 Welcome to the show we are so glad you're here for another episode of the nonprofit show and today, our guest is Josh Meyer joining us as vice president with blooming so excited to have you Josh, and you're here to talk to us about the 2023 fundraising effectiveness project take away so right up my alley super nerdy ready to get nerdy with you and and see what this looks like but before you dive in to the project we want to remind our viewers and our listeners who we are, if we haven't met yet so Julia Patrick hello to you. Julia serves as the CEO with the American nonprofit Academy and thanks to her we are 800 plus episode strong so Josh you are 801 just want you to know you're way more than a number but we of course want to recognize that. And I'm Jared ransom nonprofit nerd and CEO of the Raven group and again honored to serve alongside as co host here for the nonprofit show. 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Hey as I said we have a lot that you can indulge in so please do check out the previous episodes going all the way back to March of 2020. And you can find these episodes on multiple platforms which include streaming broadcast channels, we also are in podcast form for so for those of you that are auditory or maybe you've got some trips coming up this summer and you just want to plug in and listen. And then also the latest and greatest is you can download the app so on any of your smartphones, you can pull up in the app store the nonprofit show. And in just a couple of hours few hours today you will see the episode uploaded that we are having right now with Josh so with that we want to welcome you here to the hot seat. So Josh Meyer, Vice President demand generation with Bloomerang. Welcome my friend. Well it is a pleasure to be back here and for those of you that I haven't had the chance to meet. Welcome so so glad you could join us this morning as we sort of talk dirty not dirty talk, get dirty with the data. Wow. It is early here on the West Coast I'm gonna have another cup of coffee. I can't talk dirty, because it's the dirty nerdy talk right dirty and that's what we're going to get into and we really do think that data is sexy so talking about the fundraising effectiveness project with you. I couldn't think of anyone better to really get into, you know, all of the juicy details so Josh tell us a little bit about the, like the impetus of the fundraising effectiveness project. How it got started. Who are the players involved and just you know, give us kind of that overarching, if you would. Yeah, so the fundraising effectiveness project is a program outside of the AFP global so the Association of Fundraising Professionals. And it's, it's a number of the donor databases in Sierra, so sort of got together to share data right so it's blooming but it's also, you know, our friends over at neon and donor perfect and Kila, and Bontera adds some of their data analysts in there to sort of help us understand the data. And we meet quarterly to sort of look at what are the trends that are happening in the industry right. So we anonymize the data, pull it all together and see, you know, what's happening where are we seeing increases and where we seem decreases to better inform the nonprofits out there but also to inform the tools that we're creating right the software that we're building, so that we can make it easier to work with some of the challenges that we see in the data to make it easier for those nonprofits to dive into their data and sort of really hone in on what aspects of the data they should be focused on to sort of improve their fundraising and, you know, ultimately then sort of drive towards the mission. So, you know, I think of all the things that we see this to me is the most important because it is, it's almost like a miracle in this day and age to think that all of these, if you will, competing entities come together, they share their data and to your point it's all anonymous but this is like a real time because you're doing it quarterly, we don't have to wait for some of these studies that take more than a year, we can see what some of these trajectories are. And then, I love I'm assuming that that you at Blumerang, you're looking at where you need to make your own investments as well you're not just sharing the data, but you're improving your product lines right. 100% I mean I think one of the things we're going to talk about today here right is donor retention and so we really focused as we built out Blumerang is how do we make it really easy for fundraisers to calculate their donor retention right it's not it's like a little tricky right because you're looking at all of the donors that give that gave last year and then all of those that gave last year how many made a gift again this year right that's a little when you're sort of using spreadsheets or things along those lines right it can be challenging and we can make that super easy for fundraisers it's then they can sort of track their progress are the tactics that they're doing in the field right are they you know the phone calls that they're making that thank you notes that there's writing right is that helping to move the needle that we can make that easier for fundraisers than I think we all went right as an industry. You know, we're all putting our best foot forward. We're going to get into this I'm excited. We're going to start off with some. Dear I say like not so hot news right dollars raised they're actually down and that percentage is 1.7% tell us what this means and and and really you know like what what we can expect moving forward. So that one point set 1.7% is 2022 all of 2022 in comparison of all of 2021. And so you know I think one and on one level right I'm sort of thinking like are there still sort of covered in you know impacts right. Maybe maybe not right we're sort of on the other side of this now but you know when you're comparing it to 2021 right there was like a bigger impact there. But I think the bigger takeaway here is if you look at the the total dollars raised right 75% of that came from what FEP defines as major or large donor so donors that gave $5,000 or more. I think a little bit of a headscratcher but not really it's sort of like, what is your donor as a nonprofit like what's the takeaway here it's like what is your, what is your major gift strategy, are you making it easy for, you know, major donors to give. I'm thinking about like what are the vehicles that major donors give right and sometimes it's cash but oftentimes it's stock or securities right or donor advised funds, or you know, a year ago I would have probably said crypto today I'm not sure right. But you know I think it's also but it's how are you making it easy for your donors so if you're a small nonprofit. Do you know, do you have a process in place to accept stock right because one stock gift could make make up for you know so many smaller smaller donations. So it's it's making sure that you have the systems the opera operational mechanisms in place to be able to take those kinds of gifts and whether that's you know, investing in some software or there's actually a number of software and we actually don't do it yet. But there's a number of software that it is relatively free there's some processing fees right involved in it, but that can make this easier so I think it's, it's taking the time to kind of invest in sort of what's your overall major gift right. The other piece on that is where you finding new major donors, right. How are you prospecting whether that's you know, you know, tapping in relationships that your board members may have, or are you using services like a donor. Right now windfall donor search right some of the data aggregators out there that are sort of pulling together wealth information. And then how are you feeding that into your donor database and how are you laying that over to people that are already in your donor database but then also using that information to potentially reach out and find other major donors. Yeah, go ahead. Well I was going to say, I can't help but to wonder if some of our workforce challenges, Josh over the last year 18 months is impacting the decrease in the dollars raised right like I just, I don't know if the project talks about a correlation in that but I can't help but to consider that option. Yeah, I mean I think that's part of it I think the other pieces like boomers right like boomers are leaving the workforce and many of them are out already but then it's also they're sort of leaving us right I mean there's no other way to look at that they're passing on. And so it's also there's a there's a like a component of this as well as what's your plan giving strategy right and sort of how are you layering that in and you know how are you talking about that and so some of those major donors so some of this could be major donors right that sort of were significantly making big yes that are no longer with us but like did you take the opportunity to develop a plan giving strategy so that when they did pass they left they left that but then you got to fill the other side of the funnel right which is how do you bring new people in right and that's I think the other the other thing that worth talking about. Talk about this reduction of donor participation but this while that stat you gave us was last year I think it's really important to acknowledge that this is a trend over the past decade. So it's not just like oh well it was a bad year. I mean we're kind of seeing some shifts and some changes. Talk to us a little bit about that of what it is you think we can kind of attribute that to and maybe how we can kind of mitigate that. Yeah so dollars down was 1.7% donors right so individual donors was down 10% and so right but the way the way that that math works is because remember 75% of your donor or 75% of the dollars is coming from those major gifts so you have a lot so what that tells us is that a lot of the smaller donors are just but they're not coming back right the major gift is sort of offsetting it a little bit but like 10% down on donors 1.7% down on dollars. Yeah sorry there's a I think Julie you're going to pop in there in a question. Well I mean it's really an interesting aspect because it speaks to me the overall arching theme that you brought up is donor retention that we need to really be thinking about this because of that shift and where our donors are coming from. And I would say how they're coming to us right. It's such an interesting thing. Talk to us a little bit about volunteerism because you have addressed that in different times with us and you had some really important pieces on how volunteerism factors into donor retention factors into the cultivation piece and we don't necessarily talk about that enough. Yeah I mean I think that's interesting so like as we're trying to think about all right so donors are down by 10% we know that sort of the major gift we talked a little bit about sort of what should you be doing to bring in that new major donors but sort of how do we get that other piece of the puzzle right and one thing that you know I've been given some more thought about recently is right so these nonprofits have these amazing volunteers but are we asking volunteers to make a gift. Yeah I think sometimes we get a little nervous about that well you know they can't maybe they can't afford it or you know they just want to volunteer so we shouldn't ask them but I think that's probably not the case. I was doing a little research recently and I saw a couple stats here that kind of stuck with me. Fidelity charitable trust or the Fidelity donor advised fund did some research relatively recently and they saw that 42% of volunteers 42% of people that donated previously had volunteered for the organization. Right so they started so it was like the gateway into the organization was they volunteered they saw the amazing impact that that organization was having on the community and then they made a gift. And then the other stat I think that really stuck out from that from that research is of those that were volunteers first 50% made a larger gift than had they not been a volunteer. Right so there is this like connection with people that are volunteering for nonprofits and and they're and they're giving patterns and so that the question I take back to the audience is how are you stewarding your volunteers right how are you asking them right I think again we get little we get a little nervous like that you know but we got to ask the worst thing they're going to say is no, and I think if you do it in a taxable manner. It's not going to know it's not going to upset anyone right so you just got to sort of figure that out and then maybe even do some research right so if you have a volunteer that maybe actually have a high net worth. And that is, you know, in your best interest to ask or to steward that relationship, right but you got to be tactful about it and figure out for the right time and the right messaging and sort of build build that case. So I think there's just a couple, you know, things around volunteers that we should be thinking about. And then obviously the last thing I'll sort of stop and I'm sure there's questions is, you know, how are you managing that that the data around your right, and how are you tying that into your donor database and your CRM, or all your systems talking together right, because in order to be able to make those asks for volunteers you got to kind of see who's a volunteer who's a donor, and then sort of layer in some of that additional information to have the most impactful ask. I feel like, you know, asking volunteers to also make a financial contribute contribution has been a point of contention for ages. You know, and I've been in a multiple conversations as I'm sure we all have, you know, where organizations are like we can't do that that's, that's rude that's inconsiderate right. And then I also know the flip script of that where some of the volunteers that give generously of their time have also given generously of their dollars. So I don't I don't understand why it's such a point of contention because as you said Josh, the worst they can say is no and really that's a no not right now. That's right. And you got to make the ask relevant or I mean, you know, $5 is more than $5 that you had before or $25 right maybe they can't go big and maybe it's $25 once a year. But it's still I think it's a meaningful gift right and I think the other piece right that related to that is board giving right and if your board is not giving. My question is why right are they should they still be on the board right because that is a level of commitment that should be an expectation. If you're going to sit in a board now like there's always occasion no exceptions to that but in general that's that's the rule that we advise people to do and so I think the question is and board, you know, oftentimes are volunteers right and so it starts there. How do you build a culture that supports both volunteers and you know donors financial donors, and how do you sort of weave the two together because I think there is a there is a connection there that's really important to take a look at. You know, I agree and I think this is such a missing link and and not to I don't know if you're ready to talk about this or not but Bloomerang has made investments in volunteer management and I don't know if you can share a little bit about that with us. But it seems to me that, you know, even just starting at the school level look at how many public and private schools are ending their day early on Fridays and they're expecting those students and sometimes their families to volunteer for the rest of the day. I mean, we're getting a culture of expectation and moving this forward but yet the nonprofits aren't seeming to align this data and looking at this as a future pipeline. Can you talk to us a little bit about what the technological aspect of this might be looking like. Yeah, this is great great question. So we did we recently made an investment in volunteer management software to add to the Bloomerang portfolio of tools. And the reason we did that is our customers our clients were asking for it right how can I better manage my volunteer data how can I tie that in with my financial donations my donor database right so that I can see a true full picture of my donors right. And that that was a ass that came from from our customers and some were sort of using the donor database, figuring out creative ways to do it within the donor database well now we have a whole solution that makes it easier from the acquiring volunteers to screening them to scheduling them that oftentimes is one of the most difficult pieces about you have all these volunteers, you have all you know all these opportunities, how do you match them together without sort of losing your mind and playing in turning gray. Right. And so I think that is so the tool sort of helps streamline that whole process. And then depending on you know sort of what you like a school or a food pantry or a habitat for humanity bill. Right, or we know a lot of nonprofits do events and many volunteers to staff at various events from its setup to day of to you know tear down right. All of that scheduling right can be done and then the day of or sort of when the volunteer is engaging there's actually we, there's a built an app that comes with it and so we can do messaging in real time and so you know if it's an event that's really becomes really relevant if it's a habitat for humanity bill you know we're taking break for lunch or you know meet here. Maybe it's that morning of here's the directions to make sure here's where we need to be and you know be prepared with this equipment or this know where this attire. So just really streamlining that and then the bonus it all ties into the CRM right and so I think I hate sort of being a commercial but I think as you're kind of looking at this it's. And you're trying to figure out what technology as a nonprofit should you be investing in and sort of how does it all tie together right that's just the big piece of that is how can you find a software and solutions that ties together it doesn't have to be blooming right there are a number of other solutions out there as we talked about earlier. But I do think it that's a really important thing that you should be asking right just how can I track my volunteers how can I track their investment and how does that tie into their overall giving both time and money. I think it is so critical it is a huge piece that I feel like really gets fractured in the organizations itself like in the day to day operations. And I feel like there's also this tug of war of does the volunteer. Management does that reside within programs or within development right and like and how do we find the best fit or do we make dotted lines. So really talking about this now is just it's so critical because I'm just fascinated to hear how organizations decide to move forward with it. You know I mean I think that's a really good call out and this is the like in B2B right sales it's like marketing and sales right who owns the relationship and nonprofits. Yeah program development you know it's very true. Well I love that the fundraising effect effectiveness project has called this out in a way that it is it's not just a boohoo moment over the last 12 months but it's really looking forward for the next decade and so I love that this is something that is something we're looking at or I should say you are looking at and then reporting back to us because it's really critical. Talk to us again about this work. It is this this data is being released almost throughout the year right. Yeah quarterly is publicly available. You have to fill out a form to gain access to it. But as a fundraiser right I think it's really good to keep up to the trends right and also sort of use this to benchmark where you are right. We didn't we talked a little bit about donor retention they spend a lot of time in the effectiveness project around donor retention in the trends over time and the. Sorry I think we had like a little earthquake because my camera just San Francisco right you're just doing a podcast and like everything moves a little bit okay. That's a first for the nonprofit show I know that I don't know but like the camera definitely was like I'm I'm like okay but we're good. As not as nonprofits I think what we're looking at is the donor retention right the average is like in the low 40s right and how do you compare to that right and then the first time donor retention right that went up a little bit over the previous year and so that's a good sign so first time donor retention meaning the people who gave for the first time last year gave again this year. That's a that is a promising sign. But then how are you benchmarking yourself as a nonprofit. Are you above those numbers are you below those numbers and I think as fundraisers as nonprofit executives. It's important to have this benchmark that marks in your pocket. Obviously there's will vary community to community and type of organization to type of organization but there is there is a there's a lot of really good data in there so highly encouraged folks to check it out Well, I also want to make note of literally minutes before we went live today and email was disseminated from blooming right in the subject line is 50% of donors laps every year. I saw that Jarrett right as I was getting ready yeah. Yeah, and that to me it's stunning stunning right it's. It tells me like there's work to be done and I'm again just love nerding out over this and having the information then to make informed decisions it's so critical so thank you. Yeah, Josh you know, again I want to commend you and your teams for sharing your data there's so many folks, especially when we're talking about money in the nonprofit sector that they don't want to share this data because they're afraid of losing you know their market share or you know engagement pieces and so and Jarrett and I have said this from the get go you all do amazing job at sharing your knowledge so thank you thank you because that's a part of your culture I would imagine. Yeah, it is our pleasure, I mean I think if we can help inform than as an industry we all rise up right and I think that is part of our culture right is this this sense of empathy and sort of care and you know taking care of one another and that is really just. That's how we operate a blooming and that's how I think most of our team members, you know, operate that way as well so it's, it's, it's, yes. Thank you. Super excited I can't remember I know we're talking again in June, but June or July will have to dive in at giving USA will release their numbers for all of 2022 towards the end of June so we'll have to sort of schedule another one of these talks and we can dive in and see that be fantastic and you know again today's conversation clearly shook the earth because it is groundbreaking information. Yeah, Josh Thank you again for those of you watching and listening, Josh Meyer Vice President demand generation of blooming wealth of knowledge years of experience and expertise in the sector. Again, so grateful to have blooming as a partner and for all that you do to support, you know, missions throughout the world so really grateful to have you here thank you Josh. And for those of you that have joined us we're Julia and Jared. I feel like. What was the Ladmo and something I don't know. Oh my God, how could you not know that. I don't know just as I said we're Julia and Jared it sounded like we're Wallace and Ladmo, but you know, really glad to be here and to serve alongside in these conversations you know when we started this. It literally was a labor of love blooming was absolutely one of our very first supporters. And there and then after the show we would we would go to bed like we were like oh my God what did we do and now I'm so energized because we have such high level conversations, talking about really what's moving the needle and moving, moving the ground. So thank you to our presenting sponsors that believe in us and believe in the great work of all of you and what you're doing so, again, thank you to blooming American nonprofit Academy fundraising Academy at the National University. Join us actually Josh and I will also be there June one at the cultivate conference. And say thank you to nonprofit thought leader, your part time controller, nonprofit tech talk nonprofit nerd and staffing boutique. Again, check out these companies because they're really here for you just like you heard from Josh and blooming. All of these companies really do want to support you so please do check them out. It's been amazing. Hey everybody. I mean, I think this was the first to be broadcasting and have an earthquake. But like Jared said, you really do move the earth and we get all shaken up when we talk to you. So it was fitting that we would have that be safe my friend. And as we'd like to end every episode of the nonprofit show. We want to remind everyone to stay well. So you can do well. We'll see you back here tomorrow everyone. Josh, Jared, thank you so much.