 So, hi everyone, this is Anali. Thank you all for carving out some time for attending today's webinar on part two of the VX learning series, which is all about scaling up. To all the attendees out there, please type in any questions you might have in the Q&A section, and we'll try to answer as many as possible at the end of the session. I would now like to introduce our speaker. Please welcome Mr. Gaurav Marra, Chairman, French Eyes India Group. A very warm welcome to you, sir. Thank you, thank you. Thank you, Sonali. And thank you for hosting this, even on behalf of BusinessX. BusinessX is a platform of French Eyes India Group, which brings in the entire ecosystem of investors, incubators, startup community, a lot of other businesses, and also a lot of people who want to sell their business. This platform is in exchange for businesses, so which you can list the business and you can also find a buyer. So we always encourage learning because learning is very important for businesses, business owners, entrepreneurs, and this is a very critical time this learning has to go on. And we have to reinvent ourselves passing through this whole new crisis or new changes which are happening in the businesses. So we divide the entire series into three parts, and every week, every Saturday, three o'clock, we talk about one topic. The first cycle of the series last week I did was on investments. So how do you become an investor? Today, we talk about scale up and how do you scale up the businesses? And next, we will talk about how do you build value in businesses? And subsequent weeks, we will start getting into a lot of case studies, a lot of examples, sometimes we'll bring in some other speakers also on the forum, which will talk about their ideas, industry experts and so on and so forth. So today's subject is scale up, you know, and so scaling up is very integral for part of your business because unless an individual business don't continue to scale, they would hit fatigue and they would eventually vanish. And this is where you're seeing it much more happening now. Either you need to continue to keep eye on how to continue to scale your business to the next level, and then only you will be able to build some merit value in the businesses. So we have also seen in India and I just set some perspective here. In the last 15 years, there has been a lot of examples and a lot of good examples actually. Globally in India also, which have actually successfully scaled up and I should compliment some of the entrepreneurs and they are some are extremely young, especially in the startup space. I mean, look at a company like Oil Rooms, you know, which has started about eight, nine years back and now it's a global hotel management company. Now, this is the power of scaling up, how fast you're able to see, but going to deeper into that is just not about raising the capital and deploying the capital in so and so. It has a lot of intermediate logistics which was to be done, you know, every hotel you acquire, every hotel you've done around and every hotel you get the right kind of management and so on and so forth. So getting talent on board, getting a lot of operational issues being handled and a lot of other partnerships and complexity of businesses to handle that and continue to raise capital is not an easy task. I think we should all compliment these entrepreneurs because they have successfully scaled up. But we also have seen, so while there are good examples like Flipkarts and the Zemato's and the Swiggy's and the Oyo's and the Ola's and so many of them and Lenscard. Lenscard is a retail big scale up story, you know, they've reached about a thousand not stores I mean, no time. So if you really see retail has been a very, very complex to find locations, to turn around those locations, to get that talent, to get the inventory right and every store to perform and to all do this in a very, very short period with people who had no experience in retail. And on the other side, we see a lot of conventional retailers and in I-ware itself, if you see there are a lot of conventional retailers who are 40, 50 years of experience but still would be sub 50 stores that also running in their own geographical advantage areas which means that there are companies in Delhi which are largely in Delhi and North India. There are companies in West Bengal which are largely in West Bengal and some other smaller parts nearby. So there are and similarly in South you will find two or three brands but they will never be able to scale this business. And now look at on the other side, a company like Lenscard which is not only in operating in India now, they are opening stores in mature markets like Singapore, Malaysia, Dubai and multiple other locations. They want to be have a global footprint. So these are all good examples of scaling up but we also have and you can all Google it out and find out, you know, a lot of failures. Last four years, there is about 1000 odd companies which have closed, which actually scaled at one point time very aggressively and they closed and this can be done for many, many reasons. And then we'll talk in the today's webinar a little bit on what are the opportunities when you scale up and how you do that and what are the challenges in the scaling up situation. Recently one company I was really impressed on their scale up and now we're hearing a lot of negative news on this company almost every food entrepreneur last year was talking about this company. This was looking coffee started about in 2017. These were historic growth they did. They added 2000 stores in China in no time and went to US and listed the company and the valuation shot up and they were looking tight that they will become the next big Starbucks opportunity. And now we are all hearing that all the sales which they were doing was all cooked. It was not right. And companies passing through a trouble, very, very, very large trouble and their stores are shutting down and things of that nature. So there are something which is very, very good at one point in time with scaling up and next year you hear the same companies crashing down because there was some inherent problem in the business itself, which was not very sorted. So let's define what is scale and I've done it in my way and so I define scale S stands for strategy. Let's understand strategy a little deeper. So strategy has to be done at both ends. You know, a lot of times we take an opportunist approach. Opportunist would mean short term cycle strategies and but I personally feel that in scaling up if you have a long-term, well-drawn strategy then only it pays off. You also have to see from a timing of this scaling up because sometimes timing can go absolutely wrong. You can be on the other side of the timing. You need to really see is it the right timing if you are on the right flow of economy, you are in the right flow of markets. It's very important because some markets change and some markets are pending and that thing. And finally, which is very important in your strategy document, you need to understand that how is the consumer behavior and forecast happening. So next three to five years where is the customer moving in for your business then only you have to have a formula to the strategy of scaling up. So strategy is very important. Also a few questions you need to ask yourself how differentiated you are in terms of when you start scaling up what differentiation you bring in. You have your core values and purpose been very well-defined and who's your core customer and if the core customer is not very clear in the markets you want to scale up then you need to go deeper into the understanding of that. And so that's what S stands for. Now let's understand what C stands for. C stands for culture, competitive advantage and core competence. Now this is very important. I've seen when people do scaling up in businesses and they go to multiple markets they acquire new talent. And this happens most of the times when you do the acquisitions. In M&A this is the biggest problem. M&A is just a function of acquiring a company but companies don't integrate that because integration of two companies doesn't work because of the cultures are very different. So how do you really integrate cultures in your scaling up? And that's very important. And I've run my own business I found this was a big problem and we scaled at a one point time our businesses we find that we were not able to carry the same culture around it because just scaling up isn't so much a rush that the talent you acquire or the teams you acquire doesn't sink into the broader culture of that. So rather it can have some time but threat that it can disturb your earlier culture itself because you will come confused as our organization. The second is your what do you have a competitive advantage on moving into scaling up and your core competence should not deviate. So unless and only these three C's are very clearly being demarcated, then only you should match rather I call it a C fit. If this fit doesn't move in, you don't go further. So from a strategy viewpoint, think a long-term strategy talk about the timing, talk about markets, talk about economy and then go to C and talk about culture, competitive advantage and your core competence in what you have. Now next is A. A stands for actionable plan and accountability. So whatever strategy you formulate in terms of your scale unless and only you have a very strong actionable and measurable plan, it would not work out. And second, it would has to also have a strong accountability and accountability comes from process owners. You need to set process owners in that system and they would have to work on a very strong accountability on their processes. Fourth, which is extremely important and I'll give you so many examples. Some great companies have failed in scaling up because there was one time the liquidity dried. So the fourth point L stands for liquidity. And this is very funny, scalability is a continuous process and more you become bigger, more your capital requirement and your liquidity requirement would be much, much higher. You're much more exposed to a lot of external threats. At that time, you need to fuel it. Now you have to have a see that you don't get an interval, you don't get an interval to stop. It's like a flying a plane and you have to refuel yourself while you're flying. And there is a good quote which says that fuel in the tank is always limited, but gravity is forever. So which means that whatever if you fill it up, you pull the tank, but it is still to be limited but gravity is forever. It will always try to pull you down, right? So this is a very important aspect of scalability. I know a lot of companies which scaled acquired businesses did a lot of acquisition and they were not able to sustain those businesses just because they're at a certain time where they thought that their cash flows would start taking care of internal approvals would start handling the situation, their liquidity started to dry. And that is a big problem. Even the greatest of the enterprises and we've seen this in many, many, many companies recently particularly last four, five years of economy has shown us of great organizations but not able to go further because they at a certain level they stopped where they put in. And most of the monies they spend in their scaling up actually gets wasted because they were not able to arrange the further liquidity. So that becomes a big issue and how do you really create your cycles of filling the tank, right? So, and that has to bring an extreme amount of predictability and timing. Like for example, say if this last quarter if companies were thinking that this quarter they would raise money and this quarter nobody's raising money, right? And if you are so tight in your liquidity and you will hear this news in next one quarter or next to next quarter you will see a lot of companies shutting down. And it's not that they were bad companies but they would not be able to sustain this period because their liquidity was already very, very, very low. And this forecast is now changed for the world. Every company was having a run for six months or the big companies, multinational would have run our touts at liquidity about a year or a year and a half or sometimes two years but now this all has to change because this has given a big shock to the world and they have to understand that they need to have bigger liquidity reserves because any adversity happened like this where you have no incomes or zero incomes or less incomes for four, five, six months consistently even the best of the organizations would find a big problem unless and until they have ability to tank it up back. So this would also create a big problem for especially for startups and I see startups are in a big, big problem and they would not be able to find liquidity unless and until they are really destructive and they are very strongly invested or their current investors step up and improve their position in the current position in the company. And the finally E stands for execution and execution has to be seamless. It has to be having a consistent experience and need to make an impact. So unless and until these three things really come in your execution it would also not do that. So just to summarize what scale to me stands for it stands for strategy, it stands for culture, competitive advantage and core competence. It stands for actionable plan and accountability. It stands for liquidity and it stands for execution which is seamless and effective. So the next thing which is very important is the three challenges when you scale up your business or your enterprise, the three challenges which you would face and three areas which you probably have to focus more on. And this is one of the big areas and I have a lot of examples. I used to work with a company very closely as a consultant and the entrepreneurs were very ambitious, extremely ambitious and you build a global enterprise and the biggest problem I saw in his company was people. His people were not aligned with his mindset and this alignment never comes because he was disconnected. He was not, he was old school entrepreneur who didn't see, he saw himself in a different level and the people were commoditizing his system. So I should be using that word but so he was not able to align that and which I see very differently to these new young entrepreneurs, they really believe in their teams, their core teams work like them and they speak the same language. So if you go to a company like a Swiggy or you go to any company or say Ritesh Agarwal of Oyo, if you see the teams around them are really aligned with them. So they are no different. They don't see that Ritesh alone is making a lot of value for himself but they see themselves also making value. So unless an entity you get your A team be part of your big growth story. It would never happen. So the first difficulty in conventional businesses to scale I think is their people management. So the three P's I will talk about, the first P is essentially people. So unless an entity you get your core team aligned on your scalability and they also have a collective goals and collective achievements to be done, you will never be able to find a scalability in your business model. And once they are aligned with your goals and your ideas and so forth, then you will see that they would bring in equal or more performance for the business. So first P stands for people. The second thing is processes. So scaling up is actually a multiplier effect and your ability to fix a lot of things at different markets, different spaces becomes even more challenging. So unless an entity you have a deep down process and this is where I think all these multinationals if you see are able to do that. Because they are very process driven, they are able to achieve same amount of results or sometimes better results in all markets because they are very process led. So sometimes a lot of companies, entrepreneurs fail to scale because they have a very little processes in the system and they also don't have a predictability of those processes. So they don't know the cycles of these processes how it should be run and so forth and also ownership of each process. So they divide microprocesses in the system and each process has a owner and this is very measurable. Then only this scalability would happen. Performance is a third P. Performance management system is very, very important has to be instituted in the system. So how do you institute a performance management system? And performance management is further divided into say multiple parts. This one starts from planning and planning it goes to monitoring, monitoring it goes to developing, developing it goes to rating and rating goes to rewarding. So unless and until you put this whole performance management of the team and your people and give them from a starting from a planning, how much time effort structure and who are the key planners, then it goes to monitoring. Monitoring team is very, very strong. You have to have a lot of data which is diagnosed and given to some kind of a predictability structure. Then a lot of development which should happen continue to scale up and then you rate them and then you go to and reward them. Unless the cycle is automated within the system you will not be able to scale to the level. And a lot of times this is very dependent on entrepreneur. I think entrepreneur should stick when you are scaling up into many, I mean largely on two parts. One obviously when you scale up there are a lot of troubleshooting. So your entrepreneur's time, effort, energy should go into, it would anyway go in because it's an urgent issue. But important would be keeping the eye on the strategy. But if the entrepreneur himself is left on to handle the performance and management and monitoring it just takes all his time. And it's not something which the entrepreneur should do or the top management should do. So this is where three Ps would come. It's people, it's processes and it is performance management. These three things are very, very important for any kind of scale up. Now let's go on scaling up strategies. You know how you should really scale up. So there are a lot of internal strategies which one can do, you know and how you can do that in your other business or even e-commerce. You need to see what level of performance you are there in that asset, right? So you need to have a very clear, measurable optimum performance levels and a peak performance levels. So unless and until you start shifting your internal targets to first to reach to optimum and then to peak. So a lot of people don't have maximized there each asset. So every single asset of investment which you've done in your enterprise, you need to see how that can be maximized. It should be from a large structure. So if you have say warehouse, unless and until you know you have absolutely maximized and optimized your spaces you have some assets is not unless and until you sweat out completely your assets and get them to a peak performance, it doesn't work. It doesn't give you that kind of I think it's a waste of energy and waste of infrastructure. So that's very important for you to really put some internal focus on that. There is another big science going on is what I call organizational branching which means that sometimes change is very important and continue to bring in your scale up and you cannot sometimes bring the entire change in the entire organization. So you create smaller branches and smaller branches can quickly adapt to the new change and then it can flow within the organization. So how do you create those changes in the structure? MNA is also a very strong strategy and I would strongly recommend at this stage this is a great time for people to put up a long-term MNA strategy because next year this might not be this year but next year early to next three years I think there's a good MNA market strong assets which would stabilize which would still be there but would be available for a good value. So I would say better companies a lot of people say that this time you will get a lot of distress assets. I think let's forget about distress assets that's not so exciting a strategy but there are good assets which would be also open in the market and that can be a very good scale up strategy to look at MNA opportunities available. Then you also have a what I call affiliation strategy which means that how you can affiliate with extension of your business and extension of that. One of the things our company does is licensing and franchising can be a huge scale up opportunity. Franchising and licensing and I'll explain both of them. Licensing is unlocking your brand. So if you say have a brand and it is running in a X category and you don't know you want to only stick to that because that's where your factories and infrastructure works but you don't do other categories. For example, you're a fashion brand and you're very successful in fashion and you do woman fashion but you don't do handbags but this can be extended to handbags. There would be somebody who's great in manufacturing handbags but doesn't lack a brand. So it can be extended. Like we have a dear friend runs a company called Damilano. Damilano is a stop class luxury bag company. Now Damilano can be eyewear company. It can be also a fashion wear company. It can be also go with men belts, wallets and a lot of other things which he's already doing I think so but it can be also shoes. So licensing is all about how do you unlock the brand and take it to the category which you're currently not doing. It's a globally very, very large industry and I see in India for scaling up you can also look at licensing. You can also look at franchising. Franchising is obviously a new channel and any kind of channel you can look at for expansion of your brand and taking it to the next level. You can also look at a lot of cross alliances, partnerships, shop in shops and many other omnichannel strategies can come in. Technology itself is a very big platforms now because a lot of scaling up for companies and brands and products have happened through technology and reaching out to more customers. Another thing which business owners should not keep in mind these days is markets. Markets should not be having phobia of a particular market which you want to really stick in. You should really think through where you can go. I just finished this week calls with a lot of companies out of Brazil which were never in our radar and they all are looking at markets like India. You know, and this is surprising and when I look at it, it is a great idea because Brazil is very similar to Indian market from a consumer, from a, you know, their buying capacity viewpoint, their behavior structure, everything very, very similar. While it is a very far off country, not so much people know about each other country and so forth, but you will see in next couple of years Brazil would become a very strong trade partner to India and that's the ability I see in whenever you start looking at. Don't reserve your mind in terms of this is the only market you need to have. There are many more markets that we were invited by a large education company which wants to enter into Vietnam. They saw Vietnam economy is one of the boom economies and they are looking to scale up their education business in Vietnam. So there are a lot of people who are looking for very, you know, strong analysis and this all comes from if you are having a lot of business intelligence and business intelligence will tell you how you can scale up and which markets you should scale up. And then there are a lot of external factors and these days this cannot be ignored and now that's pandemic happening. I think external factors have to be looked at. So we should look at all global economic factors. This is the first starting point because if you don't see the global economic factors today we like it or we don't like it. A lot of people say India has always been isolated economy and we always have been better than the world. Actually answer is no. This is all a wrong perception. We are also dependent on a lot of foreign investment. We are also dependent on foreign markets. We have also dependent on exporting poor economy. Everything we are dependent on the world. So if world economic factors are changing it would certainly impact our markets also. There is another challenge which I saw the big risk in scaling up is always these last 10 years I found is disruptive innovation. There's somebody there is creating a disruptive innovation which can change your business in one single day. So that is something which you need to forecast and continue to see what is going on in the world. You cannot wait for it. So everybody knew when they were hustling in early 2000 that Amazon is doing a lot of delivery to homes in the US. Nobody thought that this disruption one day would come to India also. And these disruptions are happening. Everybody saw when Tesla started their electric cars and so on and then in thought that in three years itself this disruption would come to your market also. So there are a lot of key disruptions happening globally. And these disruption have to be taken in extreme seriousness and companies have to make themselves ready to be ready to handle this disruption. I have seen a lot of businesses which were very relevant at one point in time is absolutely non-relevant now because of these disruptions being ignored. So you cannot ignore any disruption which is happening. You need to take it extremely seriously and see, understand where the disruption is coming from and what changes are happening on those markets. And these markets sooner or later would hit your market also. Another area which is very strong which we always look at and question sometimes would people do this going forward? Like these days we are talking about COVID going on everybody is talking about would people consume this? Would people go to restaurants back? What people would do this and so on and so forth. And this is what we all, there is might be a substitute for your product or a service coming through. So if that is in the line, it can disturb not only scaling your business itself. So always keep asking yourself, is there a substitute which is going to be done? Like we started our career in franchising with the print magazine. And 10 years, while we started, a lot of people don't know we started the digital platform first then the print came in. But print was only there that time nobody was to go digital. And we were telling ourselves in the last 15 or 20 years that sooner or later print has to go. So we were on the parallel started working on a lot of our digital platforms to be ready very strongly. But I know a lot of other media houses which were totally dependent on print and they never had any strategy of online. They would not be in business going forward. I mean, they would have to shut down and companies which are smart like BCCL, Bennett Coleman, Times of India, they have a very strong online digital. They already invested for last 15, 20 years big time investment while they're running still the biggest newspaper in the country. But they are also equally planned on their all the platforms. They're digitally there, they're electronically on the television and they are also building up another feature media platforms which would come in the market. So you need to really see is there something being created which would substitute your product or a service? If that is going to happen then you need to start working on that immediately. You need to also work on the price for cost management. Cost management is also becoming a big destructor now because of inflation, supply chain disturbance not a lot of companies because of China and other things have a big issue on going on. I know steel industry was disturbed because they were Indian steel was not able to match prices with a lot of imports coming in. So this all is disturbing these companies and these companies were fantastic companies but they were not able to sustain themselves because the cheaper steel was imported from outside. So these are all issues of the world economies and there would be somebody producing somewhere much cheaper than what you can produce and then the whole scalability can be put to question. And then there is a what we call the there are two types of competition you see one is the competition you know and then there is another competition which is invisible which sometimes come from inside which means that your entire company itself there would be somebody who would become your competition. It's invisible. You don't know that competition. So you need to really see and be planned for that. That's very, very important point of it. The last part of scale is there are scale effects also because when you scale there are side effects for this and side effects you have to be ready and you need to create a strategy how you would be in better control with that. First itself is controlled itself. As you scale up you start losing your control. You have to have a mechanism that your control remains on the business. So you have to see that how do you not lose control of business. I have seen a lot of businesses failing down in scale up because they had lost the control. Second is mismatch of forecast. When we scaling up we are very bullish on forecasting our numbers which sometimes don't match the way we think so. So that also changes a lot of things. We get over leverage. Now this is a big, big problem. Scaling up on leveraging yourself and continue to take debt in the system is a dangerous idea. I've always advised that scaling up should done with equity. It's best to do with the promoter equity but that would not be sufficient. Then you need to raise equity and raise as much equity you want to for scaling up. That's not a problem. But debt is not so much advised unless you have a very strong predictable answers available. So which means that your book has already been defined. You have orders already sitting with you and then if you are raising some debt, this is still fine and if the balance sheet is not able to handle the cost of capital then that is advised. Just for having your scalability and doing future acquisition or bridging through the acquisition and acquiring more debt into that, it's not that advisable unless suddenly you have a strong predictability of a horizon of next four to five years of their forecast being there. Also, I've talked about the culture misfit. This can also be a big side effect which can come in. And finally, you can lose control on a lot of critical things. These days critical things are not only the other things. It's also about data. It's also about your IP. IP also is a big asset and sometimes in scaling up, you start losing that IP. So the final thing from my side is that scaling up a sustainable scaling is a way forward to keep long-term shareholder value in mind. So whenever you are scaling up, you need to really see that is the long-term shareholder value would remain intact and continue to grow and that's where the sustainable scaling of business should happen. So this is the answer on scale up. We will be more than happy to share the notes with all of you and which Sonali would be able to share and pass if you share your email ID. Sonali, if you have some few questions for me, then we will be more than happy to take that questions. Thank you so much, sir, for your wonderful insights. Once again, thank you so much. And we already have a few questions lined up with us. So I'll just take up the first question. So the question is, what is the biggest mistake entrepreneurs make according to you which stops them from scaling up? If you could just name one. What is the biggest mistake entrepreneurs make according to you which stops? It stops them from scaling up. So people stop scaling up in the risk of losing their control or they feel that scaling up, you know, the many minds, it's largely a mindset issue why you would not scale up. And I don't think any business should stay there. Every business should scale up. But how soon and how fast you want to do that, that's one given on the opportunity and resources. And if you have enough opportunity and enough resources available aligned with that sources and opportunity should have a balance, then you can go and scale up. Most of the time people would choose to do a very slow scale up because they feel that they would be much better in control of the scaling of opportunity. But I also have a other side to the thing. Any company which has really built market leadership would have actually gone beyond the regular logic. So look at a PVR at one point in time and how they scale to become the India's largest multiplex company. And almost everybody was saying, I remember that time, Ajay Vijli would not be able to do that. He will never be able to turn around this single cinema as people who still continue to go there. So a lot of adversity would come to you. But his belief and his study was very correct that he was shifting the whole market from single screens to these multiplexes and that's exactly happened. So sometimes you need to believe on yourself and your own vision and go after that and scale your business. But controllable, sustainable. So the second question is, how would a first time entrepreneur start with the thought of scaling up, planning a tech startup without having enough technological knowledge themselves? Yeah, so as I said, I mean, find the A team. You know, unless and until you have your resources in place, scaling up is no question. So I gave you the first part to this entire thing. Unless and until you have those things available with you, you don't have, you have right people, you have right processes and you have a right performance measurement. Unless and until this is in place with you, you don't even start talking about scalability. So if you don't have a technology guy, you get a technology guy, get a good CTO and then start working on that. And that's very important. If your foundation is not laid and just to try to put the scale, it has no meaning to me. And this answer in itself answers our next question, which was about if you could only give one advice to an entrepreneur struggling during this time, then what would that be? You know, so everybody is struggling. So one advice is that this is this time, you're not alone. If anybody is struggling, then everybody's struggling. Then every single, I don't see any businesses have, you can only measure them as a low impact or a high impact. Even people think healthcare is a low impact or in that thing, they also are suffering because they currently are over pressured. They have other issues going on and their regular patients are not coming. So everybody is at this stage suffering. So when you are in this situation, you need to one, keep the calm. Second, this all would pass. Second, you need to see and focus on your core businesses. Leave aside other things, you cannot manage all. So keep the eye on your core business and continue to fuel it up, continue to paddle it hard. And there would be time that you will start coming. I feel that smart companies, smart founders, more focused organizations would thrive as this was all over. Wonderful. So I think we'll just take up the last question now. So the question says, any case studies of clients where you successfully help with channel development? So the person who's asked the question says that his interest is in home-based cleaning systems of high end. So any- Yeah, we are essentially a channel development company. The franchise in which I'm bearing is actually a channel development business. We've worked with over 9,000 brands in home cleaning, commercial cleaning, we name it, we have done it, and all global brands. So that's what our business is. So any help you require, you can obviously reach us. That's great. Thank you so much, sir. Once again for a wonderful session. Anything in the end that you would like- I'm happy to share. Somebody's written on the chat that you can share your notes. So I will pass it on to Sonali and she would be more than happy to do that. And next week we will talk about value. It will be a very interesting session and how do you find value? So I always say that people know the price and sometimes their investment, what they've done in business, but they don't know the value of their business. And not even 1% of businesses in India know their value. So we'll talk about how do you discover value in your business? Wonderful. Thank you so much, sir. I think we'll just wrap up the session here. Thank you very much, Sonali. Thank you very much. Thanks for coordinating this. Thank you. Thank you to all our attendees for taking part into this session. We really hope you were able to add some value to your lives. And we'll see you in our next session, which is on creating value, as Gaurav sir said. So please join us next Saturday at 3 o'clock. I also put my direct email ID if you have any further questions for me. You can also reach at gm at gauravmaria.com. Happy to answer that. Thank you. Thank you so much. Once again to all the attendees, if you need any notes or if you have any questions or doubts, please feel free to get in touch with me. You can also type down your email IDs in the chat box and we'll make sure that we send the notes to you. Thank you so much, everyone.