 Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the punk rocker moons number podcast I am Amy Shira title with me as always is my co-host I'm Jason McClellan thanks so much for hanging out with us today and I'm gonna jump right into it Amy let's get to the beer yeah we're good well we're gonna say hi to Lyle real quick first just say hi Lyle hi Lyle hi Lyle okay good we've got Lyle but we're also all just like angling for beer so we're gonna we're gonna crack do you want to just crack the beer right away start drinking and then talk about the beer yes that's such a great idea let's just do that let's get to the beer faster ready and nailed it awesome what do you have any only one drinking a massive beer today no it looks like we've got two masses I've got a big one too awesome okay I've got the mammoth brewing company elderberry sour I'll show the beautiful label to those of you watching the video version of this and apologize for my voice that's gonna cut out this I've had this before and it is like I'm not a huge fan of sourds but this is like a tart sour it is so good and I am super excited to pour this right now Jason what are you drinking so awesome I really want to try that one of these days we will get you this beer yes love it no that sounds awesome well I am drinking a beer that is related very similar to a beer that I've had previously on the show but this is Santan Brewing's moon juice I've had the galactic IPA in the show before but this one is the galactic grapefruit IPA so got that going today what about you Lyle today I am drinking the abyss this is their 2015 edition and this is a special aged and rye barrels it's a dark dark delicious beer and I love it so much who's the brewer actually I've never actually oh sorry this is from the shoots oh nice in Oregon yeah I've not had this but I've been drinking the abyss for years it's it's a seasonal release and that's awesome where we're where to shoot fans here on the show yeah we have talked about that brewery before so cheers everybody cheers let's get to it so hang on I have to hmm my God it's beer so good all right so I guess I'm already jealous and talk about one of these days we got it I guess we should start and talk about why I know Lyle because Lyle I you you got dragged into this by me I don't remember I guess I just met you through like JPL people out here so let's let's tell people what it is that you do you describe it because I never really know how to describe what you do because you always talk about like melting ice on camera and wearing costumes on green screens to scare children go I will say that I do describe it halfway that way generally I don't include the dressing and costumes in green screens to scare children but that is how some other people describe it so I am I do a couple different things and it's probably hard for you to describe it because it's also hard for me to describe it so I essentially take what we do at JPL in terms of missions and projects and things like that and I turn it into lessons that teachers can then use to teach math and science in their classroom so instead of you know reading a book or a chapter or whatever about Newton's laws and you know whatever they are they can do this lesson where they'll calculate the speed or the acceleration of a spacecraft according to Newton's laws or or if they're not quite at that level we've got other stuff for them to do as well so that's everything from creating the lessons to training teachers how to do it to creating videos that demonstrate whatever it is that we're trying to do so it's kind of all over the place but it does occasionally involve video conferencing to schools wherever and talking to kids about space and how cool it is yeah and you do this from where I do this from JPL oh oh I see what you're getting at the studio itself happens to be in a basement and see you sit around in a basement dressing up for children on camera it's not that sketchy but uh yeah okay and it's a well-lit basement as studios are want to be and you want a basement studio that's not gonna have like rumbling motorcycles from outside or anything interrupting your filming because that's annoying to anybody who's ever worked in the studio that's not soundproofed okay and in your spare time the other reason we wanted to talk to you is you make beer I do make beer and I really like making beer most the most recent thing I made is actually not a beer it's a cider but it turned out pretty good but yeah I've been making beer for probably about five years almost six years maybe and I'm happy to say I'm getting better at it that's good it's that you're you're going the right way right some people I feel don't go that way so I feel like the people that you know get excited about making good beer and then try to make more beer while drinking the first beer just make bad drunk beer yeah drunk well good step number one in making beer is actually opening a beer and drinking it the trick is you then don't want to continue drinking so much beer that you end up making terrible beer so it drinking beer is in the rules of making beer but to to a point do you have a favorite style I feel like to make or to make to make I would say the one I've had the most success with are Belgians and I think maybe it's because the the strong Belgian flavors might overpower some of the mistakes that I make in brewing but they're they're probably my favorites to make but I've made I've made a porter I've made an Irish stout I made a honey ale I've done a couple others as well but I would say the one I've the one I've actually made several times is the Belgian IPA which is when I first thought about that combination I thought well that's a weird combination but it works so I stick with it nice okay and then since you brought it up how about to drink favorite to drink hold on that's my dog oh yeah oh yeah well we do talk about pets on this yes we are a pet friendly show dog Einstein so if Einstein would like to come and say hello he's welcome to Einstein's pretty hey I'm saying look over here bud hi a little face does Einstein help you here hi he he helps me brew beer and that like he follows me around and make sure I'm thank you bud thank you so much that's gross he helps me he helps me to brew beer and that he follows me around the kitchen and make sure that I don't drop anything or spill anything and if I do he he's there to clean it up awesome that's a good partner exactly it's exactly what you want a little helper yeah but he's not a big beer drinker I did have a really for the best right right absolutely and I don't say that and like I've tried to offer him beers and he's like no thanks I'm driving it's more like he he was home alone when a beer that I was brewing exploded as it was conditioning in the bottle and it spilled all over the floor he had a golden opportunity to laugh that up and he just kind of left it alone so I don't know what that's about that I wonder where he picked up a sense of responsibility it's so funny because there are beers and wines now that people make that are made specifically for animals yeah is there a beer or wine for dogs because I know there's a cat lady wine and I kind of want to get it it's just like I don't know what it is yeah yeah it's like I've actually seen it's called dog brew and it's non-alcoholic for your dog and you buy it in a six pack and you like pour it into their bowl and it's it's made with some of the same ingredients as beer but they don't go through the fermentation process so I don't know I guess it kind of be like giving your dog and o-dules or something but what does it do like what is the point of a beer for dogs like the point is to make the owner feel like hey I've got my buddy here we're gonna have have a drink oh yeah it's totally that's why the cat wine exists because it's not cat beer it's cat wine cat ladies don't drink beer they just drink boxes of wine right so wait does cat beer come in a box no it's like tiny little I've okay I sound like an extrovert I have not actually bought it apparently it's like eight ounce little mini wine bottles of catnip wine and you can like pour it into a glass for your cat and then you and your cat can sit and have have drunk times together because catnip so then they just get really high if Pete's listening you totally like made yourself have to get it now he's totally gonna want it kind of he does he does sometimes like lose his mind with catnip and if I can do that on a regular basis while I drink I mean it would just be that would be like video worthy weird night in I feel in like the best and worst ways at the same time there's definitely not a benefit to the dog like there is for the cat with the catnip but he probably gets excited in that I have something in my hands and then I give it to him and that's really all he wants in life other than to cuddle next to me or for me to rub his head so it's in the top three so as a brewer and also a fan of beer do you I know this is a tough question but is it possible for you to single out and identify a brewery right now that is either your favorite or one of your favorites I can probably do that so I really love sour beers and I think the place that I at least locally here in Southern California that's making the best sour beer is probably the brewery they've actually branched off and created the secondary brewery I think it's pronounced brewery to row or something like that and that is specifically sour and my understanding is they were worried about contamination from their souring bacteria they didn't want that to get into any of their non sour beers so that's why they created this the secondary brewery but I like it so much that I have joined up so I get a quarterly shipment of beer from them and I don't do that with any other brewery so I'm pretty happy with their stuff that was had I not gone with the abyss and this is more for a political reason because of inauguration day I probably would have had a beer from the brewery with me today yes and for those watching and listening we are time travelers again and we are recording this episode all the way back in January on inauguration day so just so you know and was I not supposed to say that no no no that's that's the magic of our show so we happily let people know that because sometimes we throw things out that probably sound a little confusing to people listening to this two months in the future but see that that I'm a big sour guy I love Sours and my favorites right now but they're also my curse because I love them so much but I'm vegan and so many you know Sours you know they use what do they use yogurts and other other things to to that the cultures to yeah do whatever Sours do at what point I say this as the one who does not know how to make beer at what point in the brewing process do you have yogurt involved in a sour my guess is that the costume and teach us well let me get my yogurt costume out and yes please horrifying so my amazing beer education videos I like that yeah got this is an untapped market all right I got to write this down we'll team up let's do it I'll give you credit for sure just like thank you guys I appreciate that it's like a high five every time yeah absolutely so the yogurt yeah I actually hadn't heard that but if I had to guess I would say that they're using the bacteria in the yogurt as a souring agent yeah because it produces if you've ever had like unflavored straight plain yogurt if it's made with the right bacteria it's really sour so that that's probably where it would go in and generally a Sours brewed just as a regular beer and then they add in the souring bacteria and then it's aged for another year maybe something like that where it gets sour so I don't know if they just like take a scoop of yogurt and pop it in there and what they do but now I'm really curious yeah I'm not entirely sure how or when they do it but I also know that some Sours they're they're also casked the cask process and a lot of cask beers almost all cask beers are not vegan friendly either as a lot of other alcohol for the same reason and that it's in the finishing process with the innus glass in a glass for those who don't know is fish fish bladder the swim bladder so fish stomachs basically they use to in the finishing process as filtration yeah that's still something yeah they use that a lot in British beers still they do in British beers a lot of wines they use a lot too but Guinness uses that and they they won't in the near future they started the process they were hoping to in late 2016 have it finished in their Ireland brewery the Saints whatever it is brewery their main brewery the one that the US primarily gets their shipments from they were changing their their finishing process so Guinness would finally be vegan it was supposed to happen at the end of 2016 but they're still working on it so that'll come this year oh wow yeah usually when I think of vegan beers I think okay not a milk stout not honey right but I yeah often forget about the yeah for sure I don't how does that even work I don't understand what what a fish fish bladder what yeah I mean they take it and they basically make it into like a gelatin type substance and yeah I don't really understand that the whole process and I'm sure plenty of people in the comments can fill us in but yeah no that seems like one of us is used quite commonly and in alcohol that seems like one of those things like how did somebody come up with that idea how did somebody realize like oh how do we like do this little bit of the process oh definitely a fish bladder I don't know let's try it let's try a swim bladder yeah they were trying to be really efficient with the fish and use every part we got this fish bladder left what are we gonna do with it yeah but why are people making beer like using parts on a fish like did they make fish beer oh we got another part we haven't used fish yeah I don't know if I want the answer to that no no let's not do too deep that's awful but I will throw this out there there is a fantastic website called barnavor barnavor.com and that is a website where you can go and find out all of your alcohol needs to find out if if your wine your your liquor your beer is vegan so hooray for vegan friendly alcohol vegan friendly so does that include again I know so little about how beer is made but I do know that a lot of like lower ABV like lambics and stuff are open air fermented with just like bacteria in the air like does is that a problem for vegans depends on who you talk to I mean okay typically no bacteria are just fine but yeah some some hardcore vegans you know problem with bacteria as well because I feel like because if it's open air then like anything can get in there yeah that's right yeah interesting and what's interesting about those open air ones is different environments around the country and around the world have different native yeast and bacteria that just sort of float through the air and so you get different flavors depending on what you're gonna get which is where the Belgian yeast strains originated as just from that particular region yeah beer is so complex and fun I love beer isn't it great it is one of these days I do want to make here just to just to understand what exactly is going on anytime you want just coming over no I know I got some ingredients right now so so how big a setup do you have in your house I know you can do like the tiny little at-home kits that like make a six pack worth of beer or you can do like the full air and end up with a keg like how big is your setup how much of your house or your garage is actually take up to do so I make five gallons at a time and that's not bad it it fills up my counter as I'm making it but once I have made it and it's fermenting it's just a five gallon bucket that I keep on my counter and then you know I move it into another five gallon vessel so not a whole lot when I'm not in the process of making the beer and then as far as equipment I've got a couple of big rubber made tubs that I keep in the garage and that holds most of the stuff I could definitely buy more and take up a whole lot more space but in terms of just kind of a straight setup that gets gets the job done not not a whole lot nice yeah it's got to be nice to do that and not have it like take over your entire house yeah then your entire house will smell like a like a crusty old bar at the end of a really long night only if I still a lot so yeah but see then I just wonder if the first step of beer making beer is opening a beer and drinking a beer by the end of making the beer aren't you like kind of drunk enough to maybe be spilling the beer well there is there is that yeah and there's that's what Einstein is there for I guess but and at that point it's non-alcoholic so he's fine with that right the real trouble actually comes in once I've made five gallons of beer and I put it into bottles and I have five gallons of beer and bottles that I have to put somewhere and I can only give away so much before I run out of people to give beer to which means my refrigerator is stock full of beer and maybe like ahead of broccoli I'm so sorry for your hardship yeah that is a tough situation and that's why some people you know when they have the space if they've got like a garage or something they'll have that beer fridge in the garage that's just devoted to beer I'd be you know I I have it's not a full-size refrigerator in there but it is one of those temperature-controlled it's made for wine but I took the wine wax out and now it's full of beer that's awesome yeah I've got one of those two where like I've got a top shelf in there and I've got some wine in there but the rest of it completely beer yeah I got a great deal on it somebody was moving down the street nice wanted to get rid of it so awesome I needed a place to put beer and now I have one yeah it's a good way to be it's a good way to be beer I kind of just wanted to ask about space now wait I can have a segue for this I can segue have you ever tried did you ever get to try the Nincasi at ground control beer speaking of beer that is brewed with yeast that flew into space so yes and in fact that was my third choice for today I have a bottle of it do you really I do yeah and I thought about bringing it out just because it would fit with the theme so nicely but yeah I love it I grew up in well not in but outside of Eugene when Nincasi is brewed so every time I go home it's a real quick easy trip to the Nincasi brewery and once I was flying home and Nincasi was actually at the airport giving out samples to people who wanted to try their beer which does not happen at LAX so yeah you got to pay a premium for beer there but yeah so I do I do really like ground control if you haven't had it it's delicious and it's yeah it's not just a novelty it's really good beer it is good beer I also have a bottle sitting on my shelf that I just keep feeling like because they sponsored a series of videos on my YouTube channel and I keep like they send me a bottle every year I guess which is awesome just like I feel like I've never know where to find it so I'm like I should save this for something special and said I just like sit there and stare at it all the time yeah one of these days I'll drink it but um so yeah that is beer that was made with yeast launched into space and I'm gonna do a second segue on top of that segue because I just remembered my one of my favorite stories about you is that one night you went out drinking and had maybe too much beer and then fell asleep inside a space shuttle engine this this may or may not have happened go on if you're allowed to say that story there was a there was a time in my life where I worked somewhere that can you say where sure why not I don't your podcast right you can oh no you can yeah no you can say whatever you want I mean all right so I used to work at Space Camp and I always wanted to be to go to Space Camp when I was a kid and it turns out working there is better because you can go on the simulators whenever you want but yeah so hopefully nobody at Space Camp is gonna you know really hate me for this but I got out you ten years after the fact like yeah I know right take away my official status unofficial yeah so went out with some with some friends and had some drinks and because I was living why I was living on base at Space Camp which is something they provided for people who were coming from out of state and didn't have housing so I went back home I was walking and I sat down they have us they have a space shuttle main engine on display there underneath their big Pathfinder space shuttle display and I was just kind of sitting there and I got a little sleepy and then I woke up a little while later so is this an engine that has flown or is it like a test engine what kind of engine are we talking that you fell asleep in if I remember correctly it was an engine from STS one so if you're unfamiliar that as the very first space shuttle flight and it flew on some other missions but they have a limited number of minutes that they can be fired and then they're taken off and replaced with new engines so yeah that one if I remember correctly was STS one one of the three nice that's definitely paying respect to an artifact of history in the best possible way so it sort of combines my my love for beer as well as my love for taking naps because I do enjoy that as well I thought you were gonna say your love for beer and your love of space but now you went for your love of naps three things that I love there you go so why don't you talk a little bit tell us a little bit about working at Space Camp like I've never been to Space Camp Jason did you ever go to Space Camp no no always wanted to go to space I also didn't learn that Space Camp was a thing until I was like 20 we should start a Space Camp for adults I have good news for both of you there is Space Camp for adults is there yes and there there have actually been a few groups of people that I know who've made a trip out for the summer to do adult Space Camp in fact when I was there boy I'm gonna forget who was some celebrity who is really popular at the time she was making movies she paid for her whole family to come out and do a week of Space Camp and that's that's what they did you're at Space Camp there's beer outside of Space Camp yeah so Space Camp is actually part of a NASA Visitor Center and it's sort of on the edge of the Marshall Space Flight Center so once you once you go outside and there is a Marriott or some hotel right next door that the adults stay in when they go to Space Camp so that's that's where the the beer would come in I think but yeah so working at Space Camp was actually a lot of fun you basically work either sort of a morning afternoon shift or an afternoon into the evening shift and you work with another Space Camp counselor and you take kids anywhere from I think the youngest kids were usually like third or fourth grade and then it went up into the middle school grades and high school grades there Space Camp and then there's Space Academy and then there's Advanced Space Academy for the older kids and essentially you you you work with these kids you teach them all about space history you teach them about elements of the mission when I was there Space Shuttle was still flying and so when we would assign kids to a mission one kid would be assigned the commander position and one would be a pilot and then we'd have mission specialists and they would basically learn the role of what those astronauts did during a mission and then during the simulated missions they would have to carry out those roles there were also space station missions as well for some of the I think the advanced and the Space Academy kids as well but yeah it was a lot of fun we did missions from Mars we did space station missions we did shuttle missions and it was just it was a whole lot of fun and there's a Saturn 5 there and that was the first Saturn 5 that I ever got to see and when I went there it was outside if you've been there recently it's in a beautiful display I forget what the building is called but when I was there they were just starting a campaign to raise money to move it from outdoor where it was getting rained on and it was you know growing some mold and other green things on it and there was the first campaign to bring it inside so one of the things that you would do when you were walking the kids around the rocket garden is you'd start at one end of the Saturn 5 and you'd walk all the way to the other end talking about the different pieces and it's right there and it's huge and it's awesome so it since moved inside which is really awesome and it keeps saying the word awesome and I use that Saturn 5 is awesome it is awesome and I realized that I used that word too liberally when I saw my first space shuttle launch because that was truly awesome and I try not to say it as much but Saturn 5 is definitely awesome and they have a full scale model that's vertical there and when I was starting my job there I was driving across the country from Oregon and I called to try to get directions because this was before the days of Google Maps and they said well just get on this such and such freeway and then follow the rocket and I said what and she said you'll see and sure enough from several miles away you're on this freeway and you see a Saturn 5 off in the distance and you just drive towards it wow yeah that's it was it was a trip nice yeah if anyone out there is a space fan and has not seen a Saturn 5 I would highly highly recommend getting yourself to a NASA center to see one because it is like ridiculous how massive that rocket is it's just like it's it is truly like awe-inspiring is amazing yeah there are three of them there's one at the Johnson Space Center there's one in Florida the Kennedy Space Center and then there's one at the Space Camp in Huntsville and yeah the way that they've got it set up is great because you walk in and your jaw just sort of hits the floor because the first thing you see are those massive engines I love when they do that it's just like you walk in you're like that's the business end of a rocket right there and you just imagine all that fire just like pouring out of that engine here's like oh that's power that is just raw raw rocket power it's awesome yeah yeah and then and then then you can turn around and watch people come in and do the same thing and be amazed when they come in and just like job drops Jason have you seen a Saturn 5 no no I haven't that's got to be on your list then one of these days well when you go to space camp yay yes yeah that happened space camp it sounds good it sounds good right Amy it sounds really good I yeah I feel like especially if you could get a little group of people together to do like a big space camp summer vacation yeah it would be rad it would be kind of awesome it's like what coughing what do adults do at space camp versus kids at space camp like do they do the same like go through missions like play jean crance and like put on a white vest and be mission controller like or is there like a difference of like space camp for kids is more like teaching the fundamentals of physics and then for the adults it's like clearly you're here because you're a nerd so just like go to Mars you know I think it's it's it's very similar in terms of what you're doing there because if you are if you're if you're an adult nerd who loves space you might want to go to space camp and learn about the history that maybe you didn't know about maybe maybe you love space and you love space travel and you're fascinated by it but you don't know the history of it or the details and and that is something that that you can get of course they gear it differently because adults learn differently and and because they're their attention spans are different than kids and things like that but yeah yeah I think it would be a lot of fun to do that how long is base camp five or six days I'd have to I'm trying to remember what it was yeah this yeah or maybe we'll start our own Amy I feel like it would be hard to do it without all the fancy NASA simulators but you could add beer and then that would make some of it okay so now what I'm imagining is we like like get it like rent out a small like studio space and outfit it to look like a space shuttle and make people drink a lot of beer before get into it and just like shake the walls yes they feel like they're actually in space but really they're just drunk in a little bit like woozy-eyed yes and tell people they have to wear like space costumes no it'd be a good time yeah it's like space camp space camp for drunk grown-ups basically what is in my head right now which I'm honestly not not against in any way no we can get people on board we'll have our own our own patches and stuff it'll be great no yeah we could make our own fake space agency just for the sake of drunk adult space camp and this has to happen in Vegas right I think it's called Dask drunk adult space camp yeah yeah and it you're totally right it absolutely has to be in Vegas cuz cuz then you get outside it's basically an alien world it's perfect no they're actually used to be a West Coast space camp here in LA it was sort of a temporary thing and I think they were considering making it more permanent but the big draw was to Huntsville and it just it never took off here hmm that's too bad so maybe there's equipment somewhere in a closet that could be used for your Las Vegas project well you're the one at JPL every day go hunt through some weird untapped hallways or something I don't know it's got like a like a motion theater that we can rent to just like shake and yeah this is all right that's right anything is possible in Hollywood great plans guys great plans I like this we've already come up with like several things we're gonna do here we have beer beer education videos we've got adult space camp yeah we're recording this right so we won't forget that's right I just gonna say so I want you to be taking notes cuz I'm gonna have to go back and rewatch this episode to remember all of our brilliant space and beer based ideas yes yeah yeah so has beer been brewed in space can that happen um I don't think it has I could be totally wrong here I know there's been coffee in space I know there's been soda in space generally soda in space and carbonated beverages are not a good idea because the the bubbles in your stomach on earth are less dense and float to the top and then you can burp but in space you just kind of puke a little bit because it's just sort of spread everywhere so yeah generally not a good idea to have anything carbonated I they did try carbonation in space though I remember I can't remember when but they yes it was a Coca-Cola like sponsored this thing where they sent like a special carbonated version of a can of coke for astronauts to like drink with a special straw and stuff and it was like a giant marketing gimmick but apparently it just like didn't really work very well I don't think you're allowed alcohol in space is the real issue yeah I mean you're not allowed who's forbidding this is it a NASA regulation the government I think so I think that's the case I know I researched this I'm not I'm not with NASA I'm pretty sure I'm pretty sure the Russian space agency probably like alcohol yeah and see that's probably the thing like they they may have distilled vodka in space I wish we knew about that but distilling might be be a more feasible thing than brewing well the trick with with drinking just about anything in space is it's it's not this satisfying mug of whatever you're you're sipping it through a straw until recently until recently I don't know if you're aware of this really awesome cup that was designed uses it uses capillary action to draw liquid to the top rather than gravity where you refill it so they've actually I've seen them online now where you can buy them yep I seem to have them for yourself here but my understanding is the way that they're designed doesn't actually work on earth they they really only work in space yeah so if you have them for your house they're really just a nice table piece or something yeah I said yeah action all over yourself to get it out yeah you need like a super tiny tube and it's not you're not gonna get that much suction out of it yeah weirdly looked into this for my grade six science hair project and I traced how far what colored water will go up the capillaries in celery stalks hmm I was awesome when I was 12 I just became more of a nerd but not in the good ways yeah can't ask not to drink in space I actually did a video on this and I will make a mental note to put a card in this video at this point point and be like here it is and the card will be in the this corner all the way at the end whoever who who's ever faces in this corner it'll be over their face right up here but um yeah I looked into the regulations of whether or not you can drink in space and I think I think the answer was no because of like compromising the mission success and stuff but uh but again you're talking specifically about NASA yes exactly yeah I am and I think I think the Soviets do allow I remember reading something about Soviets having some kind of vodka that's awesome because I'm sorry Pete just fell off my desk that was kind of amazing my desk is covered in stuff so whenever he goes on like the pile of stuff that's like a little bit unbalanced it just starts to fall and then he just like flops onto the floor this is such a successful show today so far we've we've had two two animal appearances this is great yeah two animal appearances and plenty of beer and very little like educational talk about space if we should do more of that um education I mean I can I can oh more educational content I thought you meant more pets I was gonna say I can bring Einstein back over here that's always welcome yes push right here thank you Pete and he's gonna bump his head into the mic and we're gonna so does Einstein actually like see and recognize things that are on screens you know I once showed him an article that was about how squirrels ended up in Central Park such a large first because I thought it would be really funny to take a picture of him looking at a computer pretending to read an article about squirrels and he just sort of stared at it and he does recognize things on screens he generally doesn't pay attention to screens but when he is looking at them he notices them the first time he noticed something on screens was when I was watching some it was some documentary about Yellowstone and there were wolves on this screen and he was fascinated by them but generally he doesn't he doesn't pay a whole lot of attention to the screen because it doesn't pet him or give him food that's so fascinating to me because I mean clearly some animals can see things and and recognize when things are happening on screens and and others can't and and I've read some different differing opinions about with dogs specifically about it has to do with the the breed of dog and like the the location of their eyes whether they're like sight hounds or like where the position of the eyes on the head but you know I don't buy into that because you know with personal experience with similar or same breed types you know one will be absolutely enthralled with anything that goes on the screen and like we'll sit there and scratch at the screen and follow things that are going on and others will like not see anything at all you know even so far as like trying to get them interested in a Skype call or something with somebody they know and like look who's that and you know not even not even my next not even hearing the the sound coming out of the phone or anything on speakerphone you know some dogs just like and probably cats too just like absolutely they they don't they don't they're not tuned in they don't have that in their radar is something that they need to pay attention to or that that something's going on but others are absolutely like wow something's going on there I need to get in there what's going on let that dog out of that tv screen yeah a friend of mine when she got a dog she sent me a video of her dog and I played the video on my phone and I put the phone on the floor thinking Einstein would be maybe interested in this little tiny dog behind this glass screen on the floor and he didn't really care the thing that he pays most attention to are the sounds specifically doorbells of color on the tv yeah and more specifically the Simpsons doorbell that really sets him off like you know that is a doorbell that's amazing also I'll have Simpsons in common I just realized that um Jason I was gonna ask if you if because you and your wife have lived separately in various stages of careers and jobs and life and everything have you guys ever tried to like Skype with the dogs so like you guys are separate one of you has a dog do they react to that because yeah no and my parents do it with their dog who is my brother um he doesn't respond he can't I mean he's fairly blind now but um he can't thank you Pete he can't see me but he can respond to my voice so if I if I you know they they put the phone or the ipad or whatever nearer to his to his head and I say like Teddy hi he'll he will sort of look around to see where I am but he like my mom will lift him up and put him in front of the screen but he won't be able to see that it's his sister yeah no we've definitely tried that at various various stages in their lives and they've never never even responded to to sight or sound I mean now they're blind and deaf so it's not not uh we're trying but uh yeah when they were younger absolutely nothing but and they're both Maltese and uh my in-laws have a Maltese too and he's significantly younger than my guys are but um this guy absolutely loves anything on the tv and on phones like if he sees that there's like video playing or something going on on the phone he gets super interested we're like trot toward it and sit there and like scratch at it and stuff it's so funny and sometimes just for laughs I'll take my phone and put the camera on you know and put it to the the reverse facing camera the front facing camera and like hold it in front of him so he can see himself and he just sits there and like it really confuses him but he knows there's a dog there and something's going on it's it's so funny that's sort of amazing yeah it's really wild it's so funny too that the animals have that knowledge like there's an animal there and I'm aware that there's an animal there but I don't know that that's me it's like that weird lack of self-awareness but like of course they wouldn't necessarily have to just I'm sorry for anybody looking at the video of this Pete is just loving the like face scratches right here he's sitting here like a real little spoiled brat and it's amazing so perfect um but yeah no animals that like don't have that that have the awareness of other animals but not of themselves and it always seems so weird it's like yeah they really do have the brains of like three-year-olds I had three-year-olds like don't necessarily have that sense of self awareness I think I don't have kids so I don't know but like from what I have heard of people with kids pizza kid but one of my dogs Odysseus he has at various points in his life you know he's good at recognizing other animals and he doesn't necessarily always like other animals but I remember one time specifically we were walking in in Flagstaff Arizona northern Arizona and we were walking by somebody's cabin and they had like a wood carving of deer or something in their front yard he saw this wood carving and just freaked the fuck out like he just like started barking and tearing and growling at it or what are you doing you're an idiot but he could recognize that it was in the the form of another animal it was so weird interesting no Einstein does the same thing if we come across a wooden carving or really statue of of an animal that's fascinating I don't know why yeah but that's he recognizes the shape instinctually and like that is not right do not recognize that and then he gets very protective of me I guess yeah oh that's pretty cute yeah that's one thing dogs are good for and cats are not is the sort of like being protective of you and there's danger like yeah yeah when there's danger and the only danger Pete ever gets to see is like the fire alarm going off in my building he just hides he would not rescue me from burning building wake up baby wake up just meh mom mom all right I'm out heat out um but he's hanging out with you a lot today so that's great I've been away for four days and then I had to go out to buy a wig this morning and also it's been running around all over the place so he's just like you're here you're sitting here I'm going to demand love and he knows that I can't not be heading him because he's so soft he's like a cloud yeah he's pretty great oh excuse me um I feel like we should get more JPL stories out of you because we've gotten a lot of like pet and beer talk but like you do a lot of cool stuff in space and you're probably more in tune with like what's going on in new space things than either of us are because I have no idea uh yeah it's cool for me like yes how much in your in your work are you sort of like aware of what are the next generation of like deep space mission planetary mission Europa are we still going to there like yeah do you get to like play with all the cool stuff going on are you sort of like stuck in your basement in your costumes giving kids lessons on how ice melts I feel like I should just clarify some things I'm actually on the first floor now I just go down to the basement when I need to to be in front of the green screen moving up I'm just you know I'm moving up making progress took me five years to get up to the first floor I figure by the time I retire I'll be on the top floor run into place or something like that so um in terms of being aware of what's going on it it is um in a sense it's sort of my job to know what's going on because I interact with the public and do a lot of public talks in Q&A and things like that and being aware of what's going on at JPL is important to what I do but it's also impossible because there is so much that's going on and so what I what I generally do or what I what I sort of describe part of my job is is knocking on doors and saying hey what are you doing in here and can I try and it has led to some really cool opportunities for me so I'll give you an example there is there's a building that I've been into countless times and it's where they they build robotic arms that could potentially go on a future rover or something like that and they try out different designs and stuff like that but if you go in a different door there is a totally different section and they're building these balloons that are designed to go to other planets and float in the atmosphere rather than land on the surface they just float around in whatever air currents there are on the on that whatever particular planet they're they're intending to go to and I had no idea that this was going on I just happened to find out about it and that is something that's going on all over JPL there are all these different buildings they're pretty non-descript one says science in the front of it I love that building I don't know what's in there but it literally just says science and like that beautiful 60s script over the door it's awesome that's what's in there science is what's in there I know they have an electron microscope in there and they do a lot of tests or experiments about what happens at extreme temperatures and extreme pressures with various gases and liquids and things like that so there there is definitely science going on in there but maybe one of the more fun things that I I got to do was right now I'm creating a lesson where students are using visual programming language to essentially create a a Mars exploration game where they're they're coding to make a rover that drives around the surface of Mars collect science targets and there's a there's a more to it than that I won't I won't bore you with all the educational details but I thought well you know a really good way to understand like what goes into a day on Mars and what kind of things these students should be knowing about is to go sit and observe the Curiosity rover operations team so there there's a a day long meeting very every day pretty much where they decide and make a plan about what the rover curiosity is going to do on Mars the following the following day so it's it's a process that involves a lot of different people both on the engineering side and the science side of things but it was one of those things where this this really fits my job description and getting a better understanding of that is really helpful so so there's there's a bit of that and sort of unrelated my brother who comes to visit from time to time every time he comes to visit he wants a tour of JPL and he's been here I don't know how many times and so I sort of take it upon myself to find new things to show him and so the last time he came to visit I'm like who do I know that's doing something cool that I haven't seen and he hasn't seen and maybe they can show us and so we got to go see some of the prototypes for the Mars 2020 rover in terms of the robotic arm that's going to be collecting samples so unlike the drill I mean it he's getting a little squirmy here here you go bud unlike the drill on Curiosity which powders rock samples this drill is actually going to collect core samples that can be taken out put into canisters and then collected by future missions and so it's a totally different process and a different type of drill and and all of this and there's you know there's a team of people working on that so we went to go check it out and just one of those things like oh and in this building where if you're outside it just you know has a number on it there's this groundbreaking engineering going on in there that ultimately bring back the first rocks from Mars so there's it's it's a fascinating place to work and everybody is passionate about what they're doing so they want to talk about what they're doing and so if you ask somebody hey what are you doing in here you'll find out and not only that but there are also lunchtime talks where if you want to go sit in on a talk and hear somebody talk about the performance of dry lubricants at low temperatures on Mars you can do that or if you always wanted to know about the performance of dry lubricants on Mars yeah well when it gets really cold they're they're not as good but they still work so now you know it's actually awesome in your educational efforts in your educational efforts do you show the moon any love oh yeah okay okay good good so uh there was actually um for a time almost all of what i did were were lessons to students so that's kind of where the green screen video would come in where i'd be in the studio and i'd be talking to students all over the country if you were a student if you were a teacher in uh Minnesota and you wanted your students to learn about states of matter or the sun or the moon or Mars i would connect in through video conferencing and one of the most popular ones that i had was a lesson about the moon so i definitely um talked about the moon a lot and it was a fun one because it was sort of a choose your own adventure there were i think 12 different topics about the moon and essentially i would let the kids pick which ones i wanted to hear about and they were they were long enough that you would never ever get through all 12 and however much time you were talking about usually like two or three would be how many different moon topics you could get through and so not only that but you're going to get different questions every time and generally the younger the kids are the more interesting their questions are just because they're they haven't had as much exposure to things maybe and so they're thinking about the moon differently and i loved it when the little kids would stunt me because it made me think a little bit about what they were asking but also it gave me the opportunity to say i don't know and it was good for them to hear that somebody at NASA doesn't know something because that is sort of a fallacy that's out there is that you know NASA is nothing but geniuses who know everything and the truth is there are a lot of questions that we don't have the answers to and that's why we do what we do to find those answers and then once we get those answers or not if we don't get the answers we have more questions and that's really the process of science and engineering helps us go through that process so it's it's good for that and then you can always say i don't know the answer when you grow up you can come work here and help us find the answer i love it so it's a it's a great way to to get kids motivated about like oh yeah i can do that too yeah and sometimes i might like i realize that the answer exists out there and i don't have it in my brain i can say well uh you can look that up and that gives them the the ability to go find information on their own and not necessarily have to count on somebody else giving them whatever information yeah that they're looking for that's great so also in your professional opinion as a jpl okay no i should definitely say not as a jpl employee but it's like someone who works and knows space and who works with kids what are your thoughts on like the unending emphasis on mars so um i think that mars is definitely a fascinating sorry einstein found his toy he knows i don't know if you can hear that or not but he knows how to catch with himself he takes his toy and throws it in the air and goes and gets it i love that he always does it in opportune times but um he's animals are so good at that i know how do you know what you're you're on an animal podcast so it's all good totally appropriate good work dude yeah he knows what he's doing this is the all things go all things go yeah there's the grammar all things go podcast that's what they say for a rocket launch right all things go all things go now make rocket go now um i mean as far as as far as mars goes it's um i think it's it's great in terms of um this this object out there that's visible to the naked eye you can go out and you can look at it and see this orange dot you can look through a pretty basic telescope and see it um and it gives the idea like okay we've got something to to to work towards um and i don't know i think it's it's pretty hyped up right now in terms of like SpaceX trying to get there and NASA's plans to get there in the 2030s and uh whatever that one company that's gonna send people on a one-way mars one yeah which i mean at this point they've missed so many milestones that i don't i don't even know if anybody's talking about they're supposed to launch this year originally i don't know if they were supposed to launch this year but they had a whole bunch of test things that they were supposed to do yeah i think so they've they've they've readjusted their their calendar but no they're they're still going strong i mean they're they're gonna do something they'll do something what that is and whether or not it's worthwhile we'll see but yeah um so in in terms of mars i think it's one piece of larger human exploration i think it's a really cool um and worthwhile effort to develop whatever technologies we're going to need to send humans there but at the same time i don't think that should be done at the expense of robotic missions to the outer solar system or science missions here that are just looking at our planet i don't know going to venus looking outside of our solar system into the universe and even looking within our solar system for things like near-earth asteroids that we don't want to hit earth someday we don't want them to be too near um there's sort of that limit of nearness becomes touching which um i i don't want to have happen whether i'm alive or not i just um so so mars in a sense of like this is the human destination i think that's really cool definitely in one it's one piece of the human exploration puzzle though maybe not puzzle uh human exploration plan i mean how exciting is that and again that's that's kind of like again taking taking a nest that jpl had often just sort of speaking personally um yeah so you were going to say something i was just saying you want to go ahead yeah sure i mean it's incredibly exciting to hear um you know more than just one from one source but uh the fact that there's still interest in venus is so exciting and and you know the talk this week when we're recording this of you know possible plans between a joint mission with russia and the us um showing venus some love i mean i'm so excited that there are active uh collaborations and thoughts and and just exploring other things besides mars i mean we have other close bodies it's fantastic and venus is so so exciting in itself so yeah yeah yeah i mean mars is mars is great because humans could potentially go there whereas venus is like definitely not a human destination but still really cool i mean the atmosphere acts like both a liquid and a gas it's so dense and just this past week there have been um there's been some uh announcements about this gigantic gravity wave in the atmosphere that is the largest potentially the largest in the solar system and so there's a whole lot of cool stuff going on at venus and um i i i wish that it wasn't the case that we as a society not just nasa had to choose like oh we're only going to go to this one this year and we're only going to go to this one next year um and by next year and this year i mean like planning these missions that will eventually launch years in the future so um yeah i wish that weren't the case because yeah i mean every every place you look at in the solar system is fascinating and if you look at urnus and neptune we've only been there with one spacecraft ever and like the mid and late 80s like yeah it's so time to go back there yeah i mean there's there's so much information that we can that we can find out just by going again and i say jest it's it's a it's a big undertaking to just to go out to those places so um i mean again i think a lot of our our at least my personal hope is that you know we get more billionaires who love space who you know want to use their money towards space exploration um you know musk has personal goals in mind and wants to die on mars so you know i mean mars is there for him that's his focus and that's great but you know there are and other people with business incentives too robert bigelow and and that stuff going on but there are others who just have a general fascination and interest in exploration um so there's a lot of that underway as well i just hope there are more billionaires who want to use their money in that regard um just for the sake of exploration yeah and i like that you say that in the sake of exploration because there are definitely organizations that are out there that are interested in exploring for commercial purposes and and that's kind of a uh an idea that's out there and there are organizations that are i can't think of any off the top of my head but you know they're they're fundraising and they're they're working to go to asteroids to mine resources um so in some sense is having that um ability to get resources from from asteroids is really important to human exploration but at the same time if it's just for the sake of of profit i'm i'm not as excited about that and i will that's a good reminder amy i wanted to point out on a previous episode i mentioned that a friend of ours who will have on the show in the future um who is involved in asteroid mining companies i think i said he was with planetary resources he is with deep space industries i think is the company he's on the board of okay so what does deep space which one is deep space industries they're another they're another resource they're another asteroid they're all asteroid mining yeah so deep space industry is also an asteroid company and they've released some cool images of spacecraft they plan to build they're going to go and land and like ones that look like these giant things that go and like swallow an asteroid and then like do the mining and then like spit it out yep that seems like a massive spacecraft to launch but maybe it's a tiny asteroid yeah probably target the small ones but pretty epic starts down and scale up right yeah that's right yeah that's not how engineering works just scale it up yeah easy amy i know you've seen this and jason i don't know if you have but have you seen moon um the the the film moon no i have not oh i love it it's so good yeah it's really good yeah no spoilers but no spoilers i do mining bring it up obviously the moon you're discussing mining yeah yeah and uh it's i think that movie is one of the best like sci-fi space movies i've seen ever because it's like it's out of the realm of reality and that it's technology that we don't currently have but it's like it's not insane it's just like real enough to really fuck with your head and that doesn't have space magic that's really good sci-fi i would recommend it to anybody in the snake yeah yeah i will second that and paul 18 spoiler alert there are no there are no rock spiders that are rocks on the moon that turn to spiders and infect your blood and make you see crazy things and then make lights turn on in your lunar module magically um have you seen apollo 18 jason yes i have oh my god apollo 18 those of you watching on youtube let us know your thoughts on apollo 18 in the comments because of course i've seen it amy that was like a big thing with the the ufo crowd obviously because they think it's real so yeah i might have put in my youtube comments right now uh there were not that many go pros inside the lunar module yeah i love i love the idea that there's like all of a sudden this like secret mission to the moon they magically had like 15 more cameras right and somehow got all the footage back yep without recovering the film canisters and then it just gets i love it space magic it's great of course that would be a big movie with the ufo worlds oh yes yeah yep oh that movie is all kinds of awesome bad glad you love it so much it's apollo how can i not love it and um jerry griffin who is the lead flight director on apollo's 12 15 and 17 and was a technical advisor on apollo 13 was the technical advisor on apollo 18 which is why it looks really good and is like pretty accurate until he told me he like stepped out and was like no it's it got insane i'm done i'm out so yeah i thought that was really good like even in apollo flight director can't stomach how ridiculous this movie got but the costumes look like i actually got to try on one of the spacesuits from that movie nice yeah it's like a full replica suit it costs like 16 000 a week to rent from this company in west hollywood because it has a cooling system so it needs a human to monitor you at all times weighs like 85 pounds it was nuts and were you just swimming in it like did your arm oh yeah it's like made for a six foot tall man and i'm a four foot eleven woman that's awesome standing up really tall with a little bit of lift in my shoes like it was nutty but yeah it was fun um i know this is like usually the way we end the show but i feel like well maybe we should do a beer check first i'm out how weird you guys have my glass you guys had bigs but i'm out i know but i only have this much left of my big beer and amy i appreciate your um patriotic glass i've got a patriotic glass as well uh time to get star spangled hammered fantastic yeah i'm rocking the apollo 11 for all mankind 70s vintage glass today um but yeah this is usually how we end the show but i feel like this is a good segue now i don't know but there's also like i'm almost on the beer yeah no we can we can we can work toward the end so ask it yeah we'll stretch it out are the question that we ask everybody this is all it's all on the table right now well um the question we ask all of our guests and this is just coming very naturally off the idea of sort of going to mars but also wanting to go to other places if you could go anywhere in the solar system without worrying about things like how to survive the journey no radiation food aging whatever all that's a way just if you could go anywhere in the solar system where would you go and why that's a good question um i would probably you said you did you say universe or solar system solar system okay i would go to enceladus and the reason i want to go to enceladus is because um i want to go to saturn i want to see the rings i want to see the rings cast a shadow on the planet i i want to be close to that but also enceladus is really fascinating because it's warmer on the south pole than it than it otherwise would be there are geysers shooting out we think that there might be geothermal vents under there and if that's the case when you look at geothermal vents on earth they're teaming with life it's not to say that that's what's going on there but like the idea of being able to go there they're in person and and check it out is fascinating and i just i love saturn i think it's really cool um i was uh where was i this was a couple years ago i went to uh camp del corazon it's a camp for kids with um i don't know how to how to describe it it's a it's a camp for kids with like heart conditions and it's it's a great place and i went to go talk about space and the stars and uh pointed the milky way and stuff like that and you when you go to camp which i never did as a kid you have to pick a camp name and so i picked the name of a moon around saturn minus and so that was my my nickname around the camp but i just think saturn is fascinating there was just an awesome image of one of the moons of saturn going through the rings kind of disrupting some of the rings this was just released yesterday i think i don't know if in the podcast you can make it like pop up on the screen or something like that in the video uh we have space magic on the show yeah okay jason's good at space magic all right cool cool um yeah just you know fix it in post i guess that's what they say so um we're in hollywood here for sure yeah yeah definitely so i think that's where i would want to go i mean i say in celadus but if i'm there i mean i'll probably explore some other places around this attorney and system like titan and stuff like that too so well i mean like once i'm there i have a ship and i can fly around right i'm good well that's that's bending the rules of this hypothetical but uh fantastic answer i i applaud that that in celadus is my number two titans my number one only because um i think visually it would be more fun to to check out but uh you know both are are incredibly exciting potentially astrobiologically speaking um titan you know for an entirely different type of life a methane based life but the geysers on in celadus and just so much going on there i am so fascinated by that moon and i can't wait till we do more exploration there yeah titan is titan is fascinating i mean they have they have an entire and it's not a water cycle it's basically the methane cycle where you you've got lakes and you've got precipitate uh so cool yeah it's yeah it's so nuts that's yeah jason and i are both on like team titan for this question but it's just it's just the fact that it has so many earth-like characteristics but it's so different but also has the right chemistry it's bizarro earth yeah like it is it's bizarro earth only you know sadly without bizarroed kramer george and jerry i know so that we know of that we know maybe uh what's his name kyle his name kyle kyle feldman and no i forget all their names is feldman bizarro george yeah feldman yeah there is felt feldman is bizarro newman yeah um kevin is bizarro jerry can't remember the other two but yeah maybe they do just like live in a little mere image of jerry's apartment up on titan and no they're probably there don't go in their fridge without asking never eat the olives without asking that building at jpl that says science on it um i mean one of the things that they're they're doing are um like miniature experiments related to the titan atmosphere and titan lakes and what happens under these extreme temperatures with different gases and liquids and it's it's super cool that's so cool literally and also figuratively sorry for that terrible um jason have you been to jpl i have not i applied for a job there and didn't get it but no did you i know that um sorry that that wasn't me sorry okay okay well i like you a lot more now so um well we'll have to change that in the future and that's very easy to change so i would like that very much that there's there's so much just like just weird stuff going on on that lab it's like the one thing i love too about jpl and this is a thing with a lot of nasa sites is that they're all nature preserves or like near natural areas so it's like you see somebody test driving a mars rover and then oh look a deer like why do these two things go side by side and it works i know i have to be careful when i'm walking to my car at the end of the day as i'm walking out of my building if i'm looking down at my phone i really have to look up and make sure i'm not going to walk directly into a deer and um i've had a deer come up to me and try to get my burrito once at lunch like no be no no no no this is my burrito i am not giving you any of it here's the burritos too yeah and i was at kennedy and at kennedy space center we had to stop our vehicle the driver got out picked up a tortoise moved it across the road we got back in we continued driving and there were signs everywhere like look under your car at the end of the day to make sure there are no alligators that are gonna bite your ankles so alligators oh yeah oh yeah i don't remember but yeah it's i mean i'm the giant swamp and i saw dolphins at kennedy once so yeah it's yeah it's cool and then it just makes you think especially at kennedy the environmental impact of launching rockets it's amazing that there can be wildlife on that island at all with the amount of well not currently i guess not as much but like with massive rockets taking off all the time it's just like how do you live in this environment and like not leave yeah animals yeah i don't i don't know about other places but i know kennedy has it's it's not a it's not a park ranger but they have a person who's whose sole job is to make sure that the animals are safe and protected and everybody's following the the rules to and guidelines to make sure that those animals are are safe yeah on the on the area nice so here in california in addition to jpl and armstrong and ames research center in the bay area there's also part of the deep space network which is a series of antennas around the world that we use to communicate with spacecraft they're out beyond the orbit of the moon and when you go out to uh it's called goldstone when you go out to goldstone um there are burrows out there like wild donkeys that are just wandering around the grounds and um you just kind of got to watch out for them as you're driving down the road or when you get out of your car they're not you know oh my god my voice is just dying um that's awesome and i went to speaking of the dsn um i went to the deep straits network outside of canberra in the city called tidbin villa which took me ages to say without stumbling over it this is of course in australia and um i had half a day off or you know i had a thing at night one day in canberra and i had wanted to rent a car and drive out there and i was so glad that i didn't have to drive because kangaroos are roadkill out there because it's on a nature preserve and there's wild kangaroos everywhere and the road slopes down such that there's water that collects in the side of the road and at sunrise and sundown the kangaroos come and eat the grass on the side of the road and there were dead kangaroos everywhere and there were kangaroos hopping across the road and like you're only going 35 kilometers an hour like any faster and you wouldn't be able to dodge all the kangaroos it was insane and then i looked up at you know the 70 meter dish talking to voyage or two and then oh look a sheep it's so weird it's like it's like the height of technology in space and then like nature it's just odd you never put those two things together but i love that for nasa but like it's a weird pairing of like yeah nasa and nature yeah it's a great juxtaposition i love it that's the word juxtaposition look at me two points for vocabulary see you're you're wording good because i'm at the end of my giant beer so um excuse me yeah i'm i'm out of beer and you're almost out of voice so we should probably wrap it up i'm out of voice oh my god i can't believe this is going and i have like a full day shoot tomorrow i gotta go drink some lemon water or something rest your voice sigh um yeah i don't i can't think of anything else i want to pepper pepper loud with questions event we can do it again another time we can always do it again yeah i have a beer so you have i know you've got more beer and i know you've got more i'm sure you have more weird space stories and yeah well okay so here's here's here's how about how about i share this is sort of a closing thing because i was i was on another podcast about space and beer and at the end he was like so was there anything else you wanted to say and i said uh no and that was the end of classic so uh you you had asked about sort of stories about jpl or or or something like that and so one of my favorites was i um i had set up a meeting with somebody who was working on curiosity and this was uh late 2012 i don't even remember what the meeting was about but the day of the meeting he sends me an email and he says i'm so sorry i have to cancel i thought you scheduled this meeting on mars time not earth time because at that point they were going on a 24 hour 40 minute mars clock right versus the 24 hour earth clock and and i and i had only been at jpl for maybe a year and a half and i thought this is my life now this is what happens here that's kind of amazing wow did you have to live on mars time after curiosity landed or no you weren't you weren't not so you didn't have to do that okay that was that was the operations team so yeah i mean i got to see them and hear about them and you know when i was leaving work at the end of the day and they were coming into work i got to to see that there was actually one family who uh because it was in august and the kids weren't in school they moved to time zone every day as a family and um they did that for several weeks and then that was that was it but that's that's rough yeah i'm good for them yeah i mean there have been there have been instances where i've connected to teacher groups in thailand or something like that and i've been at work in two in the two in the morning for that but um nothing like as steady as that hour shift they would do every but that's like the normal one-off weird time zone meeting this is like yeah for they do it for what 90 days so for 90 days you shift you add 40 minutes onto the day every day and then gradually that's like you know you'll line up for a day and then you're just slightly off and off and off and off and off until you're just completely opposite and then you cycle back around because mars's day is what 40 minutes longer than ours it's like 39 minutes 39 minutes 30 some seconds so they just round up to 40 to make the math easy but yeah i mean it starts out great because it's like oh eight eight o'clock and then the next day eight forty you get 40 extra minutes to sleep or however however you want to use that time but then yeah then it drifts later into the day and then yeah and then it's weird yeah and then you have canceled meetings yeah i've just read about people living on mars time just for that 30 days to like get the mission sorted and just sounds all kinds of nutty and that like that's when your best brain power has to happen for like getting settled into a new mission it's just like whoo good on you guys get on you know it's that's why you have the good brains yeah and jpl does a nice job of taking care of those people so that you know they're there yeah nice nice good on jpl high five i sell high five there for everybody watching the uh not watching the video um all right so i guess we should uh tell people where oh my god as my voice really goes i guess we should tell people lial where can people find more of you on the internet not that you necessarily tweet about space all the time but you know if they do you want to know more of me on the internet specifically unrelated to my work uh i'm on twitter and instagram both of those are at liltav that's l y l e t a v and that's because my last name is tavernier and it's hard to spell so i just give a short version that's yeah solid solid solid choice there um awesome cool and jason where can we find more of you i'm always on twitter at acentric that's a c e c e n t r i c you can also find stuff i do at rogueplanet.tv and uh i guess acentric.com awesome all right and of course i am amy and you can find me on twitter and on instagram at ast vintage space that's vintage like 1950s and space like the sky i'm not going to spell it right now um and of course if you want to never miss an episode of the punk rocker podcast uh i said it right that time um if you're watching the youtube video version of this you are on my personal youtube channel which is just under my name amy sure title if you'd like to watch the video version you find it on youtube if you would like to listen to the audio version we will have links for the audio download in the description below um i probably should say that upfront next time instead of after you've sat through an hour and a half of podcast on youtube but that's okay we're okay with that um so yes of course as always guys if you have questions for our guest questions for us ideas you want to weigh in on the things we've talked about anything at all sound off in the comments below especially if you have people that you would like us to reach out to to talk to and also beers that you would like us to drink because we are alcohol enthusiasts and we will take your recommendation yes please um absolutely uh lyle thank you so much for taking time on your friday off to sit down and talk about your work when you don't have to be working um but i don't feel so bad because you also got to have a beer at two thirty in the afternoon so it's all right um well thank you so much for the opportunity because uh not every day that i get to uh have a beer at two in the afternoon and talk about space and beer so thank you i'm so happy to help all right thank you everyone for listening and we will see you next episode cheers