 Welcome to Hawaii, the state of clean energy. I'm your host, Mitch Ewen. Our underwriter is the Hawaii Energy Policy Forum, which is a program under the Hawaii Natural Energy Institute. I'm very pleased to welcome our guest today, Megan Russell. She's a graduate assistant working for the Hawaii Energy Policy Forum. Megan, welcome to the show. Thanks, Mitch. Good to be here. Yeah, it's great to have you here. Our topic today is going to be the Hawaii Energy Policy Forum, funnily enough, under new management. Throughout its history, the forum has constantly strived to remain relevant and at the front edge of Hawaii's energy policy space and adjusted its programs to support Hawaii's evolving energy situation in all its many facets. HNEI has recently taken over the overall management of the forum and has a new leadership team. And as with all the leadership teams, they have new ideas and new initiatives going forward from 2022 and beyond, including broader membership, more outreach, and analytic-based policy development. So we're going to be talking story with Megan about the progress being made in this transition and some of the early results of interviews and past and potentially new stakeholders. Megan, tell us about the new program and how it's evolving. And let's have slide number one to help guide us through this. Perfect. So like you mentioned, Mitch, we've been restarted. We're under new management. Our principal investigator is Mark Glick. And then Dallas Igay and myself are the graduate assistants that are aiding in this effort to revitalize the forum. So our three energy transition focus areas are up on the screen as you can see. Number one, being the high penetration renewable analysis and planning. Number two is our energy transition policy and regulations. And then our third area here is white innovation initiative. And as we've been re-engaging our stakeholders, we've been sending them these three areas to get feedback on them, understand what the needs of our stakeholders are and using that to really be the driver for how the forum proceeds. So if we can... So I have a couple of questions on that. So one of the issues, not an issue, but one of the ideas we've had is, is there still an interest? Because we've had at least about a two-year delay or where we've gone basically out of business through the COVID changes in management, a whole variety of things. So what is in the reaction from, A, the existing stakeholders and new people? Is there still that same interest in having this kind of a forum in Hawaii? There really is. As we've talked to people, especially our previous stakeholders, we've gotten a really positive response. People are excited to come back and start discussing energy policy in this space again. I think the forum really provides a unique space for that discussion, for productive discussions on these difficult questions relating to energy. And especially with COVID-19, we saw a lot of changes that needed to be addressed. And we've seen a lot of, for lack of a better term, weak points in our system. And people are ready to jump in and engage and talk with us about that and create solutions to these problems. So is there any like overarching theme that you've been able to identify from? I mean, what is driving that interest? I think really what's driving the interest, I mean, overarching themes from our interviews, we've talked a lot about equity and we've also talked a lot about resource adequacy and inviting new people into this space. So one of the main changes that we've seen from the previous forum is broader membership opportunities. We're really opening up to more individuals, more organizations, all for the purpose of garnering these diverse voices that we have access to in the state. I think we're so lucky to live in a diverse space and we have such diverse energy needs that opening up the forum to more people will help us to get those viewpoints to create creative solutions and maybe think outside of the box a little bit more. Yeah, I've always thought that even from day one when I first joined the forum a zillion years ago one of the things that we lacked was maybe showing a balanced view of various policies. Like, okay, we were more supporting a given policy rather than presenting a more complete picture of the pros and cons of each proposal that went forward to the legislature. I've always thought that if I was a legislature, a legislator, I'd wanna know what the good things are and what the potential hooks are or unintended consequences are. And then I can make my own decision. I don't need somebody to tell me whether it's good or not. Just tell me why it's, what it fixes and what the potential downsides are. Can you comment on that? Of course. So, and some of the questions we've been getting as we've been re-engaging stakeholders. I think previously the forum played a big role in legislation, whether it was advocacy or other things. And as we've been re-engaging, we've been trying to navigate that space as well. I think what you just described, the giving kind of, this is a space for kind of more neutral analysis, being able to go through these proposed legislations and give input saying, here's what would be beneficial for these stakeholders. Here's what would not be. And providing our legislators with that opportunity to kind of have this maybe more of a neutral view on these bills that are being proposed in the upcoming legislative session. And I also understand from talking to Mark and also looking at your slides, which we'll put them up a little bit more of analytics involved. So that's not just opinion. And gee, I feel good about this. It's actually backing up opinions or these descriptions of a bill with a good data to show the legislator it's actually based on fact or has some scientific basis behind it. So it's just not an opinion poll. Precisely. So that's another thing you mentioned in your intro that the forum has been in this effort to stay relevant and part of that staying relevant is being a resource for people. So having these data analytics available, whether it be through our website or through legislative briefings or other things that people can go to and reference and use in their own investigation of these legislative efforts as well as broader efforts organized by us and other stakeholders in the state. So that brings me up to one of my other favorite little topics and you've had a heads up. Talk to us a little bit about our website. I found it personally because I'm not a really high tech computer person. I found it kind of difficult to use, but that's just me. Now, maybe other people thought it's great. What are the plans for our website? I mean, websites are so difficult to design and put them up as a heck of a lot of work. And previously we put a lot of effort in that website and had a lot of good intentions. What are your comments or what can you tell us about the website now? How is it gonna evolve? Of course. So for clarity, we had originally two kind of outlets. We had our forum and then we had our public facing website. And the forum was more interfacing for members and stakeholders. And I believe that's what you're referring to with the difficulty of navigation. But as we've kind of revived this forum following COVID, the initial hit, we've taken the form more in the direction of open membership, transparency, being available to whoever would like to be involved. And so as of now, we don't have plans to revitalize the forum. It's still under discussion, but we are kind of shifting our efforts more to that public spacing website. Like I said, having it be a repository of data and other resources that people might need so that when people want information on energy or legislative dealings in Hawaii, they can come to our website and have access to that information. So one other question, which you did get a heads up on, I'm gonna ask you about the forum governance. I mean, I know Mark is gonna run it as the PI and you guys are gonna be supporting him and I'll be supporting him too. But we had this structure in the forum where we had a steering group, where we had a chair of the steering group and then we had working groups. And it kind of acted like a board of directors to try to set the policy or set the tasks and the plan for the year and then sponsor various events and going forward. It was kind of how we got people involved to actually work in the forum. What's the plan or what's the thoughts? I mean, it may be too early to comment on it, but how is it gonna be structured going forward? What can you tell us today? Another great question. I think as of now, as we're re-engaging stakeholders, that's another thing we're still trying to navigate and we haven't landed anywhere specific on it. I think the idea of having specialized groups to focus on different areas of concern is definitely part of the plan. As far as governance goes with steering committees, yeah, it's definitely still in discussion with that, but we're excited to be able to reorganize and really make this an accessible place for everyone in the state. So finally, my final question before I get to some of your slides is the forum traditionally put on some big events. I mean, one of the biggest ones and probably the most important one was the annual legislative brief where we had all the legislators in the auditorium before COVID, the last this year, we had it all online in the Zoom and it actually went pretty well. But what's the plan going forward for events? On the other event we had was Energy Day, which was usually held over the YWCA. So what's the current thinking among the team right now? Well, let me tell you, right now we plan to continue with those events. I think they're great ways to engage the community, engage those outside of the forum, bring awareness to kind of our goals and the things that our stakeholders would like to do. So as of now, we do have a legislative briefing day plan for January 10th at the legislature. And we are so excited to be holding that in person this year. I do agree with you though, I think they did an excellent job of holding the online when it went really smooth. And there was a lot of great content. But yeah, this year we will be in person at the ledge on January 10th. And then we do have plans to continue with Energy Day as well. So we're very excited about both of those. Okay, so it'll be an in-person event, not a Zoom event. It will be broadcast though. I don't think via Zoom, I'll have to get more information for you on that, but stay tuned. Yeah, okay. So let's pull up the next slide and let's work through some of the more detailed elements and what we wanna talk about today. So let's have slide two up. Take it away, Megan. All right, so our first transition area of focus is this high penetration renewable analysis and planning. And these are ideas that we've been bringing to our stakeholders and getting feedback on. So data collection and analysis, like we've touched on, we would love for our website to be a place where people can go for these resources regarding energy, regarding policy. Our second point there is utility plans and integrated grid processes. There are a lot of unique projects going on in the state right now with HECO, with the County of Kauai and Moloka'i as well. A lot of innovative things happening with renewable energy sources. And those played into our community plans and really creating resilience in the state. And these are all topics of discussion that we would like to address as a forum. So that's our first transition area there that we're focusing on. Okay, so let's have the next slide up. Perfect. So our second slide here is energy transition policy and regulation. Now, obviously we are a policy forum, so this is a big one. But governance in our policy framework and then improvements in policy objectives. Now what I'd really like to touch on here is the Biden administration's recent passing of the $1.2 trillion infrastructure bill. A lot of money, a lot of possibilities. And one thing we'd like to do as a forum and that we will be addressing in our legislative briefing is the dispersal of those funds. We want to make it more of a transparent process. We'd like our stakeholders and people in the state to know how much of that has come into Hawaii to be able to plan for what we really want to achieve in the state, which is cleaner energy, higher functioning processes and equity among ratepayers and energy receivers. Yeah, I was on a workshop this morning that was sponsored by the US Department of Energy all about the budgets coming down for renewable energy. And in particular, in this case, it was a hydrogen and there's billions of dollars standing by and they have a really short timeframe for actually getting that money out the door. So they're like having to step it up for like the last 20 years it's been like they barely had enough money to survive. And it was the kind of like, you know, save, save, I'm focusing on hydrogen, but that could be on other renewables too. But in this case, it was like trying to save hydrogen. Now it's like they almost have more money than they know how to handle. And it's not a panic situation, but it's gonna totally change the way they do business because they have to get these large amounts of money out. And from our point of view, and this is where I think the forum can really be helpful is try to be help coordinate the state's response to all this money that's coming out for the various programs and set some kind of a priority on what is best for the state. What's the biggest thing we need to focus on? What's number two? What's number three? And start working with the group to develop plans for that because the funding opportunity announcements are gonna be coming out fast and thick and the response times are gonna be very short. So we have to think of, we're not gonna have six months to prepare a response. We might have one or one or a half or two months to prepare a response and get it going. So it's kind of a whole shift in the way we do business. And those that are prepared and ready to go and have their coach and plan are gonna be the guys that win the pot. So I'm not quite sure myself, who in the state is actually sitting up on top coordinating all that. It could be the Hawaii Energy Office, the state energy office. That's probably a good organization to do that. I mean, that's kind of what you'd think the energy office would do. Supported by, you know, of course, HNEI were kind of like the research arm for the state. And here's where the energy policy forum could really play a role in commenting on what's a good program and what's not. I.e. the pros and the cons like we were talking about. And that would surely engage our stakeholders because they're all gonna be interested and wanna have a place at the table and get their opinions in. So I think this is something that the forum should be embracing as we go forward. What do you think? And I think that is we relate to that completely. That's our hope is that we can make this more of like I said, a transparent process so that people aren't blindsided and say, oh my gosh, we have so much money and no plans with what to do with it. And by kind of mapping out this process of how the monies will be distributed, give people a chance to plan and to prepare with meaningful projects for the state. Exactly. Yeah, and get their good ideas front and center. So that's what people know about it. You know, if nobody knows about it, you're not gonna get any money, you know, it's like and it's gonna be a team effort. It's not like one individual is gonna be let me go in and scoop up like, you know, $20 million for their pet project. I mean, the way they've scoped this out, you know, you have to have workforce development. You have to have social justice. You have to have a whole variety of things that make up your project. This slide is my favorite. It's the most exciting one to me, but the Hawaii Innovation Initiative. So the first term on here is innovation sandbox. And that's something that's come up in a lot of our interviews, speaking with stakeholders, what you provide such a unique opportunity and test ground for new ways to distribute energy, to create energy, there's just endless opportunities here. And talking to our stakeholders, equity has been a big piece that has come up too. Like you mentioned, when these projects come down and the funds come through, social justice and equity is a big piece of everything that's happening because we do wanna make sure that energy is being distributed to all people. I mean, in my brain, the energy system is akin to the food system. Everybody eats and virtually everybody uses energy. So we need ways to distribute that equitably and make sure that everyone's getting what they need at a rate that they can afford. And so... Oh, sorry, go ahead. Do you finish your slide? Then I have one, follow up. No problem. So that's also been linking into our efforts to open up membership to engage this group of diverse voices and give people a seat at the table to really discuss their needs going forward. Yeah, so one of the big needs I've observed in working on my bus project, for example, is workforce development. Because we've been a fossil fuel economy forever and this is all new stuff. And there's a lot of fear and uncertainty among the workforce. I'm not talking about academics and people like that. I'm talking about the Luke Caller guy. The guys that actually do the work are worried about their jobs and how can they fit in this new economy? What skills do they need? How do we teach them the skills? I mean, it's not like you're being a coal miner. We're not gonna be mining coal anymore. What do I do? And so this is something we have to address. And in fact, certainly in the hydrogen presentations today, 5% of the funding they've earmarked has to go to workforce development. Because so they've recognized the fact that we have to make this transition and bring the workforce along with us so that people don't feel that they're being abandoned. And the universities and community colleges can certainly play a role in that. But they have to also understand it's like, it's not an academic exercise. We're not looking for PhDs and masters. We're looking for the guy who can swing the wrenches and can do the work. And particularly in the heavy electric area because we're talking electric transportation, all that's kind of stuff. There was a lot of safety issues involved. So I think this is another area where the forum can play a role and make sure that this is not being missed or ignored or forgotten about. Exactly. So as we're engaging our previous stakeholders, we're also engaging new stakeholders in the state. People who previously weren't part of the forum but as we engage in this innovation and this kind of sandbox idea, engaging entrepreneurs, engaging other entities and people with fresh ideas to come to the table and discuss creative solutions to these big problems. And part of that is... Sorry, go ahead. Oh, good. Part of that is creating more jobs and job security as we approach these creative solutions to kind of bolster our own economy at the same time we bolster the energy system here. So I have a question. One of these little buzz words, sandbox. So now if I'm a millennial, whatever, I kind of understand what a sandbox is. But for the normal general public, what do they mean by the sandbox? Well, let me give you my definition of it really quick. There you go. It's important to make sure that you're using terms correctly, but a place to kind of explore, try new ideas and try them on a smaller scale so that in case something goes terribly wrong, you're not harming people. Sandbox, like as a kid, when you would play in a sandbox, you can build new things, you can try new things, you can explore and there's minimal consequences to that exploration, minimal negative consequences to the outside world. You're really contained in a space as you're doing it. And so that's as we move forward, it's starting small. It's testing these on a small scale, but still allowing for that full creative spectrum to be able to try these new ideas and get to creative solutions to the difficult problems. Okay, thanks for that. So let's go through some of these other bullets here on your slide side. I'll let you lead the way. And I'll only interrupt when I want to. Okay, so as you can see here, we have EV charging infrastructure, fast charging network planning, all hot topics and things that Hawaii's looking at to improve our greenhouse gas emissions in the future to reduce those. And the discussion that's happened around that really is resource adequacy. How do we address the new needs on the grid as we create these charging infrastructures as we move forward trying to reduce greenhouse gas emissions? Transportation is one of the biggest generators of greenhouse gas emissions. I think as the state's goal is to achieve 100% renewable by 2045, we like to look at electricity and we like to focus on that as the way that we're going to achieve that 100% renewable. But really, when we look at it, transportation is a huge piece of that. And so creating that infrastructure and creating the resource adequacy to support the infrastructure is so important. And then the other thing, oh, go ahead. The other thing with electrification of transportation is, and transportation in general, is that you've got so many individuals, you've got hundreds of thousands of people who have their own way of doing it, whereas the grid is relatively easier from the point of view of you have two major players here in Hawaii, HIKO and KIUC, and you have a PUC that can command and to do certain things. But when you've got tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of people who wanna make their own choices, I wanna own a big pickup truck because I like it as big as tough. I go to the beach, don't tell me I can't use my pickup truck. It's a lot more difficult to change the way people think. The whole corporate culture or the whole transportation culture has to be changed. Agreed. It's definitely more than providing the infrastructure and providing the tools. But I think it's also a huge part of it is making sure that there is a way for people to have electric vehicles to use that space. I mean, for myself minus financial status, my biggest hindrance to getting an electric car would be, I don't know where to charge it. There you go. Just don't have the resources to do that. And so as we build that, I think the hope is that people will see this as an accessible option. And really that plays back into our equity we've been talking about is allowing a space for everyone to at least have the opportunity to engage in that space, whether it be now or in the future when they want to or need to. And of course the forum can certainly play a role by allowing everybody to share their opinions. Like, you know, I like this or I don't like that. And that's feedback that can be passed up the line to the legislators and to the people who control that. So we're getting kind of close to the end of our time. I told you this would go fast. So let's just talk quickly about your last two bullets and then we can kind of wrap it up. Perfect. So our last two points here, the role of accelerators and then exploring the mechanism for energy financing. So like I have said previously, engaging with new members in the space, engaging with the accelerator, elemental accelerator being one of them and the entrepreneurs that they work with, the fresh ideas that they have coming up. I think there's a lot of good things going on in the space that maybe they, those ideas don't get distributed as fast a pace and the forum can kind of act as a conduit to distribute that information to all the players in the state and give people access to those ideas faster than they normally would have them. And it also plays back into our sandbox idea where you kind of have this comfort, this safe space to test out these ideas and then move forward with them. Granted, they're successful. Okay. Well, you know, Megan, we've come to the end of our time and we'll have you back and your co-comrade in arms Dallas and Mark Glick, El Supremo have him come back and talk to us as this evolves as we go through it. I'd love to be able to have some of our forum stakeholder members come out here too and really use Think Tech Hawaii for the best effect in getting their viewpoints out to allow them to share with the overall community as well, not just like an internal bunch of people sitting around on the table. So this is something we can explore. Any final words before I shut us down? Just that we are excited to be back and to be engaging with the community again and we have already received so much good feedback and really looking forward to continuing this process. So thanks for having me on and looking forward to future discussions. Sounds good, we're back. We're back. Okay, so we'll leave it at that. You've been watching Hawaii, the State of Clean Energy on Think Tech Hawaii. Today we've been talking story with graduate assistant Megan Russell about the Hawaii Energy Policy Forum and its evolving vision and plan under the new leadership of HNEI and principal investigator Mark Glick. So thank you very much, Megan and thanks to our viewers for tuning in. I'm Mitch Ewan, we'll be back in two weeks with another fantastic edition of Hawaii, the State of Clean Energy. Aloha, everyone. Aloha.