 Thank you, and now I'll see if you were paid attention please who is from the dev side of the house dev developers architects shy people Who is from the upside? All right, look at that They have ops Who's from the DevOps of the side who has been married is new way to do all right. I like it. Okay. Thank you So I like to start this panel. Thank you very much for your presentation was interesting mix of experiences I like to start with the journey right with everything that started for you Right, we're what what was the time and you say you know what we need something else here Right, we can really go on like this and we're gonna explore this journey through the trip The three threads right you know technology evolution People behavioral change which is happens to be one of the hardest one I think in banking and also processes not that easy at all as well like people change right so I like to start Maybe with Steve right so um, what was the journey from the very beginning right? sorry Roger and Where do we what would everything start there? Why the reason to think about maybe a past approach and what are the challenges you guys faced in the beginning very beginning So in terms of why the past approach I think I sort of touched on that during the lightning talk the way we've been doing things wasn't really sustainable But in terms of the challenges although there were some technical challenges I mean, I don't want to I guess understate the complexity of rolling out multi-data center always on those kind of things but They're relatively straightforward compared to the people challenges the first developers We took off the ranks were working on a very old tech stack as they themselves put it when they were asked they learned 20 new technologies in six weeks to stand up the proof concept in Terms of creating buy-in we had to do a lot of road shows We had to show people rather than just tell them about how awesome it was going to be to convince them that we were capable of doing this and we faced a lot of questions from people who There's this term in the business side of the world the frozen middle We had developers who were keen to do new stuff where people at an exact level of vision of where the bank should be And there are a lot of people in the middle saying this is too different I can't get my head around this one of the earliest presentations. We did to a business leader One of his change managers said look but but if you're releasing at this kind of cadence if you're just continually pushing change out How do we handle training? How do we handle change management? We need months to do that That's the kind of pushback. We have people in in our finance area who understand very well how a financial model works for waterfall they're still getting to grips with how a Financial model works when you can have two-week sprints Literally changing your objectives as the product owner wants on a fortnight by fortnight basis and really it's it's about the ongoing challenge with that is just Continuing to build trust that this stuff all works the way it says that we say it will work That it's not going to break that it's not going to collapse the bank that we can automate things that have been people Processes that we can use evidence rather than people's best guesses And we just have to keep pushing and pushing and pushing. It's really a marathon not a sprint You can sprint the technology. You can bring an expertise to help you with that, but you just have to grind away at helping people Change as individuals and change Really familiar with also also our journey we'd we like to think about it basically on Just building up on what you said Roger It's like you have a burning platform that you need to get out to and also this shining star that that you want to be So talking about the burning platform at least for us was maybe environment provisioning that was our biggest pain and when you are going into this transformation you have these proof-of-concept kind of Projects that you want to stand up right now Do your proof-of-concept in one or two days show that to the business and then shut it down with a provisioning time of Few weeks that was not possible for us and therefore that was kind of the shining star bit but from a burning platform it was more like okay, well The developer is asking for an environment for him on his own in order to test some very Intricacy of the product itself and that was not possible. So people were getting a little bit frustrated somehow so by Giving them that success and and showcasing or identifying some of the change leaders So to say we were able to actually bring that as a wave towards the others because now it's not us talking to them It's people from from so to say from their their rows that are talking to them using the same language and the same engagement Thank you. So Flavio also you had done some work in the back office I like to be you Flavio and I mean I mean you've done some work in the big Backoffice banking, which is usually a big block monolithic in general in nature, but you have done it right put it on a very flexible You know platform. So what did he what you guys started in TESA? so we start the composing the Our corporate banking application We composite and we take out from the monolith application that is bigger the first function the landing page of the application the I would say The as I don't say how to say bonifical in English. I don't know So we take the the major Parts of the application and we move out from the monolith in a small micro services And we develop them and we gain the possibility that open shifts give to you to if the Container that you can copy and you create a different tenant all the same You can make new tests you can increase your quality of the software because you can test it and this is small code So it's easy to do better It's not magician because the memory leak is still waiting for you Anyway, you can keep an out-of-memory also in micro services application, but it's quite easy to understand why and Do something before to do not have this kind of problem Actually, we are Near to the end of this trip for the first main application while we move a lot of smallest application, but we know we haven't so many Troubles dub it against one of the our major application day in the bank and Just tonight we move the last customer to the new application and we will run an open shift from very cool So cross fingers. Yeah, first on board the customer in a new platform and Any words from you Felipe? Yes, we we follow similar approaches as well for some applications We are slowly shifting new functionality that needed to be rebuilt or we wanted to Create something new from scratch and instead of of doing with the old technologies we just Create a link to a different URL that actually takes you all the way down to open shift and we did creating with using microservices exposed through APIs new functionalities that gets Bigger and bigger functionality every every drop So we we start with a small MVP and we keep on grabbing and grabbing and try it started We just one little functionality form a big website and now there's like seven different projects working in parallel on the same application Traditional applications. They're all developing on their own paths different functionality and modifying it and Soon we will get to a position in which the all applications sold on and we are all running with new technologies Yeah, it sounds very similar to what we're doing in terms of Taking the small bits. We have already had our microservices running, but not on the pads So what we've done is we've built a make what we call the microservice framework that allows us to take the business functionality out of our microservices Put them on to a new runtime container But get all of the benefits of the extra bits that we've written into it And so that it can integrate with a API gateway It can automatically get its health checks and things which the previous micro services didn't have Thank you The only other thing I'd add just before we move on is is evidence is gold our biggest Our biggest improvements in mind share in the broader bank have been when we've been able to go back and say Here's what things look like before here is the cost of doing a deployment. Here's the time He's business opportunities. We lose when it takes this long instead of this long So before you move a thing Gather the facts about what it looked like so that you can come back after you've moved it and say Here's why it's better. Here's why this was worthwhile That really leads you my next kind of topic is so if we went through the beginning Right where you are now so you have seen the difference between when you started that maybe a month or years ago We have achieved I think flexibility and definitely time to market time to deliver to production But let's talk about you know the big trouble of the big problem of changing the architecture, right? It's we're talking about you know monolith all technology now Microservices maybe cloud native application and we'll talk about the future later What is in your view the complexity and what use what is so as a challenge, right and specifically to I mean I Like to ask you about the third-party component because now Financial services is shopping is shopping for new capability and technology with the emerging I want to say fintech is kind of a trigger sometime, but however, it's true that we Expand in the ecosystem. We're very interested into also that aspect of you know Not only the platform you're building in-house, but the guys that were coming with the goods They are now in a different form and shape because you have me you'll be moving up and And in the evolution path and maybe you're providing now a little bit behind So who's pushing them to come in with this new form factor. So what about now? We have achieved and what do you see as the ecosystem? So our our case scenario was a little bit different in a way that we were not building new functionality it was basically taking a product from the market and then integrating it and in in that shift You also mentioned the integration part and it is that integration part That is for us the biggest challenge because basically what you are taking is a heart and you want to transplant it into a body And do you want that? Somehow to to to work right so what we did is basically that heart that we were taking we kind of Duplicated in a multitude of of instances and then we tried around it to do what we call service virtualization or mocks so in in a way those Those basically duplicates are actually heart that is from itself is thinking that is inside the body so and then the the The core banking is set up on it on a VM Kind of environment and that is what we have in in production now what we have seen in in doing so is that People will build up expectation Yeah, all right. I have what I'm used to yeah I have the middle ground that now we are building but I also have this cutting edge That is actually helping us do better things right and it is that balance of Expectation that is quite quite challenging and that's what we are living currently It looks like you know typically agile agility, which is essentially really a negotiation between the devs the ops and the business guys Right a continue negotiation, which is what makes everything agile? I guess the beauty now that we can accelerate a little more on the delivery side and maybe Philip you can Share with us. What is your view? And if you can bring an idea of the achievements, right you guys have been able to to get out of this journey I was Achievement. Well, I was gonna say that to add to the previous conversation with Haris. It's a very good topic and very interesting because How did I say it? Okay, we We did the good but the great benefit that these new technologies from my point of view bring in is Standardization and automation that that gets out of a way so many problems and you just You abuse of that and that helps you a lot in the truck in you in new travel But now apart from your own software you're deploying and you're creating and you're putting into production now You have vendors that also You need to incorporate their solutions into your portfolio And you have third parties that create a software for you and you also need to adopt that software But you want to put in the same pipelines. You want to make sure that that Follows the same standards. So you end up with the same standardization and automation that provides so much benefit so much benefit and that's a Problem that we would we need to solve how do we? Adopt new software whether it's from a third party and they give you soft score or it's a vendor I give you some binary how to adopt that. I'm Incorporating our pipeline so that he it just meets our standards of quality Fly you any comment or You know, some of you are in the early journey But what is beautiful is I see the kind of the maturity level which is not codified by the way We are all here I would like to you know Kind of driving the practice in financial services to have all of you coming in as you know what we think you know There are three stages that we are 1.2 Let me push you into the second stage right it's not codified anywhere because it's new and especially in banking where you have a Lot of regulation dev ops is really a contradiction of the maker checker right to the concerns of you know Really splitting who touches proud who these endeavor in development so being dev ops in banking is quite hard Right, exactly. It's one of the things that dev ops is really harder for us. We are structured we have They're the 80 the opposite dev different situation and the tools and open shift can help you in the Exercise and the quality of your services, but only person can do the difference. We start and together with me there is the dev on this Experience and we work together for a couple of years Dev and ops with the same Objective we get the result only only because we Trust together on the result. That's I think the difference between before when The ops have only one mission availability availability and availability and normally while in the last year we work so Near so together for risk the solution to to find a way to solve our problem together and would and Deliver the new application in a different way than before Thank you, Flavio if I would give you five second each and I'm asking you a lot Show me a picture of the future five ten second top and when we go to lunch Who wants to start? What's your future? I mean Business saying hop press a button you hop That's what we all want yes One pipeline don't care whether it's on prem cloud, whatever click button spin-up things and we put it is Regulation cost whatever it's no longer about how hard it is to do Yes, I'm agree. I think that in the future we will have a mix of infrastructure While for the banking in our case actually it's all on premise. I think We are moving in different multi-cloud Steve your future. Yeah, I think it's from the developer Committing their code to get into building an environment testing it getting into production Managing it when it's on production eventually decommissioning it I'll see mostly working almost from one click And thank you if my future is with the developer amazing community leaders is to have the financial service community To create best practices to adopt open source in financial services. Thank you very much to the panelists. Thank you very much