 Alright, let's get going. Welcome everybody to another Logic Live. My name is Andy and I can't believe this is our 20th episode already, which is absolutely magnificent. I want to thank everybody for being so supportive of this and everybody who volunteered to be a guest on Logic Live and who just wanted to share knowledge that they had with the community. Honestly, it's my favorite part of being a Flame Artist is that community of fellow Flame Artists and how we all look out for each other and are willing to share knowledge. And I think sharing knowledge and looking out for each other has really never been more perfectly exemplified than in what we're going to do today. For today's episode, we're going to do Building and Running Your Flame Business at Home, part one of two with Renee Tim. Renee and Randy McInty reached out to me and said they had this great idea. And with everybody working from home and so many people asking on Logic and asking them directly, you know, hey, I'm either like, what do I buy or how do I do billing or how do I run a business? You know, so many people because of COVID have been thrust into this new way of working and can't think of a better way, couldn't think of a better way to, or a better topic to discuss than this one. So I really do want to thank them. And just a great example of if there's anything that you'd like to know more about or see discussed anything you think is important or relevant. Definitely let me know and we'll incorporate it into another future Logic Live. Before we get started with the slides, I just want to remind everybody please set your chat to all panelists and attendees. And if you have any questions, put them in the Q&A panel and that way we can keep track of the questions to make sure that they all get answered. This episode of Logic Live is brought to you by Cinesis Oceana. This is the 28th episode. And so for like most of the 20 episodes, I've told you how Cinesis is my own personal or our own personal reseller. Well, on Thursday, I went into the city into our office for the first time since the lockdown. And I went in to get some personal items out of my office, but also I think I worked there for the day. And I got to tell you like it was amazing. I'm going to stop the share again just so I can say this to camera. You know, like the studio, our studio like everybody's has always been like this, this like living, breathing, vibrant kind of exciting place where there's people and it's collaborative and it wasn't. It was like, it was just empty, you know, and it was definitely sad. But what I really appreciated more anything else were our sysadmins who go in there, you know, if not every day, then a couple days a week. One of them was there when I was there and these are the people who make the remote work possible. And I zoom chatted with them, you know, a million times since the lockdown. I've called them, I've talked to them, but I'd never stood six feet apart and had an opportunity to thank them. And so I just want to thank every sysadmin and every IT person who has been going in so the rest of us can stay home. And while I was there, I want to segue here because we blissfully have, we're busy at lively and we just had to get a rental flame. And in order to accommodate and the folks that sentences got us one the next day, I think we let them go on Friday last Friday and it was there. I think it was actually there that Friday and it was up and running on Monday. And, you know, it's as you as we as this working remotely thing has, you know, is ain't going away. And having the right people there to support you from a technical perspective is just invaluable. So just want to give a shout out as I have every week to sentences for, you know, for sponsoring this but also for, you know, for being there for the community and in our case getting us what we need so we can keep, we can keep working. With that, I want to ask Renee to join us. Renee Tim is an independent and Emmy award winning independent flame artist. She started her career in LA and spent 25 years there and now resides in Michigan. And I had the chance to meet her I think we met twice Renee. Right. We met once in New York, but then last year I presented at the Chicago user group and and you were there. Which was great because you were in the front row with Kristen Richardson heckling. And there's which is great there's there's really no no better way to begin a presentation, especially one on Python scripting with you know, then to then to be heckled from the front row so I took me right back to high school and oh there you are hey Renee. Hello. How are you. Good. How are you doing. I'm doing good. I got my I got my sign. I got my I got my plasma wall and as as Eva pointed out on logic. The you know the legendary flame throw pillows that I wouldn't say I was stolen from the NAB suite. I would say it was more like preserved, you know, like a treasure, you know for all to enjoy, you know that's my I mean that's my Absolutely. Yes, thank you, Quinn. I liberated the pillow. Thank you. Yes, it's absolutely right. Yeah. Oh man. All right, hold on. I'm just going to cross Quinn off my Christmas list here. So Renee, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself and and what you want to talk about today. Hi, everybody. Thanks for joining us. I'm going to hopefully give you some helpful tips on how to build your flame business at home. I have been in the industry for 25 years, and I am an independent artist under my company digital banshee. I have completed work on 40 feature films, hundreds of commercials. And I've worked with dozens of teams at post houses from LA to New York and Detroit and Amsterdam. And I was working with the team and iron cloud when I earned my Emmy for the NBC Sunday night football show open with faith Hill. And originally I'm originally from the Bay Area from San Francisco Bay Area and I built my career. Yeah, the accent now. Yeah. However, since I was in LA for so many years I was there for 25 years. I never really felt at home there. And so I wanted to be somewhere with seasons and trees. So we, in February of 2019, my husband and I moved to his home state of Michigan. And I've been working from home since arriving here, working either directly with ad agencies or an extent as an extension of post house. So if you want to know more, my website is digital banshee.com. Oh, that's a little bit about me. I mean, you may touch on this as we as we go through the session here but was it scary at all nerve wracking. Um, I think the thing that people think of when you move is that oh it's so cold like that I get that so much when I left LA everyone's like, Oh, you're gonna be so cold. Okay, look, I don't know anybody in Michigan. We don't have any family here anymore. I needed to completely reestablish myself with my network with doctors and and you know where to shop for groceries and just reestablishing every single thing. I mean, after you're in one place for many years you have your system of doing things and getting places and out here I'm like, Oh my God, you drive 75 miles an hour all day long. No problem. I had to get used to actually traveling at that speed. But like, I mean, scary, I guess going into the unknown is always an adventure. I wouldn't say was scary because I was really, I was really ready to leave LA. I was ready to leave. So I have my network of trusted contacts that I built after working for so long. And I'm really grateful because those people are still continuing to support me remotely. And I'm also continuing to grow my network, which is pretty amazing that whatever I'm doing works in a remote format because I've actually gotten more work from new contacts than I have from my original one. So not to say that my original people are not supporting me still awesome, but like it's growing, it's still growing. So it's totally possible. That's always the biggest concern, you know, that's always the biggest concern, especially, you know, when you when you go out on your own, whether you move or stay in the same market is like, you know, you have these contacts and then you know if you're not constantly trying to find new ones. You're always running under the risk that what if the situation changes what if they go out of business or they find a new vendor. So that's what they do. You have to stay humble. Everything's always changing. So yeah, I'll definitely touch on that. Okay. Well, let's get underway. I know, you know, one of the things that's always, I guess, good to keep in mind when when when having a conversation like this is that some of the specific solutions that you found work very well for you, but given, but for others, you know, given their their location in the world or their own, you know, the market that they happen to be in, they may need to find something unique to that market. I just wanted to throw that out there as like as the as our own personal safe harbor statement. Wow, 20 episodes we've reached the point of needing a safe harbor statement I guess that's a milestone. Yes, definitely. This is this will bring me to my my first slide here. By the time COVID hit I had already got a work year of work remote under my belt, and I had time to sort out some of the kinks. So this is not one size fits all. This is just my experience. And hopefully some of the things that I discovered that work for me will be helpful for others, but you're right, it's going to depend on your market. It's going to depend on your experience and the type of work that you do. I mean, it's all you just have to kind of take what works for you and ignore what doesn't and and make it your own. Got it. You want to go ahead and share your screened. Oh, um, yes. Are you not seeing this? I had to cancel the share so I could show my slideshow. Wow. Welcome to zoom. Thank you. Let's see. I'll get there eventually. Share your screen. This episode is brought to you by Let me play my, oh, there we go. I was going to say otherwise I'll fire up my inspirational music. Hey, there we go. Kudos for being on brand with the, with the, with the color scheme and the font. So thank you. Thank you. So there's my, my quick, my quick business card digital fancy. Um, so some assembly required. So the first thing you're going to want to do to set up your shop at home. First thing I did was hire an accountant because I think this is one of the most key professionals that you're going to hire. I don't have the time or the knowledge to deal with taxes and figuring out all those things. Like, uh, you know, here we've got to do, maybe some people in some states have to do estimated payments or what not, depending on how they form things. So I was happy to handle, to hand this over to someone else, a professional to handle it correctly. Um, for many years when I first started, I had done a DBA. That was what was what my accountant at the time had told me to do. And then I was like, okay, I started to ask questions and I realized a lot of my colleagues were, were doing S corporations. And so as soon as I got a new accountant, that was one of the first things that they told me to do. So I got an S corp and I felt bonafide. So there you go form a corporation. Um, I think another benefit to doing an S corp is a lot of companies that I was beginning to work for were not wanting to hire people that didn't have a corporation. They didn't want to hire you as a freelancer. So they felt more comfortable having a business to business relationship. So I got that sorted out. And I think things went a lot smoother after that. The next thing I did was open a business bank account so that you can get paid easier. And you can also get a business credit card so that you can put your business expenses on it. And one of the most recent things I've done and these things all come like everything I've done has just come from a moment of running up into a thing and being like, oh, well, you want this now? Okay, we've got to add this in. So the next thing and most recent thing I got was liability insurance. And I hadn't really heard of needing that until a few years ago. And I was on a job and somebody was like, okay, you're, you're all buttoned up. You've got your S corp. You've got this that the other, but do you have liability insurance? And so I like quickly looked into that and I talked to my accountant and a couple of other people and I found a place and got some and it's super easy, but I feel much better having that now. So if you get an accountant, ask them where you can get liability insurance. I've got mine through a place called Hiscox, but there's like, you know, your mileage may vary on that. So it's so true. It's like these are so many things that you don't, that you don't know about that you're not aware of either like just out of innocence or ignorance, you know, and I'm, I've, we've all heard horror stories, you know, of people who, what was it? What is it E and O insurance, you know, I forget what the E stands for, but something in omissions, you know, you accidentally leave, you leave out a legal super or something and then all of a sudden you're on the hook. Errors and omissions. Errors and omissions. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. And even from the, the corporation standpoint, or, you know, the, the point of having a corporation is God forbid something goes awry, you know, goes wrong. My dad was a lawyer, so he was constantly pointing out like, it was like that little, that book of like worst case scenarios was written as like dedicated to my dad, you know. So, but yeah, in case God forbid something happens, the corporation is liable and not you personally. And then there are also tax benefits that your accountant can explain, you know, in terms of, you know, the equipment you need to buy and things like that and write offs and depreciations. It's a whole universe of it is terminologies right. Yeah, it really is. I mean, you really open up a whole new world when you've got your, your accountant to help you keep track of all keep track of all of the stuff. I mean, it just, it's a, it's a rabbit hole. It's a rabbit hole of the business expenses. So, yeah. So that brings me to my next slide is marketing yourself is another big part of running your business. And one of the things that I did early on was I thought of the business name. You don't need to do that. A lot of people just use their name. But I wanted to have kind of a brand. So I made digital banshee and I made a logo. I did not make a logo. I hired a friend of mine who was a designer to make a logo. And then I made my real. I have business cards. I'm a big fan of business cards. I know that the age of business cards might be over, but I don't think so because I'm always handing them out. I always have them on me. I always find a reason to hand someone a business card because you never know where your next job is going to come from. And it could be from outside your industry. And people always love have having it in their hand. It's just, it's a fun thing, physical thing to have. I also think that having your LinkedIn profile up to date with and and with a good photo is really helpful. I get a lot of work on LinkedIn. And I think that a lot of people maybe don't know how to use it or aren't using it properly. And I don't have a pro account. So, you don't need one. But I mean, you can get one. They really want you to have one. Sure. I get an email from them every day telling me that. I know. Every time I'm on there. I'm the perfect candidate for one. Yeah. But just to have a good, good clear photo, a brief biography, you know, keep it short. People have a short attention span. Half of you are probably tuned out already. List your companies separately because LinkedIn will do the work for you and network and connect you to other people that work with those companies. I see a lot of people putting in their bio all the companies they work for. That's a waste of your time. It doesn't do you any good. Nobody's reading that and it's not connecting you. List your companies separately. Reach out and get endorsements from your colleagues. LinkedIn will do that for you. LinkedIn will ask people to endorse somebody if they're landing on your page. I don't know if you ever noticed that when you're on someone else's page. So, it helps. It kind of helps you get that networking going. That's great advice. And 100% I mean, again, like work the system the way it's designed to for your page. Exactly. Don't mind it. I'm a big fan of websites. I use Squarespace and I think it's a really important thing to have your website with your real on the main page. Because honestly, the only reason people are going to your website is so they can see your real and your contact information. Don't make people scroll through all the photos of all the postage stamps of all the things that they don't even know what they're looking at. I can't tell you how many websites I've been on where I'm like just it's a sea of postage stamps of stills. I'm like, yes, it's really pretty, but I can't even I didn't know whose website I want anymore. Like their name is not there. Their contact information isn't there. It's just a sea of images. So, land on your real, have the contact information easy to find. And don't make people wait for like if it's really heavy to load or it's complicated, they're going to leave. So, and make it mobile friendly, like make the layout mobile friendly, because a lot of people are doing this on their phone. So Squarespace does that for you automatically, but I'm sure a lot of places will just it will automatically build one for you. Yeah, attention span is a huge thing. I mean, I can tell you I haven't been freelance for a very long time, but as the person on the other side who is reviewing the reels. If I can't. Yeah, you know, if it's not crystal clear who I'm who I'm who I'm looking at and and and what the work is if I have to if I have to do work. I'm just going to move on to the next one. Unfortunately, it's totally true. Like I've been looking at other people's websites. You know, when I'm freelance, I'm always looking at other people's websites. And if I have to wait for it to load still, or if it's super out of date, I'm just I'm over it. I just I'm sorry. Yeah. Um, okay, so one of the ways that I job hunt is I'm always always networking. I am networking with the people that I'm doing my house refinance with. I'm, you know, someone that you know that's not in this industry always has a brag of someone who's in the industry and they want to talk about it. So you're always networking, at least I'm finding that here. It's so funny. They're like, oh, yeah, sister was in this episode of such and such. So you just that's another opportunity to have your business card because they want to see your website. I mean, you never know what help you might be able to give or, you know, fun networking thing. And if nothing else, it's just a human connection that you can make. Um, which brings me to my next point is nurture your connections, because they're only going to remain in contact intact if you check in. So check in, say hello, even especially if it's not to show your latest work. So be personal. And the more you're on people's minds on a regular basis, the more likely you're going to get picked for that next job. Because if you were just in contact with someone, I can't tell you how many times I've reached out to someone that I haven't talked to in a couple of months. And then like a few days later, they've got a job suddenly and they are asking me if I'm available. It happens all the time. Just circle back around and talk to your people. Just keep stirring the pot. I send emails to I got a question for you. How and if and if you if we're going to touch on this later in the presentation that we can totally wait but how do you make the time, because I find that being a flame artist. Many times is like an all encompassing job, like you forget to get up and go to the bathroom sometimes, you know, I mean just because you're, you're so under the gun. How do you make the time to do these things to stay on top of your bookkeeping to stay in touch with your clients. That's a great question. You're secret for that. So I don't think there's a such thing as making time for anything. How do you make time for your kids. You don't make time you prioritize it. So you just have to bounce around between what you feel is important in that moment. And it's got to be sort of like going on a diet. You don't go on a diet and then stop. You just eat better. So networking is part of my personality. It's part of my lifestyle. It's part of what I do all the time. I'm just always networking. So maybe that's just my special gift, but I think it's really important. You really always need to be talking to people. You just just send an email, pick up the phone, text somebody, you know, I've got a new puppy. I don't know how I'd have time to do anything right now. Like literally my alarms are going off constantly of the puppy outside. Feed the puppy. Train the puppy. I mean, it's just I'm sure you people with kids. It's the same thing. You just have to, you just have to like, you know, five minutes while that's happening. Or if I've got a minute here or there, I'm writing a postcard to a friend. I've got a stack of postcards here. So like if you have a minute, do a thing. So it's just sort of you just find a, find a minute to squeeze it in here and there. And it just, it just has to become part of your lifestyle. That's what I was going to say. It has to become part of your lifestyle completely. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's, it's probably one of the most important things that I do is I'm always networking because networking is not just a professional thing. It's a personal thing. It's a human thing. It's, you know, we're all out here doing this and whether or not we're working for a job together, we need to be in contact with other people. So, you know, reach out to your people. Um, and, and I important that you don't always make it about a job because it's kind of annoying when someone reaches out all of the time saying, this is what I've been up to now. This is what I've been up to now. It's like, I kind of just check out. I don't necessarily want to hear that, but maybe I want to hear about what's going on in your life. Or maybe a short hello, just like, Hey, that way you don't feel obligated to respond, but you're, you've just pinged them and now you're on your mind. So just remove the obligation out of the contact, but just be ever present. Um, I think that's super. I mean, that's so important. And, uh, it was fine. Like Joanne and the chat here just asked, what about us introverts and, um, I'm an extroverted introvert in case you can't tell. I'm, you know, but, uh, I find like, I have such a difficult time asking my clients for work. Um, so I don't do it. I talked to them about my life. I do exactly what you described. I just reach out and talk to them. They already know what I do for a living. Yes. Yes. My services, they certainly will reach out. So I just removed that from the equation and then it's not awkward anymore. Exactly. You've just said exactly that. That's exactly the thing. People are hiring you because they know you and they know your work. And if they don't know you and they don't know your work because you're new and that's fine, just be a, be a human being that, that is engaging. And I don't know how to tell people how to be engaging. I'm doing the best I can here. Um, just be, just be normal. Be more normal. Damn it. Be engaging. Yeah. So, um, hopefully that's all right. That's good. No. In the chat, they're saying great advice. Yeah. Okay. Good. Um, but, you know, I sent, I'm always sending, sending emails to producers or heads of production or recruiters. Um, but you're right. People move around all the time. You said earlier, people move around all the time. That's another reason you always have to be in touch because if you're out of touch for four months, that company just shut down and everybody's a different company. It's like bands always getting back together and the drummer's over here and the singer's over there and you're like, ah, it's a new band. So you always need to be reaching out and keeping tabs on who's where. And that's why I find LinkedIn super helpful for those of you who would please keep your LinkedIn up profile updated. Um, but on the same note, don't wear yourself out just reaching out to people because that can quickly flip over and backfire on yourself if you're not hearing back from people. Like if you're only like looking for work, you're going to maybe feel discouraged because you're always looking and no one's ever returning your calls. So in that sense, I'm going to use a little reverse psychology on you, reach out to the people who do respond to you every once in a while. Like you know that there are people in your world who you're going to hear back from professional colleagues, friends. So make sure you're touching in staying in touch and nurturing the contacts of the people that are giving you good feedback. Just like you, everybody's always heard surround yourself with the people who are supportive. Do that. Even if it's not a professional contact, I think it's really important, especially right now that we stand contact with people. Someday, when things are open again, you'll be able to do this, but between bookings, I would always take lunches, go to coffee, go on dog walks, you know, do that kind of thing just to kind of have that human connection. Maybe you can still do that if you do like a remote, like if you're in the same town as someone like right now, I'm all remote, like all of my clients are in LA or New York or Chicago or whatever. But like, if you're in the same town with some of the people that you're working with, flames or producer people, just maybe see if you can go on a walk with them or something. Get outside. Nice. Yeah. Okay. Right. Next, the next topic on this. Oh, something, another tip I did was meet and greets. Meet and greet. So something I did for many years and I still try to do it. I did it when I first moved to Michigan is I would reach out to a facility for a studio tour. And my goal was to get inside as many studios as I possibly could around the world and just see what it was like. So if we were on a trip somewhere, I would reach out to a colleague of mine in that place and ask them if they would give me a tour of where they worked. And what was really great is it gives you an opportunity to see the space, which is always fine to see another post house, I think. It lets you see how other people work. It's, it's another opportunity to make a connection. Like a lot of times I would be in a facility and I would see somebody else that I knew that worked there. And then whether or not I knew the person giving me the tour, the person that I knew that worked there would be like, oh, here I am. And then the person that's giving the tour was like, oh, you know someone. And then it seals the connection. So it makes you a more cloud. It makes you a more trusted person to call if they have someone that they need to do work. You're suddenly part of the team because someone who was there knows you. So it also makes you appreciate what you've got. Maybe you don't like where you work or maybe you do, but then you see the way other people working and you're like, oh, I do have it pretty good. So it just, it helps you balance, balance your world a little bit. That's great. That's great advice. Okay. So now you're going to wear all the hats. This is running your business. So you're going to incur all the responsibilities of a post house. And your time is spent dealing with all the things in addition to the work that you're hired to do. So your day is inherently much longer than you think it's going to be. You're doing much more than just doing the shots. So you're a producer. That means you're finding the work, booking the work, managing your holds, getting yourself lunch. I highly recommend that you make a booking confirmation. This is something that I've done since the very beginning of being a freelancer. I have a piece of paper that I've developed over many trial and failure and things are messing up. Okay. Add another line in. Oh, they did this. Add another line in. And pretty soon you've got a booking confirmation. You want to have a conversation in writing that everybody agrees to before the work is started. So in that booking confirmation, you're going to want to set the expectations and the job, which includes the dates of your booking, your rate, your delivery schedule, the payment terms, a kill fee, the contact information for you. And for each infringement, you add another phrase. So I have one of these. Yeah, it starts out with just high. Yeah. So yeah, it's every frustration gets a new line. Pretty soon you've got a book. You know what's great though is like for anybody who thinks that that might be like pretentious or off-putting or whatever. No, it's not. Because your relationship with the studio is a business relationship. And this takes all of that out of the equate. Like now you, you don't have a producer Renee who can be the bad cop or can have the awkward conversations or whatever. So you can just be the artist who, you know, makes people laugh and makes great images. It's all in writing. You know, if they need to do a kill fee, there it is. You know, the, um, you won't have to have that awkward conversation at six going, well, hey, um, uh, do you charge overtime after so many hours? You know, like it, it's all laid out ahead of time. Everybody agrees to it. Let's get down to the work. Yeah. You're your own, you're your own advocate. So I highly recommend that you make a booking confirmation. I've also made a sample, which is the other thing besides adding another line for an infringement. I've realized that nobody actually reads these. So you need to make a sample, put sample on it and provide it as soon as they put you on hold. So they have every opportunity to read it and ask questions. And then right before we book, I have the ones with the date filled out and then I email it to them, the person who booked me when I say them, and I have to tell them to read it because if they haven't signed it, they haven't read it. And I can't tell you how many times I've started a job. And I've actually had to go in the building and print it out and put the pen in front of the producer and be like, do the right thing, sign the paper because I'm not working till the paper signed. Um, because there's been also situations where they think that the day that the job starts is the moment that it's time to discuss the rate. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, we're booked. This is rolling. And I've already turned away work. This is not the time to have that discussion. So you want clear boundaries and everybody on the same page before you start the work. So you really, you have to chase people down. I mean, it's usually only the first time you work with a client. I do that. So you're also the IT person. So for the IT people, um, you're maintaining hardware, you're purchasing your software, you're licensing your internet connection disc storage file, IO security protocols, backups and archives, furniture. So for the IT, um, you're the billing department. Um, I, I recommend getting some tracking software to track your application. So you're obviously, I recommend getting some tracking software to track your hours and invoice clients and create reports for your CPA, track your business expenses, do your banking, your taxes. So there's a lot of software out there that can help you, Quicken, QuickBooks, Zoho. But yeah. And I think that the same advice you gave before applies that like you can't decide to make time for these things. You have to just incorporate them into your day. Otherwise, you're going to end up at like the two days before Christmas, trying to enter in a year's worth of, oh, that's a knowing laugh, trying to enter in like a year's worth of expenses or reconcile a year's worth of bank statements. Because where you happen to live, you have to file your taxes or your, I forget what they're called. You're assuming. Estimated taxes. Estimated. Thank you. Estimated taxes. I don't know anything about that. I don't hear what. No, no, no, no, no. Yeah, you, you were all hats and keep in mind that when you're on the job, you also have to hire all your friends. So if you're hiring freelancers, you're right back to producing. You're hiring people, you're negotiating rates. You also want to talk about how much extra you're taking to manage them. You're preparing shots for them, uploading and downloading for them, supervising the work, checking in, providing feedback, doing quality control, tracking their hours, invoicing, 1099, paying them. Oh, oh, oh, and you're the artist. Oh, and by the way, yeah, remember that project and the reason why you are hired. So at some point, you've got to do your job. Yeah. So yeah, all hats. Well, I think it's like you mentioned to me during the run through that, you know, like, uh, uh, hire help, you know, you don't have to do all these things on your own, especially if, you know, you, like, if you're overwhelmed, sometimes if, you know, if you're overwhelmed, fine, you know, what about that? What about hiring? Highly recommended. Look at that. Oh, look at that. This is a very important slide. All those things that I just like spewed at you, like with the lists that was on and on, like a Christmas list, um, you don't have to do all of that. And I don't recommend that you do all of that. Hire help, hire a designer to make your logo, hire a sysadmin to do your sysadmini things, um, hire a producer. They work freelance. They will freelance just for a day if you need them to. And I recommend that you get a relationship with someone so that you don't scramble at the last minute on a job that's totally gotten out of control and then try and find and hire a producer, find one, network with one right now. Um, if you're not able to deal with your finances, hire an accountant, um, hire a web designer. And remember, all of these things are business expenses. So keep track of that. So now this is, this is a big, this is a big one, um, managing your money, speaking of keeping track of your expenses. It just got very quiet here in the logical studio. Nobody likes to talk about this part as we all, everybody's going, oh, yeah. I'm going to talk about it. I'm looking at a pile of, there's a big pink elephant right in the front of the room. Yep. So one of the things that you're going to want to do right away is set your rate and rates are going to vary wildly based on your market and your experience. And by experience, I mean not just your flame experience, but also your ability to negotiate. People aren't always paid what they're worth. So you need to think about your value and what you're worth. I have one rate. I've decided what my time and my expertise is worth and I charge for it. And I give myself raises. I will send an email in advance so that my clients do to my regulars so that they're not surprised by it. But I will give myself raises over the years and some people, very few people will be like, can you do one more job at this rate or something? But mostly nobody says anything. They're like, all right. So either I wasn't charging enough or they understand that this is, you know, the value, but I haven't had any problems doing that. I also am in the camp of charge more to work from home. And I know that this is a, a seesaw that different people have an opinion on, but I think you should absolutely charge more to work from home because my rate, my remote rate just has a line item for a machine rental. Cause onsite, you're using their software, their hardware, their electricity, their storage, their internet, their air conditioning, their craft services. Like there's a lot of stuff you get working online on onsite. And you're you have to cover all that at home. Yeah, totally. Yeah, you, your client should cover those costs. Yes, this comes up weekly, I think in logic, there's always someone who asks like, Hey, do I charge more if, you know, and I, if I'm working from home, do I charge more if I have my own machine? Do I charge more if I, and, uh, yes, you know, it's, it's interesting. It's fascinating to me to see what people, uh, how people respond. I mean, there are some people who say that they charge less to use their machine at home, you know, I was, Renee, how do you feel about that? Um, but you know what's interesting is like I, um, I first, uh, became a freelancer, uh, first time I went freelance, uh, on flame was in 1997 or 1998. Um, and the going rate for a freelancer in New York at the time was $100 an hour. And 22 years later, the going rate for a freelancer in New York is about $100 an hour. If you say it's about the same, right? Yeah. And, um, I think, yeah, you know, like everything else kind of went up, uh, in 22 years. You know, so it, it's, um, I think you make such an amazing point. And I think if it's, you know, like, uh, I think, I think sometimes what's lost is the, uh, is the fundamental understanding between like you and your client. It's a business relationship, you know, just like when you go to a store or a car dealership or anything, you're trying to get the best price. Well, so is the person who's hiring you. They're trying to get the best price. And if they can, you know, intimidate you down, they will, and they're going to be really proud of themselves. And they'll go tell their boss and their boss will pat them on the head and that'll be great, you know. So if, if you don't stand up for yourself, if you don't set your rate, if you don't stick with it, um, yes, the fear is always there that, well, there's somebody who's going to undercut me. Well, there's always going to be somebody who's going to undercut you. So be better than them. You know, be more valuable than that person. Because at the end of the day, I mean, it's not, it, the money, it's your money, you know, and it's not that much. If the difference is, is $10 an hour over, you know, a 40 hour week. You know what I mean? Like it's important for you. Stick up for yourself, you know, and stick by your rate. Everybody's experience is going to, is going to vary wildly on this. I mean, the client, the person, the, the market, all of this. But what I found from my experience is the more I raised my rate, the more I cut the fat and got the clients out of the way that I didn't want to work with. And magically the clients that I did want to work with, the better jobs, the better market, I was connected to that because I was charging more. It's crazy, but it's like you charge more, you get more for your money on your side too. Like you just, you get better clients. I mean, you don't want to work with Sheepskates. You don't want those jobs. And yeah. So, and I also found that clients found a line item for machine rental more digestible than charging an hourly rate. That was actually recommended to me by one of my clients. You know, they knew my rate already because I had worked for them on site. And I was like, so remote. And he's like, well, this is what we usually pay for a flame rental. So if you charged us that, then I'm like, okay, sweet. So Ingo, I was just going to say that, like I said in my intro there, we have a rental at the office right now. I know what that costs me, you know, and I know what that means to bring a freelancer in. I, that's, that's, and there's a cost I have to incur. If that's your answer. Yeah, yeah, yeah, don't give everybody, don't be giving your clients handouts. There's other ways you can make amends. You know, you can give them more of something, but, but don't give them. Don't cheat yourself out of, out of things that you're paying for. Yep. Like you should not have to pay for those things and not have it reimbursed. So, yeah, that's really good advice. That's such good advice is that, you know, don't budge in the rate. There are other ways that you can, you can, you know, do right by your customer or do right by your client, you know, yeah. Yeah, before we jump ahead, there, there are a couple of questions that some, some attendees wanted to ask and they're related to this. I had, but you're both from Todd and from Joe Jinder. Do you take projects on an hourly basis? Or do you suggest taking, or do you, or what do you suggest when kind of written a little, I think what, what they're asking is, you know, do you work on an hourly basis or a project basis? Is the one you prefer over another? And what is your advice on clients who always say, oh, you know, we have a very tight budget? Well, I do both. Depends on the client, depends on the job. I do have a day rate. If I'm involved in the bid and running the job, I will offer a day rate because I can control how many days that job's going to go. And my day rate encompasses the equivalent of my hourly rate plus a machine fee, plus an overhead for running the job. Hello, producer. It also assumes that I'm working an eight to 10 hour day. So I take this into consideration when I'm bidding that job. If it's a client that I know how they work. And I know how the job usually go. I'll give them a day rate because I, again, I have a little more control over how they work and whatever. So I, there are some clients I will do a day rate for. I also have done flat rates for jobs because I've bid the job. And I'm like, all right, I think it's going to take this many days. And this is the, this is the, this is the job cost. And then I say there's going to be overages if anything changes. And, you know, we've got to manage that. And then in terms of, oh, we have a tight budget. You ask them what are all the deliverables, like what is expected? Get the scope of the job and see if there's any place that you can do less. Or if they just say tight budget, have them give you the number of the budget. Say, what are you willing to do? Make them say the number first. And then if they say a number, you can be like, all right, for that cost. I'm willing to do X, Y and Z. Like a lot of times when you get a job and you've got cleanup, the client always has a huge laundry list of like, well, here's 85 things I want to do on the job. Oh, and we've got two days. So when you get done laughing, you come back to them and you're like, okay, we can do 12 of those 85 things in two days. I mean, realistically, you're not going to do them anyway, no matter how much money you have, unless you hire eight people. So there's always ways to like cut back what you're willing to do. If they want to pay you less, you give them less, but you don't know how much less to give them unless you have all the information and you can't negotiate fairly if you don't have all the information. So try to get as much information out of them as you can so that you can decide where to, where to negotiate. But that all comes to back back to how well you can negotiate. And that's just going to come with time. Yep. Totally. I like to tell people, clients who say that you don't have a money problem. We don't have a money problem. We have a physics problem. Exactly. You want to do 200 hours worth of work in 20 hours. So yeah. Yeah. I mean, say yes to the job, just do less. Do you got other jobs? Bingo. All right. Thanks for answering that. So after setting your rate, what's the next, the next thing to keep in mind or to keep in mind, you've got to work on your, you've got a overtime as well as setting your rate. I charge time and a half after eight hours and double time after 12. And I do a Saturday, Sunday versus a sixth and seventh day rate. I know that it's common for people to do six and seventh day, but my weekends are precious and I want to ensure that I'm fairly compensated for giving them up because sometimes like I've been booked on Friday after I've already worked the whole week somewhere else. And they want me to work the weekend. So I want to be compensated. So that's too many days in a row. So say yes to the job and then you say, this is my weekend rate. And most people honestly, they're like, yeah, fine, whatever. I'll do it because if they're, if they're working the weekend, they're in a, they're in a panic mode too. Yeah, they're just happy to have somebody. Exactly. So you give them your weekend rate. Um, and you want to be careful that you don't surprise clients with money. You always discuss it in advance. Um, over time, weekend time, whatever, uh, and you put it on your book in confirmation, even if they don't read it. So, uh, yeah. So next, next is how to get paid and paid and paid. So you want to make it, we've reached to the 53rd minute of this episode of logic. Well, make it easy for people to give you money. That's the bottom line. Um, you want to make it easy for them to pay your invoice. So I offer, you can send me a check. You can ACH transfer, quick pay with Zell. Um, on your booking confirmation, you want to outline your terms of payment. If it's net 15, net 30, net 45, uh, it's, you're going to expect 45 days to be paid when I say net, I mean, how many days it takes to get paid. You can outline this, but they won't read it. And you're going to have 15 days later and then the billing department's going to get back to you and go, oh yeah, we're net 45. And it's like, okay, so nobody put it on there anyway. Totally. Um, I'm sure that your, if your client requires a purchase order number or a job number, some information, you know, they'll give you the, those specs, you know, just like delivery specs, you know, of what you need to get paid. Yeah, totally. And sometimes on the jobs, on the bigger jobs, I'll take a deposit, like a third or a half deposit down before I start. Um, it did not all of them, but some of them I do that. Um, and be prepared to chase down late, late payments. It's not common, but it's good to prepare for because you're going to inevitably get in a conversation where you're going to have to deal with uncomfortable conversations and all the excuses. So I have a letter ready to go and a system for handling them. So make sure when you have your booking confirmation set up that you get contact information then for the person who you need to contact for payment in the billing department and the executive producer on the job. And whoever else you think you might need to loop into in case they aren't paying you. So just think about the worst case scenario upon booking the job because trying to hunt those people down after you're not being paid is really hard. Totally. And then you want to manage your cash. So I know it's really hard to do right now because things are crazy and people are eating by, but try and have savings for three months for a rainy day or a pandemic reduce your client who, who, who agreed to net 15 and pays you in 90 days, you know. Yeah. Yeah. It's seriously, I mean, I've had people that paid six months later. It's it, it can be not fun. Um, try to, um, reduce your expenses. And the way I do that is I, part of my secret is I don't have subscriptions when I'm not booked. I'm not paying for things. So look at all your subscriptions and see if there's anything that's like a free alternative or a pay on demand or a pay use, pay once and use forever kind of thing. So for instance, I have a pay per bite transfer service rather than a monthly unlimited service. I use something called massive. It's massive.io. And I don't need to use it very often because 90% of the people that I work with provide me a wire drive or G suite products. So I don't really need to, but every once in a while I have a client going, how do I get these files to you? And so I can just send them a link to my wire drive and they can upload there or to my massive drive. Um, and then also photo, Photoshop, do you need it? Um, cause that's 10 bucks a month. I rarely used mine. So you can do that in software that you pay 50 bucks once instead of paying $10 for the rest of your life. Um, I also sleep or turn off my computer when I'm not using it because my Mac pro uses 300 Watts when it's idle. So that's a lot of energy. So when my game is off your credit card, does your credit card give you cash back? I have one that gives me 2%. So even if you're just using it to pay for your flame license, it's a discount. This, do you know if the Mac pro uses, maybe this is a question for Randy for next week, but do you know if the Mac raises less power? Uh, if you bought the $900 wheels, be honest. I'll ask Randy, they're laughing in the chat room right now. I can tell that's a question for Randy or my IT guy. Uh, yeah, but yeah, but just the bottom line is just start trying to stretch out your money as much as you can. Um, and I also, I just, as another thing, buy the best machine you can afford and use it for as long as possible. Cause my side station is a nine year old MacBook Air and it still works. So no problem. So after all that, now it's time to get to work. Woohoo. Woohoo. So somewhere in here, you're actually doing shots. Um, and not to keep, well, and by now you're doing tequila. Yeah. Uh, so you've got to deal with uploading and downloading files and managing your time for this and figuring out how long things are going to take for that. So you might want to make a spreadsheet to figure out your upload and download times cause saving bandwidth is saving time and you don't want to make people. You don't want to waste people's time making them download more than they need. So watch your file size, trim your handles, check your work before you give it to them. So you don't make an idiot out of yourself, making them download a blank file or the wrong file or a bad image. Um, and when you archive, compress it, it saves a lot of space, but I'm going to let Randy get into that. Um, you also need to schedule meetings for client feedback. There's a lot of waiting in this game. You thought you waited before on site. Oh my God, it can be days because you're out of sight. You're out of mind. So the client is doing what they're doing on their end. And you're like, um, hello, I've got other jobs coming. I need some feedback and your job is not moving along. So you're back to producing and chasing people down. So just they, they're going to forget about you if you're not constantly on it and the dates are going to shift on your project. Yeah, it's got to be extra complicated too. When you, uh, when you have clients in different time zones or just working on the world and yeah. Yeah, that's my next is like time zones is, you know, my clients are in LA. So that's a three hour time difference. And my day, I need to decide is my day shifted or is there a gap? Because if I get up and start my day at a normal time, I can have a really nice quiet morning jamming through shots, doing business work and all of that. But then I've got to pick up again and keep going when they want to have a review at six PM their time, which is nine PM my time. Your day gets really long. Um, so, but as part of that, you, you also want to be a responsible artist. So your work is really scrutinized right now. And it's tricky to get the job connection in the first place. So it's really important for repeat business to check your work, do a good job. Make sure that your work is in the right format, that your shot isn't blank, that you've given them, you know, same to same good frame length, the correct naming, you know, get a clear idea of what you're supposed to be giving them. And I just feel like right now that the quality matters over speed right now. Just don't be sloppy. Um, yeah, it's a five second shot. You're working on it. It takes five seconds to watch it, you know, like just watch it again. Watch it three times, take the full 15 seconds and watch it three times. You know, it's going to take you a second to just check it, yeah, check it before you wreck it. Oh, wow. Right now I'm down. I was looking, I was looking for a, for a new tattoo and I think that that's going to be perfect. So thank you. Check it out. Yeah. So, so, um, yeah, I was about to ask, we've, we've covered a lot Renee and it can seem a little overwhelming. What, uh, what advice do you have to, you know, to not burn out, to keep you fresh, keep yourself fresh and ready to slay the dragon again tomorrow. Yeah. Well, right now, I think this is the most important slide, especially right now because of the times we're living in. And I think it translates outside of your business. Um, as you can probably tell by now, working from home is no cake walk. I am so tired of people telling me, Oh, you work from home. That must be nice. I'm like, you have no idea. It requires so much discipline to maintain focus, have good boundaries, do good quality control, do time management to not end up working 12 hour days by accident. So I have a recipe for success in the self care department. Um, don't sit all day, consider a standing desk. Um, even you need to consider your, your ergonomics because the smallest thing out of whack can create issues over hours of sitting. Um, as a petite woman freelancer, I've sat in a lot of desks at a lot of companies over the years and they're all too tall. So I've had, I, I, I've sat on pillows, on phone books. I mean, I've had to make do. So you're at home and this is your livelihood. Invest in a good chair, get a good desk, make it the proper height for you and make it comfortable for you. Yeah. Water is life. Drink it, take a break. And this means getting your ass out of that comfortable chair and taking your eyeballs off the screen. You're going to get dry eyes and stiff hips and sore wrists and muscle cramps. And the more you're able to take a break from sitting, the less you're going to need all that special gear. You don't need gigas if you just take a break. Um, I use timers to remember to take a break. You can use your iPhone. You can use a kitchen timer. You can use your screaming children. Um, if you have mine, yeah, yeah. If you drink lots of water, your cat, your dog. And if you drink lots of water, not only does it keep you hydrated, but it makes you have to get up and pee, boom, instant break. Yes. It's nature's kitchen timer. Yes. Mealtime is a built-in break. You know, you're, you're right though. I never really appreciated it until I, I mean, I've now been working from home for five months and I can tell you, like, I get up in the morning and go for a walk down by the Hudson River, uh, for like an hour to an hour and a half before I start my day, otherwise I'll roll out of bed and, and like slide right into this chair and just be stuck here all day and, you know, look up and it's four o'clock and I haven't showered yet. And if I don't do that, it's like, like I appreciate the, the, like it made me appreciate the commute, not the being stuck in traffic part, but at least this was a chunk of time where I wasn't either like working or, you know, at doing or taking care of like obligations around the house, you know, or, or just at home in my home life. So it's true. I mean, yes, sometimes you're going to, you're going to get up in the job that, you know, went super late in the morning. You're going to have to get into it first thing in the morning. I mean, I've definitely woken up. I've definitely worked all nighters here. I mean, that hasn't stopped. But when I say take a break, I don't mean, I mean, it's great that you can take an hour and a half in the morning. That's super awesome. And I think that having a routine for working out is important. But it's taking a break means pretty soon it's been five hours and your ass has been in that chair. So set timers, set some timers so that you like, like breaks mean rhythm. They don't mean start and then don't, then sit all day. They mean like every few hours, get up and out of the chair, you know, like meal time is a break. Don't eat at your desk. That's a perfect opportunity to get, get up. It also puts keyboards in your, you know, crumbs in your keyboard. So, of course, but your desk at home is the most depressing thing. You know, it's depressing at the office, but at home, it's holy. Yeah. Um, and also bringing you back to your walk, weight-bearing exercises are actually really good for preventing risk injuries. Doing like a push-up pose or yoga, anything that puts weight on your wrists. You can prevent injury by doing that. Your repetitive stress injury, keeping your wrists strong. So, um, and then the last thing is managing your stress. Um, slow down, do less, do one thing at a time and do something every day that brings you joy. So, for me, I bake bread. You might have heard of it, tart in the kitchen. Um, my dogs, I have a new puppy. Um, I make time every evening to sit in my hammock. I set an alarm for it. It's like that important to me so that I step outside and even if it's two minutes, because sometimes it is just two minutes in a hammock. Um, I have a fika, like it's a little coffee drink with a, you know, just to get up and walk around. Um, talk to another human being, you know, pick up the phone, make a call, make a text, write a postcard. Um, just something that gets you out of the job for a second. Go chase your kids around. Just something that, that shakes you, gets you out of your chair, you know, steps you back from the canvas. It's, it's really important. So anyway, that's my talk. I hope you found that helpful. Um, two, two questions for you in the chat here. The first is from Suzanne who asks Renee, what is your rate for life coaching? I guess, do you, and do you have a weekend rate? Well, you've got my number. So call me, there you go. Always networking and always networking. Um, Todd here has a question, um, asking, you know, when the job is delivered, do you give your clients the flame archive perennial perennial question there? I have sure if they want it, I mean, I'll charge them for it. Mm hmm. Nothing's free. Perfect answer. Uh, would you consider sharing your booking confirmation form is a question that just came in or the same. All right. Yeah. Well, yeah, give, give it some thought. And if you're cool with it, just send it over and I'll post it with the yeah, cool. And, um, this was wonderful. Does anyone have any other questions for Renee? All right. Well, Renee, that was wonderful. Thank you so much. The everybody in the chat loves it. And I couldn't have, I couldn't have imagined like, or envisioned a better, a better chat. So this was great. Thank you very, very much. Um, I'm going to close this out with, uh, let me just throw in the chat for everybody real quick. Um, these are links for the next two, uh, episodes. So let me share my screen here. So next week we're going to do part two of, of our, uh, chat here of running your flame business at home. Uh, so that's going to be at 2pm with Randy McInty and we're going to cover the technical end and that's going to be followed by, uh, using flame with shotgun on August 16th. Another, um, recommendation, someone, uh, from logic or on logic reached out to me and said, Hey, you know, I'd love to see how a shotgun is used actually in production. So, uh, I think it's going to be great that we're going to be able to do that. And then, um, after August 16th, I'm going to be taking a couple of weeks off, um, and then logic live will resume in September with, uh, some, some hopefully some very exciting things that I'm, I've always have something, you know, uh, in the fire that I'm trying to, uh, trying to get going, uh, the logic podcast. There'll be a new episode out next week. So please, uh, subscribing your podcasting app of choice. And of course you can find this episode a little bit later today and all the past episodes of logic live on logic.tv as well as some other great content, uh, from logic. Please take a moment, uh, moment to subscribe to the YouTube channel. If, uh, if you haven't done so already. And of course, thanks as always to our friends at synocyst ocean for sponsoring logic live solutions, integration and support for digital content creators, uh, see, uh, find out everything that they have to offer as far as remote remote workflows goes at cynocyst.io. That's going to do it for logic live this week. Thank you so much. Renee and thank you everybody for tuning in. I'll see you next week.