 Okay, the train, the train has entered the station at Coronaville, a special place. We are all at this place, Coronaville. What's next? This is Stink Tech. I'm Jay Feidell. It's Wednesday and it's noon and we have our regular team here. We have Stephanie Dalton. We have Cynthia Sinclair. We have Winston Welsh. Thank you for joining Coronaville here at the station, you guys. Thank you. So, you know, the press is out there, the media is focused on these crowds all over the state and there's one commentator put it, you know, that represents, you know, maybe 1% of the people in the world that were in the country and the rest of them are sitting at home wondering what the, you know, the commotion is about because it may not deserve all the commotion it's getting. And yeah, terrible thing happened, but this is really special. And so you wonder about the press because the press is reporting this, I mean, I say ad nauseam every day, full tilt boogie all day long, and it's hard to resist it. Now, I said she had enough already, she wasn't watching it. It was repetitive. Why, you know, okay, I got it, I got the message, but you know, the problem is they're not talking about the virus anymore. They gave it up, you know, the priorities have gone to the street scene. The question is, what is going on with the virus? As Winston said before the show as well, you know, if we believe that the viruses, you know, is going to result in a resurgence, the street scene is going to result in a resurgence. The incubation period hasn't passed yet, we're only eight days in. And when we look again in two weeks, we may see real indication of that. There are pockets though, there are pockets where the virus has arguably, you know, increased. What do you guys think about that? Is it possible that this isn't going to be as bad as we think Winston? I don't know. I was interested to see Sweden was reporting now that their cases are sometimes, I think about 10 times higher than their neighbors were, and they had this sort of open policy, and they have one of the highest death rates in the world, in pursuing sort of a, I don't want to even call it the herd immunity strategy, but that was one thing here in America. We're going to see what's happening now that the places are opening up. I don't think we really had, we're not even in far enough from Memorial Day weekend to see what those crowded beaches, swimming pools, and all of that's going to actually translate to, but I will have the data here probably starting in about a week or a week and a half. So what's different about this, Stephanie, are there factors here that could actually make this less of a resurgence than we might expect with all these hundreds of thousands of people in the streets all close to each other, some of them not wearing masks, and spending hours in the middle of a crowd all day in the middle of a crowd? Well, I think that it is always an overestimate when the initial projection has made. And so when we don't meet that criteria, that level, this is the time for celebration. So I think the projection should be high as high as it possibly can be. Don't you think? That gives people the clue that this is dangerous. And then everybody goes about trying to flatten that imaginary curve to not become the real curve. There's all kinds of factors working. I mean, I remember seeing some of that coverage that was signs that said, don't go back to work. The protest is more important than going back to work. So if you are inclined to participate in the reopening, don't. Stay with us, stay in the street. And I think a lot of people, whether that thinking of that or articulating that or not, did stay in the street. They have been in the street day and night in so many cities all week long. And so the question is whether it's more dangerous if they're in the street or back to work. I'm not saying all of them can go back to work. Some of them they got no jobs. Some of them would be home instead of in the street. So it's really hard to get a handle on the demograph, the demography here. One of the factors that are playing into whether this is as highly contagious as we might have expected. And one of them is there was an article about distancing in the street. If you're outside, maybe this is one of the reasons Hawaii has had so few cases. If you're outside, you know, sunshine arguably kills the virus. If you're outside, the droplets will sail off on the wind and they won't be as focused as inside. They won't hang around and be so dangerous to the next person who enters the room. That sort of thing. It seems to me that's one factor, but what about it? I mean, is this more or less dangerous than what might otherwise be happening? Well, I think it's more dangerous, much more dangerous. When we first were talking about reopening the country, we all knew that there was going to be another spike when the country reopened. We did not expect the country reopened with a flood of people into the streets like they are. And you know, most of the people are trying to be conscientious. They're using hand sanitizer to see them out there going through the motions of trying to be careful. They're trying to stay, you know, a distance apart, wearing their masks, all of that. I saw some footage of police dispensing hand sanitizer to the protesters. I thought that was really something. I saw police actually getting involved and walking with the protesters and taking a knee with the protesters. And that's what I was really encouraged to see. I loved seeing that. The officer saying, yes, this is wrong and it doesn't represent all of us. I thought that was such an important statement to make when we were out there. But you know, we were afraid of that spike or we knew that spike was going to come when we reopened. But now that we reopened and everybody's so close together, I'm afraid that that spike is going to be three times worse than we ever expected it to be. And I also think that it's possible that some of these guys that are out there protesting aren't actually genuinely there for the right reason. And I don't just mean the bad actors that are causing all the damage. But they're there because they've been locked in a house for two months and they just want to get outside. And so they're going outside for those reasons. So I think that all of the protests are sort of a combination of people who are there because they really want to make their voice heard and they really want to see systemic change. And then I think there's people there that are bad actors to cause trouble. And then I also think that there's people that just want to get out of the house. And that's what bothers me. Well, it's a cooped up thing and drives them out into the street because they may not have jobs. You know, I was telling you yesterday, Winston, that there was some footage of some people who were arrested, young people. Most of this crowd was young by the police in New York. And these were the people who were doing mischief and looting and what have you. And they were all lined up on the curb. And they were all handcuffed with those plastic ties and waiting for the corrections van to come pick them up. And the camera, you know, kept going back to this line of people that were a couple of dozen of them along the curb. And they're remarkable, two remarkable things. One is I didn't see any masks. Sorry, I didn't see any masks. The other is, and this was really interesting, they were all howling. There were no African-Americans sitting there being arrested. I don't know if this was a choice of the police. Maybe they were trying to make a point. Or that possibly this is a real phenomenon that the ones who were doing the mischief, at least in that area were all howling. But anyway, I mean, you know, I think you got to, you got to tell, you know, the fact, the fact, Winston, is that we have been reopened for more than a week, right? Around the country. If we were looking for a resurgence because of the reopening of the economy, thank you, Dr. Trump. We've already seen it reopened in many places, but we have not seen, correct me if you feel otherwise, we have not seen any clear indication of a resurgence. Am I right about that? Well, I don't think we have seen that, but if it is, you know, the news cycle has been dominated by other things. And for our viewers on the mainland, which should point out that howling means Caucasian as well. And, you know, as far as that goes, hooligans and troublemakers and looters, they don't need it. They're just, they come in all shapes, sizes and colors, and they should be, you know, prosecuted to pull this extensive the law, because this is not helpful in all of this discussion. What seems to me about the coronavirus in this last week, despite in the last two weeks, actually, not including the riots where people actually are wearing masks, but they're more afraid probably of tear gas and that sort of thing, or being videotaped as much as spreading coronavirus, is that we're seeing sort of an, I want to call it an institutionalization of measures for when this virus will be coming back, whether it's in one week or two months or two years, that we are permanently altering the way that we stand in line, deal with cashiers, pick out a shopping cart. There's the guy that's cleaning the shopping carts between everything at the supermarket. There's, they clean up the keypad, someone else touching it, which I appreciate actually. This idea of permanently distancing. I don't know how the planes are going to do it, but we're entering the phase now that I don't think we will come out of. I don't see that. I think we're probably going to be in a permanent, I don't want to call it a quarantine mode, but don't touch me or get within six feet of me mode, maybe for the duration of this. Well, that takes us naturally to deal with Fauci's remarks yesterday, where he said there would be, I forget how many, hundreds of millions of doses of vaccine available out of this vaccine biotech company called Moderna. So I think it's an American company by the end of the year. That's interesting because there were a number of candidates and that's the one he mentioned. He didn't mention the others. And I also remember within the last couple of days, some articles and stuff on the tube, showing clips of Fauci saying things that were not complementary to him. Remarks he made early on in this pandemic where he said, don't worry about it. This is not serious. And so his credibility now for me is personal is how I feel about it. His credibility has been undermined by these clips. And now I'm wondering if there really is going to be a vaccine by the end of the year in which we can all get vaccinated. I mean, except for the anti-vaxxers who probably are out there waiting to refuse vaccinations. But this may change what you're talking about. If you believe Fauci and there will be more news about it, I think the fickle finger of the media will go to cover that story. We'll hear more about it and that we are somehow convinced of the reality there that there will be hundreds of millions of vaccine doses available for Americans by the end of the year. I'm not going to worry so much at least then about a mask. I'm not going to worry so much about how close I am to other people. I'm going to feel like this is nothing more than the flu because we have learned to manage it. So it's a psychological, a social psychological thing. It's the psychology of the masses. And I suggest that if people start believing that the vaccine is coming and soon and will save us, they're not going to be concerned. And that's actually a worry because if they change their behavior, if they do not act conservatively, if they have no fear, then we are at greater risk. And if the vaccine fails, whoa, you know, right now, I think people are not as serious. Many people are not as serious. Look at those protesters. They're not as serious. What do you think, Stephanie? Oh, I think you're so right on, Jay. And I think we're already on that track even without the Fauci announcement about the Santa vaccine. Because people understand from the data that's been promulgated that, you know, the African Americans are affected very badly by the virus. And the young, the group that's out there protesting is not. You know, they may be infected. They're all eligible for that. But they may not, they're not going to die. Their death rate is very low, although some have died. But I think that people have concluded from that that they're fairly well protected as and that this is not worse than the other viruses were dancing around all the time. One thing that occurs to me from what you say is that people are out there protesting. I mean, it's a lot of this. It's a rainbow of protest out there. And they're young. And the likelihood is, you know, they're not going to die. That's a probability. You know, you have a huge, there was a study in England, huge risk if you're over huge. Absolutely many, many, 10 times more. But if you're young, not the problem is with the young people who may be catching it from others in the protest. They're spreaders. They're spreaders. They're going to go home. They're going to go to their families. They're going to, they're going to talk to older people. And if they're shedding virus all over other, you know, other age groups in the, in the, in the, you know, the community, then we have a silent and, and your point Winston about it takes another eight days. Well, we're not tracking, have you noticed? We're not tracking at all. Zippity don't track it. So, so if these people go back into the community as young, relatively safe spreaders, and they shed virus all over other age groups, we'll have no control over this thing. And, and the, and the resurgence won't happen in eight days more. It'll happen in a couple months more. And we will have a way of dealing with it. That's right. But as maybe we've just decided the powers of me that says this is just the way it's going to be. We're going to reopen the economy because the deaths of despair and having 25 to 40% of the population out of work. Maybe people say that's why they're able to go to the riots because they don't have anything to do. They don't have a job to go to. So they're able to go there. And this is going to cause a lot more damage than, you know, whatever percent of people who are over a certain age. And let's face it, this is, this is affects older Americans, much more than younger Americans for right now that we know of. We don't know what long term effects of this is going to be. Maybe these, these things are going to render people sterile. We really don't know. That's true. That's true. And every day you find another article about some bizarre aspect of the virus with a, you know, was it COVID toe already and the article you mentioned a minute ago about how this is really attacking the circulatory system and epithelial tissue, epithelial tissue in the body and having all kinds of secondary effects that we don't know about. We don't know how it works. And that's why when you mentioned Malachi's announcement, it may be part of that that just says, you know what, folks? We've worried so much for the last two, three months. We freaked everyone out. Everyone's been in their cage, their own cage. And now we look at Sweden. We look at India. We're looking at all around the world. And we're not seeing like a third of the population die. Some people are dying. Some aren't. We don't really know why or how or when. Sometimes this virus is super bad like in Italy. Sometimes it doesn't seem to be that bad in neighboring countries. So maybe they've just decided, you know, hell with it, let's just kind of let it go. Let's hope we have enough equipment right now after a few months that we've been able to order more master whatever. It feels like that to me. It feels like now the emphasis is on let's restart the economy. Let's deal with the virus. Would you guys please continue to be conservative? I'd like to continue the show. I'd like to have all of you here. There's still a great risk out there. You know, one of the things Cynthia is that there's a lot of a lot of disinformation, like the guy who said all the vitality of the virus is diminishing. I'm going to stop and repeat it because I think that was disinformation. But then if you look, if you look on the web and get the email, there are so many people who are, you know, selling you old t-shirts for masks. You know, and I mean, there's so many different kinds of masks and none of them are really surgical masks, even surgical masks, none of them are really all that effective. At the crowd of protesters, I really wonder how many of them were using adequate masks. But that's not the other thing. There's all kinds of hocus pocus, you know, you know, snake oil going on there. Are people buying into that? Do you think they will or will continue to buy into that? I think it's very partisan, their reactions. I think that the people that follow Trump are not going to go with masks and the people that have half a brain are going to. And yeah, maybe some of the masks weren't the best masks that were out there in the crowds, but they were at least trying. We have some numbers here for you guys. You see there hasn't been really a spike that we've heard about. Because we haven't heard about it. As I go down the list, New York is up by a thousand. Illinois is up by a thousand. Massachusetts is up by 3,600. Pennsylvania up 600. This is per day. Texas is up by a thousand. The big ones, Maryland is up by 800. Virginia is up by 800. And just going down the list, you know, Arizona is up by a thousand. Tennessee is up by 800. So there has been a spike. But it's a very manageable spike, right, which was with the whole point of flattening the curb was all about. So now that we flattened the curb and we did really well, and now we're able to not over tax our health care system. And now we're going to have another spike that's going to over tax our health care systems coming from all these these protests, I believe anyway. Well, you're right. I mean, I'm really glad you have those numbers. And that that does show that there has been a reaction in the in the in the virus in the infection. On the other hand, that does sound manageable the view of the fact that the curve was being, you know, diminished before that. Therefore, we probably have sufficient hospital infrastructure to handle it. I really like to hear going on. For now, for now. Yeah, for now. What I really want to hear is that the government is restocking all of those hospitals, overstocking them, getting ready for this next flare that's going to come. We're going to get a spike. And I don't hear anybody talking about that. Sure, they have the PPE that they need right now. What if they get a huge spike. They don't have. Are you sure about that. I think it's just going off the radar. Do we have do we have enough testing. We should be testing all over the place and we should be tracking. Let me go back to Fauci for a minute though, because somehow this has to be, it has to be put in perspective. So one of the very strange things is his relationship with Trump. Was it yesterday. There were some articles about how he hasn't seen Trump, and he hasn't been at meetings of this elusive task force. Remember, the task force was supposed to be supposed to be run by Pence. Jared was there and supposed to do something. And I, you know, and the people who used to sit around the room behind Trump and these press conference rally meetings of his aren't there. And Fauci's not there. And Fauci doesn't know, according to this article, he doesn't know why exactly or, or what is happening with the task force, because there are not a lot of meetings of the task force. What is happening to our federal effort. I mean, you know, you could this is this is a subject of a whole new show. But it just seems to me that when he stands in front of the church with the Bible, when he makes these outrageous threats of violence, when he distracts everybody was calling in the army. He's not, he's not paying attention to the virus. He's not doing anything about the virus. Am I missing something Winston? Has he got something going on here, or has he just turned his back on the whole thing. Oh, I did. It's, it's just a distraction that he's able to get rid of now on a way towards something more more interesting with which is consolidation of more power. I think one sad thing about you mentioned Dr. Fauci or Deborah Berks or at the CDC, Dr. Redfield. We have had. Now, we don't trust even this, the information coming from the government we want to and I basically do I want to say the CDC is a good organization. They do great work there. The huge majority of people join that because they're the top scientists in their field, but it's been politicized. The Institutes of Health, the task force, they're having to go in and say, don't inject police, do wear masks, whatever it is. And now we just quit who the World Health Organization. How is that helping anything because we were told, Oh, well, this is a Chinese organization that's that's against America, whatever the reasons for this. The basic World Health Organization has been with us for a good 75 years. This is all part and parcel of the casualty of the last four years of wreckage of us losing faith in basic institutions, because we're told, we can't trust this anymore and therefore we start to say, and there's always the smallest kernel of truth and things, whether it's for journalism, or the media or, or in this case government institutions. So it makes us confused. The masses don't need much, even experts don't need much to read an article and say, Well, I read this. Well, now, you know, Lance, it has to go back in and say, Actually, the information we were getting wasn't right on and we're sorry to publish that. So that just feeds the whole fire. The difference between what we are getting from government and what we should be getting from government is really huge. I mean, just for example, you know, there's an, there's an ad from the CDC, you know, sort of public announcement public service announcement ad on television, and it is down at the, at the fourth grade level. And it is saying you should wash your hands and maintain social distance. I mean, you know, it's ridiculous. There's so much that we don't know about the virus is so much advice, we should be getting on how to conduct our lives that we are not getting. And they're repeating information that's months old in a fast moving pandemic. It is extraordinary how little they have given us. So I mean, I blame Trump for wrecking the CDC. But I think we have to recognize that it's wrecked. It's giving us fourth grade information in a pandemic, which, which, which science is, is learning things every day. The CDC doesn't report any of that. Wouldn't you rather be informed by a credible government organization like the CDC, the one that has been looking after us and our house, you know, for 100 150 years, I don't understand why they think that we're satisfied with fourth grade information. It will be part of the reconstruction of our nation after in seven months, hopefully when we step back and we say how did we get into this mess and how do we, how do we rehabilitate ourselves and get out of it. And to the point where we do respect our, our, our these critical organizations of government and for the time being, we rely on them as much as we can but we also look at our state, our local companies. We have to you, if you want the real news in this country, you pretty much have to do your own sleuthing and try and figure out what's there and that is, that's a whole new discussion and a whole new show. Here's what was what is happening with Twitter. And what's the other one chat snap chat now in the paper about them, you know, discounting what Trump says and pointing out that Trump is lying. It's so important and it, it not only goes for Trump, it goes to people around Trump. And my unhero of the day is Mark Zuckerberg, because Facebook, you know, just publishes that stuff, like a pipeline. And so we're not getting good information. It's terribly unhelpful because we see stuff on Facebook, we see it on the news, we, we want to trust the sources, and yet we're told not to trust anything. So you end up with just a whole bunch of misinformation, disinformation that's mixed in with the real good stuff in there. So, you know, confusion. Yeah, that's what we have we have confusion and therefore we do not have reasonable rational effective moves by the public in terms of dealing with their own lives. And we and we lose our priorities and I think into a certain degree we've lost the priorities with the protest. It's necessary for them, you know, get this political thing in the protest. And this, you know, racism issue in the protest, but how many of those people are worried about shedding virus back to their families. I mean, it's still with us. We have to build it into everything we do and we're not getting information that helps us make that choice. It's like we're almost out of time. Stephanie, can I get some closing thoughts from you? Who do you trust? You know, one one statement I'd like you to deal with is, well, you can trust We'll tell you the truth. Am I right? We can roll up to that because we can't trust who's making the policies and hopefully and coming from the federal level. I mean, remember that with all your savings, even even with the who and NIH and CDC and all of that. It's just the same pattern as as it has been with Kellyanne Conway. Where's she now? Okay. And where is Rudy Giuliani? Where's he now? And then Pence, hey, where's he gone? He was the head of the team. And so it just and now who where did they go? And so it's the constant repertoire of his to just bring it up, use it for whatever purpose, bring it out and dump it and then move on and leave all of everybody left, you know, with no end to the Senate. So I just see it as creating that more confusion, making sure nobody gets a grasp of this and hopefully CDC, Coronaville here and NIH, Dr. Fauci, you know, is enough of a momentum, you know, keep pushing the good work forward and getting it published in our newspapers, you know. Yeah, we have to keep, we meaning all of us, we have to keep working on the issue and keeping it high priority. I mean, even the reopening Congress is locked on whether to give more money to people who are out of work. And their money is expiring in and the Republicans are saying we don't want to give them any more. Oh my God. So now you have no action by the federal government in dealing with the disease and you and you have a conclusion, a termination of action to reopen just a lot of talk. This is a big problem and we don't know the consequences. So does this make you feel good Cynthia or what None of this makes me feel good. It actually breaks my heart. I've spent so much time in tears because we've lost so many people over 100,108,000 people have died from this virus. And I think that the, the enormity of that is kind of lost on people, especially with all this new stuff with the protests and sort of overshadowing all that and granted. Yes, what happened to Floyd. I mean to George Floyd was awful and police have been doing that forever. And, and it needs to change. But I wish that people could be a little more careful out there and keep in their minds that this virus is not the innocuous thing that some of the media and some of the administration are trying to tell us, and it is a deadly thing and people need to treat it as such. Yeah, to say, I mean a very good point. Winston, let's let's let you close you're going to deliver the message the Port Parole here today. You're going to try to clear clear up all the issues and and give good advice to anyone who watches this here in early June 2020. Well, you know, like when I first started, have a lot of aloha for each other. We're not out of the woods. Our economy has collapsed in Hawaii, we're 40% unemployment over restarting again. This is not going to be an easy road back. The seniors in your life, the Kapuna they still need for you to go to the Longs and Safeway Forum, you need to go check on your neighbors, you need to be a human. You need to step up in all ways that you can take care of yourself first. And when you go out, take care of others, but take care of yourself, take care of your mental, physical, emotional, spiritual health as best as you can, or you're not going to be able to help others. Yeah, there it is. I mean, when you come down to it, our survival is based on our survival as a community and statewide community or national community for that matter of planetary communities based on the notion of caring for the other person. Let's all care for each other. If we can do that, we can, we can survive. Well, thank you very much. Stephanie, Cynthia Winston, always a great discussion.