Where is the actual? Curvature that's the question Well, first of all, no one's changing the position You're just arguing with people that don't fully understand The claim like I don't fully understand the claim So if you're arguing with people that want to explain their rises three miles away And but you're not talking to the expert in the field of like optics or refraction And stuff like that and understand the actual atmospheric conditions All that stuff can be calculated and explained on a globe model and you know that because you presented That information before can you provide evidence of the actual Curvature of the earth. Why are you telling me what you can explain with calculations even though you don't understand it But you can appeal to the authority of some random other guy You have actual physical measurement of the curvature of the earth or not just admit you don't have it You have to assume it's there and you can never see the actual curve of the earth. You just have to have a question I didn't beg the question. I showed the calculation. I showed my measurement. I showed my calculation Try to we can we help me out We try to explain to him that the difference in the apparent and geometric rock Maybe you can break it down to him like I'm strong at fallacy because I never claimed to see a rising curve I claim to see the the water curve for me to the chip No, no, I did not I never said the magic word. I never claimed we've done it everybody Just We That's fine because I do think this would be a good time to go into the q&a So if anybody does need to grab a drink I think whatever we were going down there We will circle back to because there's enough questions in here. We will be busy for a little bit So I want to thank again once again batar for being here last minute Everybody if you need to take a bathroom break or get a drink feel free I just want to remind everybody. Yes, we are going to go into q&a which needs to use the washroom So if you need to go let's say one Um Yeah, uh Just want to remind everybody, you know, you're hanging out in the the old live chat or you're just watching Uh, you know hit that like button. That's always a lot of fun And you know This just came in the day and I think we can all agree that this is flat and it's awesome I've I've officially become I've officially almost become a 30 year old man And I had to get a record player and I got this Lovely flat disc that I can't put on because it would absolutely get us a copyright strike, but it is my Good old favorite green screen green screens my green screens messing it up You can see just a little bit if I move it around fast enough. It's judas priest's unleashed in the east um So I've actually been messaging sony music because i'm trying to get the rights to delivering the goods to use as the intro songs but uh I hope everybody's just enjoying listening to the Jams that we've uh that I put up that me and my buddy wrote there but Yeah, you're asking in there Sure thing. I mean you're here. So I mean as long as you're not talking about the other fellows you can go ahead So on uh, we had the modern day debate discord server I don't know if you had the link in the description, but Every saturday I'm going to try to run an open stage where people are free to come up and we can Have topics submitted and stuff like that. So I plan on doing that five p.m. Eastern standard time every saturday Maybe we can do stuff about flatter We did one about um, who should win the republican nomination today. No one was there anyways We we had a good conversation anyways just to plug the discord Yeah, awesome. Yeah, I'm hanging out in there too and uh having a lot of fun and that's uh, that's how we found a guitar tonight to get uh To get him in here for our conversation and we super appreciate him being here last minute and I think it's been going Uh, very well Uh, everybody's having a little mini debate on uh tapes and vinyl now because I was showing off my unleashed in the east record Um, so that was when judas priest traveled to japan and I think that was what 19 What does this say? I'm an old music fella Are we are you alive? But let's see 1979 we sure are we're just waiting for everybody to get back and then we're going to Uh, get right into our q&a, you know, I think Me being here last time like you're welcome. I I listened to mother didn't debate a lot, especially the Religion debates. I'm agnostic a fifth Yeah, you're welcome bro. It's uh, it's an honor for me to be here I feel I feel like I'm ill prepared though not only because I didn't have time to to study, you know Remember things from physics from high school. But as I said, I only I study software engineering at brasilia's university and like I I only have physics one, you know, which is mechanics in my course. I don't have like electromagnetism, which the kids and uh Airspace engineering, which isn't the same compass as I Have, you know, maybe one of those guys would be better suited, but I hope I'm doing a good job Yeah, we super appreciate you being here. What's it is back? So let's wait for Karen to get here and then we'll start our q&a Can I ask can I ask? Oh, there she is I was just wondering like like you guys really believe this Yes It's weird, bro. Like why like what like do you have any evidence that the ursa ball that flies around the sun? I see the sun and I see the earth and I see spaceships and I I use gps For um testing and not just for like getting around and navigating But to do but to do testing I use gps So I have to gps uses a preferred direction, which is anti relativistic Oh, you know, it's not anti relativistic. So you're complaining about the one ways The one way speed of light, which we don't we can never measure two way. Yes Not what I know not what I said So we had an error in the gps calculations and we had to correct for that Just go to the queue. No, no, there's a preferred direction from the eci and the ecif the eci is the inertial frame And then the ecf is a non-inertial frame There's a preferred direction based on the propagation of light with the sag neck effect Which debunked relativity which says that light is constant in all reference frames Well, we can just go to q&a. I don't think you're ready for that Different topic. Well, I mean So if you do want to respond before we go into q&a He brought up gps. He doesn't understand gps. So you should be no, I understand the problems we have with gps But let's move on You don't All right, let's go into our q&a and keep those questions coming at everybody. We do appreciate them So, uh, yeah, and also hit the like button. Why not there's almost what 700 odd of you watching You know, what's wrong with you? Hit the like button. We love it Uh, the omega wordy two dollars right off the bat says Don't forge your friends. Join discussion groups. So, uh, yeah, if any of our, uh, modern-day debate discord People's are in our chat right now and want to tag the discord Sure, do join our discussion groups. We appreciate to see you there Um, and who knows that could be, you know, your one-way ticket to get on the show and exercise your debate skills Um, batara is here tonight because uh, he's in our discord and uh, I see him in there very often having conversation. So, uh He had the confidence to come out here and we super appreciate that Elijah Rivera five dollars a question for the flat earthers. What do they think hit the pentagon on 9 11? There's no evidence of plane hit I mean a missile Looks like a general. I saw a general say on video. He said it was a missile Yep I wasn't there If you're asking if we blindly believe what the government said about the fact that they had 80 something cameras That they didn't release and then there's no footage of the plane There's no plane debris and then it just so happened at the very area of the pentagon That had like the documentation of the missing trillions of dollars Yeah, I mean, I don't I don't blindly. I don't think either of us. I think we pick up Year we just started a uh a conspiracy theory channel. I will say let's Yeah, has to say let's uh, if you guys want to have like two minutes to talk about that and Expound any thoughts on the other side? Well, I don't know 9 11 definitely wasn't done by the Zionists. That's what I'll say Well, that's what Elijah believes but that's beside the point So, I mean who cares about the like physical documentation improved that they literally had massage there and Amped out across the street and documented and got arrested for it, but Why do you think Israel would want to blow up the pentagon like that? Why don't you go ask them? Okay, because like Israel, okay I don't know if you saw the that video from joe biden say oh if not for israel We would have to invade the middle east and create our puppet state because that's what israel is it's the us Is puppet state? It's the us imperialism on the middle is there everything they have is paid for by the us like Why would they want to blow up the pentagon? That doesn't make any sense I'll tell you I'll tell you because what it did was they blamed it on their enemies in the middle east So then america went and fought israel's enemies for them That's why pretty simple. Yeah, why didn't they blame it on Hamas? Then why why would they blame it? Why wouldn't they blame it on fatad then why would they blame it on like a dude in pakistan, you know like What you mean the people that wanted the gold standard and refused a centralized banking system and was specifically going against israel they The motivation for israel to do it is just obvious They they claimed that their enemies in the middle east attacked us and guess where america got the intel for weapons of mass destruction drum roll please Israel and guess what we found out there were no weapons of mass destruction But guess who the war benefited drum roll israel so it seems pretty dry But the the thing is israel doesn't need to convince the u.s. Sended money, you know, like it the u.s. Are at send his billions of dollars So i'm not sending troops in a war Yeah, they didn't send troops to palestine yet, you know the the people killing palestinians are israeli soldiers, uh I believe the evidence of the 9 11 israel. Yeah, we get it So the testimony 11 is that was presented in 9 11 commission. I have no reason to believe it's not true There you go, man Make sure you take your booster too because like clearly they were just so you know the dancing israelis The dancing israelis were arrested And then admitted they staked it out admitted. They had four knowledge of it I've heard all these stupid stories. No, no, no, no, no It's it's literally verifiable through the foyer request that the government came and provided the documentation of the dancing israelis They got arrested with hundreds of thousands of dollars in cash Refused to testify refused to answer questions Contradicted themselves felled polygraph tests and then struck a sweetheart deal with the israeli government and sent them back over They're free of charge dancing israelis Whatever man. Yes, let's bow to zionism. They love us. They would never do anything to hurt us All right, let's let's try not to get too sidetracked But I I think we might have found a source for discussion in the future. So Um, well, yeah, these fellows aren't shy. They'll tell you exactly what they think and I think that's awesome We do appreciate everybody being here. Kara no zion avatar and witsett for having this discussion Uh, let's continue on with our q&a because we got all kinds of it I just want to make sure I give you guys equal love because I know I was giving the tire a little extra just for Popping in last minute. So I want to make sure you guys know. I appreciate all of you. Um, JC 23 2 dollars no question attached there Elijah Riviera 10 dollars if they said it was a missile then this subject is propaganda from the cia So that missile would have to use the satellites which use a gps which uses satellite which needs a globe All right, so we're back to september 11. Let's continue. Oh dumb I go by the way gps doesn't actually prove anything to do with a globe If you don't know that it uses the xyz coordinate system that's transposed from Cartesian coordinate systems on small local data points And of course again again It actually debunks relativity and that the earth is spinning and revolving as it uses preferred direction of west to east according To einstein's relativity There is no preferred direction and light has a constant speed in all reference frames gps is actually the current globe models Worst enemy why you would have to do research to know that so but satellites I have talks to the satellites By the way, do you do you think it's a missile? Is that why you think it was a missile? We don't really know bro. We don't you don't know Okay, we don't we we don't have evidence. It was a plane Elijah might be somebody you can convince in the flat earth or you never know come to the discord he's in the conspiracy channel I don't really think we want to kind of like try to convince or convert people Like if you can't be honest about the evidence then like I would not for you bro I would guess missile. No, that's okay. Uh, we're gonna try to uh, uh get to another question here Hopefully this one will be a little bit more on topic but uh, I do look forward to the potential of having that discussion with you guys about the The talk around that date. I don't know exactly what gets us demonetized on youtube in america. I'm in canada, so questioning is questioning is real too specifically Oh, okay. Well, well, uh, yeah, I was gonna say I might have come But we love them. We love them and bow. We bow allegiance to the middle east By the way, james since you have politics debates. I've never seen a Debate on is this room and on fire tight, you know, maybe that's a debate you guys should have Unmodern in the big but yeah, just a suggestion. Yeah Oh, yeah, for sure. And I will remind you of my name in the zoom chat is james. So uh, james is here in spirit Uh, maybe I need his zoom account because I'm not willing to pay for one But uh, my name is ryan, uh, sorry and that's on the uh the screen. That's okay, buddy We we we appreciate you there congo 44 $20 question for witsett and karen How do we reconcile your beliefs and flat earth with all the modern technology you use every day that use physics You deny you're on the internet cognitive dissonance or justice honesty. Let's kick that over to you karen first We haven't heard from you in a little bit well that is just Wrong from the beginning because we don't deny any of any of the modern technology or anything that we use and none of it Proves or disproves flat earth. So that's sort of what is that you're arguing against something that we don't even really believe so straw man straw man It's just weird, bro Like actually all modern technology assumes the earth as a stationary plane Like when you say we're using the technology all you could possibly be talking about is like an accelerometer Inside of your phone or maybe a computer accelerometer is just using a greed upon average of downward acceleration And that's just the effect that you're claiming the cause of which is what we're actually challenging It's just a gas lighting tactic But once pointed out that not one piece of modern technology requires the assumption that the earth is a tilted wobbling spinning sphere They'll just keep saying it anyway It's it's a convenient way to try to make fun of flat earthers and say you're using the very technology that you deny the science of And it's objectively wrong provably wrong. They'll never say anything specifically So I find it to be pretty disingenuous and bad Yeah, it's pretty much just taking a shot. You're just taking a shot at us with that But you can't actually debate All right. Well thoughts on the other side. They're coming at you Oh, I just sort of uh agree, you know in part like um, it's like I'm a libertarian So people will say oh if you oppose taxes you shouldn't use public services Like I don't necessarily oppose taxes regardless. They just hear libertarians the These straw men me there too. But anyways beside the point so But I enjoy like the photographs we get from mars. I don't deny those exist So we do have technology to go That's modern technology equipment that went to mars to send photographs back that I can see and enjoy But they said that we deny the modern technology that we you said we deny the physics required I know modern technology that we so you agree. That's a really stupid dishonest thing that they say it's I think fundamental to a lot of the things that we do you do you rely at least on newtonian physics so engineering does rely upon newtonian physics which um, Like you did see it. Um, he's opposed. It's like a downward force of 9.8 meters per second squared and I do agree with that but most of the stuff we build doesn't rely upon Einsteinian physics where he doesn't rely upon the bending the spacetime except gps But and would you use that? It does but we have another discussion about that like No, that i'm done Yeah, it doesn't use newtonian mechanics either, but we can move on Yeah Sorry, we literally don't they don't We literally have multiple military people Who deal in long-range? ballistics Who say that they never have used choreolus and don't use choreolus all of the firing tables that they have They have listing firing tables. It tells you distance and you know and all this other everything, but How much the earth is turning? I mean it just doesn't Doesn't happen and the spin of the bullet out of the barrel sorry to the live chat Just one second there would sit. Uh, I'm sorry to live chat. They missed the question because I I'd hit my mute button They missed my terrible joke about hitting the scroll up button Everything's a mess. No, uh, the question everybody was another question for the flat earthers Why do so many snipers in the military measure mile out shots by using the choreolus effect and hit their shots? So that's what you just heard care and respond to and we'll kick it over to witsett Yeah, so they We talked to the person that broke the world record said we've never accounted for choreolus ever I personally know multiple people that snipe in the military. They never account for choreolus What the ballers will then say is oh, well, it's built into the machines. They use they said We don't even really use those machines But even if it is That the spin of the bullet out of the barrel is way stronger than anything choreolus allegedly would be And then when you account for wind it's way strong So the truth is they don't account for choreolus whenever they shoot long distance and that wins the primary correction used This is just a fact It's a fact. So like for in order to just keep saying it you have to kind of deny reality again the occurring team I I agree that it it's probably like a couple centimeters at most depending on the range of the Shot if choreolus has effect on if it actually hits a target But a couple centimeters isn't that big of a deal for a sniper Shooting the long range hand that wind would have a greater impact on the trajectory of the bullet than Choreolus would so I I agree. I think there's other ballistic issues You could discuss than snipers that would be issues But if you talk about the much longer distant Trajectories, you could claim that they need a choreolus, but actually I looked into that as well and really the wind is still the Way way more the primary factor and when they shoot those really long like ballistics They always miss it first They take their first shot and then they make their primary most important corrections Because they can never hit their target the first time when they're shooting that far away They can just get close like oh, we didn't count for the wind correctly So choreolus is all alleged choreolus is always drowned out by the wind corrections and the spin of the barrel so You know, it's just kind of a weird thing to talk about honestly also choreolus is a fictitious forest based on a frame of reference It's not even really a thing so Well, it is it is it is an effect It's a fictitious forest based on a frame of reference on a stationary earth. It would be real So if you claim it's real Welcome to stationary. It's based on the rotation of the earth that and the amount of land is rotating Yeah, I know nothing about that. I tried to shoot a bow and arrow Yesterday and the arrow fell to the ground on my feet. I should have accounted for the spin of the earth The only way if you see if you shoot at a target that's further than the curve of the earth. It's not actually there. It's an illusion Shoot down Well, let's continue on from there everybody and i'm going to get my scroll on again here And question coming in uh from lj for 999. Thank you so much to you lj for your super chat and everybody else for their super chats NASA has billions and can break any law they want Compare that to us normal everyday humans Is hilarious now go ahead and give me one video showing real footage of space It's our tax money after all You want to go Peter? Yeah, for sure. You can open the youtube live literally youtube live from the international space station Yes, we can see the curvature of the earth from that angle from that height NASA can break any laws What what laws are they breaking? I'm not I'm not aware of any laws reason Rod But I would I would also like to point out that NASA is not the only space agency out there, you know, China has Send things to the moon recently. Brazil has a space agency Russia, I don't know Crashed on the moon recently Hey, can we look up these people? Have you guys actually watched the footage from them or are you just bringing them up? Have you ever actually watched the footage from them? Yeah, I know It's the biggest on this stuff. I've ever seen them. Have you ever watched the China? Well, that's kind of the question like the question like It's so funny, bro. It's like Can you tell me the Japanese and Chinese space footage bro? Like You might be too gone, bro So normal citizens get away with breaking the law all the time too They get away with breaking felonies all the time not all criminals are caught So the fact that somebody has billions of dollars if they get caught maybe they get better lawyers To get out of it the fact that NASA does have authority doesn't mean they are breaking laws Doesn't mean they are actually being treasonous So, um, yeah, so that's a fallacious argument Okay They're saying that he can obviously they do have protection They have all kinds of allowances on their national corporations to lie and then commit fraud and and admittedly they do have protection But his point was it's like to pretend that we as people who have just woken up to the deception can compete with someone With billions of dollars allowed to lie with protection from the government is this ingenuous. That was his actual Like all corporations can have government protection is why I That's another debate topic. I oppose corporate protection in general. I I don't think NASA's should exist with the government protection it has. I think it should be privately run But I think that's a different discussion. We can't we can't hold them accountable to all they should be private But they're private you know, I didn't ask at all Yeah, I want an audit nasa.com I want to clarify something like osaians making a bunch of claims about politics. I don't agree with him. I'm not a libertarian I'm very left-leaning Oh, bro, you were just so much cooler five seconds ago Why? I don't like I probably have more worth more I might have more in common with wits and then bitter except the religious shit and the Better shit. I'm not religious Well, you believe in god. That's all I mean Well, it's a yeah I'm logical enough to understand the necessary antecedent creation as a creator and then it requires intelligence Not an determination and intention to have the natural intrinsic order that we have near I believe everything's natural Do you believe there's an order on the earth? No, I believe The earth isn't ordered I thought everything in physics was constantly seeking equilibrium That's chaos Seeking equilibrium is chaos. Yes So is equilibrium chaos or order? um chaos Equilibrium is chaos. Yeah, so when the heat spreads out That's chaos. Yes, it's equilibrium is a state of equilibrium order Where the thermal heat spreads out evenly that's what everything seeks it seeks this state of chaos Does it started out orderly If like our current model is correct the universe started out orderly and it's going into chaos All right, bro. All right, bro But those are just adjectives. They don't mean shit Yeah, okay All right, let's continue on Yeah, everybody keep those live chats coming in we got lots to go through but we do appreciate everybody's super chats here It's spurring on more discussion and we always appreciate that here at modern day debate Why don't you click that like button while you're at it? Alrighty, let's continue on Ah, did you do? Oh, wow. Yeah, I got it. I wasn't kidding when I said I'm going to be doing that big scroll Elijah Riviera Another one five dollars to the flat earthers. Did you guys learn about flat earth through a website and magazine called popular mechanics? The editor was involved in 9 11 No, I'm not sure I did not Learn about flat earth through popular mechanics A colleague in science is stews next You guys want to know how we learn about flat earth someone mentioned the idea. We thought it was insane Yeah, I laughed at it I laughed at it and I made fun of people And I was gonna debunk them and make them look stupid There you go And then we tried to do that Honestly, can I can I ask you guys objectively? Then we turned into flat earthers because the earth is not a globe and we had to learn the claims of the globe Which most people who think the earth's a globe have yet to do and then we went and tested those things that we learned and we found out This doesn't add up the earth is provably and measurably not the globe they claimed it Then a bunch of people make it weird without ever doing that whole thing that we did and then we had to sit here and entertain them and try to make jokes I just showed evidence. It's curved. So Okay, well, what audience aside if you showed evidence that the earth's a globe Yeah, I want to I want to ask you guys a question. Am I allowed to do that right real quick? Sure thing. I need 10 push-ups and then you can Okay, I I don't think I can my shoulders I think I can do push-ups. Uh, yeah Do you guys believe in other Things that are considered conspiracies like vaccines don't work. I know the virus came from YouTube doesn't like vaccine debate. We don't believe no. We don't believe anything came from china We're actually not even allowed to talk about that. That's how you know That's how you know exactly what they said is true Can you get me because you're not allowed to talk trouble? Yeah, sorry. Sorry. I'm not allowed to talk about it. Yeah, let's try. That's how you know Let's try not say the b-word anymore. Yeah, I just forcibly not allow them to talk about it Definitely not suspects. Yeah, and I think that's good. By the way, I think I disagree with Peter That's the problem. All heartedly Freedom of expression. I think you should have been allowed to do your friggin stupid ass scientists impersonator right at mount Where the heck you were? Thank you mount rush more rush more. Yeah You should read my motion to dismiss dude You should read my motion to dismiss for facial invalidity of the free speech law Because the government's super corrupt. You're at least at least you're libertarian. I can Maybe have a beer with you. You know, like at least you understand that Yeah, I'm actually more of a social liberal, but leaning I was trying to meet you halfway, bro I can meet you for a minute. No, actually I actually think women or men can get pregnant There's seven thousand engineers and if you question me and I don't bow to israel and oh my gosh science The air is going to kill me and the government loves to kill the vibe, bro Eight billion people. So eight billion individual unique identities Yeah You agree the government lies to us and we should think for ourselves Um, government can lie to us. Yes, you agree the government should just back up off of us and let us do our own thing And we're free creatures Yes, I believe Open borders free trade. I I'm all for all that. I don't think the government should limit Us in those regards should you be forced to open your door and unlock it? All right, let's not let's not side check It would be a fun conversation. Well, I have I have a spicy Well, not as spicy as we've seen, but it's pretty spicy the craw daddy. Oh two nine five dollars I'm confused. I thought wit was a flat earther his opening demonstrated the earth is a globe Welcome to reality wit Oh, wow It's just like a troll a troll. Yes, that's a troll I'm pointing out that I'm pretty sure it is a troll But I'm always going to use it as an opportunity to teach the people brother So the rise is actually where the sky appears to meet the ground just an optical effect The parent location it goes up and down back and forth It's not physical But if you're a football there has to be a physical hump Like a hill in front of you that blocks things and this is this is basic geometry There should be a physical tangible curvature of the earth The leading edge of a sphere that blocks things in the distance with a predicted distance We actually don't see that everything falls case Everything falls down away from you on a ball You know what I'm notice about you, man? Falls down Notice about you man is like even though it was my turn to answer the question that was given to us Like when you start to hear me lay it out coherently and it begins to build You feel the need to shut it down So that you can't hear the whole thing in context. I think that's why fighters get interrupted. So I think this is an excellent point. What's it? Yeah, bro Because me and Karen will just sit here and chill and talk about all kinds of super deep profound things We want to interrupt each other and we'll learn tons of stuff But globers like they can't take like More than 10 consecutive seconds of coherence or like shut it down censor it. I can't hear it Abort abort abort All right, well, let's just make an appointment super chat cleric find a point. That's all it was doing You did it a little early All right, well, let's continue on with the super chats everyone. Uh, All right, so lj $1.99 you got a fan. What's it gonna cook these two? brainwashed guys flat bro This guy agrees with you there. What's it and he's uh So that that's a good offset right there, you know, we have one person coming at you and another one complimenting. So, uh, We balanced the scales of the universe everybody Elijah Riviera $5. Just be careful Ozyon has worked at the navy. Maybe navy intelligence the same agency that hired lee harvey Oswald next time get me to join you, bud It's also a little bit true. Yeah, but hit me up on Anything He thinks i'm a Fed like i'm an actual I don't think so. I don't think so. I don't a lot of people said Ah, I like when people say i was in the navy It's funny. Well, I let them think it too. You weren't p paid to defend the globe or you would be better at it Um, yeah, I think so I would actually i'm sorry. I'm not trying to be I'm saying like when people say that I'm like dude this person would come in just like phd physicist professor dunking on people Slice them up. They would actually know how to rebut basic like Nah You guys underestimate how much of like It's embarrassing to go against the consensus and some people aren't built for that, bro Like they have to conform They want to be considered smart and they see a ticket being smart for making fun of the people that challenge the consensus No matter how much more informed they are So don't underestimate what that will do like the the require like the longing to fit in In and not feel stupid That'll make people do all kinds of stuff It'll make it'll make people act as if they're hired by the government to be their defense attorney and That's what we get. I'm a I'm a libertarian atheist. I don't fit in with it like hardly any groups, but I think You just defended the mainstream propaganda from the government multiple times though Okay, but to bring up a point. I think I a lot of people who are educated in this topic don't even Consider debating these issues. They don't even come on to these programs. Most of them don't Well, I talked to them. They actually know Yeah, exactly. I talked to like who you're talking about like dhd astrophysicists physicists quantum physicists astronomers Who would you be talking? I talked to all of them They know less than the anti-flatter. There's they don't come on to these debates. It's all I'm saying That's right because they couldn't publicly they couldn't take the take the opportunity to publicly Lose a conversation about something as foundational as the earth. It would be detrimental With with all the respect That's not the reason they see this as losing time okay, so my my teacher Of numerical methodologies, for example, we're gonna have a submarine gel acoustics course And he invited me and he selected only some students, you know, because He's accurate with his time Like he doesn't want people that he doesn't want in the course. So Yeah, they would see this what we're doing as a waste of time, you know, I should they would say Oh, I can honestly I see it as a waste of time As you guys aren't ready to listen, but it's for the it's for the audience By the way, I talked to phd astronomers who definitely don't think it's a waste of time when I bring up that the Hubble tension is off by five to seven megaparsecs and that the inflation theory is contradictory to early dark energy Which is the alleged explanation for the uh, the two for the like extreme formations of the early galaxies And whenever I explain the horizon problem and the flatness problem and the cosmological problem and the cosmological constant problem And the axis of evil. So when I talk to these people actually they end up getting dunked on so they they prefer to be behind the scenes I'm not trying to be cocky. I mean, I'm not saying I'm amazing to know everything I've talked to them. They said it's it's It's too fringe of a subject to talk about publicly Because it puts me in a risky position um That's just a fact. That's what it actually is They actually enjoy talking to us because we think of ourselves and we research things in depth We don't just regurgitate, you know claim in term Propaganda, so I would have to disagree with they also depend on funding, you know, they need to keep their funding. So Any any teacher would see you guys as I don't want to be offensive But would see you as below their level, you know, even though I just talked to multiple phd's Okay, I just want to bring up wait. We jen who had to go for emergency or something whatever No, she she has her own view of the universe I don't know. I think you've talked to her before like she has his own theory of physics and stuff So she's definitely out of the mainstream. She still believes the earth Is a globe, right? But um Um, what is it going to point out what you said axes of evil what I heard that in there, right? Did you see axes of evil? what Well, like in world war two like yeah No, and it was also called that it when george busch was president about the middle east, right? But anyway, there's something called the cosmological background like the cosmic microwave background cmb Yeah, that's all the energy that was observed with a certain frequency of the electromagnetic spectrum in the background Okay, well the big bang model claims there was a singularity and everything exploded and expanded out from there But but it's actually simultaneously expanding from every direction at the same time So it looks like we're in the center of the universe even though it's just an illusion. We're not Which is called But anyway, so they claim that it's isotropic Isotropic means no preferred direction And they claim it's homogenous Evenly distributed when they looked out at the cmb. It wasn't it was inhomogeneous and anisotropic Had a preferred direction in fact whenever you followed the inhomogeneous distribution of energy it intersected directly on the earth So they called that the axis of evil really because it went against the big bang cosmology That's a fact. That's what happened. So I find it very weird that science is bringing up the word evil almost as if a religion or something But yeah, it showed that the earth was in the center based on the anisotropic and homogenous distribution of the background energy I don't believe the I don't necessarily believe there was a singularity either I do believe there was some expansion, but I do agree. We do have problems with that I think we have a glaring problem with dark energy and dark matter that we need to find a way to explain Why we observed this lens or the phenomenon with gravity and stuff that's not explained by Einstein's physics. I understand all that like like they have come up with other series like mons Like um, it doesn't work though. It doesn't work. I agree. It doesn't work. I know that But they are trying to find ways to resolve it Yeah, yeah, I applaud you for being that honest I am honest like I think you're relatively honest. Yeah I Can be wrong I think you're definitely up there with the best Well, let's try to continue on everybody Nathan Thompson loved me for some reason like if you watch that debate Oh, I love I love everybody. Let's continue on Lj 4.99 Lj for 4.99. Thanks for your super chat. Even my dog knows the moon landing was faked and the earth is level Ah, we're almost into the Trolling super chats again. So thank you lj. Let's continue on because We've got a lot of super chats that are pretty pertinent to the conversation. Congo 44 or five dollars. Which it please give the law of Perspective, please give me the function so I can apply it on an observation Yeah, so you have something called eye level and that gives you your diffraction line or diffraction limit So if you look out, basically you have an angle going out like this draw a line right through the middle of it That's your eye level. So based on where you are above the ground You're going to have that reach the ground faster than what's above it long story short You have an angular resolution limit to the eye And then what you're looking at will give you propagation and reception angles And if those angles fall below your angular resolution limit, then you'll no longer be able to resolve it So there you guys pray it's pretty simple overall like you can't see forever You have an angular resolution limit. You can look into Rayleigh criteria You can apply that to our observations And that's why things disappear from the bottom up because they actually lose resolvability first This is basic physics. You can go The experiments done by harper b y u cambridge, etc Alrighty, I think that answered your question. Well, let's continue on from there And yeah, let's keep those super chats coming in and thanks for the response there. What's it? Did you have any thoughts on that Karen? No, I think what's it got are pretty good I agree with what you said. I mean it was it wasn't directed at wit, but uh, yeah pointless poppy 499 wit Why haven't you flown a balloon up to the ferment? And firmament sorry I actually think that we uh have a force field that has different density layers of plasma I don't even claim the distances, but that's just what evidence shows and We're like about to send up a high altitude balloon about 30 30 miles I think I mean, yeah, we're the only ones that do tests to be honest other than like pretending that we saw the the curved horizon with a curved lens, but I don't think that you can send a balloon to the containment limit. That's insane. You can't send it higher than 120 000 feet So that's a ridiculous question. I think that there's a force filled with density layers of plasma It's illegal to even try to buy the fuel to send a rocket that which is again probably another All right. Well, let's continue on from there. Is it illegal? Kevo 499. Yeah, you have to have the government's permission Yeah, yeah, so kevo for 499. This is for you. Oh zion Uzi and no, I know I know what it is now. I know what it is. I'm just picking You've told me so many times you don't care So I got it so wrong so many times and then oh zion, right? Yeah, oh zion. It is Oh zion or ozien or ozien ozien. Oh zion. Sorry I hit zionism I've been using the name for like 30 years now. So Everybody we're having a good time here and if you're having a good time as well hit the like button Oh zion has refused to concede that objects converge to eye level due to perspective classic globy cognitive dissonance Please respond anything to say there I didn't deny that they appear to converge So they do appear to converge at eye level, but if your eye level is at the sea level Like halfway below it doesn't the ground doesn't go up The the objects come down converge to your eye level, which would be where you're right there with your eyes And that's not what I was demonstrating with my drone my drone clearly showed that 20 percent more of the ship was exposed Now what you showed was that you changed your u.s. You got Your angle of resolvability specifically your reception angle increased as you increase in height. This is just objective science physics Whatever, you know, we could deny it. I guess sure well, let's carry on and Yeah, we got lots more questions coming in here So, uh, yeah, we uh, we'll just try to carry on there Uh, so the crawdaddy o two nine I would like to apologize to everyone here on the behalf of modern day debate for making us all dumber Happening to listen to flat earth nonsense. Oh my maybe I shouldn't have read that one. That's a little spicy That's all they have. It's okay. I think it's I think it's funny. I think it's Why are these some of the most popular views you get this and like because people gravitate towards true And uh, all the all you have is like insult. I want to give this piece of advice real fast I'll I'll address that at super chat One of the number one emails I receive they say bro Your debates woke me up the looking into the flat earth But you know why it wasn't really your debates and what you said even though you were good or whatever It was the behavior of the ball When they would just change the subject and interrupt and personally attack and gaslight and poison the well and ad-hom Everything they did was change the subject and interrupt you and insult you and lie about you And misrepresent you that it made me think like wait Why why do people do that and then I went and watched the rest of them And I found out that almost all of them do that and then I read the chats And then I read the comment sections I found out almost every globe earth proponent does that and it made me wonder why I don't want to be a part of a group that just basically does that So then I researched it for their anomal flat earth or so I want to thank you guys for your behavior Because ironically it achieves the exact opposite of what you think I agree entirely I don't think I should dismiss people That have views that are outside of the mainstream view So they may be correct. Like I don't think you're correct I actually believe that you have false beliefs But I respect that you do have these beliefs and I expect respect That you've been convinced that these beliefs are true and I would not call you Irrational necessarily, but anyways, I think we only get an epistemology People are spiraling because I call them out in the chat. I mean, can you can you help us? Can we mean that that behavior if you think there's a globe you think there's a globe, right? That behavior is detrimental Yeah, well, it's the same thing with the atheist and theist debates atheists They'll be ugly They call you mentally ill Or they call you a conspiracy theorist or they call I think you're a conspiracy theorist, but I don't think that's an insult But you know, I if you agree that people may sometimes use tactics when they can't sufficiently intellectually debate the position And the other person may be more informed and more articulate so that they use that as a tactic I mean, it's a well-known tactic. It's called ad-homs and poisoning the world and diversions obfuscation right here That's what it is That's what it is Most people as soon as you get into epistemology at all, they freaking run away Bitter is not like that though. Bitter is like very engaged in epistemology and He seems pretty cool, man. We have to pull you from the depths of depravity on the left Get you over here to the stationary plane existence where we have to acknowledge that someone put the earth in the center of the cosmos Boom, you'll be golden, man. Find a nice brazilian chick. You'll start making babies Uh Well, big ones. I actually don't have babies for this big I don't think you believe in the flatter. I think you you must be gaining something out of this That's your cognitive dissonance because you're trying to convince yourself. I don't think that You found out very quickly that i'm not stupid And that I know quite a bit about it So you have to convince yourself that i'm playing some role or a smart person can possibly think that the earth is not for real I must be making a killing Because you you you did you did accuse batara. There's a let's let him explain Yeah, I don't just thought about wanting to make babies. I don't think you Yeah, I I disagree with you guys like on um frino off expression. I I actually think flatter for should be censored because Yeah You're lying to people and I I think that's that's a problem You think we should be considered Yes I want to quote somebody you should be censored. It's the Can I quote somebody disgusting, dude? What a status cuck thing to say I want to quote somebody horrible, dude. I want to quote sabine haussenfelder Okay, we're posting a video that says flatter science wrong But not stupid Yeah, but the truth is that like Can you admit the reason that you just said you think I don't really believe in it? Is because you can't just call me stupid Like why why do you think I don't believe in it? Well, like I lost I lost My job because of this I lost a job offer for this Made my life significantly more difficult to be so public about flatter stuff. Why do you think I lie about it? No, yeah, I think there's a market, you know for for uh, oh my god Yeah, that's crazy that you guys say that people people, you know pay courses about No pseudo science and I feel that as a crime, which is of Charitonism something like that in English. So yeah, I I think I I think you really believe that. Yeah. Yeah. So I think I feel bad for you. We can move on I think that the flatter first the big flatter channels are just people profiting out of Uh, gullible people that suddenly didn't get a good enough education You know should not know about flatter because we only need very basic science to know the earth is not flat As I demonstrated in my opening. So yeah, I think you got ducked on with your whole opener I I think you're actually uh profiting off gullible people that sadly didn't got got a good enough education And you're making it harder for us to educate them. So I think you should be censored for making Like a cartoon Yes, yes, dude You're the one we should model ourselves after you believe all the surface level propaganda from the government that consistently Amidst they lie to mislead us you still think that the jabs are good And they come out and told you oh, sorry, they work good Like the documents have been released. It's literally public But it's like they came out and admitted it. Yeah Hey, go ahead Can I promote or see something like I just went to wit's it gets it youtube channel He has 25,000 subscribers. He's getting like 3000 The 6,000 views maybe 8,000 sometimes you're not making a whole lot of money on youtube. No, bro. I'm super censored Bro. Yeah, you know make crap on youtube. I don't do this for money, dude I hope I hope it don't go by the The only way that I make money is doing business as far outside of anything I do online By the way, it's the only way I can pay my bills I don't care. I don't have to prove myself the people that just look for excuses to Yeah, sincerely sincerely. I I actually hope that's true and I expect that to keep that way if If that's okay, I expect that is true I think that you should reconsider your mentality that people should be censored if they don't agree with you or that you're the arbiter of truth No government has consistently been proven To propagandize its people the brainwash and take advantage of them You should do some research and realize even if we disagree We should be able to talk about it as soon as we can't There goes all freedom, bro. It's it's not complicated. It's why it's the first amendment Yeah, I This is not a debatable censorship. But yeah, I think some ideas when propagated can make society worse like Denying like like bio weapons are good for you. Yeah That's the idea that Is a bad idea that hurts people Yeah, we so yeah, we can have that discussion another time About freedom of speech, uh, you know, there's all kinds of things You've heard all kinds of dissecting points where these guys agree and disagree with each other So, I mean you don't know what side of the panel these guys could be on next time on these issues Which is super exciting pseudonym for five dollars I'm gonna say your name all screwed up now. So you got me all Oh, you've done it too many times Ozean. No, it's it's it's ought Ozean. Yeah, see everybody's Ozean, right? Well, I'm Ozean I'll do my freaking intro thing Oze Ozone talks. Yes. I don't understand. All right We gotta stop because people are gonna think that I'm just a general bully or something But really me me and uh, Ozean get along very well I don't understand hundreds of years ago when someone say a boat disappear It's going past the curve right now At 150 feet the ship came back Question mark at the end of that That's for you. The ship was never entirely invisible. So but Part of the ship was exposed as the drone went up in elevation Yep, so I wasn't looking at the ship going over the horizon All right. All right. Well, let's continue on there. Uh, the karate 029 for two dollars. Thank you so much Did the flat earthers just say science denier? Yeah, bro, it's hilarious. They're denying the fizz. They're denying the physics of Rayleigh criteria And resolvability based on attenuation and reception angles. They're denying like basic science They deny electrostatics is intrinsically stronger than gravity by 10 to 36 power They deny that all like you're intermolecular. They denied that all molecular and intermolecular attractive forces are electrostatic nature like The irony is you guys deny science and physics I'm sorry if you deny that things can disappear from the bottom up because of optics alone You deny physics and if you deny that your explanation of the drone is actually explained with perspective You deny basic physics. So like I do find it funny to throw a science denier back at you Well, I'm not a scientismist. I see that all the time. I don't worship at the altar of science I'm a naturalist Which is different. I accept scientific claims When I look into them typically I accept scientific claims like Well, like dark energy and dark matter is not a theory. It's a hypothesis to explain stuff We don't understand But you'll get tons of people that will claim that dark energy and dark matter actually does exist But there's actually we don't know that so like I don't worship at the altar of science So I'm not a scientismist. Oh, you're not. Yeah, you're not as bad as some of them All right, let's continue on Can go 44 20 dollars. What's it? So perspective makes things disappear from the bottom up So a plane flying away from you gets smaller than disappears bottom up Strange how a boat disappears bottom up But a plane at a similar distance does not Yeah, so You just don't seem to understand it Like angular size and angular resolvability are different things Okay, and first of all actually even in the distance a plane can disappear from the bottom up Which goes to show that like you're just like I don't know why you just say things It's okay Okay, so the fact that change things change angular size is not the same as angular resolution limits It's not the same thing. Sure. It's somewhat in the same ballpark of perspective. They're not the same thing So when things listen to very care when things disappear in the distance They'll disappear from the bottom up because the reception angle is smaller below your eye level than above it Which means that that reception angle will fall down beneath the Resolvable angle before the stuff above the eye level Which means it will start to lose resolvability gradually from the bottom up. It's just basic physics, bro It's it's like provable. You can do it with experiments and labs and of course the bottom of the atmos is more dense So it will absorb the light more in the higher levels of the atmos. That's called attenuation So you will lose things from the bottom of I I explained it in depth right there. I would love to not be doing it but yeah, just just look into angular resolvability attenuation And propagation reception angles relative to angular resolution angle All right, any other thoughts on that or do we want to move on? All right, I think that's about that All right, so for 999 and I deleted your name. So I'll get in a second to the globe heads Every globe toy says not for education on it. Do you believe in Facking santa claus 2 or are you just lying? I wonder if that gets me around the swear jar on youtube This one doesn't actually say that I I have seen the ones that do this see for educational purposes only but I don't see that on this one. No decoration purposes not educational Or for decorations. It doesn't see that on here either What what does that mean for a decoration purposes only? What can you not use it for like that's the purpose of Oh Oh, no, some people use them as decorations. So that because you're not accurately scale Nobody picks up a globe and starts walking around and trying to navigate with a globe. Like that's ridiculous Yeah, but they're they're they're the most accurate maps. We have by the way No, it's not Yeah, like If you if you look at the At the world map There's clearly distortion Like Greenland that the usual map that we use not the Better one Greenland is much bigger than then It should be some countries like brazil look way smaller where brazil is almost the same size as the united states, you know, because Due to the projection we use stuff in the north sim bigger But yeah, the only the most accurate maps that we have are the the globes if you measure stuff on the globe and then Do the proportion to the scale and then go to google and Research, what is the distance you're going to see that it's very accurate exactly exactly how Almost like if the earth was a globe and if you do that on any flat map that's not going to happen So the globe is another evidence that the earth is not a flat, but it's actually a globe Actually, that's not true. You have to make all kinds of magnec declarations Corrections in the south which are stream and even get up to 179 degrees to navigate as the british and us government found out As you go really far south the globe doesn't work. Oh, that's kind of ironic. I don't I don't know why people don't understand that you live on you live on a plane Sorry, the globe. I was listening the whole time. I just had to had to address. It was just kind of hard Hard to listen to that's okay. We yeah, so you got wireless ones on Yeah, I think ozion has wireless ones as well there But yeah, let's kick it over to karen for this one. Elijah Riviera five dollars What's the incentive to hide the truth about flat earth? What does gravity work on flat earth if I pay for a flight to outer space? Would you go? I Wait, what? I'll read it again read again my karen. It's a bit wordsy. I mean they asked three questions there So if I paid for a flight to outer space, would you go? What's the incentive to hide the truth about flat earth and how does the gravity work on flat earth? So Um, yeah, would you go to space if somebody paid for your flight karen? Um, I'm sure most flat earthers would probably say yes I really don't want to get on one of those rockets those death traps and like possibly be exploded into tiny bits Um, I don't really think that's necessary to prove that the earth is flatter globe Please send somebody else to to to space Okay I have children That's you say if they kill me they'd be like wait a minute. I don't know right like I think it'd be safer than going to see the titanic though. Yeah, I wasn't doing that either I would go a hundred percent think about it. We're all gonna die. That's one of the things I mean, I know we're all gonna die. Nobody gets out alive, but I'm in no rush Yeah, but it's it's like a painless way to die. You know, it's not a suffer death And if you don't die, we send the tar will send the tar It's not it's not painless for my children if I die. I don't have children bro. I don't care But yeah, go ahead. Oh, yeah, let me say be sure like I want to point out to the audience What you'll find out is the people that adamantly defend the globe It won't really talk to you about any of the gravy like the like the truth bombs So let me let me drop one on you real fast. He brought up the titan. I gotta do So like in the late 1800s There was a science fiction novel written about the world's fastest and strongest ship And everyone thought was indestructible and couldn't be sung And they put the world's wealthiest and most powerful people on it and then it sank in the ocean by hitting an iceberg That book was re rewritten or retitled and then published in 1912 the same year the titanic happened The name of the book was called the wreck of the titan And it was literally about the world's most powerful fast ship that was going to mysteriously wreck after everyone That was indestructible. It was published the same year as the titanic Which had the people opposed the federal reserve on it and then the people that got in the submarine to go look at the titanic We're in a submarine titled the titan So, you know, I don't I just don't know how normal people can hear that stuff and be like no It's totally like 17 coincidences in a row. But No, okay What do you think What is exactly the conspiracy you believe about the titanic? The people that were opposed the federal reserve like jacob asher The richest the most wealthy person in america that home owned like 90% of all mortgages He said he didn't want a federal reserve bank a centralized bank They put all those people on there jp morgan paid to have it funded He was supposed to go there Then he backed out last minute then it wrecked when they swapped out the sister ship that already had damage They got millions of dollars in insurance It's just it's it looked at you got a research stuff You're saying it was willingly sent the same Yeah, yeah, I think it's very possible that it was sank on purpose. Yeah, and they've they've had this debate on modern day debate, too I think if you look at this, I think so. I think it's been brought up a couple times. I don't agree with you But that's okay. That's everything I said was just a fact. I mean you you can draw your own conclusions I wasn't trying to distract too much. We explained gravity gravity just the effect hijacked and the presupposed cause of the bending and warping of spacetime There's never been proven is not verifiable as a replication fallacy on his face And of course things can fall to the ground on a plane so All right, well, let's try to move on from there everybody if we're good on that one And keep your super chats coming in keep them friendly everybody We appreciate them and hit that like button while you're at it. It never hurts to hit a like button Um, you know, you might you sure to agree with somebody here on the panel. So give it a like Cool Lambo 10 dollars the existence of the spherical earth is something that is not immediately evident The existence of god is also not immediately evident. Why would you believe one over the other? Uh, quick short response. I'll track you for a second, but that's okay Yeah, I have evidence. I've been presented to good enough evidence about the globe I've never been presented to good enough evidence about god and some gods have been presented to are actually Contradictory some gods I've been presented to cannot exist uh logically so Yeah, all gods I've been presented to either was with insufficient evidence or Impossible and when it comes to the globe I've been presented evidence for the globe which you can just go back to the beginning of the debate and rewatch it Yeah, we demon he was asking basically why do the I'm not mistaken. He's asking the flat earthers Why is it that you believe in the globe? Um, that requires not abundantly evident at first sight But you believe in god when it's not abundantly evident at first sight Like why do you have the double standard and the answer is obviously the earth is physically and tangibly accessible We can go out and test it directly We did that and the curvature is not existent We prove the earth is not what they said it is and of course a omniscient creator Outside the confinement of material and time is not directly and tangibly accessible So it requires logical deduction only to do that. So it's it's fundamentally different. It's not a good analogy Oh, I didn't think that was for the flat I agree I think it was for the flat earther actually I think they're asking why the flat earther Doesn't accept the claim that the globe is a globe because you can't physically see it But they accept that god exists and you can't physically see god Yeah, like that's another debate, you know, like that we we would have to Analyze the reasons that's why they believe in god, you know, like is it because of a cosmological argument that continues the argument The big day, you know, like that's a whole other hours of the day If the earth and would you guys agree if the earth is in the center of the cosmos And it had to be placed there Um, the cosmos may be infinite So the earth would be in the center But there would be no center No, no, I said if it's in the center No, I would say in the center. Um, no, you choose to be coincidence Yeah, I would say the earth is in the center of everything that exists. Okay, bro I would say that if the earth is in the center, there could be a reason that's why that is Uh, that is a creator That does not prove that there is a will behind that That would be a Literal god of the gaps argument. We don't know there for god No, you know, you have The irony of them saying god of the gaps, but then you can just make up anything you want to to fill in your gaps The multiverse So the big big doesn't work because none of the evidence matters. I'm just explaining. That's what your current side does They're like, oh, well, maybe there's maybe there's an infinite amount of universes. It doesn't matter Whatever, I'm just saying that logically. Yeah, that's the earth is logically speaking brother The earth is in the center Everything that we see logically speaking It would require intention to put it directly in the center to have a special and unique position Where everything pays homage to it moving around it. That's just basic logic This has been known for hundreds of years. Edwin Hubble Einstein. They'll all tell you that So, you know, it's whatever. Yeah, I want to say something. It seems like when you're Yeah, sorry, go ahead Well, I was going to say, uh, we've got a ton of super chats. So, um, if you got I'll try I'll try and pull back That's okay. I usually try to let the speakers direct how long they want to keep it going But then sometimes we get to the end and people are like that took four hours and I was like, well You guys can't get talking Three hours now almost. Yeah, go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Well We had a little mishap at the beginning there about richie constitution five dollars for the flat earth team Why have we never seen the edge of the flat earth? We'll start with you, Karen um Who says there's an edge I don't know that there's an edge. That's just programming. That's making you think that there's an edge The edge is in your mind That's a bit like I think as if pictures we see like flat earths like Yeah, because that idea they they implant that edge idea in your mind so that your initial reaction When somebody tells you that the earth is level and stationary or flat Is that you laugh at it because you're like, oh All the oceans would be pouring off the edge of the earth if the earth was flat But that's completely silly and wrong Because it's just not like that Weird like and who's to say you can see that far you can't see forever Why haven't we seen the edge can't go past the 60th south latitude. It's illegal I don't know We see stars light years away Oh, really, how'd you verify they were that far away? Do you know how far away a light year is? Yeah How far we we can measure their distance via parallax. No, how far away is a light year? I I would have to make the the accounts right now and I also I'm used to the metric system not the U.S. Stupid system 5.88 trillion Miles away one trillion seconds is over 30 000 years. I stacked up one trillion one dollar bills It'd be over 600 miles tall It's a it's a number. You can't even fathom. They can't verify the distance They use the ladder method which has been debunked with Hubble tension You guys should research that. I know I know he thinks around eight The sun is eight uh light minutes Is 63 241 astronomical units If you want to go by a u which is I believe the distance from the Earth to the sun It's called pseudoscience Guys, don't know the distance. This is ridiculous. I just said Howard Moore I'm gonna I'm going to continue on with the superchats because we have so many guys Uh, I don't want to keep you here all night. Howard more five dollars. Thank you blue bob jesse gordon and jesse cuz Kaloski Larry scott cusho and george knott. I'm not sure who these people are rest in peace For the measurements karen b said don't exist So I think it's a question for you. Do you know who these people are again? Can you repeat that again? I'm sorry I said, thank you blue bob jesse gordon jesse keselowski Larry scott cusho and george knott rest in peace for the measurements Karen b said don't exist I think these might be I'm not sure people that supposedly measured the earth or anti-flat earthers the reason they didn't say how they did it Because we would destroy all the flames that that was measured anything about that nonsense Yeah, they're basically saying like all right. They did measure the earth's curve karen. You didn't know and uh Kara knows damn well that they did No, I didn't know Yeah, please. Let us know let us know. All right. Well, I've been looking for that and I didn't know How long do millions of people? Millions of people do not believe the earth is flat Well, there's over 15 million in brazil or my boys from alone and in the 2022 survey in america said that over 11 answer that the earth was you think over 35 million people So you're wrong about that. But wait a second. How many in brazil? Uh, there was over 10 million like seven years ago 11 percent would be a billion maybe but I don't even think it's a billion 11 percent of americans Which would be like 35 million look up brazil brazil is million 11 percent of 8 billion is not a billion of america america no, if if you extrapolate it to the people in america If you extrapolate 11 percent to the entire world why I didn't say that I said 11 percent of america He said billion people he said millions said million do oh millions. Okay. I misheard you then. Sorry Yeah, we have 11 million in brazil. That's that's boring. I just go good Yeah, dude. I believe it. You can say it's worrying what the truth is There go or not that you haven't tested the earth there goes. I am that's why this guy should be censored I don't agree Because you can't go and like you can't entertain alternative like this But I don't speak portuguese and I wasn't telling the brazilians. It was flat, dude. It ain't my fault. Yeah, I know I know I know who was I know who is if you censor people they'll file in other ways to communicate To avoid the censorship. It has happened Actually every single time you try to censor people people have found a ways to avoid censorship No, check about this. What is it? What's it called that what is something effect a rise in effect or something That when you actually help people they're not allowed to do something they do it So so actually once again, this is where the ballers don't understand basic logic If you try to force people not to look at flat earth, they're gonna be like wait Why won't you guys let us see that just like when you lie attack straw man and red herring? They're like wait a minute. What's going on with flat earth? So Let me answer that real quick. There was a brazilian comedian His name is Leonardo links Leonardo links and he had a show That had racist jokes and he was censored and then everyone uploaded his show and You know with hundreds of thousands millions of views. It's exactly the fact we are talking about. However I posted A video during the world cup And my video was immediately not available in a list of countries because it was official Fooding that I was publishing That kind of thing if it's uh previously censored, you know If it's impossible to be published if we have ai detecting the words flat earth and it's not published then They'll create their own platforms to avoid the ai censorship the one thing anyone There's finish. Let me finish. We know this as children When we're told not to touch something when we're told not to see something we field in Wrapped we feel like oh shit like i'm going to get hurt If I try to express myself One of the one things we fundamentally know as human beings I think this the most fundamental thing to being human is of freedom to express ourself Religiously artistically verbally Vocally screaming running around Friggin being lgbtq Not if you're making society worse. Not if you're making Oh, you mean like sexualizing kids Censorship makes society worse That's what makes society worse. I want to agree to disagree on this man. It's it's Basic logical principle, man. Like uh the reason people censor ideas is because they can't intellectually debate Nope in brazil racism is censored Not because it can actually debate. Okay. Yay. You guys are so awesome, but you're not, you know, so it's like whatever Nazism not so you can't be a nazi you see there you can't you can't see it was good for the united states to bomb japan Yeah, I can say it Even though pro harbour was a setup and they didn't nuclear I think it was carpet bombing. I opposed the bombing to japan. I did that to beat. I'm on repeat to beat discord By the way, it was carpet bombing Yeah, we've we've gotten off base guys we've got back to the free speech discussion Esteban razo 199 would sit do you a j a q question mark? I don't think it's jq I don't want to accidentally look up anything that's like Suspicious, so I've already screwed up my algorithms enough by uh hanging out with modern day debate What do you what else do you guys want me to do? What do you want me to do everybody? Stop it. I don't know. All right. Yo, meg wordy Two dollars gravity is non sequitur. We experience down not in Thoughts on that Okay, we experienced down All right. You all agree, right? Yeah. Thanks for your super chat. Yeah, it's a little vague So we're having a little trouble with it there, but we'll continue on Congo ten dollars. What's it give a five kilogram plastic ball Given a five gram. Yeah, a kilogram plastic ball two meters from the ground with five newtons of force applied Please use your electrostatic equations to solve where the ball will land It's crazy, dude. This dude just invoked five newtons of force and then pretended that I needed He didn't like beg the question of newtonia mechanics. So didn't ask me to replace newtonia mechanics Didn't even understand what he was doing He literally begged the question and reified newtonia mechanics and then asked me to replace it with his variable that was reified Yeah, he did but there's an agreement Let me explain this There's something called a kinematic equation in which you can solve for 9.8 meters per second squared with initial velocity height in time alone You don't need any presupposed dynamic relationship of newtonia mechanics called a kinematic equation Everything's intrinsic electrostatic once the vector is determined, which is down and it hasn't agreed upon average of 9.8 meters per second squared It's a fact you could do all engineering you do everything in the world using a kinematic equation of height time and initial velocity Anyone that denies that is denying basic reality. It is really weird if you do The equations the same the equations the same it used as different inputs into the equation the forces for electrostatics are not strong enough at distance To explain why things are accelerating down at 9.8 meters per second scared I don't understand you it's the same equation with different inputs Now what I just said was you don't even use a need to use a dynamic assumption. You can use kinematic Equations kinematics is how bodies move in relation to each other dynamics is supposedly the force that causes them to do that Okay, we use a kinematic equation to solve for downward acceleration on the earth using height time and initial velocity and downward acceleration that due to electrostatics is not because Electrostatics is a force pulling things down to the earth. So when you say it's not strong enough to do it That's a strawman fallacy. This would take a long time to fully explain But I heard your original argument I heard you didn't get it you didn't understand it about buoyancy and all the other stuff I did understand what you were trying to claim Oh, let me rephrase that No, I didn't fully understand it, but I heard your argument. I knew what we're trying to claim We'll go listen more carefully. Yeah Yeah, again, I just want to say he's not assuming newtonian mechanics Uh newtons is simply the measurement that we use for a force. We measure force and newtons True, you know owner his name Yeah, exactly So if you presuppose newtonian mechanics and ask me to replace it within the very variable that you're not doing that He did he did You said he did because he said newtons newtons is not presupposing newtonian mechanics It literally is No, it's the unit newtons is simply the unit if it's a unit of the presupposed force No, no, no, if you if you measure if you measure the magnetic is strong and weak forces You're gonna measure it in newtons if you measure the force You know like the force between two magnets, you're gonna measure it in newtons. It's not it's not saying that the the Gravity is what magnets why magnets are being pulled Yeah, okay So assuming a force pulling things down to the ground because of the effect of downward acceleration is a begging the question in Reification fallacy. I just explained in depth at the density relationship and the electrosec relationship of the object in the medium Is what's going to determine its factor can be directly manipulated via scientific experimentation Let me give you the bottom I answer your take forever. We'll debate some other time about gravity. It will take forever Yeah, I don't mind much of what you're saying other than that that that tesla quotes actually misattributed Tesla did not actually say that quote where the earth is around I don't think that quote. Yeah, that's that's misquoted But I mean tesla did make it very clear that everything's intrinsically electric and that the sun and the moon are a local phenomenon That we get energy directly from above us. He said that the idea that space and time bend in warp is Oh You went away with it Oh, you froze are you back? Wow, I don't know Anyway, the tesla tesla. He says my connection is unstable So, yeah, anyway, yeah, like I was thinking All right I love nicola tesla like he I think he was probably one of the most influential people and rolled history because of AC but I don't worship tesla and he wasn't right about everything. He was a Genius engineer. He could functionally Make things do what he wanted them to do which Yeah, I don't know what's going on there. That's it. Yeah. Yeah Something happened with witsett The stream is ending. I think he's using a virtual camera. Yeah. Yeah, just give me a second. I'm trying to figure out. Yeah That's my drop just so you head heads up and messes up your camera I might I might drop I drop just so if it messes up your camera I'll have to drop and come back. That's okay Yeah, yeah, that's all right. We've dealt with that before in the the past Sorry, everybody. If I was muted there for a second, let's move over to our screen share Will we wait for witsett to get back and let's continue on with our questions because so many questions uh Yeah, teo mega wordy five dollars show up for a flat earth debate instead of going off into the weeds of gravity Gravity is non sequitur down is down globe needs inwards So I think they're complaining about our discussion about gravity, which we just kind of said we should move on from Um, well, I think they reframed the question. They're seeing inward to the center Of the earth, but but that's what we call down in the globe model. So That sounds like a non sequitur to me. We're we're both seeing down is to our feet. Yeah, that is for the center Depends on the ever the reference what I count down someone in japan calls up Um already what? No, I don't agree with that down is Down is to my feet. Yeah. What the down for me Which is this the reaction for the center of the earth If you continue that's eventually up for a japanese I don't agree, but that's okay All right, well All right, well kcr a low mic ryan modern day debate legend. Well, thanks kcr. I never Failed to let you down at least once per debate when it comes to that mute button. Do I? um You know, I was doing so well for so long there, but I got pulled into this as well kind of last minute So I might be off my game a little bit bite me. Thanks for being a member for the last two months for ten dollars We might have to wait for witsit for this one has he He has not tried to join back yet Hmm Maybe we'll wait on that question sure thing. Uh, well This is it's kind of a little bit of ad hominy as well What's it? You're making a joke out of yourself and ruining your own reputation being a flat earth or it's sad because I think you're actually smart It's sad watching you put that to waste Uh, oh, but we got it, but it's your life. Um, yeah, he's not here Here's no question. That's pretty personal That's no question. Yeah it's kind of just And he won't care because Witsit is is a smart guy and he's confident in his knowledge and And it's about your values too. It's not all people value a good job or high incomes Some people value what they believe is the truth and the value promoting what they believe is the truth so it I'm that's why I think it's I I wouldn't call him a liar. I don't think he's being deceitful now There's probably our pose if you don't know what Poe is it's Like somebody where you can't tell the difference between the person that legitimately Legitimately believe something is true versus a person that's pretending to believe it's true I don't believe that either Karen or witsit are those people um What is it gonna say? Yeah, that's it. You don't necessarily value money or That type of success sex success can be found in other things. Some people value believing in God Um, some people value doing charity. There's nothing wrong with that Witsit is back Let's get the screens reorganized Just one second everybody Don't mind me. My name is James right now, but I'm actually Ryan Guys never know what happened James, right? Uh, yeah, I think he's hanging out doing schoolwork right now The craw daddy. Are you just missed a personal question there? What's it? Can you hear me? No, I can't hear you witsit Are you serious? Oh, there you go. I can hear you know, um, so yeah We just finished saying that we didn't think you'd really care about this ad hominy type super chat that we just got Witsit you're making a joke out of yourself and ruining your own reputation being a flat earth or It's sad because I think you're actually smart. So it's sad watching you put that to waste, but it's your life So we'll move on from there but I figure you'd like to know that somebody was giving you some heat and uh, We all agreed that you probably wouldn't care too much You please provide physical verifiable empirical measurement of the earth's curvature Yeah, I like how we didn't really ever continue on the earth curvature thing No, but everyone wants to talk about the lack of measurable earth curvature Can we avoid it like I'm keeping it on point? That's all I talked about. We appreciate that. No, but you didn't measure anything So scar daddy for two dollars also another ad hominem will just move on Dr. Mantis toboggan five dollars where did witsit find his info on electrostatics? Did he do it to himself or is he trusting science? Good job, uh, ozian and batara you racked these fools Oof. Oh my goodness. Oh, you must be spicy But actually I did uh, I did the test myself I used the vendor graph generator and I changed the weight of an object that changed the acceleration rate I made things levitate and I actually made it go up as well I manipulated the independent variable of electrostatics changed the vector weight and direction of the object grouping that is in fact Puzzle agent and you can verify that all objects are in terms of the electrostatic simply by I used the electrostatic induction reference. Yeah, I actually did it myself But just kind of how science works. So I get you guys don't make it You try it Aluminum reacts differently to electrostatics and lead does reacts differently than iron does Depending on the type of material it is it reacts differently to electrostatics Well electrostatics holds it together and gives us the density i.e. the compactness of matter Which means it's more compact than the matter of the medium it's surrounded in which calls it to go down And drastically change the actual directionality. You have to get the family introduced by such a fact relative to the amount of matter Slow down run it back word salad. Whatever. There's four fundamental forces. Not just one When it one isn't explained by quantum physics yet, which is gravity. I understand that No, I mean it's not in any way compatible with quantum physics can't be discovered scientifically at all and it doesn't actually exist Okay, guys real quick. I'll be right back. I have to Sorry, will you go find the earth curvature while you're gone? All right, that's all right, let's continue on everybody Uh, we're all having fun here and uh, yeah, I don't usually like to ask those types of questions But I I know wits. It's such a good sport. I you know, I've hung out with them a few times here on modern day debate And uh, I know that he uh, every time I say, oh, that's a little bit kind of attacking you He's like no read it. I must I must hear what you guys have said in your in your uh, Your debacle about what he might have said which is uh, that's all fun to us over here So batars gone now. So, uh, Don't mind us. We'll just continue on here because we got so many questions. Tell you mega birdie Perhaps I will join a modern day debate one day and school optics I'm not really sure Please unless you're unless you're oh, if you're a fighter, or maybe you do understand optics Whoever seems to not not like They deny that the street lights go down weird They don't go down Oh, you see what I'm like a case in point Case in point you're talking about if they could appear to go down That's an illusion. They're not actually going down. That's what perspective Oh, so yeah, I thought when they said the optics, they met me and I was getting my first compliment to the night You say All right, let's Continue on All right. Will Bennett von dollar 99 wits it. Why does the moon have shadows and craters? Thanks for your first suit chat will Yeah, nice assumption that they're craters when they're all like allegedly perfectly 90 degree impacts, which makes sense large So ever but we can replicate the moon with a holographic Projection based on electromagnetic polarization an assumption to claim that as shadows I will agree it does somewhat look solid, especially when we've been agreeing with that I did but you can show solidity or the appearance of solidity with a holographic projection based on the electromagnetic polarization Uh, so yeah, there you go. And it looks like the phases are actually just a cyclical nature like the energy cycle itself and also polarization Why couldn't god just make it look like it's there? Why does it have to be anything? I don't know why why couldn't god just make it what it is. It's the light Like like you can make any claim like we've been to the moon, but Yeah, except we haven't okay. Give me one Oh weird that you still believe that Can I all right, so How do people even the moon landing now? Yeah like uh, what? Why why would the soviet russia not deny the moon? Oh, man, I don't know. I've actually I've actually heard two different russian astronauts and soviet astronauts specifically do that very thing I guess they don't count now that we've offered you actual cosmonauts from russia that said the moon landing was fake Now they don't count and we can just keep keep asking why they didn't buy it Yeah, I will I would expect the cosmos, but like why would not the the soviet state deny it, you know Because for one they the russia gets to tell their people what they want to to propagandize them Which is through the first ones. It's in an animal to space the first one is in a person to space the first one is in a satellite to space Then america gets to propagandize their people by saying we were the first one to land on the moon So everyone wins they all work together. They're all signed to the antarctic treaty So it seems pretty simple to me, but a lot of people seem to not understand that they all work together So that's why fatter this in I don't think you realize how strong class hatred was in soviet russian and how How much people would hate the us not and want to feel better than it Yeah, they would absolutely deny it You're talking to the leftist Yeah Yeah, yeah, I know freedom is freedom sucks, huh? No freedom is great. Yeah, let's continue on before we get down there Freedom talk again We'll have that some other time Commercial sign of video two dollars says flat tober fest 2023, las vegas october 21st and 22nd All right, you can clip that and use that for your audio whatever that is I don't endorse what was going on here on either side because I'm an emirator, but I read that that's over. Yeah, you can yeah, you yeah, you can come as long as you allow me It's actually done I'm just glad we didn't get in the bedroom talk. Whoo. Just thank my lucky stars. All right as soon as you said overfest.com Yeah, las vegas It's at toberfest.com. That's correct a bunch of flat earthers a bunch of crazy flat earthers Are gonna be all together in one place in las vegas Yep, breathing oxygen freaking rebels. Yeah It's fantastic Tharn those rebels blast them. All right All right, run boston bear 999 Witsett why in your playlist in the field? Are you able to talk to a professor of astronomy? Dr. Roberts parks for three hours and 45 minutes with a minimal drama But in here it's all drama Seems weird. Are we all drama? I know but I mean they do they do make a good point that went um frozen again No, I can hear you You are frozen. I can hear you if you're frozen I'm not even touching anything and everything's pushing now But like I will say I will say if you can hear me it is it's interesting that the phd's can talk to me about High-level science and their theories without all the drama and ad-homs and fallacies I can talk to them for four hours get them to make all kinds of concessions That when I debate on modern-day debate and they uh seemingly Can't do that What's the debate versus a discussion? Um, okay Uh, the the professionals have no problem conceding as opposed to If you want mdd, but All right. Well, uh, if we don't have any other thoughts with that one, let's continue one. Uh, yeah, but Flare for the drama. Why not? You know, let's have some fun. Uh, Amanda member for two months Here, uh, not really a question Tea baggins ten dollars Karen wits it our legends no doubt Keep up the great work out there and thank you for continuing to try to wake people up to the truth May the creator bless you and your family. So you got a fan out there you too. We want from tea baggins Thank you so much tea baggins for your ten dollars there and uh, your nice compliments to our speakers tonight Uh, gene see alicia says for five dollars Who paid the ancient greeks to be part of the conspiracy? I mean the people that were constantly molesting little boys and then like the one percent of the world that claimed The earth was a sphere because the perfect shape was a sphere and then out of the philosopher Just a couple percent of them even thought that and they all debated it And they said it had to be a sphere because the perfect shape was a sphere that god made And then they claimed that boats went over the horizon with the naked eye I don't think anyone had to pay them. They're just retarded pedophiles The Greek philosophers were retarded pedophiles. Yeah, provably and admittedly they were pedophiles. Yeah Yeah, but do you think they were retarded though? Like you think yeah, I think they were retarded Yeah, they said the earth must be a sphere because the quote unquote Perfect shape is a sphere made by the sun god. So yeah, I find that pretty retarded Okay Mitigate how much we are using those terms because I do know that can get us in trouble in my country And we do want to watch it here in my country. So just that's all right Freaking canada. Yeah other thoughts ozaw. I you had some thoughts there, uh ozawian Uh, I mean the foundation for epistemology and knowledge comes from those philosophers regardless of how Moral or immoral or right or wrong. You could have been about different issues be built Western civilization upon those concepts Over so everything they said was right. Yeah. So I guess every oh everything that doesn't matter. That's a fallacy, right? That's inflation. It's no. I'm actually pulling your argument out and making the logical conclusion Which was since we used their philosophies what they said about the earth must be no valid or something Not what I said is that what your points are relevant? Just because he said one things are true. Just because we built upon their Knowledge doesn't mean everything they said or did was good or moral What I said or correct exactly. So that was I wouldn't dismiss them entirely I don't want to cut off the conversation But I kind of have to because we've got so many more chats to go through like I'm scrolling through and I'm like Holy lightning So let's try to keep rolling through it surge in general. Thanks for being here in the live chat tonight I appreciate everything you do buddy. He says consider being a member member a member for two dollars a month Amazing. Thanks for that surge in general. I appreciate you once again for everything that you do Teo omega wordy two dollars Bitar why does is s show different curve rates? does it I don't know. I don't know if it does if it does I don't know why When it moves like maybe it's almost like it's about the camera I don't have to Can you explain that was I Um, you have different types of cameras on the ISS But we have like satellites are further away to get full views of the earth So no, we don't no, we don't they admit they stitched those together and they claim it's it's every 10 minutes And then it takes 45 minutes Wish I had that well keeping it all on brand Teo mega wordy for five dollars asks in addition to that. Oh zion Can you please explain to wit and karen how you don't understand that opening propagation Angles to reception angles means you can see more So it seems like we're all in the same vein there. So I'll let you guys continue Open and propagation angles so like the camera lens how it's open doesn't mean I'm not sure of the question. I'm not okay. He's talking about how based on aperture and Rayleigh criteria based on simple Resolvability or angular resolution the reception angle and the propagation angle of the light From the object that you're looking at that reception angle relative to the aperture determines Resolvability when you're looking in the distance and things fall below that resolvable limit of whatever optics you're using Based on aperture you can no longer resolve it which makes it disappear Things below your eye level will be closer to eye level. So they'll disappear first Disappear from the bottom up So it's just basic, you know physics Optics physics, whatever. Yep. Oh, yeah, supposedly it's all right Everything's coming in from Dr. Dino Oh, thanks for a design for wrapping up up there Dr. Dino or Dino five dollars wits it How do you plate tectonics work on the flat earth? We can measure the plates moving using gps and physical means. How do earthquakes happen? Anyway, you're asking me how plates work on a flat earth Well, like what are they bowls? Because if they're plates, then they work perfectly on a flat earth Because plates are flat So Are they are they bowls? Are they tectonic bowls? So, yeah, there's there's like horizontal layers of parallel planes that make up the earth And there's electrical vibration within the earth And whenever there's discharge we get vibrational resonance. So pretty simple. I mean actually the question is how do tectonic plates work on a globe Yeah The earth is Spinning and has a mantle and the crust rotates at a different rate as the mantle does I mean, I'm not a tectonic plate expert either But I know that's the general gist of um, where we get tectonic plates The question is like if it's a plate and it's flat, how does that work on a globe? That's just a name like no, no, it's not it's it's we use a seismology with horizontal parallels Hmm So they're asking you're seeing the force that causes the tectonic plates to move in earthquakes and stuff Is explained by some release of electrostatics is electrical discharge Okay, which is just science. I mean who needs that right? It's not okay. It's not science How do are they tectonic bowls or are they tectonic plates? It would be though the name we use doesn't freaking matter And play plate plates are like this anyway No, they're not Yeah, they are Are you kidding me? Well, how many plates have you bought that were flat? Usually they're curved to old food in them Like oh wait, you're saying there needs to be a curved higher elevation at the edge to contain things like water Wow, it's crazy. An artist is the highest elevation. The plates are inverted though. They're upside down plates All right, bruh. All right, bruh you let me know how If you want to be Want to be pedantic about names because we call it plates that means or okay flat plate doesn't mean flat Finally got my camera fixed. Let me let me let me make my seat Seismology doesn't work on the globe because the globe prediction doesn't match the actual seismic activity We have arrival times that are off by up to seven minutes based on the propagation speeds That's like all the way across the earth So an object or a location that's right here thousands of miles closer than another location will receive the signal Last even though it's closer to the epicenter We also have all kinds of anomalies with the globe model with seismology We use plates that are horizontal and parallel to even map it out and it's electrical Discharge that causes vibrational residence Let me go I've done this too much honestly Sorry for laughing everybody's Everybody's uh, the mods in the live chat are giving me a hard time on the discord for uh, once again Give mispronouncing, uh, ozion's name ozion You know what I think they care more than you do but you know, it's making me It's funny Yeah, it sure is Anyways, it's it's it's funny and surgeon But I appreciate you guys trying to keep me on track here because uh, yeah, I do have short term memory Do you have any lyrics I have to keep track of in this brain here? I've talked with you on anyways Let me have this No, I'm kidding. All right, Elijah Riviera five dollars You can measure curvature a small circle of radius on the surface With a center at that point and to calculate the circumference Or area of the circle I'm going to not give any address sending the That's not curvature Even say a method he just said you can do it. I promise A circle and a circumference. Okay, that's Still not curvature. Yeah, where's the radius to the sphere matching the convexity of the surface? Where is the physical empirical measurements of earth's alleged curvature? That's what we get Is that a question for me? I thought you were responding to that's a question for all ballers for going on seven years now What's your question can repeat it can you provide physical empirical measurements of the earth's alleged curvature? Yeah, if you want that net if you watch that netflix documentary the illiterium The the flat earthers did it themselves. No, they didn't It's what does a show where you are That's so bad. It's like it's really it's funny that ballers think that flat earthers prove the earth It has curvature. Yeah, they can't even do it themselves Can't you love us to it? Jarvis copes to it. The person that made that documentary Person that made that documentary literally said well, there were some flat earth results and some globe earth results And sure we took you out of context, but it's because we decided to make it a flat earth hit piece and be dishonest They said that themselves. Yeah, just watch the documentary folks and To completely ignore what the producer of the film said by being about being dishonest and lying Who cares what they said just watch the documentary and believe them All right. Well, let's continue on there. Mr. Monster You've been a member for over 18 months and you've asked a question We appreciate that and you said oh, no, you didn't ask a question You're just saying this is the best channel for debate. I happen to agree with you That's kind of why I wanted to be here. Hopefully everybody else agrees with me um, you know smash that like button that's always fun and uh, Give lots of love to our speakers that are out here tonight. All of their links are going to be in our description Even in the podcast Elijah Riviera Five dollars or Rivera. Sorry five dollars to the flirts. Do you think the earth is three dimensional? Uh You said nothing's two dimensional. I agree It's insane to think firefighters don't yeah The universe is flat though Yeah, which is a which is a you problem because that's called the brightness problem Which is which is a big issue for you. How did the inner density just so happen to be point zero zero zero seven d zero's Yeah, it's called the flat. It's impossible to explain I don't necessarily believe it's true. I just believe that's what the evidence is indicating Yeah, our observations show us that yeah, but it doesn't work within your cosmology Should be negative or positive curvature based on the energy density and the mathematical statistical probability of It being positive or negative then they have proposed the inflation theory which said it was current at the beginning I promise but then it just flattened out because it moved so fast Then they saw that the galaxies were way too form so they had to add the early dark energy And then they were like oh, wow that comes that actually contradicts the inflation theory of the inflaton particle that turned into everything So yeah, your cosmology is kind of weird We didn't under maybe there's different physics in the early universe Yeah, whatever whatever we but that's not god of the gaps though Well, I think we have until we exhaust all the physical explanations and I wouldn't presuppose a non physical explanation. That's typically my position when it comes to that We've already exhausted all the physical explanations. So right now for over a hundred years We've been sitting here saying I think there may be something else. We'll discover one day Yeah, I heard that that your universe is flat. I don't know so you understand it Can explain what that's the idea bro And what it is is like say the big bang says there was a singularity and then everything exploded and expanded out from there Yeah, I know I know the big bang no real fast real fast the flatness problem That the universe is flat is that if there would have to be the perfect amount of energy density Bro, we're for the respect. No need for you to repeat yourself. We have like yeah Yeah, I mean like you don't even know your religion. You can just believe it. I don't have a religion There you do I'm I'm close to buddhism You know, you believe in the big bang cosmology, but you don't know why or what it is And that's kind of it's not my area, bro. I believe whatever the scientist tells me, you know, if you want to discuss That's a religion. That's a religion software, you know, I have my materials here about how does the Ram memory stars the addresses you're You're defining religion you're defining religion differently. So Oxford encyclopedia Oxford encyclopedia not encyclopedia oxford dictionary No, oxford. I paid for the OED the oxford dictionary and I'll look it up Look, can I just pick some retard retard a retard? Here's the problem You you you said well, no, I believe it, but I trust a scientist That's what so that's what a catholic would say, right? They'd be like, well, yeah, yeah, I believe that's what the bible says I don't know why But the priests say it and they've been studying it for way longer than I have they went to college for it That that's a religion you you believe a you believe something built upon the doctrine of men void of empirical evidence You don't know exactly what you believe requires blind faith and belief and you just trust the authority That told you what to believe that that's what a religion is No, everything in science needs empirical evidence Like you can have like hypothesis to explain a data for like Everything in science needs falsifiability needs empirical evidence Science science, you know what science claims a lot of the times it isn't true You know we approve science false all the time like Expontaneous generation was proven false in the past, you know Yeah, science is just the best explanation for the stuff we have today That's the best explanation the guys that studied the universe came up with. Oh, the universe is flat. They don't know why okay I'm not I'm not challenging you that it's not my area. My area is software engineering. You know if you want to discuss that I'm not a scientist I know you guys hate the word religion No, I have no problem with you redefining religion that way. I just that's not how I use religion I just said you have a belief system that you don't know what is I have beliefs I accept is true things I accept is true based on Even though you don't know what it is you accept is true and you just trust the authority figures are gonna tell you the truth And you blindly believe whatever they say even though you don't know what it is So I mean I have justification for accepting certain testimonial claims. So I have to Yeah, like I just want to say Religion is justified. It's not unjustified. I've just it is unjustified all the evidence shows the big bang cosmology is wrong Justifying in your mind The way religion is science You believe your beliefs are justified. I had my bad, right? The way religion is usually defined. It's like a Head you got it from from reconnect, you know So reconnect To like the spruity Whatever that you believe like I'm very close to zambodism that doesn't believe in souls and god doesn't believe in reincarnation Or any of that stuff, but that's an exception. You know most religions. They're about reconnecting to a lost Uh supernatural and there's nothing supernatural in science. Therefore it's a category ever to call science Well, it's actually a belief system built upon the doctrine of men void of empirical evidence that requires faith Typically regarding a deity. So it doesn't have to be about a deity Yeah Science doesn't fit what you just said science Yeah, but Is a methodology doesn't fit the big bang cosmology where you say there may be a million universes I don't know what had that been at the beginning, but I promise it was expanding from a singularity But there is no center and all this Science doesn't talk about the creation. We can just move on. It's whatever bro audience I know people that deny having any beliefs that accept scientific claims But did I have any beliefs? So yeah, but then when I asked them when I asked them about the flatness problem They say I don't know what that is, but I believe whatever the scientists say. So that's a belief So we can move on Yeah, we have a whole page of uh, super questions or super chats. So it's a super. Yeah, definitely or we can carry on the The super questions super questions Mr. Monster five dollars So I'm guessing you think that ships just sink when they dip below the horizon the moon and the sun go underwater Seems a little trolley. Don't you think? Yeah, I don't think anybody thinks that Um the science of science five dollars Ozai and how much curvature did you see in your drone video one inch one foot one mile of curvature? 20 percent of the height of the ship 1928 percent or whatever, but that's a rough like so it could be off All right The drone is moving if the drone's going up the ship is getting bigger because your angle of view is increasing It is not curvature Oh, I'll pass to address this one single time if you see what I'm sharing here You see the eye level for the horizon You see that the angle below that is smaller than the angle above it So it's going to actually the reception and propagation angles are going to drop below the Resolvability angle first because that that angle smaller with his example of the drone It's like taking this little person and moving them up as you move them up that lower angle is going to get bigger Very basic basic Indeed All right. Well, let's try to continue on from there. I'm sure we all understand where we disagree From both sides there and of all tafer two dollars What about the call in obradi? track across antarctica Does anybody know about the call in obradi track across you went across the south pole you went Yeah, they didn't actually go across the middle of the continent and back over it They just like dip inside the con a little bit and pop back up north Did not Even when you look at the map if they show you supposedly of what he did it's not It's not going across Antarctica come on buddy Oh weird that they had to lie about it. But would they lie? He crossed antarctica, but I don't think it was across the south pole However, we wanted to find the island he went He wanted to talk a little part of it Yeah, it'd be like crossing florida east to west versus north to south He just did a nice little bit and then pop back up north. That's all I did Whatever Yeah, I don't think that's what they were implying either. But yeah, let's continue on from there Pedro a gem 25 dollars betar Did you feel that the language barrier was a big issue during the debate? No, I work to the call center. So I I speak Go ahead and see two languages I can Make do with german, you know And of course as a native portuguese Speaker, I can understand Spanish fairly enough The problem with using portuguese always that they don't understand us back But yeah, I can fairly understand german, you know, if you drop me in germany, I'm not gonna start to that Uh, and yeah, english is a stupid language, you know, english is a very poor language It's actually good that english is the A worldwide language because imagine if it was chinese or arabic, you know You go ahead Sorry, he did cross the south pole, but he did it across the narrowest part Yeah, I did not just actually I did not back up north Yeah, I did not feel that because I've been studying english since I was a kid So I'll say your english is good Whatever they're talking about Absolutely. Um, yeah, it's been a great debate and uh Yeah, I wish I could speak more languages for sure. That would be probably a handy thing Yeah, study bro. Come on. Speak a language Study mandarin before they come pick us over, bro This isn't the This isn't the first time I've been hanging out with you fellas This isn't the first time I've debated guitar either and we I've never had any There's some words sometimes you ask Yeah, what's the word? The word that pops up like curvature No, I don't know the curvature Seems like none of the ballers seem to understand the question like Can we get physical tangible empirical measurement of earth curvature? That question seems to just like shut their brain off Let's get these questions out of the way because I'm gonna fall asleep. I'm an old man. All right. All right, cool Yeah, okay, I was gonna say I'm an old man too. I got two kids. So that's let's rush the wrong flies me as an old man What's the flat earth model from richie constitution? Uh, she just had a six a baby. She had six months old my wife Six months old awesome What you have a six month old you said? Yeah, congrats minor 22 21 and 19 almost 20. I'm just kidding. Yeah. I'm in my fifties. I'm the old dude. My oldest son is 20 today Happy birthday. Happy birthday. I'm 22 Well, you still have time to my nine year old daughter tomorrow, right? Hey, happy birthday. I should behave Are you still have time to figure out you still have time to figure out that Karen you look really young I wouldn't say that you have a daughter my age. Congratulations. Well, it's a son, but thank you Yes, okay. Yeah, he's he's 20 Yeah, I'm right here. Yeah. Yeah, you're preserved girl. Congrats doesn't date ball or sorry Before we start making other pitches, uh, you know debates and whatever else we're doing Let's continue on with our super chats everybody run booster bear 999 Karen When you couldn't find any earth curvature With your uh, when you couldn't find any earth curve with your team Uh, tried how were you able to walk away from the ball earth seems many can't or won't Um Um I'm not sure what basically saying he's like when you went when you went and tested the earth and you Didn't find any curvature. How were you able to walk away from the ball because it seems like a butt to people can't Oh Yeah, well that made it easy Actually before we actually went and did the the measurements. Um, I was already a flat earth or because I had already Lived on the coast and grew up in california on the coast and grew up looking at ships Literally looking at ships on the horizon. So Um, when I started looking at all of it and asking the right questions, I realized. Oh, wow Earth really is not a ball. Um, but It Going out and actually doing the measurements was the best thing because It really sealed the deal. It was like, wow, it really is like all of us are here. We're all seeing the same thing It's not just me. It's not just in my head We all we're all seeing things we shouldn't see based on the size and shape that they tell us that the earth should be So that makes it easy. That's why, you know, I don't consider this a belief like, you know Somebody like the other guy would say, oh your belief this I don't have a belief dude I used to believe in the globe then I tested it and I found out it wasn't true and now I know Earth is not a globe. I don't really know what earth is But I know it's not what they tell us it is because we have tested it and every time we tested it fails That's all there is to it. So what earth is I don't know it appears to be level and stationary That's why I go with that It's just that simple. All right My pandemic side comes out about beliefs, but go ahead Belief is just something that is true Yeah, whatever man, like give us physical measure of temperature or we're gonna move on Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, I was just saying we should move on just because like I said, there's It's a list Rick, right five dollars. Oh, uh ozion. Can you or ozion? Can you show me credibility? Do you have proof or evidence of how far the boat was? I still struggle to see what you were proving Thanks for your first super chat rick, right? That has the um drone went higher and more of the ship was exposed Angle of viewing all righty Well, let's continue on there's lots of conversation. I think about that particular thing there So, uh, definitely check it out. Uh, kelly on v five dollars What is the difference between magnetic north and true north implying each shape of the earth? Does it doesn't really matter to limit two minutes? Yeah, like the true north Uh, not magnetic north if I'm not mistaken. It's like the like the this Center of the earth That's true north like here like here and be explained. Okay. It has no let me let me finish I think I got this like it it generates a magnetic field. I like it. It isn't necessarily where Up north, you know, and it actually moves if I'm not mistaken. That's the difference. Yeah. Yeah, like here like here Bees got you she'll be It is 1200 miles south of the The magnetic north is about 1200 miles south Of the true north, which is the axes Of the earth There's all kinds of different south so there's actually there's three different points up there. There is the actual geocentric center Okay, true north. There's actually two magnetic poles over there One of them is moving and one of them stays relatively stationary So that's the difference and where your compass points to Is the is considered the magnetic north, right? But that is not the same as true north true north is supposedly the actual axis Okay, or where the point in which the sun goes around But the magnetic north is different from that and then you have magnetic declination Which is the difference between in degrees between the true north and the magnetic Hole that the compass is going to I think I saw the video where you were showing how to test that or whatever using An actual compass and stuff for Yeah, you can measure it. You can measure your own magnetic declination You can track the sun and you can figure it all out and you can compare it to what usgs tells you All that good stuff Now let's do it in the south. They'll accurate it. Yeah, I know the south. It doesn't work the same They're not hiding in the south Well, let's try to continue on fellas We have one from s to ben raso for 4.99. I'm not going to read it s to ben Try to be a better person Taylor b for ten dollars Usia argentina is 9,845 miles from the north pole on a flat earth This would put the distance to transverse the globe at 61,791 miles at this latitude. However, it's actually 959 miles Why I didn't fully follow it Well, I've had a question. I've I asked another flat earth proponent Why can't you circumnavigate an artica and tell us how How many miles it is People try to do it. They go like way like 60,000 miles It's illegal to go beyond 60,000 basically Follow this You can't even get within eyesight of the Antarctic coastline legally. You're not allowed to go. What do you mean? There are tourists that go there tourists you on a guided tour You can go to very specific places and guided tours under supervision But you cannot take your own boat and go sailing south of the 60th parallel and try to go storm an artica You will get stopped. It's happened before It's not what I mean like that that land doesn't belong to any country like it's international water is around You can circumnavigate No, you can't it's against the Antarctic first Somebody did it and it's 72 foot oyster yacht Cartharsis too I can't handle like this is another one of those things where you make so many flat earthers because Flat earthers say you can't freely and privately explore Antarctica There's Antarctic trees signing 1959 tons of subsequent legislation since then and as soon as you get past the city south latitude You will be monitored and then intercepted and you don't get due process according to the US government But you can go to a approved guided tours on tourist trips in a couple locations And then globers will say you can go there So then the people honest people are like wait a minute They go research what the flat earthers says sees that they're telling 100% the truth and they're like, okay I'm not gonna side with these people that just deny reality. Like you guys make flat earthers. I don't I'm not seeing to go to Antarctica. I'm seeing why don't you sail Around Antarctica and tell us how many days it takes to sail around Antarctica You mean beyond the 60th south latitude Close enough where you can see part of Antarctica and go to the 60th That's the thing you can't even get close enough the 60th You can't see Antarctica coastline from the 60th parallel 500 to 1200 miles away the 60th south latitude is up to 1200 miles away from the coast Tell us how many miles the 60th latitude is Up to 1200 miles away from the coast Okay, so how many miles around Is it to circumnavigate at the 60th latitude? I don't know when people when people actually try to do that It takes them way longer than they think they have to try to go around Antarctica Well, it doesn't matter how long it takes you calculate how how fast they travel How many days it's well, yeah, you have to be supposed to distance. Yeah, whatever By the way, my phone just died but I'm But you could calculate like wins. Yeah, you can calculate ship speed No, you can calculate ship speed. Yeah, you can calculate the knots You have to know the distance they've been doing it But they've been doing it forever Speed equals distance over time in order to be in an ocean and try to determine how fast you're going You need to know the distance and the time which you have to presuppose a specific model like the globe and know How far of a distance you travel divided by the time. It's just very basic stuff They were literally doing it for thousand using knots Actually knots on roads Here we go with this thousands of maybe not thousands of years Man, let's just move on Accurately measure it next super to speed. Yeah, yeah, let's go We've gotten a pile of them tonight So, yeah, Teo, Maguardi $5. Mr. Adio had a round uncertainty is greater than any supposed Coriolis artillery are bracketed in 100 meters Swings Coriolis is a claim only a claim Our next question was like, okay We already discussed this, okay I'm just gonna put my baller glasses on so I can answer for you. Sorry. Yes. I'm going to go to bed Awesome loss and clips $10 Friday, May 13th, 2011. Venus Mercury, Jupiter Marys Rar Rar glories The 13th alignment photo from earth at night Impossible on the heliosexual model Explain globes 30 second video on youtube. Pull it up What is in the video? What do you say? Some specific celestial positioning in the sky they're claiming is not explainable on the heliocentric model I have to see the southern cross Yeah, I have to see that for the Ozean Right, you know, it's getting really bad for the globe out here, bro Like it's it's so bad now that it's like almost embarrassing. I'm not joking. It's like Everything that you guys believe has been destroyed now You just let it go. It's like getting embarrassing like by 2025. It'll actually be like Okay, okay On the flat earth on the flat earth model, how long does it take for a radar signal to travel one radar range? Wow I mean, I can ask you all fucking stupid types of questions that I don't specifically know the answer to it doesn't mean that the the It's false, right? So just because I don't know is very specific type of claim some Celestial arrangement in the sky doesn't mean there isn't an explanation for it on a globe model I was just trying to give you a friendly heads up Well, I understand but I could ask you questions that you don't have the answers for Too, I I don't I just did Like like dude, but here's the deal bro the globe the positive plane we went and tested it We debunked it the earth's default position the stationary top graphical plane. We went and measured it That's just a fact people that deny it. They're a little behind the time It's okay. People still believe in the moon landing and think that bio weapons are health So Yeah, let's avoid that. I'm gonna I'm gonna start being a baller. I'll help us get to this Let's uh, let's get through these uh super chats because there are quite still a few Um, so angel our angle of elevation ten dollars canadian The pressure gradient in air is proportional to the sound vector acceleration according to jeweler's equation governing flow Gravity doesn't do that in pro waves do sound keeps you on earth not gravity sound Sounds a vibration vibrations keep us on earth not Low-key base bro low-key base because vibrational resonance is what everything is comprised of There's nothing that doesn't have an intrinsic vibration. And what is sound? It's the mediums vibration That's why you can't hear things in a vacuum because it's actually just the air vibrating So sound but more so more specifically vibrational resonance of all the mediums including the atheric background would create a downward pressure from the Energy above us basically rippling acoustic vibrational resonance down to us But that's for true thurs. It's not In a pretty base he said I don't know next I didn't I didn't say I don't know I'd say I disagree He said no, uh next Thank you Next All right, let's continue on So Taylor b um Low altitude radar demonstrates the glow model. Why do aircrafts disappear? Why do aircrafts appear they go over to curvature? That's why All right, you know that's on the other side there They get so tiny that they become indiscernible by the human eye and therefore out of sight away How dare you use basic? All right. Well, uh, let's continue on Everybody Water as far as you can hear us. No, uh, bittar. Yeah. All right. Uh, yeah, go ahead No, I I'm not trying to say anything Oh, I thought you wanted to respond. Just give me five minutes. He's currently coming around the dollars Good Not so good. Uh, these glovers make true earthers every time they speak lmao keep it up glovers I know we should almost even five minutes. It's not any question The science of science for five dollars seems like it's hard to get people to defend the globe myth Try for globe debaters for showing. Thank you for the globe debaters for showing up. Well, thank you science of science. Um Yeah, I'm not sure if that's a backhanded compliment, but we do appreciate our speakers being here this evening and I'm trying to move through these because I uh, you know a zion might have older children than I do, but I feel old. Okay, you know Feel it because my kids are going to be up so early. Tell you omega wordy two dollars Bittar. Why are you so corrupt and closed-minded? My guitar are you crying close-minded? I Don't necessarily know what you mean by spending any time with this one I I don't think I'm corrupt closed-minded. I'm I'm open-minded You know that you You think people should be censored who don't think like you and that's where you lost everyone Yeah, not people who don't think like many people that you know, uh Ideas that are a bad for society. Yeah, but that's a subjective determination of bad Yeah, what makes you who's who are you to say what ideas are bad for society? No, you're right. Good. I'm at it. It's a hundred percent Uh, uh, I think censorship is bad for society I think being told that we're tiny specks of dust and ever expanding universe of nothing. This is bad Sorry, what? Nile is basically you saying I think I think that being told we're tiny speck of dust and ever expanding universe of nothing Is bad for society. I think that experimental medicine being bioweapons but proposed is actually good for you as bad for Society, I think censorship is bad for we have differing opinions. That's why we should all be able to vocalize our differing opinions I think well, I expect you're never the one making the laws, you know Yeah, because our world would be so base pro pedophiles getting the axe. Let's just move on All right, let's move on indeed Uh, so the craw daddy oh two nine five dollars We can absolutely dismiss nonsense like the flat earth outright and make fun of it because it is demonstrated fact There is no flat earth argument. Well, thanks for your sentiment there craw daddy. We've answered so many questions We're gonna move on from these These are yeah, these are a little ad hominy. They're not really questions So we're gonna move on from them, but the craw daddy strikes twice Five dollars. It's nothing like the theistic debate because a god is defined in a way that can either be proven true or untrue Oh, craw daddy, you trying to send us down another rabbit hole here. What's going on, buddy? We're trying to move on from these Theistic questions here. Um the globes of religion. We all agree. We can be one Uh Well, hopefully that's what you were looking for there, buddy. So, uh, vegas montana 777 carl the devil's younger brother 777 uh For 99 cents a pink ice cream cone. Well, I guess that's a meme. I don't know Maybe it's because I copied and pasted it vegas montana 77 dollar 99 no question Just continue on forte five dollars. Why are conspiracy theorists less analytical when tested compared to Non-conspiracy theorists any thoughts on that? What are you talking about? I've never seen that. That's just a made-up nonsense, bro. Like hey, does this IQ to do IQ tests use analytics? Like what are you talking about? I don't let's let's let's let's let's compare IQ test of conspiracy theorists to like normy mpc regurgitation machines called bots This is who has a higher IQ. Let's do let's see who per capita is more creative Let's let's do that. Yeah, who's pattern recognition. It's so stupid just to talk about we can move on irony of that Let's just say if you compare the small group of flat earthers versus the globe earthers that are zealous about it Way more creativity way more musicians way more independent thinkers on the flattered side. This is a fact So we I mean that's iran Yeah, like you don't believe it. You can come hang out with us in las vegas in october this october 21st and 22nd There'll be hundreds of us bring your best globe proof We yeah, yeah, come on and see you guys will switch up so quick You'll be like you guys are cool. I'm sorry. It's so funny I want to I want to I want to talk a little bit about IQ tests like I took mine It was 111 if I'm not mistaken And like well my psychologist told me oh if you weren't so anxious it would have been high Why because every time it was being timed my I would do way worse on all the tests, you know, because some of the Yeah, because I'm anxious. So yeah, I don't I don't trust those tests to tell you how I agree Because I agree there's a lot of variables in IQ tests some people don't like like being timed But the point was like the idea that they test the analytics of the brains like no, no Like conspiracy theories are some of the smartest people in the world. I know this firsthand Like I've seen correlations between I IQ Schizophrenia and schizo and conspiracy theory beliefs. So there you go Like yeah, doesn't mean shit That's that that was pretty slick. You're pretty slick, bro Let's just move on because I don't like we could go into that, but we want I don't agree with it. All right Let's continue on because we do have a few more. Uh, it's flat and amazing That was from ominol. Thanks for your membership. We'll move on from that rick, right Bitar, I'm right. They're wrong censor them beta I didn't do that right beta. There we go beta. It's too low energy. It was too low. I can't even I can't even match Amazing I was gonna say I've got so many like awful I've got so many awful impressions I can do Jordan Peterson pretty much right on the fly, but you've heard me do that a few times there with it It's a little bit by It's a little bit like uh, I was gonna say it's a little bit like Kermit the frog But as soon as I start talking about the hierarchies and how we have to clean our room And you just need to know what I'm talking about. Yeah, I was gonna say just like get my canadian in there I promise I promise I actually created a Jordan Peterson animation Whatever On my youtube channel, it's pretty cool We came from rocks and we're super not important. We're in the middle of nowhere tucked away in the corner We're insignificant. We should be happy. Thank god. Praise science. I'm not a glober. I'm not a nihilist You got to be a little nasally and just praise authority and then you're a glober Well, it's good to say I'm just trying to do an impression here. I'm not trying to call out anybody Sorry, I love you guys. It was a joke It's it's all good. It's all good So we're we are getting we're starting to wind down everybody isn't this exciting isn't this exciting We'll soon be able to pee freely. All right. Tell you McWherty $2 24 7 flat earth discord 2.0 If you don't want to debate 24 7 flat earth discord 2.0. Okay. I mean you can come join us in our modern day debate discord We got a flat earth section and you can find other people that are either like-minded or unlike minded And it's a lot of moderators that are slightly biased. Check us out The blinds are biased, but we don't me I heard it. I heard it is not a place. I like I don't I won't even say it You have tons of flatters I I'm I'm pretty I'm biased. I think yeah Um, you're not bad. You're not bad. I'll give you that. I told you that the last time. Oh, thank you I think I'm pretty nice. Anyways, no, it's all good. Leo crow $5 question for the ballers How does the sun supposedly maintain its axial rotation when it is supposed to be a ball of burning gas? It makes no sense Wait a second. The sun is not gas. It's still hot. It's your hot gas. It's plasma, you know, like The the atoms they don't they're separated. It's a lot of is ionized. Yeah No, but plasma is a different state of matter plasma and gas are different things Yeah, it's ionized. No plasma when you have plasma Like it's it's it's not gas. It's a different state of matter by definition physically. Okay. Yeah, okay It's not it's not burning as well. It's A fusion nuclear reactor fusion nuclear react There's no evidence for that electric sun theory can explain all the spectroscopic readings electric sun Good to have Jen on here. I think she does her opinion But it's more than she's smarter than you want at least she doesn't just freaking drown in pseudoscience next Plasma is synonymous with ionized gas. It's just into the matter. Is it? Yeah, I mean I you're right that it's it's a different state of matter, but I'm going I was gonna say when I think of plasma, I just think of playing halo. So, uh, let's continue I was gonna say I can talk about the grenades Must be the grenades like the grenades Oh, sorry. We can move on. Oh, no, just the weapons. I like the little pistol that charges up. Oh, yeah charges up. That's true. Yeah It's a good one. Anyways, I gotta behave myself here. That's all good. That's all the spaceships are spanish I don't like first person. Oh, actually, sorry I missed one from vegas montana 777 and if you get a bow and arrow minecraft OZ and that's pretty much the same thing. I I know I picked on you about that before Just just get a bow and craft uses flat black coordinate systems. All right. I prove it every time I play my Flat earth Try not to uh detract too much because uh, yeah, we'll try to get through these Explained from vegas montana 499 explain why people have witnessed 24 7 sunlight in Antarctica You can't say it's fake when everyone their experience is it. How does this work on a flat earth? No one thinks flat at 24 7 sunlight is even a problem for flatters They would be seeing the sun in the sky for 24 straight hours. It's never been adamantly and accurately documented So, yeah, we can have 24 hour sunlight using copy cup caustic very simple caustic mathematics explains it 24 hour sunlight is not a problem for flatters at all basic math and physics. We'll show you All right, let's continue on and we're going to try to keep these uh super chats for One speaker per side just because uh, we'll try to get through them here Cotserra $10 Sorry that we already read I killed earl $5 flippers. Please explain how the big dipper Asterism is not visible from as Australia and the southern cross cannot be seen from most of the usa So we'll kick it over to you first there Karen Yeah, Karen. Why can't we see Polaris from australia? Uh, because it's too far away It's so funny that we have to say such rudimentary things Um, it's too far away man perspective Uh, all righty. Um, good sir. Uh So, oh, sorry. Yep. Let's continue on. Uh, Esteban Rozzo $1.99. Whitsitt. Can you debate michael Sir, uh, sirtane for all of us? Well, whitsitt. Yeah, I Michael sirtane Michael sirtane Yeah, you just debated a sardane on cirq. Sorry on cirq. I guess Yeah, I reached out to him recently. We're talking about maybe maybe, uh I set that up for the betathon. I don't know how that's gonna work, but yeah, of course, I'll debate I'll debate anyone I don't know if you will Well, yeah, as long as he doesn't hear me call him sardanes on this channel, maybe he'll come over here Uh, I should revere $5 You can measure curvature a small circle of radius on the surface Without sender at that point and to calculate the circumference or area of the circle Should be again, he didn't say the methodology or continue Yeah, yeah, I mean you you can't just use signals alone In fact, they go far beyond the geometric horizon and even the radio horizons You're not using signals alone In any way to pick the earth being a ball if you were going to use radio signals and their propagation Efficacy you would actually come out with a planar Outcome and product. So I don't know he avoids the specifics of the methodology. That was the second time in a row. So Next All right, dr. Dino two dollars coming at you. So we'll just I'll say it and we'll just continue on another field Whitsett is incompetent and a big surprise Well, as we've established, uh, whitsett, uh Whitsett feeds off of your hatred It feeds his anger Yeah, it makes me power up I still love you man. I did I I get that you're kind of going through this kind of this in a struggle where you have to like Attack me for being the messenger, but it's all good. Karen and I are just trying to help you guys out You'll see it one day or maybe you want maybe maybe everyone's not supposed to see awesome, uh, teo meg wordy five dollars, uh Uh, uh, osean. I clearly demonstrated to the audience your ignorance about optics and consequences Of the angles your drone footage is moot. You are wrong I just agree. Okay. Thank you His answer was nah, but yeah, you you are correct super chatter The propagation reception ankles completely dunks on his alleged claim that verifies that the earth's a ball because it's basic is it Well, it doesn't seem like they want us to go. This is some of the most like this is the longest list of super chats I've had I will I guarantee you the end of them the end of them are going to be a lot more insulty Are you in the half of it at least? Yeah, yeah, we are we are getting we are almost to the end Don't worry. It's just that this is a lot and I just want to say thank you to everybody who did stay Uh here and especially you as well, but sorry because you came out of the blues So, I mean everybody else here is kind of a little more used to this and ready for it You just kind of popped in here. So thanks for that. I don't know what time it is three five dollars Aaron, did you know you were going to be here for four hours? No, I didn't know It's 140 for me, but yeah, we're almost done. It is 140 for me as well. We're in the same time zone I'm in Nova Scotia So, um osean drone tests was climate tree on stereo steroids That's from trolling for the truth. Okay, we'll just continue on basically what he's saying is there's a really Really stupid common people say about that proves yours a globe. Just climb a tree You can see further that proves yours a globe. He's basically saying that your drone was that on steroids, right? You know, I think I I think I did cap the open discussion at a good time It's just these super chats. They uh, they they pull Oh, no, dude. Yeah, you're good. You're good. I hear an horse Iron horse five dollars. It's all fun James has opened a spot for me to debate professor phil bell next week And he's too cowardly to front up and defend his Defend his fantasy ball. So iron horse, uh, you know, so on you out there flat earth and karen and uh Pulling you out professor phil professor phil. Don't be scared, bro You spend my dms on the regular basis watching my videos with your commentary Why don't you just debate the guy that's trying to debate you man prove that you know so much about the earth? Thing of all the bait iron horse unless you're scared professor phil iron horse won't bite you. He's not that bad I did it. It's cool. He's cool. He can he can get a with no talk Uh, that's all good. Tell you Mac, we're at $2. Is this a social club or a debate? This is a debate What have you been looking at? Like did you know we've been so much Destroyed the globe so much that it kind of does but I'm like a social club in a way It's kind of like you guys can get there. We got you. You know, I think it's no had arms No person in the world Yeah, it's so funny how you have to reaffirm how you won all the time. So it looks like no, no You guys didn't provide any physical measurement of earth curvature and we've been waiting for seven years So it's not really anything to reaffirm. I'm only here for the audience Yeah, you're just repeating what I just said Yeah, yeah, we'll give us physical empirical measurements of earth curvature and then we'll we'll reconcile I I debunk you. Okay. When I did under this with two objects I should step on the scale and not waive anything because As there's no electric electric like the electrons pass Yeah It's not a very good on English Yeah, it's all good, bro. I see what you're saying. I know what you're saying. You're wrong. Give me one Let's continue on so angel qualis Five dollars for the flatter. There's do you believe the center contains mount murru? I think it's awesome I Because I don't want to supposedly Magnetic mountain in the center We don't know that there actually is a magnetic mountain in the center Although in the old maps it does say that there's rupus negris l ltsima, which means the high black cliffs And it describes him as being 33 leagues tall And yada yada yada and then all of a sudden somewhere around 1500 years ago The islands and everything disappeared off the map, but we still do have our two magnetic points But they don't they're not in the same place Because they're traveling magnetic points. This is why I you know I'm not necessarily sure that there is a a magnetic mountain in the center That's above the surface maybe below the surface because there's certain types of minerals that have a natural magnetic field like magnetite and such Bits possible, but I don't know or or Karen. What do you think maybe like it? It's like Above the surface, but it moves around like Like when cammy showed me where like the quadrupole was like over the four magnets And then they put that piece of like magnetite over top of it And it was just like levitating above it and kind of moving around. I don't know It's floaty. Maybe it's floaty Maybe it's what we don't know. We don't know It's a trap It's a trap to try to get us to sound crazy because the truth is that this earth we live on is way more amazing and incredible than we were told and People aren't ready for the gravy People aren't ready for the gravy. All right. Well, let's continue on. We got a couple more here to go Just hold on a second here I tried to copy and paste the other ones here. I just think it's so weird that like a verse I think it's so weird you believe in a flat earth and Yeah, I think I could see the same shit over and over again. All right. All right, full story, bro Well, let's continue on angel quail says what is the best bible verse affirming the flat earth Oh man, I don't know the earth takes shape like clay pressed under a cell the earth is stationary and movable and fixed on pillars That's a firm that's stretched out strongest bronze. It's infiltratable and we're grasshopper inhabitants within it There's a few of them, you know, you know, there's like hundreds of them So it happens above the founds the deeper below That doesn't prove it. You can go ahead and save that strawman about the firmament being hammered out like like glass No, I don't I don't adhere to labels of religions, but you know, it's so funny, man What I was going to say is what I find very funny Never do we get physical empirical measurement of earth curvature? And it seems as if the ballers don't comprehend that that's the entire reason we're here That's the crux of the whole issue They claim the earth's a ball we should physically measure curvature a specific geometric location That's tangible and we do not it isn't there and they've changed the excuses for the last seven years Oh, we never see the curvature now They'll just keep changing it and like every debate we do It's never addressed and it seems like people can just ignore it Like they don't understand that that's like the entire debate summed up in one point And if there isn't physical tangible curvature of the earth that's consistent with the radius value the entire model's wrong That's why we know you guys believe in something that isn't true. You guys should maybe understand that All right, let's kick this one over to you again Elijah Riviera actually. Yeah, sorry. Yeah Let's try to kick it over to you Karen. What is the incentive this we were already asked this kind of Elijah Riviera two dollars What's the incentive to cover up flat earth and we'll let you expand on that for uh up to two minutes there Karen Well, uh, I like to say it's just because if they lie to you about where you live and where you are And you literally have no connection to the creation or the creator Then it just opens up the door for them to be able to lie to you about everything else Because you have no compass. You have no connection. You don't know nothing Your your your whole belief system is based on lies. So what is more lies on top of it? That's what it is. All right. Why does anybody lie for control? Yeah, why'd your why'd your girlfriend lie about being at the club? Most Christians believe in a globe so it doesn't seem to detract them from believing most Christians are religiously brainwashed individuals Most people are well. We got our first super chat here. This is from um No, let's see. I'm really gonna Get you on there on your super chat there taeo. McGreity taeo. McGreity. I'll just read you super chat now said can we go fund me For some reading lessons for ryan um, I mean Maybe some punctuation lessons for you, but yeah, send me money anytime you want anybody I think he's funny. That's fine Yeah, you should be a flat earth or though. I don't know what you're doing Okay Punctuation's key. Um, you can even play guitar dude your way to your way to creative would be a baller. I don't know man I was just saying you don't know where I stand on all this stuff now That's true. You're way too good on the guitar to be like I hard baller I got a friend that plays guitar. He's a flat earther. He's been playing guitar for a long time For a band called Dephtones. Have you ever heard me sing though? It's the little band. There's a little band called Dephtones All right, so let's continue on Uh, so uh, and rick's source Five dollars. Look up what scientists mean when they say space is flat They don't mean space is flat like a pancake. It means space has no curvature over long distance Yeah, we know it's called the flatness problem. It's called the flatness problem, bro It means that it has a specific parallel depth all the way out of the flatness problem It doesn't have positive or negative curvature, which is expected if there was actually in a singularity that expanded out And it has to be point zero zero zero seventy zero's That close to zero zero point zero seventy zero's One that close to zero to explain why it's so flat or would be positive or negative curvature No one can explain it statistically and mathematically impossible They call it the flatness problem the fine tuning problem That's the actual point that there's no way to explain the energy disney Into your requirement statistically for it to be flat. It should be positively or negatively curved But it's not Who cares? All right From uh Anarchy so does anybody have any thoughts on that you can say something there Yeah, like, uh, that's why I didn't engage much in that topic You know, I don't know much about big bank cosmology. You know, I study software You know, if you're not a calculus one or two lesson I I can talk to you, you know, how to solve derivatives. I know that I don't know nothing about Big bank cosmology It's cool. Do the do the equation for the earth's curvature, which is 1.225 times the square root of the surface height of feet Should be where the geometric horizon is to see if you can help us find the curve of the earth We've been looking for like seven eight years, and it's literally non-existent probably And it just really is talking about a different shape of the universe too is like we don't actually know Yeah, you know, we know it's not what all right, let's carry on We're let's carry on from there. Uh, we're almost to the end of this here Uh, taeum agwerty once again says ryan my dots and uh, tately's cost money lol Well, yeah Maybe if I keep calling you out, you'll keep sending it and then I'll get a few tips. Who knows Hey, you never know what's gonna happen there All right, taeum agwerty. Once again, uh, twitch join 24 7 a flat earth debate Flat earth discord 2.0. I will set up a debate between you and witsett paying i a Ardent when you get there. So this taeum somebody somebody, you know Uh, witsett maybe Yes, no, I mean they say they can set you up with a debate. So I mean Yeah, if they're if they're on 24 7. Yeah, I mean, no, yeah, I don't I don't I didn't hear the name. I don't remember All right. Yeah Well, their name in here was uh, taeum agwerty Mega wurty. Sorry. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah I've been saying that is like, yeah one one full name. So anyways, awesome. Oh, you had misidentified them And there's a civil lawsuit for bigotry, but we'll let you slide this down Raw man. Oh, thank you Oh, oh, man. Well, I guess I was gonna cry. All right. Awesome. Lawson krips 10 dollars didn't answer my question about the rare friday 13th Alignment globes. How can we see venus and mercury and jupiter and mara's at night in a photo? In a photo in a photo impossible That's that's the part that was screwing me up impossible In the your brain was centric model explain please The brain was reading that like next word as you were pronouncing out of here You're making the claim it's impossible. I the answer is going to be the same it was last time I don't know your specific question the answer to the specific question. Oh, you just you just have a religion, brother I I accept things are true. Yes I assume that But that I didn't accept that was true or false. I never said it was about to help teach you your belief Go ahead. I think that question was in reference to the inner planets The two planets closest to the sun from earth, right? That's a mercury and what's the other one? Mars or venus, which one's which one is it venus venus and always forget. Sorry Right. So a mercury and venus, but they're on the inside, right? So why are we if they're on the day side of earth? Why are we seeing those planets at nighttime? Why are we able to see the outside planets that they mentioned like Jupiter at the same time? Yeah, at the same time as inside I don't have the answer Oh That's okay I said that the first time second time. It's all good The truth is that your model is mathematically and physically impossible in like a million ways Okay, no, I I know it's not impossible because I know there is an answer for this question. I don't know the answer Sprinkle a little magical They're not god god done it. There you go. It's a better answer than what they say Not what I would be. Yes Once again, I'm gonna get uh seo's Comments out of the way towards me. So uh, they oh as Assured me it is seo mega word T lol knit Teo, I forgive you. I'm sorry. I I knew somebody Who's french whose name was teo and that's how they spelled it. So I just assumed but uh Yeah, don't bother me on that tyler 432 20 the sun destroys the entire globe model What do you think about they were asking if the sun if the sun is yeah They're asking you if the sun is gas or plasma. How does it maintain axial rotation? How does it maintain extra rotation? Yeah, yeah I don't see how the two things relate Well, you would actually need some mass to actually cause the gravity well With enough density to cause the axial rotation within the gravity well He's saying if it's a if it's gas or plasma, how is it maintaining axial rotation? well mass gas and plasma Have mass. What do you mean? Yeah, I mean I understand in your your uh, your position would just be like, yeah, I promise it would Plasma maybe kind of saves you, but it's not the same as material causing the gravity well distribution. So I kind of see at their point as well The real problem with the sun is beyond that Based on it's based on what's called. Um solar seismology or helio seismology Uh, which debunks supposed Seismology solar seismology. You mean like Yeah, tremors on the earth Yeah, yeah, like they they they claim to be able to research the vibrational output of the sun The helio seismology doesn't match the elemental composition and all they can explain with the yeah, like, you know spectroscopy Which helps give us the elemental composition all they can explain with the electric sun Look, I get it man. This is this is I don't have time You Are you saying that the sun causes earthquakes? No, it's just it's the study of the vibrations within the sun. It's called helio seismology. That's like, oh, okay All right, let's continue on nominal five dollars. How do we see the same constellations while facing the opposite direction in space every six months Thoughts on that panel well The equatorial stars do change throughout the year Um, I'm all I'm all out of uh baller life jack I'm not a cosmologist Oh, you're not even trying anymore, dude I'm like four hours past my bedtime. So it's all good bro. I just admit that you have a religion I just want to know how gases can gel in a vacuum in the first place Usually when you let gas release gas in a vacuum it fills the space, but somehow in space the gas giants congealed and Turned into a ball If we're gonna express gravity exists. Well, can we have an experiment to prove that? having dish But how does prove that gas can be with all the gas little gas particles spread out in in space Where does it gravity? Cavendish proves that gravity will come together into a ball in a vacuum. Yes Cavendish proves that gravity Gas come together in a vacuum. Yeah, because once once you establish that matters full matter All you got to do after that is Is do the basic logic just make that basic Leap in logic right exactly Let's look at our finishes point there Once you establish that mass attracts mass, you know that there's a vector from you know mass pulling mass all you got to do then is if you have a A big cloud of gas, which is how stars are born is do the vector add up the vectors So you you do a mathematical model when you have the the big cloud Of gas, which is how stars are born We can actually observe that in the sky and then you do the simulation with all the vectors adding up and they become stars Like it's really easy. Yeah, because actually we don't observe anything like that in the sky I don't know why you said that and actually when you add the kinetic velocity of gas See the equilibrium in a vacuum of flying second law of thermal dynamics That would be way stronger than any downward acceleration bias could possibly cause any coalescing of gas into a sphere because Again, the second law of thermal dynamics rain supreme. So we can move on that the answer is no You can't provide experimental evidence for it's a story. You believe The creation account void of evidence that you believe as other people in lab cults told you like priesthood Twice in the well, I thought you were going to engage inflation Dude poisoning the well was preemptively discrediting your opponent to a to an audience. I didn't do that Okay, okay. It's literally just adding up vectors. That's all you got to do Okay, it's like it's a simple simulation adding up vectors Yes, it proves that gas is congealed in a vacuum to form a planet. Yes Yes, what's the vector? What's the vector of gas in a vacuum? What's the vector of gas in a vacuum? No, okay You just said add a vectors. What's the magnitude of gas seeking equilibrium in a vacuum? Okay, the the magnitude of the vectors are going to vary as as gravity pulls them together because gravity You know as the radius decreases the the the magnitude of the vector increases to the square of that So the vector is actually going to be variable and it's going to pull the mass together Until the the point that the vector is so big that it causes it to to uh nuclear fusion and of course the the planets what happens to the planets is that we don't have enough gravity to keep the The the hydrogen in and what's the hydrogen gas? Let me finish. Let me finish. Let me finish. This is so Let me finish. Let me finish Hydrogen escapes from the earth because we don't have enough gravity to keep the They're in you know, it reaches escape velocity. The earth is losing hydrogen like every Every day and and and then what we're left with is just the metalicity, you know, like those clouds have metalicity Which is all the rest except the the hydrogen is that it's how you identify Which uh cloud does this star come from you look at the metallic of the star Hi, bro. We'll buy we'll buy a science fiction. I want to hear the rest No, it's not science fiction. You you can literally do this math like physicists do this math all day Math does not dictate reality Exactly math describes reality. Why are you talking about? Yeah, yeah math also can describe Superman flying math doesn't prove things We want physical demonstrations. You're making claims antithetical physics. It's the pillar. Oh my god. I'm getting dumber Can we can we wrap this up next super jet? Don't worry, bro Yeah, okay, so everyone watch just I just type the pressure the pillars of creation Which is a nebulous cloud that is exactly what i'm talking about Which is like stars being born out of that cloud. That's you assuming what's happening DM us the rest, bro We're seeing what's happening bro. We see that in the sky. I am sorry We we got three more questions to go and uh, I do want to let uh, uh, uzi and ozayan, um, all the other names that I can Try to wrap all those syllables around. Uh, we do want to we do want to let everybody go here soon because We've gone on from where we're at 1 a.m. Leo crow from dot Leo crow five dollars regardless of what the sun is plasma or gas How does it maintain its axial rotation? You guys didn't even answer it Basically just said like oh it has mass. I should be able to do how does the sun maintain its Axial Please ask three times you must want an answer. He's openly admitting that like his belief It means that if an object is already moving Adapts as he types it in google like that is his new belief What is my what is my algorithm update? I'm not claiming it as a belief. He's asking a scientific question. I don't have to answer to All right, better than veteran don't want to let him. He got trouble to let him in I'm gonna start rapping bro. Let's get out and look it up if he wants to What do we got left? Well, let's uh, we got two yep. Yep 499 the year is 2031 scientific science officially proves the earth is flat What do you do the next day? So I think they're asking like what what is this really going to impact on your day-to-day at the end of the discussion I will show that all these all these countries are working Should all the countries are working together if the earth is a geocentric stationary flame first in the middle It changes a ton philosophically shows we need to come together and demand that we are able to freely and privately explore the world that we live in together And uh the fact that we have to fight the other slaves to be like, hey, let's be able to freely explore is super weird If you have to ask what it would change then you haven't even actually been honest enough with yourself To look at the conversation seriously Yeah, I think a fundamental human race should be freedom to travel wherever we want to Including Antarctica anywhere When science proves Yeah, go ahead. All right, bro. Sounds good. Well, I was gonna say, uh, we've had plenty uh Plenty of closing thoughts as far as the q&a goes So I do uh, I've read off these last few super chats here, but we're we're not going to get any input here just because There's not really a whole lot of conversation But there are some compliments. What's it for the win? I'm now a flat earther from Stephen McCool reacts for two dollars Stephen McCool once again says for two dollars a glober is why be closed minded drones try waking up Those are a little ad hominy. So we're going to move on and also we've had such a long conversation Stephen, I'm trying to go just you behave in that live chat Yeah, exactly. We want to go to bed here. Uh, at least this was entertaining any globe curve from tayo Uh from enslaved by truth two dollars research toilet bowl earth Yes, and while you're at it research that the earth is a bag of bread as I made james say on Air many years ago when I first uh did a super chat and then I never did it again. All right It just came over here to work Stephen McCool reacts for five dollars the more globers have to defend their position the more convoluted it becomes Why do we have to make up so many theories to prove what we see? um Well, uh, Steve and I would say uh review the debate here because we've gotten a little over time There's I think plenty of discussion here between these These people here to uh flesh out what they think on this subject Um, so I hope everybody had a good time. Thank you. Uh, Karen and uh, wits it uh, the tar and uh, OZM for coming out here tonight And we appreciate you guys and we'll see you next time. Okay All right. I love thank you Bye Stay flat I'm making weird. Bye. You're baller