 Welcome everybody to not financial advice live live show and as as usual I'm joined by my two compatriots guy from coin Bureau guy. How are you doing this? What is it the evening over there? It is it's early evening over here. Yeah. Yeah. I'm very well. Thanks Rob. I'm very well. Yeah, it's it's nice here. I'm looking forward to looking forward to a nice chat with you guys. Yeah, actually. Yeah, because your days days already run out. No, of course, Ben's over there in the morning trying to get his kids out out the door. Ben, welcome. How you doing? Pretty good. Thanks for having me. Interesting times today gentlemen interesting times. So, first of all, if you're not subscribed, guys got to actually, I take that back. I just figured out the guy actually has four channels because he has nothing else to do. And those four channels are Coin Bureau, Coin Bureau Trading, Coin Bureau Espanyol, Coin Bureau Japan and also, let me say the five channels because now you got Coin Bureau Eclipse. So, links are in the description. Check out those ones. And of course, Ben over at another cryptoverse check them out and for some reason, I don't know why it says this but then you don't have 2.26 million subscribers do you? It's funny because it has my picture but then it has Coin Bureau. We're such big fans of you, Ben. We've replaced our logo with your picture. Either that or I replaced my channel name with yours. Somebody's spamming finally. All right. And then of course, for everybody, there is a link in the description for a playlist for all the NFA videos that we've done here on the channel. And that's what's happening. So, gentlemen, there's a lot of things to talk about. First things first, about the poll. I did a poll and I just asked everybody what they want to see, how they want to do things because it's not, this isn't our show. This is everybody's show. And I just asked the question, what do you want to see and how do you want to go from, we'll talk about the results in a second. We're going to go over the social metric risks. And this is the thing I, you can't really get anywhere else. I wanted to ask you guys some specific questions like what are you seeing behind the scenes? You can kind of get a sentiment of what's going on. What is the sentiment in the chats? Is it very bullish? Is it very flat? What's happening? And then also, one of the big questions I get is, or as time goes on for the bull run, is how much are you getting, getting shilled for different projects? Because it's kind of like an indicator of what's happening. Also, we'll take a look at the first Republic Bank as that looks like it's going to collapse. And then the last one, I just have to ask the question, are we making things too complicated with selling and buying Bitcoin? We're going to take a look at three different things. Fear and greed, the PyCycle index and PyCycle top. And then also a one from, it's a six month and 18 month from stock to flow from, one, that's it. So, first things first, this is what I put out. We had a question and I just asked, I said, NFL, NFA Live, should we have more time for Q&A on an NFA show? And how should we do it? And this was on, I did this poll on Twitter. I did this also on YouTube. And for the same thing, people said that they want to do the same deal, which is us just talking, talking about a format, and then a five minute Q&A at the very end. However, there were some things that were brought up. One, someone said, there's this thing called Bitcoin dominance. I don't know if I've ever talked about that. And they said, maybe we should talk a little less about that. And then also, it says, I enjoy the show, if more conversations, 10 minutes, someone says, like the current formats, but be more conversational. To be fair, I missed the fact that James used to provide a different opinion to Ben and Rob. You three are better creating a show. Depends on the amount of good questions. I wish you guys just, and this is the good one, the good one. I wish you guys disagreed more. So real quick, I'm just going to open it up. Gentlemen, for this show that we have right here, how do you see things going? Because me, honestly, like we agree on a lot of things. We see a lot of things the same way. But is there things that we don't agree on? And that's just how it is? Or how? I mean, yeah, I think in general, I've got to agree with you there, which is ironic, isn't it? I guess one of the reasons why we have this show and why we talk a lot is because I guess our outlook and our approach is kind of the same. But if there are things to disagree on, if we are going to disagree, then perhaps we need to play devil's advocate a little bit more. Which I guess is just, I guess one of the problems is, isn't it, that if you express an opinion here on YouTube or wherever, even if you qualify that and say, look, I'm just going to play devil's advocate for a minute or so, people can often kind of take you at face value and be like, oh, well, Guy says this, Guy disagrees with it. And then you're like, well, no, actually, I was just kind of thinking out loud and coming up with a contrary opinion for the hell of it. But people often tend to take you quite literally. So perhaps, I don't know, perhaps we just need to be like, look, don't necessarily take what we're saying at face value. But yeah, I think it's definitely worth exploring things that we can disagree on. Maybe we need to push back against Ben's Bitcoin dominance narrative, for instance. Maybe we need to throw that out the window. Ben's crazy narrative of Bitcoin dominance. You can push back against it, it's not going to change it. Ah, see, there it is. See, that's the first step. It's baby steps. We've talked about this. I think we disagree on the Ethereum Bitcoin valuation, right? I'm in the camp that it's going down. And I think at least Guy, I think was more, I mean, I don't know that he was necessarily saying it was going to go crazy to the upside, but I think he was more in the camp of it, at least holding the range, right? I mean, it's been in a range for what, two years now? So I think that's an area of disagreement. But yeah, I mean, look, look, you've been what, DCAing alts, right? Micro DCAing alts coins. I haven't touched alts coins in like over a year and a half. So there are certainly some areas of disagreement, right? Like you guys could dunk on me more any time the alts coins have their bear market rallies. And then I could dunk on you when they put in new lows, right? Yeah, you know what? It's a funny thing because like as I've gone through this market, the more the longer that I've been in here, the more I realized like the more assured I am of something going to happening. It doesn't happen. So then like, like, like I see this on Twitter all the time, like people will dunk on people about some kind of price prediction. And then it, you know, they'll be like, oh, that's the greatest price prediction of all time. And then it won't come true. And then like, you know, six months later that come out like, see, I told you it worked out. And it's always like these things where people like, we have, you have to be right. You have to write to me personally. I don't give a, I don't care if I'm right or not. I just want to just make sure that I continue on with my same strategy because I'm going to screw up and it's going to suck and everything else. But as time goes on, you know, I'm just playing playing the odds. So that's about it. And then I will, I always do wonder why, of course, we talk as many times why you guys don't buy alts, but you've already said so much. I buy alts. I don't micro DC anymore. I'm buying the regular ones. And then of course there's times when like in Twitter. So if you haven't, if you don't follow like guy and Ben on Twitter, go ahead and do so. It's pretty interesting how they can just like rattle off great information. But I'll just, I'll get dunked on because of course all the alts will start to go down and then like, yeah, see, I told you. Everyone gets dunked on during the pre-having years because the market is just all over the place and it wrecks everyone. The idea. Yeah. Yeah. That doesn't matter. It doesn't. You know what? It's tricky when it comes to the whole price prediction thing, isn't it? Because like we, you know, or, or people trying to, or people trying to, you know, guess which way the, which way the market is going to go. The fact is no one knows the bet. We're in the business of educated guesses. And we look at the information in front of us and we make the best, we make the best guess we can as to what we think is going to happen. And hey, sometimes we're right and sometimes we're wrong. And, but I guess, you know, it's the nature of this space that it can be quite unforgiving. So, you know, when you're wrong, that's the one that people tend to remember. If you're wrong once and you're right, you know, five times or whatever, say that people will remember the time that you, the time that you called it bad, the time that you didn't spot the bottom or, you know, whatever it is. So it's tricky. I think that I think that's something that's something I always want people who watch this and my videos and kind of, you know, anyone's videos for that matter on on crypto. And it's like, when you're watching these, you have to you have to remember that this is, you know, this is at best an educated guess, no one knows the future. Because, you know, if they did have a formula for predicting the future, they sure as they sure as hell wouldn't tell us. So, yeah, that's, that's my sense on it. This is very true. And then I'll just before we move on to the next one, I'll just say this is that I will take one. There's some good chunks that we got from the poll, which was, you know, try to give more time for the Q&A, which we're definitely going to do. And the second one was just asked to have some, have some pre done questions. So I put this out on Twitter yesterday. There was some great questions already in here, which somebody said, Rob, you get a lot of dumb questions. Don't don't answer questions about Pepe coin or whatever else, because no one really cares. I'm like, that's pretty good point. So we'll take these. We've already cured the questions. We've got a bunch of them, but we'll also ask them later on. All right. So that takes care of that. Thanks everybody for the feedback that helps out the show moving forward. Let's get into this one. Social metrics. So Ben's got this website. And of course it's into the cryptiverse. Link in the description. There's a sale going on. All that good stuff. But the big thing here is the social metrics and we don't know what we're talking about. He's done many a video on that. I actually linked this video in the description so you can check out what I'm talking about. Social metrics here. You know, we see just how much it is as far as like people who are signing up for new Twitter, new fault following new Twitter accounts for Dex's for centralized exchanges for different projects also for of course views for for us here on YouTube. So this is a good metric to see, which is great. But I also wanted to just ask the question, which is this, give us some behind the scenes info from Coin Bureau and from into the cryptiverse, your comment section. Are people bullish? Are they bored? Are they super bearish? And then of course your viewership. And then this is the thing that I always see like the more that the bull run comes up, the more projects I get asking me to show them in the email, which 99% I don't. And then last and this will be like a multi-part question. But when you see all these these social risks and these these videos coming out, who do you guys watch to get information from? And who do you totally avoid? And you don't have to name names if you don't want to. But it's just an interesting question. Who's doing it right and who's doing it wrong guy? What do you got to start with you? Sure. I mean, in terms of in terms of what we're seeing here at the channel, I think I think it's best summed up by by the phrase optimistic confusion. In the especially in the comments and things like that. Like people people's people seem to be picking up. You know, there seem to be a little more optimistic about the state of the market. Obviously, we've kind of we've largely moved past some of the disasters of last year. Things are starting to look up. Obviously, we've had crypto performing pretty well in in reaction to the banking crisis. So I think there is this there is this renewed sense of optimism, but it's very it's very cautious optimism. And as I say, there's this kind of confusion as well, because, you know, there are so many we've discussed before, haven't there? There are so many headwinds that the industry is facing right now. There's so much, you know, there's so many potentially troublesome things on the horizon, especially when it comes to regulations in the US and elsewhere and interest rates, et cetera, et cetera. So it can be I think people are having trouble kind of squaring that circus. Like, well, on the one hand, crypto seems to be picking up seems to be doing better. On the other hand, it doesn't really that's not really borne out by the fundamentals. But I think the morale of people watching is is improving. That's that's definitely something. Obviously, we've got people asking, are we heading into a new bull markets? And I mean, my outlook has been fairly, you know, fairly bearish. I I've said before and I'll say again, I mean, I don't think we're heading into a new bear market now. But as I say, as I said earlier, that's my that's my best educated guests based on what I'm seeing out there. So I could be wrong, but I mean, I do notice things like people are still, you know, people are still interested in altcoins, you know, where I can find I do a live stream on here. I did one. I did a sort of off the cuff live stream here on clips a couple of weeks ago, occasionally do them on TikTok as well. And after a while, people just all the questions are like thoughts on this thoughts on that thoughts on stuff that I have never heard of. So there's still which I'm ashamed to say, but people are asking me, it's like thoughts on XYZ. It's like, I don't know. I don't know. You tell me. So I'll feel a bit bad not being able to answer. But I mean, for instance, I put out I did a on Coin Bureau clips. I did a few weeks ago, did a video, some altcoins that I'm watching. And it did really well. Low-cap gems, low-cap gems guy, low-cap gems. Well, they weren't really low-cap gems. I mean, pretty well established, you know, it wasn't like, you know, it wasn't like I deliberately didn't put it out as, you know, 100x, next 100x or, you know, to the moon or whatever it was. It's just like, here are some altcoins that I'm interested in and that I think could have potential. And I mean, some of, you know, one of them was Aave. Like, Aave is a top 20 coin. You know, it's great. But my point is that people still seem to be interested in that sort of thing. Despite the fact that I think a lot of people recognize that at the moment it is really about the blue chips. And, you know, if you're a fan of Ben, then it's all about Bitcoin. But I think that there is still, there is still that interest. The tone seems to have changed. You know, people seem less bearish in general. Yeah. So, yeah. And in terms of, so I think generally people watching are kind of more engaged, a bit more interested. That sense of apathy definitely seems to have lifted somewhat, not entirely, but somewhat. Things like, you know, our metrics are good. Like our views are generally doing pretty well. We're still gaining subscribers. We're still growing in that sense. So that's good. And in terms of projects, yeah, we still do get projects. We still are getting projects reaching out to us, not at the same level that they did back in the bull market, say. But I mean, I think that's generally a good thing. And generally the overall quality of those projects getting in touch, I think is higher. And that's a natural bear market thing. You know, there are less kind of just Hail Mary's out there. So, yeah, it's positive. Green shoots, I could say. Good deal. And before we go on. So who do you, Guy, who do you watch? And who do you watch for? Like, you know, you're passing the time and you're perusing on YouTube. Who does it right? Who does it wrong? Well, a part that there's this guy out there who, who I like, he does bang on about Bitcoin dominance a bit. But other than that, this Ben Couch, this Ben Couch app is very good. No, it's all right. I watch you guys, obviously. I watch, I like the Defiant still. I think that's that's still a great channel. I was a bit, I was a bit sad. If you guys ever watched that Camilla Russo's chat, I love the Defiant. I was sad when Robin Schmidt left because I think like he is genuinely one of the most amazing sort of content creators out there in this space. So I watch him, I watched his, I watched his new thing based AF, which is, which is definitely worth, worth a look. But I still like the Defiant. I still watch that. I think Maddox is another one that does a great job with, with DeFi. And then I obviously watch all the moon boys as well. Just to check it out. Nice. All right. Yeah. All right. So Ben, what do we got? So for all those things we just talked about, how do you see things? And then if, and then if you want to go over the social risk metric real quick. I will give a guy some advice. See, if he wants to make all coin videos, he could make a like 1.1 X all coin gems, right? That way you can. 1.1 X will get no views. Yeah. No, I thought about that sort of. Yeah. No, I thought about for April Fool's making one called 0.5 X. But I decided, I decided not to do that. So the social risk coincidentally is, if you look at them, the, the one channel that is, is sort of single-handedly holding up the social risk is Coin Bureau. Guy, you're messing, you're messing it all up because you keep getting all these views. Yeah. Yeah. Go to go, scroll down on the left-hand side and go to YouTube views. Go all the way down. No, no, no. On the left-hand side of the screen on the, go all the way down to YouTube views. Oh, okay. Okay. You know where I'm talking about YouTube and then views. No, no, no. Subscribers. Click on subscribers. Click on subscribers. Let me just see this. You can do views too. Okay. Now, now, now hide everyone. Hide everyone. At the bottom. Yeah. Now just show Coin Bureau. I don't know if I want to do this, but I'll do it. Show him. Look at all those views. Look at him. Look at him. Yeah. Still holding from where, you know, from where he was, what a year ago. Now, now, now hide him and look at me. Oh, yeah. It's a pity party. Look at that. No one wants to hear about the Bitcoin dominance. No, but I, I think, you know, to some degree, he is one of the few channels holding up the social risk. If it weren't for Coin Bureau. So, you know, this might be half of what it is right now. So the props to guy for carrying this. Throughout the, throughout the pre-having year, because we know I'm not doing it. And at least social metrics. But, but Ben, if you didn't do the Bitcoin dominance, people wouldn't have something to complain about. And you like the hero or the villain in Twitter, which is great. No, I'm always, I'm always the villain because if it, if it goes down, then I'm, I'm the, I'm the guy who said it was going to go up. And if it goes up, people are going to be like, you know, we'll stop, you know, stop dunking on people because they lost their money in Altcoins, right? Like there's no way I come out on top of this. So, so, so yeah, I would say that guys is single-handedly holding up. And there's some other channels too that I think are doing pretty well in terms of view. I think Altcoin daily has actually been pretty good at holding views and getting new subscribers and whatnot. So those two channels alone are probably keeping the social risk elevated. Most every, everyone else is, is, has significantly lost viewership, especially myself. And, and, and new subscribers aren't really in either. Yeah. So, yeah, you can see Altcoin daily is, is, is holding up pretty well too with use. What the heck happened here? December 2019, something happened. Interesting. Well, there's always, there's always, um, sometimes you get spikes like that whenever someone like shills your channel, like a much larger channel. I, I got a big spike when I had 17,000 subscribers and guy made a video about me, or he mentioned me. And then like in that one day, I got like, you know, 10,000 subscribers, like, which was, which was a big deal because I only had like 20 or 30,000 subscribers at the time. So, so guy is the king maker. That's what you're saying. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. He's got, he's got the power. All it takes, all it takes is a hit video from me dunking on. As far as, as far as the, uh, the social sentiment, I, I would say that people are, I would, so we talked earlier about let's try to disagree on things. So I'm going to disagree. I think people are becoming more apathetic. And I think that's evidence in the fact that the social risk isn't a downtrend. I mean, it, it actually put in a new low as recently as 12 days ago or maybe 13 or 14 days ago, uh, a new low. So I would say apathy is actually going up right now, uh, which is kind of crazy considering that the price of Bitcoin has gone up. We know Bitcoin's not going to go up like every month for the entire year. So at some point, whenever it cools off or goes back down, I have a feeling the apathy is only going to, to, to increase. And we actually saw that happen back in 2019 as well, right? Like, so the early part of the year, social, social interest went back up within the last half of the year that it got completely faded back down and no one cared anymore. And, and, and actually what's interesting this time is it's not, it's not even going up even, even with the price. I mean, the price at a two X off the low and the social risk is going down. So I don't know. I mean, that could be an artifact of, you know, just people worried about layoffs or a recession, right? It could be stuff like that, which wasn't as big of a deal back in 2019. In terms of the number of projects that are reaching out to me, I would say it's probably about the same. Um, it might be a little bit less than it was in the bull market, but I've also found there's a little bit more desperation among some projects because, um, I think a lot of projects are struggling to get traction. You know, if you're like a, if, if you're a new YouTube channel trying to like create a name for yourself, it's really hard to get subscribers right now. And, um, and even if, if, if, if channels as large as ours are struggling to pull in new subscribers, think about how difficult it must be for someone with only a hundred subscribers, right? But again, I would encourage you, if you are one of those people, just stick with it because, you know, the, the, it typically does get rewarded, right? Like the, the, the interest will come back at some point is, is our, my best guess. Um, but yeah, I was looking, you know, I, I have people mostly reach out to me, uh, through, well, I don't want to say because I don't want to get more of them, but, um, good idea. Yeah. Yeah. No, but I mean, like, like just like looking in the last week, like, yeah, people are saying, you know, we wish to ask for the possibility of doing a collaboration with Benjamin Cowan channel, right? Like just very generic types of, types of things. Here's another one. Hey, it's blank. We are a venture crypto fund that invests in promising crypto projects. And, you know, it's just like, this is happening on a, on a, a daily basis for the most part, right? For the most part, about one a day, I would say is, is what I get. Um, I obviously ignore every single one of them. Uh, what my, my favorite Rob is when, is when sometimes people, you know, what is your cost for doing a promotion? And I say, well, I don't take paid promotions. And then they're like, well, um, you know, would you do it for free? And then I say, well, I take, I don't, I don't say, I don't take unpaid promotions either. Um, it's kind of funny that people say that, but like they, they generally are, you know, they're desperate. I think they want, and I, I think that's also just a, an artifact of cash is running thin, right? Like there's just not as much cash to go around to invest in these projects as there was a couple years ago. Um, and so I think that's, that's something as well. And, uh, what was the other question? Oh, the question is, so, so who do you watch to get information and who, and if anybody, now you don't contain the names, but who's doing it, who's doing it right? Who's doing it wrong? Who's doing it right to get your attention? So you watch them, who's doing it wrong with it? It's kind of like, that's, that's irrelevant. Yeah. I mean, so there's, there's a lot of truth. I think into what guy said in, in that, um, like a lot of people ask about various Auckland projects. And like sometimes I, I don't provide an opinion just because I don't really know what the hell they're talking about. I'm like, I don't know what that is. Um, and I don't want to pretend to know what that is. So in order to sometimes try to pretend, I know what it is. I will go over to guys channel and, and your channel and, and try to listen to what you guys are talking about with some of these newer alt coins. Um, because I don't, I don't really follow a lot of that stuff during this phase. I just think that everything bleeds back to Bitcoin as well. Let me, let me not go in that direction. See, couldn't, couldn't stop yourself then. Um, it's hard for me to be that interested in the Auckland market at this phase, right? At this phase. So I don't really entertain myself too much for the new projects. I just, uh, I just kind of know they're out there and, and, and know that some people are making money on them. Um, there, there's some other channels I've, I've previously watched. There's one, I haven't watched it in a while, but I thought it was called, I think, um, whiteboard crypto. I think they provide it. Yeah. Yeah. I think I remember finding that channel when I had like, or when they had like 20,000 subscribers and, and I was like, Oh wow, they're going to have more subscribers than me before. And now they do, right? I mean, cause people like that stuff. It's more, it's more visually appealing. Uh, they, they explain more of the fundamental side of things, which is very simplistic. Yeah. So that, I mean, that was one, um, a lot of the, I mean, I would say a decent number of the channels that I cover on the social risk. I, I at least tune into at some point or another, just to see what they're talking about. Um, because you know, there's a lot of people that, that disagree about everything right now. And I mean, a lot of people disagree with me about, about altcoins bleeding back to Bitcoin. And sometimes I just want to go see like why, like what is the bull case for a certain altcoin, right? Like what am I missing? What is the bull case? And, and, and sometimes there's some altcoins that have gone up against Bitcoin, right? Over the last year. And I mean, that's true, right? That all that always happens where there's always, there's always some that do. It's just hard knowing which one it's like, if you go to the casino, right? Like if you know, if you know where the roulette wheel is going to land every single time, you can always make money at the casino. Like if you know which altcoins going to outperform Bitcoin, you can always make money in the altcoin casino. It's just really hard to know ahead of time, which ones those are going to be. Um, so yeah, so I think that mostly answers what you're asking. Yeah, that's it. So then I would say this is, this is what I see. And it's the people in the comment section, you know how this has not come out wrong. You know, there's like, there's like different socioeconomic classes and you have, you know, so much here that, you know, people make between zero and 20,000 and you got 20,000 to 70,000. You got somebody who makes 75,000. It's like up to 250,000. Then you have millionaires and then billionaires. And I see like, and of course it's less and less and less. And there's a variety of factors of why that is. I understand that. But I gotta tell you like it seems like in my comment section, it's like, there's a core. It's not that big, but they just like, they're like, this is good information. It's good to know, but they're just like, I don't really care. I'm just going to be here for the long haul. I'm just going to write it out. And it's like those, the ones that are like, if it's like good or bad, they're just like, whatever, I'm DCing. I'm going to keep on it. And then that's my plan. It seems like those are the ones that it's like they're indestructible, but just really mentally with it. And I see them. I see the same comments over and over again for the same people. However, seven said that like, I'll do like a positive story. Everybody's positive. Negative story. Everybody's like, I'm the jerk. So like it's just one of those things. And then for me, like, like who I see does it right. There's a multitude of people out there. Obviously, you know, your guys's show. I watched Dave Lynn. I like how he got as well as guests on because I don't have the time to get all those guests. We curates all of them. And it's pretty good. I'll, I'll, I'll altcoin daily probably has the best thumbnails and titles out there. And I'm like, God, God, me again. And then before that's why I think he's, he does so well. And then the ones that I feel like, like, don't do it right are the ones that remember when we got in in 2017, 20, well, Ben, you were here before, but when your channel started, I think guy, you started in 2017, 20. Yeah. 2018. What was it? 2018, 2019. Yeah. I forget exactly. Right. Ben. Yeah. Ben, same way around that time. I mean, you were investing in Bitcoin before. I started with the channel. 2019 is when I started the channel. I think the ones that are doing it wrong are repeating the same YouTubers that did it back then. And the YouTubers back then were watch out for this 100x low cap gem. Watch out for this. And it's like, it's like sensationalism, which is not something we need. We need reality. I think the ones that get written reality with a little bit of click bait. I mean, you got to stand out there, right? Unless you're Ben and just be like, hey, here's the, here's what's going on. That is kind of like where I see things people are doing wrong. Just doing the old stuff. All right. So that's, that's what we see. And let's get into the stuff that's going on right now. First, the public bank. So there's two things that got to ask about this one because we've, I think, well, I know guy, you've talked about it. Ben, you've talked a little bit about it. I think, but California banks bank lost 40% of its deposits in March. And now it looks like things are going pretty bad. And this is, this is not a small bank. If you're looking at this, as far as like the biggest banks in the United States, first public bank, you know, is number 14 for Pete's Sakes. So the question that I have for you is, as always, is, is this something that we're going to see more banks collapse? And is the narrative that crypto caused banks to crash dead? Or do people just are going to just bypass this and go and whatever. So I'll start with Ben because he was just talking to me now. I don't think it's necessarily over for the banking issues. I think that, you know, sometimes that stuff can drag on for quite a long period of time. If you look at the, one of the regional banking ETFs, KRE, it's just continued to slowly push lower recently. And even yesterday, what we saw first for public bank is just doing nothing good right now. So I think the issues with some of the banks are likely going to continue. It's hard to imagine. I mean, if you look at deposits, like these are, I have this stuff on the website. I don't know if you want to pull it up, but it's like banks and whatnot, all commercial banks, even small banks and so on and so forth. One of the things you'll notice is that they're just going down right now. Yeah, there's the ETF that you have pulled up. But yeah, so I don't think that it's over with. I think that it's likely going to continue at least until we see some type of reversal in monetary policy. Maybe a little bit beforehand, like maybe once we can see the lie at the end of the tunnel for this rate-hiking cycle. Right, so there's deposits. Now click on year over year at the top. There's a Y over Y, sort of just at the top of the chart on that. And you can see just how far down some of that stuff has come. And that's why I don't really necessarily think it's over. I mean, that's a pretty big drawdown, like looking at that chart on the screen. So yeah, I think it's likely going to continue. Yeah, it's pretty bad. I mean, it's quite a long ways down. But I think it's probably going to continue for a little while. But maybe it'll be over for that downturn in the banking sector sometime in the next three or four months, I think could be the case. Because I think by that point, you're probably starting to, I'm not saying that we're going to see a Fed pivot in four months. But I think that we could be getting to the point where you can kind of see it in the distance. Like you can see when it might actually happen. And again, markets are always forward-looking. So the bank stocks could recover well before then. Remember in 2008, the people who made out like them, that's where the people that bought bank stocks after they had been crushed. When basically no one else wanted to buy them, which is kind of how everyone is today. If you think about it, right? Like no one really wants to buy bank stocks because we're all worried about how much lower are they going to go? They'll probably go a bit lower. But it doesn't mean that some type of DCA strategy into the banking sector, maybe starting sometime this summer into the end of the year could work out very well over the next three, four years out from now. So I would expect a few more banks to quickly fall and go under. But I think also at the same time, I think that that has done a pretty good job of tempering some of the effects that we could have had, had they not jumped in and did what they did back in March. Yeah, see, some people want to buy bank ETFs. Some people want to buy altcoins, whatever, because they're just scared. So what do you got? Yeah, I know I should be sort of trying to find points of disagreement with Ben here. But yeah, I think I broadly agree with him, really unfortunately. I think the Fed and the Treasury did a pretty good job. I certainly haven't seen or heard anything to suggest what other banks may be on the brink. But that's not to say that there aren't more on the brink. I kind of feel that it will get worse, but as in we will see more banks go under. But I don't see it as being one big, the whole house of cards collapsing all at once. Do you know what I mean? I think we could see more incidences like First Republic, which apparently was one of the, I think the biggest user of the bank term funding program, this thing that the Fed put out there to help these banks out. So, and obviously, yeah, First Republic is, I kind of thought First Republic was one of these sort of medium-sized ones. I didn't know it was 14th. That's interesting. That suggests it is actually pretty big as they come. Because of course, what we were talking about last week is something that still comes to mind when we talk about small and medium-sized banks is commercial real estate again. I know I've banged this drum a few times recently. Commercial real estate loans on the whole tend to originate from smaller and medium-sized banks. And obviously that is still a sector of concern. So that's one of the reasons why I think we probably could see more smaller and medium-sized banks go under. So I don't think we're, I don't think that's, you know, that has, this whole story is finished now. But then again, it does seem like the Fed and the Treasury have done a pretty good job of keeping a lid on it. I mean, it certainly, when we had SVB a few weeks ago, you did sort of think, wow, this could snowball really easily. And there's been a lot of talk, hasn't there? Because now, you know, we're in it. We're so much more in the age of social media now. And I think a lot of people have identified social media as one of the big dangers when you hear a bank going under, you know, word can spread so quickly and cause everyone to sort of rush. And for whatever reason, that doesn't seem to have happened, which I think is definitely kind of cause for optimism. In terms of what was the other thing you asked about, in terms of is this still going to get blamed on crypto by a few people? Right, because like, you know, we see like the government, Janet Yellen kind of hint at it, but not really come on and go, it's the worst thing ever. But it's kind of like there's a narrative, like the reason why these things collapse is because of crypto and digital assets. And of course, that's always the big thing with Silicon Valley Bank and signatures and blah. So to me, like I'm thinking myself, is this going to continue with the narrative and people are going to buy into it? Continue to buy into it. Because I think the Elizabeth Warrens of this world, and to a lesser extent the Janet Yellen's are, you know, they're always going to need a scapegoat and crypto is crypto is the handi-escape goat there is, isn't there? It's a new up-and-coming technology. Not a lot of people know a lot about it. It's got in many areas a terrible reputation. Obviously, you know, things like FTX and Celsius and all that is still pretty fresh in the mind to say nothing of all the catastrophes that came before that. I mean, crypto has a pretty chequered history in that sense, you know, being let down by these big sort of centralized institutions that remember obviously nothing really to do with crypto itself. But I think as long as crypto still carries that reputation around, then people like Elizabeth Warren will be more than happy to use it as a scapegoat because it's convenient. Oh, it's crypto. You know, if it hadn't been for that, you know, ignore the more fundamental issues, ignore what's really going on. It's much easier if you can just blame it on something that the majority of people don't really understand. So, yeah, I think we'll see that drum being beaten for a while yet. Happily though, I think more and more people are starting to realize that that's not the case. And I mean, one thing that I do think as well is that after 2008, okay, 2008 is a long time ago now. It certainly feels like a long time ago. But I mean, if you, it's 2023, if you're out there and you still trust banks after everything that happened in 2008 and everything that happened subsequently, then what have you been doing? What route have you been living under? You know, I think a lot of people still understand that the banking sector is fundamentally flawed. So, yeah, there'll always be a minority, I think. There'll always be a few people happy to blame crypto. But I think a lot of people know the truth. I got to tell you, there is one addiction and it's hard to kick. It's called fractional reserve banking. To get off that drug, it is very tough because it has worked for so long for so many people. Well, that's my people, I guess the top 1%, I suppose. So, I will have to agree on that one. I will say one last thing for everyone is that we've seen a correlation between as the banks start to collapse and different institutions start to collapse. What happens? Usually Bitcoin and crypto and digital assets go up. And also the amount of text messages I receive from people I haven't talked to forever are like, hey, maybe I should take a look at this Bitcoin. I'm like, yeah, I've wanted to talk about it for five years. All right. So, again, Gents, let's go into our last one, which is this, I'm always trying to simplify things and make things just as quick and easy as I possibly can. So, this is about looking at buying and selling. This cannot be financial advice. Just because we talked about it doesn't mean, I'm going to go out there and sell my house and kids and kidneys and start to buy Bitcoin because there is this great thing and it's called the fear and greed index. I'm just going to use that. The question is, are making things too complex? Maybe people should just use the fear and greed index, the pie cycle top, or this one was pretty interesting. This is from plan B. He talks about, it's a trading rule. He says, you buy Bitcoin six months before the halving and sell 18 months after the halving. And you can just see it right here, how it's worked out pretty well. Like this is back in 2015, 16, no, 14. And then of course you buy and you sell in 2017 and then you wait until the next halving in 2020 and then you sell 18 months after that. So, guy, I'll start with you here. Fear and greed index, we just use this and just go when it gets to extreme fear, then I buy and when it gets to extreme greed I sell or just use the pie cycle top and just bing, bing, bing or something like with Stock to Flow. Fear and greed is definitely a good place to start, I think. And one of the great advantages to that is that it's fairly easy for most people to understand. I mean, I'm not going to tie myself up in knots trying to explain the pie cycle top. I think viewers deserve to have an expert like Ben talk about that. So I mean, I guess in terms of how many indicators we're going to use, a nice phrase that I like that one of my colleagues here uses a lot is analysis paralysis. And it's that moment where you've looked at so many charts, you've looked at so many indicators and you're no further on really than when you started. So in the interests of disagreeing perhaps, I'm going to argue for the fact that like maybe, you know, maybe all these indicators are essentially all going to tell us all different things. Maybe the thing to do is to take a longer term view and go, well, do I believe in this technology? Yes or no? If the answer is yes, then you invest when you are in a position to invest. And I think one of the things is that it depends when you have liquidity, when you have some money to invest. If you're paid monthly, come the end of the month, chances are you're not going to have much left. Are you going to be able to budget for that next month when you get paid, say, maybe that is a good time to invest. I certainly think that there are indicators like the fear and greed worth looking at. And I think it's very easy to try and take on too much information. And of course, let's face it, there are all these indicators. You have to understand. You have to subscribe to Ben's channel to understand what all these indicators are and how they work. How many people have time for all that? So perhaps a good strategy is to pick what you believe in and invest into it slowly and over time and take a long term view. And obviously there's this thing I think a lot of people who come into crypto, it's very easy to fancy yourself as a trader, especially in a bull market, especially when everything seems to be going up all the time. Oh, yeah. Everyone's a genius in the bull market. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe the thing you need to pay attention to most is the fact that most people aren't traders. Most people don't have the aptitude for it. I know I don't. And really the best form of investing for them is long term, low touch and usually much lower stress. So that's what I'm going to argue for. I'm going to let Ben talk more about indicators because like I say, he's the expert. I think going back to what you were saying earlier though, Rob, I think two great indicators that are underrated are the texts from friends indicators. How many texts do you get from people you haven't spoken to in months or years? Hey, what about this Bitcoin? That tells you something. And the UK taxi driver indicator as well is very good. That's the one. If you get a taxi in London and they start talking about crypto, that's probably time to sell. Not financial advice. Not financial advice. I sometimes think, isn't it just best to take a long view and invest for much further down the line? Don't try and time the market. And of course, or second guess the market. And of course, all these indicators, some of them are great. Everyone has their particular combination of indicators, but none of them can predict the unexpected, can they? None of them can predict that North Korea is going to just lose the plot a little bit more and fire a missile in South Korea's direction. For instance, can they? None of them can predict what happened yesterday when this news comes out that Mt. Gox wallets are apparently selling, US government wallets are apparently selling. The price, Bitcoin was at 30K, it dipped below that. Then a few hours later, we found out that was nonsense. No indicator is going to tell you that. So that's my kind of slightly contrarian view on it. Gotcha. Ben, same thing here. Do you think we're overcomplicating things? Can we just use these indicators like, okay, and then set it and forget it and we're good? Yeah, I think that's what everyone should always do. I put out a video yesterday, looking at some of the on-chain risk stuff and just saying the goal is just buy below a certain risk level and sell above a certain risk level. If you go to the fear and greed index, if you just pull it up onto the screen, I want to do something, so you have to be careful about something. Now click on raw values at the top. Yeah. So one potential issue with selling, let's say you sold all your Bitcoin the minute the fear and greed got into the 90s, you would have sold all your Bitcoin at like 20K in late 2020. Because look at where the fear and greed index was when Bitcoin rallied on up to 20K. It was already above 90. So there's a danger there. Because the issue is that we can stay in extreme greed for a long time. We can stay in extreme fear for a long time. And when we hit extreme greed back in late 2020 at 20K, even though we were already at extreme greed, Bitcoin still rallied another 3X from that point. So I would put forth the idea that if you are going to follow these types of metrics, it should really never be an all in or all out approach. It should be just sort of like a slow, steady approach. Like maybe if the fear and greed index hits a certain level, you slowly scale out, but you don't sell everything. On the contrary, had you sold all your Bitcoin in 2019 when it went to 95, it would have worked out really well. I think the fear and greed index basically called the top in 2019. It mostly hit the actual peak. And so this is one of the things I've said in the prehaving years is that I think a lot of people think that when we get these rallies, that it'll immediately go to a new high. That's not always true. Just because it rallied beyond when it hit 95 in the fear and greed index in 2021 does not mean it has to every single time. And we saw that in 2019 where we kind of got ahead of ourselves and then we came back down. So yeah, I mean, I think though a lot of people could just use these sorts of indicators to figure out when to scale in, when to scale out. And if it's going to 95, it doesn't necessarily mean that you should sell all your Bitcoin, but it could be an indicator that you probably don't want to start betting the family farm at that point because there's only going to be a certain amount of time that something like that could be sustained. So, and as far as the plan B, the stock to flow model and what he said, I think there's a lot of truth to that. Buying about six months before the having, I think there's a lot of reasons to support that idea. I still think we're going to have another scare in crypto in the Q3 to Q4 timeframe, which is going to be about six months before the next having. And I think that scare is just going to be the recession risk. Like do we go into recession or do we not? And so yeah, like I think there's a lot of merit to that. And then, and then what he said after, you know, selling a certain amount of time after it, I think there's a lot of merit to that too. And I know people, you know, people have given the stock to flow model a hard time, but it, there were some pretty accurate parts to it, right? Like it started going up and following the line exactly when the model said it would. It just didn't go quite as high as I think a lot of people were hoping for, right? But that goes for everyone, you know, for the most part. So yeah, I think there's a lot of merit. I remember what we said before, right? All models are wrong. Some are useful. I think every single model that anyone has is going to be wrong to some degree, but they're all, I think there's certain models that are useful in some ways. And it's up to, it's up to people to figure out, you know, what type of utility they can extract from each model. Yeah. I got it. Well, good. Well said, I gotta tell you, I think with the problem with the models, especially stock to flow is people, it gets, it becomes right. Then people, they, they buy into it. And then it's right again. They buy into it. And they, they get so entranced with it that they're like, this thing is never going to fail. And it fails. So it's just how it's exactly right. All models are wrong and some are useful. I said it's anything about politicians. So that's it for today, everybody. Now we're going to do what we said we're going to do, which is take a little bit more, more of the Q&A. So if you've got a question post in there, but we can start with this one here. And I'm going to take from a variety of sources of the questions. This was pretty good. I like this one. Two thousand, two hundred K. Well, each bear market wash out is different. A company like Amazon rallied 115% before making new lows similar to Bitcoin now, rallying over a hundred percent. Love to get everyone in the spectrum this rally from the low last year. What do each of you think? So who wants to take that one? Yeah, so we've kind of, I've covered that a little bit in the worst case scenario videos that I put out. Basically the worst case scenario would be if something, so I don't think Bitcoin is going to drop 95% like Amazon did back in the dot com, right? That would put it at only a few thousand dollars. So I don't think that's going to happen. But the worst case scenario would be a, you know, what happens in a recession, which is what happened back then, right? Like that's what happened back then is we got a recession and look what happened, right? Tech stocks, then a lot of them, by the way, the Nasdaq initially bounced 77% down from the high. It bounced at 77% down and it went up and then it's, and then the Nasdaq as a whole put in new lows. Bitcoin bounced at 77% down from the all time high and more or less so did total, the total crypto market cap. So look, it's not to say that it has to happen. I've been clear about that, but it could happen if we get a recession, right? Like if a recession occurs, then you could see something like that. By the way, I mean, you're already seeing the weakness in altcoins, right? I mean, like they've been lagging Bitcoin a lot. So you could have a scenario where Bitcoin goes back down to say like a double bottom or something, but where the altcoin market puts in new lows just because they've already, they already haven't rallied nearly as much as Bitcoin has and they could easily go down more during a potential correction. So I think there is, you know, I know everyone just likes to say, well, you know, Bitcoin's 2x off the lows. So, you know, there's no way we're going to go back down. In 2019, we were 4x off the lows and I was absolutely sure we were never going to go below $4,000 again. And then we did, you know, in early 2020. So, and I think most people did not expect that to happen. So this cycle, I decided, hey, I'm going to be the person and I'm going to keep reminding people that it can happen because if it does happen and you prepared for it, then you can take advantage of it. If it happens and you didn't prepare for it, then you can't take advantage of it. And if it doesn't happen and you prepared for it, then you're now just a fixed income investor to some degree, which is not necessarily a bad thing if you can earn 5% risk-free. So yeah, it could happen. I don't think Bitcoin is going to follow Amazon 95% down or anything like that. But certainly some all-coins could go down that far. Yeah. Good one. Guy, I mean, you've been around, I think, just as long as been as far as like investing into Bitcoin, what do you think about that? Do you think that it can hold up? And then I guess another one would be, what you said before about the recessions. Do you think we are headed for a recession or not? Because that would actually indicate more things. Yeah, in terms of recession, I still, I'm still surprised that we haven't had one yet. I'm amazed that it's held off for as long as it has. So I still see that coming. That's obviously going to have an effect on Bitcoin and the rest of the crypto market as well. The thing that fascinates me about Bitcoin and I guess this is in comparison to something like Amazon is that Bitcoin's fundamentals, they remain the same. They remain the same throughout. We know what the issuance is. We know what the supply is going to be. There are no surprises in that sense. We're not looking at things like, I guess you could argue that things like fees on the network are something to bear in mind. But really it's a different story, isn't it? It's a commodity we're looking at. So yeah, I don't think we're going to see the same sort of plunge. But again, as Ben says, it's perfectly possible that we could see something like that. And when you throw a recession into the mix as well, when you throw a continued high rate environment into the mix, I think there's still, when it comes to rates, I think that the consensus is we're going to get one more rate rise in, well, it's next week, isn't it? The next meeting. I wonder what will happen when after that, if the Fed turns around and says, okay, well, that's it, we're going to keep them there. We're not going to bring them down, but we're going to keep them there. What happens as people get accustomed to that? Accustomed to a permanently, as it seems, high rate environment? Because I think that could last for a long time. So between a mixture of high rates and a recession, I think that's definitely something that could take Bitcoin a lot lower from what it is now. But I always take comfort from the fact that the fundamentals, as I say, remain the same. Well, I got to say, so like for me, I know this is not going to be very popular, but like I always talk about this, about where I see things going. And if you just take a look at it from the highs to lows, I mean, from cycle one, from 2013-2015, I mean, from the all time, from the highs in 2013-1100 to the low of the cycle, it was 85% drop. In cycle two, from 2017-2018, it was an 84% drop. Then in cycle three, which is the one that we just passed on, everybody thought that 19,000 was low, and it wasn't. It was actually 15,000. And unfortunately, that was only 77%. If we get into the 85s, that means that 85% drop is 10K. If that happens, well, it happens. Some people think that's never going to happen, but we also never thought that we go below 20,000 again. How many times do we hear that? It doesn't matter to me. I'm kind of rooting for it to go lower, but that's because I'm a jerk. So Guy, this will leave us to a question that was asked in my community, because for Guy, this is from Thorium Thoughts, does he see any everyday crypto adoption in Dubai, since we don't live in Dubai? Seeing it like that, crypto for payments in the corner store, even like kiosks or anything as far as like, you can pay here in crypto. What do you see? Because I mean, Dubai's a very rich place. I would think that a lot of crypto people are there. Yeah. Do you know one of the weirdest things? This is a bit of a tangent. I will answer the question in a moment. One of the weirdest things that I noticed when I moved out here was that they still use checks. No way. Yeah. In fact, I had to show a colleague of mine how to write a check, because he was too young to have ever met anyone, which is a bit weird. Dubai's kind of a bit strange in that respect. Yes, it's a very wealthy place, but and it is embracing, or certainly the government, the authorities here are looking to embrace crypto. I must say I haven't seen it accepted in so many places. I do tend to ask, obviously, and I have got quite a few sort of blank stares. But I have seen it in a few places. It was in just the other night, actually. I had the wife and I went out for a Chinese meal and there was a little sign at the counter saying, we take crypto. They took shiverino. What? I knew it. It's weird. I saw a place in Zanzibar where we went on holiday last year and the place opposite we were staying accepted crypto is a sort of holiday bungalow sort of place and they took ship as well. But to answer to answer the question, I don't see it. I don't see so much adoption here, which I must admit is is a bit disappointing. I do see and hear a lot from the authorities, as I say, Dubai, the UAE in general is making great strides to embrace crypto, to embrace digital assets. In terms of everyday usage, not so much. I will caveat that by saying that a lot of the sort of general shopping that we do, things for groceries and stuff, tend to do it online, especially as it gets so hot. You don't really want to pop out to the shop so much. But yeah, I must say I would have expected, in fact, I did expect to see slightly more. So let's hope that's something that changes in the coming years. Some other times. Ben, you're in North Carolina. Do you see anything out there in the States? Not really. I mean, I'm not, I'm not very plugged in. I mean, admittedly. So I probably wouldn't be the right person to ask honestly. I mean, I have seen, I have met with a couple of people that like, you know, for sure have been interested in whatnot. But those were things that like, you know, I sought out and like, you know, look them up and stuff. I haven't really seen anything too much beyond that. Oh, okay. Yeah. Cause like, I gotta tell you, like in Texas, I don't see much of anything, but you know where I see a lot of adoption? Puerto Rico. Right. You'll see like, I mean, people can pay in crypto. I've seen a bunch of different places. I've seen a crypto kiosk because it's, it's where it is. If you guys see anything like that, let me know in the comment section. But as far as like off of online, I don't really see it too much. Rob, I will say that, you know, some of the adoption that we talked about, I mean, that's one of the biggest things that crypto needs to work on is coming up with more utility, you know, like more utility than just like buying and selling crypto. I mean, I use a credit card, right? I mean, you know, you can, you can, there's other ways that people can pay. And obviously a lot of those ways, like, you know, there's so many more fees and everything associated with it. There's a lot of stuff on the backend, but the average, the average person isn't going to really care about that. Like, you know, are they going to just use your credit card, which they know about, or are they going to try to figure out how to use some, some wallet that might get rugged at any point because they set it up incorrectly. You know, I think crypto still has a long way to go and actually providing that utility. I think it'll get there. I just think it's a long process. It's the early, it's the early days of the internet, you know, like in 20 years, crypto is probably going to look a lot different than what it is today. Yeah, sorry. I think that's one issue is that like, what does adoption even mean? Like, is it just paying with crypto for stuff? I think crypto has the ability to solve more issues. And once there's real world utility in, not that there's not any, right? I think there is some, but once there's more utility, when people go to it because they're like, it just, it's like, you know, something they have to feel like they use, that's when you really start to see that adoption. I kind of still feel like we're, we're still a few years away from like the average person wanting to use crypto. I don't think we're there yet. No. I got to tell you like, I know we'll have massive adoption when people don't know they're using it. It was the same thing with the internet. When you first started it and try to do it, it's awful. I had, I talked to AMP founder and Ampura and Flex, Flex Tyler Spalding a couple of weeks ago. And he's just talking about, he's like, look, and he's been around for a long time. He's like, look, this, we won't take off until people don't know what's going on underneath the hood. He goes, so like, he says, and he's right. Payments, either that domestic or international is right for disruption. It's just that you have to get it correctly. Cause you know, like, I mean, for me, I pay about 2% transaction fees on every transaction. And then speaking, and speaking of one more thing guy about checks, I just had to write a check yesterday. I had to write a check to a gentleman in El Paso because I needed him to work on my facility to create a new concrete wall. And I'm like, and he gave me the quote and everything. And I'm like, how do I pay you? And he's told me the bank. I'm like, I can do a wire. I can't do Zell because Zell has limitations and I can't do PayPal because I don't have so much in there. And there's limitations as well. I'll meet you somewhere and write you a check. And I was like, and I was thinking myself and like, geez, I do a channel on crypto and I can't even pay my people. It's amazing to me. So anyhow, so that's that. And then two last questions. This is also, this is from Jerry Coutier. How or what has happened to the old 10 plus year Bitcoin wallet movement of past week? I don't know if you guys heard about this. There was a Bitcoin wallet that it moved. Has it been anything whatsoever? Or is this just playing into what guy was talking about as far as the Mt. Gox nonsense that happened? I don't know if anybody knows anything about that. Well, I mean, there were some, like, I did see some alerts that some Bitcoin had moved and, you know, wallets that had first picked it up a long time ago. But like, we, we see that all the time. I mean, like, like every year we see people, you know, wallet or Bitcoin moving out of wallets that hasn't been touched in five, eight, 10 years. Like that's not, I don't know. I don't, I don't really think that's a huge, a huge story because I mean, you can go back and look every single year we see those types of alerts. Gotcha. Guy, anything with that? I often wonder whether, whether when you see something like that, what the story behind it perhaps is probate related. You know, someone, someone sadly died and their relatives have been, you know, they've, they've left their Bitcoin wallet and their relatives are like, oh, right. Okay. Well, but I sell this. How much, how much is it at the moment? That's my, that's my best guess. But until, until that, until that Satoshi wallet moves, I'm, you know, I'm not going to, I'm not going to worry too much about old wallets. I reckon a lot of it is probably, you know, related to people who've passed on. Gotcha. Perfect. Unfortunately, that is how it is. And then last question, we'll get out of here. Everybody's a little bit busy. So this one, let's price predictions. Everybody loves these, even though they're the most inaccurate things you can possibly spout off, but why not? So 2024 price prediction for DOT and ADA. I will remind you that polka dot as far as the maximum reached its peak in November 2021 at almost $52. And now it's at a whopping $5.85. Cardano reached its all time high at $2.96. And it's sitting at a paltry 40 cents, 39 cents. Who wants to do a price prediction? Not all at once. I'll start polka dot. Here's my price prediction. It will be somewhere in the range between $2 and 150. Nailed it. And then with Cardano, it'll be anywhere between $0.22 and $5.75. OK. That's my price prediction. And you're welcome to call me on that later on. But I'm pretty sure I nailed that one. Is that that's going to be a This Is Age Dwell tweet? Yes, exactly. And I will also give you a bonus. Bitcoin will be between $5 and $250,000 by the end of 2023. So take that to the bank. That's a tight spread. When was this four, by the way, 2024? You know what? Let's take it out to 2025 when I think that we're going to hit the all time highs. OK. OK. Cardano, ADA 2025, all time high, I'll say $2.50. Nice. Polka dot, all time high 2025. Well, not necessarily an all time high, was it? ADAs wasn't an all time high prediction. Polka dot 2025, $40, $45. There you go. Guys, just walking figures in the air. Just want to make enemies. All right, Ben, what do you got? I have no idea, honestly. These are ridiculous. I will say that I think both of them have lower to go before they have sustained moves to the upside is my guess. What I'm more interested in is look at, I don't know, can you go to TradingView for a second? I don't think I have an account, but I can check a look. You don't have an account on TradingView? Ben, have you seen my trades? Exactly. Go to the dot ether valuation. Polkadot, look at, we talk about, does it bleed against Bitcoin? But in a bull market, you have to be also where does it bleed against the fear? And by the way, I keep saying alts bleed against Bitcoin. I'm also bleeding against Ethereum as well. Actually, Rob, you can find this on my website. Type in, does it bleed? Now go, click on that. And then look up the dot ether valuation. So put Polkadot in the first, yeah, put Polkadot there and then Ethereum's already on the second one. I will say this one thing I like about your website, because I can't keep everything. I just do a search and it's right there. So Polkadot to ETH? Yeah, look at this. Look at that. I mean, there are such a thing as where altcoins are just bleeders. And look at its drawdown over the last week, on the right hand column over there. And look at the drawdown over the last week, the last month, the last three months, the last six months, the last year, the last two years. There's this thing. Ben's getting excited. Yeah, there's this thing called a bleeder. And if we find ourselves that we have a bleeder, then you have to always ask yourself, why not just put it in Ethereum? If you're going to go put it in something besides Bitcoin and the thing you want to put it in is bleeding in ETH, why not just put it in ETH if you want to take on more risk? I mean, look, I think that with Cardano and Polkadot, I'm just to speak real for a second. I think that ETH has shown a bit more strength than Polkadot has since the highs. I think that is clear. And actually, Rob, here's an interesting thing. Here's an interesting way to look at it. Look at the dot ADA valuation. So look at the valuation of dot against ADA. Yeah, against Cardano. You already passed it. Yeah, there it is. Right, so you can see here. I mean, what? They haven't really moved with respect to a whole lot of each other. But dot ADA has been going down for, I mean, look at the right-hand side over the last day, over the last week, over the last three months. So six months. So you can see that dot in general has been bleeding back to ADA. Yeah, I get it. I just think people will like, when I see this, so it's bleeding against it. Of course, I'm losing, right? But of course, I'm always having it in my head. And I think a lot of people have it in their head who like Cardano and like Polkadot and like whatever in the theorem. They're just like, well, we want to go down because we want to buy it because we think it's going to go back up. And that is predicated on the thing about we want it to go back up. But I see what you're saying. If you were, if you could just save your money and put in here, there's a better option. Look at that right-hand column. There's not a single timeframe that was pre-selected over there that's green. Is there? I mean, sure, if you cherry pick that low, you'll find a period. But the reality is, you know, Polkadot has been bleeding against Cardano. And it's not, I'm not saying it's something that I wanted to see. But it's just, it's one of those things that is happening, right? And also what is happening is it's bleeding against Ethereum and bleeding against a lot of things. Now I will say once upon a time, Cardano was bleeding against Ethereum in 2018 and 2019. And then look what happened. It popped back up to the range high. So there is always, of course, reason to potentially be optimistic. If you think that the project is fundamentally sound and will take back market share, then you can make the case that it's very undervalued. But as far as price restrictions, I do think there's an element of, if Bitcoin goes to new highs in 2025, which I think there's a good case to be made that it will, then a lot of the altcoins will see bounces. And that includes altcoins that are bleaters on their Ether valuations and bleaters on their Bitcoin valuations. So I think at the very least, you would see some type of bounce, you know, to a little bit below their prior highs. But it doesn't, but only the ones that are actually providing increased utility from one cycle to another, I think, are actually going to go to new highs. So I think we can make the case that Bitcoin will go to new highs, that Ethereum will go to new highs, but it's always hard to know which altcoin is going to. You know, it's always hard to know. We, of course, we hope, right, we hope that our altcoin bags that are holding us down will go to new highs, but you have to be careful about predicting it because most of them, most of them won't, you know, and I mean, Cardano was one last cycle that did. And I was a big believer back in 2019, I was like, look guys, it's a good hedge against Ethereum. It's probably going to go put in a new high. And it did. I think that I'll be ready to more so talk about the altcoin market in the latter part of Q3 and Q4 because I think by that point, they'll, they'll mostly be done bleeding against Bitcoin, at least locally, not globally. I just, when you start doing that, when you, this is the thing, when you and guys are doing that about altcoins, oh, I know it's, I know what's happening. So I'll be there. All right, everybody. So look, it's a, we're, we went an hour and 15 minutes. It's a bit longer than what we did. I did a poor job as a moderator to keep her being on time. Sorry, but that's it for today. So everybody, again, go ahead and check out Ben in the Cryptoverse and Guy and his 10, 20 channels. That would be great. That is it for today. So thanks so much for stopping by everybody. We appreciate it. And we'll see you guys on the next one. Thanks everyone. Bye.