 Good evening. We're on the air again with another edition of Patience on the News. And I think this one is a particularly interesting one. Our guest is Sean Moody. Many of you know Sean because he was the Republican nominee for governor not long ago. And so, in many, you probably supported Sean. You've known about him a long time. You know about Moody's collision centers. He's a guy who built a business, a big business, and then essentially has turned it over over time to his employees. It's an employee's own business. So you know all of this about Sean, but he's on to other things now. He's still running his business, but he's a citizen. And he knows about some of our problems in our state. And he has some ideas of how to fix them. The difference between Sean and many other people is he's actually trying to do something to fix the problems, not just talk about it. He's going to talk about it here. He's going to talk about what he's trying to do to solve these problems. And it's, you know, we have a huge number of immigrants in Maine now and we have a huge shortage of people in trades and in other jobs. You see a lot of help wanted and you see a lot of immigrants. They're not working in these places where they need help. So he's going to talk about that. I'm going to preface it with a very short story about why I'm in America. I had two grandfathers, all four of my grandparents and my and my father emigrated to this country. But my two grandfathers first came in the late 1890s and they were from small Greek villages, different villages in southern Greece, poor, very poor. And at that time, there was a great labor shortage in the United States because the Industrial Revolution was reaching its peak. And so agents, employment agents, fanned out in southern Mediterranean countries in southern Europe, particularly Italy and Greece. And they went to these villages with all these teenage kids were looking for something to do. And they recruited them for the textile mills in Haverhill and Lawrence and Lowell for the railroads, the transcontinental railroads were being built between the Midwest and California. And in the Rocky Mountains, mines, metal mines, and in Pennsylvania and West Virginia, coal mines. And in the Midwest, stockyards, hard work, tough work, and they recruited these kids to work at very low wages to fill these labor gaps in these burgeoning industries. And so the kids came, no English. They looked different, shorter, swarthy, spoke a different language and they stuck together. They only had each other. They had to. They had to. They only had each other. And they worked in these places. They worked very hard and they stayed and they continued to work hard. And they helped make America what it is today. They were not welcome and they were feared. And in 1924, the Congress passed a law to keep out these undesirables, mostly Southern Europeans, Italians, Greeks, and Eastern Europeans, Jews. And they created a quota system because they said, we got too many of them and we don't want any more. And that was the story of immigration. My people came, thankfully, before 1924. And that's how they got in. Now we have something similar. We're being overwhelmed by immigrants now and it's a problem and we need to have legislation in the Congress to fix and order the immigration problem. But we can't get it. We can't get it. Look into the reasons yourselves. I urge each of you to go online, to do a little research and to find out why the Congress can't enact a immigration law that brings order out of chaos. So that's a little bit of background here. Important background, I think. And now we have all of these people coming. I would add one other thing. When my people came from these small villages in Greece, the immigration laws were simple. You had to have a doctor's certificate that you were physically sound. You weren't having, you didn't come here with tuberculosis, something like that. And mentally sound. They didn't want people who weren't mentally sound. So those were the two things. The doctor's certificate was what you needed. You didn't have to have a visa. No age requirement. They're bringing them people over at 16. No age requirements. Nothing. They came. As long as they had a doctor's certificate, they got off the boat and were admitted into the country. But they changed America and they did the dirty jobs and the tough jobs that no one else wanted to do. And they stayed and the kids got educated and they became senators and governors and CEOs and college presidents and lawyers. So we begin with that. Sean, welcome. Thank you, Harold. That's quite a story. I appreciate that story. Well, it's an important story. I didn't know that. This is not the first time we've been overwhelmed with immigrants. This is a country of immigrants. That's right. And they come because life is tough where they live and they want to better their lives. And the ones who don't want to better their lives don't come. Well, I think what's happened, Harold, is because of our system and because of the dysfunction of our system, not allowing them to work, it's word of mouth, right? So maybe some people are coming because they ought to be taken care of while they're working. So you told me a good time. Word of mouth is we don't work both ways. We're not connecting people who are desperately looking for work, mostly a lot of them immigrants, with employers who are desperately, you told me, desperately looking for employees. And it's across the spectrum. It's not just trades jobs. It's hospitals and nursing homes, you know, across the white collar, blue collar. Everybody's looking for... So how did you get in this? Okay, I said you're a good citizen. You're looking for a problem and you try to find a way to solve it. So tell us a little bit about how you got interested in this. Well, I think it's, you know, we've invested a lot of money, the Alfon, right, the Foundation, a lot of money nationally, federally is going into workforce development, which is a key component. Okay, whenever you improve someone's skills through training, their productivity goes up incrementally, right? So if someone's, you know, used to doing a certain amount of work and then through training and through experience and those grants, that funding, that is going to increase productivity and increase IGDP incrementally. But there's no substitute for having an individual, an additional person into the labor market. So, okay, this individual, it wasn't contributing at all. So it's not an incremental increase. It's a full increase. So we need more individuals in the labor participation. So the way I looked at Harold's really simple, it's like these individuals came here, as you described, to try to better themselves, their families, and to seek that American dream or that opportunity. And our bureaucracy basically shut that down on them and be known as to them. So many of them are here six, 12, 18 months without being able to get a work permit. Now think about that. I was with Michael Bork, actually, Mehmet gave us a workforce development award just recently. Michael Bork is the CEO of Mehmet. Yes. And he and Tony Payne, wonderful people. And like Michael described, he said, if you take somebody that's in a lost time injury, take the most productive person and say, okay, now all of a sudden they can't work for an extended period. These are American workers, okay, productive people with pride. If they're out of work for more than, you know, five, six, seven months, now it became like psychologically, it changes them. It's like, geez, I don't know if my knee is going to be all right on that concrete floor, you know, my back, I don't know if I can get back to work. So there's a process to get them reacclimated, light duty and so on. So if you take an immigrant that comes to this country and sits on the sideline for six months to a year, imagine what it does to their psyche. So that was, that's my point, Harold, is like, when you ride by, say, you go down Congress Street, you get three or four, you know, asylum seekers or whatever, hanging on the corner, and you get some guys been hanging drywall all day, right, 5-H fire code, his help didn't show up, and he's looking all, look at the societal stigma that that puts, look at these guys don't want to work. So, you know, the societal impacts in our communities say, the way is they don't want to know, they can't work, they won't let them work. Federal law prohibitions are important. Exactly. That's right, and they can't speak up for themselves. So SOAR is, the acronym for SOAR is Skills and Occupational Assessment Rating. It's interesting, my wife Chrissy kind of came up, we were trying to think of a name or something that would catch, and she said, how about SOAR? It's unfortunate, I was thinking about a SOAR, you know, and I didn't catch SOAR like SOAR, so I give Chrissy a credit for the name SOAR. And the genesis behind it, Harold, is very simple. These individuals were working in the home country, they're doing something productive, they just didn't just, you know, wake up at 35 and decide to come to America. So, they have skills, they have an occupation, and this program will basically assess their skill through interpreters, you know, so we have that language, and in participation of our CTE schools and our community college system, very supportive of this program. What CTE? Career Tech Ed. Okay. The vocational schools. These are the high school? High school level, yes, as well as the community college system. Dan Beallier, David Daigle are very supportive, they've come up with funding for a position, so think about it, Harold. We bring that individual in, we interview them, create a resume for them, build their resume, and then we go over and do a hands-on skills assessment, hands-on, with an instructor. So, in a few hours they can pretty well not say that this person was a carpenter, run a skillsaw, you know, do some exercises to show us what you can do. This person is experienced, so now we populate the website with participating employers, that person is going to be hired immediately and at a fair wage. So, you essentially certify them as we're going to rate them, is there a little difference? Because a certification would have some sort of liability probably with it. Okay. We're rating these individuals to give the employer a general idea of their skill level. So, when they come on the job site, they're going to be commanding a fair wage. The government, again, in their dysfunctionality is now, I will say, I give Senator Collins credit and also our congressional delegation, okay, Representative Pingree and Golden Senator King, they're all on board with us. We're going to move on. So, they're introduced legislation to shorten that work permit requirement down to 30 days. Well, what is the work permit requirement now? It's six months, but I think you talked, and I've talked to that Simon Seeker population at length, it's not six months, it's 12, 18 months, almost indefinite in some cases. So, this is a real problem. And when you think about what's spending $20 or $30 million a year, Harold, okay, state money to support these individuals because we won't allow them go to work. It's so glad that you're broadcasting this message to our folks. They need to know. Well, it's true. They won't let them go to work. And so, in the effort by the Trump administration, they're not getting political here, just the same facts to show that they're tough on immigration. In 2019, they proposed rules that said, one, a 365-day waiting period before you could apply for a work permit. So you had to be here for a year on general assistance. Makes no sense. No sense. But they proposed going from six months to 365 days. If you went through a particular border station to get here, like El Paso or Laredo, then you couldn't ever get asylum status and a work permit. And new provisions that permitted automatic terminations of asylum seekers' employment so that if they had, and they had one year, so that they were employed for a year, they had to reapply. And if, and then they would get terminated under certain circumstances, so you'd lose your job. You'd have to go, if you were one of these immigrants, you'd have to go to your employer and say, I got to leave this job. Well, I think, Harold, what you've touched on is, I'm not going to say I could understand how we got where we are, because this was really way before Trump. But I think what happened was when we had such a high unemployment rate, which seemingly wasn't that long ago, really, and it seems like it, then I think the argument was, well, we don't want these individuals coming and taking American jobs. So I do understand that, but it demonstrates government's inability to meet the times that we're in now, and not live in the old days. And like you said, Harold, your grandfather came here. We have probably a friend, Dominic Reali, right? Dominic is a great friend. And he tells the story, probably similar to that grandfather, he came here to Munjoy Hill, started laying brick within a few days after he landed. That's a tough job. Worked his way up. And models, you know, get the first sandwich shot, and that's the rest of his history. So immigration, legal immigration will be clear on that, right? We're talking about legal, people here legally, they've been, there's been screened, health screened as you described, and security screened, and they're good to go. And to not allow them to participate, to feed the family, or tell me, that's almost like a human rights violation. Sean, I understand what you say. It's all, it's been said for generations, you know, they're taking our jobs. And these are jobs that Americans would like to have. Well, in most cases, in many cases, they're not jobs Americans would like to have. They don't want, you can't get somebody who's been, family's been here for five generations to do the job. And you think of this, we have seasonal businesses in this state. Some are restaurants and tourist places. Can't get Americans to do most of that work. We have, but we have a program for that, H1 visas. So the people, young people can come from Eastern Europe to Bar Harbor, work for the season, and then go home. But they are foreigners, and they are here temporary, but we need them because Americans won't do that job. Go up to the blueberry fields in Washington County. They come from South America, they come from other places, to Maine farms, to harvest. Great blueberries. Blueberries, and that's because if they could get them from Washington County, who have been there generations, they would, but they have to bring them from somewhere else. If you go down to Florida, in the rural areas and cultural areas, you will find that there are these places where people from South America, many of them, illegal immigrants, many of them, they gather on a street corner, a particular street corner, in the morning. This is in many towns. And the agents come from the farmers and they say, we'll take 10 of you. They get in the minibus, and off they go to work for the day. Those are not Americans who want to do that. These are mostly people from Latin America, poor, wanting to do anything to make a living. So they're Mexicans, most of them. So we'll go beyond this. Look at your profession. Take lawyers and accountants and a lot of the white collar professionals, doctors, same thing. We give a million students in our university systems across this country right now, a million students that are here internationally. And they'll only keep a small amount of those students. So why does that make sense? Give them the opportunity to come over here, they invest all that money in a public education and private college. They get educated and we send them home. Meanwhile, we don't have enough lawyers, I don't know. But we certainly don't have enough psychiatrists, psychologists, doctors. Why does that happen? There's a crisis in China, a looming economic crisis, because they don't have enough young people, because the birth rate was so low. So they're really worried about what will happen to the Chinese economy because of this crisis shortage of workers. Here in this state, we had until very recently a declining population and what was going to happen to the main economy? It was a pretty tough situation. Suddenly, we have an influx of people from Africa, from Latin America who want to work, who can't work, but they solve the problem of low population growth in Maine. That's right. And the other thing, as I said earlier, Harold, it's the social aspect. If you hired an asylum seeker or whomever, an immigrant, to come work in your place of business, and they proved themselves, like any new coworker would, three to six months, you're going to become their biggest advocate. So the advocacy is out there, but they have to earn it like anybody has to earn it, and they can't earn it on the sideline. So it's another reason, well, I don't know where the ACLU is on this. I mean, where are these folks? Why aren't they up at City Hall right now? Hey, you legalize marijuana. That's federally illegal, but you don't let these people work. You asked the question, where are these people? Well, we have a lot of organizations that only want to tell you about victims. These people are victims, and that's all they want to talk about. Well, how about getting them a job? You know, Joe Brennan, who I thought was just a great governor, I really did. And I've been around politicians a long time. Joe Brennan used to go around this state when he was governor, saying, the best social program is a job. Right. The best social program. He was from Portland, right? So he knew for a while immigration what it did for this city. Yeah, because his father was an immigrant. Right, when Joe Hill? His father was a longshoreman. He came from Ireland. So, tough. You're on to something really important, but I want you to tell us how you're going to succeed. Well, your first step is you've got to change these rules. Now, I will tell you one thing. Yeah, well, that's in process. Now, again, raising public opinion. It's in process because there's a bill. That's right. Okay. That's correct. And the bill is sponsored by Senator Collins, Senator from Sentama or whatever her name is from Arizona. That's a non-partisan point. And Angus Kim. Democrats. You've got Republicans. It's so universal. That bill has to pass. That's the biggest problem. Well, I think the economy, I was quoted in a little claim to economic fame, the Wall Street Journal called in 2017. This is pre-pandemic and low unemployment back then. They're saying, you know, what are businesses doing about the low unemployment? How's that impacting you? And in the discussion, because I'm looking, I had 10 years, whatever it is, thinking that all the things you described means an agent state, people getting out of the trades, everyone's getting told they got to go to college. I see all these dynamics at work. So, I made the statement and they quoted me in the Wall Street Journal. And I said it, the next recession could be generated by the lack of people to do the work. Look at where we are six years later. And it was exasperated by the pandemic. A lot of individuals, our age, Harold, said, I'm not going to end up on a ventilator. I'm going to retire and be healthy. And I understand that. But they kind of exited. We won't let the immigrants work. Then you've got another population, our teenagers. They can't be in the kitchen. If they got a knife, they can't be in the shop. If you've got a tool, it's ridiculous. I mean, these teenagers want to, they want to work and they block them out. So, the other thing that you're well aware of is social security, punishing, right? Seniors at certain ages, they can only earn up to $20,000, whatever it is. Again, if people want to work, this is America. So, why would you restrict that? Or why would you prevent that? Politics. Just all politics. That's me, the former politician. It's all politics. You're right. These things, there are things to do. There's legislation that can be enacted that will help alleviate these problems. And it won't be enacted. And the individuals, I'm not a CPA, but think about it, that's a liability, providing transportation, providing food, shelter and everything for these individuals, right, to support them. Now all of a sudden, they're going to work. Now they're paying taxes, supporting themselves. It's like, you know, it's an economic reality. And you know, Harold, we had the discussion before we get on here, but one thing that you're really impressed and you were really passionate when you said, my grandfather was a worker and he came here and he worked his way to prosperity, because no one was telling him when, you know, how many hours he could put in and he was working for low wages. He worked himself into prosperity. And that, I would like to think, that work, after it continued through that patience, you admire a grandfather. You're not going to slack, thinking about what he went through. True. There's a lot to that. So we get it. The legislation has to pass. And I think it's terrific that the three re-evaluators, two of them are from Maine and Susan Collins, is the primary sponsor. So I wish them well. I'm not bullish on that because I see what happens. There are many people in the Congress who think that if they vote for anything that is good for immigrants, that they lose votes. In the southern Southwestern part of the country is obviously in a whole different situation. You know, we've got hundreds of immigrants coming to Maine. They've got hundreds of thousands coming over the border. So I can't even... It's politics, you know. It's people, politicians afraid of getting hurt by a position that favors or does anything for immigrants. So we'll see. So, but a lot depends on it for your program, doesn't it? I think, Harold, it's like a politician is the old saying, they're thinking about the next election, not the next 10 years or whatever. So I'm just thinking about we've got this legislation pending here now. That's a big deal. But I come back to the fact, okay, if we don't get our program in place, when they do finally issue these work permits, what are these individuals going to do? Like I said, they're going to be trying to find jobs at minimum wage or whatever. They don't really have an opportunity. So what better way? It's just not to oversimplify it. They were doing something in their home country. We interviewed 30 of these individuals just recently over at the Southern Maine Community College campus, and it was fascinating. We had two project engineers. We had a doctor. We had a marketing person. You mean immigrants, doctors and engineers? Customer service representatives. They covered the gambit. And I liken that to like, if you just took a population of people from Africa in a town there and just transported them here, they'd be doing the same thing. They're living over there. They have to have cars. They do the same things that we do. These people that you interviewed and that you had over at SMTC, they obviously already got asylum status because they can get a work permit? Some of them had and some of them didn't. And I'll be honest with you, Harold, it was kind of a testy. It turned into kind of a testy. And luckily, we had some really good advocates there, Bruce Benner and Amboly. There was another immigrant there that had the language, so they kind of diffused it. But what they were really upset about is, they've been sold this bag of goods several times and nobody's helping them. So they're really frustrated. They're like, what's this, where are we going with this? It's just another pitch. And so once we got through that and opened up up and built a little trust. So you interviewed, let's say that I have a work permit, that I qualify, have asylum status, and I need a job. And I got three kids and I'm in a rental apartment in Portland and I went to your thing. And let's say, that assessment? Let's say I'm an engineer. And I don't need to, I know it's hard for me to get a job as an engineer, but I'll do anything. I can be trained to be, I'm an electrical engineer. How about, can I be trained to be an electrician? Well, that's the thing, because their certifications, again, in their home country, if they were a doctor or an engineer, are not going to be accepted here in America. No, they're not. So now I'm willing to work for- If you get them in that field, you know, as whether they're an apprentice or they're, you know, just get them in that environment, like, get them a job at surveillance techniques, for example. Okay, so now you've interviewed them and you know, and you've figured out what they're able to do. Right. What's next? That's key. Then we populate a website and we have participating employers. Now, we vet these employers because they got to know we're going to have an, we're going to actually have a language rating as well. Some of them are going to speak more English than others. Some of them, they speak no English like your grandfather. Right. So employers need to be aware of what they're getting themselves into, but we want employers to understand that and have the capabilities of being able to introduce them into the workplace and support them. When will we see some actual connecting of these immigrants with jobs? Until they get the work permit. That's the key. They can't work. However, we're not sitting on our hands waiting. We're going to get this program in place and then have them interviewed, have the resumes built, and have the website all good to go in anticipation and continue to put pressure on our congressional delegation to get this passed. I would challenge the city of Portland to say, take a stand, be bold, and let's pass them legislate. Like I said, marijuana was illegal federally. Yeah, but what can the city council do? The city council was the first. What can they do about immigration status? They might be able to say to the feds, look, you want us to take care of them, pay for their housing. No, we're putting them to work. You don't like it, then give us the 20 or 30 million dollars that we're paying to take care of them. But it's up to the elected politicians. It's up to Congress. Congress has to pass a law. True. And so that's the problem. And we're back to why don't we hold these politicians accountable? Here, Utah's entire main delegation is for this. That's great. But unfortunately, it takes a majority of the House and Senate. Four votes in the swing. And that's what people ought to be looking at. What are the majority going to do in the House and Senate to solve this problem? Before, you know, Harold, before I drove in here tonight, my wife, Christy, and I were watching the news, and Representative Pingree was on the news tonight, I think it was Channel 13, describing this bill that was being read. That's the very thing we're talking about. It's on the hot seat. You don't have to worry about them. They're for it. Right, right. You don't have to worry about some of these Southern patrolmen. That's true. You have to worry about them. You're right. Won't pass without a supporter in the Senate. There's enough senators. But I don't think most people, and I think you have me on this program, Harold, is another way to get that word out there. I think most people watching this are going, oh my God, this is so simple and so straight. The people watching will agree with you. What are they doing, you know? But the calculations going on in the minds of conservatives in the Congress is different than what these people that are watching this think. I don't disagree here. Different calculation. You even know that world very well. But look, why do we have enough people skilled in various trades to supply the demand in Maine right now? Well, I think another initiative that you asked earlier there what we've been working on, my wife Christine and I, and we've got a group of very good Maine-based companies. We started about 12 or 15 years ago. Our kids went to school and we'd go to the awards, you know, banquets, which is great. You know, people get scholarships and all parents are proud. You know, when the young adults do well and their friends. But what we noticed was lacking was there was no recognition or celebration of anybody that was going into the trades. It was, you know, let's face it, 20 years ago or even 10 years, college or bust. You're not going to college. You're not going to mount anything. Yeah. You know, that, you didn't get into college. Well, we have good luck. So we recognize that and say, you know what, let's start. Why don't we give scholarships for people just young senior or young adults just going into the trades? I'll never forget it. It moved me. I went down to a benefit ice arena because we had opened up a new shop down Bitterford if it could be good for the community, get down there, get some recognition. It's a $500 scholarship about 15 years ago. And I can remember standing up in front of that. It was a good turn on probably 400 people there, parents, guidance, counselors, teachers and students. And I remember, you know, awarding that $500 scholarship this young man and the place just lit up, you know, his friends. Yeah. You know, it was probably like, you know, when I was in school, I probably think, geez, the show I'm going to get a diploma. This guy, is he going to get a diploma? He got a scholarship. You know, they were cheering and it was awesome. So I came away from that. It's like, yeah, we're going to do this in all our communities that we serve. And that caught on. And the Risbera family, Risbera Construction, Rocky and Billy, dad had passed and they wanted to do something significant in his honor. So they contributed $75,000 in addition to what movies was participating. That's really what enabled us to go statewide. So that has grown from the Risbera contribution. Now we're going to contribute over $100,000. This upcoming, I can't, I want to say, this graduation cycle. The $100,000 is that to be used for tuition at community colleges? It can be. Well, we got free tuition right now, which is wonderful. But tools, tool ships, you know, to be aligned, for CMP or Versa, you could about have about $2,500 just worth of gear, you know, chaps and gloves and all the helmet, all the recommended gear. So by getting businesses behind us, we're giving these scholarships across the whole state of Maine. In Memec, we're talking about Michael Bork and Tony Payne. We took us a step further. Harold, you're going to love this. So I get thinking about this. I thought, you know, these influencing these students and supporting them and celebrating, changing that narrative at every high school and every CTE across this whole state. It's working. Governor Mills just recently gave $15 million to a CTE schools here in Maine. She gets the message. She knows that there's a deficit and she's contributing, stepping up. So we're making huge progress. So we came up with this concept like, what if we gave instructor scholarships? What if we gave an instructor, an electrical instructor, a scholarship to work in an electrical company for a week? Because what happens, Harold, is someone's in the classroom for 10 years. Business is 10 years ahead of... Change, yeah. Right. They're disconnected from what was really needed in the employment world. That's right. In the respective field. So now, with Memec's financial support, we're able to offer and we've given instructor scholarships where these instructors go to best-in-class businesses to spend a whole week to learn about marketing, manufacturing, best practices. Where are the shortages? Are there shortages in auto repair? Are there shortages in plumbing? Are there shortages in electric? Cross the board, Harold. Now, think about this. Back when you and I were in school, they had industrialized and homemade. I would have been in school long before you would. Right here, I mean, they did. They did away with that 20 years ago. And I think in hindsight, it was probably short-sighted. Because the skills that you need today to be successful, the technical skills, we call it skill bundling. When I was on the university system and the community college boards of trustees, we call it skill bundling. So it's not just critical thinking, strategic thinking, conflict resolution skills, but you also need to have a physically worker keyboard, figure out a program on a device. And the technological skills that are required by employers today are significant. So working with your hands is almost equally as important as working with your mind today to be successful. And these scholarships are changing the narrative across education. And we're very proud of our work. We want to celebrate the trades and elevate the trades. Because the funding, the upward mobility, these jobs are paying $100,000 a year. You go to school, we had $80,000 worth of debt. You're trying to find that job, you usually leave me. So there is a skill, there's a deficit of skilled workers in. Yes, yes. And there's a tremendous investment. The Alfond Foundation invested in the community college between, I think, state, federal, and the Alfond Grant. They've got about 40, I think over $40 million to invest in workforce development. Because they know this is a crisis. I'm going to hear this term workforce development. Everybody uses that term workforce development. What is it? Are they training pros? Who, where are the training pros? I keep thinking, all I can think of, you'll have to help me and you help the audience too. When you say workforce development, I think, okay, community college training people and to be firefighters and electricians and plumbers and auto repair. Is that it? Tell me. Is that what we mean by workforce development? That's their core. That's what they do as a core. And they cover EMT, fire science. I mean, the amount of offerings they have at the community college system is extraordinary. It's amazing. But the workforce development dollars, which really is head up by Dan Belie for the community college system and Dan's crew, that workforce development dollars is specific to industry. So in other words, Moody's, for example, applied for a grant, okay, to be spent to train our incumbent workforce. So we're taking employers with, you know, Bath Ironworks is a big participant. Chinbro, a lot of these main-based companies take advantage of those training dollars through grants that we can invest in our coworkers to help them become more productive and raise their wages. Well, what if I've never worked in an auto repair place and I didn't go to a technical high school where I learned how to fix cars. If I come to Moody's, I can't get a job, right? Because I'm untrained. No, we actually have our own apprenticeship program. We call it Grow Our Own. So why would you hire me if I've not... Totally unskilled. It's got a good attitude, like you do, Harold. You've got a good attitude. You've got the right core. You're a good worker, Harold. If you're thinking of a career change. Thank you very much. Thank you. So, okay, so you hire people that don't have this training. It would be nice for you if a kid went to... What's the technical high schools? Portland Arts and Technology. Yeah, Portland Arts and Technology. And do they learn how to do body work and stuff like that? They offer that program. They do? Yes. So there are kids coming out of there. Not enough, probably. Not enough, but yes, there are. That know how to put an defender on a car. They've got the basics. Yeah, that's right. And I think it's all your passion. Harold, if you've got an individual, young adult, it's given that this is what we work at at the high school level, through SOAR, excuse me, through ASPIRE, is getting individuals exposed to the trades at younger ages. By the time you're a junior or senior, you've pretty much got a path, whether you're going to college or not. It's difficult to do that later in life. You get it in the middle school or earlier. Peak interest, exposure. Get young people out there and try a few different things outside of the classroom. And we're having good results for that. So all right. There's a lot going on in our educational system around what we're talking about tonight, because they recognize at the state level that if we don't develop our workforce, then our overhead is going to outweigh our ability to earn. It's just like running a household. If your overhead is too high and you're not bringing in enough, more outgoing than in going, you're all going. So part of the solution to build up an adequate workforce is this immigrant program that you're talking about. Correct. So, and part of it is our teenagers. Making sure our teenagers have access into what they want to do and pursue and pathways that they want to take. And let's keep them in main. And the other cohort that we talked about is, and we talked about this with Senator Collins, you know how they had the, it's called the Paycheck Protection Plan, the PPP program. I suggested that we call it the LPP, the Labor Participation Plan, so that we can take these cohorts, whether it's the teenagers, our immigrant population here in Maine, and seniors. Seniors that were basically forced out of the workforce because they can only earn a certain amount of money, which makes no sense. Over 65, they want to collect those securities. Exactly, Harold. You can't earn much. But again, these were put in place to try to open up jobs for our younger people. There was a reason, these laws were passed for a reason. And why they haven't gone in there and changed with the times is... I know the answer. You asked that rhetorical question, why they haven't gone in there and changed with the times, because we have gridlock in Washington, and all parties can do, what they do is obstruct. So, and I'm going to say something now. But I will tell you that I think one party is more focused on obstruction, and the other party is more focused on legislating. But it's, nothing's getting done. I mean, you have a mindset of parties, and they're in the minority, saying, our job is to make sure that nothing gets enacted in Congress. Zero. That's got to change. And there's only one way to change it. Voters, ultimately, they'll do what the voters allow them to do, or want them to do. Ultimately, that's it. No, you're right. They think the voters are for it. They'll be for it. You're right. We live in an environment where, and again, if you think about the population of political scientists in this country over the last couple of decades, how many people went to school for political science? It's gone up exponentially. So you sit around a table, come up with this political strategy, and what are we going to say, and how are we going to look good and be popular, and say the right things? You're right, Harold. Maybe what we should do is, there's a law against what's it called, obstruction of justice. Maybe we should have a law, it's obstruction of progress. Maybe that would wake them up. That's the problem. It's current American politics, and the minority says our job is to make sure that this particular president doesn't get anything done, that we can then go and try to beat them in the next election by saying, hasn't accomplished anything, and we can make that happen. I think it's going to come full circle. I mean, I look at young people. You know, when you talk about Bernie Sanders, Bernie Sanders had the mantra of the system's rigged. He's right, their system is rigged. But what young people need to figure out is who rigged it. Bernie's been down there for 25 years or more. So I think young people, I really do, Harold, with the bottom of my heart, they're going to sort this out, and there's going to be a movement in the next 10 years that we've never seen before. It'll be young people that do it. They'll finally start to figure out, connect these dots, and who's telling the truth, and who's looking out for their best interests, and who isn't. I have complete faith. It's going to happen. I hope you're right. I think you may be right. It's usually young people that engineer change in society, and because the rest of the people, they don't want to upset. Comfortable, that's right. They're comfortable, yeah. So I think you may be right. But this program that you created here, is very interesting. So do you work with, or have you met with, the Immigration Legal Assistance Program, ILAP? We have so many people that are ready to participate that want to help. Beth's technique is probably who we're referring to. Beth is all about it. And we've kind of held off on getting more support and more help until we, because we're more action-oriented. Once we get this administrator in place, once we start to build these resumes, once we get this thing moving, then that's when we'll seek those resources. Yeah. And we're talking within the next three to six months. This isn't going to be a long-grown-out thing. Next three to six months. I hope this legislation gets passed, and I hope it gets passed in a hurry. That'd be something. Do you talk to Senator Collins about this frequently? Yep. And again, we just talked recently, and she recognizes the things you said, but she emphasized that this is... She recognizes that this... She said this is a bipartisan... She said, and she's right, and you alluded to it, Harold, they don't want to make it as simple as the work permit. They want to weave in all these other things, which that's when people say, well, I can't go along with that. I thought we were just going to talk about work permits. That's the problem. So to your point, that's what she illustrated to me, was we've got to try to find a way to keep this as simple as possible, if that's kind of an oxymoron in Washington, D.C., simple. But that's what she was really trying to impress upon me, the approach. But she's got a lot of... Let's face it, she's got a lot of tenure. She's got a lot of Democrat colleagues that she's got some political capital with, right? That she's gone... Controversially, gone different ways. And I'd like to think that she sees the value, because she recognizes our participation rate here in Maine, Harold, has dropped into the mid-50s, which is about 10% less than New Hampshire, for example. It used to be in the mid-60s, pre-pandemic. What do you mean participation rate? The number of people that are able to work, that are actually working, it's in the mid... So it dropped about 10 points and it hasn't recovered. And for the reasons that I described... How do these people exist? I don't know how they go to the grocery store. That's a good question. I think, like I said, the age, right? You are my generation. I've earned enough, so they don't have to work if they don't want to. And the teenagers can't work because of the labor laws. They're so restrictive. God forbid they get hurt. I mean, look at... I love sports. Our kids all played sports. But look at the injuries that are related to sports. Broken and torn knees and this and that, right? It's all competition. You went on the job site, my God, if you sprained your ankle, you'd be in the front page of the paper, right? These employers are running sweatshops. My God, these kids are getting hurt. Oh. Yeah. So you have obstacles, but the program is good. You know, one of the things that the Department of Homeland Security has tried to lower the number of days it takes to get asylum status. The problem is that they say they're overwhelmed, and they probably are. There are too many people seeking asylum. So when you apply for asylum, you could be three years before you get asylum status, meaning three years before you get a work permit. Well, once you get asylum status, then you apply, you get another, you know, eight months or ten months. It's terrible. It's unreal. Harold, Bruce Bennett is a good friend of mine, and this is kind of the backstory. I'd go into NAP, I love cars working on them, and I'd fix up old cars on the weekends. Wait a minute, do you know how to fix up a car? Well, I'm good at fixing things, Harold. Very good at fixing things. So I'd go to NAP on the weekend, and I met this young immigrant. His name was Bruce Bennett, and he struck me. We stayed in contact and touch, and Bruce is a really good friend and become a real good ally in this movement. And he told me that he has several friends in the immigrant population that are moving to Canada because they can work in Canada. So it's like, and again, the thing that concerns me, as I said earlier, they all have cell phones, they all communicate, and if the word on the street, back home, is come to America, they'll take care of you. That is not what we want. We want that cell phone message to go, hey, we have opportunity, come up, I can get your job, I'll get it started, and we can make a future here together. That's the people we want coming to America. I'm not convinced that that's the population, like you said earlier, Harold, because they get in the word, would you get across the border? They got to take care of you. That's creating the problem, I think, personally. Well, we're at travels, and I don't think we're sending the right message on what America's all about. Well, it's not so nice when they get here under these circumstances, okay? Because they can't work. Yes, they get help from the Human Services Department, but you can't go on forever. You can't. First of all, they get that help in their own countries. And then they start working under the table, or various things. I don't think that anybody will travel through jungles, through paid people to take them across, nearly drown, carrying babies. I don't think anybody will risk their life just to get a welfare check, okay? I don't think that they put those dots together, but I think someone's soliciting them to say, hey, we got it pretty good. Come up here. Maybe, but maybe, when my grandfathers came and the village streets in southern Greece, they say, go to America, where the streets are lined with gold. But there's an old saying, if you can. The word gets back quickly. It's not lined with gold, okay? And because these people, when they get here, they're communicating with their family back home, and they're telling them, here's what I went through. I told this story once before on this show, and I love the story. About your grandfather. No, about my grandfather, but also about a movie called America, America, which is produced and directed by Elia Kazan, as a famous producer. It's about immigration. I love the movie. Anybody who's interested, just go online and figure out how you can watch through streaming, or otherwise, America, America. And it's about Kazan's uncle. And he was a Greek from Asia Minor. And his uncle was the first in his family to get to this country, and he went through hell to get here. Hell. Literally. And Kazan was asked by some reporter after the movie came out, did you ever talk to your uncle about what he went through and why he was willing to go through, he went through, to get to America? And he said, yes, I did. And he had three words in answer. He was saving himself. He saved himself. And for many of these immigrants, they go through jungles on leaky boats or wherever. I'm not saying we need order. We need a system to bring order out of chaos. We have chaos now. That's up to Congress. Hold them accountable for the chaos. Hold them accountable because they won't vote on a comprehensive immigration reform bill. They won't vote on it. It's criminal what's going on. But I agree with that. These people, they're saving themselves. They're risking their lives to save themselves. This is the greatest country that has ever existed on this planet by fire, and they know it and they want it. How can you fault somebody for wanting to better their lives and somehow get to the greatest country that ever existed on this planet? Criticize them for that? We're all immigrants, right? When you really think about it, and it's gone through phases, right here, I'll let you describe. Ellis Island, we're going through phases. And you're right, the functionality around immigration and immigrants is so bad that they don't even know it. It's like paralysis through analysis. They want to try to fix the whole thing, and you've got to do it one by one. Take this, and let's implement this. It's like the students in college. And let's get this working, you know, and let's ease some of that social tension that we have right now. With these people out there, so they can start earning a living and building a reputation for themselves and the community. Look how well respected the Greeks are today in this country. That all happened because the back-breaking work The Village Boys came. That was established right here. The Patience Boys came. The Village Boys. But yeah. And Italians, for that matter. The French, even the Asians. And the Asians especially. They're proud, they're proud people, and they've worked hard. They are hard-working people. Yeah, but remember in the 1920s, before that actually, Chinese Exclusion Act. The Congress Pact, an act saying no Asians, no Chinese. None. So what's this about? Human nature. Human beings, since they were in caves, are suspicious of and afraid of strangers. People different than them. They are. All of us were human beings. We all have those instincts. And that's what happens to immigrants. They're different. And we have, we're no different in this country than other human beings. We're afraid of strangers. I'd like to think that we've gone beyond the human nature. I'm not saying that that wasn't the case and hasn't been. But I think now, I honestly think with all the awareness today. I hope you're right. It's different. It is. It's different. I hope you're right. We're looking at individuals walking down the street, or you're in Iraq with. It's much different. I hope human beings are better than they were a thousand years ago. No question. You think of all the human beings. All the wars that slaughter, read world history. Slaughter constantly. Every hundred years, wars that kill massive amounts. Look what's happened in Russia. Right. That's human. Those are human beings that attacked Ukraine. Right. Human beings. Why? Harold, one thing helped me with this. We're getting off our topic. But that's all right. We got to end it, aren't we? You got to get the mind for this stuff. But that military buildup took place over there. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. I've got to tell you. We have to end this right now. We can talk about the Ukraine afterwards. I started this. I want to thank you for telling me. Thank you, Harold. My pleasure.