 What's up? What's up? What's up? I'm brand man Sean and I'm Corey and we are back with episode number 23 of the No Labels Necessary Podcasts got a lot of things to go through today before we get into it But first and foremost look y'all who are watching watching visually y'all ain't gonna see Corey, man Yeah, he he's not only here with us in spirit though. He is here physically He is in the room when our cameras broke on that trip to loom to to loom apparently I think EJ broke it, but that's nearly here nor there. We're thugging out this episode without it So it's gonna be a one-camera episode y'all just see my beautiful face with that being said appreciate y'all love on the To loom episode we definitely want to do more things like that as we continue to move in the industry in this podcast gets better And we want to make it better for y'all like y'all know We want to get to a million subscribers for the channel so we can keep doing really dope shit But it starts to with getting to 150,000 first we're at 125 right now So appreciate y'all support make sure y'all share if you care make sure you share and One more thing Black Phoenix Buddy you donated to the podcast and we didn't even know that you can even do this right, right? Seriously, there's something called super things apparently under these videos and Black Paul Phoenix donated $4.99 to the podcast just as a thank you and Matter of fact black Paul Phoenix you did it twice. So 998, bro We really appreciate that legitimately. We didn't even know that you could do this super things feature But appreciate that anybody else who wants to you know add to the collection plate We are happy to have that as well, you know, I'm saying so Let's get in today's topics because yeah, we got a lot of things to get through The first we're back with our look at our regular location. So we're gonna start off with some advice. Let's kick it off Right here very special clip for y'all and my question is is it better to start in music back in a day? Or is this the best time? Lee or Cohen has very strong thoughts about today's music opportunities. Check it out Get into the music business the record business This is a time for you to cobble together a little capital because it's not expensive and Find stunning talent and putting them out in the marketplace. This is the moment in time. I've never seen a more fertile business environment as it is today is that you can go tonight and record someone Ship it the next day all around the world at zero costs No manufacturing costs no shipping costs. No everything digital and inexpensive and very efficient Remember we used to make videos that cost us money to promote our songs Now there's a YouTube Video up and get paid for it. Now is the time you you may be too late if you keep waiting to get this paper As you pointed out jacquory. We first listen to that clip the last thing he was saying is get this paper Get this paper and hearing the same man That says cobble this money together say get this paper is just kind of hilarious especially with his voice, but What do you think about his sentiment? I mean I agree. Well, I mean as much as I can agree kind of know what we know, but The the path to get the artist scene is a lot cheaper right like he was saying like yo I remember when it were X amount of cost to just get this song distributed in another country You know saying today it can be in all of the major countries for you know 999 whatever tomb court did show kid or something like that cost. I was like the the barrier to entry is a lot a Lot less inexpensive a lot more inexpensive The barrier to attention is definitely a lot more inexpensive right like now this artist can make a tiktok or a YouTube video I have an Instagram meme just hit the right way and you know We get the same return as if we had to get to radio, you know or something like that So I agree within that aspect and I would say everybody too should go back and watch it a Pause it till where he actually has those stats on the screen and talked about How much the music industry is gonna is gonna grow you know something over the next couple years I don't know if you caught that part But it was showing a breakdown of it by 20 31 or something like that, right? They just show like yo It's gonna be mom. It's gonna is there's more money coming the Way to get attention is gonna be a lot cheaper and a lot more accessible all You have to do is be the one to bring the good talent to the internet that sparks and hit the marketplace And I feel it like we were just having no time similar conversation about that You know before the pot Where's like how many artists have we seen or heard stories of that? Cracked into the marketplace for a very low investment right like a couple thousand or maybe couple tens of thousands and so I Feel like as from their side being someone that's seen all those different eras right the couple of millions to break a artist era To maybe the couple of hundred thousands to break a artist era to like today could just be a good string of TikTok videos and it'd be done for possibly free like that has to be crazy Yeah, I agree because you have just That lower cost means a higher margin. Yeah, right like Like you said millions to get artists out. That was legitimately a number that was typical Back in a day and now we're talking about legitimately free. I remember hearing stories I forgot which song in particular. I'm thinking about right now but someone dropped some music in the United States, right and They didn't have the rights to distribute it internationally because they sold those rights to a company, right? Because they were popping in the United States. So they own had ownership They can get it in popping in the United States and it was popping in United States It wasn't popping overseas a company bought the rights to distribute it internationally But back then international distribution meant I guess just pushing out the CDs, right? So These people shipped it internationally But then they imported it and then so we're still able to sell it in America and like undercut them Which was crazy, right? But like that type of stuff is more difficult to pull off today, right? And the fact that they wouldn't go to the lengths though To do something like that must mean like the margin and what's what's to look pretty good on whatever song that was I really wish I could remember the story and which specific song but Like now you yourself as an artist can have worldwide rights for basically nothing You're not competing with these companies just to make sure it goes to the next place So I 100% get that the visibility and getting your product out there now I Think to his argument if I said Yeah, but you still got to stand out in the marketplace. It still costs money to get seen He'd probably be like well, yeah But that's still just a game my point is There's lower costs for the game the game is still the game but the but it costs less So I can kind of get that yeah, I think they're looking at it too as you know in their time It was kind of like Here's how big the pie is And there are a lot fewer of us cut into the pie versus today, and you know more likely moving forward The pie is gonna get bigger as we saw in that chart Hey, it's on like the music and you're gonna like double the triple or something like 2031 So it's like hey the pie is going to Hypothetically get much bigger, but they're gonna be a lot more knives cutting into the cake You know because of how cheap it is to get into it And so that becomes the trade-off and like you said the game that you're playing Hey, we could argue that and their error. Yeah, it was a lot harder to get attention But it was a lot less people that you don't think they were able to benefit because of that today You you and you all have the same chance of making it. You don't say relative to what making it kind of looks like for now But because of that, you know, it's gonna be a lot of you You know it when I think about it when I see him make this argument cuz I've seen him talk about this before He doesn't necessarily say this is the best time for artists. Yeah, he says the most lucrative Typically one thing he kind of seems to specify around is like for entrepreneurs in music Right. So of course that could apply to the artist, but they could that could not apply to the artist. Yeah, right So we're even we're not we're not even making an argument here because that's not what he's talking about Whether it's good or bad for artists is it easier today versus the old days that's a whole nother conversation which we might have had if not will definitely have it but I do agree 100% for an entrepreneur This is the best time because before You're dealing with more and more gatekeepers. Yeah, right. There's less gatekeepers So you have more wiggle room You can use a lot more of your finesse your savvy your skill set to build leverage Outside of the industry and make money and then of course bring it in the industry You have more routes to navigate versus we just got to go do these few major labels We have to deal with the same people in the room and everything is limited in terms of their ceiling Based on the major labels, which actually reminds me what I said the other day you remember Because even though it's better for entrepreneurs as an industry I still think music is Has one of the lower ceilings for entrepreneurs. Yeah, you remember me talking about that Yeah, and why is that because of those major labels, right? No matter what no matter what your skill set the highest steel ceilings are still people who are attached to those majors Yeah, all right when you could be in the restaurant industry You could become a billionaire right off the restaurant industry opening restaurants opening restaurants Oh now I've go buy and inquire another restaurant brand and I build out my portfolio tech I build out some app right and It blows up Bam, I'm I can go up to the billion dollar level hundreds of millions dollars level roofing real estate all these you can Stay within that and continue to build everything has its own barriers, etc. But music it's hard to be a ground zero person right become a billionaire straight like that music only Because at the end of the day the record labels create a ceiling for what you can do as an entrepreneur Otherwise Birdman would probably be a millionaire billionaire. I mean, yeah, you know what I mean? Yeah, like and they say I think the number was like $2 billion worth of music Yeah, I think they said he's done two billion dollars worth of revenue or record sales something like that. All right, that's great But for a bird man level impact in a different industry that number will be higher Yeah, you know me like he was something like dental equipment or something Kind of crazy it'll be it'll be a higher number and it will be he would have a Bigger piece of the pot because he also had to bust that down between so many people. Yeah, I remember that just from doing Festivals even I you just look at it. You're like dang man. Yeah, this shit can get bigger but the bigger it gets the more people that I need to be like a Security just attendance helping people throughout the events more vendors and more people to manage those vendors like my regular team It takes more and more people as you scale. So it's harder to ever get that escape velocity where at some point Each person is worth more. All right, like if I'm building out tech after a certain level of growth Tech does so much it becomes worth the people, you know, I mean like you're automating people and it's doing like what What's that have 50 billion? No, what's that have 50 employees when it? Exit it for 19 billion dollars He's at 50 employees 50 employees when Facebook bought it for 19 billion dollars That's what like Couple couple hundred I mean like that's now of course tech can be more extreme But the point is the ceiling is lower for entrepreneurs in music. However, within the periods of time This is the best time for entrepreneurs in music Let me take a quick second to say if you're an artist trying to blow your music up Or if you're a manager music professional in general trying to help an artist blow their music up I have something that's a game changer for you and it's completely Free as you may know, we've helped multiple artists go from zero to hundreds of thousands of streams We've helped multiple artists go from hundreds of thousands to millions of streams chart on billboard go viral All of that stuff and we've now made the way we branded multiple artists and help them go viral Completely free step-by-step in Brand man network. All you have to do is check out brand man network comm you apply It's completely free, but the thing is we're not gonna let everybody in forever So the faster you apply the better your chance of getting accepted brand man network comm check it out Back to the video now. We're talking about music Specifically, I'm not saying that you can't get you know become a billionaire using the cloud you build from music and then monetize it Other ways that's what an entrepreneur would and should do right, but that specific music ceiling The labels man. They they got on lock, you know, they're like remember I even talked about now You know when Gary V you on that music run? Yeah I'm like, I really feel like Gary V at some point was seriously considering getting in the music business on a deeper level He had to at least think about it and he and knowing him I wish I don't know him but seeing him Let me correct that shit. All right. I don't know him But seeing him enough and observe him enough if he did truly consider it He probably also considered that versus other opportunities that he has and what the word for his time would and he probably saw An exorbitant amount of politics bureaucracy and the ceiling that labels create to hit certain numbers And it's like thing it's gonna take how long just to build something to be worth How much when I could go run them numbers up in a couple of years on something else? That's the ceiling and then when you think about how they talk about jobs that pay less attracting Lower talent in general. Yeah, just because of the ceiling the same maybe music has that has a problem Attracting the best of the best Entrepreneurs in the long term right because you'll have them maybe early on the love of it Da-da-da, but like staying in it to change it I think there's a low morale of Staying in it to change it because we know to get to a certain number if I want to keep keep going. All right It gets real tough. Yeah Yes, I when we talk having a salesperson conversation, you know saying it's like, you know I could come over to music and it's a music service company and maybe I'm selling this thousand dollar product Or I can go over to I can't even think of something like the Medical sales Energy sales or something and they said that their products the fifth is 15 care product You know my commission looks different over there and it's like why would I do his music shit? You know, I'm making three four hundred dollars ahead over here. I could be making You know like five eight cat head great for some other company. So that's a good point, man And I think that's that's what makes music like beautiful and slow at the same time as I your Banking on the progression of the space being just by people who are just passionate about space Yeah, who are necessarily coming like there are people who come in and say like hey, I think I can make money here But we in part are largely hoping it's just people who are passionate about they keep pushing it for even they have to do Things in other spaces to still come back to this space and push a lot of people do that a lot of people are Not just on the artist side a lot of people who are doing other things while staying in music to keep that going yeah, why they got a hustle and I Think Like you said, there are people who come into it for the money purely at first But those people don't last yeah, because they do a simple math You know unless that's like your only opportunity in life because you got other life things going on Which is a thing for some people like Most people if they're just purely from money you do the math you're like There's so many easier ways So it like I I get it I get it well It's interesting. So we we kind of like We we broke down that we do a groovly or but there are caveats, right? It's the best time, but it's still not the best industry we're just talking about for entrepreneurs However, if you're an entrepreneur who's passionate about music cares about Music right and if you're an artist who wants to be entrepreneurial and have more control over your situation It's also in fact the best time. That's I think the conclusion on that one. Yeah. Yeah, exactly now second clip though, man Outcast manager says he never understood these fools. He said he understood saying these southern guys now Let me play exactly what he's talking about when he says this though being from New York managing Outcasts at the time. First of all, there was a complete language barrier. I know what the fuck nobody was talking about sitting around in the dungeon I sit in the room some days with all of them and be looking around like I don't know what the fuck y'all talking about Our shop might be wondering why we're playing this. I promise. This is extremely important for you to understand and get But okay, we'll figure it out later because it was just a different like language really like especially Not this TV version, I'm saying not this TV version y'all so like I'm talking about the dirt When they was talking like just the words where like I know that I was talking she got down with the fuck And then period if you hear fuck me I heard that loud and clear Being from New York managing outcasts at the time first of all All right, all right, so the biggest thing point number one. That's really important to understand but there's a multiple we need to get into is artist You see this is a world-class group legendary group outcast and their manager said He didn't understand them what they were saying half the time literally but also they also don't have to like you and We that we had some recent conversations with some pretty successful people that manage some pretty successful artists and They don't like the artist music like that They respect it and think that they're good at what they do But that type of music is literally not for them yet They're successfully managed in these artists and these artists are doing damn well in their career That's important to know and why because so many times artists say I don't want nobody to market my music if They don't believe if they don't believe you gotta drink the Kool-Aid ain't look at me I'm I'm a rebel. I'm gonna not drink the Kool-Aid just cuz you told me I gotta drink the Kool-Aid Drink the Kool-Aid now that you say I need a drink it, but like That's the thing So many people think that everybody on your team has to believe in your music, right in terms of I'll take that back like they have to love your music be a fan of your music. No, they don't have to be a fan of you Yes, man. Yes woman none of that stuff now what you want them to do is believe in In what you can accomplish as an artist something about something about your vision. Yeah, they have to Also tend to like care about you and want to do right about you That's what I see to be the commonalities between managers cuz you gotta remember look ain't nobody gonna like everybody's music in general And if a manager has the skill set to market different types of artists and diverse artists Then they're probably not gonna be the main category and target audience Scooter Braun managed Ariana Grande that Older white man at this point is not anywhere near the target audience for the teenage White girl. Well, I don't say just white girl, but you know what I mean? You get the point, right? They're for teenage girls. That's like where her music was at one period of time and this is a man frat Guy, but it doesn't connect But he can manage the hell out of her which he also managed asher off and he also managed Justin Bieber He also managed Kanye once at some point, but I you know, but if we want to talk, you know, starting more ground zero those artists that I mentioned so You do your manager doesn't have to like your music in that way and they don't have to like your music if they're your market or anybody in your team and in that way, but they need to see some level of packaging for you, right and And Oftentimes kind of just just like you for lack of better words. Yeah, I think it changes from person to person Yeah, I'm gonna say like maybe we go go with it. What do you what do you think for person to person? Yeah, just changes like some people like like you said they're managers. I know that work with our artists Just because they think the music is amazing and then there's some that I met where they're like, hey Like this person's content is amazing. Like you I can see his vision the way he's able to string it together Or you know Some that just like the way the artist performs. Oh, he's an amazing performer You know saying so it's like you meet so many different people that if you ask them enough questions You can start to figure out like why oh they can start to justify like why they rock with their artists and It's not always the music, you know It was used to baffle me because you meet so many artists will get offended if it's not music You know saying yeah, you don't think the music is great It's like now I just might not be the target demographic But if I understand how to put it in front of the target demographic, you know saying that am I still not just as valuable in this relationship And that's what used to get me, bro. Like I've really had come sexual art before blood. You're like just because I don't like it Don't me. I don't know what to do with it. You know, they don't get that don't like it, bro Like it's just not for me, but yo like you clearly believe in it You know I'm saying I'm seeing some hot quality things around it. The team seems pretty solid Yeah, I put my skills in this situation and see what happens, you know, but I still don't fuck with it Bro, they gave me a flashback. There's this breakfast club interview where machine gun Kelly is trying to get Charlemagne to fuck with him Like his music and like Charlemagne keeps going. I think you're a good guy I don't like your music basically and he just like he can't take it, right? He really won't I think he like freestyle and everything and then Charlemagne was like, no, I'm still not feeling it Whatever, but I think you're a good guy and That's kind of what you want a lot of sometimes, right? As long as they like rock with you, they have the skill set to do what you need them to do You can't expect some of these especially the really seasoned managers who are older To be your primary demographic. Yeah. Yeah, bro I think it's like a safe space for artists right like when you're first coming up as an artist Or I will argue when most artists are first coming up their first Round of help is usually just fans. You know saying like there are people who are fans of them reaching out to them Yeah, helping them out. So I feel like they just get stuck in that mentality a little bit Oh, you're trying to help me out. You must be a fan. It's like no bro. I just thought I could help over right see exactly That's that's not the business way of thinking about things like you said I just saw something that I could help with I saw a place that I could provide value Yeah, and then I'm providing that value based on my expertise based on my expertise What you probably don't want is them to think that your music is straight trash Even if they don't like your style of music because that's just not them They need to at least think you're probably good at your style of music. Yeah, I have the light I know me personally. I'll have to maybe not like it, but I can't hate it. You're right You know, like I gotta be like, uh, this is This is gonna be objectively good to somebody right exactly. That's that's that's all you're looking for They could say this is objectively good to somebody I can help you find that somebody and then manage What it looks like to explore and build in that audience That's about it and I know that sounds underwhelming wow, but that is what it is and funny enough though It's crazy how globalization has affected music and culture so much because this guy talking about his Not being able to I said this guy outcast manager talking about not being able to understand Outcast back in the day sound like my dad talking about when he came to the south because he's from Newark, New Jersey And he would just be like what so what? Yeah He'd be like, you know, I never understood what these folks are saying like never One thing he he would always be like, you know, I remember I was in the club one time Everybody like go Go outside the head I was like, I know what the hell they were saying You remember that show song, right? He just had all these stories of like You know, I'll be talking to somebody how far away they thought you just go down the road with a piece I like what does this mean like the language was so different But it's a beautiful thing back in the day because you could go to different places and get completely different experiences Like going it to different regions was damn near like going to different countries today It's great, it's it's so funny to hear like those type of stories because now we don't get as shocked because we experienced so much of each other online, yeah, and Because of online we experienced a lot of the same culture So it's the same when we go to these places and then you get rid of radio, right? The way it was before because radio is now Homogenized to they're pretty much just playing the hits and you have a couple of companies pretty much owning at all the stations Right. Yeah, we don't get as much of an experience of going to a different state And you just driving and then you change your radio station to the local shit and you hear some shit You never hear before and couldn't a completely different style, which I missed that part I'm not old enough for the fool like completely misunderstanding other regions But I am old enough for like riding around and being a different state and the shit is just completely different shit I just remember finding one ace hood song one day being in Virginia for the first time It was some shit that was like just bringing him back at the time I don't know but that shit was like crazy because I was coming from down here and I was like, oh, they are not playing Back home in Atlanta bro, like no, this is not coming through the speaker. So I do miss that aspect of it But I don't know man in a way as bad as it is. I think It makes culture a little bit easier to navigate at least because it's all just internet culture So, you know, if you can speak internet, you can you you good everywhere, you know We're sacrificing the unique and different for the same and convenience. Hey, you're never gonna have anybody fight convince That's like the humans Evolve into one race the humans fate, right? It's our curse. Like we it's hard for us to fight convince It's hard even to our detriment. We it's hard for us to fight convince You know the bad food that we eat all everything look man. Hey, it's convenient though That's why we think about like the the conspiracy theories. It's like we're gonna all merge into one race You know saying to me one language. I'm like, but that means what means or something to every race every gender Yeah, I'm saying every sexuality every nation everywhere. We're all united over like a mean, bro That's just where we talked about this last week. Remember, I I told EJ that he looked like the race that everybody's gonna be You weren't there for that I Forgot how we got there, but I was like, bro, I was like You can see it now, right Got a little bit everything in them and so I don't know man, um, I think Of course again, we know Everybody doesn't have to love your music in that way, especially the higher and higher up and the more people you deal with in business You aren't gonna have that expectation But that doesn't mean there is no value to people in your business stack. All right They might have some other type of value. They could be close on your team and have exceeding value, but That part just is what it is and on the other side though Again the understanding man. I I under I understand the convenience of culture today and I appreciate culture today It's not me hating but it does suck also not to have those differentiated experiences in our fight to like I'm of the the the side of things where people say, oh, we're all the same race and everybody's the same And you know, I don't see color. I don't like that shit, right? Not according to me. Yeah, like I prefer people to Experiences the differences acknowledge the differences and accept the differences, you know and just not be assholes about it That's all it is. You know, cuz the differences is a funny shit, right? That's the cool shit That's the so I hope would look, you know, we homogenize to the point of a billion EJs. Hopefully I'm not here for it Now with that being said though speaking of how outcast manager From the north did not understand understand his southern artists Got another clip for you guys And it's a good one. So I got one question for y'all How not to get booed? How do you think you can not get booed one of the best ways in your career to not get booed? But we're gonna talk about something that's gonna get you booed for sure But he fought nigga the around the time I got this song with JDK No, he fought with me at a BB King's bro, but take me to a met a Wu Tang clan I opened up Wu Tang clan Oh How did they not know better dog first of all the fact that oh jaded juice man had a song with JDK's is beyond me I did I did not catch that one I missed that or I Just forgot about it. I never know what I think because we played it one time here after we saw this clip And yeah, I definitely did not know that song All right But people who are missing this cuz maybe y'all know who OJ the juice man or maybe is y'all don't you know You know, you might not be from the South OJ the juice man was up under Gucci man So the closest he I'm not gonna say he sounds exactly like Gucci man People don't get mad at me who actually know but for y'all just imagine a Gucci man for now And then imagine early Gucci man without the clout that has any level of respect in the recognition It's just Gucci man his style his early music and put him in front of Wu Tang clan in the 2000s after Wu Tang clan is all what already Wu Tang motherfucking clan And in New York in New York May Gucci man that open Must have been you know Pam a little buyout for the spot they had to pay him I mean it really started with whoever set the feature You know, I can understand Yo, let's try to take this, you know new age for the time Southern trap artists and break him in front of this The East Coast, you know boom bout right audience That's where the sickness started Look that is that is true. That is true. So so what's the point? I Think it made for a cool Experiment it was a cool experiment, but it was a set up for failure. Yeah, right Don't open for artists that don't have the same audience that you have but what I do like about this is Like this experience is what I tell people to think about when they can't think of a target audience I'm like bro, close your eyes and imagine you open it for artists, but who will you open for that? You think that crowd will boo you if you think I love that if you think that crowd will boo you, but it's not Your target. I love that. That is the scientific route deductive reasoning where You keep us you assume that you're wrong originally. Yeah, all right, and then you keep testing until You're not proven wrong You're not necessarily right, but you cannot figure out a way to prove yourself wrong So if I imagine all these different people booing me eventually the people that are left Maybe I should actually perform in their audience I can't be guaranteed that I'm gonna be right and I'm not gonna get boo, but I can't deduce Originally from afar that that audience will boo me. So that might be a way a lot of y'all should think about it Who's gonna boo me? I know I shouldn't be in front of their audience Man, don't count the people who got fan bases that are like too nice and too hippie-dippy to be mean to people They got their limits they do have their limit my point is Don't don't don't try it like if you know if you're not that target audience You're not their target audience and it's a setup for failure 100% To perform in front of these artists that is not your target audience and if it's not full failure It's a waste of your money and time in many cases And the reason I say this is because I know a lot of artists get these opportunities to get in front of these audiences for pay Like there's I don't know. I'm Tory Lane's Traveling the country or oh Marian and I need an opener and there'll be a potential opening spot And then you get charged 5k $300 whatever the number is to be in front of this audience. It doesn't matter if their base will not like you It doesn't matter so don't waste your money. If you have that paid opportunity and more importantly don't waste your time unless Look, you're a sick individual and You like to go against the odds Right you want to say Hey, man, I really want to test myself I want to get so good at performing that I could damn near went over a room That's not even for me at the start like the Apollo Right that I respect but you gotta be Well, that might be your path to get there, you know, everybody has that origin story not everybody But you got those people that origin story man. I was in these rooms. It was so hard people hated me They came to boo you had to help them not boo by being so funny or performing your ass off And you started at that point. So I had to get good. All right. Maybe that's how you get good Experiencing some booze and some and some dead audience. Yeah, not definitely definitely and the other life been further down I will give them to is that Maybe this show is just how they were able to see the return of that feature because now if it was today, right? They would just log into Spotify for artists and like oh, like our New York stream started going up once we got that You know, Swiss Beasts and other kids feature They can see it without having to put it the artist in that situation But like then Like the artist going to shows was the was the test ad, you know saying that was the that's how we got the initial sample That we had to put you in that situation To get you know saying cut like that for us to know if that was the right move in our part Which I'm assuming learned it wasn't Now we don't have to put the artists in as many situations that might Hurt their feelings You know saying break the character because we have so much data But then like you said it's arguable that like those experiences are what made them better Hey, we fucked up as your label and thought that for whatever reason you know saying that That boom map New Yorkers would like your music. Hey, that's our bad But we learned some very valuable demographic information when they threw those tomatoes that you won't say We learned that hey, maybe all along we should have been pushing you in Alabama, Georgia Florida, South Carolina, right things like that that you know that They have eventually come back to but I can understand and respect that. Yeah, you know, I can I can get that And then plus this part he probably was just hyped to uh Open up a wu-tang. We're not how ours be, bro. Sometimes ours. I mean think about y'all. Do I demographic match? Yeah, they're just like, oh, I get to open up For the wu-tang clan. That's gonna be crazy, bro. It's gonna be such a historic moment. It's like no bro. No, it's not It's a different type of history Not the history you want Yeah, hey, look so look lesson learned Y'all be mindful who y'all put y'all's music in front of we talk about that so much from a standpoint of Because you're trying to capture a certain audience But we never really get a chance to speak about it in terms of just putting yourself In a bad position and setting yourself up for failure. No one y'all don't do it. Don't do it All right now. I got a question for you guys How weird can you get with your fans? How weird can you get with your fans jacory? How weird can you get with your fans? I feel like a Six out of ten six out of ten. Yeah. All right. I'm jacory. I'm asking y'all to do some shit Check out this clip and why we're asking that question A lot of valuable advice from dj dramos Very about this and it's adult fans of my little pony and I don't know why this is such This is such a profound example for you I think just because it's something I do not fucking get whatsoever And if you watch any videos online about it It is the strangest thing. I can't remember what's where I originally saw this like somebody told me about this Do you know about this niche adult fans of my little pony called bronies? Okay But but It just goes to show you bad like don't be afraid to like Try and and put yourself out there for the things that you're interested in no matter how weird that They may be because there's a fucking audience for everything out there, right? There's a community a group of people like minded individuals from every weird idea of fetish Concepts whatever it is that you have like there's a community out there for you If you you look hard enough and you actually begin to take action on your interest Um and yeah, I guess the the bronies that my little pony stands are are the uh The essence of what I'm trying to push with this idea if you don't see it create it that You gotta keep you gotta finish you know That's all you know It's the same words like at least twice my little my little pony my little pony. I don't know that What comes after that? I just want to stop while I was ahead. All right. I got you. I got you so Look man I think that point is very clear. First of all, y'all shout out to the dj y'all y'all follow my boy. I mean, yeah I think it's just It's too obvious man if people can do shit like this Bruh like what's your excuse for not being able to create some level of fan base I'm not saying everybody should be able to you know have the most fans in the world But if you can't find your hundred a strong hundred Then there's something seriously wrong there because there are some weird fetishes out there. There are some weird, uh Ah It's some interest out there. You know, I mean that's how I felt about the furries first time I learned about them. Oh, yeah My uh sister Was at a hotel. All right And she's like calling me. She said chime, but it's all these people out They're like grown people like wearing tails and shit and and I think some of them are doing like some weird sexual stuff The babe the way they're acting or whatever like she she's just telling me just how I first found out about them And she's I think it's called furries. That's how I first learned I learned about this Like just hearing about it on the phone back talking about like some old school Shit, you know what I mean? Like we just hear about shit not to use your imagination Like not google it or whatever and see what it looked like So I already had like a wild imagination based off of that, but it was apparently a whole convention Of it right and look you probably know more about furries than I do you seem more confident around the subject They can't see my face or nothing. That's a it's a hard pen No, man, I'm I'm not uncomfortable because Bro, I'm on the internet, bro. Like you you see things, bro You know what I'm saying? Like you on youtube a little too late for a little too long You know what I'm saying? You fall asleep on the wrong video Like you wake up this and stuff, man But but I like the that sentiment because he's pretty much proving like bro Like there's so many other ways for you to keep people interested, you know And bro, I'm always telling like clients and things I don't know. I just kind of have this concept that When it comes to talking to your fans the conversation needs to be like I like your music and you know what I'm saying? Like I like your music And you're in the basketball like I'm in the basketball So I could dim you at two o'clock in the morning and be like yo, you see the game last night And like you might have to hit me back, you know And so I think like he said like bro Like you have the ability to build off of your personal interest And your personal the things that you're into no matter how like weird or strange of Strange you might think it is and there's somebody out there that likes it Right like you're not the only person that's into this subject matter or cares about this thing and if you just Put it out there that you even care about it the people that like it will start to become attracted to you Right. Yeah. Are you garden? Yo, I thought we're gardening. Let me come You know fan check out your three song gardening EP, you know gardening sports entertainment in general uh what We Medicine politics sounds very good about it. Yeah, I know multiple artists that are doing things around politics I've seen artists use cryptocurrency. There's like their niche somehow. There's so many other Nitches that you can grab a hold to and here's the reality Today I don't care that you used to see artists only do music and go crazy That's not today It just isn't and I think we have to have artists Accept that reality that this is today because the reality of that there was an error That existed where artists could only do music and they didn't have to know how to do content It's just that it was an error and it isn't something that had to happen. There is no right or wrong for any of this shit, right? like Now it's today Now today is a time where someone who has personality and good content Is someone who can win and has an advantage at one point It was an advantage for people who could just sing their asses off. Yeah, right Today now we got autotune So I don't want to hear anybody who uses autotune Complain that they can't just do music because you're kicking somebody else off who used to just do this one thing in a certain way and kill the game, right? None of this shit is Uh specific right or wrong way It's just errors of time and everybody has to figure out how to win and exist in their error of time and I think Artists think they're entitled sometimes To have it a certain way and it just be about music No, I understand to win it that way because you can still do the music back in the day And then probably try to figure out how to flip and do even better It's nice to just be able to do one thing and go crazy and get all the revenue get all the fans And be good and then everything else be extra today. We aren't there We're a lot of times many artists have to do multiple things to just survive. Yeah, but It also doesn't matter and that's a beautiful thing that you could Be a youtuber and have some music and your music does well But maybe music isn't the main thing you're getting content off of getting revenue off of all right and living your life off of Maybe you you do still go perform and have some fans But you're not touring and doing all these other things because a lot of artists hate it touring by the way Right. There's a lot of people who didn't like it then and there's a hell of artists now, especially who do not like touring How are you going to replace that revenue? Yeah Other shit So it's a gift and a curse and I think we just have to accept it that even the consumers have evolved mentally where They don't necessarily care if you're just an artist or not and even though you might not necessarily Become a musical goat, right? That also is fine if you're living a life that you want to and You're doing it in a way that you want to yeah, right? Yeah, yeah, man. It's like you said breath I was gonna come down to what Consumers won't man. We always gonna win like the stuff that we trying to get but you said something that to me is why this is important is One that opens up where your brand can go right so opens up the type of like brand deals Like, you know, we've talked about Your brand is really a lot of times just like communicated Interests and personality traits right like I'm I really care about you know animal rights and whatever whatever So I talk about it out loud and that's that's my brand to certain people So it allows you to diversify things in a certain way. It allows you to diversify Even your artist narrative like I think about An artist like Tyler the creator and when he first started kind of rebranding into the whole like high-end Fashion space that he's in now, you know with the You know the $2,000 suitcases in the you know, however hundred dollar cologne and like what he's kind of done with like golf wing and I don't remember exactly where it started I think it started with him just letting us know he was in like like high-end cars in my cars Like so you start thinking like man like for Tyler crazier being the cars He must got money. You know what I'm saying? He must really be out here eating. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, somewhere and then It's like that was the bridge like I think about it now like watching that over those Hover me you're like four or five years and seeing where he's flipped the brand to the danis like damn Where they all just started because like he let us know he's in the cars and now like cars are such a big part of like You know like music videos and like his story and just like Other worlds that he's been able to flip into and it just was like started by him. I'm going like oh, bro I fuck with cars and like that's something i'm really into and so it's like These things give you the ability to be able to build in other spaces than just music But but you as the artist that have the power to then bring that world back into the music, right? And so now it's like yo, i'm the it's like thanos right like i'm the artist with either just the music space And you know that could be powerful. I could be the artist that has control over the music space Sports space, you know i'm saying the fashion space You know i'm saying the video game space like this community this community I have the ability to bring them all together when there's music time like the people that can do that Bro like powerful. That's just crazy, bro because you're an artist. Yeah, right? I think so many artists today Actually sell them sell short without even knowing they're doing it. Yeah, and you just the music artists. Yeah, you you What's the word? Demote yourself to being a musician and look I love musicians, right? But if you use the term artist That assumes creativity beyond just music Right. So why don't you Take on that creativity take on that challenge I never I've never seen so many artists basically say yo, no, I don't want to be creative I want less creativity. I just want to be seen one way Like what do you what have you ever seen really artists for real say that in so many masses? As much you see today usually artists like I want to be known for more than just this I don't just want to be in this box now artists are like now. I just want to be seen in this box. So and I think it's that it's that uh sensibility of just not being pleased where Like because it's being is becoming difficult All of a sudden you want it Right versus because I think it was very easy for you to become an artist. All right Then you have artists just talking about wanting to be seen as other things But since they're having difficulty being being seen as just an artist refined success as just an artist They're focusing on that and like why I do other things. But the reality is again You can Your world can go so far beyond that and today people don't really care and why does it matter, right? Remember A lot of these numbers the charts that we're looking at billboard All these things are industry things all these milestones and and and measuring boards That's an industry thing. All right. It's not necessarily about you the success of your life successfully of your career So why does that have to be a certain amount of streams for you to feel successful as an artist? You create it You're an artist, right? Maybe you want to have a certain amount of fans cool work towards that number But it doesn't mean that you have to make all your money primarily from it But you do have people who love your music you can use your art In terms of music and your music videos as a way to consolidate all of your worlds And maybe that's just a way that you consolidate The marketing of the rest of your brand and then you monetize only the rest of your brand And as you continue to experience different parts of the world and whoever you are and you communicate that to your artistry Whether that's through regular content um video games whatever your canvases are Then you come back and say again. All right now. I'm going to create some more music with the The me that is now growing into something else and then let you know what my current world looks like Right consolidating. Oh now I got sports and and I don't know we and Some kind of political thoughts all in this video somehow but it it again, it just it's just no rules to it and I and I feel like We seek rules so much All right, we seek a specific path so much And I think that's where artists like Get really discouraged because it really isn't there And people talk as if it's there and You see so many people achieving certain things that you want, but how did they get there? Well in the music industry, we know oftentimes Even with their music success it came so many different ways You knew somebody you ran into somebody random and became um A manager and then as a manager you were out one day and you linked with this one artist because your friend invited you out and All of a sudden y'all are cool and then bam y'all Go together or y'all went to school together or you had a A relative or you had nobody like all these different versions exist And then how people experience your music all this stuff is completely different The best thing to do when it comes to this music shit is hear everything that people are saying that actually know what they're talking Are they're talking about? And take their perceptions as a framework, right? That's what I Like learn just early on more from coding, but just looking at everything is framework So jacquory says some shit and I'm like, okay I now have the framework of Seeing this problem the way jacquory sees it and then I might talk to sam and then I might talk to You know x y and z and I just take their ways of seeing the problems and it doesn't even mean now that I think it that way It doesn't even matter if it's right or wrong Just understanding that there's other people who see this problem this way and now like a fucking Like super villain or something I can now like say well now i'm going to take all these perspectives and view this one problem this way and Have this super intelligence. That's how I look at it and that's how you can look at music, right? Because there are so many routes you can't just say oh because jacquory and his artists blew up this way we can move this way All right, it's not going to apply because it's a different time or it's a different style or Maybe the personalities or the skill sets are able to capitalize off of it differently but you can't say they did that and this other artists did this and Use that as a way of looking at problems to see things differently and possibly call upon a part of that Advice or a part of their story in a space that fits within yours. Yeah. Yeah, I agree. I agree. All right it's such a It's such a weird I don't know. I think it's it's such a weird experience for most of us to Leave a world of structure And right and wrong like school and then be thrown Out into this industry of music chaotic whirlwind of an industry chaotic and I think the biggest problem is entrepreneurs are Many of them are allergic to rules in some ways and they're looking to create their own rules and create something different but artists Aren't coming in to music saying I'm trying to be an entrepreneur. You know what I'm saying? They find out that they have to be an entrepreneur and see things different But if you're an entrepreneur, you're already like, oh if I leave my company to then be an entrepreneur I know that I'm going to be doing something different. I'm going outside of the norm Artists think they're going into something that's already established in structure but you get in that bitch and figure find out that Yo, this is a fun house Like what the hell is this shit, you know, so I do get that it could be a shock But at some point if you want to win You know, we all have to get over it. Yeah, that's just music That's just music man last Topic of the day and one of the most important things for artists to understand That most artists still after they understand this will never do it and I'll tell you why Snoop Dogg is talking about nipsey hustling this clip by the way At a Compton movie, right? So dr. Ray ice cube all the niggas calling me Man, we're trying to get nip to play you and start out a Compton He ain't getting back to us All right, let me highlight the little um boat. I hit him up nip Let me highlight you pull up on me. He come over to the spot God, they want you to play me and uh in the straight out of Compton movie I'm happy as a motherfucker to tell you he like no disrespect big homie But I can't play you in the movie because then people gonna just know me for being you I got to be me And that's what all do respect I was like damn out gaseous. I'm off. I called him and I said cut y'all gotta go find somebody else All right, so Why is this clip so important? There's a lot of things to pull from it one I mean, I think it takes a lot of discipline personal vision And really balls To do something like that. Yeah All right, and I mean that's nipsey hustle. That's how he built the brand that he built But Why does it take those things and why did he say what he said? It's really branding. That's what it comes down to All right, if I step in your shoes, especially this early in my career I'm always going to be seen in these shoes. It's going to be hard to get about those shoes once I get in Yeah, yeah, especially with some mini simulators like they probably already got with them being West Coast artists tall, lanky guys Before I I ever heard this story. I always thought nipsey Asked new dog vibes like more than his kid like he got the same Like nose look vibe voice and it's a lot of west coast dudes That don't sound like snoop dogs. So it's not like every west coast dudes sound exactly like them They got the cadence and stuff But like that sound exactly like him nip would sound like him sometimes Yeah, but it's like the whole one like your friends tell you look like somebody And then you get the chance to play them in the movie. It's like nah, man It's the ultimate validation for all them niggas. I'm not giving them that Hey, that's a bowl that's a bowl of the stuff right there I was like penny low-key, but but legitimately you have to be that confident in your brand And what you want to see from your brand And your ability to actually achieve that brand vision one day to be able to turn down something like this All right It takes a lot and this is why I said it's something important for artists to understand But even after artists want to stand it most won't actually Adhere to it because If they get an opportunity like this people won't take it. Yeah, like that's the extreme version of that, you know Like because I guess small version would be like you got invited You got invited somewhere that you know saying doesn't 100% align with your brand But you're like, you know, it's an event with brothers of a movie role to play one of the most iconic Rap stars ever in a in a movie that you probably feel like it's gonna be iconic at some point. Yep Yeah, but close to him man, because I don't know man. I don't know. I don't know if I could have did it Yeah, look, man, I think it's One It's cool to see how smooth was able to take it respectfully and it was able to get a lot respectfully But I think a question that everybody should ask themselves as an artist Hearing something like this like what is your brand vision? Right, because I always try to make sure that people understand your brand is not just what you do It's what you don't do and we focus so much on what we do We never consider what we don't do but if you don't If you don't decide what you don't do and will not do ahead of time when the opportunities come You'll get caught slipping and go off path without even realizing it's like, oh man, dang I did say I wouldn't do anything like this. You know, I did say That that didn't fit my brand vision, but the opportunity was so lucrative I wasn't even thinking about it in the moment and now I played myself All right, Will Smith and Jada Pinkett had this thing that they said I remember seeing this clip about their family and their kids, right? they were like Getting your priorities in order and as a couple we had our certain priorities family is number one priority, right? and what that means is if we're at the Oscars And last minute we find out willow Jaden is sick. There are some emergency We don't have to make the decision in the moment because we made the decision ahead of time Yeah, all right. We know family first. We need to dip not oh my gosh. It's such an important event What should we do? How can I make this and work this out and then you end up playing yourself one way or another? Whether it means you took longer than you should have to make the decision Or you ultimately did make the wrong decision and you stayed at the show if your priorities are that maybe your your priority is a money over family or awards and accolades over family whatever that looks like right but It making those decisions ahead of time I love that idea since the moment I heard it Because when you have those priorities in order, it's almost nothing to think about. Yeah, right so, um Shout out to dip man, you know, he's one of those folks to have story out at the story From many people who have met him and dealt with him in any way Um, I'm always excited to hear a new nip story So if anybody have any dope ones y'all drop some in the comments You know y'all drop some in the comments We would love to hear and see some of the best nip videos out there other than that We appreciate y'all once again as always Um, and thank you yet again black paul phoenix for your super. Thanks donations, you know and letting us know that super Thanks even exist Other than that i'm bram and shine i'm covered and we're out